Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly conversation
Speaker 1: about mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions
Speaker 1: we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves.
Speaker 1: I'm your host, Doctor Joy Harden Bradford, a licensed psychologist
Speaker 1: in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or to find a
Speaker 1: therapist in your area, visit our website at Therapy for
Speaker 1: Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you love listening to
Speaker 1: and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to
Speaker 1: be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental
Speaker 1: health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me
Speaker 1: for session three forty three of the Therapy for Black
Speaker 1: Girls Podcast. We'll get right into our conversation afterword from
Speaker 1: our sponsors. Welcome back for another episode of our January
Speaker 1: Jumpstart mini series. All month long, we're having conversations with
Speaker 1: talented black women leaders across creative and professional mediums to
Speaker 1: assist you in putting the p and prioritizing your personal growth.
Speaker 1: If you've been holding back on doing you, this is
Speaker 1: your sign to jump headfirst into the possibilities of a
Speaker 1: new year. As we enter a new year, perhaps you're
Speaker 1: looking to incorporate more laughter, fun, and teamwork into your
Speaker 1: daily routine. Well, what if I told you that there's
Speaker 1: an activity that can help you do all of these
Speaker 1: things plus learn to yes and your way through this
Speaker 1: roller coaster of emotions we call life. I'm talking about
Speaker 1: improv comedy, and today's guests is here to share all
Speaker 1: about it. Joining me today is improv player and coach
Speaker 1: Eva R. Lewis. For over a decade, she's been seen
Speaker 1: performing with several improv teams in the Washington, DC area,
Speaker 1: as well as at comedy festivals around the world. Since
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, she's been one half of White Privileged Black Power,
Speaker 1: an award winning diversity and inclusion improv show that she
Speaker 1: also co created and is offered to organizations. In our conversation,
Speaker 1: Eva and I explore the mental health benefits of improv,
Speaker 1: how to find inclusive improv communities in your area, and
Speaker 1: the ways in which the fundamentals of improv can bleed
Speaker 1: positively into your daily life. If something resonates with you
Speaker 1: while enjoying our conversation, share it with us on social
Speaker 1: media using the hashtag TVG in Session, or join us
Speaker 1: over the Sister Circle to talk more about the episode.
Speaker 1: You can join us at community dot therapy for blackgirls
Speaker 1: dot com. Here's our conversation. But thank you so much
Speaker 1: for joining us today, Eva.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, thanks for having me. Yeah, I'm excited to
Speaker 2: chat with you.
Speaker 1: So if you could take us back to the beginning,
Speaker 1: can you tell me a little bit about what inspired
Speaker 1: you to get interested in improv and what was your
Speaker 1: first experience with it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So what inspired me is that when I was
Speaker 2: in law school, I had a group of friends. We
Speaker 2: would go to Second City in Chicago and they put
Speaker 2: on a bunch of variety shows frequently, so we would
Speaker 2: go to just about all the shows. And then when
Speaker 2: I was graduating from law school, I had a friend Mike,
Speaker 2: who was like, I'm going to take a class and
Speaker 2: I was like, Oh, you take a class, I'll take
Speaker 2: it with you. So while we're studying for the bar,
Speaker 2: we're taking this improv class and it was a blast.
Speaker 2: It was like a nice release vow of like to
Speaker 2: be silly and the fun, meet new people, and then
Speaker 2: we would go hang out afterwards after class. So I
Speaker 2: kept that up, went through the whole Second City curriculum
Speaker 2: and then the two levels at IO in Chicago, and
Speaker 2: then moved back home and kept doing improv. So the
Speaker 2: first taste was watching the shows and then saying like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is fun, enjoyable, and then the second part was
Speaker 2: like just getting the idea when I saw someone else
Speaker 2: doing it to say hey, I want to do it too.
Speaker 1: Wow. So that's quite an interesting mix to be studying
Speaker 1: for the bar and then taking your improv classes. Yes,
Speaker 1: I can imagine. It was a great like stress reliever,
Speaker 1: a very different part of your.
Speaker 2: Brain, exactly exactly, and it lined up perfectly because you
Speaker 2: would go to class in the morning for your bar classes.
Speaker 2: Then I would go to the Starbucks that was connected
Speaker 2: to the theater and just stay there all day and
Speaker 2: then six fifty then move on over to class for
Speaker 2: seven o'clock. And then it was over two weeks before
Speaker 2: the bar. So there was no excuse, right that this
Speaker 2: is taken away from studying and passing, and I did pass,
Speaker 2: so it was it was a great time and it
Speaker 2: was just fun and.
Speaker 1: Silly, right right, right. So for those of us who
Speaker 1: may not be you super familiar with improv, can you
Speaker 1: give us a definition, like, what are some of the
Speaker 1: fundamentals of improv?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so improv is definitely in the word. And then
Speaker 2: particularly for improv comedy, which is what I do, everything
Speaker 2: is made up on the spot. What you're given as
Speaker 2: a reformer or your group is you get some type
Speaker 2: of prompt, a git we call it, and then that
Speaker 2: shows the audience that you are making it up on
Speaker 2: the spot. So everything that you see, whether it be
Speaker 2: short form or long form, and short form is like
Speaker 2: if you watch whose line is it any way, where
Speaker 2: they're doing games and they set up the game and
Speaker 2: then they play the game. Or if you're doing long form,
Speaker 2: which is like you're doing a scene like if you
Speaker 2: would go to a theater to see a play or movie,
Speaker 2: there's a scene. That scene is completely made up. And
Speaker 2: then what the improv comedy part is that you are
Speaker 2: trying to be funny. You're trying to entertain in that way.
Speaker 2: And so there are some basic principles that you learn.
Speaker 2: And the main one that I'll say, and this is
Speaker 2: something that maybe people have heard of, is yes and
Speaker 2: it is the mantra of improv. It is the first
Speaker 2: thing you will ever learn if you take a class
Speaker 2: is that yes and aspect, which is to say yes
Speaker 2: to whatever reality what's being said, and then you try
Speaker 2: to add on top of it, and you go through
Speaker 2: a variety of exercises like no butt or yes but
Speaker 2: and you'll realize that you can get to the fun
Speaker 2: faster if you just say yes and to what's been
Speaker 2: given to you. Got it?
Speaker 1: Got it. So it sounds like you guys started, Like
Speaker 1: you mentioned one of your friends was taking a class
Speaker 1: and you were like, oh, okay, I'll go with you. So
Speaker 1: if somebody is interested in starting improv, would they just
Speaker 1: look up classes in their area? Like how do you
Speaker 1: get started with it? Yeah?
Speaker 2: So the way you get started is like most places
Speaker 2: have a improv theater or they have a theater that
Speaker 2: has like some improv class or workshop. So I would say,
Speaker 2: if you're in the DC area, there's a Washington Improv Theater.
Speaker 2: I'm teaching a class in January of twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: level one. If you want to come through, just google
Speaker 2: improv classes, check your local theater. Also, there's a bunch
Speaker 2: of resources on online and a bunch of books. But
Speaker 2: obviously the best avenue is to take a class where
Speaker 2: you're either virtual I think some folks are still doing that,
Speaker 2: or you are in person doing it.
Speaker 1: Got it? So what might we expect at our first class, Like,
Speaker 1: is there a way to just sit and pay attention
Speaker 1: and look in see what other people are doing first
Speaker 1: before you jump in.
Speaker 2: Some people try to do that and then you just
Speaker 2: try to coax them in because here's the thing. What
Speaker 2: improv And everyone's biased about their own or form, but
Speaker 2: what improv It's supposed to be a collaborative, inclusive environment, right,
Speaker 2: So the idea is that there is no wrong answer.
Speaker 2: As I tell my students, there may be a better answer,
Speaker 2: but there's never any wrong answer. So the thing is
Speaker 2: there are workshops where you can get it like a
Speaker 2: taste of improv right, you know, two hours and it's
Speaker 2: usually like free events. I know ar theor does it.
Speaker 2: But the main thing is don't be too scared of it,
Speaker 2: because if you're going to anything improvised classes, the environment
Speaker 2: is such that people want to invite you, and we
Speaker 2: know this can be scary, especially if you're trying to
Speaker 2: be funny. You're like, I'm not funny, and what we
Speaker 2: all are funny in our own ways. So the main
Speaker 2: thing I'll just say, like, just give it a try.
Speaker 2: If you don't like it, leave all right, But I
Speaker 2: guarantee you're gonna get something out of it.
Speaker 1: So can you walk us through an introductory class that
Speaker 1: we might see in our first improud class.
Speaker 2: Yeah, your first class level one. We start off one
Speaker 2: acknowledging that like, hey, we all are our beginners, we're
Speaker 2: all new. Most time, you don't know people, so you're
Speaker 2: set in the groundwork to like, hey, I think the
Speaker 2: nails we use is like we're like a cool startup, right,
Speaker 2: like at your workplace, So like you don't want to
Speaker 2: be too edgy. Some people they want to talk about
Speaker 2: topics that may ignited a discussion, and the thing is like,
Speaker 2: if you're in a work setting, you probably wouldn't say that, right,
Speaker 2: but you would talk about what's on TV, what's happening here,
Speaker 2: or the latest gossip or whatever. That's fine. So it's
Speaker 2: like setting that base ground you'll work and then the
Speaker 2: first thing you're doing is like how to access the
Speaker 2: yes and part of it. So you're doing exercises where
Speaker 2: you're not trying to be funny. All we're trying to
Speaker 2: do is just work your mind to like bring words
Speaker 2: and phrases when you can. And so you may start
Speaker 2: with an exercise where it's two people, two lines lined
Speaker 2: up and you're just saying, like, hey, just state and
Speaker 2: occupation that you are, right, and then layer on an
Speaker 2: emotion to it. So like if you were a cardiologist,
Speaker 2: but you are a happy colorologist, Hey, I know your
Speaker 2: heart is clogged up, but we're gonna get through it, right,
Speaker 2: And so like if you're responding to that on the
Speaker 2: other end, you're just like, all right, doctor, you're really
Speaker 2: giving me positive vibes. So the main thing is just
Speaker 2: like jumping right in and doing the whole yes and
Speaker 2: exercise of it and then playing with the emotion. Like
Speaker 2: that's a really big part at least the improv is
Speaker 2: like accessing that emotion that it will inform your character
Speaker 2: and allow you to sustain a scene.
Speaker 1: Got it. So it is a scene that you're trying
Speaker 1: to build because I'm trying to play along as you're
Speaker 1: giving this exercise, and I'm like, Okay, if I were
Speaker 1: in this other line and somebody said, okay, I'm a
Speaker 1: happy cardiologist, Like then do I introduce myself as like
Speaker 1: whatever my profession is? Or am I building on the
Speaker 1: story of the happy cardiologists?
Speaker 2: Exactly? The two levels, right, one is like you could
Speaker 2: be another profession, right, which is the pensive librarian, right,
Speaker 2: and so what the pensive lart is making my face
Speaker 2: scrunch up and I'm thinking real hard. But I'm a librarian,
Speaker 2: so I'm here to help you tackle whatever it is
Speaker 2: you're doing, and then you can build off because now
Speaker 2: you have a character, like who you are and like
Speaker 2: your point of view in this scene. So like the
Speaker 2: one step would be that where you're just like taking
Speaker 2: care of yourself, which is like having an emotion, having
Speaker 2: a character. But then the other part of that could
Speaker 2: be maybe you are the patient and you're seeing this
Speaker 2: happy cardiologist. Now do you want your cardiologists of your
Speaker 2: problems to be so happy and care free? Right? You,
Speaker 2: as the improviser can make that decision. Right, You're like,
Speaker 2: I'm really digging this, So you're like, you know what,
Speaker 2: I just know I need you to be a little
Speaker 2: bit more serious and like just bring that happiness down
Speaker 2: because I got called darteries going on right now. That's
Speaker 2: what you can play into. But the main thing is
Speaker 2: is like taking in what's been said to you and
Speaker 2: then just adding on to it.
Speaker 1: Got it. So I appreciate that you started a part
Speaker 1: of this conversation talking about like there's no wrong way,
Speaker 1: and I would imagine because I'm like, Okay, well, how
Speaker 1: do I get this right?
Speaker 2: What's the right answer? Exactly?
Speaker 1: Like what even as like a law student like you're training,
Speaker 1: is there is a right answer to these things. And
Speaker 1: so this is really expanding you in a very different
Speaker 1: way to kind of release this idea that there's a
Speaker 1: right answer into really lean into this more playful side.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And here's the thing, Like with improv, I want
Speaker 2: to say there's no wrong answer, right, because we improvise
Speaker 2: all day like this podcast episode we're doing right, we're comprovising.
Speaker 2: And so the thing is like in real life when
Speaker 2: you're talking to friends or families or your work, right,
Speaker 2: there are things you say and you're like, oh, I
Speaker 2: wish I had said it a different way, right, But
Speaker 2: here's the thing, your message got communicated, right, You're like,
Speaker 2: maybe my delivery should have been different or I should
Speaker 2: have used different kind of words. It's the same thing
Speaker 2: with improv comedy. And it's a space like to allow
Speaker 2: you to have that freedom but also have the freedom
Speaker 2: particularly as an adult, where you are what you are
Speaker 2: saying and doing is being accepted and that you're adding
Speaker 2: onto it. So yeah, so know that there is no
Speaker 2: right answer. There may be a different word, but I
Speaker 2: like better, There could be a better response to a
Speaker 2: better way of playing in a scene.
Speaker 1: Got it, Got it? So what would you say are
Speaker 1: some of the most common misconceptions about improv?
Speaker 2: Yeah, this definitely has gotten better since I've been doing improv,
Speaker 2: But like initially it was like white male, young, twenty
Speaker 2: some years old, flannel at least flannel was a big
Speaker 2: thing when I came into the scene, as it seemed
Speaker 2: like a uniform. And what's happening now is that you
Speaker 2: now have more people of color, obviously more women who
Speaker 2: are performing, because a lot of times you would have
Speaker 2: teams where it's like all men and then like maybe
Speaker 2: one woman. But I have not seen that lately, and
Speaker 2: if I see it, it's like very rare. Most teams
Speaker 2: have a mix, and sometimes you have teams which are
Speaker 2: all women. And so I think that's the big conception
Speaker 2: is like this is a white male art form. And
Speaker 2: not to say that they don't play big roles in
Speaker 2: terms of the improv world, but there are other voices
Speaker 2: that are coming in that are also playing roles. I
Speaker 2: would also say that people think you need the jokes
Speaker 2: in improv and it really is not a joke setting
Speaker 2: what you're trying to do, and like this the whole
Speaker 2: discussion on it, what I imagine it is like more
Speaker 2: organic improv, which is like you're trying to build something
Speaker 2: with your seene partner, with your team that you're finding
Speaker 2: the fun right, you're just not anserting like if you
Speaker 2: want to do jokes like stand up, maybe more over
Speaker 2: your speed because that you're like set up punchline right delivery.
Speaker 2: But with improv of a lot of times the humor
Speaker 2: of the funny is coming from the behavior and also
Speaker 2: what you're saying. But behavior in the way you're saying
Speaker 2: and delivering it is where you're finding the fund. So
Speaker 2: the thing is like you're not inserting jokes, you are
Speaker 2: finding the fun that you typically would have in a
Speaker 2: conversation like with your family and friends. Right, Like funny
Speaker 2: moments come up the way someone said something, the way
Speaker 2: someone did something that's causing funny, but they weren't coming
Speaker 2: in with a joke to the conversation.
Speaker 1: Got it, So improv doesn't always have to be funny,
Speaker 1: Like is there a more dramatic version of improv or
Speaker 1: is it always like improv comedy.
Speaker 2: Ninety nine percent of time it is improv comedy. Now
Speaker 2: you may go some of the improv shows you like
Speaker 2: that was not funny, but they may have been trying
Speaker 2: to be funny.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: The thing is like, in terms of improv comedy, which
Speaker 2: is what I've been doing and my teams have been doing,
Speaker 2: we want to be funny. There are shows and projects
Speaker 2: where folks are not going for the funny. It's still improvised,
Speaker 2: but they're going for more dramatic, more of a play
Speaker 2: sort of thing. As a matter of fact, there is
Speaker 2: another branch of improv called playback. I've only seen it
Speaker 2: once and they blew my mind away in a good way.
Speaker 2: They're not trying to be funny. It's more theatrical where
Speaker 2: they take in what the audience is giving them and
Speaker 2: then they play it back to you. And so there's
Speaker 2: the playback, right, they're playing it back to you, but
Speaker 2: they're not going for laughs. They're going for more like heartfelt, grounded,
Speaker 2: sincere sort of improv. I would see definitely trying the
Speaker 2: improv comedy just to stretch yourself. But once you get
Speaker 2: that foundation, like going into more of the dramatic improv,
Speaker 2: it is there and people do do it?
Speaker 1: Got it? So what are the markets you're looking for
Speaker 1: in terms of like, Okay, I'm getting better at improv comedy,
Speaker 1: Like how would I measure my success there?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I think one is the ease at which you
Speaker 2: are reacting and playing with your same partner or your team.
Speaker 2: And so the way that would look like is when
Speaker 2: you initially start out, you're thinking a lot, right, You're like, Okay,
Speaker 2: what am I going to say next? And what I
Speaker 2: try to tell my students is like, I know you're
Speaker 2: thinking because you missed something that your same partner said,
Speaker 2: and if you had heard what they said, you've been
Speaker 2: able to have a little bit more fun. So I
Speaker 2: think the idea of getting comfortable with like not knowing
Speaker 2: exactly what you're going to say, meaning like you're pre planning,
Speaker 2: and then also like as you perform more in front
Speaker 2: of an audience, getting reactions from an audience. Sometimes you
Speaker 2: say something and you don't realize that it is funny
Speaker 2: right until someone laughs, or you may have said something
Speaker 2: that's cringeworthy and they go ooh, right like and then like,
Speaker 2: well that's still a reaction. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad.
Speaker 2: When you get those Ooh, that's nasty. Right, It'll still
Speaker 2: be it'll still be fun. So but the thing is,
Speaker 2: like I think, in your mind, if you know, it's
Speaker 2: just getting easier to respond and to make them up,
Speaker 2: to make them up right, the words and the phrases
Speaker 2: and behavior, then you know you're going in the right direction.
Speaker 2: There's a sort of thing like a flow. I think
Speaker 2: I heard an athlete said probably the scripted actors and
Speaker 2: actress to say, but there's a certain flow in terms
Speaker 2: of how you're interacting when you're in the scene.
Speaker 1: So you mentioned earlier, you know, like I think many
Speaker 1: of us have this idea that improv is like old
Speaker 1: white men with flannel. Like you said, right, young, what
Speaker 1: are some of the obstacles that you've had as a
Speaker 1: black woman in this space.
Speaker 2: I think the obstacles are and there have been discussions
Speaker 2: about this in terms of when you're actually doing scene work, right,
Speaker 2: because obviously we are bringing ourselves and ourselves are in
Speaker 2: the world, and so we are bringing ourselves into these scenes.
Speaker 2: And what happens a lot of times as women, I'll
Speaker 2: tell you, as women, and also as black women and
Speaker 2: as black people, right, A lot of times you get
Speaker 2: thrown into the girlfriend role or like the mom role.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of scenes that I see and to
Speaker 2: still see as like this whole trope of like women
Speaker 2: being naggers and like ruining men's lives or like send
Speaker 2: them up for this, or they like casual sexism or
Speaker 2: like sexual things that like just comes up right, and
Speaker 2: a lot of times like the scene did not need that.
Speaker 2: It's for whatever reason it's coming out. And I think
Speaker 2: also like in terms of black folks, and I see
Speaker 2: it here and like sometimes I'll point it out. I
Speaker 2: think more if I play with more advanced players, more
Speaker 2: experienced players. But there's also like if you have a
Speaker 2: white player and a black player, some of the same
Speaker 2: things that we see in real life you'll see on
Speaker 2: the improv stage. You know, if they're a medical situation,
Speaker 2: they're the nurse or the tech when it easily looked
Speaker 2: like they were the doctor. There was a discussion amongst
Speaker 2: the DC and also other improv communities across the country
Speaker 2: about like getting more people of color onto teams and
Speaker 2: like being open to that and not just having it
Speaker 2: all be white male. At least there was a recognition
Speaker 2: of that and like it has improved and going on
Speaker 2: from there. But in terms of those obstacles, I think
Speaker 2: that's it. And I will say I'm on a team
Speaker 2: Colleena Dunham, which is a all black improv team, and
Speaker 2: when we first started, we were all the only black
Speaker 2: member of our improv team and that's how we started.
Speaker 2: And since then, I'm on teams of world I'm not
Speaker 2: the only one anymore. So I think those are obstacles
Speaker 2: of just not like seeing yourself and also in terms
Speaker 2: of the topics that may come up and being able
Speaker 2: to play in that atmosphere and to be your true
Speaker 2: authentic person.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Yeah. You know, as you're talking, I'm thinking, like,
Speaker 1: as a psychologist, this sounds like a fascinating projection exercise, right,
Speaker 1: because again, wherever you go, there you are. And so
Speaker 1: of course you're bringing all of your stuff to this
Speaker 1: character that you're building on stage, right, And so what
Speaker 1: is done? Are there ever any conversations that break the
Speaker 1: playing to say, let's pay attention to the dynamics that
Speaker 1: are happening here, Like why are all the black women
Speaker 1: being cast as like caretaking roles? Are those kinds of
Speaker 1: conversations happening like as a part of a workshop.
Speaker 2: Not as part of a workshop, but I know I've
Speaker 2: had to have one on one conversations or a broader
Speaker 2: conversation in classes about like, hey, in terms of how
Speaker 2: we're playing, a lot of times we'll play different genders, right,
Speaker 2: but a lot of times like gender doesn't matter within
Speaker 2: the scene, but they'll still say that you're a man,
Speaker 2: and like this is like here's the thing, Like I
Speaker 2: present as a woman, right, and so like the idea
Speaker 2: because I'm now in a higher status, I'm now a man, right,
Speaker 2: Like there are women who are in higher statuses. So
Speaker 2: I think having those conversations is a big one. And
Speaker 2: then in terms of the race conversations, right in terms
Speaker 2: of like hey, that scene you did with the cop
Speaker 2: or the scene you're doing in terms of sexism or
Speaker 2: racism in the workplace, right, Like I see where you
Speaker 2: were trying to go, but like we need to bring
Speaker 2: it back a little bit. And I will say this
Speaker 2: since you said workshop. So there's another duo I'm on
Speaker 2: called White Privileged Black Power. We started in January twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2: There was a show. It was like a social justice show,
Speaker 2: and so my comedy partner Greg Tyndall, who's a white male,
Speaker 2: was like Hey, Eva, let's do a duo for this show.
Speaker 2: And I was like cool, and so we started talking
Speaker 2: about it. And the idea is that we started out
Speaker 2: just asking each other questions, giving honest responses, and then
Speaker 2: doing improv scenes off of it. That's a direct way
Speaker 2: of getting at some issues. So like one issue, and
Speaker 2: it could be fun to silly. Like the first question
Speaker 2: I ever asked Greg was like, Hey, Greg, do you
Speaker 2: ever look in the mirror and just thank God that
Speaker 2: you were born? And like man? Right? And so Greg
Speaker 2: took it in. I don't think he ever said yes,
Speaker 2: but then he went on this long tangent about America
Speaker 2: raise this, and then we did a scene off of it.
Speaker 2: Was fun. But the thing is like it was tackling
Speaker 2: something serious but layering on something fun and trying to
Speaker 2: make it humorous in a way that's not offensive. Right.
Speaker 2: We've done that, and we've done corporate workshops as well,
Speaker 2: where we're in the workplace and people talk about real
Speaker 2: workplace things that happened to them, and we take that
Speaker 2: and we try to layer I think a lot of
Speaker 2: times we're layering on this very serious topic with something
Speaker 2: that's not so serious.
Speaker 1: Got It. Got It More from our conversation after the break.
Speaker 1: So our conversation EVA is you know, kind of encouraging
Speaker 1: people like if they want to try this as a
Speaker 1: hobby to you know, get started. And I would imagine
Speaker 1: for people who are in spaces that already feel oppressive
Speaker 1: and if I am dealing with the stress of a
Speaker 1: nine to five, I don't want to then go to
Speaker 1: an improv workshop and I'm gonna still have to have
Speaker 1: some of these like racism conversations. So what kinds of
Speaker 1: tips would you give for people to find spaces that
Speaker 1: may be more affirming. You mentioned that you're in an
Speaker 1: all black troop or comedy club, So what kinds of
Speaker 1: tips would you give for people to find spaces where
Speaker 1: they might not have to deal with.
Speaker 2: Some of that One resource, I would say, and it
Speaker 2: may be more focused on the DC area, but I
Speaker 2: think they also branch out nationally. It's called the Black
Speaker 2: Improv Alliance, right, so it is a space of people
Speaker 2: of African descent to find the creative spaces for themselves.
Speaker 2: They're on Instagram, Black Improvate Alliance. Check them out. If
Speaker 2: you can sometimes take in a class with the front right,
Speaker 2: so that you have their comfort zone there while meeting
Speaker 2: different other folks, and a lot of times you may
Speaker 2: be in a workshop or a class where you could
Speaker 2: be the only black person or you could be only
Speaker 2: person of color, And so I would just say, like one,
Speaker 2: definitely go take a workshop, like if there's a one
Speaker 2: day workshop or two day workshop where you're just getting
Speaker 2: the taste. So that way, if you're like this is
Speaker 2: not for me, or like these people are bonkers, you
Speaker 2: move on. But the main thing I would say, like
Speaker 2: if you could take a buddy, whether you is a
Speaker 2: good one, also the instructor, and not that this may
Speaker 2: not be always, but if the instructor is a person
Speaker 2: of color, right, they may be more in tune. And
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that's for all people, but like they
Speaker 2: may be more in tune to it. So when you're
Speaker 2: picking a teacher, sure that may be beneficial. But also
Speaker 2: there are other obviously non black people not bocs, who
Speaker 2: who would just do well and would handle any situations
Speaker 2: that come up. Another thing is if you aren't interested
Speaker 2: in I definitely encourage everyone under our voices to go
Speaker 2: take a glass and you're having issues, go talk to
Speaker 2: your teacher immediately. The main thing is just get out
Speaker 2: there and try it, but do speak up for yourself.
Speaker 2: And I know you're like, I can have fun. And
Speaker 2: here's the thing, ninety five percent of time you are
Speaker 2: going to have fun. It's just maybe that five percent
Speaker 2: where you may run into something.
Speaker 1: So you know, we talked on a little bit, I think,
Speaker 1: but without addressing it directly. Improv is something that is
Speaker 1: frequently suggested by therapists for people who struggle with things
Speaker 1: like social anxiety or are some of this perfectionism stuff
Speaker 1: that we talked about a little bit, right, Like, improv
Speaker 1: feels like a great way to kind of break down
Speaker 1: some of that.
Speaker 2: Can you talk a little bit about.
Speaker 1: Some of the skills that you might learn in improv
Speaker 1: that are transferable to supporting people's mental health.
Speaker 2: So what you're going to be gaining is the ability
Speaker 2: to talk and engage with just about anybody, right Because
Speaker 2: in those initial yes and part right, the idea that
Speaker 2: when someone is talking to you one, that you're listening
Speaker 2: and also listening is like, my second thing is listen
Speaker 2: like a thief, right, Because if you're listening one, you're
Speaker 2: getting out of your head and you're focusing more on
Speaker 2: the other person, right, So that you understand what they're
Speaker 2: trying to communicate to you, and then you can respond.
Speaker 2: So the thing is like you are building up your
Speaker 2: listening abilities, You're building up the ability to talk on
Speaker 2: the spot and your presentation right in terms of yourself
Speaker 2: and being out there. I know, I've had a couple
Speaker 2: of students who were presenters before taking the improv class,
Speaker 2: and then after an improv class, they have people come
Speaker 2: up to me and say, oh my god, what have
Speaker 2: you been doing? And it was the amprovp right, is
Speaker 2: a space where you get to try out different things
Speaker 2: in a safe environment. I think, or anyone who does
Speaker 2: have that anxiety or neure diversity, and matter of fact,
Speaker 2: there is an improv team of folks who are neurodiverse
Speaker 2: and they're very good and if I play on other
Speaker 2: teams with them as well, and it just allows you
Speaker 2: to exercise that in a place that is they're no
Speaker 2: high stakes, right, Like if you bomb out, if you
Speaker 2: don't get a laugh, right, your life will go on.
Speaker 2: And I think that's the point, right, Like you're learning,
Speaker 2: Like if you mess up, if you think you're doing
Speaker 2: the wrong thing, like life goes on. You have another scene, right,
Speaker 2: you have another opportunity to do it.
Speaker 1: So what kinds of skills do you feel like have
Speaker 1: bled into your everyday life from your experience as any
Speaker 1: improvo it is Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think for me, one, I believe I'm a shy person,
Speaker 2: but I am an extrovert and so being younger was
Speaker 2: very shy. But I get energy off of people, right,
Speaker 2: and I know feel that energy and enjoy being around people.
Speaker 2: I think what I got is the ability to talk
Speaker 2: to just about anyone and to have a conversation. And
Speaker 2: it also to be play and not that you need
Speaker 2: to play with everybody, right, because some people don't play
Speaker 2: with right, but the idea of being open to individuals
Speaker 2: and listening and taking in what they're saying and really
Speaker 2: paying attention and not judging. I think in improv there's
Speaker 2: a space where you're not being judged on what you're doing.
Speaker 2: You're just existing and being in that space. So for me,
Speaker 2: my philosophy and improv is that I should be able
Speaker 2: to improvise with a rock, right, I should be able
Speaker 2: to do a very poignant, funny scene where I'm improvising
Speaker 2: with the rock I'm doing obviously in my mind, I'm
Speaker 2: doing the other side, but I'm communicating to the rock,
Speaker 2: and so I think that's just something that I've gotten
Speaker 2: out of improv and it brings such a joy to me, right,
Speaker 2: And there are only a couple of times in improv
Speaker 2: where I'm just like, this is not joyful. Do you
Speaker 2: learn from it and you move on. But it's just
Speaker 2: an opportunity to be fun and silly, like when you
Speaker 2: were a kid. If you remember when you were a
Speaker 2: child and you're just playing for the sake of playing,
Speaker 2: like there's no agenda. And I think improv allows us
Speaker 2: the entryway into that which it allows me to present better,
Speaker 2: allows me to interact with people, and a lot of
Speaker 2: times in my previous jobs you're interacting with people who
Speaker 2: are upset and the main thing is like people want
Speaker 2: to be listened to and like heard, and so I
Speaker 2: think that also has brought that into my life.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. So you've had it sounds like a variety
Speaker 1: of different experiences with improv. Can you talk to me
Speaker 1: if you can think of any differences that you think
Speaker 1: of when you're like working and playing with you or
Speaker 1: like all black group versus like in other spaces that
Speaker 1: you've been in. Any differences come to my venions.
Speaker 2: Yes, there are definitely differences. So like Lena Duna, which
Speaker 2: is an all black improv team, and we are very good.
Speaker 2: We have a lot of fun with each other, and
Speaker 2: so in terms of the humor and like the things
Speaker 2: that come up with Lena Dunham necessarily would not come
Speaker 2: up with my team that the majority of the team
Speaker 2: is white. Right, So like issues dealing with black people
Speaker 2: code switching, I got one who brought up like slavery
Speaker 2: and like slave talk. He was like a professor and
Speaker 2: he was like, all right, guys, we're gonna learn about
Speaker 2: certain dialects. Today's die like it's gonna and so obviously
Speaker 2: he's putting us on the spot, and we made it work.
Speaker 2: I also think in improv there are references, right that
Speaker 2: black folks have that maybe non black folks don't have
Speaker 2: in terms of the movie and music that we reform,
Speaker 2: that we can tap into very quickly and be on
Speaker 2: the same page about like what is it that we're doing.
Speaker 2: And one is like the Color Purple. I think it
Speaker 2: was an improv show where the color purple came up
Speaker 2: and the white guy, nice white guy, but he did
Speaker 2: not know. He didn't know. I think he's watched it since.
Speaker 2: But he did not know, and so like just to
Speaker 2: get on the page about that, and like I think
Speaker 2: also about like with the police scene and that someone
Speaker 2: calls us out as white, we are playing as black,
Speaker 2: right what you see, And so the idea of playing
Speaker 2: in that space and punch we say, like instead of
Speaker 2: punching down on folks in situations, we're trying to put
Speaker 2: jump on the situation. It's fun and you get there quicker.
Speaker 1: Yeah. It reminds me of like some of those memes
Speaker 1: you see around, like that one burgundy bed spread that
Speaker 1: like a lot of black families hand you know what
Speaker 1: I'm talking about, right, Like, yeah, so I'm mentioning like
Speaker 1: those kinds of things coming up in like maybe the
Speaker 1: black students knowing which you're referring to, and then maybe
Speaker 1: people who are not black not having any clue, not
Speaker 1: having any.
Speaker 2: Clue exactly exactly. Yeah, And not to say every scene
Speaker 2: is about race or this and that, because we'll have
Speaker 2: some funny, ridiculous scenes, but we know we can tap
Speaker 2: into that or we know if we bring it up
Speaker 2: it comes up, then we know how to play with
Speaker 2: it mm hmmm without getting nervous.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, So even I wonder if you can walk
Speaker 1: us through one or two exercises that we might be
Speaker 1: able to play with like family and friends kind of
Speaker 1: doing some of this if we're not ready to take
Speaker 1: a class or like can't find a class in our area.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, thank you for me to the other up
Speaker 2: because these are fun. And I know I have a
Speaker 2: family re union that's been going on for seventy four years,
Speaker 2: and there was a period of time where I was
Speaker 2: doing like improv u short form games with them. But
Speaker 2: we doctor Joy, we are going to play a game
Speaker 2: right now, so like before going to the show, we'll
Speaker 2: do this just to get like the brain working and
Speaker 2: the body moving. So the first one is called these
Speaker 2: five things, So Doctor Joy, I'm gonna go first, but
Speaker 2: you're gonna give me something. So like an example of
Speaker 2: this is like, all right, give me five new ice
Speaker 2: cream flavors, right, and then if you were saying that
Speaker 2: to me, then I have to come up with five
Speaker 2: different ice cream flavors, right. Or give me five taglines
Speaker 2: if you are a superhero, right, or give me five
Speaker 2: items of clothing that you would wear to the ice
Speaker 2: skating rink. It could be whatever it is, and then
Speaker 2: the person has to say it so once I say one.
Speaker 2: So like if we did the if you told me like, hey,
Speaker 2: what are five new ice cream flavors, what would they be?
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, there would be Enchilada ice cream, and
Speaker 2: then everyone will go one. Right. Then there there would
Speaker 2: be plastic berry ice cream. Two. Right. These could be
Speaker 2: as ridiculous or as real as you want. And so
Speaker 2: the idea is just like getting that muscle moving. And
Speaker 2: so every time the person says something, you know, one
Speaker 2: and then two, three, four, five, and then the next
Speaker 2: person would go on.
Speaker 1: And so the next person would then name their five.
Speaker 2: Ice no that it would be a new thing because
Speaker 2: those people have been may have been pre planning. So
Speaker 2: because I'm like, okay, let me say gotcha, yes, gotcha? No, no, no, no, Now,
Speaker 2: doctor Joy, you want you want me to give you one?
Speaker 1: You ready, So You're going to give you a topic,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna give you the my five five? Yes, okay,
Speaker 1: got it?
Speaker 2: All right? Gotcha? All right? So doctor Joy, let's say,
Speaker 2: can you give me five things you would do on
Speaker 2: a Sunday morning with a unicorn?
Speaker 1: Okay, five on a Sunday morning with my unicorn? YEP,
Speaker 1: I would take it for a walk. One I would
Speaker 1: brush its hair. Two I would give it breakfast. Three
Speaker 1: I would ride it around the neighborhood. Four let's see,
Speaker 1: I would bring its hair.
Speaker 2: Five. These are five things, right, and then then you
Speaker 2: say that at the end, these are five things you
Speaker 2: see right exactly, And that's yes, and that's it, and
Speaker 2: that's something fun you could do, you know, with anybody
Speaker 2: or even by yourself. Will be my five taglines Boom boom,
Speaker 2: boom and going from there. Yes, I love it.
Speaker 1: I can see you playing that exercise.
Speaker 2: I do have. I have a second one, and this
Speaker 2: one is called next on Springer. I don't know people
Speaker 2: remember the Jerry Springer Show right. As matter of fact,
Speaker 2: I've been to a pay per view version of Jerry
Speaker 2: Springer Show. It was quite entertaining, no matter meay, Jerry
Speaker 2: Springer went to my law school. He graduated from my
Speaker 2: law school at Northwestern Yah. So this one it's called
Speaker 2: next on Springer. So the way the exercise goes is
Speaker 2: that you're going to give a short and I'm emphasizing
Speaker 2: short word like cat or ball or something. And so
Speaker 2: if you were to give me a word like ball,
Speaker 2: and then the person who who's going would then have
Speaker 2: to take B A L L and make a title
Speaker 2: show for Jerry Springer using the first initial of every
Speaker 2: word has to start with B A L L. Right,
Speaker 2: so if ball was thrown out there, and then I'll
Speaker 2: be like ballerinas and lyne lizards next on Springer. Right,
Speaker 2: So the the idea is taking each letter and that's
Speaker 2: the beginning of the word. Right, Okay, so like, you know,
Speaker 2: you take another one like cat see a T you know,
Speaker 2: like cataracts. Oh my god, I was gonna say cataracts
Speaker 2: and titties next on Springer. Right, that's where my mind went.
Speaker 2: That doesn't mean everyone's mind is gonna go there. Yes,
Speaker 2: all right, that joy you're ready? Okay, you ready? Okay,
Speaker 2: bat B A T.
Speaker 1: Y Oh next on spring.
Speaker 2: Oh, just start with the B and ali was my
Speaker 2: first thought. Oh there you go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, black adult tight rope walkers.
Speaker 2: Next on Springer. That's it. That's it, right, that's A.
Speaker 2: That's a fun one. There's a fun one. And and
Speaker 2: let the mind wander, right, let it let it go. Yes,
Speaker 2: so that's A. That's a fun one to do as well.
Speaker 2: And the doctor I have one last one, okay, particularly
Speaker 2: if like for those other ones, Like the other first two,
Speaker 2: you can do them by yourself, but like being with
Speaker 2: other people makes it them more enjoyable because they can
Speaker 2: also hear the ridiculous stuff that's coming out of your mouth.
Speaker 2: The last one you can definitely do by yourself is
Speaker 2: to pick an object in the room or if you're outside,
Speaker 2: pick something and then do a character monologue of that. Right,
Speaker 2: and I could do a rant or rave about it.
Speaker 2: So like if I'm looking around my room, oh, I
Speaker 2: see lotion, right, And the character could be as big
Speaker 2: or small, but the main is like having fun about it, like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I love lotion. It just like it's
Speaker 2: the thing that keeps my life sustained. I mean, if
Speaker 2: I could even eat lotion, I would because I wanted
Speaker 2: to moisturize my inside. Can you believe there are people
Speaker 2: out there who don't carry lotion around and they're just
Speaker 2: ashy looking like ghosts walking around. No, I'm prestine. My
Speaker 2: skin is supple, and I'm supple to the world, and
Speaker 2: that's why I have lotion. Right, So it could be
Speaker 2: as silly or realistic as possible, but just taking anything
Speaker 2: and just doing a character talking about that object or
Speaker 2: letting that object inspire you about something, right, so then
Speaker 2: have to be exactly about the lotion. You can do
Speaker 2: something what we call a to B A two C,
Speaker 2: which is like, when I think of lotion, it makes
Speaker 2: me think of moisture, and when I think of morture
Speaker 2: makes me think of rain. Oh, Purple Rain is my album.
Speaker 2: I love Purple Rain. Right, So, like it's just allowing
Speaker 2: the mind to move and jump and then having that
Speaker 2: monologue to yourself. Yeah, thank you so much for these things.
Speaker 1: But I think these will be fun for people to
Speaker 1: play with everything. Yeah, so you mentioned one page that
Speaker 1: you thought we should look into, the Black Improv Alliance.
Speaker 1: Are there other TV shows, films, Instagram or social media
Speaker 1: pages that would be helpful for people if they're interested
Speaker 1: in learning more about job.
Speaker 2: Yes. So in terms of like podcasts, you know, there
Speaker 2: are a bunch of improper podcasts that are out there,
Speaker 2: But just in terms of a few that I would
Speaker 2: say are beneficial, there's one called UCB Long Form Conversations.
Speaker 2: I don't think they make any more episodes, but the
Speaker 2: episodes are still up and the idea is that they
Speaker 2: have an interviewer in an interviewe about some improv topic
Speaker 2: and then the interviewe would become the interviewer the next episode,
Speaker 2: and then they would you know, I guess popcorn that way.
Speaker 2: Another one is improv beat by beat, and then this
Speaker 2: one the person interviewed twenty improvisers mainly I think in
Speaker 2: the New York area, and then what they did is
Speaker 2: they clipped together these twenty people talking about like different topics.
Speaker 2: So if the topic was about object work, which is
Speaker 2: like an improv, we don't use props, so you have to,
Speaker 2: like if you're cutting vegetables, you just need to show
Speaker 2: the audience that you're doing your object work. You're cutting vegetables, right,
Speaker 2: So they would take these tip twenty different perspectives about
Speaker 2: object work and then spice them together, so now you're
Speaker 2: getting a different views on different topics in improv. And
Speaker 2: then there's Will Hines. He has a substack and it's
Speaker 2: called Improv Nonsense, So like every week he'll write something
Speaker 2: about improv and just thoughts he has on it. And
Speaker 2: he's been improvising for many, many decades and he's very
Speaker 2: good at what he does. So those I think those
Speaker 2: are some entrees into it. You could obviously like go
Speaker 2: see improv in person. I think it's better to see
Speaker 2: it in person, but you can definitely see it online
Speaker 2: if you can't get out or there's no theaters doing improv,
Speaker 2: but there's a bunch of improv like on YouTube. We'll
Speaker 2: do my shameless plugs at the end. Right in terms
Speaker 2: of like finding my pages and watching shows, and usually
Speaker 2: a lot of theaters have a YouTube channel watching improv.
Speaker 2: Theater has a YouTube channel where there's a bunch of
Speaker 2: shows that are there.
Speaker 1: Got it? Yeah, So are there any black women that
Speaker 1: you want to put on the radar for us besides
Speaker 1: you and the work that you and your group are doing,
Speaker 1: any other black women improv comedians that we want to
Speaker 1: be paying attention to.
Speaker 2: Yes for sure, Yes, yes, yes. Crystal ramser Ali. You
Speaker 2: can find her if you go to our Lenda Done Improv,
Speaker 2: She'll be listed there as well. Definitely follow her because
Speaker 2: she's doing other projects. She's also on a team of
Speaker 2: all women called Hellcat. She's definitely a big one that
Speaker 2: you should be following. There are the women from a
Speaker 2: Black Lady's Sketch Show. So like all those individuals, I've
Speaker 2: done improv and like I think still do improv to
Speaker 2: a certain extent, and even Robin Thidi was a improvisor.
Speaker 2: I think she even started Second City in Chicago before
Speaker 2: moving to LA. And then there is an all black
Speaker 2: team called Astronomy Club. They had a show on Netflix.
Speaker 2: I think it's still on Netflix, and the improvisers on
Speaker 2: that team were very good in terms of the black women.
Speaker 2: And I'm blanking her names. I see, like her her face,
Speaker 2: I think it's Keisha. It's Keisha Zoler, so definitely checking
Speaker 2: her out. And then the cole Buyer I know she
Speaker 2: if people know her from like the Cake show where
Speaker 2: they bake cakes, and then she also does stand up
Speaker 2: and has her own specials. I think she's gonna wipeout.
Speaker 2: But she also has a big improv background and I
Speaker 2: love seeing her perform because it is very good in
Speaker 2: terms of the improv and it's very silly. I like silly,
Speaker 2: ridiculous stuff, and she's doing some high level silly stuff there.
Speaker 2: And I'm obviously blanking on some other ones, but those
Speaker 2: are the ones that pop into my mind in terms
Speaker 2: of like watching them, and I know I'm going to
Speaker 2: see a good show when I see them. Got it?
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So.
Speaker 1: Where can we stay connected with you? Eva? What is
Speaker 1: your website and any social media channels that you want
Speaker 1: to share.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so definitely I'm on ig at Eva r Lewis,
Speaker 2: I you know, post shows and like clips when I
Speaker 2: can or promoting, so definitely follow me on there. Lena Dunham,
Speaker 2: definitely come see us these shows. We have shows in December,
Speaker 2: but we'll have shows in the New Year as well,
Speaker 2: and that's just Lena Dunham Improv. And then White Privileged,
Speaker 2: Black Power Greg is out in California, So a lot
Speaker 2: of stuff we're doing as virtual, but we do have
Speaker 2: some good bits that are are fun and the humorous,
Speaker 2: so definitely check out White Privilege Black Power on there.
Speaker 2: And then I'm on a team called Broken Bones where
Speaker 2: we take a gnarly injury story and try to turn
Speaker 2: it into comedy and so definitely check out Broken Bones
Speaker 2: DC on ig and so definitely check me out, but
Speaker 2: also check out improv. Everyone does improv, so you might
Speaker 2: as well go take a class so you'll learn more
Speaker 2: about it. I love that.
Speaker 1: But thank you so much for spending some time with
Speaker 1: us today, Eve, I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Axe Well, thank you, doctor Joy, thank you.
Speaker 1: I'm so glad Eva was able to share her expertise
Speaker 1: with us today. To learn more about her and her work,
Speaker 1: visit the show notes at Therapy for Blackgirls dot Com
Speaker 1: slash Session three forty three, and don't forget to text
Speaker 1: two of your girls right now and tell them to
Speaker 1: check out the episode. If you're looking for a therapist
Speaker 1: in your area, visit our therapist directory at Therapy for
Speaker 1: Blackgirls dot Com slash directory. And if you're looking for
Speaker 1: a support system to aid you in your New Year journey,
Speaker 1: join us over in the Sister Circle. It's our cozy
Speaker 1: corn of the Internet where we celebrate support and practice
Speaker 1: vulnerability each week this January, we're setting the foundation to
Speaker 1: turn our resolutions into realities. This episode was produced by
Speaker 1: Frieda Lucas, Alise Ellis, and Zaria Taylor. Editing was done
Speaker 1: by Dennison Bradford. Thank y'all so much for joining me
Speaker 1: again this week. I look forward to continuing this conversation
Speaker 1: with you all real soon.
Speaker 2: Take good care,