Speaker 1: Welcome to Guys We Fucked. Guys We Guys Book. I'm Christina,
Speaker 1: I'm Coren're sorry about last night the anti sluck shaming podcast.
Speaker 1: I never stopped. Hello, fucker's Welcome to another episode of
Speaker 1: Guys We Fucked. It's the anti shaming podcast. I'm Karn,
Speaker 1: I'm Christina and this episode is sponsored by Louis c. K.
Speaker 1: It's a new comedy special on Netflix. Uh Kart and
Speaker 1: I have watched it, and holy shit, I did didn't
Speaker 1: realize a responsoring until I we. I went to get
Speaker 1: all the ads for today's intro and I'm like, this
Speaker 1: is so cool because it is the best special I've
Speaker 1: ever seen. Um trading his usual black shirt and jeans
Speaker 1: for a suit and tie, comedy star Louis c K
Speaker 1: is ready to get down to business with his latest
Speaker 1: comedy special, which explores the misery and hilarity of life
Speaker 1: in two thousand seventeen and when the suit goes on,
Speaker 1: the truth comes out. Watch Louis c K, seen now
Speaker 1: streaming only on Netflix. Seriously, this is one of the
Speaker 1: funniest fucking comedy specials you will ever watch in your life.
Speaker 1: So treat yourself and laugh. Yeah, we both cried laughing.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, which is not? Which is tough? Yeah,
Speaker 1: well it's not tough for me. I cry laughing all
Speaker 1: the time. Oh I don't. We'll come Cee s Live
Speaker 1: if you want to cry laughing. Friday, a Glamour Post
Speaker 1: is happening co hosted by myself and Wendy's Darling at
Speaker 1: Zig Bar in the West Village, eighty two West third Street,
Speaker 1: seven thirty pm. Ticket link is in the description of
Speaker 1: his podcast. And then Saturday, April twenty nine, the next
Speaker 1: night it's Nacho Bitches at eleven fifteen pm at New
Speaker 1: York Comedy Club, co hosted by myself and Blair Saki.
Speaker 1: Tickets are ten dollars with code Nacho. And then the
Speaker 1: next night, if you want to make it the three
Speaker 1: for Sunday April, we're doing the Comedian Project at the
Speaker 1: Stand which is in Manhattan on the Third Avenue, and
Speaker 1: ticket links and info will be in the description for
Speaker 1: all those Chicka pe Massachusetts. Tonight we're gonna be at
Speaker 1: the HOOKI lau Cam hang with us on good drinks.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, yes, and then we're Austin sold out.
Speaker 1: I think, oh okay, it's there. You can't buy tickets anymore,
Speaker 1: but you might if you get a festival pass. I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure it sold out. Oh yeah. And then on Sunday, April,
Speaker 1: we're in Houston, Texas at Warehouse Live. Las Vegas, Nevada,
Speaker 1: Thursday eighteenth, Saturday May, we're gonna be in town for
Speaker 1: the Crap Shoot Coming Festival y'all. Thursday June first, Minneapolis, Minnesota,
Speaker 1: We're at the Women's Club. Tickets are available now, I
Speaker 1: put them on the perfect um. Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Whe Are you?
Speaker 1: Where are you at? Are you in Milwaukee? We'll come
Speaker 1: to see us Friday June second at the Pep Theater.
Speaker 1: And then Chicago, Illinois. We are coming back on Saturday,
Speaker 1: June three, we're doing the fourth Annual Annual Comedy Festival.
Speaker 1: Two shows. There's a seven pm and a ten pm
Speaker 1: both at Taiya Hall. Uh. And don't forget, we still
Speaker 1: have merchandise available on our website, so just go to
Speaker 1: storry about Last Night Comedy dot com, go to the
Speaker 1: merch section and it'll link you to that. We do
Speaker 1: bring a limited amount of merchandise to all our tour dates,
Speaker 1: but Christine and I have to carry them and Honestly,
Speaker 1: we're really heavy and voice to carry of them for us.
Speaker 1: They were like little yeah, so we can only do that. Um.
Speaker 1: And if you are sad tweeting us on Twitter saying
Speaker 1: that you've already binge listened to all of our episodes,
Speaker 1: guess what we got bonus episodes, Um, and they're really
Speaker 1: fucking fun. We do a bonus episode of Guys We
Speaker 1: Fucked once every two weeks and if you go to
Speaker 1: howl dot FM, slash GWF, you can hear these bonus episodes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Sometimes I'm high and I'm drunk, so you know you're
Speaker 1: in for a ride. But this week's bonus episode is
Speaker 1: really exciting because we interviewed Daisy Coleman from the Netflix
Speaker 1: documentary Audrey and Daisy, and we asked her some questions
Speaker 1: I have to do with raight, but we also like
Speaker 1: get into like what do you like to do? It
Speaker 1: was really fun. Yeah, it was a good time she
Speaker 1: was in town and it all worked out. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much to another sponsor for today's episode. It's left
Speaker 1: I tall lift all the time. You know lift, it's
Speaker 1: the car service that comes really fast. You know what
Speaker 1: else comes really fast? My ex Bryant. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I never did, but no lift is free. I use
Speaker 1: Lift multiple times a week. I use regular lifts. Sometimes
Speaker 1: when I'm feeling fancy, I also use lift Line. Lift
Speaker 1: Line is super great because, unlike some other services, they
Speaker 1: only pick up max two riders, so it's not you're
Speaker 1: not going around. I'm picking everyone up every three a
Speaker 1: clown group of clowns for the circus, because I mean
Speaker 1: sometimes that gets rough. Safety is lifts number one priority.
Speaker 1: Every driver is fully vetted through a ten point safety standard,
Speaker 1: including third party criminal n d MB background checks. Every
Speaker 1: car has to pass a nineteen point vehicle inspection for
Speaker 1: your safety and comfort. Lift even has an industry leading
Speaker 1: insurance plan protecting you the moment your lift driver picks
Speaker 1: you up. And with lift you can tip on the app,
Speaker 1: which you know seems not cool for you, but the
Speaker 1: drivers really are. They are just happier. That's the company
Speaker 1: they really prefer drive for. I talked to my drivers, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's there there. They treat them really well. It's a
Speaker 1: good company. It allows the drivers to have like a
Speaker 1: personal life, so that's nice. And right now Lift is
Speaker 1: offering our listeners a special deal for new users get
Speaker 1: three free rides up to ten dollars each. That's up
Speaker 1: to a three dollar value if you're good at math
Speaker 1: when you enter promo code g w f D. Just
Speaker 1: download the free Lift app today and enter promo code
Speaker 1: g w f D in the payment section. You'll start
Speaker 1: with the three free rides and um, that's it. You'll
Speaker 1: have a great time and you'll get home safely if
Speaker 1: you're drinking too much. Sometimes when I drink too much,
Speaker 1: I shot my pants and I have to get new underwear.
Speaker 1: And um, you guys, if you've ever been in that
Speaker 1: same situation, you're in luck because we're also sponsored by
Speaker 1: me Andy's heid Ride. Sorry, if you've been settling for
Speaker 1: store broad underwear five packs, I have something that will
Speaker 1: change your life for the better. Me Andy's Uh there're
Speaker 1: seriously soft, feel good underwear that gets delivered right to
Speaker 1: your door. If you use the special U R L
Speaker 1: ME meandies dot Com slash GWF you get off your
Speaker 1: first pair. Okay, and guess what you could save up
Speaker 1: to thirty three percent each month with a monthly subscription plan.
Speaker 1: You just select your size, your style, and the plan
Speaker 1: you want, and Means will send you under your underwear
Speaker 1: that you'll think, swoon, oh, you'll swoon for each month.
Speaker 1: I can't read out loud. Shut up. But if you're
Speaker 1: not ready for a subscription, that's okay. You could still
Speaker 1: save money because me and is offering you twenty off.
Speaker 1: Like I said, I put the bullet points not in
Speaker 1: the right order, but you fucking get what I'm trying
Speaker 1: to say. Just use the specially U r L meandies
Speaker 1: dot com slash GWF and getf your first pair. So
Speaker 1: go ahead, revamp your underwear drawer, be an adult, give
Speaker 1: your ass the modal fabric that it deserves. Once again,
Speaker 1: that's meanes dot com slash GWF me Andy's Oh oh,
Speaker 1: and I didn't put the names in there, but we
Speaker 1: got to read the names. Okay, Well could do that,
Speaker 1: I guess after Yes, So it's it has been a
Speaker 1: very interesting week for me because I did what I've
Speaker 1: been talking about for a long time. This was one
Speaker 1: of my New Year's resolutions, and I've been working on
Speaker 1: it since January. It is now April. If you noticed, uh,
Speaker 1: and I adopted a dog my gun and the dog
Speaker 1: is sitting on my chair and I want to cry.
Speaker 1: It's so cute. Yes, this is sir Alfred Hitchcock and
Speaker 1: that is his name, as I had promised myself. It's
Speaker 1: his first ever episode of Guys We Fucked and he's
Speaker 1: a sleep He's like he's sleeping through it. Woke up,
Speaker 1: which is fun. Are you having fun? Yeah? Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: just it's been a very like emotional week because Alfred's
Speaker 1: he's a puppy. He's right now, I think about twenty
Speaker 1: weeks old, and I like, when I started my search,
Speaker 1: I was looking for like a one or two year
Speaker 1: old dog, because that's like, you're not going to pay
Speaker 1: on your floor. I'm young, but you can also have
Speaker 1: a life. And then I was thinking about it and
Speaker 1: looking at a lot of dogs and I saw Alfred,
Speaker 1: and uh I thought about it for a long time,
Speaker 1: as as you must do if you're going to adopt
Speaker 1: an animal. Yeah, you probably gave that more thought than
Speaker 1: a lot of people do. And Kevin kids, Oh oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I thought, Yeah, I had been thinking about this,
Speaker 1: like before I even moved, Like I knew I wanted
Speaker 1: a dog. I mean all I've ever wanted my whole
Speaker 1: life was my own dog. Yeah, you love dogs like
Speaker 1: a dogs like obsessed with talk you are, So, how
Speaker 1: is it having your own dog? That's crazy? Well, it's
Speaker 1: great because the reason I decided to get a puppy
Speaker 1: was because I was really thinking about like my life,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I truly don't think I'm going
Speaker 1: to have kids, but I wanted to be like have
Speaker 1: some kind of a motherly experience and that I mean Jesus, Yeah,
Speaker 1: So I thought me getting a puppy would be a
Speaker 1: nice way to do that, and it totally is. So
Speaker 1: number one, I got the puppy and I was like,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, Okay, I'm pretty sure now even more
Speaker 1: so that I don't want kids, just because just because
Speaker 1: the puppy is already so much and I just like,
Speaker 1: I know the kind of lifestyle I want to have,
Speaker 1: and I just know that a baby just really wouldn't
Speaker 1: fit into that. Babies are babies are weird because it's
Speaker 1: the only are we the only mammals that are babies have.
Speaker 1: When a deer comes out of a mother, deer gets
Speaker 1: fucking walking. It's a horse. When a horse gets born,
Speaker 1: it has instincts and they're like doing stuff for themselves
Speaker 1: a little bit. But a baby, if a baby's on
Speaker 1: the floor. That's where it's staying forever unless you move it.
Speaker 1: It's weird how helpless human babies are to me, Well,
Speaker 1: it's also happy has to do with like animal years
Speaker 1: versus human years. So it's just like you're you're just
Speaker 1: moving storks. I mean, if you left a baby on
Speaker 1: the floor, I mean, you have to toss food at
Speaker 1: it and stuff, but like eventually it would get up
Speaker 1: or learn how to or learn how to push itself up.
Speaker 1: I mean, after you know it's it would be in
Speaker 1: its own feces and you know, you you you have
Speaker 1: to throw food at it and etcetera. But food in
Speaker 1: his mouth, throw ahead of lettuce on a baby. Puppies
Speaker 1: are pretty helpless too, and I mean just peeing everywhere,
Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of crying. You have to
Speaker 1: hold it. I mean I brought Alfred to the dog
Speaker 1: park and he took one look around like I'm literally
Speaker 1: hopped in my lap because I was in the squatting position.
Speaker 1: She popped on my lap and was like nope, I
Speaker 1: thought even because his foster home had a fifty pound
Speaker 1: pit pule in it, so I thought he would be okay.
Speaker 1: But yeah, he truly that I have to treat him
Speaker 1: like a son, like I have to force a personality. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I I was like forcing him at the party, gently
Speaker 1: but nicely. I was like, no, you have to go
Speaker 1: play with the other just because I wouldn't want my
Speaker 1: son to be a mama's boy either. You need to
Speaker 1: go out and socialize and you need to be a
Speaker 1: big boy. So it's like really weird. And then you know,
Speaker 1: and it was, and it's also been kind of an
Speaker 1: interesting challenge in me and James relationship because we had
Speaker 1: to learn this weekend how to co parent, I mean,
Speaker 1: because we have different you know, I'm very strict with
Speaker 1: with the dog, and you know, the dog didn't really
Speaker 1: like James at first, so that was really I mean,
Speaker 1: Saturday afternoon it was a nightmare because because if your
Speaker 1: dog doesn't like your boyfriend, that's a problem. Yeah, Saturday,
Speaker 1: Like so Friday was the first day, and like he
Speaker 1: was just like like kind of growling, not biting, but
Speaker 1: just being aggressive and barking because James is very tall
Speaker 1: and he isn't like tall people. And then I ordered
Speaker 1: like lunch. Saturday afternoon, James came home from work and
Speaker 1: the dog was like just not liking him. At all.
Speaker 1: It ended up in like dog going nuts, running through
Speaker 1: a tub of guacamole, getting guacamole all over the carpet.
Speaker 1: Then James is frustrated because he was taking it personally
Speaker 1: that the dog didn't like him, which a lot of
Speaker 1: people can't can't. But yeah, then I'm crying in the
Speaker 1: middle of the living room floor because I was number one.
Speaker 1: I was so tired from the puppy, and I also
Speaker 1: I went through all this and then you're the dog
Speaker 1: and your boyfriend don't get along. I mean that's hard.
Speaker 1: I didn't know. I just didn't know what to do
Speaker 1: because I was like, I don't want this to be
Speaker 1: like the thing that breaks the relationship. But also it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, dog's not gone back. Yeah you hear that,
Speaker 1: Sir Alfred, You are safe. See. But I got I
Speaker 1: had I had that happen with Gilda. I had a cat.
Speaker 1: I think I've talked about this podcast. Had a cat
Speaker 1: my own animal. Did Gilda after guilda Rudner and then
Speaker 1: she was the biggest kind in the world. She would
Speaker 1: fall up Steven's head and and her his back in mine.
Speaker 1: I mean, she acted like we were all a tiny
Speaker 1: little mouse begging to be eaten. Um, so that was
Speaker 1: fun and Stephen didn't want to come over. And that
Speaker 1: was when we were like falling in love. Like that
Speaker 1: was at the beginning of our relation. She was scary.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not I love all animals, and I mean
Speaker 1: she would it was boiled. Boy, was I in denial
Speaker 1: for a long time. She was frightening. I mean she
Speaker 1: because I especially. She would pull out your hair because
Speaker 1: I had really long hair at the time. She would
Speaker 1: bite your neck. Yeah, it was crazy. I feel like
Speaker 1: I had to shield myself. Yeah, you really did. And
Speaker 1: I was in the bathroom one day and Melissa, my
Speaker 1: best friend, and Stephen were sitting on the couch and
Speaker 1: I could hear them, and Melissa was like, Stephen, guilt's horrible, right,
Speaker 1: And He's like, yeah, she should get rid of them,
Speaker 1: she should write GINGI And I'm like, fuck, I gotta,
Speaker 1: I gotta. And then when I got her fixed that
Speaker 1: that was like, you need to take this cat to
Speaker 1: a farm. I was like, all right, fine, but he
Speaker 1: Stephen would have never moved in if I had. Gilda
Speaker 1: was an abusive relationship for me, no one, no one
Speaker 1: would be here. Yeah, so that's a tough. I mean
Speaker 1: you getting beaten up. Yeah, but I can't imagine if
Speaker 1: if an animal was if if Gilda was great otherwise
Speaker 1: and then like him and her and Stephen didn't like
Speaker 1: each other. I really bummed. Well, you can train almost
Speaker 1: any animal, especially when they're puppy, to like be okay,
Speaker 1: like it's already been, like it's not even been a
Speaker 1: full week, and he's already so much She's creepy. Never
Speaker 1: he was never bad, but he's already like even so
Speaker 1: much more well behaved. And I mean like you just
Speaker 1: have to be take a lot of time with him.
Speaker 1: I mean I spent literally all weekend taking care of
Speaker 1: this time I have to be so. I didn't look
Speaker 1: at my phone, I didn't like things are unanswered. I
Speaker 1: didn't respond to people's text messages. I just spent the
Speaker 1: whole week like taking him out, taking him to play,
Speaker 1: buying him stuff, taking him to Peco, getting his Leashian
Speaker 1: callar like sudden how often you have to take him
Speaker 1: out in a day? I mean, a puppy goes to
Speaker 1: the bathroom at East twelve times a day. But I'm not, damn,
Speaker 1: I am training him on a weevly pad because please
Speaker 1: let's see the sun off. Yeah that's too much. Um,
Speaker 1: but yeah and now and now James and him are
Speaker 1: like the best. But because you have to have you
Speaker 1: have to like kind of let them know who the
Speaker 1: leader of the pack is. James Watton on the leash
Speaker 1: all day on Saturday. Uh, they played Tug of War
Speaker 1: and it was just like building up a trust the same,
Speaker 1: you know, the same as if I was a single
Speaker 1: mom and was introducing my kid to the new boyfriend,
Speaker 1: Like you have to you have to build a relationship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know. It's funny my parents does. He is James
Speaker 1: strict with out for now the way you want him
Speaker 1: to be, because my parents fight over that all the
Speaker 1: time because my dad loves their pitple and wants him
Speaker 1: to sleep with them, wants them everywhere, and my mom's like,
Speaker 1: ed Edward, He's not going to listen to you if
Speaker 1: you keeps doing it. And they get in a fight
Speaker 1: all the time. But she's right, like, you do have
Speaker 1: to do well James dog. Yeah, so he like so
Speaker 1: he makes him sit and do stuff like that. He
Speaker 1: was just like giving him too many treats and I
Speaker 1: was just like, oh my god, I was like I
Speaker 1: keep with the whole bole body. I was thinking, he
Speaker 1: can't eat that much. Um, but he's he's good now. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was just it was a very interesting experience. But
Speaker 1: then when James and and Alfred are getting along so well,
Speaker 1: it's just like the cutest thing in the world and
Speaker 1: they were just and their best buds. Now, so that's awesome. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I shouldn't. I should come out of your
Speaker 1: Do you close your door when you have sex? What's
Speaker 1: that going to be? Like? I mean it's only been
Speaker 1: like two days, so we didn't have sex. We've literally
Speaker 1: been just been just been doting over him, like I
Speaker 1: just took a baby home from the hospital. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I it's I should have had James like go to
Speaker 1: a foster parents house. But I'm fucked up because I
Speaker 1: kind of I kind of had an inkling that a
Speaker 1: dog might not like James, like a little dog, because
Speaker 1: James is like he's kind of scary, like he scares
Speaker 1: me sometimes and he doesn't. He doesn't scare me when
Speaker 1: I first met him, not anymore obviously that that would
Speaker 1: be an abusive relationship. James. Yeah, no, no, No, he's
Speaker 1: like he's tall, he's very tall. He's very tall. He's
Speaker 1: very serious, and he has an he kind of he
Speaker 1: has a deep boy yeah, and he walks in the
Speaker 1: kind of like a slow in a slow way, and
Speaker 1: he gets so offended I say that. I was like,
Speaker 1: but it's it's very masculine. But it's just like the
Speaker 1: way that you are. And he is a very nice
Speaker 1: he's like a really sweet person in real life. But
Speaker 1: he just has a certain you know that midwestern because
Speaker 1: when Stephen came upstairs out for it was kind of
Speaker 1: like what the fuck dide? But then he got well,
Speaker 1: he was raised by lesbian, so he I don't think
Speaker 1: loves mad. Yeah, I lesbian taught him to hate man.
Speaker 1: I actually messaged Marshall bell Skian. I was like, exciting
Speaker 1: news my dogs found and he might kill all that
Speaker 1: you're but yeah, it has been a yeah, it was
Speaker 1: a very interesting kind of like the next step and
Speaker 1: I but then I have just been feeling these feelings
Speaker 1: of like deep love and I like, like right, like
Speaker 1: very emotional for no reason because I love him so
Speaker 1: much and I can't see anything. I just like take
Speaker 1: pictures of him and look at him. It's very weird. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean that's dogs being a dog mom I know
Speaker 1: you do, and that's why I'm like, I would imagine
Speaker 1: that's going to be a really emotional, like fulfilling thing. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I just said, Oh, that's your backpack. That is his
Speaker 1: dog back. That's his dog back, ramp around your stomach
Speaker 1: like a baby bag. It's it's you. We're like a
Speaker 1: backpack but on the front. So yeah, like is he
Speaker 1: facing you or facing the world. He's facing sideway. He
Speaker 1: can move around anyway. He looks up at me a lot,
Speaker 1: like to make sure that I'm still there. And when
Speaker 1: James was walking him on the leash, she kept he
Speaker 1: kept looking back at me to make sure that they
Speaker 1: had loud. He's like, he's a very protective because he's
Speaker 1: a terror mixed. But then like everyone's like, oh maybe
Speaker 1: he's part docs and part Chua, part Jack Russell. He
Speaker 1: has something else in him. I don't know. He's just
Speaker 1: Alfred and he's perfect. Oh god, oh I want a dog.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna go to the shelter when you leave,
Speaker 1: and we'll see what got a dog I get next week.
Speaker 1: Then they can be friends. Yeah, that'll be cute. Okay, Um,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna read an email if you guys want to
Speaker 1: email us sorry about last night show at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: Hey fucker's I've been dealing with an issue for a
Speaker 1: while and I thought you guys might have some insider
Speaker 1: advice for me. My lack of confidence is going to
Speaker 1: end my relationship. I'm twenty four, my boyfriend is twenty six.
Speaker 1: He's absolutely amazing, worships met, continuously compliments me, takes care
Speaker 1: of me. He's the one I want to spend my
Speaker 1: life with. But he's got a serious case of wandering eyes.
Speaker 1: I understand that guys will look it's natural. I do
Speaker 1: it too. I get that A lot of times I'll
Speaker 1: check someone out and I'll point the person out to
Speaker 1: him and we could both appreciate some nice tits or whatnot.
Speaker 1: But my boyfriend has a bad habit of checking out
Speaker 1: a girl so blatantly in front of me, to the
Speaker 1: point where he will do a double take, contort his
Speaker 1: neck to keep staring, and completely phase out of a conversation.
Speaker 1: But he doesn't look at just any girl. He mainly
Speaker 1: checks out leggy blonde's, which also just happened so happens
Speaker 1: to be the type of girl he's always been with
Speaker 1: before me. I'm the complete opposite on four ft eleven,
Speaker 1: half Native American, half expanic. So a fucking babe. Um.
Speaker 1: I've always had body image and self worth issues for
Speaker 1: as long as I can remember, with the exception of
Speaker 1: my liberating slut phase right before he and I got together.
Speaker 1: I was bullied through most of grade school, had my
Speaker 1: fair share of eating disorders, was in a five year
Speaker 1: abusive relationship, followed by two year sexless relationship and the
Speaker 1: top it off. Last year, I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's disease.
Speaker 1: Side effects include hair loss, mood swings in addition to
Speaker 1: my depression, fluctuating sex drive. Our sex is amazing no
Speaker 1: metabolis metabolism, which causes in increasing consistent gain weight. Uh.
Speaker 1: He insists he doesn't see it. I've talked to him
Speaker 1: about how he doubled, how his double taking makes me feel,
Speaker 1: and he reassures me that he can't help it. It
Speaker 1: doesn't mean anything. He doesn't think about those girls for
Speaker 1: more than that moment. He loves me. He doesn't see
Speaker 1: why I lack confidence, etcetera. But I can't help but
Speaker 1: compare myself to these beautiful, leggy blondes that he sees
Speaker 1: that he seems to prefer He said he will stop looking,
Speaker 1: but I don't want him to feel like he has
Speaker 1: to hide his behavior from me. That's how lies in
Speaker 1: secrets start. You're right. I've also tried explaining it in
Speaker 1: an a vice versa situation and he said he wouldn't care.
Speaker 1: We're preparing to move to California together, where I'm from,
Speaker 1: also where an abundance of beautiful people live, and his
Speaker 1: wondering eyes are not only my are my only concern
Speaker 1: I've always see. I've always it self esteem issues in
Speaker 1: my relationships. No one has has me on the pedestal
Speaker 1: the way he does. But never have I ever worried
Speaker 1: about losing my significant other due to someone else. It's
Speaker 1: something that making me, making me into a craze your girlfriend.
Speaker 1: I see them before he does, and I wait for
Speaker 1: him to stare at them. Then he quickly looks back
Speaker 1: at me to see if I saw him looking. I
Speaker 1: always do. It's gotten to the point where I see
Speaker 1: an attractive girl in person or even on social media,
Speaker 1: and I can't help but think he'd sucker. That's what
Speaker 1: he wants. We should we catch ourselves making snarky comments.
Speaker 1: I'll ask if my outfit would look better if I
Speaker 1: were blond, oh, or a group of girls will walk
Speaker 1: by and I'll automatically say he's not looking. I want
Speaker 1: to be secure enough with myself that I don't just
Speaker 1: jump to conclusions how do I love myself? I'm I
Speaker 1: keep trying to remind myself that another woman's beauty does
Speaker 1: not mean the absence of my own. Easier said than done.
Speaker 1: I don't want my insecurities to ruin our relationship. Help
Speaker 1: you know, I was going when I read this email.
Speaker 1: I was reading it and I was like, Oh, he
Speaker 1: does that. That's so rude. And then I'm like, I
Speaker 1: literally will be holding Steven's hand and we'll pass a
Speaker 1: fire station and I will stop walking and just stare
Speaker 1: and be like god damn all out loud, all in
Speaker 1: front of him, and he laughs. I've never dated a fireman, though,
Speaker 1: so if if I think it adds to it a
Speaker 1: little bit, that uh, that that's not the guy I've
Speaker 1: always dated. Like if I've always dated beefcakes, Steven's not
Speaker 1: Steven probably would feel insecure about that, right. Well, Also,
Speaker 1: you guys have just been together for so longer, You're
Speaker 1: on a different level. And also, I mean to be
Speaker 1: quite honest, I don't think most people are in like
Speaker 1: a healthy relationship on the level that you guys are on.
Speaker 1: I just I just don't think. I think it's like
Speaker 1: it's just that's just not But I really do think
Speaker 1: when this guy, when this girl's boyfriend is saying, like
Speaker 1: I only think about them for that second, like yeah, probably, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the double taking, when you when you do the double
Speaker 1: taking and you are number one physically opposite of all
Speaker 1: the women he's looking at. I get that that feels weird,
Speaker 1: feel a little flamasculated. But it's like, like she said,
Speaker 1: you're somebody else's beauty does not take away your own beauty.
Speaker 1: And but the whole with the recent diagnosis of like
Speaker 1: hair loss and weight gain and mood swings, you feel
Speaker 1: like a big old lump of crap. Sure. And also,
Speaker 1: I mean there's just such an intense history here, Like
Speaker 1: I like that you pointed out the stuff so I
Speaker 1: didn't have to think in my head, oh, that you
Speaker 1: probably have some issues. You just told us we're very
Speaker 1: self aware, which is awesome. Yeah, so you know what's
Speaker 1: going on, because like it's most of the anything that
Speaker 1: has to do with insecurity usually goes back to something
Speaker 1: that you're lacking, feelings that you're lacking for yourself, and
Speaker 1: so that's great. However, I hate the excuse and guys
Speaker 1: say it all the time. I can't help, but I
Speaker 1: can't help. You can you can? You can? I can
Speaker 1: help it. It's hard times when it's a firefighter, but
Speaker 1: I can help it. But on top of that, because
Speaker 1: not only is it disrespectful to your girlfriend, I truly
Speaker 1: do think it's disrespectful. There are there is a way
Speaker 1: to look and not make it so fucking obvious. And
Speaker 1: it's also disrespectful to the girls. You don't know. Women
Speaker 1: don't want to be oggled on the streets. So if
Speaker 1: you're going like whoa you're that's that's getting I fucked
Speaker 1: walking down the street. Girls feel that ship I call
Speaker 1: it I rape because it's unwanted. Okay, it's unwanted. It's
Speaker 1: aggressive pepy. I don't care if you're hot, I don't
Speaker 1: care if you're ugly, if you're old, if you're young.
Speaker 1: I can feel it, and I hate it, so fucking
Speaker 1: stop doing it. Yeah there, and also just like be
Speaker 1: cooler about it. There. I check out people all the
Speaker 1: time in very sly way. If you really are that
Speaker 1: bad about it, get a pair of sunglasses, like, honestly,
Speaker 1: don't hurt contorting your neck. I'm sorry, what the funk
Speaker 1: are you trying to prove? Like that's weird, it's weird. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just like you have to do some kind of
Speaker 1: like weird acting exercise where anytime you cat your you
Speaker 1: like cat yourself looking at like a buttter or something
Speaker 1: just like snap your you know, a risk, like an
Speaker 1: elastic band around your wrist and be like I'm back. Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's when I learned that from an acting class when basically,
Speaker 1: when you're not in the moment anymore and you realize
Speaker 1: that you're not in the moment, you say I'm back, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No.
Speaker 1: I think it's a good idea teach yourself something because
Speaker 1: you have to train yourself to your boyfriend he I
Speaker 1: don't know if he listens, but he has to train
Speaker 1: himself to stop to stop acting like this. Uh. And
Speaker 1: I've talked conversations with James about it too, Like I
Speaker 1: think I talked about an incident on a Valentine's Yeah,
Speaker 1: who was looking at a girl behind you? Yeah? And
Speaker 1: I get it. I I understand it's fine to look
Speaker 1: at attractive people. To look at attractive people, everyone likes
Speaker 1: to stare at hotties. But you know, there's a time
Speaker 1: and a place for that, And on your own watch
Speaker 1: you can look at whoever the funk you want. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you also, though, don't aggle like that. Yeah, no, no, no, sure,
Speaker 1: on your own watch, one watch, on her watch, on
Speaker 1: your brother's watch, don't. Yeah, you just gotta be more
Speaker 1: chill about it when your girlfriend is there. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, don't make it so obvious like that you're
Speaker 1: like pulling your own head away or like making a
Speaker 1: visor out of your hand, you know, puts a box
Speaker 1: over his head. Yeah, take a quick little glance out
Speaker 1: of the side of your eye and move on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you have more self control than you know. Dude. But
Speaker 1: on the flip side of this girl who wrote us,
Speaker 1: you need to stop making the side comments comments like
Speaker 1: playing on an outfit and saying something fucking like oh
Speaker 1: have I done that that? Yeah, that's not helping anything.
Speaker 1: It's childish. You're causing You're causing aggression in the relationship necessaries.
Speaker 1: It's just bad. That's bad all around. So you but
Speaker 1: you both need to grow up a little bit with
Speaker 1: with that stuff. And yeah, I mean as much as
Speaker 1: he needs to be respectful of you, at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, it's your responsibility to feel secure secure,
Speaker 1: and not even responsibility like your it's your process to
Speaker 1: feel secure. He is not responsible for you feeling good
Speaker 1: about yourself. He can help and he can add but
Speaker 1: that's even if like he complimented you all day, that's
Speaker 1: like a that's a foe your Your security needs to
Speaker 1: come from within. That's a faux security, absolutely, and that's
Speaker 1: going to fucking blow up in your face later down
Speaker 1: the road if you rely on other people's compliments to
Speaker 1: keep you up right exactly exactly, that's that's not where
Speaker 1: it's coming grown. I just remember the one time, well,
Speaker 1: we had a three way the night before, so maybe
Speaker 1: that was it. But Jasmine came over to do that
Speaker 1: pot She does a podcast where she sleeps in your
Speaker 1: Oh Jasmine Pia, yes, yes, yes, and she's gorgeous, Oh
Speaker 1: my god, she's so beautiful. And she came over and
Speaker 1: it was Jasmine was sitting on the couch and then
Speaker 1: Stephen was in between us, I think, and then I
Speaker 1: was next to Stephen and she was just trying to
Speaker 1: get something on her computer like she's trying to get
Speaker 1: something to work, and Stephen was flirting with her. It
Speaker 1: was the most obvious, to the point where I literally
Speaker 1: was like hello Stephen, Stephen, hello, and I waved my hand.
Speaker 1: I hole, man, we had just he just sucked another
Speaker 1: girl the night before. But I m inch, I'm like, dude,
Speaker 1: you just fuck somebody else. What the I'm the best
Speaker 1: girlfriend ever? Fuck you? Well, he didn't. Probably he was
Speaker 1: probably maybe he was even like in that kind of
Speaker 1: like dating mode. Yes, he was, totally, and I I
Speaker 1: I get it. H he told he still we talked
Speaker 1: about the other right actually said God, that was so
Speaker 1: stupid and why I did that. I'm like, god, I
Speaker 1: get it. But I even though it is my sexual
Speaker 1: king to see him for other people, seeing him flirt
Speaker 1: when it's not in So she's your friend and your coworker. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but she wasn't flirting back or anything. But she even
Speaker 1: if she was, it doesn't it doesn't matter. But I
Speaker 1: I walked to the bathroom. He didn't notice, and I
Speaker 1: walked where he could only see because she was facing
Speaker 1: this way, and I'm like stout and he didn't hear me.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh, it's gonna be fun tonight and
Speaker 1: she had to get in bed in the middle of
Speaker 1: us and wake us up in the middle of the
Speaker 1: night and interviewer and oh my god, the second we
Speaker 1: got to our bed, which was behind the cat when
Speaker 1: we had the wall ups there, she could hear everything
Speaker 1: we're saying behind the wall because it's so thin. I'm like,
Speaker 1: fucking serious. I I reamed him a new asshole at
Speaker 1: the highest whisper that I could possibly think of. It
Speaker 1: was so funny. Anyway, I don't know why I wanted
Speaker 1: in that tangent, but well, I mean, you know, security
Speaker 1: just yeah, it is. Security is a process. Is annoying.
Speaker 1: And comparing yourself is so detrimental your you're accomplishments, you're anything.
Speaker 1: You are you. If you're not happy with what you're doing,
Speaker 1: work on it. You should only be competing with yourself.
Speaker 1: And also like when people, yeah, it gets especially about
Speaker 1: it and like the warmer weather. Uh people, when boyfriends
Speaker 1: look at me when I'm walking down the street, I
Speaker 1: get so angry at them because I'm like, what are
Speaker 1: you doing. You're with a girl, and if you don't
Speaker 1: like that girl, that girl's not holding your attention. And
Speaker 1: that girl doesn't do it for you, stop dating her.
Speaker 1: But Stephen looks at titties all day, honestly, Steven Stairs,
Speaker 1: Steven kind of has a similar problem. Ish, but it's
Speaker 1: not just blonde, it's anyone with tits, anyone, and it's honestly,
Speaker 1: it is actually God, Yeah, it is very obvious. You
Speaker 1: just have to work on buttons more sleep slot about it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But what I'll say to him, I'm like, Stephen, what
Speaker 1: the fuck? And he's like, yeah, sorry, and he he
Speaker 1: does like when I remind him, he stops. Yeah, Like
Speaker 1: I get it. I Actually I stare at people all
Speaker 1: the time too. It's hard on too, because it's like
Speaker 1: nice to look at, and it's also it feels a
Speaker 1: little animalistic in a good way. Yeah. I don't know
Speaker 1: how else put it. Yeah, it's God, it's it. That's
Speaker 1: just a lot though. But then also and just remind yourself, like,
Speaker 1: if you're in a relationship, that person is with you
Speaker 1: for more than just the aesthetic, hopefully, because when you're
Speaker 1: ninety you ain't going to be rocking those They know you,
Speaker 1: they love you, and there are special things about you
Speaker 1: beyond being whatever height you are, whatever weight you are,
Speaker 1: whatever hair color, you are so like, just know that
Speaker 1: and once you realize that, once you realize that someone
Speaker 1: loves you on that like deep deep level, Like I've
Speaker 1: talked about it. If I'm not I'm not a ten,
Speaker 1: but it looks alone, but the whole package is a ten.
Speaker 1: And I think that it's important that, like you rate
Speaker 1: yourself as a human being on the whole package. Like
Speaker 1: has Jane's dated better looking girls? Yeah, a ton of them.
Speaker 1: But I know that he loves me more than he
Speaker 1: loved any of those people, because you do like fun
Speaker 1: ship and you have all these unique qualities that no
Speaker 1: one else has. You're a fun times intellectual level and
Speaker 1: there's just a lot of more important things than that.
Speaker 1: I mean, And I'm not a dog, so now not
Speaker 1: to dog the Adam like a dog, like an ugly person.
Speaker 1: Troll Yeah portrolls, they have a bad rep. Yeah ah, hi,
Speaker 1: Alfred hid I forgot he was here so quiet. We're
Speaker 1: gonna we wrote a book and um it kept me
Speaker 1: up at night. I know. If we sound like we're
Speaker 1: out of it is because we've been up edits And
Speaker 1: god damn, don't take four mindal on one day because
Speaker 1: it's like a lot of caffeine and you just won't
Speaker 1: sleep so um. But thank you to the following people
Speaker 1: who who pre ordered fucked being sexually exportive and self
Speaker 1: confident in a world that's good. I'm gonna going first, sure, Okay,
Speaker 1: thank you. Jennifer as Land, Tila Hammond, Lindsay MacArthur, Alexei Evans,
Speaker 1: Brittany Bradford, Alexandra Stark, Chris Davis, Davy rich Or, could
Speaker 1: be Dobby because there's no so might be Dobby rich,
Speaker 1: Amy Carroll, Michelle Sullivan, Natelye Chavez, Ella French, Heather Miller,
Speaker 1: Zoe Gillickson, Leela Pally, Chuck Ali Ward, Jordan Shay, Kerry Higginston,
Speaker 1: Angelica del Koro, Anastasia Borders, Stephanie Anderson, Cassidy Martini, Caitlin Lloyd,
Speaker 1: Jason White, Christopher Fisher, My Brother, Hi Kress, Hi kress Uh,
Speaker 1: Sue all Rich, Candra Snyder, Shannon McLoughlin, Jamie val A,
Speaker 1: Loadie Winger, Tarna White, Kaylee Rayner, Says, Aar Torres, Daniel Harrara,
Speaker 1: Jasmine White, Amber Jackson, Cassandra Zirkis, Megan Jeanette, Melanie Crichton,
Speaker 1: Molly Becker, Analyze Zapadka, Mindy Galford, Presley Westbrook, Samantha Napole,
Speaker 1: Leah Hassan, Hilary Birch, Zaron Stone, Brianna Hoyer, Joshua Leelanek
Speaker 1: and Gina Solibello. And also thank you very much to
Speaker 1: Natalie Higgins, I to know you, Hi, Natalie Courtney, Travis,
Speaker 1: Katie Frank, Liz Wilma's Whitney Grout, Cheryl Hicks, Sarah Schneider,
Speaker 1: Laura Corsico, Rogelio Gordson, Sorry sorry, Genial Ohlaudie, Samantha Jorko,
Speaker 1: Jessica Penel, Bar, Penel Burr, Rachel Smith, Nicole welsick, on A,
Speaker 1: Thussia Bender, vilma Aravellalo, Andrea Bain, Amanda Fortuna, Gracie g
Speaker 1: fab Ibarra, Katherine Lano, Janna Sella's Nava, What the funk you, guys?
Speaker 1: Mia Valdez, Alicia Stevens, Savannah Hubbard, Jess Fogerty, Kristen house In,
Speaker 1: Sadie Harsey, Maggie Mallam, Katrina Carol Grace Clark, McCall, Ashley Woods,
Speaker 1: Bethany Lally, Kellie Dempsey, Jason Whist, Lauren Carpenter, Paige Satury,
Speaker 1: Beth Aguilera like Christina Aguilera, but Beth, Violet Sabo, Gabrielle Busca,
Speaker 1: Whitney Borden, Sarah Pimento, Ebbie Davis, Felicia vel Maya Keller,
Speaker 1: Maria Gerhardt, Laura Penny, Maria Clark. I thought first, said
Speaker 1: Marsha Clark, and I was like, yo, but Maria, thank you,
Speaker 1: Emily Ward, Michelle Charret, Samantha Bouted, Karameyer's, Sean Sortin Sortonsky,
Speaker 1: Chanelle Holman. This is the scariest part of my week
Speaker 1: is reading all those names. When when we're done, I
Speaker 1: want to just keep making up names. I keep reading
Speaker 1: them because I know some people get so frustrated, and
Speaker 1: it's so fun of frustrating them even more. Like the
Speaker 1: more people don't like this segment the more and we
Speaker 1: only read we tread fifty names, but the people that
Speaker 1: also those fifty people are like love it, and and
Speaker 1: they send us like videos of them hearing their name,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, that's really sweet, sweet, it makes me
Speaker 1: really happy. Yeah, you know what else makes me happy?
Speaker 1: Our guests. I wasn't going into a product. It did
Speaker 1: sound like I was. Guys were done with all this stuff.
Speaker 1: We're gonna go to the interview now. Um. Our guest
Speaker 1: is a former dominatrix. She has a new memoir called
Speaker 1: The Scarlet Letters, My Secret Year of Men in l
Speaker 1: a Jungeon. This was such a fucking fascinating conversation and
Speaker 1: I loved her so fucking much. Um and she was
Speaker 1: also I already a fan of podcast. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 1: It was such a It was such a pleasantly surprising conversation.
Speaker 1: I didn't think it would suck or anything, but I'm like, damn,
Speaker 1: this girl's cool as fuck. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome
Speaker 1: to the show. Jenny nordback a little how spect to
Speaker 1: fly every time? That the realness you send ship just
Speaker 1: got my time, y'all? Ice make more? However, were I'm
Speaker 1: supposed to stay clear? Or when you pull so I
Speaker 1: feel stone alone, I feel your fingers trace my backless
Speaker 1: dray and was to skin It's a little funny. I's
Speaker 1: five s into sly why the story's gonna allow the
Speaker 1: one of us to dry? You? Okay? How are you good? Good?
Speaker 1: Jealous that you wrote a book and it's like done
Speaker 1: an ol and you're just like we've held that face.
Speaker 1: I'm on the other side, it's so hard it happens. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you were just telling us how you wrote a book
Speaker 1: that your due date was when you're only child was
Speaker 1: like three months old. Yeah, damn Yeah. It was insane.
Speaker 1: And I'm here legitimately thought that by the time my
Speaker 1: kid was three months old, my life would be like
Speaker 1: semi back to normal, like in such a control freak
Speaker 1: that I was like, I'll have a routine and he'll
Speaker 1: be sleeping more, and like I'm going to have under control.
Speaker 1: And then I got to that and was like, my
Speaker 1: life is never going to be under control again. Yeah.
Speaker 1: How is having a baby like the act of giving birth?
Speaker 1: I'm sous it is fucked like nothing. So I totally
Speaker 1: bought into the natural childbirth thing and I gave birth
Speaker 1: like at a birth center with midwives, and I was
Speaker 1: I wanted to I wanted to water birth and like
Speaker 1: so no pain killers at all, and I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, I'm gonna do this, like I'm gonna do
Speaker 1: it the right way. Yeah, holy shit. It was so
Speaker 1: much more painful than like and you're supposed to forget
Speaker 1: about that pain though, because you're flooded with these hormones
Speaker 1: of giving life. And wow, but I don't do it
Speaker 1: like I've kind of I start to forget. I'm like,
Speaker 1: it wasn't that bad, and I have to constantly remind
Speaker 1: myself it was that so bad, like nothing to do
Speaker 1: you have anything compared to So that's what I was
Speaker 1: going to say. My scale before that was, Um, I
Speaker 1: decided it would be a good idea to run an ultramarrathon.
Speaker 1: So it was a forty three mile foot race across
Speaker 1: the Scottish highlands. And this seems and I like strained
Speaker 1: an ankle a couple of yeah, so, like it was painful,
Speaker 1: it was brutal, and having a baby that was like
Speaker 1: on a scale of one to tell and having a
Speaker 1: baby made the ultra marathon seemed like a one and
Speaker 1: a half and the baby it was like a fourteen.
Speaker 1: Like it was terrible. Does the pain start when you're
Speaker 1: doing the contractions begin when you're going into labor, or
Speaker 1: does it start when the crowning happens. Um, it just
Speaker 1: progressively gets worse. So it starts and then like it's
Speaker 1: getting more and more and more intense. Yeah exactly. So
Speaker 1: it was like, you know, well, when I went early
Speaker 1: and they sent me home and at that point that
Speaker 1: I went. I was like, all right, this is I'm
Speaker 1: clearly you know, like you're measuring how dilated you are.
Speaker 1: And I thought like, okay, imminent, this is going to happen.
Speaker 1: This is expecting And they were like, I don't, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't even know how I would know,
Speaker 1: like unless like my water broke on my shoe that
Speaker 1: I would need to go. And I'm just taking that
Speaker 1: from sex in the City, right yeh. So, and they
Speaker 1: give you these like I can't remember what it is now,
Speaker 1: but it's like when you're having a certain number of
Speaker 1: contractions a certain right, within a certain length and whatever.
Speaker 1: So I was at that point and I was an
Speaker 1: excruciating pain and I was like, all right, we're gonna
Speaker 1: do this. But I still was kind of under control.
Speaker 1: And I go and they were like, you have to
Speaker 1: get to ten centimeters to have the baby. And I
Speaker 1: was three and they sent me home. I was just yeah,
Speaker 1: they were like, you're nowhere near that yet. And by
Speaker 1: the time I came back in, I was just like, now,
Speaker 1: if you wanted to change your mind and have pain,
Speaker 1: some type of pain, yeah, could you have. I would
Speaker 1: have had to have transferred to the hospital, and by
Speaker 1: the time I went back, I was a probably yeah,
Speaker 1: but I was there. I was like, if we're not, like,
Speaker 1: if this isn't happening this time, I'm going to the
Speaker 1: hospital and I want an epiderl. Yeah, And I think
Speaker 1: if I've been at the hospital, there's no question you
Speaker 1: would have gotten the epiderl. Well. I didn't realize how
Speaker 1: much women's decisions get judged really hard throughout the entire
Speaker 1: pregnancy and motherhood until I saw the business of being
Speaker 1: born and how everyone pressures moms to like, like, there's
Speaker 1: nothing wrong with you if you want an upidl to
Speaker 1: not feel my my hast her. I was there when
Speaker 1: she gave birth. I was like ten or something, and
Speaker 1: we were all in the room and she had an epidural,
Speaker 1: and then the doctor lifts up the sheets and he goes, oh,
Speaker 1: there's a head coming out. You guys gotta go, and
Speaker 1: she's like, oh sweet, and she just like okay, cool,
Speaker 1: And it was just seemed like the most seamless process. Yeah.
Speaker 1: That seems very civilized, Yeah, compared to what I did,
Speaker 1: where I sounded like an animal, like the noises really
Speaker 1: out of my mouth. I think I terrified. My poor
Speaker 1: husband really interesting. Like I've seen the bath with you know,
Speaker 1: he was like sort of holding me up from the
Speaker 1: because I was too short for the tub. I was
Speaker 1: knowledge to the end, so he was having to like
Speaker 1: hold me out of the water. And yeah, it was
Speaker 1: I was gonna say. I was like, you're pretty petite,
Speaker 1: so I was like that also, I'm sure like the
Speaker 1: more petite you are, the more excruciating the pain is.
Speaker 1: Just like as far as like hip size and like
Speaker 1: birthing hips, you know that's not no joke. Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 1: My Joanne told me I have child bearing hips and
Speaker 1: I was like, cool, okay, I'll be able to rocket
Speaker 1: made me mom getting that up Darrel probably though my
Speaker 1: mom had her natural and I'm like, what the fuck? Yeah,
Speaker 1: but my mom also had her was natural. And then
Speaker 1: she did an upidl for the second one and she
Speaker 1: said that it sucked because she couldn't feel the baby
Speaker 1: coming out and that way. She said that was really cool,
Speaker 1: and I was like, well, also it was me, so
Speaker 1: little did she know. Karina Elizabeth Fisher making her debut
Speaker 1: on Earth Here. I am It's funny everything I've just
Speaker 1: said about it. If I was going to do it again,
Speaker 1: I would still do it naturally really like that clearly
Speaker 1: like real, but maybe it was like powerful and so quickly,
Speaker 1: I think, because I think when you have an epidul
Speaker 1: you maybe sometimes do more damage and whatever. But like
Speaker 1: I was walking the dogs within like seven hours, and
Speaker 1: I was really ship four hours after I gave birth.
Speaker 1: Yeah at the birth Oh that's right, because it wasn't
Speaker 1: a hospital. The Yeah, the next lady in the tub,
Speaker 1: we gotta let you go. I delivered like mid night
Speaker 1: and was home by four am. That they probably did,
Speaker 1: you know, can you Okay? So this natural birth thing.
Speaker 1: My friend on Facebook very into the natural stuff. I
Speaker 1: saw her home water birth. I saw them, I mean,
Speaker 1: not the baby coming out of her, but I saw
Speaker 1: that the pool was in her hair. I saw. So
Speaker 1: how do you prepare for that process? How granola slash intolerable?
Speaker 1: Is it? It's this is the questions were all thinking, Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it is. I'm like, I like to think I'm kind
Speaker 1: of crunchy granola or whatever, but I'm really not as
Speaker 1: as into it as like the rest of them. Art
Speaker 1: So I'm about to get into my funny story about that.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, like we did the classes beforehand
Speaker 1: or whatever. My husband and I were just like grabbing
Speaker 1: each other, like keep a straight face, keep it together,
Speaker 1: and they're like giving you these techniques to right now.
Speaker 1: None of them did anything, man. But so my funny
Speaker 1: story about that is like so um, having your placenta
Speaker 1: encapsulated and eating it after they don't have lots of
Speaker 1: people do it, Like yeah, they freeze, dry it and
Speaker 1: put it in like pill form. So it's not like
Speaker 1: that was cruise, just like taking a big bite of
Speaker 1: the health benefits of that. It's supposedly like pulps you
Speaker 1: like get your hormones back to being balanced. Okay, I
Speaker 1: think you can like save it and use it when
Speaker 1: you're with your menopause or whatever. But so it's so
Speaker 1: common with the like granola crowd that the birth center
Speaker 1: that I was at, like you didn't get a choice.
Speaker 1: They sent you home with your placenta. There wasn't like
Speaker 1: the name in a pillform or in like they put
Speaker 1: it in a top of where they did it. So
Speaker 1: and they hadn't really told us that they were going
Speaker 1: to do this. They had just said, like, are you
Speaker 1: going to have someone pick it up for you? Because
Speaker 1: they like pick it up and they take it and
Speaker 1: they freeze right, and they give it back to you
Speaker 1: in pillform and I was like, no, I'm not so
Speaker 1: then like I've just given birth. I've got a baby,
Speaker 1: like I got to take care of this. And we're
Speaker 1: walking out to the car and like they have to
Speaker 1: check the car seat and then they're like, oh, don't
Speaker 1: forget your placenta and they're like hand it to chopper
Speaker 1: container in a bag. So I'm like my husband and
Speaker 1: are like okay. Liked. So we get home with it
Speaker 1: and we don't really know what to do with it.
Speaker 1: So we put it in the drawer of the fridge
Speaker 1: because we were like, it's a fresh keeper. Figure it out,
Speaker 1: Like it seemed weird to just put it in the trash,
Speaker 1: like it's human. Yeah, you weren't going to eat it, Jenny, Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you're a witch. Here's my like super I see,
Speaker 1: maybe really bad at just sharing my embarrassing ship. But
Speaker 1: we forgot it was in there, like in the throes
Speaker 1: of new parenthoods forgot like turkey tub in the like exactly,
Speaker 1: there was a placenta in the fridge. So like I
Speaker 1: don't even want to admit, but like it was probably
Speaker 1: like three or four weeks later that we were like,
Speaker 1: there's like, now is a bad Yeah? I think it
Speaker 1: does a pla spine? What is the expression? Date? Ones? Like?
Speaker 1: How long? It's like chicken, Like, how long can you
Speaker 1: put it in the fridge until you got you gotta
Speaker 1: freeze it? Right? So we ended up throwing it away
Speaker 1: and I didn't even look. I just like grabbed the container,
Speaker 1: put it in a bag and put in the trash.
Speaker 1: Did it start to smell? And that's how you were like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, thankfully no, But did you smell it before?
Speaker 1: Good for you know, I didn't would have done that either. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It was that thing where like you have leftovers and
Speaker 1: you're like I don't. Yeah, I'm not even gonna give
Speaker 1: us a chance to stink up my house for my
Speaker 1: god damn. So how old is your kid now? He's
Speaker 1: eighteen months? So how is that? What's it like? It's awesome.
Speaker 1: It is the fucking coolest, especially like those newborn days
Speaker 1: are just like overwhelming and he's like a blob. That's
Speaker 1: just crazy to see a person the first day they're born.
Speaker 1: I've only done that with my nephew, but it is wild.
Speaker 1: It's just like you're a a pure you're the purest
Speaker 1: thing ever, but you're so helpless, And yeah, I don't
Speaker 1: give you a lot of feedback. Like a baby, they
Speaker 1: don't like smile at you or like like you or
Speaker 1: there's it's all just like very like you're just taking
Speaker 1: care of their basic needs. So I found that really overwhelming.
Speaker 1: But now that he's getting older and he's like starting
Speaker 1: to talk a little bit, and like he's just so fascinating.
Speaker 1: It's crazy to see that he reminds you of how
Speaker 1: exciting everything is and like the joy in the world.
Speaker 1: And I just found myself laughing all the time, and
Speaker 1: like I'll go to bed and I'd be like my
Speaker 1: cheeks hurt from smiling, just because he's so fun. And
Speaker 1: do you ever have do you ever experienced um after
Speaker 1: your pregnancy, any postpartum It's tough for me to know
Speaker 1: because I was so stressed about the book at the
Speaker 1: same time that like, yeah, I mean I was just
Speaker 1: like sobbing and a mess like that could have been
Speaker 1: from I don't sleep. Yeah, I was so stressed whatever,
Speaker 1: so I mean, and the hormone swing is just so crazy.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so I don't know if some of it
Speaker 1: was postpontum depression or if it was just I was
Speaker 1: trying to do too much at once. But it was
Speaker 1: a rough couple of months. Like some of it's pretty fuzzy.
Speaker 1: I don't remember some of those days. When how did
Speaker 1: your husband help you out in that time? I mean
Speaker 1: he was so patient. I think that's all he should
Speaker 1: be because you squeeze it. He wasn't ye person plushed
Speaker 1: a human out of my lady. Bit. He's probably like,
Speaker 1: damn girl, that's impressive. He was so patient with me,
Speaker 1: Like I would just be a mess over nothing like
Speaker 1: he he didn't even have to do anything, and I
Speaker 1: would just be like sobbing, and he like never was
Speaker 1: like get it together or you know, like what is
Speaker 1: your issue or people that's always just like very patient
Speaker 1: and did whatever I needed him to do to like
Speaker 1: get through it. So what was there a I mean,
Speaker 1: obviously there had to have been a moment where you
Speaker 1: both were like, yeah, let's have the baby. I think, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a weird, that's a that's such an adult decision.
Speaker 1: We had that conversation in Disneyland, which may not have
Speaker 1: been a good choice. Like we were in line at
Speaker 1: a rind We're like we're taken back by the magic. Well, no,
Speaker 1: it was actually the opposite. We were like, I don't
Speaker 1: want to deal with that, Like, you know, we were
Speaker 1: Disneyland with like and you know, just we were doing
Speaker 1: it right, yeah, and we're looking at these parents who
Speaker 1: are struggling with kids and we're like that looks closers.
Speaker 1: We were traveling all the time. We're like, I don't like,
Speaker 1: our life is awesome. I don't want to add that.
Speaker 1: But we like got around it and we're like I
Speaker 1: think we can do this, like let's have one and
Speaker 1: see how it goes. And so we decided to do it,
Speaker 1: and obviously we did how quickly? Yeah, because then what
Speaker 1: do you like, do you wait when you have that
Speaker 1: discussion and then if you don't get pregnant by a
Speaker 1: certain number of months, do you just say, okay, let's
Speaker 1: go to the gun and see what is happening, or
Speaker 1: like I don't know, I just don't know anything about that.
Speaker 1: So there's like a whole industry and there's like all
Speaker 1: this lingo that goes with it now where like all
Speaker 1: like acronyms and ship where women get like super obsessed.
Speaker 1: But I mean I had an I U D at
Speaker 1: the time. So when we made that decision, it was
Speaker 1: all right, we're gonna set the u D out. And
Speaker 1: I guess my husband is like Mr. Fertility or something,
Speaker 1: because I got pregnant in that first cycle after taking
Speaker 1: the idea. Well after birth control is one of woman
Speaker 1: is most stop it. But then I miscarried like immediately.
Speaker 1: See that's something that happens to so many women. It's
Speaker 1: it's so much more common than people think. And we've
Speaker 1: got a lot of letters about it, and we've we've
Speaker 1: had some discussions about it, but I've never talked to
Speaker 1: somebody who has Misscary. So it's like, what is that?
Speaker 1: How did that make you feel? Did you not tell anybody?
Speaker 1: What was that? Like? I didn't talk about it really
Speaker 1: when it was happening, And it happened really early in
Speaker 1: the pregnancy for me, so I think it's a different
Speaker 1: experience if like you're you know, way into it, you're
Speaker 1: like four months pregnant or eight months pregning or whatever. Like,
Speaker 1: it was still so new that I was trying to
Speaker 1: get in my head around the idea of it, and
Speaker 1: how do you how do you know when you miss Gary?
Speaker 1: I just started bleeding really heavily, and I was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is not going well. How was that for you? Emotionally,
Speaker 1: I think I was more just like disappointed than anything.
Speaker 1: I hadn't like formed any kind of emotional connection with it,
Speaker 1: so it was like disappointing. But then on like a
Speaker 1: scientific level, I was like, obviously that something wasn't right
Speaker 1: there because the body took care of it, so it
Speaker 1: was like that was meant to happen, Like it's okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's crazy. How um, it's not crazy because I do
Speaker 1: understand how that must feel horrible to miscarry, especially if
Speaker 1: you're farther along and stuff. But it's so I didn't
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that so many people didn't talk about
Speaker 1: it and didn't the scope of how just how common
Speaker 1: it is. It's not something to feel like less of
Speaker 1: a woman about, but reading like that's what a lot
Speaker 1: of women. Oh yeah, sure, it's shame. It's like becaun't wrong,
Speaker 1: you made a mistake, you didn't do something right. It's
Speaker 1: always that's how how being a woman is and all
Speaker 1: totally and yeah. Well, and then the next time I
Speaker 1: got pregnant, that was I think when I really felt it,
Speaker 1: because I was so paranoid it was going to happen again.
Speaker 1: It was like I didn't want to form an emotional connection. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm terrified and thing's going to happen. And like every
Speaker 1: time I felt any kind of twins, I was like,
Speaker 1: oh God, is it know whatever? So that was, you know,
Speaker 1: where the emotions kind of came out. But I mean,
Speaker 1: which is a double edged shore, because the anxiety is
Speaker 1: worse for your body than like falling down half not
Speaker 1: a whole flight, but half a flight's half a flight.
Speaker 1: You've done this the researches. What about did your how
Speaker 1: did your sex change with your husband once you were pregnant?
Speaker 1: He was really nervous about it. Yeah, like he wasn't
Speaker 1: And I think that's common. A lot of guys are
Speaker 1: like worried they're gonna like mess with the baby and
Speaker 1: it doesn't help in the eye. Yeah. So, my little
Speaker 1: sister is a nurse, and she told all of the
Speaker 1: men in my family that, like she's a nurse and
Speaker 1: she she actually works in like labor and delivery, and
Speaker 1: she told them that if things go wrong, then like
Speaker 1: the baby can reach down and grab their penis. And
Speaker 1: of course that is in no way true. I can't
Speaker 1: believe anyone believe that, but a man, I think it's done,
Speaker 1: like in the back of their minds. I don't know,
Speaker 1: the baby's right there. I mean, my husband, to be clear,
Speaker 1: is going to get mad. He did not believe that.
Speaker 1: But I think you especially but I get I mean
Speaker 1: my own body, so yeah, I think you know, for him,
Speaker 1: it was emotional as well of like she doesn't want
Speaker 1: to be the one to do something to cause it.
Speaker 1: So that was sort of stressful during pregnancy. We got
Speaker 1: past it so well. Scott Stephen, my boyfriend, is like
Speaker 1: he thinks pregnant women are so sexy, to the point
Speaker 1: where he's like, man, when you're pregnant, we're gonna go well,
Speaker 1: I hope I want to oh you um, but he like,
Speaker 1: and there is something about a pregnant woman that I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: oh my god, you're like carrying a person. I don't know.
Speaker 1: That was really cool. I mean you kind of feel
Speaker 1: like a fertility goddess or something. It was just this
Speaker 1: powerful feminine experience where you're like, I'm making a human,
Speaker 1: I'm doing what I'm designed to do. Yeah. I love
Speaker 1: that we're getting into pregnancy. I know. I was going
Speaker 1: to say, I know, so pregnant but not take care
Speaker 1: of the kid, which I can. I just realized that
Speaker 1: I was time. I thought in my head, no, no no,
Speaker 1: I could be pregnant but not take care of the kid. Reverse,
Speaker 1: there's adoption. It's called I give the kid away, like
Speaker 1: I carry someone else you can put your Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: Oh that's a yeah. That's a way to have Yeah,
Speaker 1: to have the experience of birth and then just not
Speaker 1: have the responsibility. By Timmy J I don't know. Uh,
Speaker 1: you wrote a book about your experiences being dominatrix. I did. Yeah,
Speaker 1: everyone's got whiplash all of a sudden, speaking whip humanized you.
Speaker 1: Now we're gonna call it the other way. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: love it. How did that come about? The desire to
Speaker 1: get into it? Tell us how? How? Yeah, how that
Speaker 1: came into fruition for you? So I was like twenty
Speaker 1: two and just graduating from USC with a super useful
Speaker 1: degree in archaeology, and like, so cool it is, You're like,
Speaker 1: but yeah, job opportunities. Yeah, I think he's a paleontologist. Oh,
Speaker 1: you're right, but common confusing there Um. So I'm like
Speaker 1: a hundred thousand dollars in student loans and no idea
Speaker 1: what I was going to do with my life since
Speaker 1: I decided I did not want to be an archaeologist.
Speaker 1: After all that, what when did you know? Did you
Speaker 1: know before you graduated or after? Like two weeks before graduation.
Speaker 1: I was like starting to figure out what grad school
Speaker 1: I was going to go to, and I was like,
Speaker 1: I don't want to do this. This is a lifestyle
Speaker 1: and it's not for me. So then I'm like freaking out,
Speaker 1: and I think because I was freaking out, I started
Speaker 1: really doing what I think you sort of do it
Speaker 1: twenty two and examining who I was, what I was doing,
Speaker 1: and realized, like I'd been in this string of unsatisfying relationships,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't really my partner's fault because I had
Speaker 1: never spoken up about who I was or what I wanted.
Speaker 1: Like whatever they were into was what I was doing.
Speaker 1: I just like became their little person that like suited
Speaker 1: their interests. So when I started asking that question, I realized,
Speaker 1: like I might be into something that's a little a
Speaker 1: little edgier than what's out there. But this was like
Speaker 1: pre fifty shades of gray, Like it wasn't b D
Speaker 1: s M and alternative sexual practices really weren't part of
Speaker 1: the mainstream conversation. So when I started digging online, I
Speaker 1: initially found like just sort of weird stuff like b
Speaker 1: DSM fan fiction of like Dumbledore spanking her Mayan, you know,
Speaker 1: like super out there stuff. And then I found a
Speaker 1: dungeon website of a dungeon that was like ten miles
Speaker 1: from where I lived in l A. At first, I
Speaker 1: was like, what the hell is a dungeon? Like people
Speaker 1: do this professionally? What is this? It's so weird? And
Speaker 1: then you know, I'm digging through the website just fascinated
Speaker 1: and saw the banner on the side of the page
Speaker 1: that said now hiring, no experience necessary. I was like,
Speaker 1: no experience. Wow. Yeah, I was like, that's me, no experience,
Speaker 1: Like you're you're gonna train me, so hopefully. I always
Speaker 1: get scared one job saying no experience just zero here,
Speaker 1: you do not need to know anything. The more you know,
Speaker 1: the harder it is. And right, so I just like
Speaker 1: jumped off the deep end and damn applied for a job.
Speaker 1: And how do you had you hadn't been kinky in
Speaker 1: your personal sex sight before that, so how do you
Speaker 1: refuse it? To believe that but I find jobs were kinky.
Speaker 1: At that point, I was like, yeah, I'm really crazy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean they're kind of crazy. The fact that a
Speaker 1: woman would do that, and what, like do you remember
Speaker 1: the first was the first person, your first client. So
Speaker 1: I had to start as a submissive instead of a
Speaker 1: dominant because I haven't no idea what I was doing
Speaker 1: and they weren't going to just like throw me into
Speaker 1: a session. And because that you really have to know
Speaker 1: the lingo and the psychology and I mean just like
Speaker 1: safety and the implements and what to do. Like everyone's like, oh,
Speaker 1: do you just go in the room and yell at someone?
Speaker 1: And I'm like even that, Like, all right, I'm going
Speaker 1: to throw you in a room with this strange man
Speaker 1: yell at him for an hour. What are you gonna say,
Speaker 1: fucking dickhead? But you're a liar, I don't know, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean there not even him. So my very first session,
Speaker 1: I was on the receiving end and it was a
Speaker 1: tickling session. He wanted to tie me up and tickle me.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that comes like a nightmare. Had never
Speaker 1: cried in my mind that someone was turned on by that.
Speaker 1: So it's like, yeah, I've know you might answer my questions.
Speaker 1: I mean I would kick him in the face if
Speaker 1: someone tickled me while you're tied up. Yeah, do you
Speaker 1: get a choice? Like for the kink though, Like if
Speaker 1: you fucking I fucking hate being tickled. So if you did,
Speaker 1: were you asked you? You got your nose right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean you you only have to take a session
Speaker 1: that you're comfortable with. And I mean the fact that
Speaker 1: you hate being tickled would be such a turn on
Speaker 1: for so many guys who were so they want you
Speaker 1: to like it, some of them. Some of them want
Speaker 1: you to like it, but well that's mask yeah, So
Speaker 1: I mean, well, and what's funny is a lot of
Speaker 1: the guys were into tickling aren't very good at tickling.
Speaker 1: How do you get bad at how you bad men
Speaker 1: don't have a good touch. That's why it doesn't really tickle.
Speaker 1: So it's funny that the hardest part of tickling sessions
Speaker 1: wasn't that it tickled and you hated it. It was
Speaker 1: that it didn't tickle and you had to fake it.
Speaker 1: You were just like wheeling with laughter and like wriggling
Speaker 1: and what I was like physically exhausting, and and you
Speaker 1: were tied up what how what did that look like?
Speaker 1: Like your just your arms and legs? Was it? Was
Speaker 1: it handcuffs? Was it? Rope? Was So for that very
Speaker 1: first session, I was like on a bondage table, like
Speaker 1: wrist and ankle cuffs that were like attached to the
Speaker 1: Did he tie you up or did something like did
Speaker 1: he walk into the room to you being tied up? Um?
Speaker 1: He did it, which was interesting too because he was
Speaker 1: like in his seventies, so he was like struggling to
Speaker 1: like do the bonds or oh god, that's so funny
Speaker 1: and darll of That was just such a strange experience
Speaker 1: of like, on one hand that for session I was
Speaker 1: like this is really powerful, Like this man hides this
Speaker 1: from everyone in his life, but he's showing the side
Speaker 1: of himself to a stranger. Yeah. Yeah, But then it
Speaker 1: was like this weird cynical side of me that we
Speaker 1: all walk around with most of the time, where I
Speaker 1: was like, well, what the funk? This is an old
Speaker 1: guy and like I'm super young and what is he
Speaker 1: doing and tickling that's so weird? Um, I don't remember him. No,
Speaker 1: he was fully dressed and he might have but I
Speaker 1: didn't notice it. So I get back to the dressing
Speaker 1: room after that first one and sale of that to
Speaker 1: my mentor and I'm like, what the funk It's an
Speaker 1: old guy and it's weird and it's tickling and whatever.
Speaker 1: And she was like, let's just stop there and break
Speaker 1: down the things that you've just said one at a time.
Speaker 1: And she was like, he's an old guy. Let's talk
Speaker 1: about that like that ain't nice. Just because you get older,
Speaker 1: you no longer allowed to be interested in sex. And
Speaker 1: I was like, well, I mean when you say it
Speaker 1: like that, I guess that's true. You know. She was like,
Speaker 1: we call them creepy old men and whatever, but that's
Speaker 1: really unfair, Like just because you get older an older women,
Speaker 1: holy sh it, that's a whole There aren't even like
Speaker 1: creepy old women. Like I feel like it's an you
Speaker 1: never hear that frame. You're just not allowed to be sexual.
Speaker 1: Like Betty White is the exception who like talks about
Speaker 1: sort of naughty stuff. But I mean she's the only
Speaker 1: one I can think of. So I was like, whoa
Speaker 1: reality check? Like I'm gonna get old too, and I'm
Speaker 1: probably still going to be a dirty fuck. So yeah,
Speaker 1: well you have to have those moments of using the
Speaker 1: wrong vernacular. And then it's it's great that you were
Speaker 1: this person kind of went through everything you said and said,
Speaker 1: but this is why what you said is kind of
Speaker 1: sucked up and and that that's what an eye opening
Speaker 1: experience that is. Yes, and that's She was then like, okay,
Speaker 1: and tickling is weird. What are you into? That's so
Speaker 1: much better? And well I don't really know, and she
Speaker 1: was like, well, at least he knows, and it's like
Speaker 1: not afraid to go explore it. Yeah, you know, he's
Speaker 1: embraced it and found a safe space for him to
Speaker 1: do that. And your judgment has no place here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the b D s M community is one of the
Speaker 1: most judgment free places ever, supportive and open. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: my number one qualm with it. I think more touns
Speaker 1: and did he did that person tickle? Did he go
Speaker 1: near your your vagina or your breasts or did you lebrawn?
Speaker 1: Like what were you wearing? Yeah? I mean I was
Speaker 1: in some weird little like to to outfit of it.
Speaker 1: That's the only thing that freaked me out. It seems
Speaker 1: a little did he want you to a child like
Speaker 1: like the kind of pedaphilia or whatever? I mean better
Speaker 1: to act it out there. Yeah, and consensual. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean have you ever had uh any go deeper into
Speaker 1: possibly like I want you to act like a five
Speaker 1: year old or a child. I mean I never had
Speaker 1: ones that were as bad as a five year old.
Speaker 1: I think that would have been aligned for me. But yeah,
Speaker 1: there was some where it was like yeah, so wrong,
Speaker 1: and now, man, you know these people they need they're
Speaker 1: you know, but the thing is as fucked up as
Speaker 1: it is. It's like these they're not harming a child.
Speaker 1: They do exist, and it's like, yeah, better, you know,
Speaker 1: a very young twenty something acts that out with the dungeon.
Speaker 1: The manager of a dungeon that accepts the appointments, would
Speaker 1: they okay to that to them? Yeah, I mean I
Speaker 1: think it's consensual safe say, any consensual and pretty much
Speaker 1: anything you bring to the table that like is still
Speaker 1: within the rules of the dungeon. And they do have rules,
Speaker 1: which I should probably clear so everyone calls it a
Speaker 1: sex dungeon. But sex is like one of the few
Speaker 1: things that is not allowed to happen there. There's not
Speaker 1: a lot of touching in between the except tickling obviously
Speaker 1: or like yeah, I mean there there can be but
Speaker 1: so no sex, no penetration of any kind, so that
Speaker 1: rules out blow jobs or yeah, um, no exchange of
Speaker 1: bodily fluids. So we didn't do like golden showers or
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff at the dungeon or like spit
Speaker 1: north now spitting stuff. Yeah, I mean that one we
Speaker 1: sort of remember. I would spit on the floor and
Speaker 1: like be like lick it up or whatever. But well, yeah,
Speaker 1: that one was kind of like, Okay, that's not that bad. Um,
Speaker 1: And so I mean I guess the other rule is
Speaker 1: like no traditional sex acts, so I'm not going to
Speaker 1: give you a hand job. So um, I mean those
Speaker 1: were the rules. So as long as what they're bringing
Speaker 1: the table was like within those rules and they wanted
Speaker 1: to do it with a consenting adult, then could the
Speaker 1: guy jake off in a session or the woman the client. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so they could goind of do whatever they wanted. It
Speaker 1: was like this sort of I'm not going to stop you,
Speaker 1: but I'm not going to participate. So if you start
Speaker 1: doing it, I'm not going to try and like jump
Speaker 1: in and intervene like and was that for legal so
Speaker 1: it didn't fall under prostitution or okay, okay, have you
Speaker 1: had somebody jerk off in a section session, did I ever? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And then have you like, am I not the best motherfucker?
Speaker 1: And have you been like cool with it every time?
Speaker 1: Or was there one that was just like, come on,
Speaker 1: I don't know it is it is a dungeon where
Speaker 1: you fulfill a kink, so it makes Yeah, I think,
Speaker 1: like I mean, guys jerking off, it's kind of awkward
Speaker 1: no matter what they make. Awkward faces and grunts can
Speaker 1: be hot where they're like I like watching it. I'm
Speaker 1: born like a professional jerker offer. It's great but makes
Speaker 1: it look kind of sexy, but when the average guys
Speaker 1: doing it, they're like, you know, and just you're like
Speaker 1: you get to see everyone's O face. Yeah, and you're
Speaker 1: kind of sitting like don't don't don't laugh if that's
Speaker 1: what they want you to, because some of them want
Speaker 1: to humiliation. Yeah, but keeping a straight face was actually
Speaker 1: one of the hardest parts of the job because some
Speaker 1: of us that they wanted to do, like you're so smart,
Speaker 1: like you can it's like so I can't. I can't
Speaker 1: imagine being like this overly intellectual dominatrix. And especially like
Speaker 1: you know, if you have like a country sense of humor,
Speaker 1: which you know I have, so totally. Yeah. I would
Speaker 1: also people going to a dungeon two are are I
Speaker 1: think pretty smart in at least in that they can
Speaker 1: identify their kinks and they know where to indulge in
Speaker 1: them safely and consensually, and they're not ashamed to them.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, they still could be ashamed again progressive that.
Speaker 1: I mean someone them were like deeply ashamed. It was
Speaker 1: almost awkward ashamed they were where they would like do
Speaker 1: it and then they would just be like almost crying afterwards,
Speaker 1: like I really can't help myself, and like I were
Speaker 1: any of the ones that were really upset afterwards, what
Speaker 1: was like the most extreme thing that they would do?
Speaker 1: Like it was funny that the ones who were the
Speaker 1: most ashamed were usually into the most normal stuff interesting,
Speaker 1: like it wasn't anything, And I would try to explain
Speaker 1: that to them, like, which it's always gotta sucked up
Speaker 1: trying to like put the kinks on a scale of
Speaker 1: like normal to nut course, because it's like anything kind
Speaker 1: of goes. But like I just stomped on my last
Speaker 1: client's nut set. Yeah exactly, he was laughing, So yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: like you're not in a cock and ball torture. It's okay,
Speaker 1: but I mean a lot of guys are. But my
Speaker 1: boyfriend at the time was that having kicked in the
Speaker 1: balls and it. Yeah, it was intense, but I mean
Speaker 1: the guys, one of the most ashamed I ever knew,
Speaker 1: wanted to just like I think he'd been beaten up
Speaker 1: by a girl in the playground when he was a kid,
Speaker 1: and that was his fantasy. He just wanted this woman
Speaker 1: to overpower him. And I was like, that's fine, Like
Speaker 1: it's kind of hot, Like you just want a woman
Speaker 1: to take control and that. So, I mean there might
Speaker 1: have been something else going on in his mind, like
Speaker 1: maybe there was a childhood element to it that he
Speaker 1: was ashamed of. So and then afterwards, was he did
Speaker 1: he cry? Was he? Yeah? I mean he was just
Speaker 1: so like trying to apologize for being there, and like
Speaker 1: I'm you know, she's sorry and different, Like I wouldn't
Speaker 1: have been able to pay my rent had you not come,
Speaker 1: so thank god you wanted me to kick your ass
Speaker 1: because now I'm more financially stable. I was like, this
Speaker 1: is the space for that. That's sacred. Here, there's no judgment.
Speaker 1: You're fine, Like it's okay, you don't have to apologize
Speaker 1: to me, and you really are part therapists. I mean,
Speaker 1: so what kind of like therapist training do you get
Speaker 1: to handle the weight of these issues these guys shame? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I think he just the training happens in
Speaker 1: doing it and sort of decompressing with the other women
Speaker 1: in the dressing room afterward. Yeah, you kind of share
Speaker 1: a story like I would. That's how I would learn too.
Speaker 1: I would think, Yeah, like you, you learned from each other,
Speaker 1: and then you just learned from like dealing with clients
Speaker 1: and you get to where, like I've seen this before,
Speaker 1: I know how to handle it. So did it depress
Speaker 1: you ever? Sometimes? Yeah, I mean like guys who struggled
Speaker 1: with it or were like especially where I mean ones
Speaker 1: where like they were having to lie to their partner
Speaker 1: or like I mean, there was like a way older
Speaker 1: man who had like you know, been happily married since
Speaker 1: the World War two and had never told his partner
Speaker 1: and she had passed on, and it was like, you know,
Speaker 1: he went through this amazing marriage but never shared that
Speaker 1: side of himself, and that always seemed really sad to me.
Speaker 1: But maybe their marriage was amazing because he was able
Speaker 1: to indulge in that side of himself, but he maybe
Speaker 1: he knew how she would if she would react negatively.
Speaker 1: You know, you can't realize, Dick, But it's sometimes like
Speaker 1: I really don't think. I mean, I would be so
Speaker 1: I would be really disappointed and feel betrayed if my
Speaker 1: partner did that behind my back and felt like you
Speaker 1: can tell me. But I know, I've heard of instances,
Speaker 1: and I've read stories from listeners and I've I've heard
Speaker 1: all these stories on the average about how the partner
Speaker 1: is keeping that secret because they're not only afraid of judgment,
Speaker 1: but like their partner has kind of alluded to like, man,
Speaker 1: if you did that, I'd be So it's like sometimes
Speaker 1: you have to keep it to yourself. And I don't
Speaker 1: think that it could be a fun secret life too.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're we're as a society, we're so obsessed
Speaker 1: with the fact that secrets are always negative because many
Speaker 1: times they are, but I think they can also make
Speaker 1: you feel whole and have like a really deep connection
Speaker 1: with yourself. Like I like, it's something one of my
Speaker 1: biggest regrets is that I don't have any secrets, mostly
Speaker 1: because of this podcast. So I'm like, I need to
Speaker 1: do something that I can then keep a secret. We
Speaker 1: can work on that. Well. Yeah, so, I mean I
Speaker 1: I find myself keeping secrets about things that aren't they're
Speaker 1: not really secrets, but but it's normal stuff, you know,
Speaker 1: just so you have something that's yours, I have something, sure, absolutely.
Speaker 1: And how many years did you work as a dominator?
Speaker 1: I did it like consistently for a year and then
Speaker 1: on and off for another year. I was going to
Speaker 1: kind of busy my day job because I was flipping
Speaker 1: both yeah. Ship so And did you have um famous clients?
Speaker 1: I had one like super famous client where I was like,
Speaker 1: what the hell are you doing here? Like, yeah, get
Speaker 1: yourself in trouble? Yeah? Did that mean nervous? Didn't make
Speaker 1: me nervous? Yeah? Totally. I was supposed to be playing
Speaker 1: this persona and I was like, I kind of want
Speaker 1: a fan girl, right, Yeah, I got it together. He
Speaker 1: was He was really douche sheet when he first came in.
Speaker 1: He was like he wouldn't make his sunglasses off, and
Speaker 1: I was like, do you think I'm not going to
Speaker 1: recognize you? That makes it more recognizable when hat orclasses
Speaker 1: animes go through airport with the hat and sunglasses just
Speaker 1: so people think I'm famous and I'm like, had tricks
Speaker 1: on you bitch, especially like in l A. Yeah I
Speaker 1: have a big deal. But he was like smacking his
Speaker 1: gum and wouldn't take his sunglasses off. So it was
Speaker 1: like he irritated me early on enough and you like
Speaker 1: wouldn't really tell me what he wanted to do, so
Speaker 1: and I was you've seen my movies. Yeah, I'm like
Speaker 1: the interview trying to work out. I was like, is
Speaker 1: he here researching a part? And he like, maybe you
Speaker 1: want to be so he like doesn't really know what
Speaker 1: to ask for. But then I was like maybe he
Speaker 1: like thinks that we can do other stuff, and like
Speaker 1: he's trying to just be like I don't know, and
Speaker 1: then when we get to the room, he's gonna like
Speaker 1: try something. So I was like just so annoyed in
Speaker 1: the interview where I was like if it was so,
Speaker 1: there's an interview process before Yeah, yeah, you sit in
Speaker 1: a room with a client and negotiate like how long
Speaker 1: you're going to play on? Yeah, just the two of you,
Speaker 1: Like did you have a heads up that hey it's
Speaker 1: so and so Tom crew, wherever the funk it is?
Speaker 1: Oh he so he just came in. Yeah, he just walked. Okay,
Speaker 1: so yeah, Like in the interview, I just got so
Speaker 1: annoyed so quickly, And I think if it had been
Speaker 1: pretty much anyone else, I would have like, dude, I'm
Speaker 1: not like, I'm not taking this session. You won't tell
Speaker 1: me what you want, You're being an asshole, like we're
Speaker 1: done here. But I was like, I want to see
Speaker 1: what this guy wants to do, and he did. He
Speaker 1: had nothing to add to the conversation in terms of yeah, no,
Speaker 1: he was just super vague, like I want you to
Speaker 1: dominate me, and I was like, there are a million
Speaker 1: ways I can do that. It's I worked with a
Speaker 1: women where when guys said stuff like that or we're
Speaker 1: stupid about it, she would take them to the room
Speaker 1: and tie their toes apart and give them paper cuts
Speaker 1: between the toes. If they were like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: whatever pleases you, mistress, she was like, this praises me.
Speaker 1: Next time tell me. Yeah, So I'm not that in tways,
Speaker 1: I would sort of feel bad doing that because that's
Speaker 1: I mean, a paper cut, that's man, It's just hurts
Speaker 1: so much more than it looks like it hurts. What's
Speaker 1: the most violent thing a person as a request that
Speaker 1: you do? That paper cut toe thing is pretty bad.
Speaker 1: That's a creative horrible she's pretty twisted, really awesome way
Speaker 1: where you're like a that is wrong, so creative that
Speaker 1: that you even come up with that is just like
Speaker 1: I mean, it's true domination. Yeah, real show of power
Speaker 1: and creativity. Yeah. Um, I always found cock and ball
Speaker 1: to which you're kind of violent and just like we're
Speaker 1: brought up like you do not touch a man's junk
Speaker 1: unless you're like imminently in danger of being don't hit
Speaker 1: anybody in the balls. You do not ever hit someone
Speaker 1: in the balls. So it was like hard when I
Speaker 1: first started doing or I would kind of be like oh,
Speaker 1: and they would be like really, like you've got to
Speaker 1: actually hit it, so I would be so hesitant to
Speaker 1: do Yeah, yeah, I mean alright, yeah, real repercautions as
Speaker 1: far as like procreating. So my boyfriend at the time
Speaker 1: was into it and like like a whale on his
Speaker 1: like kick them, kick him the shoe on? Did you
Speaker 1: have a shoe on? Sometimes? Yeah? Did you kick it
Speaker 1: like you were kicking a goal, a soccer goal or
Speaker 1: something like you're kicking a goal hard even you're kicking
Speaker 1: your annoying as boyfriend or yeah, like full on kicking,
Speaker 1: punching whatever. So many kicks, like quite a few. And
Speaker 1: so after we we were at like a play party
Speaker 1: one night and they were like six of my friends
Speaker 1: who worked at the dungeon who were all just like
Speaker 1: kicking and punching him in the balls. And he he
Speaker 1: had made a doctor's appointment the next day to go
Speaker 1: talk to his doctor to be like, am I doing
Speaker 1: permanent harm here? Anyways to do it? After the kicking? Yeah, Well,
Speaker 1: so he'd been trying to kind of ask the doctor
Speaker 1: like is this okay? Which is an awkward conversation to
Speaker 1: have with your doctor, because the doctor's response was like, well,
Speaker 1: just don't do it hard, and he was like, that's
Speaker 1: but that's like it. So they did an ultrasound of
Speaker 1: his balls and they were totally fine. A sperm count
Speaker 1: was like slightly higher than average, Like didn't wasn't doing
Speaker 1: them any harm at all. Now when you kicked him,
Speaker 1: did you was his limp dick? Limp? No, she had
Speaker 1: a hard dick, And so did you kick the balls
Speaker 1: or did you kick the dick between? In his case,
Speaker 1: it was about the balls. But some guys are into
Speaker 1: like bad stuff happening to their dick as well. And
Speaker 1: have you ever tied a guy's balls up and like
Speaker 1: put like a weight on the animal. Wow? But that
Speaker 1: was the one kind of bondage that I was good at,
Speaker 1: like normal rope, I get all. I can't remember the
Speaker 1: knots and like I knew like yeah, the cog and
Speaker 1: ball towars your ties. I just it was so fascinating
Speaker 1: to like do it. So yeah, I can do some
Speaker 1: pretty serious damage with a shoelace. What so wait you
Speaker 1: tie you just tie it tight then with the shoelace, No,
Speaker 1: you sort of it's almost like um creating like a
Speaker 1: cock ring where you're started making them stand out to
Speaker 1: one side and like sometimes separating the balls so that
Speaker 1: you can get maximum effectiveness of like nailing them. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, my balls hurt. I know, I feel even
Speaker 1: have you just lost all of your male list? Like
Speaker 1: I'm done, you know, But some guys really like it
Speaker 1: fascinates me. I've always wanted to I would. I would
Speaker 1: really enjoy I think being with a guy who liked that,
Speaker 1: just but only to do it once to see. But
Speaker 1: I feel like that would be fun. Yeah, because if
Speaker 1: he thinks it's really hot, I'd be like, wait what
Speaker 1: all right? Yeah? I mean when you like your sense
Speaker 1: of normal after that is just weird because like, you're right,
Speaker 1: I would think you've like crossed that line and that's
Speaker 1: comfortable at a certain point. So what do you what
Speaker 1: do you have some sound effects to you with a thunder?
Speaker 1: This is very is that thunder? Yeah? Huge thunderstorm happening.
Speaker 1: But I like it. It's perfectly what are your kinks?
Speaker 1: I it turns out into penetration, like I like sticking
Speaker 1: things in other things. A strap on was just like
Speaker 1: my ultimate um or. I got to do your sounding
Speaker 1: a couple of times. I've heard about that wand up
Speaker 1: your Yeah, you insert a metal rod into the wreath
Speaker 1: us so goes into the penis and it scared the
Speaker 1: ship out of me at first, but I did a
Speaker 1: couple of times and it was fine. It was just
Speaker 1: kind of thrilling that it's almost like you're fucking a penis,
Speaker 1: which I think, yeah, you're penetrating a penis some like
Speaker 1: penis And that was just like, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: walked out feeling like do peters me? I do I
Speaker 1: only did the trap on thing once, but when my
Speaker 1: partner was like, yeah, I would like to try this really,
Speaker 1: Oh my god, okay, and then I handed out. I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: it feels like I got a dick. It's kind of cool. Yeah,
Speaker 1: um so I'm into that. I'm I'm like weirdly into suspenders.
Speaker 1: Is my random one you're wearing them or the other
Speaker 1: person someone else wearing suspenders. I just liked, look control myself.
Speaker 1: It's do you snap them? You look like you want
Speaker 1: to get fucked snap, like grabbing them, looking at them.
Speaker 1: I don't know what it is that spenders just like
Speaker 1: turned me on. I feel like that about like long ties,
Speaker 1: like grabbing somebody by their time, Like yeah, yeah, that's
Speaker 1: what they're for. Yeah, so I mean those are kind
Speaker 1: of a big ones. I think. Beyond that, I just
Speaker 1: like kind of twisted like into whatever. Has there anything
Speaker 1: been ever kank that was presented to you that either
Speaker 1: like like made you physically like nauseous that you said
Speaker 1: no to that during it you're like, I can never
Speaker 1: do this again, even not even beyond judge, just like yeah,
Speaker 1: thissceral reaction. I had a client who had these fantasies
Speaker 1: of women being like gang raped by African tribes so specifically, yeah,
Speaker 1: and it was like it was weirdly racial. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: looked like Dilbert and he was an accountant and like
Speaker 1: of course he was an accountant, but protector. It was weird,
Speaker 1: you know, like there were like weird racial aspects of it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that we're very uncomfortable. And then like just the level
Speaker 1: of violence that he brought to it was like, how
Speaker 1: did you gent futilation kind of stuff? His was mostly verbal.
Speaker 1: He wanted to like talk through the scene and the fantasy.
Speaker 1: There wasn't I didn't really do much And did he
Speaker 1: say did he slip and say something that you're like like,
Speaker 1: all right, now, I could definitely deem you racist. Yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, I mean there was no it was like
Speaker 1: a white woman being by an African tribe and it
Speaker 1: was just like you were so far away, but one
Speaker 1: there was I feel like the the women of other
Speaker 1: races who works at the dungeon had to deal with
Speaker 1: a bunch of ship like that all the time. Like
Speaker 1: if you were a black girl, they would want to
Speaker 1: come in and like act out you know, like slave
Speaker 1: master fantasies or whatever. And and so I mean we're
Speaker 1: the women okay with it or not surprisingly, I mean
Speaker 1: the one that I knew well was like to her,
Speaker 1: it was weird that like I was as offended by
Speaker 1: it as I was, because it was like of everything
Speaker 1: that they're coming to the table with, you know, you know,
Speaker 1: like that just it's a fantasy and it's whatever. Like
Speaker 1: she just sort of accepted that was what was going
Speaker 1: to happen. I was always like, that is not okay. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well it's it's it's a very uncomfortable territory, especially if
Speaker 1: you're a white girl and you're like, I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't I don't have a I don't have this uggle,
Speaker 1: but I don't know. It's just very it's also becomes
Speaker 1: safe to like be when in doubt, just be offended
Speaker 1: on behalf of other people. So it's like, I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't know people we've we've gotten some emails from
Speaker 1: black women who have like racked it out of slave fantasy.
Speaker 1: Sometimes a fantasy was their own fantasy. Yeah, and they
Speaker 1: loved it or I mean, it makes perfect sense. It
Speaker 1: goes along with a great fantasy, like the kind of
Speaker 1: like the the shittiest parts of humanity also turn us
Speaker 1: on in a weird way, so weird. Yeah, and that's
Speaker 1: exactly it. And I think that was her point is
Speaker 1: like this still falls under safety as long as I'm
Speaker 1: okay with it, Why are you like, why is this
Speaker 1: the thing you're offended by? So because it's like, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's acting, it's not you know, yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean yeah, damn. And then are you kinky with your husband?
Speaker 1: So well, the ball he's not the ball. He doesn't like, no,
Speaker 1: didn't marry the ball guy. Yeah, I did not marry
Speaker 1: the ball guy would not be impressed by that. Um,
Speaker 1: these days we are in like the parent we have
Speaker 1: parents sex where we had like five minutes and we're
Speaker 1: listening for a baby and like, I think people want
Speaker 1: me to have a really sexy answer to that, and
Speaker 1: I'm like whatever, I'm just happy to get laid right now. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But I think with him, it's like less about having
Speaker 1: to It's not like a theatrical production where like someone
Speaker 1: has to call someone else like slave or mistress or whatever,
Speaker 1: and it's more like this intimate power exchange where he's
Speaker 1: just this very like powerful, confident man and he's like
Speaker 1: the alpha to my alpha. That lets me be like
Speaker 1: all of me. But he's still sort of making me
Speaker 1: feel very feminine and he's like manly on top of that.
Speaker 1: So what a dynamic. He's like something out of a
Speaker 1: romance novel. He's just like, yeah, day man, how long
Speaker 1: have you guys been together? Um, we've married for going
Speaker 1: on four years, and how long have you been together
Speaker 1: before the marriage? We were together for about a year
Speaker 1: before we got married. We got me really fast eloped.
Speaker 1: And did you how far in or were you not
Speaker 1: doing the dom thing when you met him? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: had stopped doing it professionally when I met him, okay,
Speaker 1: upon his request or you just kind of want to know,
Speaker 1: I was just already finished doing it and I did. Um,
Speaker 1: I was either twenty four or five, very young, and
Speaker 1: you had and so how long was this man? I
Speaker 1: did it for like the better part of two years,
Speaker 1: And so he was probably cool with that. I would
Speaker 1: imagine he sounds like a cool, understanding dude. Yeah he
Speaker 1: I mean his philosophy was like, if doing that and
Speaker 1: having those experiences allowed you to become who you are now,
Speaker 1: then great, Like that's if that's what it took for
Speaker 1: you to like find your voice and your authentic self
Speaker 1: and that you feel centered and good about it, and
Speaker 1: that is that? Do you do? You would you describe
Speaker 1: that as accurate, like damming helped you find yourself? Yeah? Absolutely.
Speaker 1: I found it a really empowering experience and it gave
Speaker 1: me permission to be assertive as a woman. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: it's funny how those that in our sexual lives like
Speaker 1: if we can assert ourselves and explore even if it
Speaker 1: that means we asserting ourselves and that we want to
Speaker 1: be a submissive or something that's exploring our sexuality in
Speaker 1: a way like to our truest, most genuine self. It feels. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of like you have a little pep in
Speaker 1: your step because once you understand yourself as a woman sexually,
Speaker 1: it's I don't know, you do feel this like power, yeah,
Speaker 1: just within yourself. It's kind of nice. Yeah, so that's exactly.
Speaker 1: I found it a really empowering, fulfilling, positive experience. It's awesome.
Speaker 1: I think he could see that, so he was supportive
Speaker 1: of it. And I mean the other hard thing to
Speaker 1: that was like I knew even then that I wanted
Speaker 1: to write about it, So when I was telling him
Speaker 1: about it, it it was like, not only did I do this,
Speaker 1: but like I'm planning on meeting public with it, Like
Speaker 1: this isn't a dirty secret that I'm ashamed of. I
Speaker 1: feel like it's important to talk about it. And he
Speaker 1: was cool, Yeah, have you had any backlash? Um? I
Speaker 1: mean talking about sex stuff, not to my face and
Speaker 1: not from like anyone that matters. I mean, certainly like
Speaker 1: the comments section of the articles that are being published,
Speaker 1: I'm saying, always the worst there. I mean there's, like
Speaker 1: you talked about before, there was a little girl's target
Speaker 1: ad that you couldn't read the comments on because it
Speaker 1: was like calling girls slots, and I mean there was
Speaker 1: there was an ad the other day for a mattress
Speaker 1: company that featured a homosexual couple that of course was
Speaker 1: a nightmare. You know, just a lot of bad stuff.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean I'm sure there are people out
Speaker 1: there who are offended and calling me a slut and
Speaker 1: a prostitute and everything else, and like that's fine. It's
Speaker 1: like l o l okay. I hope you love yourself
Speaker 1: more one day. But yeah, I mean you guys take
Speaker 1: that in stride so well. And yeah, yeah, it's weird.
Speaker 1: Like when it first happened, I was like, well, You're mean,
Speaker 1: what the fuck you don't know me? But then it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: they just don't love themselves exactly, And I'm like I
Speaker 1: want to defend myself, and then I'm like, that's a
Speaker 1: waste of energy. The best of defending yourself is just
Speaker 1: continuing to be yourself. I think that's the best way
Speaker 1: to defend yourself, like unapologetically. You know, uh, as far
Speaker 1: as writing about it, did you sign any kind of
Speaker 1: like nondisclosure forms or anything like while working at the
Speaker 1: dungeon and the clients don't either, or so that famous
Speaker 1: person like he just trusted that could mean or he
Speaker 1: just doesn't give a ship or it doesn't give a ship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, no one should give a ship. It's like
Speaker 1: when people get caught with with um sex workers of
Speaker 1: any kind, it's always this like huge scandal. I'm like,
Speaker 1: can we stop being so fucking surprised that that men
Speaker 1: and women will seek out a sex worker because maybe
Speaker 1: their partner is or they don't have a partner, or
Speaker 1: their partner's judge or something like it's not a big deal. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean the only tales is like as far as
Speaker 1: like some people do consider it infidelity, Like if you're
Speaker 1: having sex with someone else. I mean that that's a
Speaker 1: private discussion that the rest of society doesn't need to
Speaker 1: drive on part of Yeah, well, I mean I'm not
Speaker 1: supportive of that, Like I think it's way better to
Speaker 1: be open and honest in your relationship. Like I don't
Speaker 1: think lying to your partner is a great idea, But
Speaker 1: I mean I also fully recognize that it happens, and
Speaker 1: sometimes it could save the marriage or the relationship, and
Speaker 1: sometimes it doesn't. But it's like, you know, everyone, are
Speaker 1: you monogamous with your husband? Yeah? And is that something
Speaker 1: that you want to happen forever or you you don't
Speaker 1: know or you assume or until further notice. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think I've been through enough, even at the young age,
Speaker 1: that I feel like I'm still at to recognize that
Speaker 1: saying anything about forever is like dumb yea, you just
Speaker 1: don't know how things are gonna feel, or how you're
Speaker 1: going to change, or what life is going to look like.
Speaker 1: So I'm always hesitant to like put that out there,
Speaker 1: but I definitely know it's the right decision for us.
Speaker 1: I mean, at the somewhere I'm standing and for the
Speaker 1: foreseeable future, I think I've just like done it all,
Speaker 1: like I have men, women, threesomes, orgies, any kind of kink,
Speaker 1: like I've experienced it all. And because of that, I
Speaker 1: can recognize that what I have with him is better
Speaker 1: than all of it combined. And that intimacy that I
Speaker 1: have with him is just so special. And I mean
Speaker 1: it helps that he's a sex god, like the man
Speaker 1: is just like, sure, your husband's a sex guy. He's
Speaker 1: how so oh my god, it's men talk about like,
Speaker 1: oh I get off on your pleasure. He actually means
Speaker 1: they're great, Like he just is so committed to like
Speaker 1: me getting off and not just once, like you know,
Speaker 1: like it's time to move on, and he's like, no,
Speaker 1: we're not done yet. His mission in life to just
Speaker 1: make sure like you come as much as you want to. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's pretty nice. So it I mean to have that,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't want anything else. Like I used
Speaker 1: to kind of make fun of people where I was like,
Speaker 1: you don't fantasize about your partner like you think about
Speaker 1: porn or you're reading dirty shit or whatever. And because
Speaker 1: that's what I was doing, and I caught myself fantasizing
Speaker 1: about my husband, and I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I'm that person, Like this is weird. I've made fun
Speaker 1: of people for so long, but like, you fucking liar. No,
Speaker 1: it's a thing. I was just talking to Steven the
Speaker 1: other day about it, Like I I usually when I mastered,
Speaker 1: me like fantasize about him him with another woman because
Speaker 1: I have like a cuck holding kink button. And He's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: when I I fantasize about you, I'm like but because
Speaker 1: I have that cuck holding thing, I'm like just me, No,
Speaker 1: you kind of fansizing other people like who else? She
Speaker 1: goes just you shut up, all right, But I'm like, no,
Speaker 1: like fantasy, fantasy about it. Yeah, yeah, but that's that's great,
Speaker 1: and it is. It's something that people think, is it
Speaker 1: real or everyone's lying when they say that, or it's
Speaker 1: just because they want everyone to think that that's the case.
Speaker 1: But it's something that exists when couples. Husband Ken just
Speaker 1: fantasized about his wife and there you know, yeah, it's
Speaker 1: and I'm totally comfortable or I was always comfortable being like, no,
Speaker 1: I don't fantasize about you. I'm watching porn when I'm
Speaker 1: asking and I'm like reading a dirty novel or whatever,
Speaker 1: but it's now I'm where I'm like, yeah, I'm fantasizing
Speaker 1: about my sex god of a husband. How did you
Speaker 1: guys meet? We worked together on the construction site for
Speaker 1: almost three years and like a connected well, so we
Speaker 1: connected in the sense that he was like in charge
Speaker 1: on site of the general contractor, and so pretty much
Speaker 1: any time I had to go talk to him, it
Speaker 1: was because my team had fucked something up that was
Speaker 1: going to mess with his schedule and I had to
Speaker 1: go and be like sorry, like this is not good.
Speaker 1: And I you know, at that point, I'm working as
Speaker 1: a dominatrix and was not really intimidated by anyone, like
Speaker 1: because I just dealt with so much. Nothing phased me.
Speaker 1: He intimidated the ship out of me. I was always like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'll talk to this guy. So then I mean, just
Speaker 1: like very end of the job, we finally connected. Like
Speaker 1: it was a party where I mean, because it's a
Speaker 1: job site, it's pretty much all men. So when we
Speaker 1: would go out drinking and whatever, all the guys would
Speaker 1: get just like trashed and I would be one of
Speaker 1: the only women. And it was always just like it
Speaker 1: would get a little uncomfortable there's not there's not a
Speaker 1: lot of women in construction in part of it kind of,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, man, it's got to be rough to
Speaker 1: be the only check on us a new development site,
Speaker 1: like yeah, And so he was like the only guy
Speaker 1: there who was like still pretty much sober and just
Speaker 1: like in control, and he was like dealing with the situation.
Speaker 1: And I was turned on by that. And then it
Speaker 1: was weird because he was such a gentleman, like that
Speaker 1: traditional gentleman where like I know he was going to
Speaker 1: drive me back to my hotel that night, and you know,
Speaker 1: we like walk out to the car and he won't
Speaker 1: unlock it until he gets to it to open the door,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, what the funk? Body, Like I don't want,
Speaker 1: I don't need you to know my door, Like what
Speaker 1: are you doing? And then so he kept doing stuff
Speaker 1: like that. We're like we're walking down the sidewalk and
Speaker 1: he would like insist on being on the outside protect me,
Speaker 1: and I was like, why are you doing? I see
Speaker 1: I I'm I was so runs us over. We're both
Speaker 1: fucked trying to be a hero in an instance, But
Speaker 1: what if what if their bones get stuck in the
Speaker 1: wheels and then you're saved. Well I've not thought about
Speaker 1: that part. Yeah, I would be like I would be like,
Speaker 1: thank god you died for me. I mean, I want
Speaker 1: my boyfriend, but come on, it's got to be one
Speaker 1: of us, one of us. It's not going to be made.
Speaker 1: So you were a little like Yeah, I was like,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm come off. It's kind of confit in whatever,
Speaker 1: woman like, I don't need you to do that stuff
Speaker 1: for me. And then I stopped and really like process
Speaker 1: that he was being genuine about it, right, and that's important.
Speaker 1: Realized that he was. You know, I'd spent years being
Speaker 1: like worshiped and looked up to by all these men
Speaker 1: who were like being submissive to me, but it was
Speaker 1: always about their pleasure. It was never really about me
Speaker 1: or anything to do with deepest thinking. Dominatrix really really
Speaker 1: reflected he was the only man who had ever really
Speaker 1: made me feel like that, like he it was about me,
Speaker 1: and he legitimately cared about me that much and like
Speaker 1: worshiped me in a way without but was still this
Speaker 1: very masculine, powerful man. And that was just a balance,
Speaker 1: a delicate balance. But if you're going to achieve it,
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, that's reality check that that exists too.
Speaker 1: And then also just that like I think I had
Speaker 1: gotten really confused and my self worth had gotten really
Speaker 1: caught up in my sexuality, Like that was what I
Speaker 1: brought to the table, and for him, it wasn't about that.
Speaker 1: It was like he loved me for me, and like
Speaker 1: the sex was great, but you know, he didn't need
Speaker 1: me to like be a performing monkey or like you
Speaker 1: know right right right, like oh, let's get other women
Speaker 1: or whatever. Yeah, exactly like cold girlfriend's home. He was like,
Speaker 1: because I that was so my automatic at that point,
Speaker 1: where I was like, I mean, do you want to
Speaker 1: bring another girl home? I'm okay with it, and he
Speaker 1: was like, no, I want you. And I was like
Speaker 1: that's real. Like I just kept waiting for the other
Speaker 1: shoe to drop. You're clearly like there's something and I'm
Speaker 1: waiting for it. So so I married him. Damn. It's
Speaker 1: like that's great. And then now you have a baby
Speaker 1: and you have a book. Wow, you're so together. Oh
Speaker 1: that's funny, and you're like in control of your sexuality,
Speaker 1: like you're just like you all like that. That's fucking cool. Thanks,
Speaker 1: that's admirable. Thank you, and we're gonna wrap up soon.
Speaker 1: But uh, with any book, um, the publicist always sends
Speaker 1: like an interesting sheet of like facts Jenny can tell you.
Speaker 1: So one of the things that Christine and I looked
Speaker 1: at was how to be submissive but still a feminist.
Speaker 1: I want to see, what are your thoughts on that.
Speaker 1: We love those publicist sheets. Nothing makes us laugh harder.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, tell us about this feminist, Jenna. I
Speaker 1: have to get a straight face first. I think like
Speaker 1: women have a hard time with this where it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: you can't be a submissive and be a feminist because
Speaker 1: then like you're serving a man, or you're like giving
Speaker 1: your power to a man, and I think the more
Speaker 1: looks more like a militant feminist. Up it is, I've
Speaker 1: heard of it. I've heard that, But I think people
Speaker 1: just get really confused, and there's this misconception that like
Speaker 1: being submissive is surrendering your power, and I think when
Speaker 1: it's in a healthy relationship, unlike what has maybe been
Speaker 1: presented in some of the mainstream media, it's it's so
Speaker 1: empowering and the submissive is actually the one in control.
Speaker 1: They can stop the scene at any time. They the
Speaker 1: dominant is only doing it because it please submissive, so
Speaker 1: in a way they are serving the submissive. So it's
Speaker 1: like it's a very nuanced, complex power exchange. So I
Speaker 1: think I just think it's important to reassure women because
Speaker 1: so many of them do have submissive fantasies, that that's
Speaker 1: okay and it doesn't mean like it says nothing about
Speaker 1: you as a woman a fifties housewife, and like you
Speaker 1: can have whatever dynamic you want outside of the bedroom
Speaker 1: and like that's fine, or you can carry it outside
Speaker 1: of the bedroom if that turns you on, and like
Speaker 1: you're both okay with that. But I just think it's
Speaker 1: importan and to point out to women that like that
Speaker 1: is fine, Like you are still a strong woman. It
Speaker 1: doesn't mean you're like weaker or it's all, you're almost
Speaker 1: stronger than a lot of women who who don't want
Speaker 1: to explore their sexuality or kind of explore certain crevices
Speaker 1: of it, because it's like and you feel more in
Speaker 1: control of yourself. And not to say you're better or
Speaker 1: worse than any other woman, but it's like womanhood is
Speaker 1: very and feminist. It's just like do you and as
Speaker 1: long as no one's getting hurt and you're enjoying yourself
Speaker 1: and you feel empowered. There you go so perfect. Do
Speaker 1: you have any other thoughts or that you We haven't
Speaker 1: asked you about things that you want to convey to
Speaker 1: the audience. I don't think. So where can we buy
Speaker 1: your book? You can get my book pretty much anywhere
Speaker 1: books are sold, so Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Indie, Bound Books,
Speaker 1: a million, whatever. All the other sites are scarlet right,
Speaker 1: It's called the Scarlet Letters. My alter ego was Mrs Scarlet,
Speaker 1: so it's the Scarlet Letters. My secret ear of men
Speaker 1: in an ell A Dungeon. And I'm also on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram,
Speaker 1: and in all cases I have an interesting last name,
Speaker 1: so I just have Jenny nord Back is my handle,
Speaker 1: and that's j E n n y n O R
Speaker 1: D b A K. Sweet. Wow. This has been so much,
Speaker 1: but I learned so much. Thank you so excited. I
Speaker 1: got you guys a time. This has been guys. We
Speaker 1: fun the anti slut Shining podcast. We'll talk you next Friday,
Speaker 1: super because I don't try trys. Today's show is sponsored
Speaker 1: by talk Space, the online therapy company that believes a
Speaker 1: therapy should be affordable, confidential, and convenient. A talk space
Speaker 1: therapist can help what you want to pass to a
Speaker 1: happier life. For a special offer for our listeners, visit
Speaker 1: talk space dot com slash g w F Again. That's
Speaker 1: talk space dot com slash g w F