Speaker 1: The Around the NFL Podcast one a Stitcher award. I think,
Speaker 1: where the hell is that? Welcome back to another edition
Speaker 1: of the Around the NFL Podcast. My name is Dan
Speaker 1: Hansus and I'm joining room filled with I'm heroes. Patrick
Speaker 1: Alivan back in the house, Chris Westling back in the house.
Speaker 1: And Greg Rosenthal. What's up? Boys? He dare still in
Speaker 1: the house. It's good to have the guy that he
Speaker 1: knows there. Greg's here, West. How is your vacation? It
Speaker 1: was wonderful. Couldn't have been better. I feel like you
Speaker 1: criss crossed America looking for a red's wind. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: still looking. I'm still looking. It's not good. We ate
Speaker 1: very well, which is something I haven't been able to
Speaker 1: do for the last very good. But this was the
Speaker 1: Great Fried Chicken Sandwich Tour. You know, we just ate
Speaker 1: great fried chicken. I mean, let's be honest here, and
Speaker 1: this is a good conversation to have with Mark. Mark
Speaker 1: will be back on Wednesday, by the way, so we
Speaker 1: should better get this conversation. And now I mean pound.
Speaker 1: It's related to food, especially but meat and a fried
Speaker 1: meat product, I mean pound for pound, you want to
Speaker 1: talk about just a delectable sinful, delicious sandwich. A fried
Speaker 1: chicken sandwich, let's fly. There's a wide range of how
Speaker 1: well they can be made prepared for you. You can
Speaker 1: have some basic fried chicken that you'll never want to
Speaker 1: eat again, but the best fried chicken sandwiches, it's like,
Speaker 1: all right, I don't want to eat that again tonight.
Speaker 1: Your thoughts. Patrick Claibon, Welcome back to the show. It's
Speaker 1: good to be back. I love getting that direct message
Speaker 1: from Greg. Anytime you get a d M from Greg Rosenow,
Speaker 1: you know it's specially Oh anyway, I got some juice
Speaker 1: here and then he asked me to come on the show.
Speaker 1: It's even better. I've gotten some lewd d ms from Greg.
Speaker 1: It's not it depends what kind of d Who has
Speaker 1: the problem with a fried chicken sandwich. Sometimes people go
Speaker 1: too much on the bread. Yeah, and it's it's breading
Speaker 1: on the chicken too. You gotta be careful. Let me
Speaker 1: let the chicken be the star. Can we just hey,
Speaker 1: if you want to put a little buffalo sauce on it, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna be mad about that either. This trip,
Speaker 1: this trip reminds me of we want. My wife and
Speaker 1: I had a summer of fried chicken in New York.
Speaker 1: She used to have a little projects. She would like
Speaker 1: basically make it her you know, Jeff, Yeah, Emca. She
Speaker 1: was looking for the best fried chicken in New York.
Speaker 1: So we just spent the summer criss crossing the City's
Speaker 1: not the whole country, but looking for the best that
Speaker 1: we could find. Very worthwhile project, and I think we
Speaker 1: found it. We had fun. I don't write it, I
Speaker 1: don't remember one, but it was a great summer. One
Speaker 1: last thing on sandwich talking. Isn't it true that you
Speaker 1: have quite as bad on the waistline as the summer
Speaker 1: of milkshakes? That was interesting you Patrick Claymont and your
Speaker 1: wife often have a sandwich Saturday. Yes, pre child in
Speaker 1: the in the in the tour of the planet. One
Speaker 1: of those fun things you get wiped away as soon
Speaker 1: as you have a child. We we can't necessarily go well,
Speaker 1: now that mouth was a little bit bigger, we can
Speaker 1: probably take into more places, but were every Saturday we
Speaker 1: went to one of these renowned sandwich shops in l A.
Speaker 1: Based on some on lists, we created our own list.
Speaker 1: It's adorable about that list, Yes, Eusta, I believe it's
Speaker 1: how you say it in Venice and Greg, if you
Speaker 1: could circle back with Emmica and let me know what
Speaker 1: is the best fright in you had? Okay, okay, and
Speaker 1: think of a fit. Talk, good talk. Welcome to the
Speaker 1: Monday edition of the Around the NFL podcast. Uh. It
Speaker 1: is April the ninth, which it's a bit of a
Speaker 1: quiet time on the league council. Let's face it, the
Speaker 1: draft about two two and a half weeks away and
Speaker 1: things will catch fire then, but we'll let you know
Speaker 1: what's going on. West. You're coming back at a good time.
Speaker 1: This is like when I like getting West on the show.
Speaker 1: We can really dig into like just a lot of
Speaker 1: speculation and just basic thoughts and like you know, loosely
Speaker 1: formed opinions on what's going to happen this year. Definitely. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we got in at about two in the morning. I
Speaker 1: was just telling Greg before you came up here that
Speaker 1: this is the part of the off season where I
Speaker 1: have to convince myself that my job even matters. So
Speaker 1: we will go through the news such as it is,
Speaker 1: uh as well as a yeah, a segment that ties
Speaker 1: into this type of this time of year season slash
Speaker 1: draft narratives. Are you buying, you're selling, you're holding a
Speaker 1: got three options? There three options. I don't know. Should
Speaker 1: you hold in a segment like this? I guess so,
Speaker 1: I mean poor podcast. I mean you gotta, yeah, you gotta,
Speaker 1: you gotta take. You can't hold if you want, But
Speaker 1: maybe there will be some judging eyes. Is there a
Speaker 1: conceivable situation where you could show some onion just hang
Speaker 1: some onion on a hold? Is that possible? Maybe maybe
Speaker 1: we'll find out today because I think Greg might have
Speaker 1: something cooking. Feel like he's replying if you're saying I
Speaker 1: don't want to all be selling, I feel like there's
Speaker 1: gonna be a lot of selling, and so maybe it
Speaker 1: takes more courage to hold. Sometimes I feel like, if
Speaker 1: you're gonna be holding on a podcast, maybe the medium
Speaker 1: isn't for you. That's fair, it's fair. A lot of
Speaker 1: hot takes. I got a good feeling about this show.
Speaker 1: All right, let's get into it and start with a
Speaker 1: suspension of a widely respected linebacker in the nf SEES
Speaker 1: South Division, North South. Okay, let's do some news. We
Speaker 1: go in the closet, roll on the closet, the doors
Speaker 1: flying back there, the doors flying open to the front
Speaker 1: and me and a person we made a lot of
Speaker 1: friends tonight here in the Kangaroo, we're holding the door shut,
Speaker 1: trying to keep everything from flying around back there. It's crazy.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know the voice, if it's like a
Speaker 1: silkier version of Barack Obama, that's Patrick Clayband. And I
Speaker 1: want to say that that's a compliment. Um when I
Speaker 1: do my research before the show and do a little digging.
Speaker 1: Claibron working his way through the ranks back in the day,
Speaker 1: stubbled on a video of right, does your research included
Speaker 1: watching old Clayban? Does that have to do with this show?
Speaker 1: Don't dig into the method behind it, but just know
Speaker 1: that I found this YouTube clip of Patrick surviving a tornado?
Speaker 1: Where was this a little background? This was in Graysville, Alabama,
Speaker 1: and so the there's severe weather coming through central Alabama
Speaker 1: and me and my sports producer that day, Christminculley, we're
Speaker 1: just sitting there. You know, everybody's loading up umbrellas and
Speaker 1: getting all this material and you just feel left out,
Speaker 1: and so it's like, where are we not covering? So
Speaker 1: like idiots, we charge out into the storm to go
Speaker 1: cover a spot in Jasper, Alabama where nothing was happening.
Speaker 1: It's like a Twister two plot and people are holed
Speaker 1: up in a hotel. We're there with him. We did
Speaker 1: a report and then it's like, all right, let's go back.
Speaker 1: So we see our friends are at a gas station.
Speaker 1: On the way back, pull in to say what's up.
Speaker 1: Our friend Mike interviews a little girl, and then the
Speaker 1: lights drop, boom black. The door, the the sliding door,
Speaker 1: the automatic door, the front starts buffeting loudly and cracking,
Speaker 1: and so the gas station attendant puts everybody in the freezer. Um,
Speaker 1: Mike is doing a live hit. The the top of
Speaker 1: the ceiling is shaking and door flies open, and that's
Speaker 1: the sound bite that we had there. And me and
Speaker 1: some random guy go grab the back of the freezer
Speaker 1: door and trying to keep it from blowing off. And then, uh,
Speaker 1: thirty seconds go by and everything's quiet. It's wild. I
Speaker 1: was saying that Clayban on our instant messaging service that
Speaker 1: shall not be named, uh, that I was lucky enough.
Speaker 1: And you know, all these people complain if you grew
Speaker 1: up in the Northeast, I can't believe it's still winter.
Speaker 1: I hated here, and it's like one thing you grew
Speaker 1: up in the Northeast, and I wasn't around for Sandy
Speaker 1: five years ago or whatever. But you really miss out
Speaker 1: on most of the extreme weather and those type of events.
Speaker 1: Tornado West, I'm putting it right at the top of
Speaker 1: the scary natural disaster power rankings. I've never been involved
Speaker 1: with one, but just imagine that bastard coming right towards it,
Speaker 1: churning away. It's similar. So I grew up in the Midwest,
Speaker 1: which is Tornado Alley. We had a lot of tornado watches.
Speaker 1: But it's similar to an earthquake where I realized that
Speaker 1: a year or two after living in l A, that
Speaker 1: you sort of just had to give yourself up and
Speaker 1: turn yourself over to mother Nature because you can't fight it.
Speaker 1: You just sit in your bed and say, do what
Speaker 1: you're gonna do with me. Treat me like a rag doll,
Speaker 1: because for a minute of my life, I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: know what's going on here. So you didn't go down
Speaker 1: to the basement, you didn't do anything like we did.
Speaker 1: We did that, Okay, I thought you were just like nephew.
Speaker 1: I think it's look, mother Nature is not some Disney movie.
Speaker 1: It's a killer. It will eat you and it's feeding
Speaker 1: time twenty four hours a day. So I'm putting tsunami
Speaker 1: at the top of the rank. Hey listen, I hey, tsunami.
Speaker 1: That's a good one. They all suck. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: the weird thing about coming another one to l A
Speaker 1: and like earthquake happens and then people are like, oh,
Speaker 1: that was nothing, and I'm like the ground moved, Like yeah,
Speaker 1: straight up. People are in danger and all these situations
Speaker 1: like like what's the tsunamis it's coming. Tsunami's atop the
Speaker 1: power ranks until you get a huge volcano eruption or
Speaker 1: a meteor coming from manage. All those are very good.
Speaker 1: Life is pressure and powerful. Um, all right, start with
Speaker 1: Thomas Davis. Glad everybody's alive for now anyway. The Carolina
Speaker 1: Pathers linebacker announced on Twitter on Friday he violated aided
Speaker 1: the league's policy on performance enhancing drugs that will cost
Speaker 1: him the first four games of the eighteen season, and
Speaker 1: Davis left a two minute video on his Twitter and
Speaker 1: social media profiles explaining it. Uh he was completely caught
Speaker 1: off guard, he said, he took ownership of the situation.
Speaker 1: But this is Davis. The two thousand fourteen Walter Peyton
Speaker 1: Man of the Year. So this is a bit stunning
Speaker 1: claibron for a guy that has really been the face
Speaker 1: of that franchise. Uh So this is a little bump
Speaker 1: in the road in his career, obviously. And you mentioned
Speaker 1: Walter Payton Man of the Year and that that's something
Speaker 1: that you saw in his response because you kind of
Speaker 1: measure how people are by the way that they respond
Speaker 1: to these things. And before we even knew about it,
Speaker 1: Thomas Davis has a two minute and I think thirty
Speaker 1: second statement, looking dead on into the camera saying he's
Speaker 1: not a cheater, he never intended to cheat. But if
Speaker 1: if you go to the n f l p A website,
Speaker 1: the list of banned substances is scrolling six pages along,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of play says where you a guy
Speaker 1: could get caught up in. In terms of Thomas Davis,
Speaker 1: I believe him here, I do. And I also raised
Speaker 1: my eyebrows when he said he hasn't taken anything different
Speaker 1: in the last six or seven years. And I believe that.
Speaker 1: So I do wonder about you do wonder about the
Speaker 1: testing a little bit, like why why would you fail something? Now?
Speaker 1: And this has happened with different athletes that they fail
Speaker 1: a test with a substance that they've been taking for
Speaker 1: a long time, like if it just makes you wonder
Speaker 1: about the efficacy of the testing in general. Davis is
Speaker 1: thirty five years old. He just turned thirty five. Um
Speaker 1: possibly will have a lesser role this season, but to
Speaker 1: start the season, Shack Thompson is going to get a
Speaker 1: lot more work with Thomas Davis out of the lineup.
Speaker 1: In other news, Andrew Luck obviously, the big mystery, the
Speaker 1: great mystery of the offseason right now is where will
Speaker 1: Andrew Luck be in week one? Will it be on
Speaker 1: the field with a uniform on and shoulder pads and
Speaker 1: a helmet and he's barking out play calls and he's
Speaker 1: taking that hike and he's throwing that situation or well
Speaker 1: hating the picture with the words make here, thank you,
Speaker 1: or will be the one where he's on the sideline
Speaker 1: in the track suit and with the ear a piece
Speaker 1: in and depressing everyone and it will become you know,
Speaker 1: a big part of that telecast just shots at Andrew Luck.
Speaker 1: We don't want that, we want him on the field.
Speaker 1: And he spoke to the media, uh during phase one
Speaker 1: the start to phase one of the Cults offseason program.
Speaker 1: He said he has yet to throw as he calls it,
Speaker 1: the duke, which is the NFL football official football. He's
Speaker 1: been throwing smaller type balls and uh we need the
Speaker 1: sirens sound drop for that. When the duke has potential
Speaker 1: to become one of those words that the NFL writers
Speaker 1: just pick up on and then everybody's saying it one year,
Speaker 1: and then you go back the next year, nobody's saying it.
Speaker 1: It has that, it has that potential. And here's also
Speaker 1: what Luck had to say about where he is physically
Speaker 1: right now. I'm not a perfect feeling athlete right now,
Speaker 1: you know, by any means. So there's still a focus
Speaker 1: on me to make sure that I can feel really
Speaker 1: really good and then be unbreakable. You know. I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't want to put myself in a situation where
Speaker 1: where this happens again and I have to go through
Speaker 1: the same thing again and again. Uh So, as far
Speaker 1: as a breakdown and percentage, I'm working on throwing technique
Speaker 1: and and a lot, but it's hard for me to
Speaker 1: give you a number. There wes your thoughts after watching
Speaker 1: and listening to Angel Luck today, well, I guess, I guess.
Speaker 1: If you're mining for a takeaway, it's that don't expect
Speaker 1: him to be on the practice fields much this offseason,
Speaker 1: that he's really aiming for training camp. After so much optimism,
Speaker 1: perhaps misguided last year. The Colts have been very careful
Speaker 1: aout the message they've been putting out, and Luck has
Speaker 1: been careful about it. Everyone seems confident, and uh, probably
Speaker 1: the most honest to anyone's been, it's been Frank Rice
Speaker 1: Frank Reich on our podcast when he said, we hope
Speaker 1: that quarterbacks go, you know, right in front of us,
Speaker 1: all the picks in front of us, because we're that
Speaker 1: confident that Luck is gonna be ready to go in
Speaker 1: week one. But we're all just guessing until you actually
Speaker 1: see him. As he said, without a governor on in
Speaker 1: training camp? What is that? The governor is something that
Speaker 1: it's like a restrictor plate in Nascar. It controls what
Speaker 1: you can and can't do. He's saying, without limitation. I
Speaker 1: think that has a chance like the duke take over.
Speaker 1: Everyone's you know, you've never been in a golf cart
Speaker 1: and felt like you could get more out of it.
Speaker 1: I always dream when I'm in a golf cart that
Speaker 1: I could really let it loose. That's the governor. That's
Speaker 1: the governor. If you lift the seat and yank on
Speaker 1: a few wires, you can kind of alter it there,
Speaker 1: depending on it's just for you. It seems like a
Speaker 1: lot of working under the hood stuff which I don't
Speaker 1: have skills at. So yeah, I think that's fair Greg. Yeah,
Speaker 1: um I I listened to it, and I just wondered, like,
Speaker 1: how difficult this entire process has been for Andrew Luck.
Speaker 1: I don't know if he's I think he finds some
Speaker 1: solace in literature, and I think he's been reading a lot.
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's been self helped to kind
Speaker 1: in the mix or whether he's talked to people about it.
Speaker 1: But he had a lot of guilt for having disappointed
Speaker 1: his team. He thought he was a distraction. I think
Speaker 1: he's such a smart and obviously motivated guy that just
Speaker 1: this has been kind of a year of struggle and
Speaker 1: he's trying to And he seemed very positive today, like
Speaker 1: he was in a good place today, but that had
Speaker 1: taken kind of a long time to get to that
Speaker 1: good place. He also looked like he was jacked more
Speaker 1: than you've ever seen him, So that's a good maybe
Speaker 1: part of that the guilt you're talking about if he
Speaker 1: if he does in fact have guilt, is what he's
Speaker 1: saying about. Some of the methods and his recovery last year,
Speaker 1: maybe not skipping steps in a lazy way, but trying
Speaker 1: to expediate the process led to him having a setback,
Speaker 1: and he wants to get everything right this time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: as a guy who's never been in this situation before,
Speaker 1: he's used to playing football at this time throwing it
Speaker 1: this time, and he fell into that. And what I
Speaker 1: like about this stage that the two eighteen version of
Speaker 1: The Luck Injury Store, he is, like West mentioned the honesty, like,
Speaker 1: we're gonna be upfront about our cautious optimism. We hope
Speaker 1: he's back. If he's not, we're not gonna do anything
Speaker 1: stupid because he's the most valuable person on our team
Speaker 1: and we don't really have any actual hope without him,
Speaker 1: so we're not gonna do anything dumb. And I like,
Speaker 1: I appreciate that versus, oh, yeah, he's he's good. He's
Speaker 1: gonna be back on Tuesday, And then Tuesday rolls around
Speaker 1: and right next Tuesday, when when he was speaking about
Speaker 1: skipping some steps in the process. I don't think you
Speaker 1: have to read too far between the lines to look
Speaker 1: back at the two thousand sixteen two thousand fifteen season
Speaker 1: and how the Colts and Andrew Luck, who wanted to
Speaker 1: be on the field for his team, kind of handled
Speaker 1: the initial injury. And I think if if they could
Speaker 1: all do things over again and they tried to get
Speaker 1: Luck to talk about this, that's really the point where
Speaker 1: I think they would do things really differently. Meanwhile, on
Speaker 1: the throne of Sleeves, the Boston Herald reported that uh
Speaker 1: Rob Gronkowski was quote chastised in front of other Patriots
Speaker 1: players for being a TV twelve client last season early
Speaker 1: in the prior season, and that incident, uh was a
Speaker 1: quote big part of Gronkowski's irritation with the team that
Speaker 1: I suppose lingers into the present day. Um So we'll
Speaker 1: see what that means. And I think, Greg, you are
Speaker 1: program to say, don't worry about this deal, but well,
Speaker 1: that's that's been your narrative this offseason, right that. I
Speaker 1: just say, by the way, I knew I wasn't gona
Speaker 1: be able to finish this set up. I was just
Speaker 1: gonna say that and then Greg's gonna get mad at
Speaker 1: it started talking. That's when your narrative all this offseason.
Speaker 1: But what was your narrative last off season? It was
Speaker 1: that I was downplaying the Patriot and that I always
Speaker 1: say that they're terrible, that actually, no, they're they're you know,
Speaker 1: they're not guaranteed to win a super Bowl. That I
Speaker 1: was downplaying. So you're basically saying I'm the exact opposite
Speaker 1: this time. I don't even know what you're talking about.
Speaker 1: Every year you say there, you know, they'll you know,
Speaker 1: they'll be fine. I'm not worried about them. But last year,
Speaker 1: as you were saying, you guys were saying, give them
Speaker 1: the Lombardi Trophy in April canceled the season, they're guaranteed
Speaker 1: to win the Super Bowl, and I was saying, well,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't think they're a perfect team.
Speaker 1: I don't think I think they're That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: You said that was ridiculous, that I was always down playing,
Speaker 1: which is basically the opposite. All right, My point is,
Speaker 1: are you worried about this? Usually when I ask you
Speaker 1: this question about the Patriots, are you worried about blank?
Speaker 1: You say no, are you worried about this issuation situation,
Speaker 1: the Alex Guerrero uh TV twelve method Brady. Of course,
Speaker 1: that's led to some heat with Belichick. Now Gronk is
Speaker 1: doing the same method, looking trim and fit, and Belichick
Speaker 1: not happy about that either. These are the two most
Speaker 1: important players on the team and there's friction with the organization.
Speaker 1: I'm concerned about Gronks distaste for whatever's go ambivalence about
Speaker 1: the Patriots and playing football in general, because he's the
Speaker 1: second most important player on the team. The Guerrero specifics
Speaker 1: aren't that important to me. This was a story Tom
Speaker 1: Curran reported about a while ago that they got on
Speaker 1: him about his training methods, and I think was just
Speaker 1: Belichick making kind of a sarcastic comment about it during
Speaker 1: training camp last year. And you know, Gronk, it's stuck
Speaker 1: with him. And it has not been officially announced by
Speaker 1: Mr Tom Brady that he's playing this year. I'll say
Speaker 1: it again or Gronk or Gronk, but you know, most importantly,
Speaker 1: Tom Brady has not come out and said I am
Speaker 1: playing football this year. You know, last the last couple
Speaker 1: of years, Dan, you and I have had it back
Speaker 1: and forth on Tom Brady and you wanting to Uh,
Speaker 1: the gradual decline was setting in and I was on
Speaker 1: the opposite side of that. I'm not going to take
Speaker 1: that stance this year. There's some smoke to the fire
Speaker 1: when he's talking publicly about the end of his career
Speaker 1: for the first time and that his family might not
Speaker 1: want him to play anymore. To me, Tom Brady sounds
Speaker 1: like a guy who's more near he's accepted. He's more
Speaker 1: near the end of the line that coming off a
Speaker 1: Super Bowl moving on, Ah, I mean, how many times
Speaker 1: does this have to happen before people start do? Stop doing?
Speaker 1: And bits at the airport security line not the place
Speaker 1: for bits Packers. Wide receiver Trevor Davis arrested this weekend
Speaker 1: charged with making criminal threats after making a joke about
Speaker 1: a bomb at l A x Uh. The public information
Speaker 1: officer Rob Pedregon Pargon told the ESPN Davis was taken
Speaker 1: into custody, released May third court court appearance. Uh. He
Speaker 1: was asked basically and this was the bit clay boon.
Speaker 1: I mean, when are we gonna learn people? Uh? He
Speaker 1: was asked, and this happens he was on it. He
Speaker 1: was heading towards on a trip I guess to Hawaii.
Speaker 1: He was asked if whether there was any aerosol cans, knives, weapons,
Speaker 1: or explosives in his luggage. Davis turned to his female
Speaker 1: companion and asked if she remembered to pack the explosives.
Speaker 1: He was then taken into custody and booked. Can't do it,
Speaker 1: can't say ball? Let it do it? Is he Our
Speaker 1: whole lives are like an opportunity to tell a joke
Speaker 1: versus whether you should hold hold back and not go
Speaker 1: for the laugh. And you know it's a balancing act,
Speaker 1: but every few years you have to remind yourself that,
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes the laugh just doesn't work. I mean,
Speaker 1: he's just trying to make his girlfriends chuckle about bang.
Speaker 1: The risk reward in this one is is pretty off.
Speaker 1: This was like the chad Ojo Sinko signing of the
Speaker 1: Patriots of of Jokes here. I mean, the the possible
Speaker 1: reward was pretty low risk massive at the most. Right,
Speaker 1: three people are going to hear the joke, right, and
Speaker 1: you're one of them. Two of them have control, yeah,
Speaker 1: one of them has control over the next. You know, however,
Speaker 1: many nights of your life. And finally, the news the
Speaker 1: Lions began their off season program on Monday, So good
Speaker 1: for them getting to work nice and earlier this year
Speaker 1: after learning a very hard lesson that there are no
Speaker 1: shortcuts during the summertime in the NFL. You famously weren't
Speaker 1: happy that they started reigning camp after all the other teams,
Speaker 1: even though league rules didn't allow them to start training
Speaker 1: camp till after all the other I think I think
Speaker 1: they realized they're gonna have to be all in this year.
Speaker 1: There's gonna take another level of commitment considering the backup
Speaker 1: quarterback they signed. Who was it again? Oh was your boy? Oh? Yeah,
Speaker 1: that didn't make the show. This is what happens when
Speaker 1: you go on vacation West that Matt Castle signs and
Speaker 1: it doesn't even make the show. I don't know if
Speaker 1: I've ever seen anything like this in the NFL where
Speaker 1: a guy has demonstrated that he can only throw in
Speaker 1: a ten by tan yard box and people still keep
Speaker 1: signing him, trying to get mad on the show. It's like,
Speaker 1: if I'm Matt Castle signing. If Matt Castle signs and
Speaker 1: West isn't there to deride it, that didn't really happen.
Speaker 1: I feel like Matt Castle would probably be right there
Speaker 1: with West. It's like, get me out, guys. I'm not
Speaker 1: I'm not even blaming him. But did the lines not
Speaker 1: watch the last two years of tape on mac last
Speaker 1: three years he hasn't played, And yeah that he has
Speaker 1: played a little bit. He Dolphins game was gloriously. He
Speaker 1: is in the Josh McCown or I'm trying to think
Speaker 1: of some other examples of these. He is, he is,
Speaker 1: but that in the in theory they sell it as
Speaker 1: he's a great veteran to have in the room. It's
Speaker 1: like another coach. Well then again, he's just now reaching
Speaker 1: the face of another coach. It's like another coach in
Speaker 1: the room. He's just now reaching where Matt Shop was
Speaker 1: in two and that guy is still in the league.
Speaker 1: That's true. Maybe the reason they did start practicing on Monday,
Speaker 1: Kuss Castle is like, I'll sign him one condition. You
Speaker 1: guys work hard to something. They're gonna that's the guy
Speaker 1: we want in the building. They're gonna try hard now,
Speaker 1: baby leadership. That's what's happening in the news. And now
Speaker 1: a word from my our sponsor. Spending too much time
Speaker 1: at the office, on the couch or sitting in the car,
Speaker 1: you begin to confuse what you do with who you are.
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Speaker 1: Spartan Baby. All right, here we go west. It's your
Speaker 1: favorite time of year, So let's dig in to some
Speaker 1: saucy narratives of the off season. Are we buying, we're selling?
Speaker 1: We hold in? Okay, okay, okay, Well, I don't want
Speaker 1: to like undermine your segment. I'm still not clear what
Speaker 1: a narrative our segment. Lest you're back from vacation, rejoined
Speaker 1: the group I'm in. I've got some narratives that I
Speaker 1: think our narratives, but I'm still not sure what a narrative.
Speaker 1: We're not going to start with you then, so we'll
Speaker 1: get we'll get things off on a steady foot and
Speaker 1: let me get it going. I'll start with, uh, there's
Speaker 1: a report you ready? Is a report count as a
Speaker 1: narrative or does it help to That's what I'm saying
Speaker 1: what is the na call it narratives, the stories. I
Speaker 1: feel like report is only one faction of the narrative.
Speaker 1: That a report would not be a narrative. The segment
Speaker 1: could be is this a narrative? This is what you know?
Speaker 1: It's funny, that's true. What's funny is that, for instance,
Speaker 1: report today, an NFL talent evaluator told NJ Advanced Media
Speaker 1: is Matt Lombardo the Johnson select the USC quarterbacks Sam
Speaker 1: Donald Donald if he is available at number two overall. Okay,
Speaker 1: I was gonna do mine and the name of it
Speaker 1: that was gonna be in the news. Now it's moved
Speaker 1: from the news. That was also going to be my narrative. Okay,
Speaker 1: here we go. I had it as the Giants will
Speaker 1: trade out of the number two pick or select a
Speaker 1: player who is in a quarterback. That was the narrative.
Speaker 1: That that is kind of the narrative, and I will
Speaker 1: sell hard on that narrative for this reason, um that
Speaker 1: the Giants are too smart to mess this up. In
Speaker 1: my opinion, knowing this organization and knowing everything, there have
Speaker 1: been bumps on the on the road recently for the Giants.
Speaker 1: They really butchered the the ELI benching and how that
Speaker 1: was handled in general, and maybe some people aren't so
Speaker 1: hot on this head coach higher Uh. The two thousand
Speaker 1: seventeen football season, I feel like was a misstep for
Speaker 1: the New York It was and maybe that's either you
Speaker 1: could look at it two ways, trying to win football games.
Speaker 1: You could look at it two ways. It's either that
Speaker 1: was a bump in the road for the organization, a
Speaker 1: bad year last year, or maybe they they have some
Speaker 1: issues right now upstairs and it's leading to bad decision making. However,
Speaker 1: they are number two, and they're very lucky to be
Speaker 1: there because they haven't been this bad in many years,
Speaker 1: and it just happened to fall where they had dropped
Speaker 1: the three and thirteen bomb when this was a rich
Speaker 1: prospect class. They're sitting at number two ELI and you
Speaker 1: guys know, you guys love this stuff. He's thirty seven
Speaker 1: and is showing clear signs of decline at this point.
Speaker 1: And I know they you know, they love the Notre
Speaker 1: Dame guard and I know they love the Penn State
Speaker 1: running back and all that. But it is just crazy
Speaker 1: to me to think that they would not build a
Speaker 1: bridge to the future with one of these hot shot guys.
Speaker 1: I don't know who it would be, but I would
Speaker 1: be stunned if they trade out or don't take a quarterback.
Speaker 1: So I am absolutely selling on the idea that they
Speaker 1: don't do it. This was mine narrative too, and I
Speaker 1: would just add that, especially against the backdrop of what's
Speaker 1: going on in the NFL this offseason, it's far as
Speaker 1: the price that teams are paying to get up, go
Speaker 1: up and get a quarterback. What the Jets gave up
Speaker 1: to go up to get in a position to take
Speaker 1: a quarterback. The Giants are already in that position, and
Speaker 1: you're telling me they're gonna pass on a guy who
Speaker 1: can replace Eli Manning. Who come on, that guy cannot
Speaker 1: carry the Giants offense. They'd be even as I'm an
Speaker 1: Eli supporter, as you guys know, but they would be
Speaker 1: very lucky if Eli gives them two more years of
Speaker 1: even average quarterback play. It's just the nature of the
Speaker 1: game and the worst I'm on Dan side on this,
Speaker 1: and in fact, more confusion with the narrative. How does
Speaker 1: this even become a report that some random talent evaluator,
Speaker 1: not even in the Giants front office, is saying what
Speaker 1: the Giants will do at number two, as if David
Speaker 1: Gettleman is gonna tell some guy not affiliated with the
Speaker 1: organization what his plans are at number two. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: why I can't be the dominating narrative because it's completely
Speaker 1: or not take unless, of course, it's a Gettleman smoke screen. Okay,
Speaker 1: I think he's doing a little. Now we're through the
Speaker 1: looking class, but I would I would leaning leaning hold here, Um,
Speaker 1: I I agree um that it's it's a preposterous situation
Speaker 1: considering the prices as West mentioned. But if somebody does,
Speaker 1: let's say Buffalo is there at twelve and they've got
Speaker 1: their cachet picks, if they do make an offer, that's
Speaker 1: wild to geentleman, and he's not sold on Josh Rosen
Speaker 1: like a lot of people are. Um, Like, I would say, yeah,
Speaker 1: Rozen's there, if Donald's there, you take one think that
Speaker 1: if you look at history, gentleman has never traded back
Speaker 1: in the first round. That doesn't necessarily mean anything but
Speaker 1: just worth note. But you know, if if in Buffalo
Speaker 1: that's what they want to do and the price is right,
Speaker 1: I can see them trading out. But who knows they
Speaker 1: might have traded with the Jets if the Jets had
Speaker 1: just picked up the phone. I mean that that was
Speaker 1: a crazy decision by the Jets not to call the Giants.
Speaker 1: Because I am buying this narrative. I'm on the other side,
Speaker 1: and it's because I just think they've gone too far
Speaker 1: down the road with Eli Manning in terms of telling
Speaker 1: him how much love him. He made it very clear
Speaker 1: after the season that he did not want a number
Speaker 1: two overall pick in the building. That that story has
Speaker 1: kind of been forgotten because it was even before Pat
Speaker 1: Shermer was hired, but he made it pretty clear in
Speaker 1: some interviews that he wouldn't really appreciate that what quarterback
Speaker 1: would not blaming him at all. My point is that
Speaker 1: they have gone so far to the mat form with
Speaker 1: him publicly, and they've kind of talked about building this
Speaker 1: offense and how Pat Shermer is the perfect guy. From like,
Speaker 1: I'm I believe them because I don't think I think
Speaker 1: taking him almost would be a slap in the face
Speaker 1: the Eli mean not, you know, as much as people
Speaker 1: thought started Gino Smith was. But I think the way
Speaker 1: that they've positioned it that they've said Eli is our guy,
Speaker 1: and so I I am believing them that they want
Speaker 1: I don't think it's a good idea, but I think
Speaker 1: that's what they're gonna do. They're gonna take Chub or
Speaker 1: someone that trade back. They'll be right back in the
Speaker 1: same position next. I kind of agree with you as
Speaker 1: a As a you know, I haven't necessarily rooted on
Speaker 1: the Giants over the years on this show. I'm fine.
Speaker 1: I'm fine with them sticking with the ELI go for it,
Speaker 1: all right, let's move on, Patrick, Do you want to
Speaker 1: try yes, let it rip submit this if it is
Speaker 1: a narrative, the idea of a culture change to fix
Speaker 1: your team and make it a better team. In two
Speaker 1: thousand and eighteen, I've googled Chicago Bears culture change. I've
Speaker 1: googled Miami Dolphins culture change. Um, I've heard that the
Speaker 1: Tampa Bay Buccaneers are going to change the culture in
Speaker 1: their locker room. The Raiders plan on doing it. Well,
Speaker 1: they can't, for the life of me, figure out what
Speaker 1: the hell it means. So the general idea of a
Speaker 1: culture he's thinking big that it even means something. All right,
Speaker 1: that's a narrative. So what are you are you? You're yes,
Speaker 1: superstar on this nebula idea that you're going to change
Speaker 1: the culture of your locker room. You can change the
Speaker 1: culture of your locker room if you have the right
Speaker 1: guy that comes in and can do it. Like Old Parcels,
Speaker 1: he could change the culture of an organization overnight. But
Speaker 1: there aren't a lot of Bill Parcels is most of
Speaker 1: the If you're asking Matt Patricia to change the culture,
Speaker 1: I don't know. But in a lot of the teams
Speaker 1: you mentioned aren't even changing. I'll allow it. If you're
Speaker 1: changing your coach, right, who's gonna have meetings at a
Speaker 1: different time. But if you get rid of Vandamican, Sue
Speaker 1: and Jarvis Landry and so now it's like we've got
Speaker 1: a different well that I agree with to. As it
Speaker 1: turns out, banishing j A. G. I E to the
Speaker 1: Super Bowl Champions doesn't really change your culture. I disagree.
Speaker 1: I feel like it really had a positive effect on
Speaker 1: j Gian. That's true. Is Adam Gatee is gonna be
Speaker 1: changing the culture or is that culture going to be
Speaker 1: improved just because Sue's not there? Even though there's a
Speaker 1: lot of talk that Sue wasn't even a bad guy,
Speaker 1: it was just a situation where he got stuck with
Speaker 1: that type of stigma. I'll sell that too, because fifty
Speaker 1: there's fifty three guys, there's ninety in the off season,
Speaker 1: then there's fifty three and in the season that's It's like,
Speaker 1: it's hard to change an entire culture just with you
Speaker 1: know whatever that even mean, what does it mean? Doesn't
Speaker 1: mean anything? But our ability to change it by making
Speaker 1: decisions is overrated. It evolves naturally and and usually from
Speaker 1: a bunch of people playing on the same team together,
Speaker 1: coming up together. But even then you can add somebody
Speaker 1: who changes that. I do believe that culture can be changed.
Speaker 1: I just don't think we can. We can do it
Speaker 1: whatever we want to or however we want to. It's
Speaker 1: beyond our control. I might have picked I might have
Speaker 1: picked up bad. No, I thought that was it was
Speaker 1: good because all it's all auto cell and it's just
Speaker 1: like all right West this provocative votive. Again, confusion with
Speaker 1: the narrative here, But pick pick from any of the above.
Speaker 1: Josh Rosen's intelligence is a problem. His status is millennial
Speaker 1: is a problem. Him being too stubborn or cocky is
Speaker 1: a problem. How about he had two concussions last year.
Speaker 1: Shouldn't we be talking more about that than all of
Speaker 1: this nonsense about having as Kevin Clark from The Ringer
Speaker 1: put a lot of the same traits as Tom Brady
Speaker 1: and Aaron Rodgers mentally and Peyton Manny mentally. And this
Speaker 1: is what's getting picked apart the guy. Here's what we
Speaker 1: know about Joss Rogan. He everybody agrees he can play,
Speaker 1: and he's smart enough to do everything in NFL quarterback
Speaker 1: has to do with the line of scrimmage and post snap,
Speaker 1: So he can play, and he's smart, and we're worried
Speaker 1: about all this other nonsense that I'm I'm selling on
Speaker 1: any of that meaning anything, Um, I'm with you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the especially the way that Moura put it. He's a
Speaker 1: guy that wants to know why good Like why is
Speaker 1: that a bad thing? Bake Sean McVeigh would have any
Speaker 1: problem with that. The smart coaches get that. And maybe
Speaker 1: Moura would say, and I don't wanna because More has
Speaker 1: gotten himself in enough trouble. I don't want to, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't think he never necessarily said the y comment
Speaker 1: and then the millennial thing as a hardcore negative thing.
Speaker 1: But you have to have the right staff to handle
Speaker 1: a y guy. And it's like, I mean, if you
Speaker 1: don't have that, if you don't have that staff, then
Speaker 1: you're like rich co tight staff or something, and you
Speaker 1: already screwed anyway. If you don't have that staff, you're
Speaker 1: playing for like eight and eight. If you're if you
Speaker 1: don't have that staff, you're you're coming in, you know,
Speaker 1: working for anval network. And people were, oh, no, people
Speaker 1: were confused about, like, well, is that is that a
Speaker 1: negative thing that Jim Mora saying it. He was saying
Speaker 1: it in response to a question about why he would
Speaker 1: have put Donald as the pick for the Browns. So
Speaker 1: even that was weird because Donald was more suited to
Speaker 1: the city he would be playing. And what does that
Speaker 1: even mean? They're they're from like twenty five minutes apart. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what is He's like? It's like Sam Donald's from a
Speaker 1: cold town. It's hard, down on his luck. He's coming on.
Speaker 1: And then you've got Josh Rosen, the liberal elite out
Speaker 1: there with his anti Trump statements, and it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: because honestly, I feel like that's the root of it,
Speaker 1: that he's smart in the wrong direction. Yeah, the concussion
Speaker 1: thing is is a concern, though, a fair thing to
Speaker 1: bring up. Yeah, the the health risks are fair because concussions.
Speaker 1: What we know is that if you have one or
Speaker 1: two or three, you're more likely to have more. We
Speaker 1: just don't know. We have no ability to predict predict
Speaker 1: when those concussions will happen. Greg Yourn, all right, here's
Speaker 1: a narrative for you. Yeah, the Rams, they've added too
Speaker 1: many good too many players, too many guys. I mean
Speaker 1: it's gonna be they're asking too much of Sean McVeigh.
Speaker 1: Much like a lot of a lot of different personalities here,
Speaker 1: a lot of changes, a lot of you know, keep
Speaker 1: to leave and sue and peters handle and expectations. There
Speaker 1: are people that that's your narrative. A team needs to
Speaker 1: sign a bunch of players without personalities. It's just a
Speaker 1: U So you're selling that narrative. I don't know, are
Speaker 1: we are we? Yeah? I'm sick. Yeah, I thought you
Speaker 1: were just throwing them out. I think you could definitely
Speaker 1: argue they're less likely to repeat their success just because
Speaker 1: so much went right last year and health is always
Speaker 1: and then if you're one of the healthiest teams of
Speaker 1: the last decade. But I don't think it's because Wave
Speaker 1: Phillips and Sean mc can't control these men. Too many players?
Speaker 1: What yeah, what does it mean? Actually, it means that
Speaker 1: will be so much new talent that they might struggle
Speaker 1: to find for these guys maybe to get comfortable and
Speaker 1: also to find that put them into the scheme in
Speaker 1: a way that will be as successful as the previous players.
Speaker 1: People are uncomfortable. I think with the idea in football
Speaker 1: that like, okay, you add a bunch of star players
Speaker 1: and then suddenly you're good, because that doesn't necessarily work
Speaker 1: because it's such a team game. But that's like so
Speaker 1: many of the recent champions have added a ton of
Speaker 1: players like to see, including the Philadelphia Eagles. I mean,
Speaker 1: which team made more transactions over the last two seasons
Speaker 1: than the Eagles? Like Addie like I I think that's
Speaker 1: kind of an old That's the way NFL used to
Speaker 1: work when you were able to have continuity. But adding
Speaker 1: a lot of players like that alone is not going
Speaker 1: to make me discount you at all. That's basically how
Speaker 1: the NFL works out. I think the narrative is an
Speaker 1: offshoot of distraction truth ring, Like, uh, you know, these
Speaker 1: these guys, they're going to have a conversation in the
Speaker 1: locker room and then they're not gonna like each other
Speaker 1: and they're not going to play well because they're distracted. Right,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's the idea. Somebody's gonna say something.
Speaker 1: Do you know your your team is in a really
Speaker 1: good place? If the number one narrative of doubt is
Speaker 1: are there too many good players? Right? And and like
Speaker 1: expect how are they going to handle expectations, which is
Speaker 1: like they were. They were one of the worst teams
Speaker 1: in the league two years ago. So if that's like
Speaker 1: your biggest issue, it all comes back to culture. Do
Speaker 1: you have a culture in place that can handle expectations? Culture,
Speaker 1: in this instance is a gym that you find another
Speaker 1: narrative kind of that Sean McVeigh can can do anything
Speaker 1: that they just trust you know, send send you people
Speaker 1: to Sean McVeigh. It helps when your offensive coach is
Speaker 1: smarter than the rest of the offensive less than a
Speaker 1: year older than in Dominican Sue by the way over
Speaker 1: under Rams wins Patrick clay bout twelve and a half,
Speaker 1: it's been set, you said eleven and a half. Last
Speaker 1: week it moved up. I just want to see if
Speaker 1: anybody was super bullish on this Rams team, just checking
Speaker 1: it's a tough conference. I don't have that much confidence
Speaker 1: in Jared Cough. Sorry, that's fair, that's fair. Alright, one
Speaker 1: more time through I will talk the Buffalo Bills, and
Speaker 1: the narrative around the Bills is that they will use
Speaker 1: their two first round picks, I believe at twelve and
Speaker 1: twenty two or one one of those, uh to get
Speaker 1: one of the quote big four? Who are the big
Speaker 1: four we know by now, Sam Donald, Josh Rosen, Josh
Speaker 1: Allen or Baker Mayfield. Why doesn't Lamar Jackson get to
Speaker 1: be part of a big five? He has not been
Speaker 1: brought up in that narrative sense because like he's in
Speaker 1: the he's been grouped with the Lamar Jackson and then
Speaker 1: uh so the four is a subset narrative of the
Speaker 1: prime arrat Yes, am, I I'm right right. These are
Speaker 1: their four guys. They were grouped together that I think
Speaker 1: Jaxon and Mason Rudolpher and that like next tier it seems.
Speaker 1: And I think the over under on quarterbacks taking in
Speaker 1: the first round it is probably five and a half
Speaker 1: or even six, you know, because I think at this
Speaker 1: point people expect Jackson to go in the first round
Speaker 1: and and maybe Mason Rudolf anyway, So yeah, the Bills
Speaker 1: will use their two first round picks to get one
Speaker 1: of the Big four or make a play to get
Speaker 1: one of the Big four. I am buying on this
Speaker 1: just because they're they're in too deep now because the
Speaker 1: Jets made their move, So they're going to get one
Speaker 1: of the Big four. The Patriots now, of all teams,
Speaker 1: it's like an Independence Day when the ship goes over
Speaker 1: the White House and it's just waiting there and you're
Speaker 1: waiting for them to strike. That's the Patriots. So that
Speaker 1: adds more like stress and anxiety. I'm sure on One
Speaker 1: Bill's Drive or wherever they play, wherever their facility is,
Speaker 1: I think that might be right. Actually I think it
Speaker 1: is One Bill's Drive in Western New York. Uh So,
Speaker 1: what is Billy being gonna do? Brandon Bean, He's not
Speaker 1: gonna He's not gonna stay and let the pick come
Speaker 1: to him. I don't think. And by the way, I
Speaker 1: believe he trade or the Bills traded out of their
Speaker 1: pick that became Patrick Mahomes last year. So you got
Speaker 1: that history, and and I just don't think that they
Speaker 1: are gonna come to this point to let the draft
Speaker 1: come to them, because they would have serious egg on
Speaker 1: their face, especially if you don't believe a J. McCarron
Speaker 1: is a sixteen game starter. So I believe they make
Speaker 1: a big move and it might cost more than those
Speaker 1: two first surrounders to get it done at this point.
Speaker 1: And I think this is very good news for the
Speaker 1: Browns at four, the Broncos at five, potentially the Colts
Speaker 1: at six, definitely, maybe even the Bucks and Bears at
Speaker 1: seven or eight. I think the Bills are making another
Speaker 1: move to get up. No, I don't think anything they've
Speaker 1: done makes sense if they don't end up falling through
Speaker 1: on that now nobody unless unless they love Lamar Jackson
Speaker 1: and they think he's gonna get to them. But wait,
Speaker 1: I think even if it was Lamar Jackson, they would
Speaker 1: maybe want to move up to make sure they don't
Speaker 1: get left out in the cold. It's kind of I
Speaker 1: would think it would be a very unsettling time to
Speaker 1: be in the Bills front office when you see what's
Speaker 1: happening your division during this drap, especially after you're amassing
Speaker 1: all of this UH material in slow motion, and then
Speaker 1: the Jets bang you and go ahead and make their
Speaker 1: and then you're you're sitting there and left with all
Speaker 1: this ammunition. They already got banged by the Jets, and
Speaker 1: you don't even know if you can if you can
Speaker 1: use it here. So I'm going to buy it as well.
Speaker 1: I don't very rare that the Jets bang anyone, so
Speaker 1: I'll take they've got him a check. I'll buy it
Speaker 1: as well because I think one of those quarterbacks that
Speaker 1: they don't necessarily have to get into the top four
Speaker 1: or even five, that that drafts are surprising, and maybe
Speaker 1: one of them that they happen to like slips past
Speaker 1: and they only have to move up to eight and
Speaker 1: it's not going to cost him a crazy amount. They're
Speaker 1: gonna do it. They're gonna sit around. They made the
Speaker 1: playoffs last year and they are not currently relevant. So
Speaker 1: what do you do in the NFL to become relevant?
Speaker 1: Because this is a team without an identity. What do
Speaker 1: you think of when you think of the Bills? Their
Speaker 1: defense that Sean McDermott in theory has a sound, They're
Speaker 1: a they're a team in theory sound sneak theory. And
Speaker 1: I'm no, I'm just saying like they were a solid
Speaker 1: defense last year. It's like, oh, they tackled. Well, they
Speaker 1: you know they didn't. And if the team is desperate
Speaker 1: for relevance and really wants to finally get back on
Speaker 1: the map, and the Bills really, even though they made
Speaker 1: the playoffs, Baker Mayfield feels like a guy that they
Speaker 1: would nabe just say if it, let's fly and see
Speaker 1: if this works out. They're the vlat of Vostok of
Speaker 1: the NFL. They're literally off the map. I was thinking,
Speaker 1: what that's the West rep. I don't get it's an
Speaker 1: outpost in. Patrick probably knows it's now post in Well,
Speaker 1: you both closer to Japan, but yeah, it's There are
Speaker 1: many teams that you could qualify as a rebuilding in
Speaker 1: the NFL right now. I think the Bills would qualify
Speaker 1: and the Cardinals would qualify. Not sure if any others.
Speaker 1: I guess the Bears, Bears have been for a while.
Speaker 1: Jet I guess I was thinking NFC off at that man,
Speaker 1: uh Ryan Tanne, who still quarterback of the future in Miami.
Speaker 1: That's a good one. I'm gonna hold thought it wasn't
Speaker 1: gonna happen. You thought it wasn't gonna happen. It's happening.
Speaker 1: And here's why. Because they they are holding, they aren't
Speaker 1: really sure. They don't really they're not buying, but they
Speaker 1: don't aren't filled with the confidence and maybe not with
Speaker 1: the agreement between coaches in front office, and they don't
Speaker 1: know how this draft and everything is gonna go. So
Speaker 1: maybe this isn't a good position to be in holding
Speaker 1: from their end. But I don't think they know whether
Speaker 1: they can do better, So they're just kind of seeing
Speaker 1: what's going to happen. If it depends on the draft though.
Speaker 1: If the draft shakes out differently and quarterbacks are there
Speaker 1: at eleven, does that Yeah, then if that impacts decision,
Speaker 1: then are they really that invested in him in the
Speaker 1: first place. I very rarely. It's a great it's a
Speaker 1: great point, Patrick, it's I rarely get a chance, or
Speaker 1: we don't get a chance. We'll we go off reports
Speaker 1: and things. But we actually had the head coach in
Speaker 1: the room with us at the owners meetings, and the
Speaker 1: way he explained it, you know, he said, I've only
Speaker 1: had Ryan for thirteen of my thirty three games, and
Speaker 1: the way I read it, and and he was an interesting,
Speaker 1: interesting guy to try to read. But I think he
Speaker 1: really liked what he had in Tannehill when he was healthy,
Speaker 1: and I think Gays, I don't know what it means
Speaker 1: for like future or is he the long term answer?
Speaker 1: But I don't think Gays is gonna bail on Tannehill
Speaker 1: in two thousand eighteen, even if there's somebody in the
Speaker 1: draft that they like. I think they have so many
Speaker 1: needs on both sides of the ball that they keep
Speaker 1: rolling with Tannehill. So I am uh buying buying your narrative.
Speaker 1: Well before this became a full fledged narrative, and it
Speaker 1: was only a report payback win the good old days, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, a couple of months ago. Yeah, that's perception
Speaker 1: was that one of those guys Baker mayfielder Josh Allen
Speaker 1: would be available for the Dolphins and it was easier
Speaker 1: to buy then. I think the quarterback market has moved
Speaker 1: on the Dolphins, and for better or worse, they're stuck
Speaker 1: with Tannah West. Strange things are did you west Patrick?
Speaker 1: Did you offer your by hold seal? Oh, I'm I'm
Speaker 1: buying it. You're buying Okay. Strange things are afoot in Foxboro,
Speaker 1: meaning that that's starting with the sec with Seth Wickersham,
Speaker 1: long form on Belichick and the problems with him and
Speaker 1: Brady and Craft. I don't think that's been ironed out.
Speaker 1: And Dan, I'm going on record the dynasty is over.
Speaker 1: I've never said this, but I I think there there
Speaker 1: is something really there. There are problems with with Brady,
Speaker 1: Gronk and Belichick. And Brady and Gronk are the best
Speaker 1: in the NFL at what they do. Now, all that
Speaker 1: can be ironed out, but it seems to me that
Speaker 1: there are real problems. Those are the three most important
Speaker 1: figures in the whole organization. Gronks not one of the
Speaker 1: three most important things. I mean, Robert Kraft is, but
Speaker 1: that's that's a small Okay, Look alright, three of the
Speaker 1: top four most important figures you okay, Now, yeah, they
Speaker 1: they're the two players are crossed with the coach and
Speaker 1: the coach. I don't think the coach is going anywhere. Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm with you. I'm buying in and you know i'd
Speaker 1: buy anyway. But I actually believe it, and as as
Speaker 1: much as I enjoy it, I'm actually gonna hold uh
Speaker 1: this conversation in this narrative because I think what we've
Speaker 1: seen starting with the Wickersham article, it's like a narrative
Speaker 1: regression to the mean with regards to the Patriots, like
Speaker 1: everything has been so glowing. You know, these guys were
Speaker 1: doing their job. They're the best franchise ever they do
Speaker 1: with the Patriot way. And that was last off season
Speaker 1: when they were gonna go nineteen and now. But but now,
Speaker 1: like there's just casual stories like we don't even know
Speaker 1: what Belichick said to Gronk. He could have said, hey,
Speaker 1: I hope those avocado shakes are good, and then everybody
Speaker 1: had a good laugh. Doesn't sound like it though, but
Speaker 1: just sound like it that basically, Gronk had a really
Speaker 1: poor started training camp. He knew it, and in Belichick,
Speaker 1: which you can really easily imagine, made some sarcastic comment about,
Speaker 1: you know, looks like you're the new training regime and
Speaker 1: you know, not working out too great Gronk, and you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: actually a jerk about it. But I'm a full fledged
Speaker 1: cell on this. The Patriots have been They are a
Speaker 1: team that's been coached well and they had good players
Speaker 1: and I don't think that's changed. Um, so yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: setting you getting off the hold. I'm gonna sell and
Speaker 1: just remind something of West Set at the beginning of
Speaker 1: the show. Yeah, this is the time of year when
Speaker 1: you wonder if any of these stories this really matter
Speaker 1: at all. It goes back, though, to a time when
Speaker 1: football was being played. It goes back to the coach
Speaker 1: screwing screw in the organization for a Super Bowl strategy.
Speaker 1: But I guess I would say since all those stories
Speaker 1: came up, they had one of the great comebacks against
Speaker 1: one of the great defenses in NFL history. They were
Speaker 1: tied in the fourth quarter of the Super Bowl. And
Speaker 1: that's why I'm selling just that. I think the dynasty
Speaker 1: might be over in the sense that they're un likely
Speaker 1: to win another title just because the odds are against them.
Speaker 1: But I think they can be a good football team,
Speaker 1: just like they were after the whole Brady thing. You
Speaker 1: neglected to mention that the coach cost them a Super
Speaker 1: Bowl with a ridiculous decision to bench Malcolm Butler. I
Speaker 1: wouldn't say that that necessarily cost him. So what does
Speaker 1: that have to do with anything That has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with that has nothing to do with Tom Brady
Speaker 1: being unhappy. Do you feel the game would have played
Speaker 1: out differently? If, of course, of course it would. I'm
Speaker 1: just saying that. Then a million different things are. How
Speaker 1: do we know that Tom Brady wasn't unhappy with Belichick
Speaker 1: about the but but did I don't think that affected
Speaker 1: his play during one of the great performances in NFL history.
Speaker 1: It didn't, But it could affect how many years he
Speaker 1: wants to play considering this team and the ownership and
Speaker 1: the coaching staff and all of the personalities. It was
Speaker 1: never a person personality problem for the Patriots before. But
Speaker 1: now we see these guys clashing. I don't think it
Speaker 1: ultimately really matters any personality clash, Like can you execute
Speaker 1: well on the field. They've done it well, so they
Speaker 1: like Brady and Belichick might not really like each other
Speaker 1: that much, and that's okay. It'd be almost weird if
Speaker 1: they did by this point after through all this. Greg,
Speaker 1: how about that the Broncos will not take a quarterback
Speaker 1: with their selection. They've spent so much guaranteed money on
Speaker 1: case Keenum and John Elway would not want to put
Speaker 1: himself in the position of having taken two first round
Speaker 1: picks in three years, because if you were wrong a
Speaker 1: second time, then you've got real problems. And I'm selling
Speaker 1: on that that they I'm I'm I think they have
Speaker 1: I think they are in the market for a quarterback. Well,
Speaker 1: I don't know if they'll take it or not, because
Speaker 1: it has to depend on who's available and certain things.
Speaker 1: I don't necessarily think they're trading up. But I think
Speaker 1: they have to be in the market for a quarterback.
Speaker 1: And I don't think John Elway would be afraid if
Speaker 1: the right if if he's into one of these players
Speaker 1: and it gets to him that, don't think he'd be
Speaker 1: afraid to take one. Why because of Case Keenum. I
Speaker 1: agree with you that I don't think l A would
Speaker 1: rule out a quarterback. Maybe he loves somebody, but I did.
Speaker 1: I'm a little surprised just seeing this now that Keenum
Speaker 1: Case Keenum just turned thirty. Um. And when I bring
Speaker 1: it up, it's because if he really, if Elway really
Speaker 1: does like Keenum a lot, he might see him as
Speaker 1: the long term answer and he's not a two year
Speaker 1: band aid. But at the same time, do I necessarily
Speaker 1: believe that. Probably not, because Keenum had one real good
Speaker 1: year in his whole career. Uh, I'm gonna hold on
Speaker 1: this one. I think this one, Yeah, this one's a
Speaker 1: little I'm vexed by this one because I think if
Speaker 1: Keenam was thirty six or thirty five, I'd be like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you know, he's definitely gotta Even if he didn't, even
Speaker 1: if he loved Keenam, you'd have to look down the road.
Speaker 1: I think Keenum is young enough where he if he
Speaker 1: likes Keenam, he could say, I'm gonna build around this guy.
Speaker 1: I've lost all confidence in John Elway's to manage his quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: Look at their decisions of the last couple of years. Say,
Speaker 1: draft Paxton Lynch in the first round. He's been an
Speaker 1: un unqualified bust case Keenum. They've got a guy in
Speaker 1: the building who's been every bit as good as him,
Speaker 1: well up until last year. Trevor simeons they could have
Speaker 1: had Keenum for a lot cheaper the year before, they
Speaker 1: didn't want him. Now they want him for forty million
Speaker 1: more than they were all willing to get him for
Speaker 1: the year before. And they brought brock Oswaller back last year.
Speaker 1: What what is going on with John Elway and I
Speaker 1: I just can't I can't trust his ability to read
Speaker 1: quarterbacks anymore. This after almost giving brock Ostwaller the money
Speaker 1: before he got money from Houston in the first place. Well,
Speaker 1: The crazy thing too, is like, uh, Elway was, you know,
Speaker 1: praised relentlessly until the last eighteen months or so. The
Speaker 1: one thing you wouldn't think he would actually struggle with
Speaker 1: it was a quarterback and knowing the right guy to pick.
Speaker 1: But that's where we are now, where there's doubt whether
Speaker 1: Elway knows how to pick the position he feels. He
Speaker 1: feels desperate, and now he's instead of getting out in
Speaker 1: front of things, he's reacting to things, and that's where
Speaker 1: that's what's driving his decisions. Are you buying or selling
Speaker 1: or Hold got a lot of pop on this show.
Speaker 1: Hold got more pop more than we talked. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: continue to voice the opinion that if you are going
Speaker 1: to Hold on a podcast, she should probably get into
Speaker 1: a different line of work. Like like you're on it's
Speaker 1: a vocal media. You have your opinion. I think Claiban,
Speaker 1: Dan and myself, I'll have one hole the e got
Speaker 1: off this whole You're hosting the show, just the solo show, Mike,
Speaker 1: I'm I'll buy buys respect me. Um. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: it's I think it's pick depended again. I think it
Speaker 1: depends on who gets there. Um, if he's not in
Speaker 1: love with Josh Allen and Josh Allen is there. I
Speaker 1: think Baker would be the pick um. But again it
Speaker 1: also depends on what Buffalo is willing to do. Are
Speaker 1: they willing to throw in the first next year? Um,
Speaker 1: something more from this draft, including the two first they
Speaker 1: have to move up. But I'm also selling is as
Speaker 1: Greg said on Up to the Minute the other day
Speaker 1: about Paxton Lynch in the future, they don't wish ill
Speaker 1: on Paxton Lynch. But but to be honest, well they yeah,
Speaker 1: they said, they said, we have you know, we we
Speaker 1: still believe in him, and I was, yeah, that was
Speaker 1: it was a smoke screen singer. I was like, well,
Speaker 1: I don't think they wish ill on him, but I'm
Speaker 1: taking position here that the guiding principal is John Elway's
Speaker 1: delusion that he has a championship caliber ball club and
Speaker 1: he can probably go to another position because Keenam can
Speaker 1: win him a championship. All right, there you go, good
Speaker 1: talk Irie, good uh by cell hold it's fun. Yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, Patrick, I got to look into another career,
Speaker 1: as do you guys. It's up. You got off your hold, Um, Patrick,
Speaker 1: you are the man on Up to the Minute Live
Speaker 1: on NFL Network UM which airs I believe at two
Speaker 1: pm Pacific time, which is five pm Eastern. Yeah, nailed it,
Speaker 1: uh And he gives you all that up to date
Speaker 1: information from the newsroom. So if you want to be
Speaker 1: in the no during narrative season and more importantly draft season,
Speaker 1: check out Patrick. And also if you want those hot takes,
Speaker 1: we want to do some hot takes. We don't want
Speaker 1: to force it though, but just know that the hot
Speaker 1: take on Budsman always is on the lookout, So follow
Speaker 1: Patrick at Patrick claibn for fiery takedowns of bad tweets.
Speaker 1: Love it all right, We'll be back on Wednesday. I
Speaker 1: think we might go five across with Mark Back and
Speaker 1: Connie Fox. So a lot of catching up to do,
Speaker 1: uh So looking forward to that. Until then, stand had
Speaker 1: the signing off for Graysville's finest The mail Man, the
Speaker 1: old bosson Lindsey fault On behind the Glass. Now what
Speaker 1: guy sa