Buzzcast

Buzzcast is a roundtable discussion about podcasting from the people at Buzzsprout. We'll cover current events and news, podcast strategy, tools we are using, and dip into the Customer Support mailbag to test our podcasting knowledge. If you want to stay up-to-date on what's working in podcasting, Buzzcast is the show for you.

https://buzzcast.buzzsprout.com/

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episode 59: Podcasting 2.0 with Dave Jones + Video Buzzcast Update [transcript]


In this episode, the crew discusses why we're hitting pause on uploading Buzzcast to YouTube, Dave Jones joins the show to talk about Podcasting 2.0, and we open up the mailbag to answer your podcasting questions.

Links from this episode:

  • Check out Podcast Index
  • Zapier for automated social media posts
  • How to Rebrand Your Podcast


Review Buzzcast in Podchaser or Apple Podcasts to let us know what you think of the show.

Buzzsprout's Dynamic Content tool now allows you to save multiple clips in your Dynamic Content Library and track how many downloads each clip receives. Learn more on our New Features page.


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 2021-08-27  1h0m
 
 
00:00  Alban
It is so stinking nice to
00:00
like, show up and record this
00:04
show. And Travis has already put
00:04
together an outline. Kevin's got
00:08
suggestions, I throw my thoughts
00:08
into the mix. And then Travis
00:13
goes and does all the work from
00:13
there, too. It's out into the
00:16
wild. And I don't see anything.
00:16
That's an absolute joy for at
00:21
least two thirds of the team.
00:21
Yeah, I mean, exactly.
00:30  Kevin
You guys remember, like
00:30
two months ago, when you were
00:32
like, We're going all in on
00:32
video Buzzcast. I was like,
00:35
that's, I mean, I will agree and
00:35
commit and disagree, disagree
00:39
and commit, I'll do something.
00:39
But I don't want to do this.
00:42  Alban
I never said that. The
00:42
only reason we ever did video
00:48
was because of you.
00:50  Kevin
That is true. I will take
00:50
that. Because when we first got
00:53
locked down, and we weren't
00:53
allowed to see anybody in
00:55
person, I was like, well, it
00:55
would be nice to be able to see
00:58
you guys when we record. And if
00:58
we're going to be doing video
01:00
chats Anyway, why don't we go
01:00
ahead and publish those. So I do
01:04
take the full blame for moving
01:04
us to video in the first place.
01:07
But how's that working out for
01:07
us?
01:11  Alban
Not good. The first one
01:11
we did was like a year ago, we
01:16
did that live stream to our
01:16
YouTube channel. And that just
01:21
kind of grew into then we wanted
01:21
to play around with Riverside,
01:25
which was doing video remote
01:25
video recording, and then squad
01:28
cast launched video, remote
01:28
video recording. And I think,
01:33
you know, we've you kind of had
01:33
the tools, the tools were there.
01:36
So we started playing with the
01:36
tools and experimenting. And now
01:40
the experiment is coming to an
01:40
end, at least for now, at least
01:44
for now. So do we want to give
01:44
like the whole story of it, kind
01:49
of walk through why we made each
01:49
decision along the way? And
01:53
let's give the sparknotes what
01:53
we learned the highlights
01:56
sparknotes? Yeah, start at the
01:56
beginning. Kevin, why did you
01:58
want to start doing some video
01:58
Buzzcast.
02:01  Kevin
When we first started
02:01
recording Buzzcast, we would do
02:03
it together in the office in our
02:03
little studio space. And we
02:07
could play off of each other's
02:07
energy, right? I think, Listen,
02:12
I'll speak for myself, I'm not a
02:12
super high energy person. So it
02:15
helps for me to be sitting
02:15
across the table for somebody or
02:18
to see somebody else's reactions
02:18
to what I'm saying or when
02:21
they're speaking themselves to
02:21
be able to keep myself amped up
02:24
and engaged in the conversation
02:24
when we went audio only and
02:26
there was no video component, it
02:26
was hard for me to continue to
02:29
keep my energy high. And to stay
02:29
engaged. I've also got a little
02:32
bit of add that I'm I'm fighting
02:32
and dealing with at the same
02:34
time. So that part was was
02:34
necessary in order to be able to
02:40
just produce good content. What
02:40
I was interested in is that
02:43
since we're doing this video
02:43
component Anyway, why don't we
02:45
record this, we've always said
02:45
that YouTube is an interesting
02:48
opportunity for people to
02:48
promote their podcasts because
02:50
they do have the algorithm, they
02:50
do have the recommendation
02:52
engine. But you shouldn't just
02:52
publish your audio only there.
02:56
Because that doesn't feed into
02:56
the strengths of the algorithm.
02:58
So you're not even getting the
02:58
benefit. And you're taking all
03:00
this extra time to do that. In
03:00
fact, you could be you know,
03:04
putting yourself at a
03:04
disadvantage if you do that,
03:05
because then you get a bad
03:05
reputation with the algorithm.
03:08
So anyway, we were doing video,
03:08
why not go ahead. And while we
03:12
edit the podcast, the audio
03:12
version, why not edit the video
03:14
version and just stick it on
03:14
YouTube and see if we get a bump
03:16
from it. That is where you guys
03:16
come in on the analytical side
03:20
and say, Is this working is this
03:20
not I will say that the
03:24
constraints from just somebody
03:24
who's on the podcast are much
03:29
higher than I anticipated. It's
03:29
one thing when you're out of the
03:32
office, or if you're traveling
03:32
or you can't be here there to be
03:35
able to quickly grab a USB mic,
03:35
throw it in your bag go with
03:38
you. And you can record audio
03:38
from anywhere in the world, it's
03:40
not too hard to find a quiet
03:40
space, most hotel rooms are
03:43
pretty quiet. Or if you're
03:43
staying on Airbnb or something
03:45
that you can find a closet, you
03:45
can find a quiet space to record
03:47
audio, being able to travel with
03:47
a decent camera setup. Or if you
03:52
don't have a decent camera
03:52
setup, then you're using
03:54
whatever on your laptop, you're
03:54
constantly worried about your
03:57
background, like all this stuff
03:57
is going on. It's just a
03:59
different level of commitment
03:59
and what's required in terms of
04:03
being able to put a show out
04:03
every week or every other week.
04:05
So that has been added an extra
04:05
level of commitment to the show,
04:12
which again, not something that
04:12
we weren't willing to do, but
04:14
something that was a little bit
04:14
unexpected. Didn't know going
04:16
into it. And then from an
04:16
analytical side, like how
04:19
helpful was it actually, for us
04:19
growing the show? That's what
04:23
you guys have dug into. Right?
04:24  Alban
Yeah, I mean, we can talk
04:24
a bit about the analytics buzz
04:28
cast itself was getting more
04:28
attention, let's call it
04:33
attention than it ever had
04:33
before. We were getting between
04:37
the downloads that continued to
04:37
grow on the RSS side. And on the
04:45
YouTube channel being added to
04:45
that it was huge. And then we
04:48
started doing clips of Buzzcast
04:48
episodes. And those were doing
04:52
really well. And so if you
04:52
wanted to add all that up, it
04:56
was like wow, this show is
04:56
doubled in sighs This is great.
05:02
But we on the other side, were
05:02
kind of frustrated with the
05:08
growth of the YouTube channel.
05:08
We grew a ton the first year.
05:13
And we just kind of seen a lot
05:13
of slowing down of our growth.
05:17
We didn't know exactly why. And
05:17
we kept kind of digging into the
05:22
data. And I think it might have
05:22
been Jonathan first, or maybe it
05:27
was Travis, who said, I just
05:27
clicked through all of the last
05:30
videos. And I noticed most of
05:30
the Buzzcast ones lose
05:35
subscribers. And I was like,
05:35
That's not true. And then I
05:39
click through and went, Oh,
05:39
that's definitely true. I was
05:43
very skeptical by nature. And so
05:43
and then we started digging in
05:48
deeper. And I took, I think it
05:48
was like six different stats
05:54
that we use to kind of quantify
05:54
how valuable each individual
05:58
video is. And I just went back
05:58
and looked at, like the last 90
06:03
days, all the videos that were
06:03
created during that 90 day
06:05
period, I think we had 22
06:05
videos, or 26 videos, all of the
06:12
Buzzcast ones were in the worst
06:12
category, they were they
06:15
represented, like the very
06:15
bottom five episodes, or videos.
06:20
And, you know, we, I think
06:20
Travis, you had some good ideas
06:25
of why the Buzzcast ones were
06:25
performing near the bottom. But
06:29
in the end, we were kind of
06:29
doing the thing that we've
06:32
always criticized, we've always
06:32
criticized people who were
06:34
putting a static image on a
06:34
YouTube video on a YouTube
06:39
video, just having audio, you
06:39
know, we said that can crush an
06:44
existing valuable YouTube
06:44
channel. And we were crushing
06:49
our existing value bowl YouTube
06:49
channel, by adding this, you
06:55
know, some of this, basically
06:55
podcast content in video format.
06:59  Kevin
To clarify, we weren't
06:59
crushing it because we weren't
07:01
putting the static image when we
07:01
were putting real video up. But
07:05
we weren't playing in line with
07:05
the the rules of YouTube or to
07:09
use the algorithm in the
07:09
smartest and best way we were
07:11
confusing the algorithm. We were
07:11
publishing different lengths of
07:14
content, different formats of
07:14
content. And so we ended up is a
07:17
very important and valuable
07:17
channel for us for marketing our
07:20
software and telling the world
07:20
about what Buzzsprout can do for
07:22
you as a podcaster. We were
07:22
hurting that marketing channel
07:26
for us, right?
07:27  Alban
Yeah, I guess what I was
07:27
saying is, we were not being
07:30
hypocritical in the way that we
07:30
created the video, the content,
07:34
because we weren't publishing
07:34
the static image with the audio.
07:38
But the reason we say we
07:38
recommend everybody else not to
07:41
do that, is because what it's
07:41
doing is it's showing YouTube
07:45
that your content is low
07:45
quality, and it's a specific
07:48
type of content. It's audio plus
07:48
an image. Well, when we were
07:53
looking at it, YouTube was used
07:53
to a much higher production
07:57
quality, a very different type
07:57
of content for our channel. And
08:02
so I think people were
08:02
constantly confused. They're
08:05
running into videos that they
08:05
thought were going to be Travis
08:10
or Sarah jalon, doing an in
08:10
depth tutorial. And they were
08:14
clicking, and they were finding
08:14
me pontificating about Facebook
08:18
podcasts for 20 minutes. So
08:18
Travis, give us some more
08:22
insight, what's what are the
08:22
differentiators between our day
08:26
to day content are the bread and
08:26
butter that we do very well, and
08:29
what Buzzcast was doing on our
08:29
channel?
08:31  Travis
One thing to keep in
08:31
mind is when we create content
08:34
for Podcasting, Q&A, when we
08:34
create tutorials, things like
08:38
that, we have a very specific
08:38
aim for those videos. Right? So
08:42
we're trying to answer questions
08:42
really well, we're trying to
08:45
take all the knowledge and best
08:45
practices for how to be a
08:49
podcaster. And consolidating
08:49
that into a form factor. That is
08:54
something you could easily watch
08:54
in just a few minutes and get
08:56
all the information that you
08:56
need. And because we're able to
09:00
put that level of focus on it,
09:00
like Alan mentioned, the
09:03
production quality is better. We
09:03
have custom animations, and B
09:06
roll, which is just a fancy way
09:06
of saying we cut away to
09:09
different videos of models doing
09:09
things that match what we're
09:12
talking about on screen. And so
09:12
we're able to create a type of
09:18
content that works really well
09:18
in a YouTube ecosystem. And so
09:23
if your whole channel is that
09:23
kind of content, then YouTube
09:26
starts knowing Okay, if someone
09:26
we've kind of identified them as
09:31
a potential podcaster, and
09:31
they're asking a podcast related
09:33
question, Buzzsprout is going to
09:33
be the channel we recommend
09:36
because we know they have this
09:36
kind of content. The reason that
09:39
we split off Buzzcast the full
09:39
episodes into a separate channel
09:44
a couple of months ago, is
09:44
because we noticed that those
09:49
videos were not performing at
09:49
all at the same level as the
09:54
Podcasting, Q&A and other
09:54
tutorial videos were doing. And
09:57
that was a common practice we'd
09:57
seen with other youtubers That
10:00
created video podcasts, they
10:00
would create new channels for
10:03
them. And then if they had
10:03
clips, that would be a third
10:06
channel. So they would actually
10:06
have three channels, they'd have
10:07
their main YouTube channel, a
10:07
full podcast channel and a clips
10:10
channel, in order to make sure
10:10
that they were kind of playing
10:14
by the rules, the best practice
10:14
of YouTube. So these were all
10:16
things that we, you know, as we
10:16
were experimenting, we weren't
10:19
sure like, how far are we really
10:19
going to carry this book? Like,
10:23
how invested Are we going to get
10:23
into video Buzzcast. And so it
10:27
didn't make sense to spin up a
10:27
whole YouTube channel, we're
10:30
just going to do a couple
10:30
episodes and then retire it
10:32
right. So we tested in our on
10:32
our main channel first and said,
10:35
Okay, that's working. So then
10:35
what if we took the next step,
10:39
and we made it consistent? And
10:39
then what if we took the next
10:41
step and made a separate, and so
10:41
it's kind of like evolved over
10:44
time. And now to Kevin's point,
10:44
it's at the place where we just
10:48
wanted to make sure, if we keep
10:48
going on this trajectory, it's
10:52
going to serve you guys, it's
10:52
gonna make Buzzcast better for
10:55
you. And it's also going to make
10:55
sense in the grand scheme of the
10:59
other things that we're doing to
10:59
produce and create content. And
11:02
so we're now at this nexus point
11:02
where if we're going to be able
11:06
to go back and record in the
11:06
studio, you know, that has a
11:10
level of production that even
11:10
exceeds what we're currently
11:12
what we were doing before. And,
11:12
and so at this point in time, it
11:17
makes more sense for us to pause
11:17
it, knowing we can always turn
11:21
it back on later. But just to
11:21
double down and refocus our
11:24
efforts on the audio only
11:24
version of Buzzcast.
11:27  Alban
So if I can kind of tie
11:27
this together with what are the
11:30
best practices we have learned
11:30
for YouTube, and podcasting, in
11:35
particular, because podcasting
11:35
is really growing on YouTube,
11:41
one out of five people now who
11:41
say they listened to podcasts,
11:44
they listened to most of their
11:44
podcasts on YouTube, one out of
11:48
five, that's pretty remarkably
11:48
high numbers. That comes from
11:53
Edison research. I actually
11:53
interviewed Tom Webster this
11:57
morning, and he told me that so
11:57
it's definitely working there.
12:01
But it takes a lot to make it
12:01
work. And it was not stuff that
12:06
was going to make sense for us
12:06
to do. So. I think to do
12:10
podcasts, well on YouTube, you
12:10
probably need to be recording a
12:14
person so that you have that
12:14
live engaging element. Because I
12:19
don't know how to say this
12:19
exactly. But like, the level of
12:23
engagement you want to see
12:23
between the hosts during a audio
12:28
and a video medium is very
12:28
different. Right now, like I can
12:33
see Kevin and Travis and like
12:33
Kevin looks kind of
12:36
disinterested. That doesn't
12:36
bother anybody who's just
12:39
listening to this because they
12:39
go, Oh, Kevin's probably
12:41
listening attentively. But you
12:41
know what? But if we're on
12:48
video, I'd be the first comment
12:48
we ever got on one of our
12:51
Buzzcast episodes was why does
12:51
albot look so mad. And I was
12:54
like, Oh, that's just my face
12:54
looks. That's just me. Like,
12:59
that's just me not smiling. And
12:59
so that works perfectly fine.
13:03
When you're recording long
13:03
distance recordings. When it's
13:07
on video, it starts to look a
13:07
little weird. And you can either
13:11
kind of over fake enthusiasm, or
13:11
you can get together in an audio
13:15
studio get together in a studio
13:15
in person. So like, get together
13:19
in person, I think is a very
13:19
high recommendation, they should
13:23
try to get that number, you
13:23
know, if at all possible, then
13:28
you've also got to have like
13:28
multiple shots to be able to
13:31
keep it interesting. So that's
13:31
probably a camera on each host.
13:35
Maybe an additional wide angle
13:35
camera, you can see that we've
13:38
experimented this in some of our
13:38
Podcasting Q&A videos is
13:42
rolling, I think three different
13:42
cameras now all at once, and
13:45
then we flipped between them.
13:45
For us to do the three of us in
13:50
the studio would require us
13:50
probably to be shooting like
13:55
four or five cameras at a time.
13:55
And then the, you know, that
13:59
really ramps up the amount of
13:59
video editing that we're doing.
14:03
Okay, so we're buying a bunch of
14:03
cameras. We're buying, we're
14:06
doing more in video editing.
14:06
We're getting us all together in
14:09
the studio in the most
14:09
dangerous, dangerous COVID
14:13
hotspot United States right now.
14:13
So three negatives, and all for
14:17
the benefit of starting a new
14:17
YouTube channel that isn't
14:21
exactly in alignment with what
14:21
we want. So that's to kind of
14:24
wrap it up quickly. What how
14:24
we're thinking about this. Maybe
14:28
we come back, maybe not. But
14:28
until next time, listen to us on
14:32
our RSS backed podcast.
14:35  Travis
Yes, we are definitely
14:35
not going anywhere. You'll just
14:38
need to listen to us anywhere
14:38
except for Spotify will be.
14:42  Alban
This is basically Apple
14:42
podcasts and indie apps
14:45
exclusive now. Yeah, I would say
14:45
so. I would say so.
14:48  Kevin
Yeah. I think it's an
14:48
interesting point that you
14:50
talked about when you talk about
14:50
your interview with Tom Webster
14:53
and he's saying that one in five
14:53
podcasts are roughly 20% of
14:56
people listening the podcast in
14:56
YouTube, and I can't help it
14:59
think that that is it just don't
14:59
think that there's a stat that
15:05
we should just take without some
15:05
additional thought, right? Like
15:10
listening to a podcast and
15:10
YouTube is a different
15:12
experience than what a lot of us
15:12
who produce podcasts are in the
15:15
podcasting space probably think
15:15
about when we think about
15:18
podcasting, like the benefits in
15:18
the beauty of podcasting is it's
15:21
it's passive, it's something
15:21
that you can do not only on
15:23
demand, but at your convenience
15:23
while you're doing other things
15:26
while you're doing housework
15:26
while you're exercising, while
15:27
you're at work while you're
15:27
driving a car, you the YouTube
15:30
experience is different than
15:30
that. And so while the YouTube
15:34
ecosystem is huge, and it might
15:34
be a lot more mainstream in
15:37
terms of the number of people
15:37
who engage in that space, and
15:39
then at some point, click on
15:39
something that is calling itself
15:41
a podcast, it's, it might just
15:41
be an exposure thing, it might
15:45
just be the size of the
15:45
ecosystem thing, it might not
15:47
necessarily be what we would
15:47
consider a podcast and all the
15:52
great benefits that go along
15:52
with podcasting. And I don't
15:53
want to get into the details of
15:53
is it does it really have an RSS
15:56
feed and all that stuff, that's
15:56
not really what I'm talking
15:58
about. I'm just kind of talking
15:58
about the size of the medium and
16:00
the number of people who at some
16:00
point during their normal day,
16:03
flip open YouTube, and might
16:03
click on something that is
16:05
calling itself a podcast. So
16:05
that being said, YouTube is a
16:11
fine place for you to distribute
16:11
content and being creator. But
16:13
hopefully, there's some
16:13
takeaways from what we've
16:16
experienced over the past year,
16:16
pressing into the YouTube Space
16:18
a little bit in terms of putting
16:18
a podcast onto YouTube, there's
16:22
a lot more that goes into it
16:22
than just recording a zoom call,
16:25
and then throwing it up there.
16:25
If you really want to succeed,
16:28
you have to understand the
16:28
algorithm, you have to
16:30
understand how the medium works,
16:30
you have to understand what type
16:32
of content works there is, this
16:32
is a larger level of commitment.
16:35
And you might find a huge
16:35
audience and huge following
16:38
there. But it's probably not
16:38
going to be it's not an
16:43
overnight success. It is a lot
16:43
of work. And it is very
16:45
different than audio only
16:45
podcasting. So as we continue to
16:47
unpack, and learn things about
16:47
how to use YouTube, or other
16:52
channels to grow your main
16:52
podcast, your audio only
16:55
podcast, it's distributed
16:55
through RSS, we will continue to
16:58
share those learnings with you
16:58
and hopefully make you a better
17:00
podcaster. But this is where we
17:00
are today. And the decisions
17:03
we've made. So this podcast will
17:03
not be on YouTube, and not in
17:07
video form. And as we learn more
17:07
and grow more, we'll share all
17:11
our learnings with
17:15  Travis
so if you've been a
17:15
Buzzcast listener for any length
17:17
of time, you know, we're big
17:17
fans of the podcast index and
17:21
podcasting 2.0, that entire
17:21
group, that entire working group
17:25
of people dedicating themselves
17:25
to improving the open podcast
17:29
ecosystem, and creating really
17:29
fun new features that allow you
17:33
as a creator, to make awesome
17:33
content and help your listeners
17:36
really engage with your show in
17:36
some really unique ways. Kevin
17:40
and Tom had an opportunity to
17:40
sit down with Dave Jones, who is
17:44
working on the podcast index and
17:44
podcasting 2.0 to talk about a
17:47
new feature that Buzzsprout is
17:47
now supporting, and also tease
17:52
out some fun new things that
17:52
they have coming down the
17:54
pipeline. So here's that
17:54
conversation between Kevin Tom
17:58
and Dave Jones.
17:59  Tom
This is Tom Rossi,
17:59
technical co founder of
18:01
Buzzsprout. And I am glad to be
18:01
joined by Dave Jones, one of the
18:06
two guys running the podcast
18:06
index, Dave Jones and Adam curry
18:10
have been doing amazing work
18:10
with the podcast index. Dave,
18:13
welcome to the show. Thanks for
18:13
all that you're doing. Tell us a
18:17
little bit about the podcast
18:17
index and what you guys are
18:20
doing over there.
18:21  Dave
Let's see, what are we
18:21
doing at the podcast? And what
18:23
are we not doing at podcast?
18:25  Kevin
So Dave, the podcasting
18:25
to auto project is like it
18:29
incorporates the podcast index
18:29
and the podcasting namespace
18:32
right and a whole bunch of
18:32
things. Can you tell us like
18:34
what's the difference? What are
18:34
the two functions that those
18:36
those two things sort of where
18:36
they come together? How does it
18:38
all work?
18:39  Dave
Yeah, we get this question
18:39
a lot. What the heck are y'all
18:42
doing with all these various
18:42
projects? And then what did they
18:45
even mean? And so podcasting 2.0
18:45
is the name of our podcast, but
18:51
it's also the name of the
18:51
broader movement of trying to
18:54
preserve, protect and extend the
18:54
open RSS ecosystem,
18:57  Kevin
right. When we say this,
18:57
this is a little bit different
18:59
than what like fireside chat
18:59
introduced it podcast movement,
19:01
is podcasting to Dotto, right.
19:01
Yeah,
19:04  Dave
I gotta hope it is
19:04
completely different. Yeah, but
19:07
podcasting. 2.0 is just an open
19:07
source, volunteer movement of
19:13
people coming up with ideas and
19:13
launching projects to help
19:17
preserve the open RSS ecosystem
19:17
of podcasting, and podcasting
19:21
inside the app. So pod inside
19:21
podcasting 2.0. But that would
19:24
be the podcast namespace where
19:24
all these new features and tags
19:26
are coming from. Also within
19:26
podcasting, 2.0 would be
19:30
something like pod ping, which
19:30
allows hosts to rapidly notified
19:33
apps and aggregators of new
19:33
episodes, things like that.
19:36
That's all in the podcasting 2.0
19:36
side of things. The podcast
19:40
index is the thing that we
19:40
created at the very beginning in
19:44
order to facilitate all these
19:44
other things. So the podcast
19:48
index is the largest directory
19:48
of podcasts on the internet.
19:51
It's were like 4.1 million
19:51
podcasts right now feeds. We are
19:55
a directory and also an API for
19:55
podcast app. to hook in to get
20:01
their podcast data from,
20:01
basically, they just start
20:04
coding an app, they plug into us
20:04
and they get all their data in,
20:08
it saves them a world of hurt on
20:08
that side of things. So those,
20:12
the podcasts index is the APN
20:12
directory, but geisen 2.0 is all
20:16
the features and community
20:16
movement.
20:19  Kevin
Right, and then huge
20:19
opportunity with the index is
20:22
that we're not tied in or
20:22
reliant on Apple anymore. So
20:24
like over the past two or three
20:24
months, Apple's directory has
20:26
been having a ton of problems.
20:26
Not to mention even before that,
20:29
when it was working, well, it
20:29
would take you probably a
20:31
minimum of two or three days up
20:31
to a couple weeks to even get in
20:34
Apple podcast directory, then
20:34
when you publish a new episode,
20:37
it might be 24 hours or more
20:37
before that new episode gets
20:40
released in search showing up on
20:40
any of the apps that rely on
20:43
that directory. And the index
20:43
solves all that along with other
20:46
technologies that you're
20:46
developing as well like the pod
20:49
paying and everything else.
20:49
Right.
20:50  Dave
Yeah, we started this
20:50
whole project with with the
20:53
directory and the API with the
20:53
idea that we wanted to take
20:57
Apple Apple's directory away
20:57
from being the center of the
21:02
podcasting universe, which has
21:02
been for, you know, 15 years at
21:05
least. And the idea there was
21:05
that, you know, no, no knock on
21:10
Apple, I mean, they've been good
21:10
stewards of podcasting, it's
21:13
just that it doesn't make a lot
21:13
of sense for an open
21:18
specification, like podcasting,
21:18
an open system that anybody can
21:23
participate in, it does not make
21:23
a lot of sense for that. To be
21:29
controlled by a single humongous
21:29
entity like apple, I mean,
21:33
they're literally the biggest
21:33
company in the world. And so
21:35
it's sort of like you have this
21:35
weird spectrum where you got
21:37
podcasting, which is completely
21:37
open, I can hand write an RSS
21:41
feed today, and get into the
21:41
inbox and create a podcast. And
21:45
I can do it from my computer in
21:45
five minutes. But then you have
21:49
the directory where all the
21:49
podcasts are found, his career
21:52
is controlled by this huge
21:52
corporation. So it really just
21:56
didn't didn't make a lot of
21:56
sense, the goal there was create
22:00
a directory that is completely
22:00
open, anybody can join it,
22:03
anybody can add to it, anybody
22:03
can put their podcast into it in
22:07
15 seconds. And then the next
22:07
step, which is the which is the
22:12
part that has to happen, make it
22:12
available for free, and
22:15
everybody can download it, you
22:15
can download it our entire
22:18
database right now from our From
22:18
the homepage of our website, and
22:23
do whatever you want with it,
22:23
you can go create your own
22:25
directory or your own API or
22:25
your own apps. So if it's not
22:28
free, then it doesn't solve any
22:28
of the problem. And if you have
22:32
to have us, it still doesn't
22:32
solve the problem. You need to
22:34
be we need to redistribute it.
22:34
And so that's what we that was
22:37
the Gulf in the beginning.
22:38  Tom
One of the features that
22:38
I'm most excited about out of
22:40
podcasting 2.0 is pod ping, can
22:40
you tell us a little bit about
22:44
that?
22:44  Dave
Yeah, sure. podcasting
22:44
suffers from the same thing that
22:47
all RSS based infrastructure
22:47
does it, what you have is a
22:52
system where you publish an
22:52
episode of whatever this is, or
22:55
a blog post or anything, any bit
22:55
of information, you publish that
23:00
to an RSS feed, think of it like
23:00
a WordPress blog. So then the
23:04
RSS feed, which is just a file
23:04
on a web server somewhere, it
23:07
gets updated. How does the rest
23:07
of the world know that you've
23:10
just put a blog post up on your
23:10
website, they have to be
23:13
notified, or they have to go and
23:13
check in there's, there's the
23:17
only two ways to get that
23:17
information. So just think of it
23:20
like, you know, clicking on a
23:20
website refresh button over and
23:24
over and over just to see if
23:24
something new pops up. That's
23:27
essentially what all of these
23:27
infrastructures have to do,
23:31
whether it's podcasting or
23:31
blogosphere, or any of these
23:34
things. It's just what you
23:34
resort to is just checking the
23:37
website over and over and over.
23:38  Tom
And this is this is one of
23:38
the things that we see all the
23:40
time, right, where we have
23:40
podcasters, who will publish an
23:43
episode. And then they're
23:43
wondering, Well, where is it? I
23:46
published it an hour ago? Why
23:46
don't I see it anywhere? Why
23:49
don't I see it on Apple? Why
23:49
don't I see it on Spotify? And I
23:52
think what what's exciting about
23:52
pod pain is this is a solution
23:56
to that problem, which is if you
23:56
subscribe to a feed with with
24:00
pod pain, you'll know whenever
24:00
it gets updated. You'll know
24:03
about it immediately.
24:05  Dave
Yeah, and that's a just a
24:05
reversal of that whole thing of
24:08
instead of checking over and
24:08
over and over for new content.
24:11
We tell you, you know, the
24:11
publisher tells you when there's
24:15
content,
24:15  Tom
pod ping solves two
24:15
problems. One is the polling
24:18
with RSS feeds. And then you
24:18
also have the problem of much of
24:22
the web sub pub pub is built on
24:22
Google, which isn't reliable. So
24:27
pod ping does it in a reliable
24:27
way. And so as I've talked to
24:30
people about pod paying, and
24:30
they said, Well, don't we
24:32
already have a solution for
24:32
this? Well, we don't have a
24:33
reliable solution for this. And
24:33
so that's why a lot of people
24:37
just continue to pull RSS feeds.
24:37
So really excited about the work
24:40
that you did with with pod Ping.
24:40
One of the features of the
24:44
podcast namespace that we've
24:44
just implemented at Buzzsprout.
24:47
That I'm sure everyone would
24:47
love to hear why we did it. Is
24:51
the gu ID, or the gu ID. How do
24:51
you say Dave gwit? Yeah, let's
24:56
Duguid. Goo it sounds gross.
24:56
Let's do good. There's no way
24:59
around it that it's He's gonna
24:59
sound gross. So but tell us
25:02
what, what's the grid? And why
25:02
do you want podcasting companies
25:06
like Buzzsprout and podcasters.
25:06
to include this in their RSS
25:09
feed,
25:10  Dave
a grid is a globally
25:10
unique identifier, geo ID. It is
25:15
a long number that uniquely
25:15
identifies a thing and object
25:20
globally in the world. It's this
25:20
thing is this number. And so
25:26
that is a thing that Apple's
25:26
directory has always had.
25:30
Everybody's podcast has an
25:30
iTunes ID, or an apple podcast
25:35
ID. And if you go and look for
25:35
your podcast on Apple's podcast
25:40
directory, you can see at the
25:40
end of the little URL in the
25:42
address bar up there, you can
25:42
see your Apple ID, because Apple
25:46
has been the center of the
25:46
podcasting universe for so long,
25:49
that iTunes ID has become the
25:49
way that many apps identify a
25:54
podcast in there's problems with
25:54
that. We solve those problems
25:59
earlier this year, when Apple's
25:59
API stopped returning the
26:04
location of where podcast live
26:04
at. So they stopped returning in
26:09
their API for many, many feeds,
26:09
they stopped returning the
26:13
actual URL, which is would be
26:13
like, you know, buzzsprout.com
26:16
slash such and such. That's a
26:16
huge problem because it broke
26:20
tons of apps. And we were on the
26:20
front lines of that, because a
26:24
lot of people started using our
26:24
API when that happened, because
26:26
it broke and broke their app.
26:28  Kevin
Is this stuff going to
26:28
help us move in the direction of
26:31
like global comments, global
26:31
ratings and reviews? Are you
26:35
guys working on infrastructure
26:35
to be able to allow podcasters
26:38
to leave a five star rating in
26:38
one app that then translates
26:42
over to another app or a comment
26:42
over here on pod friend that
26:45
could get posted in pod chaser?
26:48  Dave
Yeah, I hope so. I mean,
26:48
that's the idea. That's, that's
26:51
absolutely the goal with this.
26:53  Tom
Just a quick note for our
26:53
Buzzsprout listeners, don't you
26:56
don't have to write into the
26:56
port and ask us to put a grid on
26:59
your RSS feed, they're already
26:59
there. So all these features
27:03
whenever we can we want to
27:03
implement them without having to
27:06
require, you know, any, any kind
27:06
of, you know, technical
27:09
knowledge on our podcasters. And
27:09
so, yes, the goods are already
27:12
there. And we continue to follow
27:12
all the work that Dave and Adam
27:14
are doing, and we will implement
27:14
those features as they come up.
27:17
Dave, thank you for being on the
27:17
show. Thank you for all the work
27:21
that you're doing to help make
27:21
podcasting. Awesome. We
27:24
appreciate it. And thanks for
27:24
being here.
27:26  Kevin
Yeah, thanks, guys.
27:26
Appreciate it. listeners, please
27:29
check out podcast index.org
27:29
click on apps, download a new
27:32
podcast app, recommend it to
27:32
your listening audience. And
27:36
yeah, support the movement. It's
27:36
really good stuff for
27:38
podcasting.
27:41  Travis
So we asked the good
27:41
people of the internet, namely
27:45
on our YouTube community chats
27:45
if you subscribe to the YouTube,
27:48
the main Buzzsprout YouTube
27:48
channel, you may have seen this
27:50
in your subscriber feed. Alban
27:50
asked on Twitter, we also posted
27:54
in the Facebook group, the
27:54
Buzzsprout podcast, Facebook
27:56
group, just your questions. So
27:56
we're going to run through a
28:00
lightning round, have a bunch of
28:00
questions and hopefully will
28:04
give you some okay answers.
28:04
Alright, so the first question,
28:07
Alban, I want to see this off to
28:07
you first, because you're going
28:09
to be the best person to answer
28:09
this question. This is from
28:12
Arielle, she asks, Why is Alban
28:12
the coolest? No,
28:16  Alban
no, no. Why is Alban the
28:16
coolest? My response to that
28:21
because that was to my asking
28:21
people questions was please
28:24
delete this. So yeah, no answer
28:24
to that. plead the fifth. Hmm.
28:28
Next question.
28:31  Travis
Kevin, do you have a
28:31
rebuttal response?
28:33  Kevin
I agree. It's puzzling.
28:33
He is the coolest. Nobody really
28:35
can explain why but she's right.
28:35
Ariel, one of our good friends.
28:39
Just start a podcast movement
28:39
works with squad cast. Awesome
28:42
software. Awesome People. So
28:42
check them out. Thanks for the
28:45
question. Ariel. Sorry, we don't
28:45
have a better answer for you.
28:47  Travis
He just is. It's just
28:47
the sky is blue. Alban is cool.
28:51
And podcasts are awesome. Next
28:51
question comes from Julio. And
28:56
Julio wants to know about
28:56
automatic social promotion. Is
29:02
there an automatic way to post
29:02
to social media accounts
29:05
automatically from your RSS
29:05
feed? Okay,
29:08  Alban
so yes, there is a way to
29:08
do it. I think the way that I've
29:13
seen most people do it is
29:13
through Zapier or Zapier,
29:16
depending on how you want to
29:16
pronounce that name, it's, you
29:19
know, you pretty much have it,
29:19
check the podcast feed once an
29:22
hour or something if there's new
29:22
episode, then kick off these
29:27
tweets and these social posts.
29:27
So there's a way to do it. I
29:32
would advise Julio not to do it,
29:32
though. This is one of the
29:37
marketing things that like
29:37
everybody really wants an
29:40
automated solution for we're
29:40
like, wouldn't it be cool if I
29:43
didn't have to write all my
29:43
tweets, instead, I just did the
29:47
thing I'm already doing and then
29:47
some software. Sometimes people
29:51
say AI, even if it's not AI,
29:51
that some thing will go and do
29:56
all the work for me. And that
29:56
would be cool. It'd be very
29:59
cool. What It ends up happening
29:59
is, you end up tweeting the
30:02
exact same tweet, once a week,
30:02
or four times a week with just
30:08
different links. And the only
30:08
people I know who I've seen do
30:13
this, it's like, those don't get
30:13
any engagement. No one's liking
30:17
them. Because the algorithm can
30:17
see and like your followers can
30:22
see, like, just a link to some
30:22
random website plus your
30:26
boilerplate text. Much, much
30:26
better would be for you, if you
30:32
think there's a quotable element
30:32
of your podcast to go create a
30:37
audio gram or a soundbite and
30:37
share that. If you're
30:42
overwhelmed by all the
30:42
promotion, like I've got five
30:45
different social channels and
30:45
only one person to do all the
30:49
work. Well, then the right
30:49
answer, I think, is pick one
30:52
social channel and write one
30:52
tweet, one Instagram post one
30:57
story, whatever it may be, for
30:57
each episode, and get that out
31:01
there. And you will I think, do
31:01
better just by doing one manual
31:06
action than trying to set up
31:06
this automated solution that
31:10
will pretty quickly fade into
31:10
the background noise of Twitter
31:14
and the rest of the social
31:14
platform. So my recommendation
31:17
is probably don't do it.
31:19  Kevin
Alright, good advice. And
31:19
if you decide not to take
31:21
Alban's advice that SAP yours
31:21
EAP i e r dot get answered. Next
31:29
question came in from we don't
31:29
know who anonymous question is,
31:33
should we auto distribute to
31:33
YouTube? timely question, we
31:37  Travis
just this is a similar
31:37
question. So I would say, go
31:40
back to the first part of this
31:40
episode, where we talked about
31:43
why we're pausing video
31:43
Buzzcast. It is the rare
31:48
exception. Where a podcast can
31:48
auto publish a video of a still
31:55
image with an audio file playing
31:55
in the background and have any
31:59
level of success and we're
31:59
talking, I can count on like one
32:02
hand, the number of podcasts
32:02
that I know, do this, and they
32:05
have they do you get some
32:05
traction. I'm thinking Tim
32:07
Ferriss, I'm thinking of all but
32:07
like not very many beyond that.
32:11
And that's simply because it's
32:11
not what YouTube is built for
32:13
people don't go to YouTube to
32:13
not watch something, they go to
32:17
YouTube to watch videos. So any
32:17
kind of automated YouTube
32:21
distribution is going to strip
32:21
the video element out. And that
32:26
kind of defeats the purpose of
32:26
putting it on YouTube,
32:28  Alban
start with the video, and
32:28
then take the audio to put on
32:31
your podcast. The other way
32:31
around is not as valuable. Sorry
32:35
to interrupt your question
32:35
traps.
32:36  Travis
No, that was a perfectly
32:36
fine way to sum it up.
32:38  Kevin
Good advice. Next
32:38
question came in from Rick, how
32:41
long should your podcast title
32:41
be?
32:43  Travis
Here's the good news.
32:43
There are no rules that I'm
32:46
aware of other than, you know,
32:46
there's a certain maximum number
32:49
of characters Kevin, do you know
32:49
off the top of your head? What
32:52
the max number of characters is
32:52
for?
32:54  Kevin
It's got to be it's got
32:54
to be big?
32:56  Alban
It's something like 255,
32:56
right? Yeah,
32:58  Travis
it's quite long. So if
32:58
it fits in a tweet, you can make
33:02
it an episode title. So the
33:02
strategy becomes how do you
33:07
create an episode title that
33:07
gets your listeners to say, I am
33:10
going to listen to another
33:10
episode this week. Or if you're
33:14
using some kind of podcast SEO
33:14
strategy, where you're trying to
33:17
get those episodes to show up
33:17
inside of podcast apps, then
33:22
you'd want to make sure that the
33:22
title captured those those
33:23
keywords. There's no rhyme or
33:23
reason to how long the title
33:28
should be. There are some
33:28
podcasts that have quite long
33:31
titles, again, thinking about
33:31
the Tim Ferriss show where he
33:33
has like the whole summary of
33:33
the episode in the title. And
33:36
depending on the app that
33:36
someone's listening to it in,
33:39
you'll see more or less of it.
33:39
And then you'll see the little
33:41
ellipses at the end, if it's
33:41
runs over the kind of like a lot
33:45
of space there. But in general,
33:45
just hit the high point, what's
33:50
the main thing people can expect
33:50
to get out of the episode, make
33:52
it really clear up front, and
33:52
however long it needs to be is
33:55
how long it needs to be.
33:57  Kevin
Yeah, and I'll throw in
33:57
my little tip because I listened
33:59
so much in the car. And I use
33:59
Apple CarPlay to do that. And
34:03
whatever app you're using
34:03
everything in the Apple CarPlay
34:06
interfaces is blown up huge. And
34:06
so you really don't see very
34:09
many characters at all. So I
34:09
would say regardless of how long
34:11
your episode titles are, I don't
34:11
know that that's super
34:13
important. But please put the
34:13
most important information at
34:16
the front like we'll use the Tim
34:16
Ferriss example, because you
34:19
already brought it up. But like
34:19
I already know it's Tim Ferriss
34:21
show, so don't say Tim Ferriss
34:21
show podcast episode number yet,
34:24
like that's gonna be the same
34:24
for every single episode put,
34:27
like the guest name first, like
34:27
Tell me who's on there. So
34:31
regardless of the app that I'm
34:31
using, or how much they decide
34:33
to show, I'm seeing the relevant
34:33
information at the beginning,
34:36
not the same thing over and over
34:36
for every episode. Indeed,
34:39  Travis
wise words. Kevin, I
34:39
want to queue this one up to you
34:44
as our technical expert here.
34:44
This is from dog tail storytime,
34:48
podcast can turntables free
34:48
features help you grow your
34:53
audience because there is a free
34:53
chargeable and then you can pay
34:55
for some other stuff,
34:56  Kevin
right? So here's what I
34:56
would say about charitable I'm
35:00
not exactly up to date on what
35:00
they give you in their free plan
35:03
versus the different paid tiers.
35:03
And one of the reasons that I'm
35:07
not is because of the way that
35:07
charitable, like implements
35:10
their technology, they to use
35:10
most of the powerful features of
35:15
charitable you, they're gonna
35:15
want you to put in a URL prefix
35:20
on your RSS feed. So that's
35:20
something that you can totally
35:21
do as a Buzzsprout podcaster, we
35:21
don't limit you or not let you
35:24
do that, you can absolutely do
35:24
that. But what I'm not familiar
35:28
with enough, because we've just
35:28
never looked into doing it
35:31
ourselves is, we as soon as you
35:31
do that, you turn over all your
35:34
privacy, like all all the
35:34
information, your IP addresses
35:37
of all of your audience to
35:37
chargeable. And I know that they
35:40
do some attribution. So they
35:40
then have code that different
35:44
businesses can put on their
35:44
websites to look for overlapping
35:47
IP addresses between the people
35:47
who are downloading podcast
35:49
episodes and the people who are
35:49
landing on websites. And then
35:52
what they're doing on those
35:52
websites like, are they buying
35:53
certain products? Are they
35:53
checking out, they use some of
35:56
that technology to retarget
35:56
them. So if they show up, they
35:59
listen to this episode, and they
35:59
land on this website, they might
36:02
want to show them an ad for
36:02
something similar from another
36:05
podcast or something. All of
36:05
that stuff kind of goes against
36:09
things that I'm into things that
36:09
I get excited about. it rubs me
36:13
it rubs my privacy button the
36:13
wrong way. Like I don't love
36:15
tracking, I love. I love
36:15
targeting, like the idea that
36:20
saying, hey, this podcast is
36:20
intended for this type of
36:23
audience. So if you're a podcast
36:23
sponsor, then that's something
36:26
that you should look at, because
36:26
this is content that's geared
36:29
towards people who are into
36:29
motorcycles, and who are the
36:31
types of people that are into
36:31
motorcycles? Well, it's mostly
36:33
these types of people. But we
36:33
can't identify any individual
36:36
motorcycle owner and say that
36:36
they also have this level of
36:39
education or could be this
36:39
gender, or might be this level
36:43
of household income. Like
36:43
that's, that's where the line
36:45
crosses for me. And charitable
36:45
is kind of more into the other
36:47
stuff. And so I don't know a
36:47
whole lot about it. But I would
36:50
tell you that if you're
36:50
interested in exploring
36:52
charitable, please read their
36:52
terms of service, please make
36:54
sure that you're comfortable as
36:54
a podcaster, that as soon as you
36:57
start hooking up their, your,
36:57
their tools to your podcast,
37:00
you're going to expose some
37:00
level of your listeners, your
37:04
privacy to them, and I don't
37:04
know what they do with it. So
37:07
please do some research before
37:07
you get into that. Not saying
37:10
it's not the smart move for you.
37:10
But just educate yourself before
37:14
you do it.
37:15  Travis
Next question is from
37:15
Stephen. And he has some premium
37:20
content that it seems like he
37:20
already has on Patreon. And so
37:23
his question is about adding
37:23
that premium content to Spotify
37:28
and Apple podcasts. So in
37:28
addition to Patreon, should he
37:33
offer subscriptions directly on
37:33
Spotify, or Apple?
37:36  Alban
So the answer to Stephen
37:36
will be a little different than
37:40
for everybody else. Steven is
37:40
actually the podcast host and
37:43
producer, Apple Insider. So he
37:43
does a lot of pretty produced
37:48
podcast episodes. It's very
37:48
tempting to say, Oh, of course,
37:52
do it. Why not put your podcast
37:52
episode everywhere? Because
37:55
that's what I would want to do
37:55
is make it easy for people who
37:58
are on Spotify to subscribe,
37:58
make it easy for people on Apple
38:01
to subscribe, make it easy for
38:01
anybody, anywhere else to
38:05
subscribe via Patreon. Why not?
38:05
Well, the why not is the amount
38:11
of work that that could take. So
38:11
there's quite a few. There's
38:16
just an article I read about I
38:16
believe was NPR was NPR hiring
38:21
two different people. And their
38:21
primary responsibilities was
38:25
uploading all of the podcasting
38:25
content to all these different
38:29
platforms. And double checking
38:29
to make sure they did the ads
38:32
free version there. This one got
38:32
that bonus content. This one, we
38:37
gave it the right title, blah,
38:37
blah, blah, being put everywhere
38:40
on the web, if you're an indie
38:40
podcaster. And you're just
38:45
saying, hey, I want to
38:45
experiment and see if I can make
38:46
a little money. Well, man, this
38:46
is really not a exciting
38:51
proposition, to add multiple
38:51
hours to your workflow to make
38:55
sure that your podcast episode
38:55
is put up all over the place.
38:59
But if you are a larger team,
38:59
and you have the resources of
39:02
something like Apple insider
39:02
behind you, like Stephen does,
39:05
that may well be worth the, you
39:05
know, the time and effort to
39:08
make sure it's as easy as
39:08
possible. The only slight
39:12
caveat, I guess I'd give it the
39:12
end is for Steve in particular,
39:16
the podcast is Apple and cider
39:16
is for people who are really
39:19
into Apple products. If they're
39:19
really into Apple products,
39:23
they're probably using Apple
39:23
podcasts or one of the other
39:26
dominant iOS apps. I just be
39:26
surprised if they got a huge
39:31
following over on Spotify as
39:31
paid platforms. But it'd be
39:35
interesting to see that but
39:35
yeah, so that's maybe how I
39:39
would think about that question.
39:39
Yeah,
39:42  Kevin
let me jump in here
39:42
quick. This is a bit of a
39:45
tangent off of the paid
39:45
subscription workflow in the
39:48
amount of work that you put into
39:48
it. Something to keep in mind,
39:50
you might hear oftentimes,
39:50
people say, make sure you have a
39:53
large enough following before
39:53
you start going into premium
39:55
content. And the reason that
39:55
like we've given that
39:58
recommendation and other people
39:58
As well as because it's the same
40:01
amount of work whether you end
40:01
up with one subscriber or 10,000
40:03
subscribers Exactly. And so
40:03
you're making a commitment to
40:06
the people who decide to give
40:06
you money for your premium
40:08
content that you're going to do
40:08
as extra work every week, you're
40:10
going to do the bonus episodes,
40:10
you're going to do the ad free
40:12
version, whatever it is that
40:12
you're promising, you're going
40:14
to do that whether one person
40:14
decides to pay you $5 a month,
40:17
or 50,000 do. And so make what
40:17
we say make sure you have a
40:21
large enough following before
40:21
you take this commitment. It's
40:23
because when we when you launch,
40:23
we want you to have enough
40:26
income coming in from your
40:26
premium offerings to justify the
40:29
effort that goes into it. And it
40:29
can be a large amount of effort.
40:32
So just think that through
40:32
before you jump into any
40:34
subscription or premium
40:34
offering,
40:36  Travis
the next question comes
40:36
from Al Pete's, hey, longtime
40:40
listener, first time caller, how
40:40
important friend, how important
40:44
is it to have a team behind you
40:44
with your podcast?
40:48  Alban
Okay, well, to quote
40:48
Marilyn Monroe, maybe I'll save
40:52
this for later. I'm not I'm not
40:52
lucky locked in on you've got to
40:56
have a team. I mean, the Marilyn
40:56
Monroe quote, it's better to be
41:00
unhappy, alone and unhappy with
41:00
someone else. So I think this is
41:05
the way I've approached it.
41:05
Maybe I'm in a dark place of my
41:08
life.
41:09  Kevin
But there's another quote
41:09
that says misery loves company,
41:12
like those conflict.
41:14  Alban
Yeah, misery loves
41:14
company means like, if other
41:16
people are miserable, then
41:16
they're going to want to like
41:19
make you miserable, too, right.
41:19
And Marilyn, and rose saying,
41:22
like, I'm already having a rough
41:22
go of it. I don't need another
41:26
person who's having a rough go
41:26
of it. Also kind of venting
41:29
their stuff on to me, too.
41:30  Kevin
You think they're
41:30
complimentary. Okay,
41:32  Alban
I use if you're on a good
41:32
team, and it is a joy to work
41:37
with other people. It really is
41:37
like, it is so stinking nice to
41:42
like, show up and record this
41:42
show. And Travis has already put
41:46
together an outline, Kevin's got
41:46
suggestions, I throw my thoughts
41:51
into the mix. And then Travis
41:51
goes and does all the work from
41:55
there to it's out into the wild.
41:55
And I don't see anything. That's
41:59
an absolute joy for at least two
41:59
thirds of the team. Yeah, I
42:03
mean, exactly. But if you're on
42:03
a team, where let's say you're
42:08
the one making the outline, and
42:08
you're the one kind of carrying
42:11
the conversation, and you're
42:11
splitting the money three ways,
42:15
you know, let's say you're
42:15
actually making some money off
42:17
the show, it can get old, and it
42:17
can get really old, if like,
42:22
people are also changing the
42:22
recording time, or they're
42:25
supposed to create the social
42:25
media posts, but they don't. But
42:28
you're still editing the post
42:28
editing it. And we really
42:33
appreciate Travis, but I think
42:33
there's a lot of editors and
42:36
podcast producers, who don't get
42:36
a lot of credit for the amount
42:41
of work and thought that goes in
42:41
to that part of the show. The
42:46
the face, the voice of the show,
42:46
often is the one getting all the
42:52
credit. And so I would boil that
42:52
all down to sometimes it's
42:58
really great to be on a team,
42:58
sometimes it can be tough. And I
43:02
am constantly impressed by very
43:02
small teams that what they're
43:05
able to get done. The You know,
43:05
my first job ever was working
43:10
for the government, when I was
43:10
17, working in a library. And
43:13
like you just saw how slow
43:13
everything moved. And now
43:16
working on a really, really
43:16
small team that builds
43:19
Buzzsprout. It's a lot of fun to
43:19
see how quickly we can get
43:22
things done. So I think in some
43:22
future life where I'm a, you
43:28
know, I think anything, I would
43:28
not want to be on a smaller
43:31
team, not a bigger team. And
43:31
there's people in the podcasting
43:34
space who have teams of two or
43:34
three. And I bet that they're
43:38
loving it that way. So certain
43:38
things can only happen if you're
43:42
really big. But if you're small,
43:42
I think it's a good thing to
43:46
enjoy it and maybe don't grow
43:46
unless there really is a good
43:49
reason to do so.
43:50  Kevin
Yeah, let me tackle the
43:50
same question from a different
43:52
angle. Because you could also
43:52
look at it as like, what do you
43:55
have more of time or money if
43:55
you love doing your podcast, and
43:58
it's successful for you. And
43:58
whether you're doing it alone or
44:01
interviewing somebody
44:01
necessarily great, but you don't
44:03
have all the time to put into
44:03
the promotion, or you're not
44:05
giving it as much love as Mark,
44:05
you're not giving as much
44:09
marketing love as you would like
44:09
to or you don't have time to
44:13
edit it to the level of quality
44:13
that you want to then those are
44:15
things that money might be able
44:15
to solve for you. So you might
44:17
be able to maybe team isn't the
44:17
best word maybe it's it's think
44:22
about it in terms of help, like,
44:22
how important is it to have
44:25
help? Well, if you have
44:25
resources on the money side
44:28
moreso than on the time side,
44:28
then I think that's fantastic.
44:30
Well, a lot of us have more time
44:30
than money. And so in which case
44:34
you can learn to do this stuff
44:34
yourself. And there's great
44:36
resources on YouTube and
44:36
everything else. So I think just
44:38
kind of figure out where you are
44:38
and what works for you. I
44:40
wouldn't be afraid of using a
44:40
team. But I wouldn't necessarily
44:42
say you have to use a team
44:42
either. So whatever works for
44:46
you, so thanks for the question.
44:46
All right, next question came
44:49
from DJ s cube. DJ s KOB.
44:53  Alban
What ej S wave? DJ skewb
44:53
dj skewb Okay,
44:58  Kevin
what's the best way to
44:58
rebrand and retain your
45:00
audience.
45:01  Travis
Oh, well, this one,
45:01
lucky for you, DJ Scoob is
45:04
relatively easy. We actually
45:04
have a video on our YouTube
45:08
channel that I'll link in the
45:08
show notes, where we talk about
45:11
rebranding, what used to be five
45:11
minute Mondays to what is now
45:14
Podcasting, Q&A. The biggest
45:14
things you want to think through
45:18
is make sure that your audience
45:18
knows what's happening before it
45:21
happens. So it doesn't happen by
45:21
surprise. They're not looking
45:24
for, you know, five minute
45:24
Mondays in their podcast
45:27
library, and they go and it's
45:27
not there, and they don't know
45:30
where it is or why it's missing.
45:30
And they didn't scroll down to
45:33
see Oh, there's this new podcast
45:33
called Podcasting Q&A, that I'm
45:36
happy to be subscribed to make
45:36
sure they know what's happening
45:39
ahead of time. And then when you
45:39
actually do the rebrand, make
45:43
sure that you're still serving
45:43
the same kind of person. So if
45:45
you start off as like a Star
45:45
Wars fan podcast, and then you
45:49
want to jump into home
45:49
gardening, it doesn't make sense
45:51
to rebrand that because it's
45:51
built to serve a different kind
45:55
of person, someone who's looking
45:55
for something different. And so
45:58
if you're rebranding it, like
45:58
changing the name to be, you
46:01
know, more dialed in or you want
46:01
to take your name out of it and
46:04
change something like, that's
46:04
totally fine. Just make sure
46:06
you're serving the same kind of
46:06
person. Otherwise, you're gonna
46:08
have better success, just
46:08
creating a new podcast from
46:12
scratch. Alban, we talked about
46:12
Facebook podcasts a couple times
46:16
here on the show, and we have
46:16
lots of thoughts on it. History
46:19
breeze podcast wants to know, is
46:19
there any update on Facebook
46:22
podcasts?
46:23  Alban
Do you actually know who
46:23
history briefs is?
46:25  Travis
I do not.
46:26  Alban
That's a our friend Brad
46:26
shrieve wonderful Ostuni show.
46:29
So if you want to hear short
46:29
stories about history, check it
46:34
out. Okay, so what's happening
46:34
with Facebook podcasts? Well, I
46:39
still am very bullish on it. I
46:39
think Facebook could open the
46:44
door to millions of new
46:44
listeners, if they ever decide
46:47
to really launch Facebook
46:47
podcasts, they announced a ton
46:51
very quickly. And then they had
46:51
a date to their was launching.
46:55
And it was only going out to
46:55
like 1% of podcasts, and only 1%
47:00
of Facebook iOS users in the
47:00
United States. So we're talking
47:05
like a super, super limited
47:05
quantity of people we're seeing
47:09
it. And it really hasn't
47:09
launched much more than that.
47:15
The only update I have is, you
47:15
know, we had one of our shows
47:20
how to start a podcast in there.
47:20
And that was cool. And I we
47:23
played around with a little bit.
47:23
And then I saw Buzzcast got
47:28
added. And that was cool. But I
47:28
went back in recently, because I
47:33
got an email that said your
47:33
podcast has been added to your
47:35
Facebook page. And I went in and
47:35
there are like 80 podcasts
47:40
associated with the Buzzsprout
47:40
Facebook page. Okay, well, why
47:44
is that because some of you know
47:44
Buzzsprout hosts over 100,000
47:48
active podcasts. And a bunch of
47:48
you are doing great shows that
47:53
Facebook has found and said, Ah,
47:53
these would be great on Facebook
47:57
podcasts, we are going to
47:57
automatically connect it to
48:00
their Facebook page. And they
48:00
have incorrectly identified that
48:04
Buzzsprout is the owner of that
48:04
podcast. And I have to imagine
48:10
the same thing is happening over
48:10
for all the other podcast hosts.
48:14
We didn't publish any of those
48:14
shows, obviously, because those
48:17
aren't ours to publish. And, you
48:17
know, if it was associated the
48:22
Buzzsprout page, it wouldn't
48:22
help you grow your podcast on
48:24
Facebook anyway. So I guess I'm
48:24
just saying, I still think this
48:29
could be good. I'm looking
48:29
forward to learning more,
48:33
they've got to get a nice way to
48:33
submit shows via RSS, or to at
48:38
least manually Connect shows
48:38
that they find to Facebook
48:42
pages. Because this totally
48:42
automated solution is definitely
48:45
not working now. But we saw
48:45
growing pains. In the beginning
48:48
of Spotify, we saw Growing Pains
48:48
like this, the beginning of
48:51
Amazon, to a much lesser extent.
48:51
And some even with beginning of
48:56
Google podcasts. It's reasonable
48:56
that we have them. Now with
49:00
Facebook. I'm sure it'll get
49:00
cleared out. But once this
49:04
launches, and once it there's an
49:04
easy solution. Brad, you'll be
49:08
one of the first people that to
49:08
know, because I think it could
49:11
be really big in the grand
49:11
scheme of things for podcasts.
49:15
It's gonna be huge, huge.
49:15
Facebook was very big for our
49:20
former president. So
49:21  Kevin
that's the next big thing
49:21
is when was that platform that
49:24
got canceled?
49:24  Alban
parlor?
49:27  Kevin
parlor podcasts coming?
49:29  Alban
We had them for a hot
49:29
minute. Do you not work? Okay,
49:32
so there are two parlour apps.
49:35  Kevin
There was doesn't have
49:35
enough editing work to do
49:37
already. Now we're gonna go into
49:37
the parlor.
49:39  Alban
This is a segment This is
49:39
the second podcast. All right,
49:43  Kevin
let me fire off another
49:43
question for you. What is the
49:46
least complicated platform for
49:46
recording? I'm assuming we're
49:50
talking about recording multiple
49:50
people remote, so let's steer it
49:52
in that direction.
49:53  Travis
All right, multiple
49:53
people remotes and we're gonna
49:57
set up a basic bar of a Audio
49:57
needs to be at least average,
50:02
right? There's lots of solutions
50:02
for, you know, capturing phone
50:05
calls and things like that, but
50:05
not really the level of quality
50:08
you'd want in a podcast, if you
50:08
just want super simple and very
50:15
intuitive zoom, surprisingly,
50:15
can give you some good audio if
50:19
you have all the settings tuned
50:19
correctly. So you'll want to
50:22
record separate audio files for
50:22
each participant, you'll want to
50:25
turn original audio on. So that
50:25
zoom isn't compressing the audio
50:30
file as it's being streamed back
50:30
and forth. And you'll want to
50:34
save it both locally to your
50:34
computer and to the cloud. At
50:37
the same time, if you have all
50:37
those settings turned on, and
50:39
the other person has the zoom
50:39
app download to the computer,
50:42
it's pretty intuitive. But if
50:42
you want something that is going
50:46
to give you that extra level of
50:46
quality, and the software that
50:49
we've used for Buzzcast that we
50:49
recommend for podcasting is
50:52
Riverside, and squad cast, both
50:52
of those will give you
50:57
completely lossless audio. So
50:57
whatever the microphone is
51:00
recording, that's what you're
51:00
going to get. And it's built
51:03
right into a web app. So you're
51:03
going to send someone a link,
51:07
they click it, and you can start
51:07
recording your podcast.
51:10
Fantastic. Alright, one more.
51:11  Kevin
Let's do one more. And
51:11
this is a tricky one. Luckily,
51:14
we have an expert on the panel
51:14
today. Can you use small
51:18
snippets of movie audio? Or
51:18
waves when discussing a film or
51:22
a show?
51:23  Alban
Can you?
51:24  Travis
Alban, you're the
51:24
expert. You tell us?
51:27  Alban
All right. Yeah, I guess
51:27
Kevin wants me to give my non
51:31
real this is like a fake thing.
51:31
But I am a lawyer. I'm not your
51:35
lawyer. I wasn't even a good
51:35
lawyer, even when I was a
51:38
lawyer. So I take all that into
51:38
account.
51:41  Kevin
Why Why do people do
51:41
that? album? sidebar? legal
51:44
term? Why? Why every time a
51:44
lawyer gives an answer on a
51:49
podcast or or TV show or
51:49
somebody that why do they say
51:52
that? What do they say I am a
51:52
lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer.
51:54
Why is that?
51:54  Alban
Okay? So there's actually
51:54
a lot of law around whether or
51:59
not a client or attorney client
51:59
relationship is formed. And so
52:05
sometimes people will like show
52:05
up in your office and be like,
52:07
blah, blah, blah, talk to you
52:07
about their case, and then be
52:09
like, cool, you're my lawyer.
52:09
And then you're like, No, no,
52:12
you're not my No, no, I'm not
52:12
your lawyer yet. And they're
52:15
like, Oh, yeah, you are. And you
52:15
can actually kind of get roped
52:18
into doing some legal work,
52:18
especially if you're already
52:22
like going to trial, even if
52:22
they're not paying your bills.
52:25
all that to say, you got to make
52:25
sure that people know when
52:29
there's a attorney client
52:29
relationship formed. And I think
52:34
that it's gone a little bit too
52:34
far when people are like, I'm a
52:38
lawyer, but not your lawyer,
52:38
like no one in their right mind
52:41
is thinking like this random
52:41
anime avatar lawyer on Twitter,
52:46
like re tweeting back at you is
52:46
actually their attorney. No one
52:49
thinks that there's a
52:49
relationship there.
52:51  Kevin
So just to be clear,
52:51
Alban, you are my attorney, but
52:54
you're not the listeners.
52:54
Attorney. Right? I actually.
52:58
Okay, so can I use a clip from a
52:58
movie or a TV show? Can I put it
53:01
in my podcast? And if I do that,
53:01
am I gonna get in trouble?
53:05  Alban
Alright, so the what
53:05
they're kind of hinting towards
53:08
is copyright law, and
53:08
specifically fair use. So if
53:12
something is copyrighted, you
53:12
can't use it in your podcast?
53:16
Well, you can, but then you will
53:16
get sued. And then people are
53:20
most people are savvy enough.
53:20
They're like, but sometimes I
53:23
know that stuff is in in things.
53:23
And there's this thing called
53:27
fair use. Yeah, there is there
53:27
is a legal defense to a
53:32
copyright suit called fair use.
53:32
And that's when you're using me
53:36
it would be like if your Do you
53:36
there's different ways you could
53:39
say we're using it for
53:39
educational purposes. I'm only
53:44
using this in a satirical way
53:44
I'm using it. In a way I think
53:49
that modifies the original I
53:49
forget the legal term for that.
53:52
It's been a long time since I
53:52
didn't do well on copyright law.
53:55
But all that to say, yeah, you
53:55
can use stuff, but then you get
54:00
sued for it. And then you try to
54:00
prove to the judge that it was
54:03
an acceptable fair use. That's
54:03
not the situation you want to
54:07
find yourself in for your movie
54:07
podcast. What is much better is
54:14
to just talk about the podcast,
54:14
or to actually get to license
54:19
whatever, you know, whatever
54:19
license you need to get to
54:21
actually share those clips. This
54:21
is definitely not the end.
54:25
Another thing to think about is
54:25
a lot of different platforms are
54:30
scanning to find content that
54:30
is, you know, violating
54:35
copyright, because of DMCA. So.
54:35
YouTube has bots that are
54:41
checking every video going, Hey,
54:41
is there any Miley Cyrus music
54:44
in here, and if it is like, turn
54:44
it off, turn off this video and
54:50
let Miley Cyrus give you a
54:50
strike on your account. So
54:55
that's going on in the
54:55
background for all a lot of
54:58
these channels. Spotify, YouTube
54:58
in particular, I'm sure Apple
55:03
has some as well, if you're on
55:03
any of those platforms, even if
55:07
you have the copyright, it can
55:07
get a little dicey because the
55:11
bot picks you up says, Oh,
55:11
that's copyrighted music, turn
55:15
it off. And then you've got to
55:15
actually work with that platform
55:17
to be like, no YouTube, I
55:17
actually have rights to this. I
55:19
mean, there's so many kind of
55:19
funny examples of people
55:23
uploading their own music to
55:23
YouTube, and YouTube goes, Oh,
55:26
this is copyrighted. And they're
55:26
like, yeah, by me, I gotta turn
55:28
this off for a bit. So all that
55:28
to say, don't, it's not worth
55:33
the hassle. I have heard of
55:33
people who do shows that involve
55:38
a lot of music, or movie
55:38
trailers or stuff that is
55:42
copyrighted on Patreon. And they
55:42
put all of it behind the
55:46
paywall, and my only thinking is
55:46
the only people who see it are
55:49
paying subscribers. And there is
55:49
no algorithm running around
55:54
checking for copyrighted
55:54
material that is a copyright
55:56
violation that is just unlikely
55:56
to be caught. So wouldn't
56:00
recommend it. But um, yeah,
56:00
don't use it. Be good. Don't do
56:06
bad things.
56:07  Kevin
Alright, challenged to
56:07
that answer. I listened to
56:10
podcasts like Seth Rogen does
56:10
the akimbo podcast, and people
56:14
do it on talk radio all the
56:14
time, they play these little
56:16
clips, like whatever, you know,
56:16
a little sound from the Seinfeld
56:20
show, or a famous one liner from
56:20
friends episode or something
56:24
like that, just as like little
56:24
transitions where they make a
56:25
joke, and they get, you know,
56:25
they're like, you know, for
56:28
whatever reason, new moon or
56:28
something like that, like comes
56:30
in, like, how do they get away
56:30
with that? And can I do
56:34
something like, to that extent
56:34
on my podcast without trouble,
56:37  Alban
I need to go pull it up,
56:37
Kev, I mean, you're, you're
56:40
still in your landing into Fair
56:40
Use space again. And so you
56:44
could still end up like, I think
56:44
all of those radio stations like
56:48
some, you know, whoever owns the
56:48
rights to Seinfeld. Now, Fox
56:51
could be like, Alright, let's go
56:51
after him for that. It's just a
56:55
big difference if like your
56:55
radio station, or you're a
56:59
pretty big company that actually
56:59
has a lawyer on staff that can
57:03
be like, Oh, I can respond to
57:03
the threatening letter. I can
57:06
respond to YouTube when they're
57:06
trying to get this taken down.
57:10
Versus I'm an individual. And
57:10
all of a sudden, I'm dealing
57:15
with this massive issue, at
57:15
least in your mind. I mean, you
57:19
get one cease and desist letter.
57:19
Most lawyers, like when we get
57:23
cease and desist letters are
57:23
like, yeah, these get sent out
57:25
all the time. And a lot of
57:25
times, there's no suit even
57:28
coming after, after them. But if
57:28
you're an individual, and you
57:33
get a cease and desist letter,
57:33
you're like, Oh, my gosh, I
57:36
can't go spend 10 grand and hire
57:36
an attorney. I can't fight this.
57:40
We're talking about a podcast
57:40
with 80 listeners. Well, as soon
57:43
as that happens, now, you're
57:43
going back in and re editing all
57:46
your episodes to take out these
57:46
segments, you're taking down
57:49
episodes. It just throws a huge
57:49
wrench into your life is like
57:53
did that ever improve the
57:53
podcast anyway? I don't think
57:57
so. So that's my take on why I
57:57
would probably leave it out.
58:02
Well, Albert, I
58:02  Travis
think that's fantastic.
58:02
Official lawyer Lee advice.
58:05
Kevin, are you gonna say?
58:07  Kevin
Well, every now and then
58:07
this does happen. And some of
58:09
our customers get cease and
58:09
desist letters and they get sued
58:12
and they say like, what can you
58:12
do to help me and we can only
58:15
have like one response, which
58:15
is, I know a lot of people want
58:18
to send water. Just send your
58:18
cash. Alright, wrap us up.
58:24  Travis
If you want us to do
58:24
more of these a lightning round
58:27
Question and Answer segments,
58:27
make sure that you tell Alban on
58:31
Twitter. that'll probably be the
58:31
fastest way to get to one of us
58:34
and let us know that you really
58:34
liked that. We did this. That's
58:36
it for today. We'll get to the
58:36
next one. Keep podcasting