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episode 38: 2021 Podcast Predictions + Visual Soundbites Just Got a Whole Lot Better [transcript]


In this episode, we discuss our new "one click" Podcast Index submission, custom artwork for Visual Soundbites, an easier way to use custom domains for your Buzzsprout podcast website, and answer listener questions about everything from guest release forms to predicting what will happen in podcasting in 2021.

Click here to download a simple guest release form if you want to start using one for your podcast guests.

Check out our new Buzzsprout merch store on Cotton Bureau.

Subscribe to the Buzzsprout YouTube channel to watch gear reviews, software tutorials, and podcast strategy videos.

Review Buzzcast in Podchaser to let us know what you think of the show.

Buzzsprout's Dynamic Content tool now allows you to save multiple clips in your Dynamic Content Library and track how many downloads each clip receives. Learn more on our New Features page.


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 2020-11-06  58m
 
 
00:00  Travis
It's like the asteroid
00:00
that comes near Earth every once
00:02
in a while and you got to have a
00:02
backup plan. You know, it's like
00:04
the existential threat. that'll
00:04
probably not happen. You would
00:07  Kevin
have to plan for the
00:07
asteroid.
00:08  Alban
I don't think we have a
00:08
backup. That's the best.
00:11  Travis
I'm putting all my stock
00:11
in SpaceX, Bruce Willis, Bruce
00:13
Willis gonna save us from the
00:13
asteroid. I hope so. We
00:16  Alban
don't have time. We just
00:16
we got to get the oil drillers
00:19
we need to get up into space to
00:19
go take out this asteroid.
00:25  Kevin
Did you guys see the new
00:25
podcast index submission within
00:29
Buzzsprout?
00:29  Travis
Yes, I did. I actually
00:29
went through and submitted all
00:32
of our shows.
00:33  Kevin
Oh, yeah. Was it easy? It
00:33
was like one.
00:36  Travis
Yeah, it's like, I think
00:36
it's technically two clicks.
00:39
Yes. I think it's funny
00:40  Alban
that we call everything
00:40
one click submission. But it's
00:42
like if the last click is a
00:42
click isn't everything on one
00:45
click submission?
00:46  Kevin
I don't think you can say
00:46
one click then Amazon trademark
00:49
that.
00:50  Alban
I think there was like
00:50
one click Checkout, right?
00:53  Kevin
I don't know. I think
00:53
just like to
00:55  Alban
pause the podcast. So we
00:55
can look up the trademark raffle
00:59
for Amazon's one click purchase.
00:59
That, by the way, has burned me
01:03
so many times.
01:05  Kevin
What you buy things
01:05
accidentally?
01:07  Alban
No, I, you go, Hey, that
01:07
looks like a really cool Lego
01:11
set. And then you just buy it.
01:11
And then like the next day, it's
01:14
there. And you're like, Well,
01:14
why did I buy that Lego set?
01:17  Kevin
That's an excuse, man,
01:17
you would have bought it even if
01:19
it was like 11 clicks.
01:22  Travis
Yeah, so we now have, we
01:22
now have to click submission to
01:26
the podcast index, you click on
01:26
the little button that says get
01:29
listed as the podcast index
01:29
icon. And then on that page, we
01:34
tell you all the things that you
01:34
need to have in your feed in
01:36
order to get in, and you click
01:36
Submit and then you're you're in
01:39
Easy peasy.
01:40  Alban
The whole purpose of this
01:40
podcast index. It's founded by
01:46
Adam curry, who I guess everyone
01:46
heard about last episode. But
01:48
the main, the main point is, a
01:48
lot of apps are finding all the
01:54
podcasts through the apple
01:54
podcast API. And there is a
02:00
possibility, though, we don't
02:00
have any direct evidence of
02:04
this. But there's a possibility
02:04
at some point, Apple would say,
02:06
Hey, you know what, we're not
02:06
going to have this openly
02:10
available for people just to
02:10
grab all the new podcasts, add
02:13
them to their apps, it's totally
02:13
would be a reasonable thing for
02:17
Apple to do. And so the podcast
02:17
index is a group of people that
02:21
are going, Hey, we kind of need
02:21
a backup plan, if that were to
02:24
ever happen, you know, kind of
02:24
an open decentralized way for
02:29
podcast apps to find new
02:29
podcasts.
02:32  Kevin
Right? Well, the mission
02:32
of the podcast index is to
02:35
preserve the pod podcasting as a
02:35
platform for free speech. And
02:39
this becomes a very real
02:39
scenario, because this is
02:42
happening today, like the idea
02:42
that a podcast could be censored
02:46
off of certain platforms. That
02:46
just makes sense. And it becomes
02:49
a certain point, it becomes the
02:49
responsibility of platforms to
02:51
do so. And you can see different
02:51
platforms that are struggling
02:53
with that in our world right
02:53
now. So Facebook is struggling
02:57
with what is censorship look
02:57
like? What is responsible
03:00
content moderation look like?
03:00
And how do we implement that.
03:03
And the same things happening in
03:03
other platforms like YouTube.
03:06
And Apple's probably going to
03:06
have to figure this out for
03:09
themselves as well in their
03:09
distribution platform, which is
03:12
Apple podcasts. So it's a huge
03:12
directory. As all that stuff
03:15
happens. The podcast index is
03:15
saying, We need something that's
03:19
platform agnostic, that there's
03:19
not a company and a brand and
03:22
advertising dollars behind that
03:22
they have to, you know, moderate
03:27
and protect and make sure that
03:27
everything is fact checked.
03:29
Again, like Twitter's putting
03:29
factchecking badges on things,
03:32
podcasting right now is open to
03:32
preserve that openness. The
03:36
podcast index has said, Hey,
03:36
we're just going to be an open
03:38
community by developers. And we
03:38
will be a directory which
03:42
podcast creators can submit
03:42
their podcasts to that we don't
03:45
have advertisers, and we don't
03:45
have a brand to protect them and
03:48
have anything. So it just
03:48
protects the free speech of
03:50
podcasting and open distribution
03:50
that is made available by open
03:55
podcasting. So if you think
03:55
about people who have been d
03:57
platformed, whether it be not D
03:57
platform, but like D monetized
04:00
on YouTube, whether it be
04:00
PewDiePie, when he went through
04:02
that, or somebody like more
04:02
controversial, like an Alex
04:05
Jones, they have had trouble
04:05
keeping their content on certain
04:09
platforms or being able to
04:09
monetize it on platforms, this
04:11
would be the solution, this
04:11
would be you can put your
04:13
podcast here, third party apps
04:13
can choose whether they want to
04:16
pull from it or not. And then
04:16
you could go find a third party
04:19
podcasting app and find that
04:19
content if you want. Now, this
04:22
is not an endorsement of that
04:22
content. It's just a way to
04:25
protect the open free speech
04:25
opportunity that podcasting
04:29
currently provides.
04:30  Travis
Well, and we're seeing
04:30
it play out on Spotify right now
04:33
with Joe Rogan, where it's been
04:33
documented multiple times how
04:38
Joe Rogan will have a guest on
04:38
his show that a lot of Spotify
04:41
employees don't like or like
04:41
don't agree with their stance or
04:44
what they talk about. And
04:44
they're having these huge
04:46
internal discussions about,
04:46
like, should Spotify have
04:50
editorial control over Joe
04:50
Rogan's content, and that's like
04:53
an active fight between the C
04:53
level executives and the rest of
04:57
the Spotify team. Right. So So
04:57
Just the fact that that is a
05:01
conversation that is happening
05:01
shows that it's not even just
05:04
like, you know, you have to be
05:04
a, you know, a conspiracy
05:06
theorist in order to kind of
05:06
fall into one of these
05:09
categories, it could very easily
05:09
get to the point where like
05:13
social media is currently trying
05:13
to figure out, what do we
05:16
censor? What do we not censor?
05:16
If we're not careful that can
05:19
happen with podcasting apps as
05:19
well.
05:21  Kevin
I was like, trying to
05:21
think this through the NC is
05:23
Brian.
05:24  Alban
Well, I see it is like,
05:24
the actual thing that I'd be
05:27
worried about if I was a podcast
05:27
app would be, hey, I'm totally
05:31
reliant on a platform of Apple
05:31
podcasts, who is a direct
05:36
competitor. And that would be my
05:36
big fear is like a app
05:42
developer, I'd be like, you
05:42
know, man, this is crazy that
05:45
I'm relying entirely on a
05:45
competitor to tell me when new
05:48
podcasts to come out. And Apple
05:48
is doing all the work they're
05:52
going through and making sure
05:52
that there's a real podcast,
05:54
it's labeled correctly, they
05:54
actually have real people doing
05:58
this. And so I see the much
05:58
bigger threat is being apple at
06:04
some point says, Hey, we're
06:04
going in a different direction.
06:09
And no longer are we going to
06:09
foot the bill for everybody
06:12
else. by figuring out which
06:12
podcasts are good, which are
06:15
explicit, which are not all that
06:15
you that's now back to you guys,
06:19
you figure it out on your own.
06:19
And if Apple were to turn that
06:23
off one day, then all the app
06:23
developers are totally in the
06:27
dark. And we either have to go
06:27
to some would podcast launch,
06:32
they just don't get into apps,
06:32
and it becomes very painful. or
06:36
they'd have to be like, you have
06:36
to submit your podcast to like
06:40
50 apps. And that's a painful
06:40
process. And so what the podcast
06:46
index is doing is providing kind
06:46
of an insurance plan on that and
06:51
saying, hey, submit everything
06:51
here, we will get all the data
06:56
from the podcast hosts will
06:56
aggregate it all together. And
07:00
so all of the directories or all
07:00
the the apps can go ahead and
07:05
say and pull from us. And
07:05
there's a lot of benefits that
07:10
are there. Like they can do a
07:10
lot of things that Apple has not
07:12
done, saying like, hey, new
07:12
episodes up. I mean, one of the
07:16
most common questions we get in
07:16
support is, why am I not? Why is
07:19
my latest episode not showing up
07:19
in Apple yet? Because Apple's
07:22
never innovated in that way.
07:24  Kevin
I totally agree with
07:24
that. Let me say this, though,
07:27
not not to discount anything
07:27
that you're saying. But to agree
07:30
with it further, like what Apple
07:30
is doing is extraordinary,
07:33
because podcasters have to
07:33
submit directly to Spotify, just
07:37
like we have to submit directly
07:37
to Apple. But Spotify doesn't
07:40
provide us an open API to be
07:40
able to pull all the podcasts
07:42
that they have indexed. Right.
07:42
And we don't really assume that
07:46
they would. Like we're like,
07:46
that's kind of weird. So what
07:48
Apple is doing is going above
07:48
and beyond by making this
07:50
available. And they have been
07:50
doing that for a very long time.
07:53
The question is, like, are they
07:53
really just that kind hearted to
07:56
the podcasting community? Or,
07:56
like, like, what was their
08:00
motivation outside of being
08:00
generous? The same thing with
08:03
Amazon, Amazon is, you know,
08:03
they have a new way to submit
08:07
podcasts into Amazon to get into
08:07
amazon music and now audible.
08:11
But at the same time, they're
08:11
not opening their catalogue, for
08:14
others to be able to pull an
08:14
index and like drive third party
08:18
apps. So what Apple's doing is
08:18
absolutely extraordinary and
08:21
different than what anybody else
08:21
in the industry is doing. And
08:24
the question has to be like, we
08:24
have to try to figure out or
08:27
protect ourselves from like, why
08:27
are they doing it? How long are
08:29
they going to do it? And exactly
08:29
what helping said, this could
08:32
really all go away tomorrow,
08:32
they could shut it down. If
08:35
Apple says, Hey, our podcasting
08:35
app used to get 60 or 70% of
08:39
plays, and now it's only getting
08:39
40 or 50. We don't like that.
08:42
How about we just stopped
08:42
letting people use our directory
08:45
that would drive our traffic way
08:45
back up to where we like it.
08:48
They could absolutely do that. I
08:48
don't think they would, I don't
08:50
know if they would, but I don't
08:50
work there. I don't know, what
08:53
they're thinking or why they're
08:53
doing what they're doing. Good.
08:55  Alban
I honestly think that
08:55
this has been an incredible
08:58
service that Apple has provided
08:58
the podcasting ecosystem for 14
09:03
odd years or whatever, they
09:03
launched the API. And it's a lot
09:08
and they've been, I mean, nobody
09:08
else has done this or is
09:12
interested in doing this work
09:12
into actually figuring out
09:17
what's going on with each
09:17
podcast figuring out if they're
09:19
explicit, or not figuring out if
09:19
they're pirated, or they're
09:21
acceptable content, approving
09:21
them, and then allowing all
09:25
their competitors to pull it.
09:25
And as podcasting gets bigger
09:30
and bigger, it as an industry
09:30
gets on the radars of people at
09:35
higher up at Apple or people at
09:35
Google or Amazon, like more
09:38
companies are going, Hey, maybe
09:38
I need to start figuring out you
09:43
know how we are going to make
09:43
we're going to make money off of
09:45
it. And just like the incentives
09:45
are there for Apple at some
09:49
point to say, Hey, we are going
09:49
in a different direction. And no
09:52
longer are we going to provide
09:52
this absolutely free, very kind
09:56
service to all of our
09:56
competitors. You know, our
09:59
competitive app. We don't, you
09:59
know, we don't actually make any
10:02
money. And so it's not, we don't
10:02
have to imagine Apple is going
10:07
to do some terrible censorship
10:07
or they're going to screw
10:10
everyone, we'd have to say, hey,
10:10
if we do this thing for us for
10:13
free, at some point, you can't
10:13
just rely on other people that
10:16
take care of you. You want to
10:16
make sure you can take care of
10:18
yourself. And that's I can't
10:18
think what podcasts index is
10:22
providing. It's like the
10:22
asteroid
10:24  Travis
that comes near Earth
10:24
every once in a while, you got
10:26
to have a backup plan. You know,
10:26
it's like the existential
10:28
threat, that'll probably not
10:28
happen.
10:29  Kevin
You would have to plan
10:29
for that asteroid.
10:31  Alban
I don't think we have a
10:31
backup that's the best. I'm
10:34  Travis
putting all my snuck in
10:34
SpaceX, Bruce Willis, Bruce
10:37
Willis, gonna save us from the
10:37
asteroid.
10:38  Alban
I hope so we don't have
10:38
time. We just we got to get the
10:42
oil drillers we need to get them
10:42
up into space to go take out
10:45
this asteroid.
10:46  Kevin
But that is a good
10:46
summary of why Buzzsprout is so
10:51
into what the podcast index is
10:51
doing. Like it's really
10:55
important, like what Alban said
10:55
is like the idea of a company
10:58
continuing to do this for free
10:58
forever, that's not a really
11:01
good. I wouldn't say it's naive,
11:01
but like, it absolutely could
11:05
end at any day. And so building
11:05
something that can serve as a
11:09
replacement, or stand in or a
11:09
backup, or would you help me
11:15
with words here, guys, it's an
11:16  Alban
insurance policy?
11:17  Kevin
Well, I was gonna say,
11:17
like, augment, like it can work
11:19
in conjunction with. Yeah, that
11:19
was what I was looking for. No,
11:22
thanks to you, Alvin. The the
11:22
power of it is it's being
11:28
developed by open source, like
11:28
methodologies. And so it's not
11:32
one company that's doing all the
11:32
work and carrying the load for
11:35
free podcast index has set up
11:35
themselves up, and are
11:39
developing in the open on
11:39
GitHub. So anybody can log in
11:41
and create an account and
11:41
contribute code. And they're,
11:44
they're being funded by
11:44
donations, people who like what
11:46
they're doing are sending in
11:46
money. And Buzzsprout is doing
11:49
that as well. And we think this
11:49
is a really good plan and needed
11:54
in the podcasting industry. So I
11:54
would do this like a call to
11:56
whoever's listening to this
11:56
show. If you if you're a fan of
11:59
Buzzsprout, if you're a fan of
11:59
what we're talking about, if
12:00
you're a fan of independent
12:00
podcasts, and then remaining
12:03
open and free and having less
12:03
reliance on platforms that are
12:08
run by for profit companies,
12:08
then I would suggest you have
12:11
these conversations with other
12:11
people in your circle of
12:13
influence. So like if you're in
12:13
other podcasting groups on
12:16
Facebook, or if you meet at
12:16
local meetups with other
12:19
podcasters look into what the
12:19
podcast index is doing. look
12:23
into how Buzzsprout is
12:23
supporting them, not just with
12:26
directory submissions, but also
12:26
the new podcast namespace, the
12:30
tags that we're supporting, and
12:30
we're building out UI within
12:33
Buzzsprout, to be able to push
12:33
those tags into your feed. So
12:36
that we can be able to, if you
12:36
choose to stay open and
12:39
independent and not relies
12:39
specifically on a platform, you
12:42
can have the same feature
12:42
parody, whether you're locked
12:45
into a Spotify platform or not,
12:45
or whether you're locked into
12:48
Apple platform or not. So let me
12:48
give you an example of a tag
12:51
that we're working on, we're
12:51
working on a person tag that
12:53
would be within your Buzzsprout
12:53
feed well and would be within
12:57
your RSS feed. Again, if you're
12:57
hunting on Buzzsprout, it would
12:59
be your Buzzsprout feed. But the
12:59
what the person tag allows you
13:02
to do is list the people who
13:02
appear in your episode. So you
13:07
would always be in your own
13:07
podcast. So you'd be the host,
13:09
you might have a co host. And
13:09
then you could add other
13:12
additional tags for guests that
13:12
are on your podcast, you'll be
13:15
able to get the person's name,
13:15
the role that they played like
13:17
host or guest or producer or
13:17
whatever, you can give a link to
13:21
where that person's profile
13:21
lives or their Wikipedia page or
13:25
pod chaser, profile, whatever
13:25
you want to link to. And then
13:27
you could also give an image.
13:27
Now third party apps will be
13:30
able to pull that information
13:30
and display it in the app. So if
13:33
you're listening in hyper
13:33
capture, or pocket casts or
13:36
overcast, and you're listening
13:36
to a podcast that has these
13:39
tags, that app could display
13:39
your image and the image of your
13:42
guests. And if you tap on the
13:42
face of the image of your guest,
13:45
it might link might open up
13:45
their Wikipedia page, or it
13:47
might open up their pod chaser
13:47
page. This is stuff that like
13:51
Apple has been able to do an
13:51
apple podcast, if you look at
13:53
any of the top, what is it 200
13:53
or something podcast, I think
13:57
that they started doing it in go
13:57
go look up Conan O'Brien needs a
14:00
friend and Apple podcasts, and
14:00
then scroll under the show
14:03
notes. And you'll see a picture
14:03
of Conan and a picture of his
14:05
associate producer and a picture
14:05
of their guests. And if you tap
14:08
on those things, you get more
14:08
information about those people
14:11
that has not been open to the
14:11
world of podcasters. You know,
14:14
the million plus podcasters that
14:14
are out there, that's only been
14:17
available to the select few that
14:17
Apple has invited into that
14:19
program.
14:20  Alban
This is another argument
14:20
for the podcast index as a whole
14:23
because this is a feature Apple
14:23
rolled out. And Apple said you
14:28
know, it's so much easier for us
14:28
just implement this for
14:30
ourselves rather than trying to
14:30
go through this entire
14:34
podcasting ecosystem. And the
14:34
downside is it unless you are a
14:37
top 200 podcaster or you and you
14:37
listen inside of Apple podcasts
14:43
that doesn't show up. Right. And
14:43
the hope of the podcast index is
14:48
hey, let's democratize this a
14:48
little bit. Now everybody if
14:52
they want can specify these are
14:52
the people on my podcast. Here's
14:55
their photo, here's your
14:55
interest information. And now
14:59
that can be available. We'll in
14:59
all the podcast apps.
15:02  Kevin
Yeah. And I'll just go on
15:02
since we're on a roll, there's
15:05
another tag that we're working
15:05
on, which you're familiar with,
15:07
if you're a Buzzsprout customer,
15:07
you can create sound bites.
15:11
sound bites have traditionally
15:11
been videos that you say, Hey,
15:15
you know, here's an hour long
15:15
podcast, but at minute 20 to 30.
15:19
There's an interesting 45.
15:19
second bit that I think would
15:22
serve as a good promo for the
15:22
episode. So you create this
15:24
video, you download it, and you
15:24
can post it on different social
15:26
sites, we want to take that,
15:26
like the data behind that not
15:30
necessarily the video, but the
15:30
data, that in this episode at 20
15:33
to 30, there's 45 seconds of
15:33
interesting content. And we want
15:36
to add that to your RSS feed.
15:36
That allows third party apps
15:40
like overcast pocket casts hyper
15:40
chaser podcast attic, to then
15:44
read that information, because
15:44
now they have it as well. And so
15:47
now when you go to like the
15:47
Browse or discover section of
15:50
those apps to find new podcasts,
15:50
they might have like a scan
15:52
feature. And they might say,
15:52
Hey, I know that Kevin listens
15:56
to podcasts in the business
15:56
category in the sports category
15:59
in the comedy category. So I'm
15:59
going to look through all the
16:01
podcasts that we have listed in
16:01
our directory. And I'm going to
16:04
find any podcasts that match
16:04
those categories that have sound
16:08
bites, and I'm going to start
16:08
playing the sound bites like
16:10
thank you like a FM radio
16:10
driving around your car in the
16:13
90s or 2000s. And you go into
16:13
scan mode, right? You drive into
16:17
a new town, you're like I'm
16:17
gonna scan the stations and try
16:18
to find a song that I like that
16:18
could happen within podcasts,
16:21
apps, and it could help
16:21
discoverability of new podcasts
16:23
help you find new shows that you
16:23
want to listen to. But right
16:26
now, third party apps can't do
16:26
that. Because the data doesn't
16:29
exist in the RSS feed. So when
16:29
you go to discover the Discover
16:34
section of any podcast app, what
16:34
do you see charts, and where's
16:37
the chart data come from
16:37
primarily apple. And so that's
16:40
not good. Like, we have to be
16:40
able to figure out new ways for
16:44
people to discover podcasts and
16:44
solve this without relying on
16:47
algorithms, who builds good
16:47
algorithms, big tech companies.
16:51
And we note that I'm not going
16:51
to go into the whole tirade of
16:53
why algorithms are dangerous.
16:53
But there is a way to solve
16:57
discoverability or improve
16:57
discoverability without a
16:59
reliance on algorithms and
16:59
things like soundbites might be
17:02
a step in that direction. And so
17:02
again, we need a group of people
17:05
working together to solve these
17:05
problems. And this, this means
17:08
that competitors have to work
17:08
together. So us as a hosting
17:11
company, we have to work with
17:11
other hosting companies to
17:13
figure this out and agree on
17:13
terms of what we're going to put
17:15
in the feed. And then we also
17:15
need apps that compete against
17:18
each other for market share, to
17:18
agree this is good for the
17:20
industry overall. And we're both
17:20
gonna implement it our own way.
17:24
That's what's happening at
17:24
podcasts index, in this open
17:27
source, software development
17:27
group. And it's a great way for
17:30
us to move forward as an open
17:30
community without an lessening
17:33
our dependence and without the
17:33
dependence on these closed
17:36
platforms like Apple podcasts,
17:36
Spotify, Amazon, one day,
17:39
whoever else.
17:43  Travis
So to speak. Speaking of
17:43
sound bites, we recently rolled
17:45
out a new update to our visual
17:45
soundbite tool, which is
17:48
probably one of the more more
17:48
popular features as far as being
17:51
able to share your episodes on
17:51
social media, you can create
17:53
this little video that you can,
17:53
you know, upload, that's a
17:56
teaser for your episode. And
17:56
before, we only had it where you
18:00
would have your podcast artwork,
18:00
and like a text space, and you
18:04
could adjust some colors. But
18:04
then we rolled out the ability
18:06
for you to you know, either
18:06
introduce episode specific
18:10
artwork, and now custom artwork
18:10
images. So Kevin, you want to
18:14
talk about the the changes that
18:14
we made the upgrades and then
18:17
how someone might use the new
18:17
visual sound bites.
18:20  Kevin
Yeah, it's it's super
18:20
simple on the like interface.
18:23
When you log in and you go to
18:23
create a visual soundbite for
18:27
your episode, it looks very
18:27
similar, you still have the two
18:30
options between like a text and
18:30
then our work only. But now when
18:34
you go into artwork, only you
18:34
can upload custom artwork. So if
18:36
you don't want to use your
18:36
podcast artwork, if you don't
18:38
want to use episode specific
18:38
artwork, you can make artwork
18:41
just for this specific
18:41
soundbite. Which is a really
18:44
interesting opportunity. Because
18:44
you know, with a graphic, you
18:48
can do all sorts of things. You
18:48
could have your artwork, or you
18:50
could have an image of the
18:50
person who's talking, you could
18:52
put text over it, you could kind
18:52
of you know, they come up with
18:56
what how do I want to title this
18:56
soundbite and put that text on
19:00
the image, you still get the
19:00
little waveform animated
19:03
waveform graphic that you can
19:03
move around as appropriate. So
19:07
it opens up a whole lot of
19:07
possibilities. And there's still
19:09
all three formats. There's
19:09
square, there's landscape,
19:12
there's portrait format, and
19:12
there's different size
19:14
dimensions, depending on which
19:14
one you choose which size
19:16
graphic you should use. But give
19:16
it a shot, open up your image
19:19
editing application, come up
19:19
with a cool graphic, and upload
19:22
it try it out.
19:23  Travis
Yeah, if you end up
19:23
creating a custom digital
19:25
soundbite with a custom image,
19:25
posted in the Buzzsprout
19:28
Facebook community and tag the
19:28
three of us, we'd love to see
19:31
the kind of stuff that you're
19:31
doing with it. Now when it comes
19:33
to your podcast website.
19:33
Whenever you create a podcast
19:36
with Buzzsprout. We give you a
19:36
website that you can use when
19:39
you're first getting started
19:39
when you're first starting your
19:41
show. And not a lot of people
19:41
know that you can do this but
19:44
you can actually use your own
19:44
domain and map it to the
19:50
Buzzsprout website. So when
19:50
someone goes to my podcast.com
19:53
they just see your podcast. They
19:53
don't even necessarily know that
19:56
it's affiliated with Buzzsprout
19:56
and we just lost overhauled and
20:00
upgraded that whole dashboard,
20:00
where you go through the
20:03
different options of things you
20:03
can do with your podcast
20:06
website. So Kevin, what are what
20:06
are the new things when someone
20:09
goes to website and then website
20:09
URL, kind of walk through the
20:13
different options that people
20:13
have and which ones might fit
20:16
best for which podcasters
20:17  Kevin
Sure, by default, every
20:17
podcast is gets a URL for their
20:22
podcast website, which is
20:22
buzzsprout.com slash something.
20:25
And it's a number, it's an ID,
20:25
it's not super beautiful. There
20:29
is a way that the first
20:29
customization ops option is
20:33
super simple. And it's something
20:33
that everybody should do day
20:35
one. And if you haven't done it
20:35
already, just log in today and
20:38
do it. And that's just, you
20:38
know, personalized. So it's not
20:40
just a number, a random number,
20:40
at the end, you can actually put
20:43
the name of your show or a
20:43
catchphrase or whatever you
20:46
want. And you can have that,
20:46
that buzzsprout.com, bring up
20:50
your podcasts website. So for
20:50
Buzzcast, for example, we have
20:53
buzzcast.buzzsprout.com, if
20:53
anybody opens a web browser and
20:56
goes to buzzcast.buzzsprout.com,
20:56
they land on our podcasts
20:59
website for the show. So that's
20:59
that's like the no brainer, you
21:03
don't have to have go buy a
21:03
custom domain or anything to do
21:06
that. And it's a, it's a super
21:06
friendly way for you to be able
21:10
to mention the website within
21:10
your, your podcast episodes. In
21:16
a way that like, like you're
21:16
mentioning a URL now that people
21:18
can remember, because again,
21:18
most people are listening on
21:20
mobile devices. So when they're
21:20
out walking or driving or
21:22
something, they're not going to
21:22
remember buzzsprout.com slash
21:24
1234569. like no one's gonna
21:24
remember that, but they might
21:27
remember buzzcast.buzzsprout.com
21:27
to find your your website. So I
21:31
would suggest that number one,
21:31
but if you want to go to the
21:33
next level, and you have a
21:33
custom domain for your site, and
21:37
you still want to use the
21:37
Buzzsprout website, you don't
21:39
want to create your own
21:39
WordPress site, or what are some
21:41
of the other ones like a
21:41
Squarespace or Wix site, or even
21:44
your own custom coded website,
21:44
you can do that you can use the
21:48
Buzzsprout website that you get
21:48
with your account, and you can
21:50
use it with your own domain. And
21:50
so that's the third option where
21:53
it says use your custom domain.
21:53
The reason one of the main
21:57
reasons that we revamped This is
21:57
because we needed to get good
22:01
data. So this stuff isn't
22:01
working with domains is not
22:04
super simple thing, especially
22:04
for people who aren't familiar
22:07
haven't done it before. There's
22:07
DNS records and see names and
22:12
names and all this stuff that's
22:12
super complex. So with the
22:15
revamp of the interface, what
22:15
we're trying to do is make it
22:18
simpler to be able to get the
22:18
correct information into
22:21
Buzzsprout. So that we will be
22:21
able to point people who come in
22:24
from your domain to your website
22:24
properly. And getting good data
22:28
is a big part of the process for
22:28
us to be able to innovate and go
22:32
beyond where we are right now as
22:32
well. So that's the motivation
22:36
behind this new domain, make it
22:36
easier for you to set up your
22:38
custom domains. And it also sets
22:38
us up that once we start getting
22:42
good data, and people are using
22:42
this more and more that we'll be
22:45
able to take your website that
22:45
we give you with your Buzzsprout
22:47
account to the next level. So I
22:47
don't want to go too much into
22:51
the things and the features that
22:51
we want to build out on those
22:53
websites. But we want to make
22:53
them more and more robust for
22:56
you make them work better for
22:56
you as podcasts websites. And
22:58
that's not saying they don't
22:58
work right now. But we've got
23:00
some big ideas that we want to
23:00
implement. But it's reliant on
23:03
making sure that people can hook
23:03
up their custom domains
23:05
successfully, before we can roll
23:05
out some of these new features.
23:09  Travis
Yeah, we can't tell you
23:09
about the new holograms feature
23:11
that we're rolling out in the
23:11
near future. So that's good that
23:13
we're going to stay tight lipped
23:13
about that. I don't know you
23:17
could have you know, visual
23:17
sound by playing in the air
23:19
above your phone, that'd be
23:19
pretty cool. add it to the list
23:22
added to the list. Not
23:22
necessarily Buzzsprout dashboard
23:26
UI related. But something cool.
23:26
Something that people have asked
23:29
us about for a while, is Hey,
23:29
you guys wear Buzzsprout shirts
23:33
on all your YouTube videos.
23:33
Where can I get one? And for the
23:35
longest time? The answer was
23:35
well go to a podcast conference,
23:38
we'll give you one for free if
23:38
you come by the booth. But
23:42
Kevin, you just did some great
23:42
work hooking us up with some
23:45
high quality t shirts that it's
23:45
like a store. Now it's a store
23:48
where you can buy Buzzsprout
23:48
Mart right?
23:50  Kevin
It is. And I don't know
23:50
how to tell people to get there
23:52
because they don't have friendly
23:52
URLs like we do
23:55  Alban
like the link in the show
23:55
notes with but we have a cotton
23:58
bureau store. We got super nice
23:58
shirts, and you can like what's
24:04
really nice is that they're all
24:04
custom printed. So we've got a
24:07
bunch of designs that Kevin put
24:07
up and you can kind of go
24:11
through and you can pick out
24:11
like which color you want which
24:14
fit you want which design you
24:14
want. And kind of make a one of
24:19
a kind shirt so a lot of people
24:19
who've shared images on Twitter
24:23
that we've been retweeting like,
24:23
I have not seen the same shirt
24:27
ever show up twice because
24:27
everyone kind of has the option
24:30
to design something themselves.
24:30
I just tested it and it works
24:33
great if you go to cotton
24:33
bureau.com and they have a
24:35
search function in the top left.
24:35
So click up there, type
24:37
Buzzsprout and you'll see all
24:37
the different shirt designs.
24:41
Just for the record my entire
24:41
wardrobe is Buzzsprout t shirts.
24:44  Kevin
I what I wear every day.
24:46  Alban
Kevin is not a load of
24:46
that. I think that john pretty
24:49
much wears them all the time. My
24:49
wife has some I've got of I feel
24:53
like it's like kind of the
24:53
wardrobe for almost everybody in
24:55
our office and all the spouses.
24:55
I'm just I'm holding out for
24:59
that Buzzsprout hoodie to show
24:59
up. At the office, I am so
25:01
excited about
25:01  Kevin
get sweatshirts from
25:01
cotton Bureau. But we did order
25:04
some specific hoodies for people
25:04
that work in the office. Because
25:08
it's getting cold in Florida
25:08
dropped to 80 this week.
25:14  Travis
So we asked you guys in
25:14
the Facebook group, what you
25:16
wanted us to talk about in
25:16
Buzzcast this week, because the
25:19
last time we did it a couple
25:19
episodes ago, you guys really
25:22
liked it. So we'll keep doing
25:22
it. As long as you guys keep
25:24
sending us questions. The first
25:24
question comes from Brad and
25:28
Brad's question is, is it
25:28
necessary to have your guests
25:32
sign a release form? This is
25:32
actually a question that comes
25:35
up pretty frequently in the
25:35
Facebook group. So it'll be good
25:38
thing for us to talk about,
25:38
because depending on who you
25:40
ask, you'll get conflicting
25:40
answers. There's not like a
25:43
consensus answer that you'll
25:43
hear in the podcasting space.
25:46  Alban
All right, so I'll jump
25:46
on this one. As our resident
25:49
lawyer, yeah, I am a lawyer, but
25:49
I am not your lawyer. And I'm
25:53
not giving you legal advice. But
25:53
let me give you my take on it.
25:59
What you get, when you ask
25:59
lawyers or people who work in
26:03
the legal profession about like
26:03
whether or not you should take
26:06
some additional precaution, you
26:06
will always get the answer. Yes.
26:10
They'll always be like, yeah,
26:10
sign a release form, get it
26:13
double notarize do all this
26:13
stuff, so that nothing bad could
26:16
ever ever happen to you in your
26:16
life. But the downside to that
26:20
is you put in all this work, you
26:20
put in a ton of work, getting
26:23
people to sign release forms,
26:23
everyone gets a little bit tight
26:26
when they see like, why am I
26:26
signing a form again? Like,
26:29
wait, what am I doing, maybe I
26:29
need to get someone to look at
26:31
this for me. And you could just
26:31
add a lot of work to your plate
26:36
for something that not really
26:36
pay off. You know, the only time
26:39
that a release form is going to
26:39
be super important is if there's
26:43
a super contentious interview,
26:43
or they want you to take it down
26:46
Well, in most times, you
26:46
probably would just take it down
26:50
anyway, even if you have the
26:50
legal right to keep it up, you
26:52
probably be like, yeah, if you
26:52
don't feel comfortable with what
26:54
you said, why don't I just take
26:54
it down. Um, one benefit I could
26:59
see to getting a release is
26:59
sometimes when you're
27:02
contracting, the main benefit is
27:02
getting everybody on the same
27:06
page. And to get everybody onto
27:06
that same page, you actually
27:11
write out exactly what's going
27:11
to happen. Um, what we've
27:14
actually done, Travis and I did
27:14
a video interview, that'll
27:18
probably come out on the YouTube
27:18
channel. We did last week, just
27:21
after we start recording. That's
27:21
when I say, so we're recording
27:26
this video, here's how we're
27:26
going to use it. Here's how we
27:30
will incorporate your answers
27:30
into future videos. Is that
27:34
okay? And then they say yes. And
27:34
we cover all the bases with just
27:41
a very simple, normal human
27:41
person question of, Hey, this is
27:47
what I plan to do. Are you okay
27:47
with that? And then when they
27:49
say yes, that there's no
27:49
confusion. And so now we've
27:52
gotten on the same page. And I
27:52
think that that's probably what
27:56
I would recommend for most
27:56
podcasters. If you're going to
27:59
have a conversation with
27:59
somebody, and you're a little
28:02
bit afraid that they may ask you
28:02
to take it down, or you just
28:05
want to cover your basis. Once
28:05
you hit record, just say so
28:10
we're recording this, here's how
28:10
to go out. Is that sound cool to
28:13
you? And they'll say yes. And
28:13
you're done.
28:16  Kevin
Yeah, the majority of
28:16
podcasts that I'm on, we have
28:19
some sort of exchange like that
28:19
either at the beginning, usually
28:21
at the beginning, but sometimes
28:21
at the tail end, if if the
28:24
person whose show I'm on doesn't
28:24
do at the beginning, then I'll
28:27
usually instigate it at the end.
28:27
And it's very much like you
28:29
said, Robin, it's like, let's
28:29
just be clear, this conversation
28:32
is being recorded. Let's be
28:32
clear of who owns the content.
28:34
So I'm a guest on your show, I
28:34
don't own or claim, right, or
28:36
copyright to any of the content
28:36
that I'm giving to you right
28:40
now, for no monetary exchange,
28:40
it's yours. What you do with it
28:43
is completely up to you whether
28:43
you publish episode or not, like
28:46
I don't go into any interview
28:46
with an expectation that, I
28:50
mean, just being a podcaster. I
28:50
know sometimes we do, you know,
28:53
a great hour, and it's amazing,
28:53
and you want to publish it,
28:56
sometimes you do about hour and
28:56
we weren't on today. So we might
28:59
reschedule and try for another
28:59
time. Or you might just say,
29:00
hey, this person might not be a
29:00
great fit for my show. I love
29:03
giving people the flexibility to
29:03
do it's their show, do what you
29:06
want with it when I sign up and
29:06
say, Yes, I'll be on your
29:09
podcast, I'm giving you an hour.
29:09
And at the end of that hour,
29:12
hopefully you love it and it
29:12
serves you well and meets your
29:15
goals and you publish it and
29:15
loving it helps your podcast
29:18
grow. But if it doesn't, I don't
29:18
want you to feel forced to have
29:21
to figure out how to work this
29:21
in or how to fix all the dumb
29:24
things that I said, don't feel
29:24
that pressure. And I tell people
29:26
that all the time when I agree
29:26
to be a guest on their show. So
29:29
I would ask anybody who came on
29:29
our show, we try to ask them the
29:33
same thing. Like we got an hour
29:33
scheduled today. Let's have a
29:35
great conversation, we'll do our
29:35
best. But hey, if it doesn't
29:37
work out, we might not publish,
29:37
I want you to know that up
29:40
front. I can't guarantee that
29:40
we're gonna publish it or use
29:42
it. I want you understand that
29:42
this is our contents our show.
29:44
So you're donating your time to
29:44
us. And the conversations being
29:47
recorded. Are we clear on all
29:47
those things? Are you
29:48
comfortable with all those
29:48
things? They say yes, we go into
29:50
the session. And it's just it's
29:50
just nice and friendly. Now that
29:54
doesn't mean that a month from
29:54
now, somebody might not say you
29:57
know, I wish I didn't say that.
29:57
It's actually blowing up. It's
29:59
causing me a lot of time.
29:59
trouble when you take it down,
30:01
I'll have that conversation with
30:01
anybody at any time, because I'm
30:04
a friendly person and respectful
30:04
of them. But I don't want the
30:07
legal obligation to have to take
30:07
it down. Like it also might turn
30:10
out, that's one of my most
30:10
popular episodes. And I could
30:12
explain that to them, we could
30:12
have a conversation about I
30:14
don't want to be in a situation
30:14
where they're gonna bring a
30:16
lawsuit against me. But again,
30:16
99.9% of these times, these
30:19
things can be worked out by
30:19
being a nice person and being
30:21
reasonable and listening to both
30:21
sides and having a conversation.
30:23
And I will also say this, if I
30:23
ever asked if I agreed to be on
30:26
somebody's show, and they sent
30:26
me a legal form design, I would
30:28
not sign it. Now, that's just me
30:28
personally, I will not do it.
30:32
Because like, I'm already
30:32
donating you an hour or so of my
30:35
time to be on your show, I just
30:35
don't want to jump through any
30:38
additional hoops, I don't want
30:38
to read your agreement, I don't
30:40
want to have to send your
30:40
agreement to Alvin, my legal
30:43
friend, and have him read it and
30:43
take up his time, I don't want
30:46
to make sure I'm not agreeing to
30:46
something that I didn't realize
30:48
I was agreeing to. So my rule is
30:48
just I won't sign it. So if you
30:52
go ahead and take that step of
30:52
getting an agreement drawn up,
30:55
you might have to realize also,
30:55
the flip side of that is that
30:57
there might be a lot of people
30:57
who you want to have in your
30:58
show, who just aren't willing to
30:58
go through the burden of
31:03
analyzing your agreement, make
31:03
sure they're comfortable signing
31:05
it,
31:05  Travis
not to beat a dead
31:05
horse. But one other thing to
31:08
consider is just the kind of
31:08
podcast you have and the kind of
31:10
guests that you have. So if you
31:10
know that the people that you're
31:13
having on your podcast, can be
31:13
kind of flippant in that way of
31:16
like, well, I like that I'm on
31:16
your podcast now. But two weeks
31:19
from now, I might change my
31:19
mind. You know, use some
31:22
discretion, use some wisdom. And
31:22
you know, there are very simple
31:26
podcast guests release forms.
31:26
I'll link to one in the show
31:28
notes, where it is written in
31:28
plain English, but it does cover
31:32
your bases. And you're going to
31:32
send it Some say, hey, just sign
31:35
this before you jump on. And,
31:35
you know, we'll be we'll be
31:37
ready to rock and roll.
31:38  Alban
Don't send it to Kevin as
31:38
he will not sign it
31:41  Kevin
will not be your Yeah.
31:45  Alban
All right, What other
31:45
questions do we have?
31:46  Travis
Another question that we
31:46
have is from Donna. Donna asks,
31:51
How can we get more feedback or
31:51
analytics on how long listeners
31:55
Listen, like, where do they
31:55
typically drop if they do stop
31:59
listening in the middle of the
31:59
episode, and I feel like the
32:01
best place to find this
32:01
information is inside of Apple's
32:04
podcast Connect analytics. So
32:04
Apple podcasts has their own
32:08
analytics platform that shows
32:08
you how your podcast and your
32:12
episodes are performing on their
32:12
app. There's some funky filters
32:16
that they put on that data. So
32:16
it's not a complete picture of
32:19
your podcast consumption in
32:19
Apple podcasts. So like, I think
32:23
the last time I checked for like
32:23
a Buzzcast episode, it shows
32:27
like 27 plays and Apple podcasts
32:27
for an episode that if you go to
32:31
buzz, like Buzzsprout, it shows
32:31
like 650. And so it's like
32:35
there's some filters that go in
32:35
there. But they do have some
32:39
charts that show you, you know,
32:39
kind of over time, the
32:42
percentage of people that are
32:42
still listening at any point in
32:44
the episode. So if that's the
32:44
kind of information you're
32:47
looking for, I would go to Apple
32:47
and their analytics platform,
32:51
which we have a link to in our
32:51
stats page. So if you just go to
32:54
your stats and Buzzsprout and
32:54
scroll to the bottom, there's a
32:56
button there to go and log in to
32:56
Apple podcast Connect.
33:00  Kevin
If you log into Apple
33:00
podcasts connect and you're not
33:01
seeing any stats for your show,
33:01
or it says not enough data. I
33:05
don't know maybe Travis you know
33:05
the exact numbers, but I think
33:07
it's around you need like 100
33:07
plays per episode or something
33:10
in five episodes. Is that right?
33:10
For me,
33:13  Travis
you need five plays that
33:13
fit into their criteria for a
33:18
particular episode. So the full
33:18
criteria is the person listening
33:22
has to have given Apple
33:22
permission to share their
33:26
diagnostics data, okay? So so
33:26
they have to give Apple explicit
33:30
permission, saying you can have
33:30
data about how I'm using your
33:33
phone, then they have to be
33:33
listening on a current version
33:37
of Apple podcasts. So if they
33:37
haven't updated the app in a
33:39
while, it also won't show iOS 11
33:39
or later, right? I think so. So
33:44
if they're listening on an old
33:44
iPhone and they haven't updated
33:46
the app, then that won't show
33:46
either. There's also a 72 hour
33:49
delay. So somebody listens to
33:49
your podcast on Monday, their
33:52
data won't show up in podcast
33:52
connects until Thursday at the
33:55
earliest. And then if you have
33:55
fewer than five plays on that
34:01
episode, within the timeframe
34:01
window that you're looking at,
34:04
whether that's last 30 days or
34:04
last 60 days or whatever, then
34:08
it won't show anything. So you
34:08
could have 100 people that
34:11
listen to your podcast and Apple
34:11
podcast four of the meet all the
34:14
criteria to show up. And but
34:14
because you don't have five,
34:17
it'll say zero people. So it's
34:17
not a good indicator of like how
34:20
many people are listening in
34:20
Apple podcasts. But if you want
34:23
to look at what a subsection, or
34:23
sub segment of your audience is
34:27
doing in Apple podcasts, and how
34:27
much of the podcasts are
34:29
listening to, then it can become
34:29
helpful. Okay.
34:33  Kevin
So at the end of the day,
34:33
if you log in and says no data
34:35
available, just keep plugging
34:35
away. Hopefully you'll get there
34:38
soon. But you do need a certain
34:38
amount of data in Apple before
34:41
they're going to show you
34:41
anything.
34:42  Alban
That is correct. One
34:42
question we also get on this is
34:46
people who reach out and they
34:46
say, hey, why isn't Buzzsprout
34:49
showing me this data? And
34:49
there's a couple reasons for
34:54
that. But the main one is the
34:54
only way that we would ever see
34:57
this data is on our own players.
34:57
And we could display that. But
35:03
you have to remember players are
35:03
a very embed players is a very
35:07
different listening experience
35:07
than what people are doing on
35:10
their phone. I know for myself,
35:10
personally, when I listen to
35:15
something on a podcast player, I
35:15
mostly listened to maybe like 30
35:18
seconds. And if I like it, I
35:18
download the episode to my
35:22
phone, and I listened to it on a
35:22
run, if I don't like it, and I
35:26
just turn it off. But you would
35:26
just get this data, they would
35:30
say, you know, some people are
35:30
listening to this episode for
35:33
like, 30 seconds. And that's it.
35:33
And you would, you would
35:36
probably read that as, Oh,
35:36
there's a problem with this
35:39
episode. Nobody is listening to
35:39
it. Well, the reason would be
35:44
you, the only data Buzzsprout
35:44
could ever give you is such a
35:47
bad sample, that it would
35:47
actually confuse you more than
35:52
it would help you. Um, so so
35:52
there are other hosts that will
35:56
provide that data. But that is
35:56
actually just a piece of data
35:58
we've decided to not show
35:58
because it really does not help
36:02
inform you in any way about how
36:02
people are really consuming your
36:07
podcast. So that's why we always
36:07
say, Apple podcast is the best
36:11
place to look. Spotify also
36:11
provides this data, Google
36:14
provides some of this data. And
36:14
so we provide the links in our
36:18
stats to those because those are
36:18
actually what's happening in the
36:22
apps. And that's much more
36:22
representative of how people are
36:27
listening to your podcast,
36:28  Travis
while said. And then the
36:28
last question that I've got here
36:31
is from Don. So Don asks, What
36:31
is the outlook of the podcast
36:36
industry for 2021? and asked if
36:36
we have any predictions, perhaps
36:41
about what podcasting will look
36:41
like, in actually not too not
36:45
too long from now, a couple
36:45
months from now. But what is
36:48
2021 look like for podcasting.
36:50  Alban
So one kind of hot take,
36:50
I would throw in there, I don't
36:53
know how hot this take is. This
36:53
may be like, mild hot, this is
36:59
not super hot. I think the two
36:59
biggest ad sellers on the
37:04
internet, are Google and
37:04
Facebook. And they do a massive
37:08
amount of the digital
37:08
advertising on the web. And
37:11
right now, the two of them are
37:11
very far away from podcasting.
37:17
Google has Google podcasts, and
37:17
they do some things, but none,
37:21
neither of them have any
37:21
connection to selling ads and
37:24
podcasts. And at the same time,
37:24
we're seeing Spotify get
37:28
incredible evaluations based on
37:28
all their work in podcast ad
37:33
tech, a lot of people are
37:33
interested in it. And that just
37:37
leads me to think the two people
37:37
who actually will benefit from
37:42
you know, who have a lot of
37:42
desire to get into this space
37:45
have not Facebook and Google. So
37:45
I would not be surprised if one
37:50
of the two of them makes a big
37:50
acquisition and makes a big move
37:53
and says, Hey, we're gonna try
37:53
to start selling ads in
37:56
podcasts. I don't know exactly
37:56
how to do it. A lot of those ad
38:00
tech companies have been
38:00
purchased by somebody. But I
38:04
think at the 2021 mild
38:04
heartache, we could see one of
38:10
those to start stepping in to
38:10
selling ads on podcasts.
38:14  Kevin
Yeah, I don't think it's
38:14
out of the realm of possibility.
38:17
I think my like friendly
38:17
amendment to what you just said,
38:22
would be, I think we might see
38:22
some larger companies who have
38:28
kind of cracked ad tech in
38:28
different verticals, like
38:32
cracked it in the search space
38:32
and cracked it in the social
38:34
space, they might start
38:34
experimenting in the podcasting
38:37
space. Because what's happening
38:37
right now the experiments that
38:40
have been done so far, have not
38:40
like produced the results or
38:43
given the returns that I think
38:43
have caught the interest of some
38:46
of these larger companies. That
38:46
I think is the most dangerous
38:49
thing and potentially disruptive
38:49
thing to open podcasting is if
38:52
somebody figures out an ad,
38:52
either whether whether it be ad
38:55
tech, or an ad methodology or a
38:55
process or something that is
38:59
super effective and super, like
38:59
technically possible to roll out
39:03
in podcasting, the way that
39:03
podcasting works today. I think
39:07
that could be very disruptive.
39:07
But I don't think that's like, I
39:11
don't even know if it's
39:11
possible. It's not a technology
39:13
problem. I think it's a medium
39:13
as like a format problem.
39:17
podcasts are long form on demand
39:17
content. And I don't think that
39:22
plays well, with all of the ad
39:22
tech that's currently working
39:26
really well. Like there's no,
39:26
there's no intent, Google
39:29
crushes it with the Google
39:29
search engine, because there's
39:33
intent like we know what people
39:33
are looking for. So we can
39:35
charge people to show up in
39:35
those results. That makes a lot
39:38
of sense. There's like the
39:38
YouTube space and how they put
39:43
ads around videos, short form
39:43
content, you know, very
39:48
entertainment driven, very
39:48
attention focused. And so they
39:51
can figure out and optimize
39:51
their algorithms to serve ads
39:54
that are not disruptive that
39:54
won't push people off platform.
39:57
A lot of their ads are five
39:57
seconds later, their ads are 15
39:59
seconds. They can optimize like,
39:59
how long do we have to play an
40:01
ad before we allow them to skip,
40:01
so they won't jump off the
40:03
platform. All of that stuff is
40:03
very different. In podcasting,
40:07
podcasting is a very different
40:07
thing. And the only thing that's
40:08
really proven effective so far,
40:08
and not just effective, but very
40:12
effective, are host read
40:12
endorsement, advertisements or
40:16
sponsorships. That stuff doesn't
40:16
scale very well, like it doesn't
40:20
scale well enough to catch the
40:20
interest of huge large ad
40:24
corporations like Google and
40:24
Facebook, and whoever else wants
40:27
to jump into the space. They
40:27
will net I don't think they'll
40:30
ever be able to, you know, get
40:30
podcasters at scale, to give
40:36
hosts read endorsements for
40:36
dozens of things that they can
40:39
optimize. And so maybe it'll
40:39
happen one day, but I, I think
40:45
that's the huge barrier is
40:45
podcast advertising isn't
40:48
necessarily effective. When you
40:48
do dynamic ads that are just
40:51
dropped in, pre roll, mid roll
40:51
post roll between episodes that
40:55
are just the same ads that we're
40:55
used to hearing on YouTube or
40:58
Facebook or anywhere else. The
40:58
ones that are effective or host
41:01
read and host read ads don't
41:01
scale and can't be optimized.
41:04  Alban
Alright, so let me give
41:04
you the counterpoint to this.
41:06
Because this is my hot take, or
41:06
my medium take this is my
41:09
prediction. Google already is
41:09
working on a product when they
41:14
bought FameBit for YouTube. And
41:14
then they now we're making this
41:18
new product on the ad side,
41:18
where they will work with
41:21
advertisers to get you
41:21
sponsorships in YouTube videos.
41:25
And it's not public yet, but it
41:25
is being they're working on it.
41:29
And I think that podcasting
41:29
could get something a little bit
41:33
closer to that. So imagine this
41:33
is the world. I go in as an
41:37
advertiser, and I say, hey, I
41:37
want to get on a bunch of
41:39
podcasts. It's got to be
41:39
branding, brand related, it's
41:43
not going to be direct action,
41:43
like hey, go and sign up for
41:46
this thing, but like, hey, Blue
41:46
Apron is pretty cool. Check it
41:50
out, like listen, like overtime,
41:50
learn about Blue Apron. So the
41:54
brand advertiser goes to Google
41:54
ads, and then they put in I want
41:59
to be on podcast, here's the
41:59
type of people I want to reach.
42:02
And here's what I want you to
42:02
talk about. And then that is
42:06
proposed to any of the
42:06
podcasters who are hooked up.
42:09
And then they do a host read ad.
42:09
And then it is inserted into the
42:14
podcast. But it is always the
42:14
host read, I think if we ever
42:18
got to a point where it was like
42:18
commercials again, like that's
42:20
gonna be a huge loss for
42:20
everybody. Because the real
42:24
value of a podcasting ad is that
42:24
it's read by the host, and
42:28
endorsed by the host. And so you
42:28
could imagine like a host goes
42:32
through and says, These are the
42:32
only 20 companies out of this
42:35
huge list that I have any
42:35
affinity for. So I'll read ads
42:38
for them. And those are the only
42:38
ones that can go into my
42:40
podcast. Like I could see that
42:40
being the future, rather than
42:45
some other way. What do you
42:45
think?
42:46  Kevin
Well, yeah, I mean, you
42:46
know, I'm not I'm not against
42:48
that model. But that is what
42:48
popcorn is doing. It's an ad
42:52
marketplace. It's not a it's not
42:52
dynamic content insertion at
42:55
scale, ad network. It's not
42:55
using algorithms is not being
42:59
optimized. And so I think that
42:59
it's possible that the
43:03
podcasting market becomes big
43:03
enough one day where that is of
43:06
interest to a company like
43:06
Google, I just think we're a
43:08
long way from it. Like the idea
43:08
of fame, that being an
43:11
attractive model for Google
43:11
wasn't realistic until they had
43:15
hundreds of millions of
43:15
channels. Well, podcasts total,
43:18
like if we actually look at
43:18
legitimate active podcasts, how
43:21
many are there, quarter million,
43:21
like, if we're being super
43:25
generous, a half a million, if
43:25
we're saying like, had published
43:27
an episode in the past six
43:27
months, maybe half a million, if
43:30
the market is just way, way
43:30
small. And I don't think it's of
43:34
interest to them, which I think
43:34
is fantastic for independent
43:37
podcasters. Because the
43:37
opportunity is ripe, like you
43:39
don't want to be in an industry,
43:39
like right now hopping on
43:43
YouTube and building a channel
43:43
to 100,000 subscribers, which is
43:46
a massive amount of work takes a
43:46
massive amount of time. And you
43:49
can spend a lot of money on
43:49
equipment and ads to promote
43:52
your show and your channel and
43:52
everything else. And then you
43:55
start getting checks from Google
43:55
for $100 a month when you turn
43:57
on AdSense, like that doesn't
43:57
make sense. But it's the
44:01
opposite. Right now, in
44:01
podcasting, you build an
44:03
audience of 10,000 in the
44:03
podcasting world, and you can
44:06
attract sponsors that will pay
44:06
you 20 and $30. CPM. If you want
44:10
to do the CPM model, which you
44:10
don't even have to do like I
44:12
like the idea of using that as a
44:12
point of reference to start. But
44:15
I like value based advertising,
44:15
like the idea of, hey, it's $500
44:19
for a 32nd pre roll on my show,
44:19
I need you to buy for up front.
44:23
And at the end of that, evaluate
44:23
it. If I help drive more
44:25
business to you. Let's do it
44:25
again. If not, don't like the
44:28
idea of doing CPM. Again, CPM is
44:28
a good starting point. But it's
44:32
not something you should be
44:32
selling on. But if we ever get
44:34
to the point in podcasting,
44:34
where ad tech is driving dynamic
44:38
ads, or even populating a
44:38
marketplace, the prices are
44:41
going to be way low. Way low,
44:41
like right now is the heyday.
44:45
And it's not like short term.
44:45
It's not like the heyday is here
44:48
today. But it'll be gone in the
44:48
next year or two. Like I think
44:51
we've got a good runway like the
44:51
next five years independent
44:54
podcasters could again if you
44:54
want to don't feel pressure to
44:58
monetize your show, if that's
44:58
not one of your goals. But if it
45:00
is one of your goals, this is a
45:00
great place to be able to do it.
45:03
Probably not. And I would never
45:03
say this, that this is an
45:06
opportunity for you to replace
45:06
your day job. But you can easily
45:09
with I shouldn't say easily with
45:09
hard work and effort and
45:12
determination, there is plenty
45:12
of opportunity to cover the cost
45:16
of doing something that you
45:16
love.
45:18  Alban
Okay, so let me take on
45:18
number two prediction. The
45:22
podcast industry as a whole is
45:22
going to continue on this
45:26
trajectory we've been on for the
45:26
last five years of really,
45:30
really strong growth, more
45:30
podcasts, more tools, more
45:34
podcast listeners, I mean, the
45:34
people who have been in the
45:38
space for a long time, it feels
45:38
like it's saturated, you're
45:41
like, Oh, if only I'd started
45:41
510 years ago, it would have
45:45
been easier. Well, it's still
45:45
the days where starting a
45:49
podcast and doing a good show.
45:49
You can build slowly over time
45:53
and get a good amount of
45:53
listeners. The industry is going
45:57
to continue growing, we are
45:57
still early. So I think by the
46:01
end of next year, there's like
46:01
one and a half million listed
46:06
podcasts, less than half a
46:06
million that are actually
46:09
active. I bet those numbers
46:09
double by next year. That would
46:12
be my prediction as far as like
46:12
size.
46:15  Kevin
Absolutely. The numbers
46:15
have doubled this year, they
46:17
will at least double again next
46:17
year, the number of customers
46:20
that we've had on Buzzsprout. Am
46:20
I crazy? And have they almost
46:23
tripled by the end of the year.
46:23
They will Yeah, like podcasting
46:27
is growing like crazy, for sure.
46:27
But we are still very young and
46:31
very, very small. Like I think
46:31
that this growth continues or
46:35
even ramps for the next five
46:35
years easily,
46:38  Travis
which complements my hot
46:38
take my prediction for 2021
46:41
which is that we're going to see
46:41
more podcast specific hardware.
46:46
So for most of podcasting
46:46
existence, we simply repurposed
46:52
equipment that was made for
46:52
other things, right. So we've
46:56
repurposed radio microphones and
46:56
microphones that Michael Jackson
47:00
used to record his thriller
47:00
album, and said, Hey, that will
47:03
probably work for my podcast. Or
47:03
let me go and get this mixer.
47:07
That's like a music mixing board
47:07
for recording five instruments
47:10
at once and cobble together this
47:10
thing to make my podcast. We're
47:14
starting to see more companies
47:14
bring out podcast specific gear.
47:18
So zoom just released their pod
47:18
track p four, which is their
47:21
first podcast specific audio
47:21
interface, which we just did a
47:25
big review on, which we really
47:25
like we're big fans of it. rode
47:28
put up the road caster pro last
47:28
year, sure just released the
47:32
shore MV seven, which is like
47:32
the little brother to the SM
47:35
seven B that has the USB
47:35
capability to go right in your
47:38
computer. So one of the things
47:38
I'm excited about is seeing the
47:41
innovation in the hardware space
47:41
of the recording equipment that
47:44
we're gonna start to see coming
47:44
out that is podcast specific,
47:48
versus having to repurpose
47:48
things that are used for
47:50
streaming or gaming or for music
47:50
production.
47:52  Alban
Yeah. For anybody who
47:52
didn't catch Travis's comment.
47:56
He said, we're using microphones
47:56
that Michael Jackson used to
47:59
record thriller, The Shure SM
47:59
seven B, which is what I use is
48:04
at least supposedly, what
48:04
Michael Jackson used to record
48:07
thriller. I don't know that for
48:07
sure. And now sure is launching
48:11
something that looks pretty
48:11
similar. That has just a ton
48:14
more podcast capabilities. And
48:14
it's so much cheaper, the in the
48:18
seven, which Kevin has in his
48:18
house, and we're going to do an
48:22
unboxing and a review, I think
48:22
next week. So it will be super
48:27
interesting to look at this
48:27
gear, when it's made for
48:30
podcasters. It is very
48:30
different. And I think that
48:35
overall, the barriers to entry
48:35
to podcasting continue to go
48:39
down, as the equipment is made
48:39
for podcasters I plugs right
48:44
into your computer rather than
48:44
to a huge soundboard. Because
48:47
that's not always really needed
48:47
for podcasters. And, you know,
48:52
we've, you think about all the
48:52
editing tools, we use many of
48:56
the editing tools like audacity
48:56
or GarageBand were made for
48:59
music. And then there's things
48:59
like Hindenburg, that are you
49:04
made quite a bit more for you
49:04
actually, for podcasters.
49:08  Travis
I mean, even to scripts
49:08
to script came out recently.
49:11  Alban
Yeah, the scripts
49:11
probably the better example of
49:13
that. Another prediction, I
49:13
think is we're seeing this
49:16
overall move by businesses,
49:16
celebrities, politicians, lots
49:21
of people with kind of higher
49:21
profiles, start moving towards
49:25
what I would call owned media,
49:25
where they actually are
49:28
connecting directly to their
49:28
customers, voters, audience,
49:32
however, that would be defined
49:32
for them. And I think a lot of
49:35
them are going to see the
49:35
credible attraction of
49:38
podcasting, because you do get a
49:38
long form genuine connection
49:43
with your audience. And so we'll
49:43
see more of them start podcast.
49:48
I mean, we did see this in the
49:48
Democratic candidates, a lot of
49:52
them either started podcast or
49:52
have since started podcasts. And
49:58
I think we're gonna see more of
49:58
that. I think that's a great
50:02
thing for this the podcasting
50:02
industry because what does that
50:05
end up doing? If somebody wants
50:05
to listen to, you know, their
50:10
favorite tech CEO, or they want
50:10
to listen to the person that
50:14
they really love in politics,
50:14
well, they've got to download
50:17
that app. And they've got to
50:17
start listening to podcasts. And
50:20
that just grows the listener
50:20
base for all of us. You know,
50:23
we've never seen moments where
50:23
big podcasters join the
50:27
industry. And it actually
50:27
depresses the numbers for
50:30
people's podcasts. When cereal
50:30
launched a bunch of people got
50:33
into podcasting, podcasting,
50:33
industry stats went up for
50:37
everybody, because it's not
50:37
right now. It's not zero sum. If
50:41
somebody gets a listener, you
50:41
lose one. It's actually they
50:44
bring new people to podcasting.
50:44
And so I think we will see more
50:47
high profile podcasts that are
50:47
just kind of laid back
50:52
conversations. And as those
50:52
happen, I think we're gonna see
50:56
listener numbers get a little
50:56
bit of a bump.
50:59  Kevin
Yeah, I think it's I
50:59
think that's interesting. I
51:02
totally agree with your analysis
51:02
on it. Your take on it, it would
51:04
be a good thing as more and more
51:04
people with large followings hop
51:08
into podcasting. Totally agree.
51:08
I think that you know what I was
51:11
thinking about that when you
51:11
were saying that is it's so
51:13
interesting, the difference
51:13
between the mediums and I'm just
51:16
comparing podcasting and like a
51:16
YouTube channel, like, why is it
51:19
like what is the draw of
51:19
podcasting? that's bringing in
51:23
Celebrity, more and more than
51:23
we've seen that on YouTube? Like
51:26
we don't see, whatever? Justin
51:26
Long, Justin Long, like, he's
51:29
kind of like a B.
51:31  Alban
Actor. I have no idea who
51:31
that is.
51:32  Kevin
Well, he's the guy used
51:32
to be in those Apple
51:34
commercials. He's like, I'm a
51:34
PC. I'm a Mac, you know, he was
51:36
the skinny Mac, okay, you've got
51:36
a podcast, like, I'm sure he has
51:39
a fan base, and they're big, and
51:39
he does a podcast. The guy who
51:43
used to be on I can't remember
51:43
their names Jason Bateman. And
51:46
the guy who does the voice of
51:46
Batman in the Batman Lego
51:49
movies, Will Arnett Will Arnett,
51:49
and somebody else, the guy used
51:53
to be on willing grace.
51:53
Somebody, the three of them just
51:56
launched a podcast together like
51:56
a comedy podcast, I'm gonna be
51:59
like, what is it about
51:59
podcasting, and this format that
52:02
is drawing celebrity, I don't
52:02
see any of these channels
52:04
existing on YouTube, the thing
52:07  Alban
that stands out to me is,
52:07
when you're a celebrity, I think
52:11
that you're always crafting this
52:11
image. And it's being projected,
52:15
and it's highly refined. And
52:15
it's all often refined by
52:18
someone that's not the celebrity
52:18
themselves. So When will our
52:22
nets in a movie or TV show?
52:22
Well, people are editing that
52:26
and changing it so that it's
52:26
kind of their version of him.
52:31
And I'm sure that they kind of
52:31
crave the ability to talk to
52:35
their fans in a genuine way. And
52:35
podcasting there, it's so easy
52:41
to just sit down behind a mic
52:41
and have a conversation,
52:44
especially if you're a person
52:44
who has kind of a built in fan
52:47
base, because you're already
52:47
well known. And if people are
52:51
interested in just hearing your
52:51
riffs on life, and what you
52:54
think about what's going on in
52:54
the world, well, then you've
52:57
kind of got a podcast already
52:57
set up for you. And all it's
53:00
gonna take is an hour and a half
53:00
your time. And you'll be able to
53:04
connect and just such a more
53:04
genuine real level than you
53:07
would if you were doing a
53:07
YouTube video where it had to be
53:11
really crisp and really edited,
53:11
because that's kind of what they
53:15
already are doing in other
53:15
spaces.
53:18  Kevin
Okay, I'm going to drop
53:18
mine. It's not a prediction. I
53:21
don't want to do prediction. But
53:21
I want to do a desire, like a
53:23
hope what I hope somebody starts
53:23
building in the podcast space.
53:27
And that would be more
53:27
interactive, time shifted, or on
53:31
demand listener experiences. I
53:31
equate this in my mind to like
53:35
what Netflix did. And I think it
53:35
launched either shortly before,
53:38
or just a happy coincidence that
53:38
they launched their, where they
53:41
called watch party, mm, UI and
53:41
stuff. They launched that around
53:46
the time that a lot of people
53:46
were being locked down in
53:48
quarantine, and started becoming
53:48
very popular thing. I think
53:51
there's an opportunity in
53:51
podcasting for something like
53:53
that to happen. Right now, a lot
53:53
of people will listen to a
53:56
podcast, and then they want to
53:56
talk to other people about those
53:58
podcasts. And it's kind of how
53:58
podcasts grow right now is word
54:01
of mouth. But oftentimes, I find
54:01
myself telling somebody about a
54:04
great episode of a podcast I
54:04
just listened to. And then I
54:07
have to wait for them to go
54:07
watch it. Or I'm sorry, not
54:09
watch it, but listen to it. And
54:09
then hopefully I'll bump into
54:12
them again next week. And now we
54:12
can have a conversation about
54:14
it. Because now you listen to
54:14
it. But now it's like a week old
54:16
for me. And so I can't remember
54:16
everything that this podcast, so
54:19
it's difficult opportunity. Like
54:19
it used to be different, right
54:23
when we had like primetime
54:23
network TV like did you watch
54:25
that? Seinfeld last night and
54:25
Haha, we're laughing about
54:27
Seinfeld, because we both had to
54:27
tune in at 830 to watch that
54:30
episode. And we can talk about
54:30
on Friday podcast and anytime
54:33
shifting medium is different in
54:33
that we're not going to watch or
54:37
listen at the same time. And so
54:37
Netflix is trying to solve that
54:40
problem with this idea of kind
54:40
of watch parties like let's all
54:42
get together at this time and
54:42
watch this episode that we like.
54:45
Like I think there's opportunity
54:45
to do something like that and in
54:47
podcasting, but it doesn't
54:47
necessarily have to be real time
54:51
because it's not visual and part
54:51
of the draw of podcasting is
54:54
that it's passive so I can
54:54
listen to it on my walk or
54:56
something. But if somebody
54:56
created a group, where I could
54:59
be like, Hey, I'm And Travis, I
54:59
really liked this podcast
55:02
episode, I'm going to share it
55:02
with you. And here's, you know,
55:05
two or three of the things that
55:05
I loved about it. And then you
55:06
guys could come comment under
55:06
that. And you can comment under
55:08
that. I would really love that.
55:08
This feels like a little bit of
55:13
an add on to what we see and
55:13
like good pots, because good
55:15
pods has like all the
55:15
commenting, people being able to
55:18
discuss asynchronously discuss a
55:18
podcast episode that they
55:22
enjoyed, you can listen to it. I
55:22
don't know if they have the
55:25
ability to like timestamp, like,
55:25
Oh, this is a good point. I
55:28
wonder what was going on here.
55:28
But you could totally see them
55:30
adding that.
55:31  Alban
Yeah. And it'd be pretty
55:31
cool that if you know, you could
55:34
be listening, and you hear
55:34
something that's interesting,
55:38
you know, I wonder what their
55:38
time out there. And then all of
55:39
a sudden, there's comments
55:39
popping up from people who have
55:42
previously left comments at that
55:42
timestamp saying like, Oh, I
55:46
like this. I don't like that. I
55:46
wonder if they have considered
55:49
these points?
55:51  Kevin
Yeah, I don't know. I'm
55:51
just I've just been thinking
55:54
about I think about the draw for
55:54
my children now because they
55:57
don't get out as much. So they
55:57
don't go to the movies with
55:59
friends. But like, Netflix watch
55:59
party is a popular thing for my
56:02
daughter who's 15 to be able to
56:02
do on a Friday night, like
56:04
she'll go up in a room and 10
56:04
o'clock should pop up on her
56:06
laptop and all of her friends
56:06
will get along and they'll watch
56:08
an old movie together. And
56:08
they're chatting the whole time
56:10
about what's going on in the
56:10
movie. I don't know if something
56:12
like that could work in
56:12
podcasting, but it feels like a
56:14
low barrier of entry app to kind
56:14
of build and put out there and
56:18
see if it takes off in
56:18
podcasting, I think it'd be an
56:20
interesting experiment. So
56:20
that's kind of it's not a
56:23
prediction, but it is a hope or
56:23
desire that I see that I would
56:26
like somebody to take on. I'd be
56:26
bullish about it, I'd talk about
56:29
it, I try it out.
56:30  Travis
Awesome. Well, that does
56:30
it for another episode of
56:33
Buzzcast. If you have not yet
56:33
already done so make sure that
56:37
you go and subscribe to the
56:37
Buzzsprout YouTube channel so we
56:39
can get that nice shiny silver
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56:42
which is super cool. We've been
56:45
pumping out a lot of content
56:45
there recently. We got the P for
56:48
the pod track before review, the
56:48
test went up. We're going to be
56:51
reviewing the new shirt MV seven
56:51
microphone in the near future
56:54
and putting that up before the
56:54
end of November or beginning of
56:57
December that timeframe. So make
56:57
sure that you're over there
57:00
subscribe so you can get all the
57:00
new content as it comes out.
57:03
Well that's it for today. Thanks
57:03
for listening. And as always
57:07
keep podcasts