Speaker 1: Of Course Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
Speaker 1: This is QLs classic. My name is Corse Love. We
Speaker 1: go back into the archives May of two thousand nineteen,
Speaker 1: and we interviewed the legendary proprietor a Black Music Month herself,
Speaker 1: the Queen Diana Williams. Sma Suprema rog called sub Prima
Speaker 1: su Prima role called Suprema so suprima role called Suma
Speaker 1: sufrima role course love in the place, Yeah, with Diana
Speaker 1: and the fan. Yeah, is I so cool? Yeah? I am.
Speaker 1: I Am I South Roll su Primo role. My name
Speaker 1: is Fonte, Yeah, and I can say I hung yeah
Speaker 1: with that beautiful lady. Yeah. From Unsung Supremo roll Call
Speaker 1: Suprima Supremo rogue call. My name is Sugar. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I hope that one day. Yeah, I can be a
Speaker 1: guest on Soulful Sunday Somma Supremo role calls bus Bill.
Speaker 1: Yeah to the extreme Yeah on Q well, let's with Yeah,
Speaker 1: Ebony Moonbeams, sum Roll so Much Supremo roll call Bill. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and here's the thing Yeah, last night, yea too many
Speaker 1: Chicken Suprema roll call, Suma subpremo roll call. It's like
Speaker 1: em yeah, and my god mother Deanna, Yeah mother, black
Speaker 1: music mom. Nobody knows it better. Rolla suprema roll call,
Speaker 1: sub prima, subpremo roll call. My name is Dianna, not Banana. Yeah,
Speaker 1: lights getting like one. Yeah, but I'm Deanna. Supremo rolla, subpremo,
Speaker 1: roll call, su prima sub premo, roll call, su prima suremo,
Speaker 1: roll call. Nice, nice one. Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to
Speaker 1: another episode of Quest Love Supreme. We are officially in
Speaker 1: back Home. Yes, you're back home, Steve. We are back, Steve,
Speaker 1: back back. How do you feel to be back? Lazy?
Speaker 1: We are live, Okay, We are recording right We are
Speaker 1: recording right now at Milk Boy Studio formally known and
Speaker 1: still sort of kind of known as the Studio. We
Speaker 1: are actually in the room where uh, the lyrics of
Speaker 1: You Got Me, the Song that Changed my Life was
Speaker 1: was recorded. The vocals were done all the things while
Speaker 1: the part vocals were done here as subsequently every Roots
Speaker 1: album afterwards, from Phrenology on down to Rising Down. But
Speaker 1: we are in studio A A lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of Philadelphia history is in this room smells like yeah PTSD,
Speaker 1: Steve Man, I'm telling you it's got the grit. And
Speaker 1: this is one of the places that Rich made me
Speaker 1: cut vocals like verse like thirty damn times like yeah,
Speaker 1: I told it's all Rich Nichols here. Yeah. Yeah, this
Speaker 1: is the spirit of the Rich Nicols episode. Show me
Speaker 1: pouring in the room next to yours. Not my first,
Speaker 1: but my first Rich Nichols. No, okay, can we not
Speaker 1: do this right now? We have guests in the room.
Speaker 1: Oh um, wait a minute, Oh would you like to
Speaker 1: be honest? Ya, don't do that to me. You prepared
Speaker 1: and you wrote it down. I don't have to find
Speaker 1: see I'll come like, like, what do you call it?
Speaker 1: You can do the cleanup and I'll do it, but
Speaker 1: you have to do I think this. I think it's
Speaker 1: only a propose and for you agree to introduce our
Speaker 1: guest today. Okay, if i'm if, I'm if I'm based
Speaker 1: on when you're talking, I feel like I feel like
Speaker 1: this is the chip off the old block here. So yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a it's a small chip of a big block.
Speaker 1: How about I'm the small ship of a black box? Um?
Speaker 1: You want boxes? All right? So, ladies, and gentlemen, boys
Speaker 1: and girls. The woman who you know what it is, Deanna.
Speaker 1: You have aware, you have a way to make everyone
Speaker 1: who lose their cool fante that I'm good over here,
Speaker 1: it's just me and a mirror. I'm literally I feel
Speaker 1: I can be in the room with any human being
Speaker 1: and just be like, no big deals, President Obama, Michael Jordan, whatever, Stevie,
Speaker 1: I'll be down in a second. Like. But with Deanna,
Speaker 1: there's there's a very regal like. I s together my
Speaker 1: college worker ladies and gentlemen. All right, So yeah, this
Speaker 1: this we we are in the presence of loyalty right now.
Speaker 1: This is gonna be the longest introduction ever, the most
Speaker 1: ineloquent when I've ever done in the history of the show. Yes,
Speaker 1: exactly over there, No, seriously, this woman has history in
Speaker 1: the city of Philadelphia. Um, I've I'm in my career
Speaker 1: took uh uh a. I can't even talk to because
Speaker 1: it's hard to describe. Have some barrieres and relax, listen,
Speaker 1: start with you. You can start with that way. I will. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I will say that I first, my my first real
Speaker 1: entrance into the non apotism le Andrew's world that I
Speaker 1: came from really started with I am and interning and
Speaker 1: network International Association of African American Music. Yes, she wow,
Speaker 1: she is about Oh, no one knew what I am
Speaker 1: talking about NAS album? Where is this going? Oh my god,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna let it be ten minutes before I say,
Speaker 1: ladies and Joana correction, I'm drilled and honored to be
Speaker 1: with you and radio Legend officially welcome you to the
Speaker 1: city of brotherly love and sisterly affects. So she also
Speaker 1: coined that term. I forgot to mention that the sisterly
Speaker 1: affection part poclamations and things like that. Yeah, inclusion. Rightly,
Speaker 1: women have been part of the fabric of Philadelphia and
Speaker 1: everywhere every place for as long as Philly Radio. Right now,
Speaker 1: her voice is very soothing. Yeah, I feel like she's
Speaker 1: going to turn around and interview us any moment that
Speaker 1: it's discourse, it's conversation with human exchange. Always spoke. I
Speaker 1: was about to say the one area that you have
Speaker 1: not affected light Year, because sometimes you clean up for
Speaker 1: a company and then you're like the Lenny Kravitz episode
Speaker 1: which we got dominated for. We did get that one episode.
Speaker 1: You you cleaned up nicely, you know, but I'm just
Speaker 1: saying that it was vit right, sounded like whatever I
Speaker 1: raised right there. When when did this voice come to be?
Speaker 1: When did you? I feel like you're always in regal
Speaker 1: honey milk. I feel like the term honey milk or whatever,
Speaker 1: that's not what my lover says when we're fighting. Now.
Speaker 1: I grew up, first of all, I'll take you back
Speaker 1: to the beginning. I was born in Queens, raised as
Speaker 1: a small young girl in the Bronx and pen. My
Speaker 1: family moved to Puerto Rico. My mother's Puerto Rican. I'm
Speaker 1: half Puerto Rican, so my mother was a college professor.
Speaker 1: So we moved to pr to buy Yaman, which is
Speaker 1: where a lot of my family is, and I spent
Speaker 1: two years perfecting my non Spanish, my my new Eu
Speaker 1: Rican Spanish. So you had a new Eurecan voice. Uh well,
Speaker 1: well no, just no accent. If you're talking about I
Speaker 1: read it, write it and speak it. And I learned
Speaker 1: to do that. I learned how to speak it. I
Speaker 1: learned Spanish before I learned English because my mother was
Speaker 1: in school, my father was working. But my grandmother, who
Speaker 1: spoke no English whatsoever, was my caretaker. So I learned
Speaker 1: Spanish before I learned English, or probably simultaneously. So your
Speaker 1: mother's mom, my mother's mom, My maternal side of the
Speaker 1: family is Puerto Rican. My father's from Culpepper. My father
Speaker 1: has transitioned, but my people were from Culpepper, Virginia. So yeah, Spanish, English,
Speaker 1: but New York. And then when we moved back to
Speaker 1: the States, I grew up in Harlem as a teenager.
Speaker 1: So I was informed by this amazing upbringing that I
Speaker 1: had in New York, a cosmopolitan city with people from all,
Speaker 1: you know, spectrums, all parts of the world, and all
Speaker 1: socio economic backgrounds. So my, when I consider my formulation,
Speaker 1: my development, it's as a result of being in this
Speaker 1: gumbo of humanity in New York City. You were how
Speaker 1: old when you came back to I was about twelve twelve.
Speaker 1: So I spent my formative teena teenage years in Harlem,
Speaker 1: the Schaumberg and yes, okay, uh, I'm curbed court I have.
Speaker 1: I'm currently working on a project right now that I
Speaker 1: didn't even know existed until about a year ago. Um,
Speaker 1: but the world doesn't seem to know that. In the
Speaker 1: summer of nineteen sixty nine, a festival was thrown in Harlem.
Speaker 1: Uh with I mean, in short, we called it Blackwood Stock. Uh.
Speaker 1: It was Nina Simone, sly On the family stone, Uh,
Speaker 1: the stable singers, Jesse Jackson. Literally like when you see
Speaker 1: the footage, it's forty thousand people in a Harlem park.
Speaker 1: Uh in the summer of sixty nine? Was it Mount
Speaker 1: Morris Park? Mount Morris Park? Yes, the recollection of Mount
Speaker 1: Morris Park that period and well no sixty nine No,
Speaker 1: but Mount Morris Park absolutely, because I spent many times
Speaker 1: there for free concert arts. Yeah. Absolutely. What was the
Speaker 1: environment musically in Harlem? Like? Because I mean as much
Speaker 1: as I hear about the folklore of of Harlem, uh,
Speaker 1: not even the jazz since but post jazz, I I
Speaker 1: don't have a feel of what the culture was like
Speaker 1: it was. I mean we're talking about the birthplace of
Speaker 1: the Harlem Renaissance. Harlem has always been a capital, of
Speaker 1: mecca of music and culture. So I grew up hearing
Speaker 1: music everywhere in Harlem. It was blasting out of people's
Speaker 1: radios and their cars and their homes. The free concerts.
Speaker 1: We had a program in Harlem called Jazz Mobile that
Speaker 1: was founded by Are you familiar with this Dr? Billy
Speaker 1: Taylor was the founder of Jazz Mobile and it provided
Speaker 1: free lessons to inner city youth. So for me, I
Speaker 1: studied the flute and my teacher was the legendary Jimmy
Speaker 1: he So what Yes, Yes, Jimmy Heath was my flute teacher.
Speaker 1: And ironically, years later I ran into him in St. Louis.
Speaker 1: He was with his brothers, the Heath brothers. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: he was We were in the Ritz Carlton. I was
Speaker 1: there to attend Steve mckeever's wedding. Steve McKeever, the founder
Speaker 1: of Hidden Beach, who signed Jill Scott and many others
Speaker 1: from Philadelphia, kindred such a radio person I wouldn't trying
Speaker 1: to get okay, So anyway, I saw Jimmy, and Jimmy
Speaker 1: calls me over and he says to his brothers, Dianna
Speaker 1: was my best student. I wanted to bore a whole
Speaker 1: go through the floor because I am horrible, talent less,
Speaker 1: probably well lovely, but honey, I could not. You know,
Speaker 1: you have to be able to improvise, and I just
Speaker 1: did not have those skills. I had an appreciation of sensitivity,
Speaker 1: a passion for the music, but just don't have any talent.
Speaker 1: So I always hear about um, maybe like from the
Speaker 1: generation that came before I came up, and I guess like,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm one of the last people that like the
Speaker 1: idea of like music appreciation and who knows what this
Speaker 1: uh instrument it is? And I want to try that viola,
Speaker 1: you know, that sort of thing. But was it just
Speaker 1: expected even if you didn't have musical talent. Was it
Speaker 1: just expected like for a non musical person you just
Speaker 1: saw the flute and was like, okay. Actually, my first
Speaker 1: boyfriend that I lost my virginity too, from Brooklyn Lethal,
Speaker 1: he played the flute. So as a result of being
Speaker 1: around him in intimate circumstances, one day I just picked
Speaker 1: up his instrument and started, I'm not super class. I'm
Speaker 1: telling you what happened, satur Anyway, That's how I came
Speaker 1: to study the flute. Yeah, but you know interesting, So
Speaker 1: to your question, a mirror the question about music. Music
Speaker 1: and Harlem was everywhere, and even people who did not
Speaker 1: have talent or could play an instrument had an appreciation.
Speaker 1: We used to when we got music, we would sit
Speaker 1: together in a group and devour an album. We would
Speaker 1: read the liner notes because back in the day everybody
Speaker 1: did liner notes for their music. We would read where
Speaker 1: it was recorded, who was the engineer, where everything, all
Speaker 1: of the details, the minutia of a record. Not just
Speaker 1: did we absorb the music. Of course, we were smoking
Speaker 1: weed at that time, okay, all right, yeah, and we
Speaker 1: would just we were very knowledgeable when it came to music.
Speaker 1: That was expected of us, especially growing up in Harlem.
Speaker 1: That was the expectation that you were damn whatever was
Speaker 1: new coming out, that you were going to their shows,
Speaker 1: that you were up on what was happening musically. Do
Speaker 1: you have any siblings? I don't. I'm an only child.
Speaker 1: What cousins? Cousins? Exactly, I've got tons of cousins. So
Speaker 1: how did Now this is unusual because usually, uh, it's
Speaker 1: the trickle cultural trickle down, a system of the older
Speaker 1: sibling puts the youngest one onto something and you absorb it.
Speaker 1: So who was your daughter? My father? My father? My
Speaker 1: father played the radio all the time. We listened to
Speaker 1: w ABC, the Good Guys, and we also listened to
Speaker 1: w w r L, which was the African American AM station.
Speaker 1: So I grew up hearing you know, all the mix
Speaker 1: sounds because is back in the day when I grew up.
Speaker 1: They played black and white artist on w ABC. But
Speaker 1: then w w r L only all black music. So
Speaker 1: that's where I got my ears. My daddy big on music.
Speaker 1: But the only all black station was the a M
Speaker 1: w w r L, Yeah, the AM station. Who were
Speaker 1: the personalities of the day, well, um Enoch Gregory, uh,
Speaker 1: just you know the good guys. I can't remember all
Speaker 1: the names, Cousin Brucy. I mean, there were a ton
Speaker 1: of radio personalities. But the first woman that I ever
Speaker 1: heard on the radio Vye Higginson. V Higginson. Well she
Speaker 1: was on w b LS with Frankie Crocker. And we're
Speaker 1: talking early seventies because I graduated from high school seventy one,
Speaker 1: the year that Marvin Gaye released What's going On? Um,
Speaker 1: that that is the soundtrack to my life. That's the
Speaker 1: music would beat the Franklin. That's what I came up
Speaker 1: because it was yeah, yeah, yeah, I did. That's when
Speaker 1: it came out. Imagine going out into the world. What's
Speaker 1: going on? Wow? So yeah. Then w l I b
Speaker 1: FM became w b LS, and that's where I heard
Speaker 1: Vy Higginson. And when I heard her, I just fell
Speaker 1: in love. I was enamored with her voice, her her style.
Speaker 1: It sounded like you were in her bedroom. It sounded
Speaker 1: very intimate, and that's what I went absolutely absolutely she
Speaker 1: was on air personality. She was an on air personality.
Speaker 1: She's still on the radio now on the station that's
Speaker 1: online in New York. And but she was Doris Troy's sister.
Speaker 1: And she did the play Mama, I Want to Sing.
Speaker 1: That's by Higginson who produced it in Doris Troy just
Speaker 1: well and look that was her sister. So anyway Higginson, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and Frankie Crocker. I'm a graduate of Frankie Crocker University,
Speaker 1: but kind of school, okay. So playing the magnitude of
Speaker 1: the power that Frankie Crocer had on New York and
Speaker 1: national nationwide. Frankie Croker was a radio personality and a programmer.
Speaker 1: I would say he was the dean of FM Black
Speaker 1: Radio at its at the beginning, and he programmed w
Speaker 1: b LS one of seven point five in New York
Speaker 1: and later other stations around the country. But he had
Speaker 1: the most effortless style, very commanding presence on the radio,
Speaker 1: and he introduced New York audiences to Barry White U Disco,
Speaker 1: the sound of Philadelphia, but he would also mix in
Speaker 1: maybe he would throw in some Frank Sinatra. He could
Speaker 1: do that because he was the program director. But it
Speaker 1: was an eclectic sound and he said it was three
Speaker 1: sixty degrees of the total experience of black music. So
Speaker 1: Frankie Croker hired me after I spent two years in Washington,
Speaker 1: d C at w h u R nineties point three,
Speaker 1: which is also a very important radio station in the
Speaker 1: history of music and black radio because it was the
Speaker 1: home of the original Quiet Storm as created by Cathie Hughes,
Speaker 1: who is my best friend, also the founder of Radio one,
Speaker 1: TV one Interactive one Urban one. Melvin Lindsay was He
Speaker 1: wasn't the first host, but he became. Yeah, there was
Speaker 1: some there the two other hosts. Yeah, exactly, video soul
Speaker 1: like our first celebrity who passed from from exactly. That's
Speaker 1: very truely. Yeah, But Melvin was also my protege because
Speaker 1: he was a student. Howard University owned the radio station,
Speaker 1: but it was a commercial outlet in the middle of
Speaker 1: the dial, and Frankie Crocker liberally borrowed from what we
Speaker 1: were doing in Washington d C. Okay at ye after
Speaker 1: a while, but that's where I started as Ebony moon
Speaker 1: Beams at w h R and d C. So I
Speaker 1: did not go to Howard. I was very, very silly.
Speaker 1: I was very caught up. I was hired on the
Speaker 1: eve of my nineteen birthday by a gentleman named Bob
Speaker 1: Nighthawk Terry, who's also another legendary if you saw the
Speaker 1: movie Talk to Me, that was SAIDs character. But that
Speaker 1: was the gentleman who hired me and gave me my
Speaker 1: break in radio in d C. So two years after
Speaker 1: being have Any moon Beams and being in DC, I
Speaker 1: got a call on the hotline from Frankie Crocker offering
Speaker 1: me a job first in St. Louis. That didn't work
Speaker 1: out too well. I went to St. Louis, and all
Speaker 1: due respect to St. Lou it was just too small
Speaker 1: for me. Okay, I just wasn't And my mama went
Speaker 1: with me and she was like, oh, not too much
Speaker 1: culture here, we gotta we have to go. It's true.
Speaker 1: My mom is from there. I think Jerry Curls until
Speaker 1: like two thousand. Yeah, that wasn't that wasn't working for
Speaker 1: And then he offered me a job in Chicago. That
Speaker 1: didn't work either, because the owners called me and said
Speaker 1: the money that Mr Crocker offered you, we cannot afford
Speaker 1: to pay you. And I was like, okay, deuces. And
Speaker 1: then he called me again on the hotline at w
Speaker 1: h R. At this point I was doing mid days
Speaker 1: and he said, come come to New York. Come come
Speaker 1: to be a lame come home. Wow, this is this
Speaker 1: is the episode I've been waiting for him, all the
Speaker 1: questions I've had about every city. Can you explain why
Speaker 1: d C is such an important mecha for black music
Speaker 1: and being the Chocolate City and even even now today
Speaker 1: like shows that we do in d C are way different.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe Detroit comes in a comes in a close second,
Speaker 1: But what is it about d C? So I'm assuming
Speaker 1: that the musical diet that the city is raised on
Speaker 1: that determines the the caliber of artists that that come
Speaker 1: through the city. And I am I correct. Yeah, you
Speaker 1: mentioned Chocolate City. It was definitively Chocolate City when I
Speaker 1: was there. It's been ultra gentified gentrified now, so it
Speaker 1: is no longer Chocolate City. But the the d C
Speaker 1: that you're referring to, um, you know, it's the d
Speaker 1: m V. So it's the district of Columbia, Virginia and Maryland.
Speaker 1: But this you had the migration. You have people coming
Speaker 1: from the South, even the Midwest, moving to d C
Speaker 1: for government jobs. It's a government city. It's the you know,
Speaker 1: the nation's capital, largest black middle class in the country.
Speaker 1: There you go. So it created this middle class, but
Speaker 1: people who had disposable income. And you know, music is
Speaker 1: at the core of our d n A for black folks,
Speaker 1: all due respect to everybody else, but for us, I
Speaker 1: think we're born in our DNA with U with a
Speaker 1: sponge that can absorb all the genres of our creation.
Speaker 1: And so in d C you had this this middle class.
Speaker 1: You have people who had disposable income. They bought tickets
Speaker 1: to every show, they went to the club's. You know,
Speaker 1: it was just part of our culture to to embrace
Speaker 1: music and the artists that came through town. Not to
Speaker 1: mention Go Go, well, Go Go of course, the genre
Speaker 1: that was born exclusively in d C and and Chuck
Speaker 1: Brown all of those people. Okay, friends, can we finally
Speaker 1: have this conversation about Go Go? Yes? Yeah, you know
Speaker 1: what point I'm about to bring up? Well, I just
Speaker 1: wanted what what what what year would you say was
Speaker 1: the origin the beginning of Go Go early seventies. By
Speaker 1: the time I got to d C in nineteen seventy three.
Speaker 1: When I got there, it was in full swing. Trouble, trouble, fong,
Speaker 1: all of that was in full swing. I think the
Speaker 1: thing is is that, Okay, I know that early soul
Speaker 1: searcher for I have a more break beatn traditional right
Speaker 1: and all that stuff that that Chuck Brown did before. Okay,
Speaker 1: this is authentic Go Go. However, I truly believe and
Speaker 1: this is where this my This is a very unpopular
Speaker 1: take on the history Go Go, But I believe the
Speaker 1: DNA of Go Go starts with Grover Washington Juniors, Mr Magic.
Speaker 1: I've heard that. I've heard that before before. The rhythm
Speaker 1: palette of Go Go is but what he is and so,
Speaker 1: but I'm just saying that I would assume that with
Speaker 1: that sort of backdrop, we definitely played it a lot,
Speaker 1: that many bands have played it and played it and
Speaker 1: played it and put it into the repertoire that ship DC.
Speaker 1: So I wonder if any DC music historians will back
Speaker 1: me up in the fact that Gonna do what I
Speaker 1: did with it, I started in seventy two, but when
Speaker 1: I got there in seventy three, it was it was
Speaker 1: everybody everywhere. I mean, you could not go to a
Speaker 1: club but not here, go go music. It was just
Speaker 1: so could they have been an influence on him? Possibly?
Speaker 1: You know what? I've been in the reverse though. I'm
Speaker 1: just saying that most go go that I know of,
Speaker 1: Like the first example that it was truly played to
Speaker 1: me was around seventy eight, seventy nine. But I've investigated,
Speaker 1: I've investigated many of those d C funk bands and
Speaker 1: all my record collections, and that kind of the music
Speaker 1: was still post soul, post p funk ish, that sort
Speaker 1: of thing. And so I'm just saying I'm putting it
Speaker 1: out there. I'm gonna find somebody to We're also talking
Speaker 1: about the home of Marvin gay Boom Duke Allington. I mean,
Speaker 1: just that's right, when Marvin Gaye got his band, who
Speaker 1: do you come to Philadelphia? But when you want to
Speaker 1: play weekend shows? Where are you going DC? What you
Speaker 1: want to do a Saturday and a sun Okay, Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not going to find anybody back up
Speaker 1: this argument. So of of of your formative years, what city,
Speaker 1: what city do you feel had the most culture as
Speaker 1: far as uh impact and richness in black music. Is
Speaker 1: it d C? Is it New York. It's a combination.
Speaker 1: So again, I grew up in Harlem. I spent radio
Speaker 1: formative years in d C and Chocolate City with black folks,
Speaker 1: and then I came to Philadelphia and Philadelphia. At the
Speaker 1: point when I came to Philadelphia, I came because I
Speaker 1: started dating Kenny Gamble and instantly fell in love with him.
Speaker 1: So when I came to Philadelphia, the sound of Philly
Speaker 1: was in full throttle, and we're talking Harold Melvin and
Speaker 1: the Blue Notes. Teddy was still in the group when
Speaker 1: I came. He started as the drummer and then moved
Speaker 1: into the lead position. But it was Pattie LaBelle and
Speaker 1: the People's Choice and the tramps and the Delphonics and
Speaker 1: the stylistics and all of that was going on when
Speaker 1: I initially came to Philly in the mid seventies. And
Speaker 1: the first time I really came here was with Gene Carne,
Speaker 1: who is the godmother to my oldest son, clif Jean,
Speaker 1: was about to sign her deal with Gamble. But I
Speaker 1: had met Gamble a year earlier in d C, when
Speaker 1: I was hosting an Jay's concert and we formed our friendship.
Speaker 1: But when I first visited Philadelphia International was with Jeane
Speaker 1: when she signed her deal. Was it always on three
Speaker 1: Broad Street? It was three o nine, I'm sorry. Was
Speaker 1: my high school? Okay, performing arts? Just to go back
Speaker 1: to the Chuck Brown, go go Mr Matka thing. I
Speaker 1: found a quote from Chuck Brown about that, and he
Speaker 1: basically admits that he got it from Grover, but says
Speaker 1: it Grover they both got it from somewhere else. And
Speaker 1: the quote is all I did was break the beat
Speaker 1: in half. I got it from Grover, for sure, but
Speaker 1: we really both got that from the spirit from gospel.
Speaker 1: It's an old church beat. Oh sucks, look at that.
Speaker 1: I'll give you half an okay, all right, okay, I
Speaker 1: want that one. Go um. Thank you for that clarification. Yeah,
Speaker 1: gotta get the truth out there. Yeah, so Philadelphia um
Speaker 1: in in the well really at the height of it.
Speaker 1: First of all, do you credit Gamble and Huff for
Speaker 1: being the proprietors of disco? Many of said that absolutely
Speaker 1: well as a case start at first because he had strings,
Speaker 1: and Verry White because he's the first to go to
Speaker 1: hundred sums and bb ms, but you know, as far
Speaker 1: as the sheen and the class, and plus you know
Speaker 1: Earl Young, Young, Young Earl will not let you get
Speaker 1: out of a room without giving him his props. To
Speaker 1: the second, it was very second and forever. And Earl
Speaker 1: Young the founder of the Tramps and the drummer but
Speaker 1: also the studio drummer for many, not all, of the
Speaker 1: Gamble Huff songs. So I definitely give them credit acknowledged
Speaker 1: he did. He played with everybody, but he was a
Speaker 1: primary drummer for many of the Gamble Haff sessions. So yeah,
Speaker 1: So when I came here, initially it was hetty because
Speaker 1: there was all kinds of music. It was jazz. It
Speaker 1: wasn't just Gamble and Huff and what they were doing.
Speaker 1: It was you know, I knew of the tradition of
Speaker 1: great gospel artists, the Dixie Hummingbirds. I met Ira Tucker
Speaker 1: when I first moved here. Ira Tuck, her senior. Uh
Speaker 1: you know that we're talking about the Ward Singers, all
Speaker 1: of that. Rosetta Thorpe, you know, um Fonte and I
Speaker 1: were talking about that yesterday. Rosetta Thorpe, the mother of
Speaker 1: rock and roll here Philadelphia. Really, yes I did not
Speaker 1: know that. What I did not know that and he
Speaker 1: had on his Yeah he did. He did a project project.
Speaker 1: She wasn't born here, but she lived here. She lived here,
Speaker 1: and she died here. So yes, Rosetta Thorpe. While we're
Speaker 1: at it, um to the person that keeps on putting
Speaker 1: Beachy Thompson from the Dixie Hummingbirds as my great grandfather,
Speaker 1: he is not true. And I'm the one that keeps
Speaker 1: em raising it. So yeah, like, I just want to
Speaker 1: put that out there too, because every journalist is like,
Speaker 1: you know, three generations and I'm like, no, Beachie Thompson
Speaker 1: is not my grandfather. So as you want to put
Speaker 1: that out there, that's important. Um. So any note like,
Speaker 1: are there any notable historical Philadelphia musical stories that you've
Speaker 1: seen firsthand that I don't love you anymore? You know?
Speaker 1: D he left the blue notes like what? Oh well,
Speaker 1: Teddy was my neighbor. He was my is the cold
Speaker 1: borrow cup of sugar neighbor and also one of my
Speaker 1: closest friends to his transition. In fact, I delivered the
Speaker 1: obituary at his memorial um watching Teddy Pendergrass leave the
Speaker 1: um situation with Harold because they were fighting. They were
Speaker 1: duking it out. I mean they were having physical fights.
Speaker 1: It was abusive and out of control by the time
Speaker 1: he left the group. But to see Teddy Pendergrass go
Speaker 1: from being with the group and then becoming one of
Speaker 1: the biggest artists in soul music and and he was
Speaker 1: crossing over pop. He was going to become a movie star.
Speaker 1: He had a Teddy Jeans line, Yes, Teddy Jeans. But
Speaker 1: to witness that was pretty spectacular. Just to see the
Speaker 1: energy that happened as a result of the sound of
Speaker 1: Philadelphia worldwide, that was pretty heady. I mean, I have
Speaker 1: tons of stories with artists. Did you have any influence
Speaker 1: in getting him to finally settled down with a natural
Speaker 1: as opposed to Teddy? No, absolutely not. Teddy had many
Speaker 1: hairstyles during the duration, was like the influence in his life.
Speaker 1: That yeah, that was before me. And had I known
Speaker 1: him at the time, I would have said, your prettier
Speaker 1: than mine. You need to know Teddy. Teddy was quite
Speaker 1: something extraordinary. You met him a mere yeah, yeah, you
Speaker 1: were in the room with him. You know, he had
Speaker 1: a magnetic energy on like which same thing that Marvin had. Um,
Speaker 1: there's only a few people. Sam Cook had it that
Speaker 1: that Jennison, Miles Davis had it. Miles Davis my good
Speaker 1: friend of Miles Davis. He definitely sty okay. Period of okay,
Speaker 1: we're talking early seventies when I was in d C
Speaker 1: and m Two May, who is a beloved of mine,
Speaker 1: a Heath connection, another Heath. Well that's how I met
Speaker 1: him through his father, Jimmy Heath. But he was playing percussions.
Speaker 1: He was playing congas with Miles and they came to
Speaker 1: d C and I was on the air w h R.
Speaker 1: He said, come by, check out the show. So after
Speaker 1: the set, he introduces me to Miles and he says, Miles,
Speaker 1: meet Deanna. Deanna me Miles, and Miles says, marry me.
Speaker 1: I'm standing there looking at him like uh no, And
Speaker 1: he says, well why not? And I said, because I
Speaker 1: just met you. I don't know you like that. But
Speaker 1: I had on this long white dress and a white
Speaker 1: gale My head wrap. And he says to me, but
Speaker 1: you look like a motherfucking bride. So from there we
Speaker 1: developed a very dear friendship and um went on for
Speaker 1: years until I started dating Kenny Gamble, and Gamble was like,
Speaker 1: I'm not having Miles Davis around my woman, it's not happening.
Speaker 1: It's like that. So but we we stayed friends, um
Speaker 1: for years. You were the original coffee shop chick. What
Speaker 1: is that? The the the the Nubian goddess that we
Speaker 1: would think of head wraps and since. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: like me, but I was after it was a mirror.
Speaker 1: It was the post civil rights era. It would say
Speaker 1: it loud, I'm black and I'm proud. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: that period of awakening with black folks when we were like,
Speaker 1: you know, no more, no more dogs biting us, no more.
Speaker 1: It was past Montgomery and the boycotts where we were like,
Speaker 1: we recognized our economic power and our beauty and strength.
Speaker 1: We know whence we came from. But once the Nixton
Speaker 1: era sort of set in and you know the leaders
Speaker 1: were killed, than a lot of that just cools off.
Speaker 1: And you know the seventies was mad hedonism. Oh me,
Speaker 1: it was Mina Simone, Aretha Franklin say it loud, I'm
Speaker 1: black and I'm proud. That happened in the seventies. James Brown, Um,
Speaker 1: all of that was the seventies. So I just you know,
Speaker 1: my uncle, but who stole my Grandmam Steve. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: here we go. You had you had brothers coming back
Speaker 1: from Vietnam. Okay, they were distressed, and many of them
Speaker 1: came back with habits, heroin. I mean, you know, so
Speaker 1: we were starting to deal with crack and all of
Speaker 1: that happening in our community. So so there was a
Speaker 1: lot going on. Were you discouraged at all with as
Speaker 1: I will say that afrocentricity had its second wave eighties
Speaker 1: seven with the hip hop generation. But was there a
Speaker 1: period between yeah, s eighty post this go between eighty
Speaker 1: and eighty five where you just felt like, oh, okay,
Speaker 1: we're we're done this and now we're bourgeois, We're getting jobs,
Speaker 1: we're our hair No, like yeah no, because I recognized
Speaker 1: that we're not monolithic. We're all we're shades and variations
Speaker 1: were not all one thing. So Indiana has always been
Speaker 1: this black so I mean black music mom started in
Speaker 1: the seventies and it continues on. So that's a whole
Speaker 1: you know, that's a yeah, not the thing. Now we're
Speaker 1: not monolithic. So I saw all types of some folks
Speaker 1: with boogie, some were still wearing their hair natural, someone
Speaker 1: wearing braids. It was a whole lot of stuff going on, right,
Speaker 1: But I'm just saying that you are unapologically black, and
Speaker 1: what else could I be. But that's the thing too,
Speaker 1: for some people to kind of spook that's sat by
Speaker 1: the door their way into society, they might have to
Speaker 1: change clothes a little bit. Now. First of all, remember
Speaker 1: so for me, I I talked about graduating from UM
Speaker 1: Frankie Crocker University. But then I was greatly influenced by
Speaker 1: one of the blackest people I know, Kenny Gamble. He
Speaker 1: was my man um. So I was raised up as
Speaker 1: a woman by a strong black man. That's that was
Speaker 1: my education. And then again my parents, my family, I'm
Speaker 1: very clear where I come from and who I am
Speaker 1: and so, and it was very black. And my mother,
Speaker 1: although she was Puerto Rican, she recognized that she's an
Speaker 1: African woman. First time I went to Africa and went
Speaker 1: with my mama. We went to Senegal, um to Ghana,
Speaker 1: and my mother disappeared one day and we were like,
Speaker 1: where's Nancy, where's Nancy. Well, my mother went to the
Speaker 1: marketplace and got her garb. She got some sisters to
Speaker 1: me and she came back garbed okay, and had several
Speaker 1: outfits and My mother was like, yo, I'm an African woman.
Speaker 1: I know this, and that's the spirit in which I
Speaker 1: was raised. I was raised with a great deal of
Speaker 1: consciousness and exposure to black folks. So growing up in Harlem,
Speaker 1: for me, it was the Schaumberg, it was Langston Hughes,
Speaker 1: it was the Negro Ensemble Company. It was all this
Speaker 1: great energy about blackness around me. Do you think that's
Speaker 1: a little bit of some Northeast privilege when it comes
Speaker 1: to black folks in a way to to be able
Speaker 1: to continue that, because I see what a mirror is saying,
Speaker 1: and sometimes it depends on where you are too physically. Possibly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they have that black conversation all time about the difference
Speaker 1: between the South and the Northeastern. No, there are differences,
Speaker 1: we were, definitely, but I celebrate our commonalities. I recognized
Speaker 1: the differences. But you know, I just came from a
Speaker 1: well spring of black culture growing up in Harlem and
Speaker 1: the Bronx, the home of hip hop rap. So you know,
Speaker 1: for me early so let me tell you this too. Also,
Speaker 1: when I was a teenager, I met roy Airs. I
Speaker 1: met a woman named Rna Williams who managed roy Airs.
Speaker 1: So I was fifteen meeting Roy Ares and hanging out
Speaker 1: with people like Roy Airs, and and then uh, Jimmy Heath,
Speaker 1: who I mentioned to you. And then when I was
Speaker 1: about seventeen, a girlfriend of mine named Brenda introduced me
Speaker 1: to Stevie Wonder. So I met Stevie. I call him Stevelyn.
Speaker 1: I met Stevelyn before I even got into radio, and
Speaker 1: he invited me into the studio. He was doing music
Speaker 1: of my Mind, Music of my Mind, so I was exposed.
Speaker 1: And then I mentioned the flute. I decided to take
Speaker 1: flute lessons because I still was trying to trying to
Speaker 1: develop my talent, and I'm met Bobby. I met Bobby.
Speaker 1: But then I approached a gentleman to take flute lessons.
Speaker 1: And his name is Hubert Laws, the greatest flowlest of
Speaker 1: all time. I will tell you that I never got
Speaker 1: a flute lesson, but he taught me a lot. So
Speaker 1: I started dating Hubert Laws, and as a result of
Speaker 1: that relationship, I was exposed even greater too. Um he
Speaker 1: would take me to Rudy Van Gelder's studio in Jersey
Speaker 1: and he was signed to c t I at the time.
Speaker 1: So who did I mean? My favorite love Cree tailor.
Speaker 1: So I met Cretaylor, Rudy Van Gelder, Hank Crawford, Esther Phillips,
Speaker 1: Grover Washington Junior, Freddie Hubbard right, and they performed with
Speaker 1: each other, They recorded with each other, So I would
Speaker 1: go with Hubert to the sessions. But one of my
Speaker 1: favorite sessions, I think you can all appreciate this is
Speaker 1: one day Hubert said he had a session, and uh,
Speaker 1: he took me, deposited me in the control room. And
Speaker 1: who was in the control room Quincy Jones and Donnie Hathaway.
Speaker 1: So it was my first time meeting Donnie and coming
Speaker 1: back Charleston Blue is what they were recording, and Hubert
Speaker 1: was on that session. So I sat in the control
Speaker 1: room with them, and of course at that point I
Speaker 1: knew who Donnie was. He was very shy, demure, quiet,
Speaker 1: and Quincy calls Aretha Franklin and introduces Donnie to Aretha
Speaker 1: on the phone and he tells Aretha, you gotta hear him.
Speaker 1: You know, Donnie Hathaway, And of course he was signed
Speaker 1: to Atlantic Records. So at this point in your life,
Speaker 1: these things aren't phazing you Like, I'm young. I'm young,
Speaker 1: I'm taking it all in. But you know what. It's
Speaker 1: set the bar from me. It's set an appetite for me,
Speaker 1: because what I have discovered over time is that I
Speaker 1: am most intrigued and attracted to the exceptional. And that's
Speaker 1: what I have had all of my life. I have
Speaker 1: been um involved friendships, romances with people who are supremely gifted.
Speaker 1: I would say, that's what I like. I'm to hear
Speaker 1: your opinion on life in two thousand nineteen and where
Speaker 1: music is going, well, I say, never a dull moment.
Speaker 1: That's how I approach life daily with human beings. There's
Speaker 1: seven billion of us, right, Fante. We were talking about
Speaker 1: this last night, but Sly and the family Stone said,
Speaker 1: everybody is a star. We all have our unique shine,
Speaker 1: we have our individuality. Um, we contribute to this energy
Speaker 1: that keeps our planet revolving around the sun. And have
Speaker 1: to tell me I'm sugar, Steve. You already know that, sugar,
Speaker 1: and that's Diana is already You're already forced to listen
Speaker 1: to everything from back because she's a media coach. So
Speaker 1: when you say, are you going to be blue faces media?
Speaker 1: She tried with code black. You know it's like walked out.
Speaker 1: So how did it? What was well, he was disrespect
Speaker 1: You're still doing media coaching yea, and development, yes, talk
Speaker 1: about entails because I don't think a lot of people
Speaker 1: know could you teach us? I had this? Okay, you
Speaker 1: just had media training, didn't you? I did. I got
Speaker 1: media coached. Ud keep yourself in the mouth, yeah, because
Speaker 1: I was. I I did this thing for NBC uh
Speaker 1: Sunday morning and then immediately thereafter. But they told me
Speaker 1: I did. The guy he told me he did a
Speaker 1: good job. But it's it's a lot. It's I'll be
Speaker 1: honest with you, guys. After episode ten you went and
Speaker 1: got was like, no, man, you see it too much
Speaker 1: like Obama? You are you were so like there was
Speaker 1: There was actually a point back then when I was
Speaker 1: editing out all of these I call those fillers. They're
Speaker 1: all part of natural conversation. But yeah, the overuse of
Speaker 1: it is like, all know what I'm saying interesting because
Speaker 1: it's not a lot of media coaches. I'm like, dang,
Speaker 1: who'd you get great gudmother? Because really there's it's a
Speaker 1: handful of people who do niche part of the industry,
Speaker 1: but I do. I call it artists development, human development
Speaker 1: with an emphasis on media But for me, it's I
Speaker 1: get a lot of young artists, so I'm schooling them
Speaker 1: on what I feel are the rudiments of things they
Speaker 1: need to know. Kanye, Kanye was one of your students.
Speaker 1: She had to lead that one to Yeah. That was.
Speaker 1: That was. I was approached by Leo Cohen called me
Speaker 1: directly after the Taylor Swift incident and asked me. He said,
Speaker 1: my friend needs help. Can you meet with Kanye. This
Speaker 1: was months after he had already gone to Hawaii he
Speaker 1: was recording. He came back and I met with him
Speaker 1: at his home in New York, and he really didn't well.
Speaker 1: First of all, I was approach to coach him when
Speaker 1: his first album was coming out, and he didn't want
Speaker 1: any coaching. And I ran into him someplace and I said,
Speaker 1: I was supposed to coach you. He says, Oh, I
Speaker 1: know how to handle the media. I know what to do.
Speaker 1: I got this. I don't need any any any I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, Duke, respect brother, I love your music.
Speaker 1: Piece of blessings. But later I went to his home
Speaker 1: and spent the afternoon with him, and we talked about
Speaker 1: Taylor Swift, we talked about life in general. I took
Speaker 1: him a black obelisk, and I gave that to him
Speaker 1: as a gift and he was like, well, what is this?
Speaker 1: I said, it's an oblisk and it's Egyptian and you'll
Speaker 1: see it in Rome, and you'll see it in Europe
Speaker 1: and in South America. You'll see it everywhere. But it's Egyptian.
Speaker 1: I'm looking at him right now. The obleist okay, d C.
Speaker 1: Washington Monument, the obless okay. Simple. But we wound up
Speaker 1: not working together. He really did not want it. It
Speaker 1: was Leo who wanted it for him and felt that
Speaker 1: he needed it. But Kanye is the type of artist
Speaker 1: you don't. He's yeah, you don't, all right, so can
Speaker 1: you give us? Uh? What do I do? Never does this?
Speaker 1: But I'm I hope you do. Yeah. Yeah, because even
Speaker 1: now I still feel like an amateur and doing this.
Speaker 1: We're gonna have to give her a check after we're done.
Speaker 1: You know that, right, because it's like a mere jump
Speaker 1: on my record for free. I do that. I never
Speaker 1: charged with drumming for really, you shouldn't have said that
Speaker 1: on the air. I literally don't. What do you Whether
Speaker 1: there is there's something else you charged for walking in
Speaker 1: or not? I mean when you. I'm at a place
Speaker 1: now where you know, like, drummer is my passion. DJ
Speaker 1: is my passion. Sean won't let me DJ for free.
Speaker 1: But like you know, if I like the person, I'll
Speaker 1: drummer and not think about it. What am I going
Speaker 1: to do with the two thousand bucks? Like, yeahousand bucks
Speaker 1: for the average person, there's a whole lot of money
Speaker 1: a mayor think about it. Let's also say that half
Speaker 1: of my salary and this show is going to the staff.
Speaker 1: So what you're saying, I like, for you, that would
Speaker 1: not be a lot of money, but to the person's
Speaker 1: given it, it would be a lot. So it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't keep your money. Yeah what I'm saying. But
Speaker 1: so what would be a better way to Deanna to
Speaker 1: clean that up and say it at all? But it's
Speaker 1: already done see Diana with t I since the beginning,
Speaker 1: so I know you know how to clean after the
Speaker 1: fact as well. It's different with every artist, it's different.
Speaker 1: I tailor. I have a program. I call it the
Speaker 1: influence system, and it's influence meaning the ability to prevail
Speaker 1: upon the thoughts and feelings of others. And that's what
Speaker 1: artists do. And I don't just work with artists. I've
Speaker 1: also worked with athletes like Alan Iverson, heavyweight boxer Roy
Speaker 1: Jones Jr. I work with. I worked with Michael Vick
Speaker 1: as well when he came out of prison, and that
Speaker 1: was t I called me one day and had Michael
Speaker 1: Vick on the phone and said, Deanna is my person.
Speaker 1: You need to get with Deanna. But Michael was not
Speaker 1: very happy when he came out of jail because everybody
Speaker 1: kept asking about the dog fighting and and he was like, look,
Speaker 1: I just served two years in jail. I don't want
Speaker 1: to talk about this anymore. And I was like, Michael,
Speaker 1: let me bring you to reality. You will be talking
Speaker 1: about this for the rest of your life. It doesn't
Speaker 1: matter even though you went to prison. This is part
Speaker 1: of your story now. And you know people are very
Speaker 1: attached to their dogs. Uh, and you were involved in
Speaker 1: the situation. I hate dogs people. One of the many
Speaker 1: so different people at Taylor. For instance, I'll give you
Speaker 1: the Little Kim story. So Little Kim was on the
Speaker 1: red carpet and and Howard Stern asked her what was
Speaker 1: it like to have sex with a big, fat, ugly
Speaker 1: guy like big and small now him? She wanted she
Speaker 1: just wanted to fight him, but she was on the
Speaker 1: red carpet. It was I think the MTV Music Awards,
Speaker 1: and so she kept it moving, but she was very upset,
Speaker 1: very angry. At this time. She was signed to Atlantic
Speaker 1: a little later and they said, you have to do
Speaker 1: Howard Stern. This is when he was still doing terrestrial
Speaker 1: radio before Sirius XM and Kim didn't want to do it,
Speaker 1: and they said, okay, we've got the perfect person to
Speaker 1: help prep you for the interview with Howard Stern. I
Speaker 1: went to the Trump Tower. She was getting her face
Speaker 1: beat at five in the morning, and we sat and
Speaker 1: worked on how to approach Howard, what to say me
Speaker 1: anticipating the questions that he would ask her, and also
Speaker 1: I protected her. I was like, if we're not gonna
Speaker 1: let him ask you about Biggie, you're gonna bring up
Speaker 1: Biggie before he does, providing control the narrative and providing
Speaker 1: the strategy and how we were going to deal with that.
Speaker 1: So very early in the interview, she says to Howard,
Speaker 1: you know you and Biggie would have been boys. I
Speaker 1: think y'all would have been friends. And he says, really like, why,
Speaker 1: why do you say that, and she said, because you
Speaker 1: have a big personality, and so did Big and I
Speaker 1: could see the two of you being boys. So at
Speaker 1: that point she disarmed him. Yeah, and he did not
Speaker 1: say anything negative about him, and that was her concern
Speaker 1: because she was like, if he attacks my man one
Speaker 1: more time, we're gonna be fighting up in that studio.
Speaker 1: And uh, she just took control of the interview and
Speaker 1: the narrative and she just had Howard sterned, purring and
Speaker 1: in the palm of her hand. That's because we prepared
Speaker 1: for him. In fact, on that particular album, she had
Speaker 1: done a song where she shouted him out and she said, Howard,
Speaker 1: you paved the way for me as an artist who
Speaker 1: deals with sexual issues. You paved the way with your
Speaker 1: fights with the FCC, talking about sex all of that.
Speaker 1: So Howard, thank you. So all that was part of
Speaker 1: how we crept. And when we left, I was in
Speaker 1: the Ingram Kim came in, hugged me high five. She
Speaker 1: was happy with the results, Atlantic was happy. She was
Speaker 1: pleased Howard also, So yeah, so it depends. When Charlie
Speaker 1: Wilson came out of rehab, I worked with him on
Speaker 1: how to talk about the rehab experience and his his
Speaker 1: path moving forward. Usher. I only worked with him on
Speaker 1: he wanted to talk about being dyslexic. He had never
Speaker 1: discussed it publicly, right, And that's what we worked on.
Speaker 1: And he was a big star at the point where
Speaker 1: I worked with him. So it varies. But I also
Speaker 1: worked with new up and coming emerging artists, and they
Speaker 1: don't know anything about how to go to radio, how
Speaker 1: to go to television, they don't know. They know how
Speaker 1: to create, they know how to perform, but oftentimes they
Speaker 1: can't talk about what they do. So back to your question,
Speaker 1: there was a woman at Motown named Mrs Powell, Mrs
Speaker 1: seeing Powell. She did the artist development at Motown and
Speaker 1: Barry Gordy right, Barry Gordy's sisters recommended her because she
Speaker 1: had an etiquette charms school in Detroit and prepared people
Speaker 1: to be models and what have you. But remember many
Speaker 1: of the artists that Barry Gordy signed out of Motown
Speaker 1: came straight from the hood, from the projects, and they
Speaker 1: didn't know which four to use. They didn't have any
Speaker 1: idea of what to expect, especially with Barry taking them
Speaker 1: all over the world. So Mrs Powell prepped them, so
Speaker 1: I consider her the mother of artist development and coaching.
Speaker 1: And then Susanne to Pass came in later and took
Speaker 1: over from Mrs Powell, and she worked on prepping the
Speaker 1: Jackson five specifically, So I also credit Suzanne to Pass
Speaker 1: as being another mother of artist development. So I studied
Speaker 1: everything that they did. Who do you feel who do
Speaker 1: you feel your greatest student was? Or yeah, that's where
Speaker 1: I'm very impressed Tip. But I give Tip a lot
Speaker 1: of credit. I mean, he we worked together for eight years.
Speaker 1: Anytime he released a record, anytime he did a book,
Speaker 1: a film, TV show, whatever, he would call me go
Speaker 1: to Atlanta to his home. We would lock up, or
Speaker 1: I'd go on the road wherever he was and we
Speaker 1: would sit, lock up, talk um and just what I do.
Speaker 1: What I did with Tip is I would give him
Speaker 1: language and thoughts. I would let him talk to me
Speaker 1: first express how he felt about whatever it was, the music,
Speaker 1: the book, the film, and then I would give him
Speaker 1: some language in ways to discuss what he had done.
Speaker 1: Because you're also brought of the Dave Matthews work too, right,
Speaker 1: But I didn't work with Dave. I worked with the band.
Speaker 1: I worked with the rest of the band. Yes, they
Speaker 1: do talk. And this was in preparation for the Sunday
Speaker 1: morning show that you did CBS sun Morning. They were
Speaker 1: doing a special one of their members had died in
Speaker 1: a tragic accident. Remember that they did not know how
Speaker 1: to talk about the passing of their member even with
Speaker 1: each other. They had not discussed the death with each other.
Speaker 1: So when I came in, I've met with the members
Speaker 1: individually and then collectively. Um. So yeah, and so it varies.
Speaker 1: What is something that you would say to an artist
Speaker 1: that is absolutely like in talking dudes and don'ts of
Speaker 1: interviewing or whatever. What are the things that you would
Speaker 1: say to artists like okay, absolutely, like do not do this, yeah,
Speaker 1: don't be on your phone, don't be disrespectful, don't make
Speaker 1: um do not not make eye contact. First of all,
Speaker 1: I encourage my clients to do their homework, just like
Speaker 1: I did with you guys. I read up on you individually.
Speaker 1: What did you find inside? You know, I'm scared, No,
Speaker 1: nothing to be scared of. But you know, you do
Speaker 1: your homework. That's the beginning, and that's the first tenant
Speaker 1: that I teach us operation. So do your homework. Know
Speaker 1: where you're going know who you're speaking with. I'll listen
Speaker 1: to what they've done. If they're a print journalist, read
Speaker 1: something they've written. So I give them basic human etiquette
Speaker 1: and respect. So how do you did? You pretty much
Speaker 1: prepare for your first meeting with a client the same
Speaker 1: way you do. You do your research, you know, find
Speaker 1: out everything, you watch old interviews and like, do you
Speaker 1: come up with like a list of you know, I
Speaker 1: saw this interview, I didn't like what you said. Here,
Speaker 1: I'll sit with them. It depends on how many interviews
Speaker 1: they've done. Some artists i'll sit For instance, bow Wow
Speaker 1: Bow Wow started, as you know, as a teenager. Chat
Speaker 1: He started as a teenager, and by the time his mother,
Speaker 1: who was his manager and his publicist Patti Webster at
Speaker 1: the time, brought me in. He was angry with Jermaine
Speaker 1: Duprie and he every interview that he was doing he
Speaker 1: was hostile, angry, upset, and so they brought me in
Speaker 1: to calm him down and to give him a way
Speaker 1: to express his disappointment and his love for Jermaine. So
Speaker 1: initially he was like, I don't need I'm a star,
Speaker 1: I don't need any coaching. The very first time I
Speaker 1: went to his home, and he wasn't He just wasn't
Speaker 1: in the frame of mind. So I won't work with
Speaker 1: someone if they're not um willing, if they're not open
Speaker 1: to the process, and so um I left. However, the
Speaker 1: next time I saw him was up at the Sony building,
Speaker 1: and when I got off the elevator, he was standing
Speaker 1: there and he ran away. I never had a man
Speaker 1: run away from me. But when he came back, I said,
Speaker 1: give me fifteen minutes. Fifteen minutes and then you can leave.
Speaker 1: And I had ordered all of his interviews, and we
Speaker 1: sat and watched his interviews, and I said, all we're
Speaker 1: gonna do today is count how many times you say
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: and then watch a video of yourself. There you goreeriously
Speaker 1: because when I did the media training, he made me
Speaker 1: watch me. He filmed me having an interview with this guy,
Speaker 1: and then we watched it, and it's really uncomfortable and
Speaker 1: it's really hard to watch yourself. And then you stop
Speaker 1: because I kept on like not dropping my eyes and
Speaker 1: like playing with my hands and looking like an idiot.
Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, I look like an idiot. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So watching yourself, hearing yourself you're absolutely correct, allows you to.
Speaker 1: But Rome wasn't built in a day, so you don't
Speaker 1: change overnight. But mindfulness, being aware of your ticks, of
Speaker 1: your body language, of your lack of eye contact, whatever
Speaker 1: it is, So studying it, if you really applying yourself,
Speaker 1: will help. So that day we watch, I said, just count.
Speaker 1: That's all I want you to do is count how
Speaker 1: many times you say you know what I mean, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. And of course when he counted
Speaker 1: up to about fifty after watching all of these, that
Speaker 1: was right that minutes, he turns around and says, Okay,
Speaker 1: Dianna helped me. He recognized at that point that he
Speaker 1: had a problem and an issue, and he was amenable
Speaker 1: to the process. Question, yes, how did you get into
Speaker 1: doing this? Well, my background is radio. As I said,
Speaker 1: I started a lot of interviews. Is it because rappers
Speaker 1: are known as well? I've I've worked with heavy metal artists,
Speaker 1: I've worked with pop artists. I mean I worked with
Speaker 1: Justin Bieber on his first album. I worked with Rihanna
Speaker 1: on her very first album. So I've worked with artists
Speaker 1: in all genres. Yeah, I mean we all need help.
Speaker 1: Influence Entertainment is my company, and it is me. I
Speaker 1: am the one that does the coaching. People are hiring
Speaker 1: me for my expertise and my ability and my success
Speaker 1: getting people to be better. I am about inspiration. I
Speaker 1: am constantly drawing inspiration everywhere, and I like helping people
Speaker 1: be their best because that's what I aspired to be.
Speaker 1: But follow up and with Bill said, what was the
Speaker 1: moment that got my Because even I know when you
Speaker 1: were like, I'm going to do this all right? So
Speaker 1: I was managing an artist named Gary Taylor. He's a
Speaker 1: songwriters just gets better with That's right exactly. I was
Speaker 1: managing asshole Gary, so he doesn't get better with times.
Speaker 1: In fact that in the coolest manner, weary, I'm just
Speaker 1: being fat your actual Yeah, yeah, like a lot. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I want to be your friend. Two, okay, we canna work.
Speaker 1: You were going to afreciate the Yeah, now that's why
Speaker 1: I opportunity to your wedding. I've appreciated two weddings. So yeah, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: well well what time times when I'm not getting married relaxed.
Speaker 1: We were calling a ride er die ceremony not to
Speaker 1: get me. Yeah, so where were we helping Although you
Speaker 1: know I will tell you. So I managed him and
Speaker 1: I got dragged into managing. I don't like management. It's
Speaker 1: just not my skill set. It's not you did Carol.
Speaker 1: I managed Carol Riddick as well, Philadelphia's own Carol Riddick.
Speaker 1: But with Gary it was just hard talking with him.
Speaker 1: In fact, we were in Chattanooga, Tennessee, in the back
Speaker 1: of his limousine on a promo tour. We couldn't afford
Speaker 1: a road manager road manager, so I went out with
Speaker 1: him and he was so difficult the entire trip. And
Speaker 1: I said to him, you know, Gary, you write these
Speaker 1: great love songs, but part of your problem is you
Speaker 1: you need good love, You need some loving. You need
Speaker 1: somebody to you really do. You're lacking and you're an assohole.
Speaker 1: And you know how, he goes to the record label says,
Speaker 1: I don't want to work with her anymore. She reminds
Speaker 1: me of my ex wife of stuff. I'm like, okay, well,
Speaker 1: I don't want to work with you either. And furthermore,
Speaker 1: here's the number four, not a psychologist, but a psychiatrist,
Speaker 1: because you need medical medicine. And then my partner at
Speaker 1: the time plays the tape for me, Gary sent this
Speaker 1: to you. He wants to make up and she puts
Speaker 1: a cassette in the car and it's Anita Baker good Love.
Speaker 1: And he wrote the song inspired by me telling him
Speaker 1: because in the song he says, I want to know
Speaker 1: what good love feels like, good love, good love, good
Speaker 1: morning to night. So yeah, Gary Taylor, but he was
Speaker 1: signed to Virgin Music. Was I'm sorry Virgin? Yes. And
Speaker 1: the woman who was the head of the Black music division,
Speaker 1: Sharon Haywood, why do I know that? Yes, yeah, the
Speaker 1: cyclopedie you. Sharon Haywood takes me to lunch one day
Speaker 1: and she says, this is after the Gary Taylor debacle.
Speaker 1: She says, you get along with artists, you overstand them.
Speaker 1: While I use the word overstand, she said, you get them,
Speaker 1: they get you. You should do artist development. I had
Speaker 1: never considered it until that day when Sharon says to me,
Speaker 1: you should do that, And I was like. My first
Speaker 1: job Jimmy jam and Terry Lewis. I worked with a
Speaker 1: group called Solo, So so Jimmy and Terry. My second
Speaker 1: vertical Vertical Hole was my seconde and my third was de'angelo.
Speaker 1: I coached D'Angelo. He was my third artist and he
Speaker 1: remains to this day my most precious person. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: so that's how it started years ago. So I've been
Speaker 1: coaching years. Wait, we didn't even bring up the origins
Speaker 1: of black music. We skipped the seventh but we went
Speaker 1: in the seventies. Let's go back in time. So you
Speaker 1: are the proprietor, the inventor of Black music month, Gamble Okay,
Speaker 1: ed right myself. So why did you feel that it
Speaker 1: was necessary? And when when was it first officiated? Eight nine?
Speaker 1: We went to the White House. We petitioned the White
Speaker 1: House to President Jimmy Carter was in the House. Yes,
Speaker 1: Georgia Farmer and so um. Gamble had gone to Nashville
Speaker 1: and was very impressed with Music City and the power
Speaker 1: of the c m A and what they were doing.
Speaker 1: They literally had established a geographic region and made music
Speaker 1: the core of what was going on there. So he said,
Speaker 1: we need to do that in the black music industry.
Speaker 1: So that was the beginning of the b m A,
Speaker 1: the Black Music Association, And part of that endeavor was
Speaker 1: to have a period of time where we celebrate the
Speaker 1: outstanding contributions of people in the past this generation and
Speaker 1: one's coming up. So it was really Gambles brainchild. And
Speaker 1: then you know, we were together at the time. I
Speaker 1: think we were on baby number two. We've been together
Speaker 1: for years, and there were local chapters established around the country.
Speaker 1: But what happened was some years later when I was
Speaker 1: producing I Am that you referenced earlier. There the International
Speaker 1: Association of African American Music, which was it is a
Speaker 1: non um, non membership advocacy organization dedicated to the preservation
Speaker 1: promotion of black music worldwide. So I wrote President Bill
Speaker 1: Clinton asking him to host a reception very similar to
Speaker 1: what Jimmy Carter had done on the White House lawn
Speaker 1: where we had Evelyn King and tons of people. I
Speaker 1: wanted you to break down that day. Father took some
Speaker 1: historic photos, ron St Clair Um, Evelyn Champagne, King Berry,
Speaker 1: Chuck Berry was there as well. Williams was there. It
Speaker 1: was an interesting and I felt, really, yeah, fast, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what it's got to be. The same guy. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, I went to Clinton. I wrote the White
Speaker 1: House and asked them to hold a similar reception and
Speaker 1: they said, well, we see where Jimmy Carter held this
Speaker 1: reception back in the seventies, but he did not sign
Speaker 1: a presidential proclamation. So just go get some legislation, come
Speaker 1: back to us, and we'll do stuff in the White
Speaker 1: House and recognize June Black Music Month. So it took
Speaker 1: me a few years. I had Senator Arl Inspector, who
Speaker 1: was a Republican from Pennsylvania. I had Congressman Shaka fata.
Speaker 1: I literally put my most comfortable pair of shoes, not
Speaker 1: these minola's, and walked around Capitol Hill and petitioned and
Speaker 1: begged and you know, brought statistics about the power of
Speaker 1: black music that we're a multi billion dollar entity, not
Speaker 1: just feel good. You know, it's a business, it's it's
Speaker 1: an economy. And it took a few years, but we
Speaker 1: got legislation passed saying June is Black Music Mom. And
Speaker 1: then I went back to the White House. And at
Speaker 1: that point I had several private meetings in the Oval
Speaker 1: Office with Bill Clinton and took delegations of people in
Speaker 1: the industry, artist as well as executives to the White House.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, so Gamble and I and we worked together.
Speaker 1: Even do we separated, we are partners in life. We
Speaker 1: have three kids, we have a grandson. He's the head
Speaker 1: of my family, the love of my life, and this
Speaker 1: was part of our mission. In our work. We are
Speaker 1: about making people aware of black music and it's potency,
Speaker 1: not just economically, but how it informs everything and everybody
Speaker 1: change your lives. How about that? Can I think I
Speaker 1: wanted to ask you about was in regards to Unsung
Speaker 1: because that was how I first came about your work,
Speaker 1: and I told you about it when we were speaking
Speaker 1: last night. How I just kept seeing you pop up
Speaker 1: in every Unsung and I was like, Wow, I gotta
Speaker 1: figure out who she is. Yeah, she was the Unsung Lady.
Speaker 1: That was really what I was like, Oh yeah, that's
Speaker 1: the Unsung lady. So when we first met at World
Speaker 1: Cafe Live after Things After for and Change Show and
Speaker 1: Nick brought you backstage, I was like, I always done
Speaker 1: Sung Lady, Oh so bright. So it's one thing in
Speaker 1: every Unsung, like every every storyline and Unsung is and
Speaker 1: then hip they were doing so great, and then hip hop.
Speaker 1: So what were your personal feelings and um when rap started,
Speaker 1: you know, dominating? Uh, what was your personal feelings on
Speaker 1: on rap music and how did you make that transition?
Speaker 1: Whereas maybe some of your other peers were just like Ah,
Speaker 1: this is this is bullshit. You seem just from you know,
Speaker 1: our conversations, you seem to be really open to not
Speaker 1: just working with rappers, but also just really embracing the
Speaker 1: culture and um, you know, and accepting it. So what
Speaker 1: was that like for you? I grew up in the
Speaker 1: Boogie Down Bronx, come from where rap music was born.
Speaker 1: And furthermore, Uh, growing up in the late sixties seventies
Speaker 1: in New York and Harlem. Who did I hear? I
Speaker 1: heard the last poets. I heard the last poet. And
Speaker 1: for folks who are not up on the last poets,
Speaker 1: listen to them and you will hear the seeds, the beginnings, um,
Speaker 1: Nikki Giovanni. Uh, That's what I grew up on. In
Speaker 1: addition to hearing rap in the Bronx and then of
Speaker 1: course the Sugar Hill Gang. That was revolutionary. So I
Speaker 1: embraced it and as it evolved, as as as a
Speaker 1: rap evolved, I kept up with it. And a lot
Speaker 1: of the people that I worked with in the industry
Speaker 1: came out of wrap. They came out of that, so
Speaker 1: it was never difficult for me. And as far as
Speaker 1: unsung as concerned, it started in two thousand eight, the
Speaker 1: first season was the Donnie Hathaway, Phillis him and the
Speaker 1: Clark Sisters. I didn't do the Clark Sisters, but I
Speaker 1: did the other ones. Well. First of all, I knew
Speaker 1: Phillis Himan. I had met Donnie Hathaway. I played his
Speaker 1: music from the beginning of him releasing music. So oftentimes
Speaker 1: in these stories that are shared on Unsung, I have
Speaker 1: firsthand knowledge of these people unable and many of them
Speaker 1: my friends. Philip's timing was there to mirror she was
Speaker 1: there to hear you intern that I AM. Do you
Speaker 1: remember that? Do you remember seeing Philip time and walking around?
Speaker 1: I remember, yes, that was when we did the first
Speaker 1: I AM celebration. Yeah, what were your remembrances? What are
Speaker 1: your recollections of me? Andre Um? Because I was frantic. Well,
Speaker 1: now I kind of make the I always used the
Speaker 1: Ray Croc Ronald McDonald example of Ray Croc is the
Speaker 1: power behind the the movement, whereas people know Ronald McDonald
Speaker 1: and think that he runs McDonald's, but it's really the
Speaker 1: person in power. So I knew you were the person
Speaker 1: in power. And I've just always been one too observed
Speaker 1: from afar. So I was about to say this is
Speaker 1: probably the most we've ever been in a room together
Speaker 1: speaking in our decades history. So usually I hands down,
Speaker 1: you scare the ship out. No, I study people. I'm
Speaker 1: getting to be told. I'm I'm working on that. Um.
Speaker 1: I'm so insular and in my shell that I don't
Speaker 1: even with Stevie want there. I mean, they're they're luminaries
Speaker 1: who like, hey, let's go out the dinner, let's hang
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I'm cool. I'm cool. I've been that
Speaker 1: way for a long time. I'm just slowly getting out
Speaker 1: of that that that that Rapunzel protective phase of my life.
Speaker 1: So um, but no, back then, I used it for
Speaker 1: everything it was worth. I mean I made I think
Speaker 1: that was the day that I became friends with Chuck
Speaker 1: and Hank um Uh Chuck d and Hank Shockley of
Speaker 1: Public Enemy, and I am yeah, Oh really I was
Speaker 1: not yeah, because I tried to explain that because mere
Speaker 1: you like what every year I am, you like evolved
Speaker 1: and matriculated like you was intern one year, then I
Speaker 1: remember you did like the Showcase. Another year you went
Speaker 1: the Roots, and then in this year you did a
Speaker 1: tribute to like Jazzy Jeff or something. Do you remember
Speaker 1: when when I had the Roots at the Kennedy Center.
Speaker 1: Do you remember? I remember that was speking to a group,
Speaker 1: you performed and talked to a group of kids. I
Speaker 1: think that was the public enemy performance thing. Yes, I
Speaker 1: remember all four of my I am they were crucial.
Speaker 1: I will say, probably the greatest night of my life. Okay,
Speaker 1: I've seen and where did you meet? Where did you
Speaker 1: meet in in your penthouse suite? And was on the piano? Yes,
Speaker 1: it was post an event that I honored. I was
Speaker 1: gonna say that was probably the first magical night for
Speaker 1: for a career at that point where it was sort
Speaker 1: of like I don't belong in the room, that sort
Speaker 1: of thing that was. That was a moment where the
Speaker 1: best part of that night was um sitting with Andre Fisher,
Speaker 1: uh drummer with Rufus and uh he was there with Natalie.
Speaker 1: So I said, I basically had my first quest of
Speaker 1: supreme with Andre Fisher and Natalie Cole. While Stevie wonders
Speaker 1: this casually going through his cavalcade, oh hits in the
Speaker 1: in the in the piano in the week. It was
Speaker 1: like three hours, like to the point where you go on, boy,
Speaker 1: like he's doing creeping. Let me go sit down. When
Speaker 1: I come back, maybe he'll be on the sur duke.
Speaker 1: And I think we should explain I am. I did.
Speaker 1: I produced an annual music celebration, a conference that had panels, luncheons,
Speaker 1: and gala, a gala where we honored everybody from Little
Speaker 1: Jimmy Scott to Shaka Khan, Stevie Wonder, baby Face, l
Speaker 1: a Read New addition, tons of people, and this went
Speaker 1: on for sixteen years. I gotta ask, Okay, how hard
Speaker 1: is it to organize? Because I don't feel like you're
Speaker 1: the press. I don't feel like you're the Ray Crock
Speaker 1: in the position of they got this. I feel like
Speaker 1: your hands on you talk to people, I mean you
Speaker 1: talk to us, and we were not through you know,
Speaker 1: like then, so I felt as though you had your
Speaker 1: imprint on literally every aspect of from from the smallest
Speaker 1: uh talking session to the networking part of the night
Speaker 1: to the big gall of dinner. How hard was it
Speaker 1: two manage, micromanage whatever. How hard was it to organize
Speaker 1: that event? It was challenging, but I also had a
Speaker 1: lot of energy and again the passion and commitment to
Speaker 1: preserve and promote our music, and like you said, I
Speaker 1: wasn't even aware that Hank Shockley was there. I mean
Speaker 1: there was, so everybody came, Jenny Riley, every Jimmy Caster,
Speaker 1: everybody came. It was just the magnet for artists. And
Speaker 1: again because of me being on the radio one too,
Speaker 1: because of my relationship with Gamble uh three, my partner
Speaker 1: at the time also had a lot of relationships, so
Speaker 1: it facilitated. And I'm a passionate letter writer. I'm a
Speaker 1: letter writing motherfucker. Okay, So my letters just again the
Speaker 1: passion that I have for our culture and music. So
Speaker 1: I got all those people. I paid no one. All
Speaker 1: the years that people came in and did tributes, I
Speaker 1: did not pay anybody. Is it is it important to
Speaker 1: remember names and make connections? And absolutely it's you know this,
Speaker 1: it's a relationship business. Think of all of us. It's
Speaker 1: all about your relationships and how you connect with people.
Speaker 1: It's a give and take. So relationships can get you
Speaker 1: places sometimes where even money came. Absolutely, at the end
Speaker 1: of the day is how you feel about another pole
Speaker 1: with somebody, it don't even matter. The check is so good.
Speaker 1: So with for instance, with the Roots, I mean you know,
Speaker 1: and you know, Rich was a tough one, but I
Speaker 1: went passionately and I thought you guys were very talented.
Speaker 1: I recognized that's the other thing. I have a good year,
Speaker 1: and I for talent. Back to M Too May, who
Speaker 1: I know that you guys have had on the show.
Speaker 1: M Toumay introduced me to Spike Lee. We were at
Speaker 1: a party in Brooklyn. He had just finished shooting She's
Speaker 1: Got to Have It just finished and I met Spike
Speaker 1: and I love cinema, so immediately I was interested in
Speaker 1: his film and him and that's when we started developing
Speaker 1: our friendship. And then it's one point he's like, you
Speaker 1: and Stevie Wonder are friends. I was like, yeah, he said,
Speaker 1: I would love to meet Stevie. Him up. He wrote
Speaker 1: about it in his books. I introduced Spike Lee to
Speaker 1: Stevie one, I wrote Stevie and I said, I called him.
Speaker 1: I said, Stevelyn talented filmmaker. I think he is going
Speaker 1: to be one of the most brilliant directors of our time.
Speaker 1: And of course that has come to pass. So yes,
Speaker 1: I'm very proud of that introduction. So you are a
Speaker 1: bridge what other bridge connections many many, many, many many.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm I want I just I like us connecting.
Speaker 1: I like us being productive from the energy that we create.
Speaker 1: I love that. And like I said, I think what
Speaker 1: makes me a great artist development coach is that I'm
Speaker 1: interested in seeing people reach their maximum potential. So it's
Speaker 1: a lot of connections. I mean, I feel, as I
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier in our conversation, I am attracted to the gifted.
Speaker 1: I am a tracked it to the talented timp I'm
Speaker 1: attracted to people who are exceptional and I have been
Speaker 1: blessed to have had relationships with these people through the
Speaker 1: course of my experience, and it feeds me. It gives
Speaker 1: me the energy to propel me further to help others.
Speaker 1: I believe I was put on this planet to inspire.
Speaker 1: I'm amused. I'm real clear on what I am. I
Speaker 1: am immune. So I want to say, somebody say, Donald Doling, Baby,
Speaker 1: I've been told that that was written for me. Just
Speaker 1: cussed a lot, yeah, yeah, lots of songs. I mean,
Speaker 1: George Cables wrote Ebony Moonbeams. He's a piano player, and
Speaker 1: I was told that he heard my song my um
Speaker 1: My Show and wrote it. And then Bobby Hutchinson recorded
Speaker 1: um Ebony Moonbeams and then Freddie Hubbard, who was a friend,
Speaker 1: recorded Ebony Moonbeams. So, uh yeah, so where's that name
Speaker 1: any Moonbeams come from? I was walking down the street
Speaker 1: in New York. I was starting a TV show while
Speaker 1: I was at City College in New York. I went
Speaker 1: in as a major. Had to change that real quick,
Speaker 1: I told you, because that wasn't working. And I saw
Speaker 1: a spotlight going through the moon and I needed a
Speaker 1: name for my show, and I was like, oh, there's
Speaker 1: a moonbeam, and everything at that time was black, right, ebony,
Speaker 1: So I just put Ebony Moonbeams together and that was
Speaker 1: the birth of my radio handle while I was in
Speaker 1: d C. And it's just kind of followed me all
Speaker 1: my life. In fact, Gamble calls me Moonbeams to this day,
Speaker 1: so that's kind of like his name for me. But yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, I always wanted and I've met presidents
Speaker 1: and leaders and all manner of celebrity and people, but
Speaker 1: the person that I wanted to meet the most was
Speaker 1: Gordon Parks. As a young girl, I saw an exhibition
Speaker 1: called Harlem on My Mind at the Metropolitan Museum and
Speaker 1: that just I saw the photographs of Gordon Parks for
Speaker 1: the first time. And James Vanderzy and I just became
Speaker 1: totally enamored with their narrative and how they documented not
Speaker 1: just black people, but people period. And so for me,
Speaker 1: my mission became meeting Gordon Parks. And I spent an
Speaker 1: inordinate amount of time trying to figure out who I knew,
Speaker 1: who could introduce me to him and what have you.
Speaker 1: And I was not very successful. Yes, yes, absolutely absolutely
Speaker 1: did you ever get to meet him? Well, again I
Speaker 1: told you I'm a passionate letter writer. Yes, I kept
Speaker 1: writing him. I kept writing until one day he had
Speaker 1: a vicious gatekeeper. Her name is Joanna Fiora Fiori. She
Speaker 1: is a photographer, but she was his assistant as well,
Speaker 1: and she was like, well, Mr Parks is busy. Mr
Speaker 1: Parks is sick. Mr was always an excuse. And then
Speaker 1: finally one day, because I never stopped writing him, kept
Speaker 1: writing him, telling him how his photography, his art. For
Speaker 1: many who do not know, Gordon Parks directed Chaff The
Speaker 1: Learning Tree. He's um he was a great director in
Speaker 1: addition to being a fabulous photographer and a writer. And
Speaker 1: then one day I got the call, Mr Parks would
Speaker 1: like to invite you to his home for lunch and
Speaker 1: so needless to say, the day he opened the door
Speaker 1: and I saw him, just is pinching myself and we'd
Speaker 1: be wearing a white button down. Yeah, he sure was.
Speaker 1: His shirt was kind of open. It was just like
Speaker 1: a real sexy and but we became really good friends,
Speaker 1: to the point where the day of his memorial service,
Speaker 1: I went and his daughter came over to me and said,
Speaker 1: you know, my father spoke very fondly of you, and
Speaker 1: that meant everything to me because he was very dear
Speaker 1: to me. We were very very close friends. Uh, hip
Speaker 1: hop historians, you shouldn't know that court in Parks shot
Speaker 1: the Great Day in Harlem. Yes, did he shoot yall
Speaker 1: remix No REMI Yeah, he shot that. Yeah, that was
Speaker 1: that was his his shot. Um. It was really weird,
Speaker 1: like it was that day septem the whatever a black
Speaker 1: star and love movement, Like that day was such a
Speaker 1: surreal day in hip hop history. And he just stayed
Speaker 1: he first of all, Um, I think the camera at
Speaker 1: the time, Sheina Lester was still uh editor at Double Excel.
Speaker 1: So you know again, uh, you want to meet Mr
Speaker 1: I just want to watch him. So I just like
Speaker 1: watched him from Afar and and it was so chaotic
Speaker 1: that day because that was really the day that classic
Speaker 1: hip hop and kind of current hip hop was meeting
Speaker 1: for the first time. So you're watching like rock him,
Speaker 1: rock him losing it over. Tarik was one of the
Speaker 1: weirdest things in my life ever seen. And like the
Speaker 1: Locks meeting, like all these Grandmaster Flash and all them,
Speaker 1: but he just stood there so cool and behind a
Speaker 1: camera that was easily I forget, I forget what brand
Speaker 1: it was, like, that's what I was just about to say.
Speaker 1: I like, yeah, it was a seventy one, I believe
Speaker 1: its camera and uh, he just he took eight shots
Speaker 1: and then Coolie walked, He packed his things and walked off.
Speaker 1: He was one of the most humble people that I
Speaker 1: ever met for being in his category for real. I
Speaker 1: mean he could play the piano, he did, he did orchestrations,
Speaker 1: wrote symphonies. What was it about his work that attracted you?
Speaker 1: Because in what particular area? Because he did so many things.
Speaker 1: Photography again, I saw Harlem on my mind as a
Speaker 1: young girl. The photographs captured what I what I knew,
Speaker 1: what I had could relate to seeing our people. I
Speaker 1: just think he had a tremendous eye for capturing the pain,
Speaker 1: the sorrow, the law, the tenderness, all of that I
Speaker 1: just got from him. It was just so black, you know,
Speaker 1: just so black and so Yeah, one question um I had,
Speaker 1: going back to just your artist development work, how in
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen with Twitter too, how do you manage that
Speaker 1: it being a time where artists can literally I can
Speaker 1: be three o'clock in the morning drunk off my ass
Speaker 1: at home in my not me person. I don't get drunk. Well,
Speaker 1: let me be good. Let be good. I ain't gonna
Speaker 1: get drunk on Twitter. Let's say that. But but you
Speaker 1: know where people can artists can literally get canceled, say
Speaker 1: what they want and get canceled with no filter, and
Speaker 1: there's a direct line from them to the rest of
Speaker 1: the world. How do you manage that in twenty nineteen?
Speaker 1: And what is your advice to to artists in this
Speaker 1: era where one week can get your ship down. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I review my clients Twitter, their social media before I
Speaker 1: work with them, and I'll go in very early and
Speaker 1: say to them, you need to stay off of social media.
Speaker 1: I had to do that with Nicky Gilbert. She was
Speaker 1: doing the show and she was fighting with everybody, was
Speaker 1: a constant fight in her social media, and I said,
Speaker 1: you need to stay off um social media thirty days.
Speaker 1: That's all I'm asking, stay off. And she she later
Speaker 1: told me, she said, thank you for that. You saved
Speaker 1: my life because she was so stressed out fighting with
Speaker 1: people and bickering and arguing. So I'll review. Some people
Speaker 1: are really good with their social media, but I've warned
Speaker 1: them and I tell them, you're as you just said, Fonte,
Speaker 1: you can ruin your career and one tweet. So when
Speaker 1: you write it, look at it. I've had to do
Speaker 1: that many many times, haven't you. Where you write something
Speaker 1: and you're like, what are the what are the implications
Speaker 1: of consequence? You end up not hitting That's what I
Speaker 1: don't just delete that ship. So yeah, wow, speaking, that's
Speaker 1: where we are. I was going to ask you about
Speaker 1: being in a me too error, uh current Joe Biden
Speaker 1: error where you have relationships with men of of all
Speaker 1: different kind of eras and for women. I was going
Speaker 1: to ask you advice on that because especially post Joe Biden,
Speaker 1: where we're trying to figure out what's appropriate. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: and you've been through it all because you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: you have to gauge and and check people. If you
Speaker 1: are not that person that likes a hug, just extend
Speaker 1: your hand. Be real clear, this is not a hug,
Speaker 1: This is a handshake. Um. You know, your body language
Speaker 1: tells volumes, speaks volumes about you know, you can set
Speaker 1: um boundaries with people, and you have to do that sometimes,
Speaker 1: but sometimes people do not respect the boundaries and they'll
Speaker 1: come in for a hug, and if you don't want
Speaker 1: it at that point, you just have to you know,
Speaker 1: you have to speak up and be very honest. You
Speaker 1: just cannot if you feel that you're being offended or
Speaker 1: people are doing something that is disturbing to you. Hey,
Speaker 1: the clothes mouth does not get fed. You got to
Speaker 1: speak up like they're going to get the point. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you have to let them know too, because you can't
Speaker 1: assume that. Hey, you can't assume they know and then
Speaker 1: be I think it's unfair to assume that they're doing
Speaker 1: it with bad intentions, you know what I'm saying, Like,
Speaker 1: if someone comes in for a hug and you're not
Speaker 1: with it, you I feel like you just have to
Speaker 1: say that because exactly speak up. Like today, you know,
Speaker 1: when I arrived at the studio, Fante gave me a
Speaker 1: hug that I did not want to relieve. I mean
Speaker 1: that was who does not want that kind of hug?
Speaker 1: I mean you feel like you're being hugged. Okay, I
Speaker 1: accepted it, well played or you know, people, I can't
Speaker 1: replace it. But when you see how they have cut
Speaker 1: together the Biden videos, it looks creepy. You know, he's
Speaker 1: like this touching the child's forehead, the chin, under the neck,
Speaker 1: and he's still and still he was the vice president.
Speaker 1: So it's also for some women who don't say stuff,
Speaker 1: is like, well, can he affect my life? If I
Speaker 1: tell his mother to get off me? Is he gonna
Speaker 1: be like, hey, fun her? I don't right Again, you
Speaker 1: have to decide your what, your space and you and
Speaker 1: if you don't speak up, then that's kind of on you.
Speaker 1: If you are feeling uncomfortable with someone at any time, man, woman,
Speaker 1: anything like I went over to a girlfriend's house recently
Speaker 1: and her dog kept humping me, you know, and I
Speaker 1: had to be like, yo, get your dog, get your dog,
Speaker 1: and she put the dog in the cage, you know,
Speaker 1: to your Michael Vick point, like just like what was
Speaker 1: take Diana on the Beyonce kiss the Mari's a friend, Okay.
Speaker 1: I was like, what happened? Okay, I don't know. Was
Speaker 1: that some awards show? Uh? Mari Hardwick. He greeted Beyonce
Speaker 1: and first he came in and he gave her like
Speaker 1: kiss on the cheek, hugged there and it was like
Speaker 1: no problem, and then he went back for the double tap.
Speaker 1: He kissed again and it looked kind of from you
Speaker 1: never addressed jay Z right who was sitting. That is
Speaker 1: not accurate. It started with jay Z here first and
Speaker 1: then walked around him to Beyonce, hugged her kiss turn.
Speaker 1: Were they in the movie together? I think no, I
Speaker 1: don't think so. But they ever worked together? I don't know.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe they've known each other some obviously. But it
Speaker 1: was a double kiss and double the double tap. But
Speaker 1: you know what happened? She, I think kind of moved
Speaker 1: so it almost when he kissed her looked like he
Speaker 1: was kissing her close to her mouth. Power. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I think it's just but he people the Beehive came
Speaker 1: for him. They were like, yo, Y're wrong, that's about
Speaker 1: but our man was standing right there. He is not
Speaker 1: a disrespectful person, I know, Amari. He's a good guy
Speaker 1: and Layah, that wasn't nice. It wasn't but it wasn't
Speaker 1: and I got it from her. Okay, okay, so before
Speaker 1: we wrap, Yes, what is next for you? You've she's
Speaker 1: gonna media coach Bill Sherman at Harvard. You've traveled to
Speaker 1: South Africa for what do you in politics next? No?
Speaker 1: Not at all? Out at all. That's just too confining.
Speaker 1: That's not a book. Yeah, you haven't written books, but
Speaker 1: I approached Yeah, right, letters, I should do collect letters.
Speaker 1: But if you write a book, will people feel certainly? Well?
Speaker 1: You know, I respect that. Like even the stories I
Speaker 1: shared with you there there's I didn't tell you anything
Speaker 1: super private. Uh and and nothing that I don't think
Speaker 1: my clients would be adverse to me sharing. But I
Speaker 1: have been approached to write a book. Um, I'm interested
Speaker 1: in documentaries. My long game always was producing documentaries. So
Speaker 1: that's why Fante being on Unsung suits me. I did
Speaker 1: executive produce, the co executive produced the episode on Teddy Pendergrass. Uh.
Speaker 1: And that were your thoughts on the Teddy documentary? Oh,
Speaker 1: I just watched because I watched it, and I mean,
Speaker 1: I like, be honest, but you know, nothing last the
Speaker 1: way you. So I watched it. I think I should
Speaker 1: give you context. I watched it with his widow, Joan Pendergrass,
Speaker 1: who is a dear friend. I watched it with Olivia Lynchenstein,
Speaker 1: who is the director, her associate, Tyrese and the sister
Speaker 1: who runs his company, and Charlie Mack. We had a
Speaker 1: private screening. He absolutely well. He was like a son
Speaker 1: to Teddy, and Teddy hand picked him. Charlie Mack is
Speaker 1: the one who approached Teddy and said, need to do
Speaker 1: your biopic, and he introduced Tyrese to Teddy. Tyrese slept
Speaker 1: in the room in the hospital. Teddy was in the
Speaker 1: hospital nine months in intensive care before his passing. Tyrese
Speaker 1: came from California slept in the room with him. I
Speaker 1: will forever love him for his devotion, his dedication to Teddy.
Speaker 1: It was more than a movie. They developed a very
Speaker 1: strong bond and Teddy gave his blessings to have Tyrese
Speaker 1: portray him in the biopic, which is now official. Lee
Speaker 1: Daniels is directing. But back to the documentary. I watched
Speaker 1: it and I was extremely happy to hear my friend's voice,
Speaker 1: to see him when he was able body walking all
Speaker 1: of that, there was footage that I had never previously seen.
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day I read Olivia.
Speaker 1: At the end of the documentary, I felt very disrespected
Speaker 1: for my ex Kenny Gamble. I felt that Sheep Gordon
Speaker 1: made comments suggesting that Gamble and Huff abandoned Teddy, which
Speaker 1: is the furthest thing from the truth. Teddy did not
Speaker 1: think he could sing anymore. Teddy didn't want to live.
Speaker 1: Teddy wanted to commit suicide. So when Gamble and Huff
Speaker 1: severed their relationship recording wise with Teddy, what what The
Speaker 1: man was on the edge of life and didn't think
Speaker 1: he could sing, So that's what happened. But the way
Speaker 1: Sheep was representing it and the way she was representing
Speaker 1: also didn't like the mouth of time they spent on
Speaker 1: the taz Lang murder. That was bothering bothersome because Teddy
Speaker 1: left it open. But a little in prince here that
Speaker 1: Teddy was involved or who who had the most to
Speaker 1: gain from her death? So what were your feelings on
Speaker 1: on Sonny Hobson's comments, Same thing, same thing. Sonny has
Speaker 1: been running around for years making allegations in undows or
Speaker 1: suggestions that Teddy was involved in that, so of course
Speaker 1: I have problems with that as well. And uh so,
Speaker 1: you know, I let her know, and Joan Pendergrass opened
Speaker 1: up her husband's archives to Olivia. They made three separate
Speaker 1: trips to Boston, which is where Teddy's widow lives, where
Speaker 1: she opened up the archives. So it was nice to
Speaker 1: hear Teddy's voice because he pretty much guided the documentary.
Speaker 1: He narrated it because he she had access to those tapes.
Speaker 1: She did not mentioned Joan. She interviewed Joan, but decided
Speaker 1: to exclude reference to Joan. And meanwhile, I saw I
Speaker 1: didn't know all the Teddy's girlfriends, but I knew the
Speaker 1: main ones, and I saw a bunch of random chicks
Speaker 1: up in that documentary that Joan never knew of. I
Speaker 1: didn't know anything about. It was crazy. So at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, it had value because it did
Speaker 1: tell some of his story. But I felt disrespected because
Speaker 1: of how she treated Joan and um the inferences or
Speaker 1: suggestions that Teddy was involved in tas his murder, and
Speaker 1: that Gamble and Huff abandoned Teddy. Gamble helped pay for
Speaker 1: Teddy's funeral. Gamble went to the hospital. I would bump
Speaker 1: into gamble with our children in brent More Hospital. I
Speaker 1: never once saw chev Gordon, nor did I ever see
Speaker 1: Danny Marcus in the hospital. However, Danny knew how to
Speaker 1: find his way to a telephone to ask Joan when
Speaker 1: Teddy died, could he represent the estate the same person
Speaker 1: Danny Marcus was manager, a manager of UM with Sheep
Speaker 1: Gordon of Teddy. Yeah, and when Teddy needed financial help
Speaker 1: and went to Danny. But when he died they wanted
Speaker 1: to be in control of the estate. Problems with those people.
Speaker 1: And I'm happy to have this opportunity to go on
Speaker 1: the record and say again parts of the documentary had
Speaker 1: value and we're good, and then the parts just negated
Speaker 1: a lot of it. To me and with Joan. I
Speaker 1: told the director, I said, you could have Chiron at
Speaker 1: the end, because they Chiron at the end of the film.
Speaker 1: Uh that Teddy went on to have four gold albums.
Speaker 1: But not only did Teddy go on to have four albums,
Speaker 1: he got his g e d. He went to Drexel University,
Speaker 1: he fell in love again and he married Joan. Yes, sir,
Speaker 1: he went to college. He did not graduate, but he
Speaker 1: attended Drexel University, she could have Chiron that Annie established
Speaker 1: a foundation to help other um paralegics and quads. He
Speaker 1: was a quadriplegic. So I just felt, like, you know,
Speaker 1: she said, oh, we decided to end it. It Live
Speaker 1: aid By the way, I went with him that day
Speaker 1: to live aid Um. That was his first public performance
Speaker 1: post his accident. He was terrified, but he got through it.
Speaker 1: So I encourage people to still see the doc. But
Speaker 1: at the same time, you know, now you're hearing my notes,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of behind the scenes. Can I asks, Okay,
Speaker 1: since we kind of brought up tests, is there anything
Speaker 1: can you explain what the environment was like in Philadelphia
Speaker 1: at least with the legend of was the was the
Speaker 1: was the junior black MANFIA trying to get in the
Speaker 1: music business or like I mean again, I'm I only
Speaker 1: here things in hindsight, like thirty years forty years after
Speaker 1: the fact, But what was the presence of them in
Speaker 1: Philadelphia at all? Is there anything you can speak on? No,
Speaker 1: I just I mean everywhere you got black mafia's, you
Speaker 1: got them, you got the mafia everywhere, You've got organized
Speaker 1: crime involved in unorganized and organized living. But I'm just
Speaker 1: saying it was so different back, especially Okay and Joe
Speaker 1: and Sylvia Robinson. Yeah, I was pretty sheltered from all
Speaker 1: of that. A mirror. I just didn't I didn't even
Speaker 1: in radio and stuff. Yeah, but I didn't did They
Speaker 1: didn't mess with me. I was Kenny Gambles woman. I didn't.
Speaker 1: I was insulated from that. I didn't have to deal
Speaker 1: with that I even personally. But I mean it there was,
Speaker 1: it was. I'm saying, it was there, it is, it
Speaker 1: is here, it is everywhere. Yes, okay, yeah, but I
Speaker 1: was a little I said, protected an insula. Okay, it's
Speaker 1: just part of life. Good answer. I don't know that real,
Speaker 1: real talk, actual actual good but you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I want to take a moment to thank you all
Speaker 1: for having me today because I respect what you do.
Speaker 1: Having an opportunity to have long form discussions about the
Speaker 1: history and the culture is significant. So the role that
Speaker 1: each of you play with this broadcast, with your podcast
Speaker 1: is significant. And personally, I'm so very proud of Layah
Speaker 1: because I changed her diapers. I was the fact that
Speaker 1: she holds her own with you gentlemen, because you're all formidable,
Speaker 1: as is she. But but but you do it. But
Speaker 1: you do it. And I'm very proud of her because
Speaker 1: in the entertainment game, she has so many capacities as
Speaker 1: a woman in this business, as a professional, and uh,
Speaker 1: I love her. I love sending to her on the radio,
Speaker 1: I love watching her on TV, and I think that
Speaker 1: promise well you guys, Yeah, well that's fine, and I'll
Speaker 1: take some of the credit because I support her. I
Speaker 1: believe in her. She represents the now in the future
Speaker 1: for me as a woman in this game. So I'm
Speaker 1: very proud of you. I love you dearly. And uh,
Speaker 1: all I can say is bravo the first that I
Speaker 1: can't wait to officiate your wedding. I'm available a mirror
Speaker 1: if you should ever get married. I'm feeling to do
Speaker 1: that lost Fonte already. But how about that. I love
Speaker 1: Fonta and when he was talking about Nicolai because I
Speaker 1: love the foreign exchange, and so I developed a friendship
Speaker 1: with Nicolay and that's how I met Fonti. She brought
Speaker 1: them back. Man, do you so, can I tell the
Speaker 1: DM stories that or does that? This is the moment
Speaker 1: I really met Diana Williams and she revealed more about me,
Speaker 1: revealed more about her than any interview in anything. Okay.
Speaker 1: So we had met backstage at the at the World
Speaker 1: Cafe Live thing, and so from that point on, like
Speaker 1: we follow each other on Twitter and everything, and so
Speaker 1: we're talking on Twitter one night and it was late
Speaker 1: one night, and um, I don't remember what we were
Speaker 1: talking about, but it was talking about something on the
Speaker 1: timeline and then we like we got into the d
Speaker 1: M s and so we were laughing out something. So
Speaker 1: I just said, I was like, oh, sire you being
Speaker 1: it was good to meet you everything, and she was like, Fante,
Speaker 1: I'm tired, and I you know, immediately I was just saying,
Speaker 1: I said, okay, well, I'm thinking I'm ain't even working
Speaker 1: so hard, you know, like, what's what's going on? And
Speaker 1: she gives me the greatest response that let me know
Speaker 1: that she was the illest. She said, I'm tired of niggas,
Speaker 1: said I am too, and that so much that let
Speaker 1: me know. I said, Yo, she the realist one out.
Speaker 1: From that point on, we've been cool. I said, listen
Speaker 1: because she's so eloquent and so, you know, because you said,
Speaker 1: like her everything's classic and she just said I'm kind
Speaker 1: of niggas. Boy, I felt that ship in my soul
Speaker 1: on behalf of Like Yeah, Fonte, Boss Bill, Unpaid Bill, Sugar,
Speaker 1: Steve and myself Niggas. Yeah, thank you coming on the shelf.
Speaker 1: It's been a long time. Yeah, it's Love Supreme, Pura.
Speaker 1: We will see you on the next Girl Round. Thank you.
Speaker 1: What's Love Supreme. It's a production of My Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to
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