Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my
Speaker 2: name is Noel.
Speaker 3: They called me Ben. We're joined as always with our
Speaker 3: super producer Paul, Mission control decand most importantly, you are you.
Speaker 3: You are here and that makes this the stuff they
Speaker 3: don't want you to know. This one is for our
Speaker 3: fellow dog lovers in the audience today. Yes, the dog
Speaker 3: man's best friend and one of humanity's most successful eugenics
Speaker 3: experiments ever, whether you're talking the chihuahua or the cane corso,
Speaker 3: the domesticated K nine just connects with the human being
Speaker 3: the way so few other living things do. I mean,
Speaker 3: dogs are super intelligent and this leads a lot of people,
Speaker 3: especially dog owners, to say, Hey, my pooch friend, my
Speaker 3: doggo sibling, kid, family member is capable of everything a
Speaker 3: human mind can experience, unfortunately, up to and including very
Speaker 3: dark things like grief, the sense of loss, jealousy or
Speaker 3: technically envy, and suicide. In tonight's episode, we're exploring a
Speaker 3: bizarre localized phenomenon, one you may not have heard of
Speaker 3: in Scotland. It seems dogs overwhelmingly choose to end their
Speaker 3: lives at one particular bridge. Now, had you guys heard
Speaker 3: about this before we embarked on this episode just a
Speaker 3: little bit.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I have to say, Ben, I love the
Speaker 4: idea of this being a night episode. This is a
Speaker 4: nighttime episode, now, Yeah, I mean, like just kind of
Speaker 4: the basics that there is this particular bridge that's very
Speaker 4: popular dog walking location that potentially causes dogs to do
Speaker 4: some pretty dark stuff like you said, or you know,
Speaker 4: or does it, but potentially.
Speaker 5: I think for me, it's whether or not they choose
Speaker 5: to end their lives or something. For one reason or another,
Speaker 5: they're jumping off of a bridge, right, So like for me,
Speaker 5: it's the phrasing of choosing to end their lives. I
Speaker 5: think we're gonna explore that in this episode because it
Speaker 5: certainly seems that way if we're if we're applying those
Speaker 5: potential you know, the ability to make that choice right
Speaker 5: or or is it something that they're just that's causing
Speaker 5: them to jump off that bridge for one reason.
Speaker 3: It's sudden overwhelming compulsion.
Speaker 4: Well, I mean, I have to say I would never
Speaker 4: really fancied myself a dog person until you know. I've
Speaker 4: been with my partner now for a couple of years,
Speaker 4: and she had a wonderful dog named Jude, who she'd
Speaker 4: had since a puppy for like thirteen years, and I
Speaker 4: grew to really love that dog and really experience that love,
Speaker 4: like realizing how similar it is to the love of
Speaker 4: a human. So I think with that in mind, it's
Speaker 4: easy for us to think that that goes both ways,
Speaker 4: you know, and that it feels like it goes both ways.
Speaker 4: And I think to a degree, there is awareness from
Speaker 4: the dog's perspective of their masters and certain behavior that's
Speaker 4: very easy to ascribe meaning to, you know, and much
Speaker 4: of it likely does, but some of it might also
Speaker 4: just be like I want to get fed, and this
Speaker 4: is how I go about doing that.
Speaker 3: And I didn't include a lot of the compelling studies.
Speaker 3: If somebody wants to reach out on email conspiracydyheartradio dot com,
Speaker 3: I'm glad to send along studies that do speak to
Speaker 3: the idea or the exploration of the idea that dogs
Speaker 3: experience emotions similar to those of humans. For now, here
Speaker 3: are the facts there's a place called Dumbarton, Scotland. You
Speaker 3: probably haven't heard of it unless you're familiar with this story,
Speaker 3: or you live in the United Kingdom, or if you
Speaker 3: live in Glasgow, you've definitely heard of it. Because Dumbarton's
Speaker 3: about thirteen miles is the core of It flies northwest
Speaker 3: of Glasgow, and like a lot of places near a
Speaker 3: city the size of Glasgow, this has become kind of
Speaker 3: an exurb or suburb, if you will. It's a commuter town,
Speaker 3: so a lot of people will have a job in
Speaker 3: Glasgow and they'll live somewhere that's a little more affordable, right,
Speaker 3: even if it's a bit more of a commute. It's
Speaker 3: on the banks of the River Clyde. And that the
Speaker 3: River Clyde's a weird name. Etymology fans, you'll enjoy that later.
Speaker 3: It's home to a lot of history. Once upon a
Speaker 3: time it was the capital of the ancient kingdom of Strathclyde.
Speaker 3: Get it astride the Clyde I mean I mean basically
Speaker 3: means valley of the Clyde, and etymologically, Clyde can be
Speaker 3: traced back to a word that means a river. So
Speaker 3: the River Clyde is like the river River as far
Speaker 3: as we can tell. But okay, so it's old, old
Speaker 3: old humans have been hanging out there and peoplings at
Speaker 3: least back in the days of the Iron Age. And
Speaker 3: that's kind of normal in Europe, in Western Europe, because
Speaker 3: you know, in Europe two hundred miles long way in
Speaker 3: the US two undred years a long time. You go there,
Speaker 3: you'll have a wonderful time. There's a lot of beautiful scenery,
Speaker 3: there's a wonderful castle, there's a lot of old buildings.
Speaker 3: But these days the town is not famous for its
Speaker 3: views of various locks. It's famous for one unfortunate structure,
Speaker 3: the overtuned bridge or Overton bridge. We'll just call it.
Speaker 3: That spelled o v e r t o un.
Speaker 4: It's not to be confused with the Overton window. That's
Speaker 4: something very different. This is a bridge, and it's also
Speaker 4: spelled differently.
Speaker 5: It's very weird to take a look at this bridge
Speaker 5: for the first time if you've only read about what
Speaker 5: this bridge is and what it's purported to do. It
Speaker 5: is in the Gothic style, and when you look at it,
Speaker 5: it's pretty striking. It For me, it's very castle like,
Speaker 5: which you know, harkens back to some of the Gothic
Speaker 5: building of the time that you were just speaking about there, Ben,
Speaker 5: And it had a really cool designer, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's designed by this landscape architect named H. E. Milner,
Speaker 3: and Milner created this well, it takes a while to
Speaker 3: assemble these things. Obviously it was designed by him, but
Speaker 3: it was completed in eighteen ninety five as essentially an
Speaker 3: incredibly fancy driveway. And to your point, Matt, about the
Speaker 3: description of things versus how they actually look pictures of them,
Speaker 3: it does remind me of the first time I saw
Speaker 3: the Tower of London and I thought impressive, old, I
Speaker 3: get it's a big deal. Is it a tower? And
Speaker 3: I was like, it must just take fewer stories back
Speaker 3: then to be a tower, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: They were like over three stories. Woo, give this guy
Speaker 3: a blue ribbon.
Speaker 4: But it's a narrow thing that protrudes skyward, I guess.
Speaker 4: But you're right, the barrier to entry for towership was
Speaker 4: a little bit lower back then. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're still not going to like this bridge if
Speaker 3: you're afraid of heights.
Speaker 2: Though, Oh no, oh no, yeah, oh no.
Speaker 3: Because it goes up. It's not super duper long. It's
Speaker 3: a walkable bridge. But if you look over the edge,
Speaker 3: or if you see it from above and you look down,
Speaker 3: you'll see that it's three arches basically, and the main
Speaker 3: arch in the middle goes over a huge steep drop.
Speaker 3: It's fifty feet straight down to something called the Overton Burn,
Speaker 3: another confusing name. The Overton Burn is a small river.
Speaker 3: Burn is a weird thing to call it river. But
Speaker 3: you know, we don't make the rules for Scotland, nor
Speaker 3: should we, and you might get that, you know, sort
Speaker 3: of vertigenous vertigo feeling when you look over and see
Speaker 3: the drop. But if you were to exit the bridge
Speaker 3: yourself over the edge, you would you would have to
Speaker 3: make an attempt. It's not like a swingy rope bridge.
Speaker 3: It's very stable and as far as anyone can tell,
Speaker 3: multiple folks have examined over the years, it's made of
Speaker 3: normal stone. There are no specific anomalies in its construction
Speaker 3: or chemistry. We can spend a little time on the
Speaker 3: acoustics later as well. But it's a bridge. It's a
Speaker 3: nice bridge. It's a regular bridge. People walk their dogs there,
Speaker 3: tourists go there all the time. It looks really.
Speaker 4: Nice, it does it does have that you know, it's
Speaker 4: sort of covered in some lichen type of growth over growth,
Speaker 4: so I guess so it does have kind of an
Speaker 4: old timey look to it because you know, it is
Speaker 4: around surrounding it, it is quite beautiful, very lush green spaces,
Speaker 4: and this, you know, all tracks for being a pleasant
Speaker 4: dog walking situation. You know, a lot of times the
Speaker 4: dogs aren't aren't even leashed, and they're you know, sometimes
Speaker 4: able to kind of frolic around in some of the
Speaker 4: adjacent areas and maybe hopefully if they're doing their business
Speaker 4: on the bridge, their owners are kind enough to pick
Speaker 4: it up. But you know, they could also go down
Speaker 4: into the woods and so they're wild oats. That's not
Speaker 4: the expression, but you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Mm hmmm mm hmm.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and walking a dog off leash, now, knowing what
Speaker 5: we know, is a really bad idea. So if you
Speaker 5: ever plan on going out there, please leash your dog.
Speaker 5: We're going to get in that too, that a little
Speaker 5: later about leash law in that particular area, but yeah,
Speaker 5: just be careful.
Speaker 3: Uh yeah, in general, if you're in an area with
Speaker 3: a lot of humans honestly a lot of other animals,
Speaker 3: or you're in an area that that's unfamiliar territory to
Speaker 3: you and your you and your pooch, you should have
Speaker 3: your dog on a leash. As a matter of fact.
Speaker 3: If unless you have a working dog or a farm
Speaker 3: a farm dog of some sort, then't have the dog
Speaker 3: on a leash. Here's here's the issue. According to the legend,
Speaker 3: which is kind of recent. Since the nineteen fifties, locals
Speaker 3: have been referring to this not by the name the
Speaker 3: Overton Bridge, but by a couple of more distressing street names,
Speaker 3: the Bridge of Death or the Dog's Suicide Bridge, because again,
Speaker 3: according to the story, canines in particular have difficulty with
Speaker 3: this crossing. For the better part of a century, they've
Speaker 3: been purposely jumping from the bridge, often to their deaths,
Speaker 3: with no rational explanation. So what is going on here?
Speaker 3: Is a bridge driving man's best friend to quote unquote suicide.
Speaker 3: We'll dive into it after word from our sponsor. Here's
Speaker 3: where it gets crazy, all right, First we have to
Speaker 3: look at the sources. We know that local legends sometimes
Speaker 3: don't have the same rigorous scholarship you might expect from
Speaker 3: from other stories. Right, because people are communicating this orally
Speaker 3: and becomes part of folklore. In this case, we see
Speaker 3: that a lot of local historians and researchers estimate hundreds
Speaker 3: of dogs i've jumped from the bridge. And if you
Speaker 3: read the more extreme reports like tabloid reports and thinking
Speaker 3: of Daily Mail, The Sun and so on, they'll say
Speaker 3: as many as six hundred or more dogs have dropped
Speaker 3: off the bridge. At least fifty are said to have died.
Speaker 3: But the deal is there are multiple confirmed incidents of
Speaker 3: jumps and deaths like it has happened multiple times. It
Speaker 3: has been reported in multiple outlets. There's one full length
Speaker 3: book about it, called The Barren of Rainbow Bridge by
Speaker 3: a local author named Paul Owen. So far, that's the
Speaker 3: only book that is fully centered on this, but you'll
Speaker 3: see it pop up in a lot of anthologies about
Speaker 3: you know, unexplained mysteries, time life, books of the Unknown,
Speaker 3: and so on. So we don't know how many dogs
Speaker 3: have jumped, but we do know they have.
Speaker 4: Had you guys heard of this idea of Rainbow Bridge
Speaker 4: being associated with dogs passing into the afterlife? Yes, I
Speaker 4: had not until very very recently. I'm obviously this isn't
Speaker 4: the Rainbow Bridge also something of Norse mythology, or it
Speaker 4: certainly at least is in the The Thorn movies.
Speaker 3: M Yeah, the idea of a rainbow bridge in I
Speaker 3: guess in legends. It can change across culture, but you
Speaker 3: can you can see that it's been taken up in
Speaker 3: a lot of a lot of pet literature, like when
Speaker 3: a it's it's just this side of heaven a place
Speaker 3: called the rainbow bridge. When a very beloved pet dies,
Speaker 3: the pet goes to that rainbow bridge.
Speaker 4: And it was.
Speaker 3: Inspired from a Norse poem to help Danish people more
Speaker 3: in the loss of animals.
Speaker 4: Got it.
Speaker 3: That's that's my understanding.
Speaker 4: No, that sounds right. I mean not to get too
Speaker 4: morose about it. But the dog I was referring to
Speaker 4: earlier we recently had to have put down due to
Speaker 4: some some serious cancer that it's bread and gotten just
Speaker 4: completely to the point of, you know, causing quality of
Speaker 4: life to go seriously downhill. And a really great organization
Speaker 4: called Lap of Love that I think is national. They'll
Speaker 4: come to your home and you know, help transition your
Speaker 4: animal and as peaceful and you know, I guess comfortable
Speaker 4: away as possible. And the lovely doctor who did the
Speaker 4: procedure for us for Jude wrote us the loveliest letter,
Speaker 4: a handwritten letter, and referred to you know, Jude finding
Speaker 4: her way across the Rainbow bridge. And I had never
Speaker 4: heard that before.
Speaker 3: That's why I highly recommend Lap of Love whenever anybody
Speaker 3: asked me about putting having to help a pet move on,
Speaker 3: it's just much less scary for them when they're in
Speaker 3: a familiar place, probably taken to a veterinary now.
Speaker 4: And actually, I've been talking with you as part of
Speaker 4: what made me really realize how important that was, because
Speaker 4: just the stress and trauma, especially with the dog who
Speaker 4: has maybe lost the use of her legs or whatever
Speaker 4: it might be, having painful you know things that you know,
Speaker 4: moving just becomes really really difficult and painful. And this
Speaker 4: was we were able to kind of have her in
Speaker 4: our favorite spot, like on a sunny day, with like
Speaker 4: light coming through, with actual rainbows shining through some of
Speaker 4: these little rainbow things we have in our house, and
Speaker 4: it was really lovely. For lovely being a tricky term,
Speaker 4: but for what it was, we really were able to
Speaker 4: make it a peaceful, you know, family kind of you know,
Speaker 4: nice situation. So second, that really wonderful organization, you know.
Speaker 3: The quality of life thing has Unfortunately that that dilemma
Speaker 3: has come up for a lot of dog owners who
Speaker 3: have encountered this phenomenon at Overton Bridge, because we know
Speaker 3: that sometimes dogs do survive this plunge, but many of
Speaker 3: them suffer terrible, terrible injuries such that their quality of
Speaker 3: life is just not worth it. So to put the
Speaker 3: animal out of pain, they have to be euthanized. Others
Speaker 3: struggled to survive and perish soon after their injuries. In
Speaker 3: at least one instance, a dog apparently jumped from the bridge,
Speaker 3: survived and ran all the way back up the slope
Speaker 3: and then jumped off again. So that dog, that dog
Speaker 3: hads vinegar to them. Interestingly enough, there's not another spot
Speaker 3: like this in Dumbarton. There's not another spot like this
Speaker 3: in Scotland as far as we could tell. There's not
Speaker 3: another place like this in Europe, at least with this
Speaker 3: specific threat to dogs. It seems to be unique. And
Speaker 3: we'll get to the theories, but before we do, there's a
Speaker 3: very important timeline question. I believe a lot of our
Speaker 3: astute fellow conspiracy realist probably clocked it's this all right.
Speaker 3: The bridge is finished in late eighteen hundreds eighteen ninety five.
Speaker 3: We said, the legends say that the dog suicides began
Speaker 3: in the nineteen fifties. However, reports of these dog jump
Speaker 3: incidents and let's call him that. Let's call him dog
Speaker 3: jump incidents to stay away from the S word. Really,
Speaker 3: they didn't really hit the news until the early two thousands,
Speaker 3: like two thousand and three or four. So I mean,
Speaker 3: and we've got an example of what happened there with
Speaker 3: poor Hendrix.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's at least a story coming to us from
Speaker 5: the Daily Mail from October two thousand and six about
Speaker 5: a woman named Donna Cooper and her collie named Ben.
Speaker 5: By the way, they jumped off of this bridge.
Speaker 3: And that article cites an earlier example in two thousand
Speaker 3: and four when a guy named Kenneth Meekley and his family,
Speaker 3: along with their pooch golden retriever named Hendricks, were walking
Speaker 3: on the bridge. And this story has a lot of
Speaker 3: the same commonalities. We'll see multiple instances of this. The
Speaker 3: dog is fine and suddenly bolts on the bridge, jumps
Speaker 3: off the edge. Apparently they favor a a couple of
Speaker 3: certain spots in the bridge. Hendricks survive, but spent the
Speaker 3: rest of his life, absolutely fearing and hating that bridge
Speaker 3: as you do it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we're talking fifty ft drop, yeah, fifty feet straight yeah,
Speaker 4: and you know to what to like a rock, wooded rocks.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like the Burn is a small river, so there's
Speaker 3: not enough there's not enough water there to cushing an impact.
Speaker 5: And just to give a little more of the number
Speaker 5: of dogs here, as we're estimating some of these according
Speaker 5: to that article from two thousand and six, they said,
Speaker 5: quote during one six month period of last year, so
Speaker 5: two thousand and five, five dogs jumped to their deaths.
Speaker 5: If that's you know, half a year, five dogs, there's
Speaker 5: a good chance that there are way more than maybe
Speaker 5: or even reported. Uh, but that's and that's those are
Speaker 5: the ones who died, right, who jumped to their deaths.
Speaker 5: So there may have been many more that jumped and
Speaker 5: hurt themselves.
Speaker 3: And it continues. I mean, if we fast forward to
Speaker 3: twenty fourteen, then we see Alice trevorro or trevorro who
Speaker 3: was walking with her dog, a cute little Springer Spaniel
Speaker 3: named Cassie. She reported a similar experience. And we've got
Speaker 3: a full quote here that comes from one of the
Speaker 3: anthology books. I mentioned Unsolved Enigmas, which was written by
Speaker 3: Sam Pilger and Leo moynihan. Now I'm not sure if
Speaker 3: he's related to Bobby moynihan from Saturday at Life. I
Speaker 3: don't know why I said that, Like that's the first
Speaker 3: detail people are gonna.
Speaker 4: Ask me about. Well, too many other moynihans. You know
Speaker 4: what is Bobby? That's not a super common Nay, there
Speaker 4: is job rule. We need him away in. We need
Speaker 4: him to give us his wisdom to bestow it upon us.
Speaker 4: So in twenty fourteen, Alice Trevoro is walking her Springer
Speaker 4: Spaniel Cassie, and had her own report of a strange
Speaker 4: incident on Overton Bridge. She had this to say. I
Speaker 4: had parked up, and as she is so obedient, I
Speaker 4: didn't put her lead on me and my son walked
Speaker 4: toward Cassie, who was staring at something above the bridge.
Speaker 4: She definitely saw something that made her jump. There is
Speaker 4: something sinister going on. It was so out of character
Speaker 4: for her. And this is from that book that you mentioned,
Speaker 4: been Unsalted Enigmas. I think the telling part here coming
Speaker 4: from a dog owner who maybe has no skin in
Speaker 4: the game per se, to like, you know, make a
Speaker 4: case for something sinister, a play is just the fact
Speaker 4: that this was out of character for the dog. You know,
Speaker 4: like owners know their dog's behavior and know what spooks them,
Speaker 4: and you know, probably what I ever would have done
Speaker 4: something like this to elicit such a reaction, you'd think
Speaker 4: would be noticeable.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Okay, So that's the problem with the timeline too.
Speaker 3: The larger the macro issue where dogs who have an
Speaker 3: immensely long history in Scotland immediately jumping off this bridge
Speaker 3: as early as you know, eighteen ninety six and people,
Speaker 3: to your point, Matt, just weren't reporting it. Did something
Speaker 3: change between eighteen ninety five and the early nineteen fifties
Speaker 3: that prompted dogs to start jumping to seek this untimely end.
Speaker 3: That's an unfair way to put it. We'll get to
Speaker 3: the anthropomorphization later, but it doesn't stop here. The timeline
Speaker 3: issue leads us straight to the world of theory, and sadly,
Speaker 3: there is one incident in particular that must be cited.
Speaker 3: It does not concern dogs. This is an official disclaimer, folks.
Speaker 3: This is you're about to hear a pretty graphic description
Speaker 3: of human violence and unspeakable tragedy. So this may not
Speaker 3: be appropriate for all listeners. Go ahead and just fast
Speaker 3: forward about four or five minutes. Give you a time
Speaker 3: to push the fast forward all right. For everyone who's
Speaker 3: still with us, you need to know the story of
Speaker 3: a man named Kevin Moy. Kevin Moy was thirty two.
Speaker 3: He suffered from both paranoid schizophrenia, and he'd later be
Speaker 3: diagnosed with it, but he was known to suffer from
Speaker 3: depression since he had contracted myalgic encephalopathy eight years before.
Speaker 3: In nineteen ninety four, he began to be convinced that
Speaker 3: he was the devil and that his newborn son, was
Speaker 3: two weeks old at the time, was the Antichrist due
Speaker 3: to a birthmark on the child's head. On the first
Speaker 3: outing he had with his son, he threw the child
Speaker 3: over the bridge.
Speaker 4: Wow, it is hard to hear.
Speaker 3: In court, according to the testimony, it came out that
Speaker 3: he believed that he and his infant were to blame
Speaker 3: for the Gulf War, and that he and his son
Speaker 3: would destroy the world by infecting mankind with a virus
Speaker 3: if he did not immediately end both their lives. Of note,
Speaker 3: he also attempted to take his own life unsuccessfully before
Speaker 3: being apprehended by authorities, and he had told police he
Speaker 3: was doing this to save the world. At the trial,
Speaker 3: which took place on January thirtieth, nineteen ninety five, he
Speaker 3: was found not guilty due to insanity and remanded to
Speaker 3: the care of the state. This was based was a
Speaker 3: jury trial. It was based on the statements of four
Speaker 3: different psychiatrists. Or asking why did he choose this bridge?
Speaker 3: Moy believed that the location had a dark, ancient history,
Speaker 3: dating back to the age of the Druids, and this
Speaker 3: tragic incident leads us to the first theory, which is
Speaker 3: actually surprisingly popular among the locals. It's the concept of
Speaker 3: the thin place. Have you guys ever heard of thin places?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 5: No, it's where spooky. Well, imagine the rainbow bridge that
Speaker 5: we were talking about between Midguard and Asgard, right between
Speaker 5: the spiritual plane or the godly plane and our earthly
Speaker 5: realm Imagine that rainbow bridge, except it's really short, and
Speaker 5: that would be a thin place. In my opinion, at least,
Speaker 5: you only got to take a few steps and then
Speaker 5: you've crossed the entire rainbow bridge.
Speaker 3: Yeah, a thin place. You can see this in Stephen
Speaker 3: King novels. You can see this in so many works
Speaker 3: of fiction, the idea that there is a certain place
Speaker 3: they can function as a nexus between the unseen world
Speaker 3: and the world of the day. This is why so
Speaker 3: many folkloric depictions of encounters with other worldly forces take
Speaker 3: place at like a crossroads at midnight, right where at
Speaker 3: a certain glade when the stars and the moon or right.
Speaker 3: The concept of the thin place going across cultures is
Speaker 3: still It's something that's very strong in Celtic myth as well.
Speaker 3: There was one old Celtic saying that was weirdly enough
Speaker 3: out its way into New York Times that says Heaven
Speaker 3: and Earth are only three feet apart, but in thin
Speaker 3: places that distance is even shorter. So in this theory, one,
Speaker 3: thin places are real, and a lot of people still
Speaker 3: believe some version of that. We'd love to hear your
Speaker 3: personal experience with this. And two, dogs, by nature of
Speaker 3: their superpowers of sensation, are somehow more sensitive to these
Speaker 3: than the average person. So this would lead us to three.
Speaker 3: The idea that in an attempt to cross over that
Speaker 3: very short rainbow bridge like you're talking about, Matt, to
Speaker 3: the other side of the thin place, dogs are leaping
Speaker 3: toward what they perceives the other side. No evidence exists
Speaker 3: to prove anything anomalous about this location as far as
Speaker 3: scientists are concerned, but it's still it's still a belief
Speaker 3: that people are having. And doubtlessly, if hundreds of dogs
Speaker 3: haven't died as a result of this over the years,
Speaker 3: then doubtlessly, at least a few times somebody told their kids,
Speaker 3: you know, Buster Buster's body may be here, but he
Speaker 3: crossed the rainbow bridge, you know, because you want to
Speaker 3: do what you can to help your kids navigate that
Speaker 3: kind of grief. This is a doubter episode. Now, obviously,
Speaker 3: not everybody agrees with this concept of a thin place
Speaker 3: existing in the first place. I guess they would say
Speaker 3: the places are generally of the same spiritual thickness. Uh,
Speaker 3: But that's not the only explanation. One guy who disagrees
Speaker 3: with the thin place concept is that author we mentioned earlier,
Speaker 3: Paul Owen. In his work Paul and later interviews as well,
Speaker 3: Paul doesn't agree that a thin place is responsible. Now,
Speaker 3: he believes that there are thin places, you know, old
Speaker 3: standing stones and things of that sort, but he doesn't
Speaker 3: think the bridge is one of them. Instead, he believes
Speaker 3: the bridge is haunted, and he believes that this apparition
Speaker 3: is the prime mover of this tragic phenomenon.
Speaker 4: That's right, the spirit of Lady Overton, who is said
Speaker 4: to have you know, walked around this bridge after her
Speaker 4: husband passed in nineteen oh eight, referred to colloquially as
Speaker 4: the White Lady of Overton. There's an interview in the
Speaker 4: Huffington Post where Ohen acknowledge the following the thing that
Speaker 4: he observed. I was up there one summer's day and
Speaker 4: I felt a very strong jab, like a phantom finger,
Speaker 4: twice in my back. It was the sensation you get
Speaker 4: when you fear someone might push you over the edge
Speaker 4: of a train platform. It's a very strange place. One
Speaker 4: of the things peculiar to the location is that it
Speaker 4: can seem very peaceful and tranquil, but it can turn
Speaker 4: at a moment's notice. So weird vibe and felt like
Speaker 4: someone poked him in the back. Of course, that could
Speaker 4: also be one hundred other things, right.
Speaker 3: It could be a perceived sensation, It could be a
Speaker 3: twinge of a back muscle. But in Owen's defense, I
Speaker 3: think anybody with long term back problems will know that
Speaker 3: you recognize, you know, You know your own body, so
Speaker 3: if you have back spasms or twinges or back pain,
Speaker 3: you know what it feels like, and you wouldn't mistake
Speaker 3: it for a stranger giving you the poke hope Facebook style,
Speaker 3: the hokey poke missed it too late.
Speaker 5: Move on, all right, we talked about a little bit
Speaker 5: at the beginning. Let's go back to just how close
Speaker 5: this bridge is to the Overton House, the large ornate
Speaker 5: again like Gothic style mansion, let's call it. That's sitting
Speaker 5: right there. And it's literally if we're talking about how
Speaker 5: short the Ramow Bridge is, that it's a crazy short
Speaker 5: walk from the front door of that house or I
Speaker 5: guess the main entrance of that house to where this
Speaker 5: bridge is.
Speaker 3: It's a really fancy driveway.
Speaker 5: You're right, No, you described it perfectly, Ben. It's just
Speaker 5: it's strange to me when I'm imagining the white lady
Speaker 5: of Overton, you know, mourning the death of her husband.
Speaker 5: This would be a place where she would walk and contemplate,
Speaker 5: you know, death and everything, and where you would just
Speaker 5: feel all of those things. And if you know, we've
Speaker 5: talked about it before. We just talked about it in
Speaker 5: Fortnite and Robo about residual energy. If that exists, right,
Speaker 5: if someone's intense energy experience in one physical place could
Speaker 5: possibly remain there in some way, and if it can,
Speaker 5: then this would definitely be a physical location.
Speaker 2: Where that kind of energy would linger.
Speaker 3: Let's say, yeah, okay, So I may not be the
Speaker 3: best person to unpack this with everyone, because I do
Speaker 3: despite all the science I've read about this, I do
Speaker 3: inherently have a predisposition that causes me to believe there
Speaker 3: can be vibes left. I do believe that, and maybe
Speaker 3: science will ultimately disprove that, or maybe it will prove it,
Speaker 3: But right now the question remains out because science doesn't
Speaker 3: know how to answer it. So here, with all all
Speaker 3: that caveat, just to be fair to everybody about where
Speaker 3: I'm calling from, shout out Raymond Carver. There's something interesting
Speaker 3: they don't see brought up a lot in these conversations.
Speaker 3: So if there is a ghostly entity, and this ghostly
Speaker 3: entity is somehow causing, through its existence or through its intention,
Speaker 3: these deaths or these jumps, then why haven't any of
Speaker 3: the other countless thousands of people who doubtlessly died in
Speaker 3: that area over centuries had the same effect Why is
Speaker 3: it just the one? I argue it's because that one
Speaker 3: makes for a good story, does that? I mean, it's
Speaker 3: just a question of numbers at that point too. And
Speaker 3: then also the timeline. If she's mourning this death in
Speaker 3: nineteen oh eight, what gives why didn't it go into
Speaker 3: the Why was it only in the nineteen fifties? Is
Speaker 3: that when she passed away herself? You know, I don't
Speaker 3: know's it's.
Speaker 2: Being widely reported on.
Speaker 3: Is that when it's being wildly.
Speaker 5: Maybe people who lived in the area did have dogs
Speaker 5: or humans or whatever that jumped off the bridge before that,
Speaker 5: It's just nobody heard about it. It was a sad
Speaker 5: thing that happened in town, you know.
Speaker 3: And then also another thing about the ghost angle is
Speaker 3: if you are listening when this pot comes cast comes
Speaker 3: out in twenty twenty three, if you're alive in the
Speaker 3: modern day, you have walked over countless graves. A lot
Speaker 3: of people died before you got here, you know what
Speaker 3: I mean? The world is full of ghosts and that
Speaker 3: in that sense, I don't know, it's just maybe it's
Speaker 3: a little bit posthumously unfair dependent on one ghostly entity.
Speaker 3: But there's another issue too with the reporting in this sense,
Speaker 3: in a lot of reporting out of England. I'll say,
Speaker 3: you can see these comments that I don't. I'll defer
Speaker 3: to you guys, I don't think they're meant to be
Speaker 3: dismissive or derogatory, because they're always very careful to pull
Speaker 3: quotes from people living in Scotland when they say stuff
Speaker 3: like this. But you will almost inevitably see some sideline
Speaker 3: thing that says there are a lot of superstitions, paranormal
Speaker 3: belief the people, these people in Scotland, they've a step
Speaker 3: closer to the supernatural than the rest of us.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: And I don't know, it feels like it's a way
Speaker 3: of kind of othering a culture, if that makes sense.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but look at pictures of the Overton House. If
Speaker 5: you grow up playing around that place and you look
Speaker 5: up at some of those second story windows, third story windows,
Speaker 5: they've got the drapes like half closed. They're open, right,
Speaker 5: but they're just creeping in on these old, old, old
Speaker 5: window panes. It doesn't matter if there's somebody in there
Speaker 5: just hanging out reading. It's gonna give you creeped out
Speaker 5: vibes just from the Gothic architecture and the way those
Speaker 5: curtains look telling.
Speaker 3: You, yeah, you've probably been mistaken for a ghost at
Speaker 3: some point in your life. Folks, depending on where you
Speaker 3: hang out, right, we're all someone else's ghosts at some point.
Speaker 3: But yeah, that's a really good point too, Matt. And
Speaker 3: we've got a quote that came from The Independent from
Speaker 3: Alistair Dutton, who is a local taxi driver at the
Speaker 3: time of this interview, and Alistair says, people in Dunbarton
Speaker 3: are very superstitious. We grew up playing in the Overton
Speaker 3: grounds and we believe in ghosts here because we've all
Speaker 3: seen or felt spirits up here. And you see this
Speaker 3: in other cultures too, you know, you go, like we're
Speaker 3: talking about this in la Urna. You know, if you
Speaker 3: go into someone else's house culturally speaking, if you're in
Speaker 3: their neck of the woods and they tell you, hey,
Speaker 3: that lake is haunted. It doesn't matter if you believe
Speaker 3: in ghosts or not. Just don't be that guy in
Speaker 3: the horror movie. Just don't go to the lake. They're
Speaker 3: trying to help you, or they're running some kind of
Speaker 3: weird criminal operation and that's how they keep people out
Speaker 3: of the lake. We've all seen Scooby Doo I don't
Speaker 3: know how.
Speaker 4: The Scooby Doo gang is never wise to the fact
Speaker 4: that they're being had every time. And then of course
Speaker 4: then you get the the what is it the thirteen
Speaker 4: Ghosts of Scooby Doo where ghosts are now real? Yeah,
Speaker 4: also I believe in in a pup named Scooby Doo.
Speaker 4: There's some real spooks as well, but in the original series,
Speaker 4: always a creepy old man or some grifter trying to
Speaker 4: pull a scam.
Speaker 3: Because they were all just high. That's how they guess,
Speaker 3: particularly follow Velma. Velma's on the straight narrow, and she's functional.
Speaker 3: She's functional, but.
Speaker 4: She parties fair enough, fair enough.
Speaker 3: So so now that we've cast dispersion upon the moral
Speaker 3: standing Scooby dow uh, we we should probably answer one
Speaker 3: of the questions that we imagine naturally came to you,
Speaker 3: our fellow listeners here, What about the people who actually
Speaker 3: live in the Overton House? You know, Like, to your point, Matt,
Speaker 3: is it some like really creepy guy who who just
Speaker 3: vaguely says means stuff about dogs? Is he like, is
Speaker 3: there a gargamele in there with dogs as the Smurfs? Not?
Speaker 3: Not really, it's a guy from Texas.
Speaker 2: Yeah, isn't he part of the church or something?
Speaker 3: He runs? Uh? He runs a charity to help women
Speaker 3: in unfortunate situations from the Overton House. Well, that's where
Speaker 3: he lives. He and his family lived there. But his
Speaker 3: job at he said time at the interviews, was running
Speaker 3: this charity.
Speaker 5: Wow, charity must be going really well.
Speaker 4: Uh wow?
Speaker 2: Where did he make his money?
Speaker 5: M Okay, anyway, that's just a really expensive looking house, y'all.
Speaker 2: That's all it is.
Speaker 3: It's a definitely it's definitely something that the only way
Speaker 3: most podcasters could buy it is if they teamed up
Speaker 3: and made like an Instagram HiPE house and had fifteen roommates.
Speaker 5: No, if they verboed it for a day and a half.
Speaker 2: That's how. That's how you get it.
Speaker 3: What is verbo?
Speaker 4: What is VERBOI?
Speaker 5: Oh, I'm renting the house for whatever? What what's the
Speaker 5: really popular one? I'm an Airbnb like right, that's how
Speaker 5: you get it?
Speaker 3: Okay, okay for a day.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: But his response, you know, is, hey, Scotland's weird man golf.
Speaker 4: I mean, come on, what kind of people do that?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Bob Hill says exactly that. He says, there's a
Speaker 3: lot of the supernatural here, it's very common in people's lives.
Speaker 3: And then he says Overton, the Overton area in particular
Speaker 3: is quote more spiritual than other parts. That's Texan Pastor
Speaker 3: Bob Hill. But he doesn't necessarily buy it as the explanation.
Speaker 3: He has one that requires neither superstition nor belief in
Speaker 3: the divine or the infernal or alternate dimensions. He's like
Speaker 3: Dennis Reynolds and it's always sunny in Philadelphia. He's basically saying,
Speaker 3: what about the smell? You haven't thought about the smell?
Speaker 3: Which leads to our next possibility.
Speaker 4: Gotta say, I like the idea that Texas Pastor Bob
Speaker 4: Hill is Bobby Hill from King of the Hill, all
Speaker 4: grown up and then having found God. And also, you know,
Speaker 4: it kind of jives with his whole showmanship in the
Speaker 4: character God'm sorry, guys, I was getting excited about the
Speaker 4: new King of the Hill series coming out. No, you
Speaker 4: haven't thought about the smell, have you you?
Speaker 3: Which leads to our people, Yeah, which leads to our
Speaker 3: next possibility. We're gonna pause here for word from our sponsors,
Speaker 3: and then we'll go to the last big theory, which
Speaker 3: has we'll find may not still explain what's going on
Speaker 3: at overton Bridge. Okay, I'm getting the realm of science,
Speaker 3: the scientific take. To answer this, we have to go
Speaker 3: back to the question we posed at the beginning, which
Speaker 3: is this, do dogs, like some human beings, commit suicide?
Speaker 3: Would they purposely take their own lives? Do animals at
Speaker 3: all do this thing that the human animal does? To
Speaker 3: answer that, we're going to lean on a great house
Speaker 3: stuff works article by our old pal Jessica Toothman. Hey Jessica,
Speaker 3: and Hey Matt, do you remember Jessica.
Speaker 4: I do.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, it might have been a little before your time, nol.
Speaker 3: She might have moved on.
Speaker 5: Ye.
Speaker 4: I don't think we cross paths, but this article is
Speaker 4: definitely on point.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and shout out to Jessica's former co worker now
Speaker 3: husband Andrew because they actually they are a workplace romance
Speaker 3: gone right, and congratulations to you to so. In Jessica's
Speaker 3: article do animals commit suicide? She points out that experts
Speaker 3: largely don't believe that most animals are capable of what
Speaker 3: of suicide in the human sense. We know that animals
Speaker 3: can and do die on purpose, right, but it may
Speaker 3: not have the same emotional motivating factors, Like, think about
Speaker 3: the octopus. Unless it gets a very specific kind of
Speaker 3: exciting brain surgery that's still on the fringe of science
Speaker 3: and I think is being actively repressed, then reproducing will
Speaker 3: trigger a hormonal kill switch in the octopus. Reproduction is
Speaker 3: a death sentence. Or think of all the self sacrificial
Speaker 3: tactics that different insects will take, right like when bees
Speaker 3: will swarm around a wasp to increase the body temperature
Speaker 3: of the wasp and they're sacrificed themselves to cook it.
Speaker 3: Or how you know, speaking of bees, how they've got
Speaker 3: one sting and then they're out. I can't imagine that's
Speaker 3: that's a that's a real kick in the pants biologic.
Speaker 4: To die on such an aggressive note, you know, and
Speaker 4: such a state of of duress just doesn't seem like
Speaker 4: a good way to go.
Speaker 3: Imagine if you could punch people once.
Speaker 4: Once and then you're dead. Everybody got to make that
Speaker 4: punch count.
Speaker 3: Everybody's like one punch man. Well, sad thing is gets
Speaker 3: way more intense. Oh.
Speaker 4: The sad thing though, is that the bee. It's it's
Speaker 4: not like they have to do it on purpose either, right,
Speaker 4: Like if someone like touches a bee, they could get
Speaker 4: stung or like grabs a bee or something, or maybe
Speaker 4: they do do it on purpose. But my point is,
Speaker 4: do they know it's going to kill them? Probably not.
Speaker 3: Well, it's for the good of it's for the good
Speaker 3: or the hive.
Speaker 4: Right, Well, that goes back to the whole question of animals.
Speaker 4: Do they know? What do they know? When? Do they
Speaker 4: know it? You know, do the dogs know if they
Speaker 4: throw themselves off this bridge is going to do them harm?
Speaker 4: Probably not, certainly not in the way that we're describing
Speaker 4: it or talking about ideas of suicide. Right.
Speaker 5: I want to posit that I do not believe that
Speaker 5: any of these dogs that have jumped off of this
Speaker 5: bridge believe or think in the moment that whatever action
Speaker 5: they're taking is going to cause them any harm whatsoever.
Speaker 2: Same, And I.
Speaker 5: Only know this because of the motivation factors that I've
Speaker 5: identified in my two dogs. And and it's there's like
Speaker 5: three or four things, right. It's they were outside and
Speaker 5: they smell something, and they will go crazy trying to
Speaker 5: identify where that scent is coming from. They see something
Speaker 5: in the woods and they're trying to track it with
Speaker 5: their eyes and as they move and they'll run along
Speaker 5: the fence to watch it and move with it. If
Speaker 5: they hear something like if they're in the house and
Speaker 5: they hear, like one of my dogs, if she hears thunder,
Speaker 5: even far in the distance that I can't detect, she
Speaker 5: gets nervous. Or if they hear the raccoons that are
Speaker 5: on my porch, apparently they go nuts. And what was
Speaker 5: the other one?
Speaker 2: Oh? Food?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 3: Yeah, food, And then maybe some fear motivation like well,
Speaker 3: thunder would cover the fear motivation as well as the
Speaker 3: auditory motivation. Yeah, I agree with you. And also, of course,
Speaker 3: just to add this in here, yes, some higher order
Speaker 3: animals that's not the most fair term, but some higher
Speaker 3: order animals do appear to die of grief or heartbreak.
Speaker 3: That also happens, but none of those things are the
Speaker 3: same as when the human primate contemplates or commits the
Speaker 3: act of taking its own life. And in all the
Speaker 3: documented cases of canine death or injury on this unfortunate bridge,
Speaker 3: not a single doggo exhibited signs of distress or malaise
Speaker 3: in the days or hours leading up to their incident.
Speaker 3: If one to explain this lean on zoology, If you're
Speaker 3: a zoologists, you want to look at a couple things
Speaker 3: to understand these behaviors, similar to what mattch just wonderfully
Speaker 3: broke down the nature of the animal, the organism in question,
Speaker 3: as well as the nature of the environment in which
Speaker 3: the animal exhibits that behavior. And this is we're going
Speaker 3: to cut some stuff out of here real quick. So
Speaker 3: one of the questions we would have to have is
Speaker 3: what about the sounds. What if there is a sound
Speaker 3: that is outside of human hearing range, but as a
Speaker 3: siren call to dogs that's very easy to measure. It
Speaker 3: does not appear to be the case. People have also said,
Speaker 3: well there's a nearby nuclear plant, perhaps that could explain it.
Speaker 3: That doesn't seem to be the case. In twenty ten,
Speaker 3: this animal behaviorist named doctor David Sands teamed up with
Speaker 3: some folks and gave the first real scientific investigation of
Speaker 3: this phenomenon. His can cclain illusion really informs our conclusion
Speaker 3: on the show. He says, look, these canines are not
Speaker 3: purposely taking their own lives. They're chasing something and as
Speaker 3: not a rainbow bridge. Look at the dogs who've jumped
Speaker 3: from the limited demographic data we have, a lot of
Speaker 3: them are long nosed hunting breeds, the kinds that are
Speaker 3: drawn to scents, and what kind of animals tend to
Speaker 3: live in these small rivers in the forest. Mammals of
Speaker 3: some sort. And then he also said, think about how
Speaker 3: tall a dog is, think about their chase instinct, especially
Speaker 3: if they're hunting or working dog. They don't have the
Speaker 3: visual perspective to see that the ground has dropped. Right,
Speaker 3: the last time they remember the ground, it was entering
Speaker 3: the bridge and there's this slope. So to them, from
Speaker 3: their perspective, the bridge is over level ground. They're just
Speaker 3: on a weird part of the ground that happens to
Speaker 3: have these two walls on either side, so they don't
Speaker 3: clock that there's a fifty foot drop and these smells
Speaker 3: are coming up from the river, you know, thinking of
Speaker 3: things like minks that one gets brought up a lot
Speaker 3: minks or pine martins right, or I don't know, field mice.
Speaker 3: You know, insert any large prey mammal here. What would
Speaker 3: you do. You're walking by and you smell it, and
Speaker 3: as far as you know, it's just over the side
Speaker 3: of the wall.
Speaker 5: I think this is extremely valid. Again, if you look
Speaker 5: at pictures of this bridge and consider how short it
Speaker 5: is in length. And then also look at what the
Speaker 5: bridge looks like as you're entering onto it. If you
Speaker 5: are at a dog's height, doesn't matter how tall your
Speaker 5: dog is, like a little Scottish Terrier to a Dalmatian
Speaker 5: at that height walking along, it doesn't look like there's
Speaker 5: a drop off at all. So you know, if you
Speaker 5: can just imagine the dog would have no sense. As
Speaker 5: you said, Ben, that there's a fifty foot drop after that.
Speaker 5: No matter which side you enter that bridge from, it
Speaker 5: doesn't look like there's a huge drop there, and that's
Speaker 5: because of how relatively far out onto the land that
Speaker 5: bridge stretches.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and again it's a short bridge. As you pointed out,
Speaker 3: there were some hunters, I believe, who originally said, well,
Speaker 3: I've been here for quite some time, there's no mink
Speaker 3: in the area, but that was disputed by a guy
Speaker 3: named David Sexton, who joined doctor Sands in this investigation.
Speaker 3: And Sexton said, Hey, one end of this bridge in
Speaker 3: particular has nest of minks and squirrels and mice, and
Speaker 3: they all produce smells. So this seems to be, at
Speaker 3: least for my money, this seems to be the most
Speaker 3: likely theory because it requires us to prove the smallest
Speaker 3: amount of things. The first two theories rely on cultural
Speaker 3: interpretation and frankly a couple things modern science can't measure yet,
Speaker 3: let alone prove. But the third still needs some additional testing,
Speaker 3: you know, to be water tight or to pass the
Speaker 3: stiff test.
Speaker 2: Oh, very nice, man.
Speaker 5: Water is really important as well, because who is the
Speaker 5: I watched a short documentary on this from a long
Speaker 5: a little while ago.
Speaker 2: A guy named David Sands.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's doctor David Sands did the investigation.
Speaker 5: Okay, so he's the one who even notes when he's
Speaker 5: standing on top of that bridge that you can constantly
Speaker 5: hear running water. But if you look down, the water
Speaker 5: isn't very deep at all. It's not a dry creek
Speaker 5: bed by any means, but there's not a ton of
Speaker 5: water flowing. But it sounds like there's a lot of
Speaker 5: water moving as well. So I'm also imagining that if
Speaker 5: the dog even understands in some way that there's a
Speaker 5: drop there, the sound may trick them into believing that
Speaker 5: there's deep enough water for them to jump into water
Speaker 5: the way they maybe.
Speaker 4: Have in the past splash around. Good old time.
Speaker 3: Totally makes sense. I mean, this is the thing. In
Speaker 3: the meantime, people are learning to be more careful with
Speaker 3: their canines around this area, more careful with their pets.
Speaker 3: Overton Bridge is not a bad place. It doesn't have
Speaker 3: a bad vibe. It's a beautiful piece of local history. Tourist,
Speaker 3: pedestrians and canines go there all the time. It's just
Speaker 3: you know, keep your dog on a leash, especially around
Speaker 3: that part, around any drop like this, because if the
Speaker 3: scientific causes are the explanation, and again they seem the
Speaker 3: most likely, then it would mean that logically this place
Speaker 3: is probably not unique just because of the geography. Well,
Speaker 3: and you know, I'm talking about smells.
Speaker 4: I mean things around bodies of water or as you know,
Speaker 4: like after it rains, like smells kind of carry further.
Speaker 4: So if you're in a very like moist climax, you know,
Speaker 4: like Scotland, you're surrounded by running water and all of
Speaker 4: this greenery, those smells for certain types of dogs, you know,
Speaker 4: are gonna be very tempting.
Speaker 5: Guys, I think I may have found it, and you're right, nol.
Speaker 5: The American mink is an invasive species in.
Speaker 2: Scotland, Okay.
Speaker 5: It arrived in or late nineteen twenties so early nineteen thirties. Hmmm,
Speaker 5: I like this go on right, there were deliberate releases
Speaker 5: of mink and breeding that were occurring in nineteen fifty six. Okay,
Speaker 5: the mink population. This is according to Invasive Species dot
Speaker 5: Scott so Scottish invasive species. What guys, it's right around.
Speaker 3: The British number one and the mink number two right
Speaker 3: as invasive species.
Speaker 5: I'm just pointing this out to say maybe this was
Speaker 5: an invasive species around that time when we started hearing
Speaker 5: about things jumping off that bridge.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 5: Oh, and there's another really interesting thing. In two thousand
Speaker 5: and four there was one of the first mink control
Speaker 5: projects that was in Aberdeenshire. Aberdeenshire, guys, what if the
Speaker 5: dogs like just started picking up on this mink smell
Speaker 5: for the first time right around the early windows.
Speaker 4: It's great. It's really helpful with the timeline for sure.
Speaker 4: And you know what else. Minks are known for their musk. Oh,
Speaker 4: mink musk is actually a profitable product. If you type
Speaker 4: in mink musk you get all kinds of entries for
Speaker 4: like websites, Minnesota trapline products, you know, for attracting other minks.
Speaker 4: Mink musk, mink glands, you know, for sale and all
Speaker 4: of that stuff. They are known for excreting a very
Speaker 4: potent aroma.
Speaker 3: Which is how they come up as usual suspects. So
Speaker 3: this is our this is what we think is the
Speaker 3: most likely explanation. It doesn't exactly have to be minx,
Speaker 3: but there's some compelling, circumstantial evidence that they can be.
Speaker 3: They could be the culprit here unwittingly. So with that
Speaker 3: in mind, we want to hear your stories. Do you
Speaker 3: think this explains it? Do you think there's something else
Speaker 3: out there? And most importantly, does your neck of the
Speaker 3: Global woods have any other similar unusual places. If so,
Speaker 3: let us know. We can't wait to hear from you.
Speaker 3: We try to be easy to find online.
Speaker 4: We are. You can find it the handle conspiracy Stuff
Speaker 4: on Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook. Also check us out on
Speaker 4: Instagram and we're doing all kinds of fun content also,
Speaker 4: some of which ends up on YouTube, but you can
Speaker 4: find this on Instagram with the handle conspiracy Stuff Show,
Speaker 4: as well as on TikTok. We also find some of
Speaker 4: those fun little breadcrumbs of content.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, guys can add one more mink thing before I
Speaker 5: tell people how to call us please, I'm sorry to
Speaker 5: keep going.
Speaker 4: On this with love God, please no make it up.
Speaker 5: Going back to doctor Sands who tested the sense of
Speaker 5: three different animals, Ben that you mentioned what was a
Speaker 5: was mink, squirrels, and mice.
Speaker 2: I think uh.
Speaker 5: In the way he admits it's unscientific testing, it's not
Speaker 5: controlled testing. But in his tests with ten dogs where
Speaker 5: he released them their three different scents, the dogs could
Speaker 5: go to mice, squirrels, or mink, seven out of the
Speaker 5: ten dogs went directly to the mink scent, which just
Speaker 5: is an unscientific way of showing that these dogs of
Speaker 5: all different breeds tend to at least be most interested
Speaker 5: in the mink versus the other two cents just put
Speaker 5: it out.
Speaker 4: Cracked it. But Matt, if anyone else has anything to
Speaker 4: add to this theory, what are some other ways they
Speaker 4: can reach out to us if they don't want to
Speaker 4: do the whole social media regamarole, The rumors are correct.
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