Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,
Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big
Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they
Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the podcast. It is great to have
Speaker 1: you here. New listeners, old listeners, wherever you are in
Speaker 1: the world. Hi, my chronic overthinkers, all of my fellow
Speaker 1: anxious friends out there, Welcome to this week's episode. Today
Speaker 1: we are discussing the psychology of overthinking and chronic indecisiveness.
Speaker 1: This has been raised by you guys again and again
Speaker 1: as a huge challenge and experience in your twenties, and
Speaker 1: personally I can really relate. I don't know why I
Speaker 1: have not done this topic before, especially considering my own
Speaker 1: personal experience. Overthinking is such amaze that really feels impossible
Speaker 1: to get out of. Our thoughts can be so loud
Speaker 1: and so difficult to navigate, and they can result in
Speaker 1: this spiral where we feel like we have been thinking
Speaker 1: about one small thing for hours and hours, or we
Speaker 1: are absolutely paralyzed by indecision because what if we haven't
Speaker 1: considered all possible outcomes? There is a psychological reason. A
Speaker 1: lot of us find ourselves feeling this way and adopting,
Speaker 1: i would say, a maladaptive thinking style. And with most things,
Speaker 1: I think an explanation can be incredibly liberating. I personally
Speaker 1: find it so infuriating when people talk about living in
Speaker 1: the moment or instructure to just simply stop thinking about it.
Speaker 1: It really overlooks so many of the deeper cognitive roots
Speaker 1: of this experience, ranging from a fear of uncertainty to perfectionism,
Speaker 1: traw my childhood learning, and even comorbid mental health conditions
Speaker 1: like anxiety and ADHD. It's not all within your control.
Speaker 1: There are so many hidden elements of overthinking that we
Speaker 1: do not discuss. And then, of course there's the indecision.
Speaker 1: We've spoken about the paradox of choice on the podcast before,
Speaker 1: but essentially it's this theory that when we have a
Speaker 1: lot of options, it actually becomes harder to make a
Speaker 1: decision compared to when we have fewer options, because we
Speaker 1: become paralyzed almost by the possibilities. That's particularly pertinent, I
Speaker 1: would say for those of us in our twenties, because
Speaker 1: we are just at the beginning of a long journey
Speaker 1: and range of life decisions. And during this period, I
Speaker 1: think we are typically presented with a lot of different
Speaker 1: options and paths. You know, what do I study at university?
Speaker 1: What if I want to go and travel for a
Speaker 1: few years. Which of these job offers do I say
Speaker 1: yes to? Do I move to this new city, or
Speaker 1: do I settle down? You know, we don't want to
Speaker 1: box ourselves in, But what I'm personally seeing more of
Speaker 1: anecdotally is a generation, you know, my generation, our generation
Speaker 1: of people that are so overwhelmed by options that they
Speaker 1: actually remain quite stagnant because of that fear around making
Speaker 1: the wrong choice. And I think a lot of that
Speaker 1: can be explained by our tendency to overthink. And if
Speaker 1: that sounds like you, you are most certainly not alone.
Speaker 1: I think although the experience of overthinking can feel incredibly isolating,
Speaker 1: it is a hugely common experience. And the good news
Speaker 1: is that you kind of have the power to reprogram
Speaker 1: your brain. You can unlearn these patterns of thinking. And
Speaker 1: that's really what I want to talk about today. We're
Speaker 1: going to break down the mysteries of overthinking from the
Speaker 1: origins and the reasons why we overthink, why it may
Speaker 1: actually indicate a greater level of self awareness, how it
Speaker 1: links to diagnosable mental health conditions, and some of the
Speaker 1: leading theories and tips on how we can stop overthinking
Speaker 1: not through rationality but through a bit of delusion and distraction.
Speaker 1: I'm personally very much in need of this episode, I
Speaker 1: don't know about you. And also, before we get into it,
Speaker 1: special thank you to Nish, a wonderful listener from Sydney
Speaker 1: who came up to me whilst I was eating sushi
Speaker 1: at the food court. Very glamorous, but she actually helped
Speaker 1: pick this week's episode, so we all have her to
Speaker 1: thank for this topic. I think, without further ado, let's
Speaker 1: get into the nitty gritty around the psychology of overthinking
Speaker 1: and indecisiveness. As always, let's start with the basics. What
Speaker 1: actually is overthinking? Obviously, we are constantly thinking at all times,
Speaker 1: so it's not the quantity of thoughts that's the problem here,
Speaker 1: but actually the opposite. It's when our thoughts lack nuance
Speaker 1: because we become fixated and stuck on one thing in particular.
Speaker 1: Maybe that is a certain situation or a topic, or
Speaker 1: a person or a hypothetical that we cannot stop returning to,
Speaker 1: in which we analyze for excessive periods of time. These
Speaker 1: kind of thoughts are what we would call maladaptive, meaning
Speaker 1: not appropriate, because we can become obsessive and these cognitions
Speaker 1: begin to control us rather than the other way around.
Speaker 1: If you feel like you can't relax, that your brain
Speaker 1: will not shut off even when you want it to,
Speaker 1: that's a massive indicator that you are someone who is
Speaker 1: an overthinker. This pattern, it actually normally suggests that there
Speaker 1: is something beyond your control that is bothering you. And
Speaker 1: by mulling it over and over again and examining it
Speaker 1: from every direction, and we give ourselves a sense of
Speaker 1: agency over whatever we're thinking about. Often, though, you know,
Speaker 1: when this type of thinking becomes habitual, we are met
Speaker 1: with chronic indecisiveness. A key hallmark of overthinking is the
Speaker 1: inability to resolve a specific thought. And so when we
Speaker 1: cannot move past our doubts, or we cannot stop questioning
Speaker 1: our next move or ruminating on something that's happened, we
Speaker 1: naturally can't make progress. And I think this results in
Speaker 1: a stalemate. You know you are going to struggle to
Speaker 1: move forward or make a decision if you're not actually
Speaker 1: clear on how you think about the situation, or you're
Speaker 1: still stuck in that thought spiral. I'll give you this
Speaker 1: example that I was thinking about, and that is thinking
Speaker 1: about your ex partner, thinking about someone that you loved
Speaker 1: and everything that went wrong and all the what ifs,
Speaker 1: and you're ruminating about past events and you're kind of
Speaker 1: somewhat frozen in those memories. You can't make a decision
Speaker 1: about how you want to heal or move forward. You
Speaker 1: can't begin to date new people or reclaim your own
Speaker 1: mental space and thoughts if you cannot break out of
Speaker 1: this loop. I think another source of overthinking, particularly during
Speaker 1: our twenties, is this age old conundrum of would my
Speaker 1: life turn out better if I were to do things
Speaker 1: differently or make a certain set of decisions. Like I
Speaker 1: spoke about earlier, we're really faced with an endless list
Speaker 1: of possibilities or options during this decade, but also a
Speaker 1: lack of hindsight to make sense of what we actually want.
Speaker 1: And I think overthinking tricks us into thinking that what
Speaker 1: we're doing is somehow helpful, and that if we constantly
Speaker 1: mull over and think about what we want or this
Speaker 1: situation will somehow find some hidden solution that we hadn't
Speaker 1: actually found before, and that's not always the case. I
Speaker 1: think we often find ourselves in a state of what
Speaker 1: we call analysis paralysis, whereby the more we think about something,
Speaker 1: the harder it actually becomes to make a decision because
Speaker 1: we have too much information to process and too many
Speaker 1: variables to consider. And as we know, contrary to popular belief,
Speaker 1: humans are actually better at making decisions when they have
Speaker 1: less information or choices to consider. There's this other side
Speaker 1: to overthinking as well, which is worrying about how others
Speaker 1: perceive us. If you find yourself in your head a
Speaker 1: lot like myself, or you know, when you're around people,
Speaker 1: you really can't break away from thinking about how they're
Speaker 1: perceiving you. It can really take away from those interactions
Speaker 1: and the quality of those relationships. I think the approval
Speaker 1: of others is something that we all innately crave, but
Speaker 1: studies have shown that we consistently overestimate how much they're
Speaker 1: actually thinking about us. I said this to my friend
Speaker 1: the other day, but no one is thinking about you
Speaker 1: as deeply as you're thinking about yourself. We are very
Speaker 1: much self centered, self absorbed creatures, and yet I think
Speaker 1: we've all had those moments where we've changed a million
Speaker 1: times before a social event because we are overthinking what
Speaker 1: others will think of us, or you've ruminated for hours
Speaker 1: on some tiny, tiny part of an otherwise pleasant interaction
Speaker 1: with someone because you're so concerned with how you came off.
Speaker 1: There's actually a name for this in psychology. It's called aladoxophobia,
Speaker 1: and it's essentially intense anxiety about the approval of others.
Speaker 1: And I would say it's highly correlated with overthinking. The
Speaker 1: good news is well not really good news. But an
Speaker 1: element of this that I think might make us feel
Speaker 1: better is that if you are an overthinker, as much
Speaker 1: as it can be incredibly mentally exhausting and paralyzed, it
Speaker 1: may actually indicate that you're probably more self aware and
Speaker 1: emotionally intelligent compared to the average person. Self Awareness, by definition,
Speaker 1: refers to the ability to observe your own thoughts and
Speaker 1: recognize how you are perceived by others, but also internally
Speaker 1: being able to identify what makes you an individual and
Speaker 1: the impact of your decisions. Elisa is unsurprisingly linked to
Speaker 1: our emotional intelligence, and what that refers to is the
Speaker 1: ability to recognize the influence of your emotions and actions
Speaker 1: on others. Thinking about an issue from different perspectives and
Speaker 1: reflecting on how a decision may affect others, especially your
Speaker 1: loved ones. It really allows for greater empathy. You know,
Speaker 1: you look internally and you're able to see correlations between
Speaker 1: how you act and how others respond. So if you're
Speaker 1: someone who typically sits with your thoughts for I would
Speaker 1: say an un comfortable period of time, the chances are
Speaker 1: that you, as a consequence, are much more in tune
Speaker 1: with how your decisions not only influence the people around
Speaker 1: you hence that level or need for social approval, but
Speaker 1: also your own internal self perception and your future. That
Speaker 1: I think is a beautiful quality, but it also comes
Speaker 1: with its burdens. A question I actually get a lot
Speaker 1: is can I be too self aware? And I think
Speaker 1: when we examine the relationship to overthinking, the answer is yes.
Speaker 1: When we fall into the trap of over analyzing everything,
Speaker 1: a few things occur. Firstly, of course that chronic indecisiveness,
Speaker 1: but also an inability to focus on our responsibilities, perhaps
Speaker 1: a failure to see the bigger picture, and that results
Speaker 1: in anxiety and at times panic. But also from the
Speaker 1: outside it can look like self absorption. I don't necessarily
Speaker 1: think that's the case, because a lot of the time
Speaker 1: when we overthink or mostly worried about others or the
Speaker 1: feelings of others. But when you do spend too much
Speaker 1: time inside your own thoughts, sometimes it can be hard
Speaker 1: to get that perspective you need to make the right
Speaker 1: decision or to really see clearly what the situation is.
Speaker 1: So why does this occur? That's the million dollar question,
Speaker 1: isn't it? Well. Psychology gives us a few answers, and
Speaker 1: the primary ones are this fear of uncertainty and an
Speaker 1: illusion of control, a fear of failure, and I think
Speaker 1: that's really linked to perfectionism and procrastination, and then also
Speaker 1: our childhood environment and the chaos that may have been
Speaker 1: our childhood and things like generalized anxiety disorder, depression and ADHD.
Speaker 1: This fear of uncertainty, I think is perhaps one of
Speaker 1: the best explanations, in my opinion, for why we overthink.
Speaker 1: Humans do not deal well with unknowns because unknowns present
Speaker 1: danger or that could potentially indicate situations that made jeopardize
Speaker 1: our survival. It makes us really uncomfortable to not know
Speaker 1: the outcome. And they've actually proved this in a series
Speaker 1: of studies looking at the impact of uncertainty on our
Speaker 1: brain and our body. In these experiments, I think they
Speaker 1: were conducted in like the late nineties, but I'll have
Speaker 1: to fact check myself there. In these experiments, they hooked
Speaker 1: participants up to a series of electrodes that could deliver
Speaker 1: like a slight electric shock. It wasn't too painful, but
Speaker 1: it was definitely there. They then either told participants when
Speaker 1: they would shock them, they gave them almost like a timeline,
Speaker 1: or they left it ambiguous so the shock could come
Speaker 1: at any time and the participant wouldn't know. So the
Speaker 1: participants who experienced the unpredictability condition, so the second condition,
Speaker 1: they reported significantly more discomfort, more anxiety, and more pain
Speaker 1: despite the level of the shock being the same compared
Speaker 1: to those who knew when the shock was going to occur.
Speaker 1: And this basically demonstrated that uncertainty unknowns they can really
Speaker 1: intensify how threatening a situation feels and can also result
Speaker 1: in this state of hypervigilance where we cannot break out
Speaker 1: of just thinking about this one stimulus. When is this
Speaker 1: shock going to happen? What do I do to prepare
Speaker 1: for it? You know, those people who knew that the
Speaker 1: shock was going to occur. They had the timeline, they
Speaker 1: had the roster, They were able to let their mind want,
Speaker 1: whereas the other set of participants were so consumed with
Speaker 1: thoughts and anxiety. In other words, they really began to
Speaker 1: overthink their circumstances and what they were about to receive,
Speaker 1: what they could expect. I think our reaction to uncertainty
Speaker 1: has an evolutionary process. Our brain wants to ensure our
Speaker 1: survival and it wants to predict what is going to
Speaker 1: happen next because it allows us to prepare our body
Speaker 1: and our mind in the most effective way possible. So
Speaker 1: in uncertain situations, that planning is a lot harder, and
Speaker 1: so our brain uses overthinking as a way to bring
Speaker 1: a sense of calm and control to the chaos. When
Speaker 1: we face ambiguous situations, our brain wants to find the
Speaker 1: most possible outcome, and so what it does is it
Speaker 1: sends our brains spiraling. It sends us thinking about every
Speaker 1: single possible catastrophe. When we think about that in the
Speaker 1: sense of our twenties, right, there are a lot of
Speaker 1: unknowns we are Depending on where you're at in your twenties,
Speaker 1: still quite young, you know, some of us have only
Speaker 1: really been adults for like two years. If you're twenty
Speaker 1: at this point, maximum nine years, so you're still really
Speaker 1: a child in regards to your twenties. You don't really
Speaker 1: have any idea of what's coming for you. That's kind
Speaker 1: of both the beauty and the chaos of this deck.
Speaker 1: And so this constant analysis, this overthinking, it creates a
Speaker 1: sense of false control over our circumstances because we think
Speaker 1: that we can prevent negative outcomes by fortune telling them,
Speaker 1: by thinking this situation over. I think keeping ourselves stuck
Speaker 1: in what I would call problem solving mode makes us
Speaker 1: feel like there is a solution if we just think
Speaker 1: hard enough and long enough about our circumstances. It's this
Speaker 1: fairly common mental fallacy, and the unconscious reasoning is essentially,
Speaker 1: if I can imagine every possible outcome, if I can
Speaker 1: think about this a million and one weighs over no
Speaker 1: matter what the outcome is, I'll be prepared. And yet
Speaker 1: we actually can't predict the outcome. We can't predict the future,
Speaker 1: and this heightened state of alertness and rumination means that
Speaker 1: we actually will probably make worse decisions, or we won't
Speaker 1: make a decision at all, I think moreover overthinking also
Speaker 1: stems from a desire to avoid mistakes or failure by
Speaker 1: excessively dwelling on past experiences or hypothetical futures. We attempt
Speaker 1: to anticipate and prevent our potential errors, and that leads
Speaker 1: to a perpetual cycle of overthinking. None of us like
Speaker 1: feeling like a failure, especially when we have high expectations
Speaker 1: for ourselves or for the situation, and we want to
Speaker 1: avoid that uncomfortable feeling and protect our self esteem. So
Speaker 1: our brain employees overthinking as a way to essentially predict
Speaker 1: what situations might present the opportunity to make a wrong decision,
Speaker 1: and how we can prevent that failure. I think we
Speaker 1: may also develop this fear in relation to other people
Speaker 1: and their experiences and hearing from them. This is called
Speaker 1: informational learning in psychology. You know, for example, your friend
Speaker 1: is doing this like really hard course that you have
Speaker 1: to do, and they tell you how difficult it is
Speaker 1: and the fail rate for the final exam, etc. Etc.
Speaker 1: And what you may find is that you deliberately then
Speaker 1: avoid that course or that situation, or find yourself overthinking
Speaker 1: how you're going to approach it because you are so
Speaker 1: bound up in your fear of failure. Maybe this won't
Speaker 1: surprise you, but this is highly correlated to perfectionist tendencies.
Speaker 1: If you've listened to my episode on perfectionism and academic anxiety,
Speaker 1: you'll know this already. But often, if we aren't convinced
Speaker 1: we can do something perfectly, we will avoid doing it
Speaker 1: all together. In other words, we procrastinate because we are
Speaker 1: so consumed by not meeting our standards or the standards
Speaker 1: that have been imposed on us. Procrastination isn't about a
Speaker 1: lack of capability or ability. It occurs because we don't
Speaker 1: feel mentally prepared to perform or complete a task and
Speaker 1: get the outcome that we want. Come so overwhelmed by
Speaker 1: the idea that what we produce won't be perfect that
Speaker 1: we habitually avoid doing it. If you've ever found yourself
Speaker 1: kind of staring at the blank page of an assignment,
Speaker 1: already anticipating what it would feel like to get a
Speaker 1: bad grade, and really paralyzed by how to start, perfectionism
Speaker 1: might actually be the root of your overthinking. As hard
Speaker 1: as it is to acknowledge, we are all going to
Speaker 1: fail throughout our lives. A million times over in a
Speaker 1: million different ways, and also in ways that we could
Speaker 1: never anticipate. No matter how much your brain tries to
Speaker 1: trick you, that you can avoid it by overthinking. I
Speaker 1: think maturity comes from recognizing that although no amount of
Speaker 1: ruminating will protect you, whatever does happen, you get to
Speaker 1: decide how you'll respond. A mindset I try and adopt
Speaker 1: is that every failure is actually just a lesson in disguise.
Speaker 1: It's a scenic detour on which you get to learn
Speaker 1: so much more about yourself than if everything had come
Speaker 1: kind of gone right. And also, I think making the
Speaker 1: wrong decision is always better than making no decision at all,
Speaker 1: because remaining stagnant not doing anything is one of the
Speaker 1: worst things we can really do. In our twenties, we
Speaker 1: have so many possibilities. There's this study I always cite it,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to sign it again. But you are
Speaker 1: going to regret the choices you don't make more than
Speaker 1: the choices that you do over and over again. They
Speaker 1: find this. So it might not be the perfect decision,
Speaker 1: maybe it won't guarantee complete happiness, but at least you've
Speaker 1: made it. The other origin of overthinking, I think is
Speaker 1: really important to discuss is childhood environment and our early
Speaker 1: learning experiences. Most people who have developed a tendency to
Speaker 1: overthink and subsequent difficulty with decision making have acquired this
Speaker 1: habit in childhood, particularly if they were raised in an
Speaker 1: unpredictable environment. As children, we are incredibly vulnerable and dependent
Speaker 1: on our caregivers for literally everything. We also don't yet
Speaker 1: possess those coping mechanisms to deal with uncertainty in an
Speaker 1: appropriate manner. So, for example, if you had parents who
Speaker 1: were perhaps unpredictable, maybe they dealt with addiction, or they
Speaker 1: were constantly moving around or changing your routines, they weren't
Speaker 1: there for you, or in severe cases, maybe they were abusive.
Speaker 1: As children, we use overthinking as a way to bring
Speaker 1: about a sense of control over our surroundings and to
Speaker 1: be prepared for what might be thrown at us. This
Speaker 1: has the result of perhaps momentarily lessening our anxiety, but
Speaker 1: it actually contributes to using or developing a maladaptive thinking style.
Speaker 1: The more we react to a situation by overthinking as
Speaker 1: a way to self soothe in the presence of chaos
Speaker 1: and uncertainty, the more deeply ingrained this coping mechanism becomes
Speaker 1: and as we grow up it becomes or difficult to
Speaker 1: replace this thinking style because as children we didn't really
Speaker 1: have the self awareness to understand that it may be harmful,
Speaker 1: and so it's maintained into adulthood. I think with all
Speaker 1: disordered thinking or maladaptive habits such as this one, I
Speaker 1: think it is really valuable to assess what the childhood
Speaker 1: origins may have been. Additionally, if as children we maybe
Speaker 1: felt like we didn't have much agency over our life,
Speaker 1: this may also make it difficult to make decisions and
Speaker 1: cause us to be paralyzed by overthinking because we don't
Speaker 1: feel confident enough in our own abilities and discernment. I
Speaker 1: would love to see a study on that, actually, I
Speaker 1: think would be so fascinating. Such a fascinating research topic,
Speaker 1: you know, the intersections between childhood blame and ownership over
Speaker 1: responsibility in adulthood. There you go a research title. If
Speaker 1: anyone wants to do their thesis on that, it's all yours.
Speaker 1: I think another psychological factor contributing to overthinking is a
Speaker 1: heightened state of self awareness and self consciousness, which we
Speaker 1: spoke about before. We possess an inherent tendency to evaluate
Speaker 1: and judge ourselves, but we also have this tendency to
Speaker 1: seek the validation of others that makes us inherently self critical.
Speaker 1: And this self critical mindset often fuels overthinking because we
Speaker 1: excessively scrutinize our actions and our decisions because we fear
Speaker 1: potential criticism or rejection, and social comparison plays a role
Speaker 1: in overthinking. Comparing ourselves to others, especially of course, in
Speaker 1: the error of social media, can create unrealistic expectations. And
Speaker 1: then I think therefore constant need to measure up, a
Speaker 1: constant kind of standard that we feel we need to
Speaker 1: meet and that we feel we need to compare ourselves to,
Speaker 1: resulting in this overthinking and this spiral about our worth
Speaker 1: and our achievements. Those are some of the high level
Speaker 1: psychological explanations. But we cannot we cannot talk about overthinking
Speaker 1: without examining the relationship to diagnosable mental health conditions like
Speaker 1: generalized anxiety and ADHD. So we are going to discuss
Speaker 1: that and so much more after this short break. The
Speaker 1: act of overthinking can be linked to a number of
Speaker 1: psychological problems, such as anxiety and depression, although it's kind
Speaker 1: of hard to know what happens first in most cases.
Speaker 1: This researcher put it really perfectly when they said, it's
Speaker 1: a very quintessential chicken or egg kind of conundrum. However,
Speaker 1: one of the primary symptoms of a generalized anxiety disorder
Speaker 1: is not only persistent anxiety, but also overthinking and someone
Speaker 1: who plans for all possible worst case scenarios. When we
Speaker 1: get down to the biological reason why this occurs, we
Speaker 1: can see, I think more clearly where overthinking actually comes from,
Speaker 1: and it's really not your fault. A range of neurotransmitters
Speaker 1: are responsible for the typical symptoms of anxiety and with
Speaker 1: that overthinking. For example, serotonin glutamate GABBA, and the hormone
Speaker 1: neuropenephron it's otherwise known as adrenaline. They all play a
Speaker 1: role in modulating our anxiety response. So one study found
Speaker 1: that when levels of GABBA in our brain are too low,
Speaker 1: it can trigger excessive worrying and excessive overthinking because GABBA
Speaker 1: is what helps control the signals between the nerve cells
Speaker 1: in our brains. So when these signals are not mediated,
Speaker 1: when they're not moderated by this neurotransmitter, our brain goes
Speaker 1: into overdrive. There's nothing kind of stopping those neural pathways
Speaker 1: from constantly firing, and that's where we really start to
Speaker 1: feel like our brain is on a bit of a
Speaker 1: hamster wheel, that we are not in control of our thoughts.
Speaker 1: It's important to note here that overthinking is just one
Speaker 1: symptom and it's not a diagnosable disorder. You cannot be
Speaker 1: diagnosed with overthinking. It's just a cognitive process that is
Speaker 1: associated with a broader condition, that being anxiety that is
Speaker 1: characterized by this fear, by this excessive worry and hypervigilance.
Speaker 1: But I think it's really worth examining whether the root
Speaker 1: of this thought pattern could be mitigated by managing your
Speaker 1: overall anxiety levels. There is also this concept of depressive rumination,
Speaker 1: which is a form of overthinking where we feel almost
Speaker 1: comforted by dwelling on the past and what we regret,
Speaker 1: by going over our mistakes or our regrets again and again.
Speaker 1: It's like kind of how waves turn glass into sand
Speaker 1: or smooth out hard surfaces. Each time we examine a memory,
Speaker 1: it becomes more blunt, and when we ruminate on it,
Speaker 1: we lessen the emotional pain attached to it. Or so
Speaker 1: we think that might just be a myth, because it
Speaker 1: may actually be. The more we think about something that
Speaker 1: actually aggravates our anxiety response, it makes it harder to
Speaker 1: let that memory pass and it elevates our distress. I
Speaker 1: think it's a super fine line to walk. You really
Speaker 1: do have to process what you go through. But when
Speaker 1: you find that you cannot stop returning to something that
Speaker 1: was cringe or embarrassing, or something that was maybe even traumatic,
Speaker 1: there are some really major negative consequences to that. That's
Speaker 1: why this kind of cognitive process is associated with a
Speaker 1: major depressive disorder in some instances, not all. Of course.
Speaker 1: The other mental health condition I want to discuss is ADHD.
Speaker 1: I will say I'm not an expert on this. This
Speaker 1: was just a really fascinating article that I read and
Speaker 1: I think it's valuable to put forward. But whilst we,
Speaker 1: I think most typically associate ADHD with hyperactivity and impulsivity,
Speaker 1: it also manifests an excessive ruminating and an inability to
Speaker 1: break out of a specific thought pattern. Individuals with ADHD,
Speaker 1: they often report obsessive thoughts and difficulty regulating or bringing
Speaker 1: their thoughts under control. Once again, it can be a
Speaker 1: primary symptom that may lead someone to seek an ADHD diagnosis.
Speaker 1: You know, it might be that first kind of red flag.
Speaker 1: If you can't stop overthinking, and you can't stop obsessively
Speaker 1: thinking about something, maybe it's a sign that you do
Speaker 1: need to seek professional help. If that is the case,
Speaker 1: not all overthinking is generally indicative of a larger problem.
Speaker 1: It is just a typical symptom for some people. So
Speaker 1: take it with a grain of salt and maybe go
Speaker 1: and see someone if you're finding that it's really interrupting
Speaker 1: your ability to function. Now that we've kind of discussed
Speaker 1: the theories behind overthinking and the subsequent indecisiveness that tends
Speaker 1: to come from it, I think we really need to
Speaker 1: explore the ways in which we can bring this behavior
Speaker 1: or this tendency under control. Part of that is understanding
Speaker 1: the types of decision makers that we are and how
Speaker 1: we can reprogram our brain to kind of ignore the tiny,
Speaker 1: itty bitty details and ignore all the possible pathways and
Speaker 1: just focus on the bigger picture. Back in the early
Speaker 1: two thousands, these psychologists, they came up with this theory
Speaker 1: that there are two types of decision makers in the world.
Speaker 1: There are satisfiers and there are maximizers. Satisfiers they aim
Speaker 1: for a good enough solution. They have a very clear
Speaker 1: set of criteria that they are not trying to maximize,
Speaker 1: but just satisfy. And when their criteria is met, when
Speaker 1: they get what they're after, they're happy with that decision.
Speaker 1: They're really happy with it. They are what we would
Speaker 1: call highly utilitarian and practical. The example that people give
Speaker 1: is looking for a new car that's a good one. Actually,
Speaker 1: so if your like main criteria is like, I want
Speaker 1: it to drive, and I want it to be under
Speaker 1: five thousand dollars, you'll find a car that drives under
Speaker 1: five thousand dollars, you'll purchase it. You're not looking for
Speaker 1: a car that can drive really really well and is
Speaker 1: under three thousand dollars. You're not constantly looking for the
Speaker 1: better option. You're just looking for something that meets or
Speaker 1: satisfies those criteria. In contrast, maximizers are not satisfied unless
Speaker 1: they have the best possible outcome, the perfect solution. But
Speaker 1: often in aiming for that kind of perfect outcome, they
Speaker 1: have very ambiguous criteria. It's really based on the right feeling.
Speaker 1: And interestingly, in this study conducted in two thousand and seven,
Speaker 1: they found that these types of decision makers are actually
Speaker 1: less happy compared to satisfiers, because maximizers are constantly preoccupied
Speaker 1: with the what if, What if I find something better?
Speaker 1: What if something better comes along in the future, and
Speaker 1: I've already accepted this other decision. They also reported more
Speaker 1: avoidance of decision making in general, that chronic indecisiveness that
Speaker 1: we're talking about, and they're more likely to report impulsive,
Speaker 1: spontaneous decision making, which sounds counterintuitive, but I think the
Speaker 1: reasoning behind that is because they are so consumed with
Speaker 1: overthinking what the best possible outcome could be that they procrastinate,
Speaker 1: and when they actually do have to make the decision,
Speaker 1: it's often closer to the deadline, or they do so
Speaker 1: impulsively because they're so exhausted from this rumination from considering
Speaker 1: all the possible outcomes that they no longer have the
Speaker 1: brain space to actually make a proper decision, so they
Speaker 1: do so spontaneously. In order to address our underlying tendency
Speaker 1: to overthink and therefore that chronic indecisiveness, what we need
Speaker 1: to do is shift from being a maximizer to a satisfier,
Speaker 1: and that involves a few things. When you were faced
Speaker 1: with a decision, narrow down the solution using chunking. This
Speaker 1: is a psychological idea whereby a big group of information
Speaker 1: is broken down into smaller parts and grouped by common
Speaker 1: elements or easier problems. So this really allows you to
Speaker 1: tackle a big decision by turning it into a series
Speaker 1: of smaller choices, And it also allows our brain to
Speaker 1: channel that energy we used to overthink into a meaningful
Speaker 1: problem solving strategy, and it makes the problem less profound,
Speaker 1: and it makes it seem less life changing when we
Speaker 1: kind of take off those smaller chunks. So, for example,
Speaker 1: someone actually messaged me with this conundrum they were having
Speaker 1: the other day of choosing between two job options, and
Speaker 1: one of them paid more, but the other one was
Speaker 1: more aligned with what they enjoyed and what they saw
Speaker 1: themselves doing in the future. Using that satisfied principle and
Speaker 1: that method of chunking, we need to break down our
Speaker 1: two options and break down that information using a series
Speaker 1: of discerning questions. So in this example, you know, can
Speaker 1: I live off the salary of the second job? Would
Speaker 1: I be able to pay my bills? That's like a
Speaker 1: minimum criteria for living. Then there's that second question of
Speaker 1: what actually matters more to me? Right, now this is
Speaker 1: personal preference and values, financial security, or workplace satisfaction. And
Speaker 1: then let's look to the future. What are the opportunities
Speaker 1: for promotion or further development? Which job is going to
Speaker 1: offer me more in the next five years or ten
Speaker 1: years around Korea development. From those questions, we can kind
Speaker 1: of create a bit of a rudimentary pros and cons list,
Speaker 1: So instead of feeling paralyzed by this big choice, we
Speaker 1: can approach it as a satisfier would what are the
Speaker 1: minimum conditions for my happiness here, and which of these
Speaker 1: choices meets those minimum conditions. I think it's also to
Speaker 1: remember that everything in life is temper and fixable. The
Speaker 1: decision you make right now, it's not going to lock
Speaker 1: you in for the rest of your life. You can
Speaker 1: always admit that maybe you made a mistake or you
Speaker 1: made the wrong choice and go back and fix that,
Speaker 1: or also maybe even find yourself satisfied even though that
Speaker 1: choice may not have been perfect. Life is kind of
Speaker 1: what you make of it. So many times you think
Speaker 1: that you will be more satisfied doing something else. But
Speaker 1: the grass is, as they say, always greener on the
Speaker 1: other side, so overthinking it isn't actually going to make
Speaker 1: you happier or give you the outcome that you want.
Speaker 1: Another massive strategy. This is my favorite strategy. I personally
Speaker 1: use this a lot when I'm overthinking, is to find
Speaker 1: some way to make your thoughts tangible and organized. When
Speaker 1: we overthink, everything in our brain feels like a mess.
Speaker 1: It feels like this big group of like unruly vines
Speaker 1: that have just tangled up in our brain. But there's
Speaker 1: this saying that a problem on a page is a
Speaker 1: problem halved. Hold that anxiety or worry or that thought
Speaker 1: in your mind. Grab a pen and paper, and spend
Speaker 1: twenty thirty minutes, however long, writing down every single aspect
Speaker 1: of the problem that is concerning you, every possible ramification,
Speaker 1: every possible element. Get those thoughts out into the open,
Speaker 1: and you'll suddenly find they are a lot more manageable
Speaker 1: because you're actually able to do something productive with them.
Speaker 1: You feel like you've done something useful. I also find
Speaker 1: that it can really minimize some of our own internal delusions.
Speaker 1: Sometimes things that seem highly probable in our brain can
Speaker 1: sound so silly when we speak them out loud or
Speaker 1: when we put them in writing, because we let our
Speaker 1: minds process that information in a different format. It's the
Speaker 1: same reason why talking about a problem with the friend
Speaker 1: often helps us ease our anxiety and tendency to overthink,
Speaker 1: because when we speak it out loud, we kind of
Speaker 1: see how irrational we might be, you know, how irrational
Speaker 1: we might be. And I think that kind of tactic
Speaker 1: of making what is normally internal external and making it
Speaker 1: tangible has personally really really helped me out. Distraction also helps.
Speaker 1: I know that sounds like a cop out, but sometimes
Speaker 1: we just need some peace and quiet and we want
Speaker 1: to give our brains a rest. Telling yourself to stop
Speaker 1: thinking about it will never work, but making it harder
Speaker 1: for your brain to think about it does. Our minds,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day have limited space. So
Speaker 1: when we fill up that space with a challenging activity
Speaker 1: like doing a puzzle or listening to a podcast and
Speaker 1: going for a run, or reading a book and listening
Speaker 1: to music, something that activates multiple parts of our brain,
Speaker 1: we kind of jam all the channels, meaning that our
Speaker 1: anxiety is overthinking and our indecisiveness and those problems that
Speaker 1: we have or those thought patterns they can't get through,
Speaker 1: and it makes it really difficult for our brain to
Speaker 1: ruminate on them obviously, though I think would be unethical
Speaker 1: if I didn't say that this is a short term solution,
Speaker 1: and sometimes we do need to go a lot deeper
Speaker 1: to kind of identify those bad mental habits and what
Speaker 1: we would call automatic negative thoughts in psychology, so an
Speaker 1: automatic negative thought, it refers to a pattern of negative
Speaker 1: thinking that interrupts our ability to make decisions. This ranges
Speaker 1: from things like overthinking, but also fortune telling, which is
Speaker 1: an element of overthinking, and overgeneralizations, should statements, I should
Speaker 1: do this, I should have done that, and also jumping
Speaker 1: to conclusions, feeling like you know what's going to happen,
Speaker 1: catastrophizing in a situation. We can train ourselves to identify
Speaker 1: when these types of thoughts are present and deliberately refocus
Speaker 1: our thinking. Catch the thought, write it down, examine the
Speaker 1: evidence for it. Why do you think that you're going
Speaker 1: to fail? Why do you think those people don't like you?
Speaker 1: Why do you think you're making the wrong decision? Why
Speaker 1: do you think that person is mad at you? Is
Speaker 1: there evidence for this thought or is it just an
Speaker 1: automatic negative thought that you've internalized. Part of that is
Speaker 1: also going to see a therapist or a psychologist, someone
Speaker 1: asked me the other day, like, is therapy actually worth it?
Speaker 1: I think that in these situations, in all situations, it
Speaker 1: actually really is because this person is completely impartial. Their
Speaker 1: only focus in those sessions is to tell you the
Speaker 1: truth and help you through your problems. So what they're
Speaker 1: going to do is really call you out for your
Speaker 1: negative thought patterns, for your automatic negative thought thoughts. They're
Speaker 1: going to hold you accountable when you're overthinking, and kind
Speaker 1: of act that you know, as that voice of reason,
Speaker 1: that person who interrupts those thought patterns as they are
Speaker 1: occurring and asks you to correct them. You know, is
Speaker 1: this actually helpful? Is thinking about this really going to
Speaker 1: give you a solution? The chances are probably not. Like
Speaker 1: we said, overthinking tricks our brain into thinking that if
Speaker 1: we mold something over a million times over, if we
Speaker 1: ruminate on it enough, somehow, some new solutions, some new
Speaker 1: outcome will be discovered. And I don't really think that's
Speaker 1: ever the case. You don't really have to do it alone.
Speaker 1: I think that's the final message here. You know, it
Speaker 1: can be really paralyzing and really difficult, and I think
Speaker 1: it's worth considering what level of professional help is needed,
Speaker 1: you know, fear of failure, perfectionism, anxiety, whatever it is.
Speaker 1: Your twenties should be a time for freedom and getting
Speaker 1: to enjoy all of those precious moments and all those
Speaker 1: little joys without constantly worrying about what comes next or
Speaker 1: who thinks what about you? So I would say, from
Speaker 1: one chronic thinker to another, I really hope you find
Speaker 1: that piece, and I hope that this episode has been helpful.
Speaker 1: I guess my final reminder for the day is where
Speaker 1: you place your attention is where you place your energy.
Speaker 1: And although sometimes it can feel like our thoughts are
Speaker 1: in control, that is not the case. It is your brain,
Speaker 1: It is your mind. You have the ability to kind
Speaker 1: of sort through the rubble, sort through the mess, and
Speaker 1: select what you want, select what you want from all
Speaker 1: of that, select what you want from the chaos. Also,
Speaker 1: you know as much that as it is a really
Speaker 1: common tendency, I think it's also really valuable to just
Speaker 1: quickly return to that point. A lot of this is
Speaker 1: to do with things that are outside of our control,
Speaker 1: this need for a sense of certainty. Even some of
Speaker 1: those neurotransmitters like Gabba, those are really kind of the
Speaker 1: culprit in this situation. So it's not some personal flaw.
Speaker 1: It is sometimes just the way that our brains are wired,
Speaker 1: and you don't need to fix yourself in order to
Speaker 1: cope with that thought pattern. I think that's a really
Speaker 1: a really good place. Actually, I want to I kind
Speaker 1: of want to end things, because, yeah, I just think
Speaker 1: sometimes in my own personal life, I find myself overthinking
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I just wish I could stop thinking
Speaker 1: about this. I don't want to think about this. I
Speaker 1: don't want to keep annoying my friends with this like
Speaker 1: minor concern that they don't really care about. But knowing
Speaker 1: that is that it is, you know, somewhat of a natural,
Speaker 1: even evolutionary process has really helped me accept it, which
Speaker 1: means that I've been able to address it. So I
Speaker 1: really do hope that you enjoyed this episode. As always,
Speaker 1: if if there is someone in your life who needs
Speaker 1: to hear this, you should send them a link. Maybe
Speaker 1: they will find it helpful, maybe they won't. I don't
Speaker 1: really know, but it's always nice to show that you're
Speaker 1: thinking of them and that you know what they're going through.
Speaker 1: So please feel free to share this episode along if
Speaker 1: you also feel cooled to do so. No pressure, but
Speaker 1: please feel free to leave a five star review on
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you are listening right now. It
Speaker 1: really helps the show, it helps it to reach new people,
Speaker 1: it helps me, so I really do value the support
Speaker 1: and if you have an episode suggestion, please feel free
Speaker 1: to join me over at that Psychology podcast. I take
Speaker 1: any and all ideas, I add them to my list,
Speaker 1: and every now and again I really like to pull
Speaker 1: something from what someone has suggested and dedicate a whole
Speaker 1: episode to it. So there's something that you're going through
Speaker 1: that you want a psychological explanation for, please feel free
Speaker 1: to ended over. As always, we will be back next
Speaker 1: week with another episode. See you then,