Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie, and you're listening to stuff I'll
Speaker 1: never told you. And this is a very special bonus
Speaker 1: episode and the first of a bonus segment about first.
Speaker 1: So this is pretty exciting. And to help me with
Speaker 1: this very special, super bonus packed episode is my good
Speaker 1: friend and co worker Eves. So let's get to it.
Speaker 1: So now we are joined by a good friend of
Speaker 1: mine and co worker Eves. It's good to see you again. Yes,
Speaker 1: you've heard from Eves on the episode we did around
Speaker 1: um Invisible Disability. And we're going to do this segment
Speaker 1: that we hope will be a regular segment about female First.
Speaker 1: And we spent a decent, not embarrassing amount of time
Speaker 1: trying to come up with an acronym for it because
Speaker 1: I love doing ridiculous acronyms allah shield from Marvel movies.
Speaker 1: So right now we're working with female first empower. Well
Speaker 1: we'll get there, we'll get there. You know this has
Speaker 1: to be done, though, we're not giving no, no, no,
Speaker 1: Please right in with your your suggestions. I actually came
Speaker 1: up with one of these for the other podcast I
Speaker 1: do and like no one will get on board with it.
Speaker 1: I'm like, it's time for another segment of Plate and
Speaker 1: they're like Annie, but you can also hear Eaves on
Speaker 1: This Day in History class. And one of the reasons
Speaker 1: I I'm really excited to have you on here is
Speaker 1: because part of doing this show, I've just come to
Speaker 1: realize there's so many women who have done amazing things
Speaker 1: that I'd never heard of, I was never taught about.
Speaker 1: I can say that I've ran into that a lot
Speaker 1: too doing This Day in History class, and I'll just
Speaker 1: get so excited when I found out things about women
Speaker 1: to like, oh my gosh, they did this, they did this.
Speaker 1: Everybody needs to know, you know. So I think even
Speaker 1: if there are people that we know about, maybe we
Speaker 1: don't know everything about them, and then there are people
Speaker 1: that or who we haven't heard of at all. So
Speaker 1: I'm excited to to be able to talk about people
Speaker 1: in history who did amazing things. Yeah, and put a
Speaker 1: spotlight on on women who have either been erased or
Speaker 1: just never gotten the spotlight they deserve. That's something we
Speaker 1: talked about it in our Wikipedia episode of just how
Speaker 1: many women kind of forgotten to time? And Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: a big, big history nerd, so I uh, I'm very
Speaker 1: happy to to include this and today you have to
Speaker 1: two women who kind of uh that there's a couple
Speaker 1: of similarities, some more important than others. I was like,
Speaker 1: their names will start with him. Did you go through
Speaker 1: a whole checklist of like similarities and differences. I can
Speaker 1: see you doing that. I do, like, I really do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it's important to talk about them, But I
Speaker 1: want to talk about first first in general, because I
Speaker 1: think there's kind of some I don't know, hesitancy over
Speaker 1: celebrating first Sometimes. I do think it's really important to
Speaker 1: look back in history and see how things started and
Speaker 1: see how they snowballed on from the things that happened
Speaker 1: um in the beginning. Um, Like, things have precedents, they
Speaker 1: don't just come out of nowhere, and I think that
Speaker 1: that can get a little lost sometimes. So it's definitely
Speaker 1: important to recognize the first women, the first black people
Speaker 1: to do this, the first Native American people to do
Speaker 1: things like we haven't today's episode. But um, I think
Speaker 1: that there's an argument to be had about the value
Speaker 1: of first, because it kind of is like one of
Speaker 1: those things that sounds really nice, send really pretty on paper.
Speaker 1: But there's definitely an argument to be had about the
Speaker 1: value of first, especially when it comes to first when
Speaker 1: they are mixed with like gender and with ethnicity, because
Speaker 1: a lot of the times they'll be a first woman
Speaker 1: to do something and then a first Black woman to
Speaker 1: do something. But a lot of Tom's people weren't recognized
Speaker 1: for the very reason of that ethnicity. So it kind
Speaker 1: of does in a way at times overshadow people's achievements
Speaker 1: in history. So I don't know, how how do you
Speaker 1: feel about Do you have any thoughts on that? I think, Um,
Speaker 1: it's kind of like you said, a nice it's a
Speaker 1: nice thing, and it is important because we've talked about
Speaker 1: time and time again, seeing yourself represented directly impacts what
Speaker 1: you think you can do. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: it is it's a complex There's like a lot of
Speaker 1: people behind that, right, and a lot of people that
Speaker 1: were probably forgotten. Um. And again going back to Wick Pdia, Um,
Speaker 1: there's just so many women. Um are other marginalized people
Speaker 1: that did the thing and then weren't recognized for it. UM.
Speaker 1: So I do think like first are important, but you
Speaker 1: should always and I'm just a big proponent of this
Speaker 1: in general, have that context behind it, like why were
Speaker 1: they the first or like were there other people that
Speaker 1: preceded them and made it possible for them to do
Speaker 1: the thing that we're also not recognizing exactly. And the
Speaker 1: way you put it makes me think of how sometimes
Speaker 1: first get shoehorned into things like start adding on a
Speaker 1: bunch of adjectives and qualifiers to make a thing a first,
Speaker 1: like the first this and then the first that, and
Speaker 1: the first this and the first. Um. We had an
Speaker 1: episode on the same history class on the first jazz recording,
Speaker 1: which was by a band of white men, and we
Speaker 1: know that jazz has history and African American communities, um,
Speaker 1: and it's still a thing of note to talk about.
Speaker 1: We did talk about it, but there's also a history
Speaker 1: behind that first jazz recording and there was a reason
Speaker 1: that a white band was the band that got to
Speaker 1: have that recording in the first place. So I just
Speaker 1: want that a weirdness, you know, like just because something
Speaker 1: is the first doesn't mean that there's not another history
Speaker 1: behind it that's just as notable. Yeah, that's it. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So do you want to talk about our first our
Speaker 1: first our first historical guest on the show today, our
Speaker 1: first first historical guest. I like this, And also now
Speaker 1: I'm going to come up with like my own first
Speaker 1: like the first Annie to have a podcast with an
Speaker 1: e Yu doing a first segment with Eve's Wow, You're
Speaker 1: gonna go in history books now for that reason, not
Speaker 1: all the other things we've done, specifically this. Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: let's let's get into it. I'm excited to talk about
Speaker 1: both of these women. Yeah. So, um, our first woman
Speaker 1: is Maggie L. Walker. The ellis Brolina. Um. So, I
Speaker 1: guess I want to just set the scene first. So
Speaker 1: at the time him, when Maggieleena Walker was alive or
Speaker 1: just in the beginning, UM, women didn't have the vote,
Speaker 1: and she was born right off the back of the
Speaker 1: Civil War essentially, so she was she grew up during
Speaker 1: their reconstruction era, which is an era when President Lincoln
Speaker 1: began planning the reconstruction of the South, and so at
Speaker 1: this time there were many people who were enslaved who
Speaker 1: were newly declared free, so it was a time of
Speaker 1: major upheaval. Like essentially, UM, there were things like black codes,
Speaker 1: which were laws that attempted to undermine black people's freedom,
Speaker 1: and people were desperately trying to hold onto that system
Speaker 1: of slavery at the time, which showed up in things
Speaker 1: like sharecropping and lynch ngs, and segregationist policies were also
Speaker 1: really big. These were gym crow laws that we're talking about.
Speaker 1: So but at the same time all of these things
Speaker 1: were happening, Black people were also becoming more involved in
Speaker 1: the political process, and education was playing a huge role
Speaker 1: in the way that black people were interacting in the
Speaker 1: community and churches as well. We're a big part of that.
Speaker 1: So there was it was just a turbulent time basically,
Speaker 1: and this was the period that Maggie Walker lived in. UM,
Speaker 1: And it's I think it's just really cool in general
Speaker 1: to think about women specifically, or Black people specifically who
Speaker 1: were making moves in such a transitional period. UM. That's
Speaker 1: really inspirational, right, I know, Like, don't forget how inspiring that.
Speaker 1: That's another thing that's important about context is like wow, yeah,
Speaker 1: because I'm thinking like like, I think, so I really
Speaker 1: don't want to put these dishes in the dishwasher today,
Speaker 1: And then I'm like, wait a second. Maggie Walker was
Speaker 1: born right after the Civil War ended, and she started
Speaker 1: it back, you know, so I don't know. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: another thing that I like, I like to think about
Speaker 1: first that they're they're really inspirational when you put them
Speaker 1: in context and complain about stupid things like me are
Speaker 1: not stupid. I mean that is a fair complaint, you right. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The first black owned bank that was charter in the
Speaker 1: United States was a Savings Bank of the Grand Fountain
Speaker 1: United Order of True Reformers serious name, so you know
Speaker 1: it's serious, UM. And that was founded on March second,
Speaker 1: eight eight, and it opened on April three, eighteen eighty nine.
Speaker 1: So that was the first black own bank that was charter.
Speaker 1: But the first US black own bank that actually opened
Speaker 1: was a Capital Savings Bank, and that opened in d
Speaker 1: C in October eighteen eighty eight. So there was stuff
Speaker 1: brewing before Maggie Walker came along. But in nineteen o three,
Speaker 1: Maggie Lena Walker became the first woman in the US
Speaker 1: to charter and become the president of a bank. So
Speaker 1: she was the first woman period, not just black woman,
Speaker 1: she was black, but she was the first woman in
Speaker 1: the US to charter and become the president. And this
Speaker 1: was in Richmond, Virginia. And I say it like that
Speaker 1: because Richmond was once the capital of the Confederacy. UM.
Speaker 1: And it is also an hour away from Charlotte's Ville. Um,
Speaker 1: so you know, just think about the history of this
Speaker 1: place where she was opening a bank. Uh yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: When I was researching her, I saw I found two
Speaker 1: laws that I thought were really interesting that we're active
Speaker 1: at the time, and one of them was apparently in
Speaker 1: Richmond and probably a lot of other places, but Richmond,
Speaker 1: you couldn't once you got married, you had to say
Speaker 1: goodbye to a job. That what right? Oh man? So
Speaker 1: she when she got married, she had a job as
Speaker 1: a teacher. She got married and then he had to
Speaker 1: give it up. Yeah, and she wanted to do big
Speaker 1: and great things. So I guess not that teaching isn't amazing,
Speaker 1: not saying that, but you know, she stayed active like
Speaker 1: her whole life doing things. But yeah, that's that's that
Speaker 1: was a really like wow, that's very specific and what
Speaker 1: a law. Jeez. Yeah, she um, she volunteered a lot, right,
Speaker 1: There was an organization that she volunteered a lot at. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there was. She She ended up being involved in a
Speaker 1: lot of organizations And I'm going to get to a
Speaker 1: list of them later because it's really a mouthful. When
Speaker 1: if you want to come up with an acronym for
Speaker 1: all of her organizations that she's been in. I challenged
Speaker 1: you to challenge. I just got really excited about that.
Speaker 1: So I guess I'll go through her background a little
Speaker 1: bit first, like you see how she became this person
Speaker 1: who was so involved in all of these organizations. She
Speaker 1: was born in eighteen sixty four in Richmond, Virginia. As
Speaker 1: I mentioned earlier, her mother was Elizabeth Draper Mitchell, and
Speaker 1: she was a formerly enslaved assistant cook for Elizabeth Van
Speaker 1: Lou who was a union spy, union spy and abolitionists
Speaker 1: who she kind of ensured the education of her servants.
Speaker 1: And Maggie's biological father was an Irish American man that
Speaker 1: her mom had met on the Van Lou estate, so
Speaker 1: the two of them didn't marry, but shortly after Maggie's
Speaker 1: birth she got married. Her mom, Elizabeth got married to
Speaker 1: a man named William Mitchell, who was also at this estate,
Speaker 1: but he was a butler, and William became the head
Speaker 1: waiter at a hotel a little bit later in Richmond,
Speaker 1: but unfortunately he was later found drowned in a river,
Speaker 1: which was a very sad point of you know, a
Speaker 1: sad part of Maggie's life because his death was ruled
Speaker 1: to suicide, but Maggie believed that he was murdered. Really
Speaker 1: sad But at age fourteen, she joined the Independent Order
Speaker 1: of St. Luke's, which was the organization that she became
Speaker 1: a lot more heavily involved in over the course of
Speaker 1: her life and actually was until the end of her life. UM.
Speaker 1: And at first it was an organization that helped the
Speaker 1: sick and the elderly enrichment. It was a burial society
Speaker 1: at first, and then as it grew and developed, it
Speaker 1: turned into a fraternal order in a life insurance company. UM.
Speaker 1: It was a black organization. If I didn't say that already,
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. The order provided financial and social support
Speaker 1: to people, and they did things like lended money to
Speaker 1: people who had financial difficulty and raised money for members
Speaker 1: who had health problems. But after Maggie's mom's husband, after
Speaker 1: her husband died, UM, Maggie really began to work with
Speaker 1: her mother to help her out financially. So she helped
Speaker 1: her mother on the laundry business. So she delivered loads
Speaker 1: of clothes to people as part of her mother's laundry business.
Speaker 1: And laundry was one of the few things that black
Speaker 1: women could do at the time that that was accessible
Speaker 1: to them as work and domestic work in general. And
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know how important domestic work is in
Speaker 1: the history of women. Um So, we'll get to that later,
Speaker 1: but um So, at this time she kind of started
Speaker 1: realizing the social gap between black people and white people
Speaker 1: in America. So she went to the Lancaster School and
Speaker 1: she went to Richmond Colored Normal School, and then after
Speaker 1: she graduated in eight three, she went and she started
Speaker 1: teaching in the public school system, which leads to your
Speaker 1: point right when she gave her her job because she
Speaker 1: was married or she had to give over because um So,
Speaker 1: Maggie was a part of the Independent Order of St.
Speaker 1: Luke's as I said earlier, she started being involved in
Speaker 1: that organization as a teenager, and the i s O
Speaker 1: well started providing like these weekly sickness and disability benefits
Speaker 1: and death claims for members beginning in eight which is
Speaker 1: very important because at the time, white owned firms denied
Speaker 1: the black community access to disability and life insurance in
Speaker 1: that gem Crow era, So that was a big deal,
Speaker 1: Like it provided a lot that people didn't have in
Speaker 1: the black community at the time. So over time, her
Speaker 1: Maggie's leadership in growing the membership of the organization really
Speaker 1: allowed more payment of death claims and lower costs for premiums.
Speaker 1: So she really helped the organization in that way. And
Speaker 1: Maggie's contributions also contributed to the development of modern African
Speaker 1: American communities that provided services like business and real estate
Speaker 1: financing and education, food and clothing and things like that.
Speaker 1: So that was important at a time when communities, or
Speaker 1: black community specifically, we're building in the United States. And
Speaker 1: so over the course of her life, we'll call it
Speaker 1: the IO s L. That's still kind of hard, but
Speaker 1: the name itself Independent Order of St. Lukes is also
Speaker 1: kind of a mouthful, so we'll call it the IO
Speaker 1: s L. UM. So she did a lot in the
Speaker 1: IO s L over the years of her life. That
Speaker 1: was something that she was heavily involved in, and so
Speaker 1: in she co founded the Juvenile Department at the IO
Speaker 1: s L, which provided leadership opportunities for Black children. UM.
Speaker 1: Kids were taught things like financial responsibility, work ethics, and
Speaker 1: hygiene skills UM running the gamut. Here. At one point,
Speaker 1: the order began giving kids mental pocket banks so they
Speaker 1: could fill them with money and then open a savings
Speaker 1: account at the St. Luke Penny Savings Bank, which is
Speaker 1: her bank that she found it, which we'll get you
Speaker 1: a little bit later. And so in she became the
Speaker 1: right worthy Grand Secretary at the Independent Order of St. Luke's.
Speaker 1: And at the time that she became that the Order
Speaker 1: was like it was kind of dwindling, like there were
Speaker 1: only a few thousand members and it was in debt.
Speaker 1: And she really built up the organization to over a
Speaker 1: hundred thousand members in twenty four states, and she made
Speaker 1: it this kind of vehicle of economic empowerment for black
Speaker 1: folks and for women. The Order also collected three point
Speaker 1: five million dollars over the time of her leadership while
Speaker 1: she was there and built up a hundred thousand dollars yeah,
Speaker 1: built up a hundred thousand dollars in reserve. And she
Speaker 1: held that Grand secretary position until she died. So she
Speaker 1: was committed to the post she was and she also
Speaker 1: employed a lot of black women um at the organization.
Speaker 1: She donated to black schools, especially ones for girls, and
Speaker 1: she wanted women to have the same employment, the same
Speaker 1: professional opportunities that men had, and she wanted girls to
Speaker 1: be able to envision having those kind of opportunities as
Speaker 1: well careers outside of teaching and domestic work. So on
Speaker 1: August nine o one UM at the annual convention of
Speaker 1: the Order, she called for another Black bank. There were
Speaker 1: only about twenty in the US at the time, so
Speaker 1: she said the following She said, first, we need a
Speaker 1: savings bank. Let us put our moneys together, let us
Speaker 1: use our moneys. Let us put our money out at
Speaker 1: usury among ourselves and reap the benefit ourselves. Let us
Speaker 1: have a bank that will take the nickels and turn
Speaker 1: them into dollars. So she was really into this idea
Speaker 1: of economic empowerment and kind of self help and really
Speaker 1: building up communities and ways like that. So she also
Speaker 1: at the same time, like in nineteen o two, she
Speaker 1: began publishing the St. Luke Harold, the newspaper of the
Speaker 1: Independent Order of St. Luke's, and she used that newspaper too.
Speaker 1: It was distributed to people, but she used to encourage
Speaker 1: black people Enrichmond to establish their own institutions. And by
Speaker 1: nineteen sixteen the paper had four thousand subscribers. So as
Speaker 1: we can see, she was just really like, she was
Speaker 1: really innovative and she was really trying all these new
Speaker 1: things to get to get things going, and she was
Speaker 1: trying to use this kind of I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: holy trinity. Well she was. She was trying to use
Speaker 1: this trinity of the paper and a department store that
Speaker 1: she later opened up and the bank too create this
Speaker 1: like bustling and thriving part of the black community in Richmond. Right.
Speaker 1: And like we said, this is when things were it
Speaker 1: was reconstruction and things were bidding getting built. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I love that she opened a department store. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: didn't do so hot. Um ended up closing. I think
Speaker 1: it opened in nineteen o five and it closed in
Speaker 1: nineteen eleven because black people weren't supporting it. Um. And
Speaker 1: that's not I know I can sound bad, but the
Speaker 1: black people didn't come out to it, and they should
Speaker 1: have done this, But it's kind of like they felt
Speaker 1: that pressure at the time from white owned businesses. They
Speaker 1: thought that there would be repercussions for them visiting that
Speaker 1: business as well, because white owned businesses and white people
Speaker 1: were pushing back against the store. Because Maggie was trying
Speaker 1: to use it as this place where that would feel
Speaker 1: safer for black people to go and would also employ
Speaker 1: a lot more black people, but because they didn't get
Speaker 1: to where they needed to be financially, it had to close. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so things fail sometimes. I don't think that should detract
Speaker 1: us from our missions, do you know? Otherwise I don't
Speaker 1: know where i'd be. I'd just be at home. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: Thank you for that. You know, I don't turn it down.
Speaker 1: I'll accept it. I appreciate it. I believe in you, Annie,
Speaker 1: Thank you. I know that that's not what will happen
Speaker 1: with your life. This is not a like hit on
Speaker 1: pick Star movies or anything that just made me really
Speaker 1: sad for some reason. So there were a lot of
Speaker 1: racial stereotypes at the time that discouraged white bankers from
Speaker 1: loaning money to black people, and because they thought that
Speaker 1: black people wouldn't repay the loans, stereotypes like that, and
Speaker 1: if black people were given loans, they were often charged
Speaker 1: to hire rate of interest in white customers. I mean,
Speaker 1: we don't have to get into paid loans and we
Speaker 1: don't have to talk about lending practices today, but there
Speaker 1: are precedents for things. Um, a lot of things have
Speaker 1: been going on a long time in the United States
Speaker 1: when it comes to marginalized communities, but UM a lot
Speaker 1: of white owned banks did accept deposits from black customers,
Speaker 1: but some didn't, and those managers thought that black customers
Speaker 1: would scare away the white people who were coming into
Speaker 1: the business. So Maggie knew that it wasn't the best
Speaker 1: idea to go to these white owned banks, and that
Speaker 1: they're needed to be black owned banks that black people
Speaker 1: could patronize. So she wanted to be the person who
Speaker 1: could create that bank. So she was already clearly into
Speaker 1: women's empowerment and the empowerment of black people and building
Speaker 1: up community, so the bank was just part of that.
Speaker 1: So she started building up her banking and her accounting
Speaker 1: and her business skills by studying banks that were in Richmond, Virginia.
Speaker 1: She recruited in It Burke, the hit teller from their
Speaker 1: True Reformers Bank, which was the bank that we talked
Speaker 1: about earlier, the first black bank that was chartered in
Speaker 1: the US. And so after all that happened and she
Speaker 1: built up all her skills and self educated UM, she
Speaker 1: opened the St. Luke Penny Savings Bank on the first
Speaker 1: floor of St. Lucoll on November two, nine oh three.
Speaker 1: The goal of the bank was to encourage savings and
Speaker 1: facilitate loans, and yeah, she became the first woman period
Speaker 1: to charter a bank in the United States in Ene. Yep,
Speaker 1: that's uh. I love the name. I don't know why,
Speaker 1: but like saving pennies. I've just had a good experience
Speaker 1: with every place that I've been to that's got that name,
Speaker 1: and they're mostly bars, but penny the word the word
Speaker 1: penny in their name interesting. So are you a person
Speaker 1: who picks up pennies on hits but not pennies on
Speaker 1: tails or do you not pick up pennies at all?
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I actually feel a deep pang in
Speaker 1: my heart every time I see a penny, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is so sad because if no one picks you up,
Speaker 1: you're just out of our money circulation. Yeah, it's just
Speaker 1: like lost money. That's why I pick it up every time.
Speaker 1: I feel Yes. And this is gonna be so embarrassing
Speaker 1: because I'm going to sound like a cheap skate saying this,
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna come forth. I'm gonna speak my truth
Speaker 1: right now, do it. I can't stand when people don't
Speaker 1: give me back change at like restaurants. I hate that.
Speaker 1: I'm like do you know how important these nickels are
Speaker 1: to me? This is my life. I'm the same way.
Speaker 1: I'm the same way because I have to pay for
Speaker 1: laundry still and I'm always like, this is laundry money.
Speaker 1: I need this. Don't take this from me. And it
Speaker 1: happened a lot when I was in I feel like
Speaker 1: l A. Oh yeah, like taking to l A, l A.
Speaker 1: What's going on cheap skates? Yea. Let me not offend
Speaker 1: any l A listeners. Well no, no listeners from l A.
Speaker 1: They just have the money to give those nickels away.
Speaker 1: If Friday with your experience with the nickel situation in
Speaker 1: l A, please we need to know. Please do how
Speaker 1: I would love to We have some more about all
Speaker 1: of these first to share with you listeners, But first
Speaker 1: we have a quick break for a word from our
Speaker 1: sponsor and we're back. Thank you sponsor. Um So. By
Speaker 1: the end of the first day of the bank's business
Speaker 1: after Maggie opened it, it had over nine thousand dollars
Speaker 1: in deposits, and by January of nineteen o six, savings
Speaker 1: deposits were a hundred and seventy thousand dollars. So that
Speaker 1: provided opportunities for home and business loans, and by nineteen
Speaker 1: twenty the bank had financed over six hundred home loans,
Speaker 1: allowing for significant real estate holdings among the black community
Speaker 1: in Richmond. So it was just a a snowball of
Speaker 1: things that were able to happen after she opened this
Speaker 1: bank basically, and most of the female account holders there
Speaker 1: were domestic workers as well. So her Maggie's vision for
Speaker 1: the bank was like she wanted multiple branches in Virginia
Speaker 1: and Brandon, d C. It didn't really work out like
Speaker 1: that in the beginning, um only there was only a
Speaker 1: branch in Hampton, Virginia. But it was successful over the
Speaker 1: years and it continued to grow, especially in the beginning,
Speaker 1: and it helped really ensure the existence and longevity of
Speaker 1: the middle class of black people in Virginia or in Richmond.
Speaker 1: And so in nineteen there was a stock market crash
Speaker 1: which would have affected the bank and as it did
Speaker 1: a lot of banks and other businesses. Um So Maggie
Speaker 1: had the foresight. She was a smart woman. She was
Speaker 1: a smart woman, and she merged the St. Luke Bank
Speaker 1: with two other black banks in the area, which were
Speaker 1: the Commercial Bank and Trust Company and the Second Street
Speaker 1: Savings Bank, and in nineteen thirty the bank became the
Speaker 1: Consolidated Bank and Trust Company, and Maggie was the chairman
Speaker 1: r chair person, the chair she was the chairperson, Okay.
Speaker 1: The bank continued to operate as a black owned institution
Speaker 1: until two thousand five when yeah, like a long time
Speaker 1: when it was purchased, thank you for recognizing how amazing
Speaker 1: that is, UM, when it was purchased by the Abigail
Speaker 1: Adams Corporation, and then the Premier Bank bought it in
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven. So at that time it was the
Speaker 1: longest operating black owned bank in the States. UM. And
Speaker 1: that brings us to contemporary times. UM. But during her
Speaker 1: lifetime a bank wasn't the only thing that she was
Speaker 1: involved in. Like she was also politically active. She was
Speaker 1: socially active. As we mentioned at the top of the episode,
Speaker 1: these were ready days in in the United States and
Speaker 1: there was a lot to fight for. UM. So in
Speaker 1: nineteen o four she was an organizer of the boycott
Speaker 1: that protested the Virginia Passenger in Power Companies policy of
Speaker 1: segregated seating on street cars and enrichment. And we talked
Speaker 1: about the department store she opened that in nineteen O
Speaker 1: five and she also so here's where the organizations come in. Um.
Speaker 1: She worked for the Order of St. Luke's. But she
Speaker 1: was in a ton of other organizations, including she was
Speaker 1: the vice president of the Richmond chapter of the n
Speaker 1: double a cp UM later in life. But here's some
Speaker 1: other roles. She heilled are you ready for this? So
Speaker 1: buckle in the National Association of Colored Women, She was
Speaker 1: in the National Association of Wage Earners, the Council of
Speaker 1: Colored Women, Interracial Commission, International account of Women of the
Speaker 1: Darker Races, National Negro Business League, and the Negro Organization Society.
Speaker 1: That's pretty solid. She had a lot going on. She
Speaker 1: shod and I'm just she didn't have Google cow probably,
Speaker 1: but if she did, if she didn't off the hook right.
Speaker 1: Too many notifications all the time. So in nineteen twenty
Speaker 1: one she also ran for public office under what they
Speaker 1: call Lily Black Republican ticket, and the ticket didn't do
Speaker 1: so well. She was running for Superintendent of Public Instructions,
Speaker 1: so she lost like everybody else had the ticket. But
Speaker 1: you know, it is what it is. And um, but
Speaker 1: that was a venture of hers as well. She tried
Speaker 1: to go into office also when she also lived in
Speaker 1: a really nice house in a really nice part of
Speaker 1: town Um in Virginia. From nineteen o five to nineteen
Speaker 1: thirty four, she lived in a Victorian townhouse in an
Speaker 1: elite black neighborhood in jim Crow Richmond, Um. And it
Speaker 1: was pretty fancy, Like it was kind of fancy, and
Speaker 1: she has some cool people come over, Like she had
Speaker 1: some cool friends like w. Douvoce, Mary McCloud, Bethune, and
Speaker 1: Langston Hughes Um. But yeah, her house was like I'm
Speaker 1: just trying to imagine this when I think about families,
Speaker 1: like who has so many children who were so huge,
Speaker 1: which I feel like doesn't happen that much anymore, but
Speaker 1: she had I think I think it was like at
Speaker 1: once at one point like dozens of rooms in the house,
Speaker 1: Like she had more added on to the townhouse. Then
Speaker 1: he got up to twenty or thirty two rooms or
Speaker 1: something like that, because there was a lot of family
Speaker 1: that was living in the house at one time. Like
Speaker 1: families had their own like parts of the house, which
Speaker 1: I think is really cool. Um. And I think that's
Speaker 1: another conversation that is a longer conversation to be had
Speaker 1: when it comes to continuing to nurture generations of the
Speaker 1: family within black community specifically. Um, another conversation to be
Speaker 1: had that we don't have time for it right now. Um.
Speaker 1: But yeah, she had a huge family and house that
Speaker 1: she lived in and she lived well, like she was successful.
Speaker 1: Um So later in her life she did um a
Speaker 1: lot more things. She fought for women's suffrage in the
Speaker 1: nineteenth Amendment UM, which prohibits the government from denying the
Speaker 1: right to vote in the basis of sex. And she
Speaker 1: just kept doing things after the bank was growing. So
Speaker 1: she's the first she is. Yeah, her story is really cool,
Speaker 1: and I love that she did do so much stuff
Speaker 1: to empower people in her community, Like that was a
Speaker 1: big push for her. UM So inspiring first for sure. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think that the thing she did, it's also
Speaker 1: really good to look back on because you know, a
Speaker 1: lot of like talk when it comes to a black
Speaker 1: community and financial education, financial literacy, economic empowerment and the
Speaker 1: black dollars staying in the black community is still a
Speaker 1: conversation that happens a lot right now and for good reasons.
Speaker 1: And we're also talking about reparations a lot right now,
Speaker 1: because nobody got paid for the work that they did
Speaker 1: while they were enslaved. Um. But the things that Maggie did,
Speaker 1: I think people it's easy to be able to look
Speaker 1: to her as an inspiration or as a leader of
Speaker 1: what to do to economically empower people and to keep
Speaker 1: that goal on one's mind and to try new things,
Speaker 1: you know, and to continue to educate people. And she
Speaker 1: was just so so determined and so headstrong at a
Speaker 1: time when it probably was easy not to be you know,
Speaker 1: like it's probably easy to lose faith what I mean
Speaker 1: by that, right, right? Right? So yeah, I just I
Speaker 1: think she's really cool. And yeah, so do you want
Speaker 1: to move on to our next first? Yeah? I like this.
Speaker 1: I feel like we're reviewing, like two thumbs up Maggie Walker,
Speaker 1: because you look, what we think about you is very important,
Speaker 1: is okay, And it does all the other stuff you've
Speaker 1: done in your accolades, It doesn't matter. When I say
Speaker 1: you're cool, You're cool. Cool. Heaves gives you the cool
Speaker 1: stamp and you are set you up set. But yeah,
Speaker 1: let's let's move on to your other first, who, as
Speaker 1: I not so coolly pointed out, is another woman whose
Speaker 1: name starts with Anne, and she's got other things going
Speaker 1: on for her that was so cool. Annie, don't down
Speaker 1: yourself like that. If he just gives me the cool
Speaker 1: thumbs up, Oh gosh, my life is made. What Annie
Speaker 1: and I were talking about earlier is that the similarities
Speaker 1: between these two people, Maggie Walker and Maria tald Chief,
Speaker 1: which is who we're about to talk about, and Maria
Speaker 1: tal Chief, like Maggie Walker was the first woman to
Speaker 1: do a thing, but she was also a first Native
Speaker 1: American woman to do a thing, so she um ethnicity. Notwithstanding,
Speaker 1: she was the first. She was the first woman, and
Speaker 1: she was the first major prima ballerina in America. And
Speaker 1: she was the first because she was Native American. She
Speaker 1: was also the first Native American to do that thing.
Speaker 1: But she was a pioneer in the field in general.
Speaker 1: So she was a prima ballerina for the New York
Speaker 1: City Ballet. That's how she got that first. Um is okay,
Speaker 1: so I have taken ballet, but prima ballerina UM for
Speaker 1: for people who don't perhaps know, please tell us no,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm asking you, isn't it. It's like
Speaker 1: the prime ballery. Yeah, the principal dancer. UM, I haven't
Speaker 1: taken ballet either, said you have you have Okay, so
Speaker 1: you're way way more on point than I am about currently.
Speaker 1: Not what is that called the point? One point? The point?
Speaker 1: The point was a ballet pun that just happened, but
Speaker 1: it was physical so it just felt flat on his face. Well,
Speaker 1: the day that we're able to somehow translate sound into
Speaker 1: also feeling our vision when people can see what's going
Speaker 1: on in the podcast studio, that's what that is called for.
Speaker 1: Now we just inherate it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: if you can imagine listeners, so it would be like
Speaker 1: to like watch something that we are visionaries, but if
Speaker 1: you can imagine, it's like to watch we are ever
Speaker 1: died right now. But also who was ahead of her
Speaker 1: time is Ritty was very ahead of her time. So
Speaker 1: she was born on January and she was born named
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Marie Tall Chief in Fairfax, Oklahoma on the O
Speaker 1: Sage Nation Reservation UM and her fa father was Alexander
Speaker 1: Joseph Tall Chief, who was a full blooded oh Sage
Speaker 1: and a big time real estate exect. And her mother
Speaker 1: was Ruth Tall Chief who had Irish, Scottish and Dutch roots.
Speaker 1: And at that time, the O Sage were the wealthiest
Speaker 1: tribe in the US since they had discovered oil on
Speaker 1: their land and everyone held mentmal rights. But you know,
Speaker 1: Maria still had some stuff going on in her family
Speaker 1: UM and her father had a drinking problem, which often
Speaker 1: led to arguments with Maria's mother and the O Sage
Speaker 1: were obviously still subject to persecution like Native American tribes
Speaker 1: were in America at the time from the federal government.
Speaker 1: So in eighteen eighty four, the U s officially banned
Speaker 1: what they called quote pagan ceremonies UM, and they began
Speaker 1: imprisoning and even killing American Indians who took part in
Speaker 1: tribal religious ceremonies, and so the throughout the late eighteen
Speaker 1: hundreds in the early nineteen hundreds, the government was enforcing
Speaker 1: laws that outlawed Native American traditions. And there's a old
Speaker 1: rich like I don't want to say rich because that
Speaker 1: sounds positive, but there's a long history of uh of
Speaker 1: Native Americans practices being forcefully assimilated and being Christianized and
Speaker 1: so on and so forth. Maria's grandmother, Eliza Big Heart
Speaker 1: Tall Chief, still snuck Maria and her younger sister into
Speaker 1: secret tribal ceremonies when they were children, which is just
Speaker 1: really endearing to me. I don't know, it sounds really cute,
Speaker 1: but Maria was fascinated by all the outfits, the dancing
Speaker 1: and the songs at the pow wows, and that really
Speaker 1: stuck with her throughout her childhood different lifetime. So when
Speaker 1: she was three, she went to her first ballet lesson
Speaker 1: UM in the basement of the Broadmoor Hotel in Colorado Springs,
Speaker 1: UM And by the time she was five, her ballet
Speaker 1: teacher already had her dancing on point on the toe thing,
Speaker 1: the toe thing, which um is actually not great to
Speaker 1: start that earliest in Julie. Maria also started piano lessons
Speaker 1: when she was young. Her mother really wanted her to
Speaker 1: be a concert pianist, but Maria wanted to do ballet,
Speaker 1: like that's where she really wanted. She did do piano lessons,
Speaker 1: but what she really wanted was ballet, so her family
Speaker 1: called her Betty Marie. When she was eight years old,
Speaker 1: her family moved to Beverly Hills, California, So, under the
Speaker 1: guidance of the famed dancer and choreographer Ernest Pilcher, Maria
Speaker 1: and her sister learned everything from ballet to acrobatics to
Speaker 1: tap dance, and Ruth was really excited to get her
Speaker 1: daughters out onto the stage, so sometimes she made them
Speaker 1: do these cringe worthy Native American dances that were really contrived,
Speaker 1: um to be called tribalt. So yeah, in nineteen thirty eight,
Speaker 1: Maria and her sister began studying basically from here, it's
Speaker 1: just ballet, ballet, ballet, like you know, when you're in something,
Speaker 1: you're in something, and as we know, with a lot
Speaker 1: of people who we're a passionate artists, like their lives
Speaker 1: become that art and they just really delve into it.
Speaker 1: And that was that was Maria's life from that point.
Speaker 1: So she basically really got heavy into ballet from here.
Speaker 1: So in nineteen thirty eight, she and her sister began
Speaker 1: studying under David Lashin and his wife was a prima
Speaker 1: ballerina Tatiana Ribauchinska and Bronislava Nijinska, who was a notable
Speaker 1: ballet teacher and choreographer. So Nazynska was a really tough
Speaker 1: teacher who pushed her students to be dancers at all time,
Speaker 1: but not just when they were like practicing and performing.
Speaker 1: You make it a part of your life, and she
Speaker 1: really recognized Maria's talent and they decided to cast her,
Speaker 1: or she decided to cast her in the ballet chopin Concerto,
Speaker 1: which was performed at the Hollywood Bowl in nineteen forty
Speaker 1: Oh wow, yep. So Maria graduated from Beverly Hills High
Speaker 1: School in nineteen forty two, and she hit the ground running.
Speaker 1: After that. She got a job as an extra in
Speaker 1: the film Presenting Lily Mars, which start Judy Garland. We know,
Speaker 1: we all know, yes, well, I'm not going to make
Speaker 1: any assumptions, but never sued, and soon after she earned
Speaker 1: a spot at Valet Roust de Monte Carlo, which was
Speaker 1: a major ballet company at the time. And when she
Speaker 1: was performing with Ballet Rous, this is the time that
Speaker 1: she went from Betty Marie as her family called her,
Speaker 1: to Maria tall Chief. One word originally in her name
Speaker 1: is tall Chief is two words, but she went to
Speaker 1: she was already using tall Chief as one word, but
Speaker 1: she changed her first name to Maria because her colleagues
Speaker 1: said that a more Russian sounding name would help make
Speaker 1: her more appealing and palatable to people. Wow. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: she started rising in the ranks Basically she went from
Speaker 1: the court of ballet to solo parts, started being in
Speaker 1: the spotlight. And the Russian choreographer George Balance, she who
Speaker 1: has been called the father of American ballet, really helped
Speaker 1: her sharpen her ballet skills um over the years. So
Speaker 1: he helped her on the turnout or when they when
Speaker 1: dancers like rontate their legs outwards so the toes point
Speaker 1: away from each other. I'm trying to do my hands
Speaker 1: doing the thing again, what do you know about this?
Speaker 1: Because you were in ballet? What am I? What am
Speaker 1: I talking about? Okay, So he trained her to become stronger,
Speaker 1: and he just really helped her embody the art of ballet.
Speaker 1: And she even once said Marie even Want said that
Speaker 1: she didn't fully understand ballet until he came around. So
Speaker 1: that ballet relationship turned into a more romantic relationship in
Speaker 1: n the two of them, Maria and Balance, she got
Speaker 1: married when she was twenty one and he was forty
Speaker 1: two years old, So there's a big difference there. But
Speaker 1: that marriage didn't last too long. It only lasted six years. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but so it was it was a rough relationship. Um.
Speaker 1: They didn't really the job or mesh like that much,
Speaker 1: but what at least not romantically, but while why there?
Speaker 1: While they were together and afterwards they collaborated a ton.
Speaker 1: So they went to France and Maria made her debut
Speaker 1: at the Paris Opera Ballet in nineteen forty seven, and
Speaker 1: in nineteen forty eight Maria joint Balancine's new company, the
Speaker 1: New York City Ballet, and she was Prima Ballerina there
Speaker 1: until nineteen sixty. Wow. Yeah, a long time, A long time.
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking about and I'm always fascinated by athletes, um,
Speaker 1: by their like what's what's the word for it, Like
Speaker 1: how they're able to do these really intense things for
Speaker 1: so long. Yeah, Like that seems like so much stress
Speaker 1: on the body. It does. Yeah, I remember when, um,
Speaker 1: Michael Phelps was like phelips Mania and it was like
Speaker 1: this is what are he eats every day? And this
Speaker 1: is his work out every day? What? Yeah? What you
Speaker 1: have to have serious resolve to stay that dedicated to
Speaker 1: something that's so physical and so intensely physical, and like
Speaker 1: you said it, it becomes your life like everything m hm.
Speaker 1: Really interesting. So we have a little bit more for you,
Speaker 1: But first we're going to pause for one more quick break,
Speaker 1: for a word from our sponsor, m and we're back,
Speaker 1: Thank you sponsor. So Maria rose to the top of
Speaker 1: the ballet world when she started the Firebird at the
Speaker 1: New York City Ballet and her performance as the sugar
Speaker 1: poem Ferry in a version of Chaikovsky's The Nutcracker, and
Speaker 1: a bunch of other roles that showed off her technical
Speaker 1: skill and her passion. And so she toured Europe and Asia,
Speaker 1: and she performed with other ballet companies and even play
Speaker 1: Russian ballerina Anna Pavlova in the nineteen fifty three film
Speaker 1: Million Dollar Mermaid. So she was she was talented. You
Speaker 1: have a lot of things. Sounds like it, sounds like it.
Speaker 1: So during her life she was always involved in the
Speaker 1: ballet world in some way. Even after she retired from
Speaker 1: dancing and settled down with her family in Chicago, UM
Speaker 1: she went on to become the director of Ballet at
Speaker 1: the Lyric Opera of Chicago, and she founded the Chicago
Speaker 1: City Ballet and was its artistic director from eighty one
Speaker 1: until eight seven. M So a lifetime, lifetime of achievements.
Speaker 1: So it's time for us to give her lifetime Achievement
Speaker 1: Award like we did with Maggy Walker. We've got the
Speaker 1: thumbs up, ready to go. You're cool. Yeah, so that's
Speaker 1: that's that's Maria taal Chief. That's yeah, that's an also
Speaker 1: pretty amazing story. I didn't know she was in a film. Yeah. Um,
Speaker 1: so if you don't mind me asking, why did you
Speaker 1: pick these two? These two women? So I was I
Speaker 1: want okay, so sometimes they're selfish, you know, I want
Speaker 1: to know more about them. So, um, I was already
Speaker 1: familiar with Maria, so we had an episode on her
Speaker 1: for this day in history class, but I wasn't as
Speaker 1: familiar with Maggie Walker, and I wanted to learn more
Speaker 1: about her. And then I, like I said earlier, didn't
Speaker 1: realize the connection between the two of them in terms
Speaker 1: of the whole ethnicity and woman thing um going on.
Speaker 1: But um, I figured that was a serendipitous occurrence. But yeah,
Speaker 1: so that's it was just I don't know, you know,
Speaker 1: sometimes you just don't know exactly why. Um. But they
Speaker 1: were the ones who jumped out to me, and I
Speaker 1: think it was also like a even though they have
Speaker 1: their similarities, they're also very in very different fields. Like
Speaker 1: one's an artist, and one's a financial like in the
Speaker 1: financial area and the business development um social justice economic
Speaker 1: justice kind of area, and artists, but they're both equally like,
Speaker 1: they're both important, and they're both people that were able
Speaker 1: to look to when it comes to setting andrews and
Speaker 1: setting goals and just being inspirational in general. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that's probably part of it. Not Also, I just think
Speaker 1: it's really good to highlight black women who were working
Speaker 1: in the financial area because we we do hear a
Speaker 1: lot about people or black women in history who dealt
Speaker 1: with social justice, but not necessarily from the financial and
Speaker 1: banking angle of it. So I thought it would be
Speaker 1: really cool to highlight her for that reason. Yeah, yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 1: I agree. Um, and I had never heard of either
Speaker 1: of these women, so I'm very glad to have two
Speaker 1: more inspirational women too. Yeah, I hope that a lot
Speaker 1: of people haven't either, not because I don't want them
Speaker 1: to know about people, but because they get to learn
Speaker 1: about somebody else, you know, some some new people today,
Speaker 1: and hopefully people will continue looking into their stories because
Speaker 1: we've only talked for so long. If I don't know
Speaker 1: whose life you could fit into what hour? So I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: especially not these women, right right, right, um, yeah, there's
Speaker 1: definitely so much more that if you're listening to this,
Speaker 1: you're like, wow, I want to know everything. There's so
Speaker 1: much out there for you. Yeah. Um, but I think
Speaker 1: that this brings us about to the end of this
Speaker 1: our first first female first. I'm going to come up
Speaker 1: with something first female first, like four h but four
Speaker 1: f forever inimitable. I feel like I'm making up words
Speaker 1: at this point. Maybe that's what we need to do.
Speaker 1: I mean, we've learned from these women. You can't let
Speaker 1: barriers stop you. You need to we learned already, see see. Yeah, um,
Speaker 1: well we'll do that. We'll work on that all podcast.
Speaker 1: But in the meantime, thank you so much for joining us, Eves.
Speaker 1: This has been really fun and educational and uh yeah,
Speaker 1: hopefully this will be a recurring first segments. Yes, thank
Speaker 1: you for having me. Yes, and I'll be back soon.
Speaker 1: Oh I hope so. Um. And like we've mentioned, you
Speaker 1: can hear Eves on this day in history class. And
Speaker 1: it's like five episodes a week, right, it's seven every day.
Speaker 1: It's every day. So I complain about my life. It's
Speaker 1: still a lot of work. Like we're all swapped here. Yes,
Speaker 1: yeah that is true. So yes, you can hear Eaves
Speaker 1: every day on this day in history class, and I
Speaker 1: highly recommend that you check it out. Thank you any
Speaker 1: This brings us to the end of this our first
Speaker 1: episode of First. I hope that you enjoyed it as
Speaker 1: much as I enjoyed doing it with my good friend Eves.
Speaker 1: If you would like to email is about a first
Speaker 1: you would love to hear about, you can. Our email
Speaker 1: is mom Stuff at how stuff works dot com. You
Speaker 1: can also find us on social media. On Twitter we
Speaker 1: are at mom Stuff Podcasts, and on Instagram we are
Speaker 1: at Stuff I've Never told You. Thanks It's Always fair
Speaker 1: producer Andrew Howard, and thanks to you.