Speaker 1: M h foot force. If it doesn't work, you're just
Speaker 1: not using enough. You're listening to software Radio, special operations,
Speaker 1: military news and straight talk with the guys and the community. Yeah,
Speaker 1: soft Rep Radio on time on Target. We are at
Speaker 1: episode four hundred and seventy. I'm Dennis Jones. That's Jack Murphy.
Speaker 1: We are very blessed to have an in studio guest
Speaker 1: with us. We're having a This is my first double guest,
Speaker 1: so I'm excited we're doing we're doing a double dip today.
Speaker 1: We're I don't even want to give the full secret.
Speaker 1: We're double dipping episode four seventy. Um, he's your friend.
Speaker 1: I want, I want you to do the introduction. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So Miles and I go way back to range your
Speaker 1: battalion back in the day. Um, and then we stayed
Speaker 1: in contact, and you were doing maritime security work. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was doing maritime and you were and you were
Speaker 1: doing executive protection stuff here in the city. Yeah, in
Speaker 1: New York, and uh, I just kind of got tired
Speaker 1: of burnt out of it and then applied to Columbia
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, follow you were there at the
Speaker 1: belly of the Beast, and then I just passed the
Speaker 1: torch to other guys to come to Columbia as well,
Speaker 1: and and uh, you know, Columbia University. I think it
Speaker 1: put more gray hair on I know me probably you
Speaker 1: than uh than being any time in the army. But uh,
Speaker 1: you know, glad, I was fortunate to do it. Glad
Speaker 1: I was fortunate. You know. Um, you know you were
Speaker 1: there and you kinda asked you about it. It's like,
Speaker 1: how is it? And you kind of guided me there.
Speaker 1: Maybe a glutton for punishment, Maybe it's a trap. I
Speaker 1: don't know. You know, you were, I mean I sensed
Speaker 1: you were pretty exhausted doing the exact protect job. You
Speaker 1: were watching the I don't know if you want to
Speaker 1: say any now now, I don't want to get that,
Speaker 1: but we were. It was uh ep, it's it's uh.
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of some people like it, but
Speaker 1: I mean after a while you just can't do it.
Speaker 1: After a while, you're telling me how you were like
Speaker 1: a one man band. Yeah, everything, Yeah, it was. It was.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not gonna take the thing away from
Speaker 1: I learned a lot. It was a great experience, but
Speaker 1: it's not a career. And I saw, you know, it's
Speaker 1: time to go get an education. I was burned out.
Speaker 1: I was living out a bag for two and a
Speaker 1: half years contracting all over the world. You know, I
Speaker 1: take a break, go to Columbia, went to Columbia, did
Speaker 1: undergrad their grad school, and then while I was there,
Speaker 1: I helped out a lot of different soft guys, primarily
Speaker 1: ranger back guys. Get in. Um, I know you probably
Speaker 1: go there and there's a platoon of rangers there right now,
Speaker 1: and those guys have been really successful, doing really great things,
Speaker 1: and more guys are coming in to fall in spring
Speaker 1: and everything, and it uh, you know, just paying it
Speaker 1: forward for all the guys. And that's another thing I'm
Speaker 1: kinda here to talk about. What I'm doing in the
Speaker 1: next step is the uh psychedelic slash. Some people call
Speaker 1: it plant medicine space. Right now, I wanted to ask
Speaker 1: you if you don't mind like your own personal experience, UM,
Speaker 1: you had, I mean having difficulties transitioning out of the military,
Speaker 1: transitioning into civilian life being a private security contractor, and
Speaker 1: then jumping into academic life at Columbia. I mean it's
Speaker 1: a culture shock, you know. Yeah, it's a culture shock
Speaker 1: for me. My problem derived from I want to do
Speaker 1: a career. I got injured at four shoulder two back
Speaker 1: surgery to have electronics all inside. Yeah, that's I have
Speaker 1: a battery inside my back, electrodes in my spinal cord.
Speaker 1: I can never get an m R. I again have
Speaker 1: to do ct scan from here on out uh med
Speaker 1: boarded the doctors, something I'd never really run again. I
Speaker 1: can walk longer in thirty minutes is really painful, as
Speaker 1: on hydro code on oxy cotton's all that stuff. But
Speaker 1: I never really never really affected me, like depression or
Speaker 1: any of that stuff, because I was like, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: get better, but you're also going a million miles. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm I go. I hedge my bets as much
Speaker 1: as possible, especially now considering back then I was gonna
Speaker 1: do a career, gonna do twenty years, but then I
Speaker 1: had an injury overseas and it's just the music stopped.
Speaker 1: Is like this is I'm never going to recover from this,
Speaker 1: So right now, that's that's kind of how I've always been.
Speaker 1: I have to do a bunch of different things because
Speaker 1: you never know, there are no guarantees. Everything's temporary. Everything
Speaker 1: does and especially in the private sector, you can get
Speaker 1: fired or you can find another opportunity time. And um,
Speaker 1: that's kind of going to Columbia and doing all this
Speaker 1: other stuff. I kind of figured it out. It's just
Speaker 1: I have to constantly hedge my bets. And in this economy,
Speaker 1: it's like unless you're a doctor or an engineer, like
Speaker 1: you have to be good at ten different things. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and even a doctor, they're not making as much money.
Speaker 1: I dated one here. Uh she just told me as
Speaker 1: she's getting less and less, you know, her paychecks getting
Speaker 1: smaller and smaller. And it's really the days of the
Speaker 1: old retirement working in the factory and getting the Golden watch.
Speaker 1: Those are over and well over, and especially this digital economy.
Speaker 1: So uh, that's that's kind of I'm going to college,
Speaker 1: getting undergrad masters again. Just put another not from the belt,
Speaker 1: opened up more doors. And that's my best advice. You.
Speaker 1: You really have to hustle if you're gonna be a
Speaker 1: veteran get out. And the interesting thing about you, as
Speaker 1: long as I've known you, you've never drank. Yeah, never
Speaker 1: never been drunk. Don't like alcohol. I've drank a little bit.
Speaker 1: Somebody give me a shot, and I'm just like pacify them, like, okay,
Speaker 1: take a shot. I'm good, but that's rare. But I've
Speaker 1: never been drunk. I've never smoked weeds, smoked cigarettes. I've
Speaker 1: dipped a couple of times in high school, loved it
Speaker 1: and decide this is gonna be a bad habit. I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna have my my gum line anymore. But I
Speaker 1: just never had interest in it. Especially in range of
Speaker 1: Italian you'll get kicked out for anything alcohol related, so
Speaker 1: on and so forth. So it was smart of you,
Speaker 1: and you also saved quite a bit of money, I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was always the d D so that helped out
Speaker 1: a lot of guys too. I was a great wing man.
Speaker 1: That's one thing I always pride my cell phone. But
Speaker 1: it's not um, It's not something that never fascinate me.
Speaker 1: It's just it. Honestly, it felt like especially waking up
Speaker 1: the next morning seeing all my buddies they wasted the
Speaker 1: next day. Yeah, but then, how did you go from
Speaker 1: being like straight edge to like, let's drop some d
Speaker 1: MT bro. UH just had some connections I'm in since
Speaker 1: I'm in the veteran space, that helped so many people out,
Speaker 1: especially with UH veterans getting top tear institutions a lot
Speaker 1: of people come with me to opportunities, and I'm in
Speaker 1: a few different networks who are pursuing psychedelics, so to speak.
Speaker 1: And I was invited, uh to go down to Costa
Speaker 1: Rica to do some stuff, and uh, five mm oh
Speaker 1: is one of them. I did five mm O d
Speaker 1: m T. I went down there to kind of vet
Speaker 1: it to see if it's legit, because I sent a
Speaker 1: couple of guys before me and they just they can.
Speaker 1: I was skeptical. I didn't believe it. And in that
Speaker 1: connection came to me through a Yale connection, not the
Speaker 1: veteran connection. So there were some high net worth individuals like, hey,
Speaker 1: check out this guy. He's helping out some veterans. So
Speaker 1: I went down there. Well, first I sent some guinea
Speaker 1: pigs down there to check it out, and uh, these
Speaker 1: were legitimate guys and special operations, uh ivy League, And
Speaker 1: they came back nothing but good things, like Wow, that's
Speaker 1: I was expecting to be like an acid trip. You know.
Speaker 1: You know what were they telling you? Uh? They just
Speaker 1: said it's legitimate. We can't tell you really anything. You
Speaker 1: just gotta go down there and do it. And that's
Speaker 1: what people will tell you because just if I tell
Speaker 1: you everything, you're gonna go into the experience looking for it.
Speaker 1: You need to go in there blind. Uh and so
Speaker 1: I so I took the leap and I was like, okay.
Speaker 1: So I went down to Costa Rico. They invited me down.
Speaker 1: I did five uh you know was I didn't plan
Speaker 1: to do five mm o And they're just like, hey,
Speaker 1: you want to do this? I was like, And at
Speaker 1: that point in my life, I was transitioning out of Columbia.
Speaker 1: Had some depression issues, but it's mostly anxiety, as like
Speaker 1: what I'm gonna do was this? And I had depression.
Speaker 1: I was on some medication stuff like that. I smoked
Speaker 1: five mmo. They had to tell me how to smoke
Speaker 1: because I never smoked anything before in my life. I
Speaker 1: was like a twelve. I was like a fifteen year
Speaker 1: old in McDonald's park smoke cigarettes, you know, and uh,
Speaker 1: here I am at thirty six, like how do you smoke?
Speaker 1: I smoke it boom, go right under and it knocks
Speaker 1: you right out. No't matter how bad you are, how
Speaker 1: many what you've done, You're out. And I just started
Speaker 1: it was like I was choking. I was like, I
Speaker 1: was like that and I initially thought I was choking
Speaker 1: or whatever clear, but it was like, no, that's just
Speaker 1: part of the process. And I went under and I
Speaker 1: could I was lucid. I could feel myself. And the more,
Speaker 1: the more you surrender, and that's why they say, the
Speaker 1: more you surrender, the farther you go. Just let go,
Speaker 1: don't fight it, and that's why I did. And I
Speaker 1: white it out, which means everything went white. I kind
Speaker 1: of saw white silhouette and I came out of it
Speaker 1: and I went from you know, like I was choking
Speaker 1: dying too. I sat right back up and goes, guys,
Speaker 1: I think I mess something. I don't doesn't smoke this
Speaker 1: right or something, and I don't like and they looked
Speaker 1: at me like and they hit me again, and uh.
Speaker 1: I passed right out and again professional environment pillows everywhere.
Speaker 1: It wasn't like in a garage somewhere, and I float.
Speaker 1: I was I was outside as a kaleidoscope of colors
Speaker 1: and I was outside my body, floating through space. And
Speaker 1: then I came out of it energized and it was
Speaker 1: like another person. I was just so happy and just
Speaker 1: like excitement because I went in there, I was just
Speaker 1: I was monotone like always am. But and then when
Speaker 1: I came out and you know, I was like, Wow,
Speaker 1: this works, this is legitimate. This is there's no high either.
Speaker 1: Granted I have a true basedlin I've never been high.
Speaker 1: But I talked to other people who've done who did cocaine,
Speaker 1: who did everything, who kind of been in that, you know,
Speaker 1: veterans who have done other stuff, chased other stuff, and
Speaker 1: they're like, yeah, there's no high with this. There's no
Speaker 1: uh on a chase, this just for a high. This
Speaker 1: is literally healing. What have you? Well, A month goes by,
Speaker 1: I had, I had residual of X and I'd feel
Speaker 1: depression because I could feel depression coming on. It's like,
Speaker 1: oh man, I feel it coming on or whatever. It
Speaker 1: starts to come on and then to go away, dissipate
Speaker 1: and then it just went away. I never had depression
Speaker 1: until this day. I was around six months ago. Never
Speaker 1: used medica. I've never used medication or anything since then.
Speaker 1: So I got invited back for full treatment to go
Speaker 1: down to Costa Rica. I did eyebel gain. Ebel gain
Speaker 1: is an extract of a boga, the root bark from
Speaker 1: the aboga tree and western Africa. Um it's uh an
Speaker 1: intense plant. UH. Usually in Africa, the Boiti tribe does
Speaker 1: the actual bark. But here we did is two is
Speaker 1: a jail capsule. I took it and then thirty minutes
Speaker 1: later I took it again. And not only are you
Speaker 1: doing the the capsule taking it, but it's the whole experience.
Speaker 1: For example, between that month or so for my five
Speaker 1: m e O to my UH to this this experience.
Speaker 1: Eyebol Gain had a coach, so we were giving coaches
Speaker 1: through being true to you. And those are people who
Speaker 1: are coaches and they they you talked to him once
Speaker 1: a week, a couple of weeks before you go in,
Speaker 1: and they just try to get a baseline and you
Speaker 1: just tell them about yourself, you know, blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: So in their coaches because they're gonna tell you what
Speaker 1: happens on the back end to kind of ground you
Speaker 1: and I'll go into that. So I took iebe Gain
Speaker 1: and there's a fire ceremony. It's the whole enchilada. It's
Speaker 1: not just you know I'm doing something, I'm taking it.
Speaker 1: For example, in this room. And you have to have
Speaker 1: the environment, it has to have nature. You have to
Speaker 1: kind of eat right, not drink or smoke before that.
Speaker 1: I kind of fasted before I went in. So I
Speaker 1: took a jail cap of Ibo gain and thirty minutes
Speaker 1: later took another one. I had a guy next to me.
Speaker 1: He was just kind of uh we uh. I had
Speaker 1: a bed and I was linked up to E. K. G.
Speaker 1: Very professional doctors everything. And there's a guy next to
Speaker 1: me and uh, We're just standing there talking, you know,
Speaker 1: changing into boxers, getting ready, you know, pajamas whatever, because
Speaker 1: we know we're we've been told we're gonna be down
Speaker 1: for a while. As we're sitting there talking, goes wa,
Speaker 1: I think I felt something. I'm like, you know, I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know, all this is hocus pocus, you know or whatever.
Speaker 1: But the thing is, I have to do this myself
Speaker 1: because I have all these other veterans that come for
Speaker 1: me to stuff and I can't refer anything out unless
Speaker 1: I do it myself right fair enough. And because they're
Speaker 1: gonna ask me what is it like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: just go do it. It sounds like yeah, And so
Speaker 1: the guy's like, oh man, I felt something. I was like,
Speaker 1: oh well. And then so we're get in bed. We
Speaker 1: have blindfolds, we have there's music playing. D m T music.
Speaker 1: You can go to YouTube and pull up d m
Speaker 1: T music and it's similar to that. It's actually very soothing.
Speaker 1: So we go in. I put on the blindfolds and
Speaker 1: I'm just sitting there and I'm sitting there for a while,
Speaker 1: and I start hearing him. He starts spurging. They call
Speaker 1: it Perginy's throwing up. And I'm like, man, I'm not
Speaker 1: feeling anything. You know, this is bunk, you know, like whatever,
Speaker 1: And then I start seeing stuff. I start feeling stuff,
Speaker 1: and I kind of I don't want to go too
Speaker 1: much into it because I don't want to ruin the
Speaker 1: experience for it, because y'all might want to do it
Speaker 1: one day. And I would suggest, you know, hey, if
Speaker 1: that's something you want to do instead of going to alcohol,
Speaker 1: instead of going to pills, I suggest, ay going to that.
Speaker 1: Take a trip to Costa Rica. Uh, some people go
Speaker 1: to Africa kind of a far trip. Maybe you want
Speaker 1: to hang out with the even Barlow or something. But
Speaker 1: you know, but uh, cost analysis, I would say it's
Speaker 1: much cheaper than anything else out there when it comes
Speaker 1: to the pills, that therapy, your time, all that stuff.
Speaker 1: It's for some people I've heard with Ibogain, sevent of
Speaker 1: heroin addicts who do it go cold turkey after doing it,
Speaker 1: and yeah, it's it's it works for a lot of people.
Speaker 1: But in my experience, so I started seeing some stuff,
Speaker 1: start feeling some stuff. People were talking to me. I
Speaker 1: saw stuff his childhood, and I start traveling to all
Speaker 1: these different places and talking to people, and you know
Speaker 1: because they tell you. One of the coaches said, have
Speaker 1: a list of questions before you go in. My coach
Speaker 1: was even Ozmatt He's an Abu gang that's his specialty.
Speaker 1: Different coaches have different specially some of our Ayahuasca coaches,
Speaker 1: some of our Eyebu gang coaches, and he says, have
Speaker 1: a list of questions from childhood to wherever about stuff
Speaker 1: you just have. You know, what do you mean? What
Speaker 1: kind of questions like why? Like why is the sky blue?
Speaker 1: Like what? Well? You know, for example, Uh, if somebody's
Speaker 1: been a rape victim, or somebody's had traumatic sexual assault
Speaker 1: as a child and they're not sure about it, but
Speaker 1: something triggers them what happened and it may take you
Speaker 1: to that experience to where you see what happened to you.
Speaker 1: Jesus Well, I don't know if you want to go.
Speaker 1: But the thing is as part of the healing process
Speaker 1: because a lot of people who do that, it's in
Speaker 1: your subconsciousness, and your subconscious you're like, for example, I've
Speaker 1: heard of just reading books because I'm constantly reading stuff.
Speaker 1: This girl is walking through a uh grocery owl or whatever,
Speaker 1: and she smelled dove soap and she just started trigger.
Speaker 1: It triggered her and she just she couldn't move. She's paralyzed. Well,
Speaker 1: when she was being when she was a child, you know,
Speaker 1: somebody raped her and it was the dove soap in
Speaker 1: the bath that that triggered that because she smelled that
Speaker 1: as she was being sexually assaulted. So stuff may trigger.
Speaker 1: You don't know what it is, so you ask why
Speaker 1: does it? Why does it have that effect? So it
Speaker 1: will take you to that to that experience, to your
Speaker 1: subconscious and maybe even show your subconscious. And so I started,
Speaker 1: uh trout all these plays talked to you know, different things.
Speaker 1: I was under for about thirty hours. Not to like
Speaker 1: prior too deep if you don't want to get into it,
Speaker 1: but I mean, did you have to did you like
Speaker 1: go back and reconcile like stuff from your childhood or
Speaker 1: like combat experience. You know, it's you know, it's funny.
Speaker 1: I had experience from childhood, but there's nothing traumatic. Is
Speaker 1: just a question. It just showed me what happened. I
Speaker 1: don't want to get into that because it's kind of
Speaker 1: I would get into it, but y'all think I was crazy,
Speaker 1: So I'm not gonna go into I'll go I'll fly
Speaker 1: and tell you. But uh, what it told me is
Speaker 1: just nothing's really wrong with you. I didn't purge nothing's
Speaker 1: wrong with you. Uh. And I had a question. I
Speaker 1: did have a question, you know, because it's really bothered
Speaker 1: me throughout my life and everything is the injury. I
Speaker 1: want to do a career, what I do now? What
Speaker 1: is my purpose? And this being or whatever told me, yeah,
Speaker 1: I injured you because I had more, you know, I
Speaker 1: maimed you because I had bigger plans for you and
Speaker 1: I wanted you to be a builder. I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: whatever that means, you know. So it gave me and
Speaker 1: that was peace of mind. And now after coming out
Speaker 1: of it, because I'd always be like, man, I wish
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have been injured. I wish now I'm just like, hey,
Speaker 1: that's part of the plan, you know, and so you
Speaker 1: can wake up at any moment. For example, you need
Speaker 1: to go to the bathroom, there's people there to guide
Speaker 1: you to the bathroom or to help you purche, just
Speaker 1: somebody watching you're going in and out. You're still under
Speaker 1: and like, yeah, I'm like, I'll wake up out of it,
Speaker 1: go use to bath him. It's not like you're trapped
Speaker 1: in a nightmare. No. Never, for me personally. Maybe other people,
Speaker 1: but for me personally, no, I could wake up at
Speaker 1: any moment. Uh. There was one of my the people
Speaker 1: watching me. I was snoring and I could hear them
Speaker 1: snoring as I was traveling and I was in this
Speaker 1: other place. I hear him, and I was thinking, oh,
Speaker 1: I don't want them to get in trouble. So I
Speaker 1: woke up to wake them up, and I was like, hey, hey,
Speaker 1: you're snoring, but you're not bothering me. I just don't
Speaker 1: want you to get in trouble, which you wouldn't have
Speaker 1: gotten in trouble, but it's just you know, you're helping
Speaker 1: up your breath, you know what I mean. So I
Speaker 1: told him, I was saying. As I went back into it, Uh,
Speaker 1: I got hungry incredibly hungry because I fasted before I
Speaker 1: went in. I hadn't eating probably twenty four hours, you know,
Speaker 1: since the Friday morning I went in and all this
Speaker 1: other stuff. So I woke up, I went up and
Speaker 1: I ate food real quick, and I went back down
Speaker 1: and I didn't purge at all. And so because my
Speaker 1: stomach was becoming a distraction, so it's like, hey, need
Speaker 1: to go eat because this is becoming a distraction. So
Speaker 1: I ate. I went back in and I woke up
Speaker 1: thirty hours later, and um, it was I mean it
Speaker 1: had a lot of questions were answered. I went to
Speaker 1: a lot of different places. Uh, some people had woken
Speaker 1: up before me, and I could hear people elsewhere. And
Speaker 1: one of the coaches was right next to me while
Speaker 1: I was under, And I woke up and he's right
Speaker 1: next to me just watching me. Um As, his name's John,
Speaker 1: awesome guy. He's one of the being true to you
Speaker 1: coaches and he was just watching me, and I just
Speaker 1: told him some of the stuff that happened, and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh man, I feel bad. I'm still under
Speaker 1: while other people were out talking and stuff. I don't
Speaker 1: want to keep using to know this is about you
Speaker 1: go back under. So I went back under and I was.
Speaker 1: I was in for thirty hours and it felt like
Speaker 1: a few hours and I came out of it and
Speaker 1: I felt good. I wasn't there was no high. I
Speaker 1: wasn't discombbulated like you were hungover. No, it was like, wow,
Speaker 1: that was interesting. And I tried to process some stuff.
Speaker 1: And I also give you a book and tell you
Speaker 1: write down everything. And a few hours later I smoked
Speaker 1: five mm o d M T. And a few hours
Speaker 1: after that experience, yeah smoked five yeah. Yeah. And what
Speaker 1: they say is they have bugang cracks you open and
Speaker 1: the five mm o sinks you in. Right after that experience,
Speaker 1: and I was under because there again, when you do
Speaker 1: the five mm o, they bring it down. The music
Speaker 1: is playing, there's there's incense, there's the doctors, there's the
Speaker 1: coaches are there, there's other veterans, and it's a very
Speaker 1: bonding tribal experience. And I mentioned that because as more
Speaker 1: and more veterans, because I'm in different networks, are getting
Speaker 1: into this space, it is the right way to do it.
Speaker 1: In a wrong way, that was the right way. And
Speaker 1: one reason I will talk about this is because there's
Speaker 1: a lot of phonies out there, I would not say
Speaker 1: a lot of phonies. There's phonies out there who are
Speaker 1: gonna try to take your money. And I'm not talking
Speaker 1: about they say they're Shaman and they're not Shoman, trying
Speaker 1: to act like they're Shoman. That I'm trying to explain
Speaker 1: everything because that is the right way, because I don't
Speaker 1: want there to be a bad experience and attaint everything
Speaker 1: because it does so much. Not only helped me out,
Speaker 1: but everybody I'd known, he has helped out everybody. So
Speaker 1: I went down there, Uh it was, you know, it's
Speaker 1: a mattress everything. I spoke five m e O and
Speaker 1: I went right out and I just and I was
Speaker 1: under for probably I've been told ninety minutes, but at
Speaker 1: least forty five minutes. And I was under and I
Speaker 1: just started talking and telling about all different types of
Speaker 1: stuff I was And I just spoke and one of
Speaker 1: the there's an older guy there who's been in the
Speaker 1: scene a while, and he's like that was like Shakespearean,
Speaker 1: you know, and I just and without even a stutter,
Speaker 1: I just started talking about like history and like this happened,
Speaker 1: this happened, and this happened, and then uh, I came
Speaker 1: out of it and uh and again when you come
Speaker 1: out of it, you go outside and you ground. You
Speaker 1: call it grounding yourself. You go your barefoot, you walk
Speaker 1: on the grass because sometimes your mind can be blown, right,
Speaker 1: and you don't know if you're in reality. Yeah, you
Speaker 1: don't know if you're in reality. Supposedly, that's one thing
Speaker 1: with a boga the bark. Some guys their minds become
Speaker 1: blown because you go so far. And that's why you
Speaker 1: need coaches to bring you down like ground you ground,
Speaker 1: you ground because if you come to back to your
Speaker 1: work and you start telling people, they're gonna think you're crazy.
Speaker 1: And I need to commit this guy. And I've had
Speaker 1: other buddies go down and they they're not grounded, and
Speaker 1: you push people away. So that's what coaches are there.
Speaker 1: They come in, they ground, they ground you and um,
Speaker 1: you go outside. And that's why you're around nature. And
Speaker 1: you want to do this around nature because the nature
Speaker 1: grounds you walk in and grass everything. And you come down.
Speaker 1: And again when I mean come down, you're not coming
Speaker 1: down from a high. You're just you're processing so much information.
Speaker 1: Your mind is going to million miles an hour. And
Speaker 1: after that left Costa Rica came in to the US.
Speaker 1: I had my coach uh uh Evan. We would talk
Speaker 1: for an hour for the three weeks after that, we're
Speaker 1: still keep in contact. Awesome guy. Uh and he just
Speaker 1: he grounded me. He And I'd tell him, hey, I
Speaker 1: saw this, was this mean? He's like, well, and they're
Speaker 1: not trying to project, they're just you're still feelings when
Speaker 1: you come back. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, residuals. Uh.
Speaker 1: In between my first five am O and my eyebgain
Speaker 1: experience that month, I would close my eyes and I
Speaker 1: would still see visions of uh, you know, the tools
Speaker 1: CD and the artwork, the geometric patterns. I would see
Speaker 1: stuff like that, just as as I'd be in Butler
Speaker 1: Library at Columbia and close my eyes and see geometric
Speaker 1: patterns still and it doesn't freak you out right, like
Speaker 1: you don't I know what's going on, and yeah, I
Speaker 1: know it's going and it's awesome. And that's why I
Speaker 1: look at tool now differently. I was like, Wow, they've
Speaker 1: done this, because there's no way you see this artwork
Speaker 1: and you just think this up. They've been under something
Speaker 1: to see this stuff, and everybody, a lot of people
Speaker 1: see the same stuff when it comes to these geometric patterns.
Speaker 1: That's what's wild. And I think that plays into the
Speaker 1: architecture of other stuff like it's something in the human
Speaker 1: mind or something in the universe, you know, And uh,
Speaker 1: that's you know. And can I'll go into that after
Speaker 1: I talk about the ayahuasca experience too, and and after
Speaker 1: my that weekend of Ebel game five, m oh, I
Speaker 1: have a coach and they they grounding and you need
Speaker 1: a coach. Did somebody to talk to me like hey, this,
Speaker 1: this this, and he honestly helped me with meditating. Meditating
Speaker 1: helps out too, and meditating it helps you get into
Speaker 1: that space as well. And some people who meditate can
Speaker 1: release d m T to go back into that space
Speaker 1: through breathing and stuff like that. Yeah, I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: through a breathing class on the twentie in New York
Speaker 1: and supposedly you can release d m T and all
Speaker 1: that other stuff. I'll let you know if you want
Speaker 1: to come. But some of these people they cannot even
Speaker 1: they get away from the plants, they don't use the
Speaker 1: plants anymore, and they released d m T on their
Speaker 1: own through breathwork to go back into that place. Would
Speaker 1: we have like Jack and I haven't done this, would
Speaker 1: we like, are we gonna be able to release d MT?
Speaker 1: Probably not. I doubt it with that, So we gotta
Speaker 1: get to Costa Rica the next year. You gotta go
Speaker 1: to Costa Rica. And uh. But once you're so called
Speaker 1: see the light where they say, once the bell has
Speaker 1: been rung, it can never be unrung. And that's when
Speaker 1: And again I was a skeptic. But everybody who goes through,
Speaker 1: they're like, when you start really telling them about some
Speaker 1: of the stuff you see, they're like, okay. And they
Speaker 1: see some of the same visions too. I see somebody.
Speaker 1: I've known a couple of people who've seen pyramids in
Speaker 1: their visions in the same experience. You know, So, what
Speaker 1: was the difference this? What was the impact that's had
Speaker 1: on your life when you came back to back to
Speaker 1: the United States and you're going about, you know, your
Speaker 1: graduate school program or your relationships or what what was
Speaker 1: the what was the impact? How did it change me?
Speaker 1: I know some of the guys I sent before me.
Speaker 1: One thing I noticed about the guys I sent before me,
Speaker 1: they were so happy, and I thought they were like
Speaker 1: high on oat or something like, why are you so
Speaker 1: have you so weird, you know, And I was kind
Speaker 1: of on the other side, you know. I was like, Man,
Speaker 1: this guy's weird. You're so happy now and all this stuff.
Speaker 1: I don't know why. Maybe he's on drugs or something.
Speaker 1: But when I came back, I was happy. Uh no more,
Speaker 1: no more medication, no more. I didn't need any of
Speaker 1: this stuff, nor you know, anxiety, none of that stuff. Um,
Speaker 1: and I started losing weight. I didn't eat as much
Speaker 1: because I didn't need the food. Because when you think
Speaker 1: of there's a food addiction. I don't drink. If I
Speaker 1: get depressed rated, there's any issues. I don't do drugs,
Speaker 1: I don't smoke, I don't drink, but I may go
Speaker 1: to food food therapy. So I stopped eating as much food. Uh,
Speaker 1: lost weight. It was just better. Uh. Answered a lot
Speaker 1: of questions. I had peace of mind. This is why
Speaker 1: I was injured overseas, you know, this is you know,
Speaker 1: I'm just keep doing what I'm doing, building networks, doing
Speaker 1: all that stuff. And then that kind of it led
Speaker 1: me to a nonprofit called hero At Carts Project. Jesse
Speaker 1: Gold created it, and that's ayahuasca focused kind of. I
Speaker 1: believe they're expanding the other stuff. I mean, there's a
Speaker 1: million different plants. They do different stuff. Every plant has
Speaker 1: d MT. We all have d MT inside of us.
Speaker 1: So thankfully to Jesse Gold, he invited me to uh
Speaker 1: Peru Tera Poto, Peru to do ayahuasca. Uh it was
Speaker 1: four eight days. You do four ceremonies, only did three.
Speaker 1: Uh we went through the and if you do want
Speaker 1: to do and again. I had another coach before I
Speaker 1: went down. She was her name is Jamie Lerner. Lerner.
Speaker 1: I butchered it. I apologize, But she's an ayahuasca coach,
Speaker 1: so she she's not. I don't think she's ever done
Speaker 1: iboger eyebo gain. She just does ayawaska. That's her thing
Speaker 1: she does. I was. She lived in Terra Poto for
Speaker 1: four years. She does all this stuff. She left corporate America,
Speaker 1: went to the jungle, did her thing. Because you have
Speaker 1: this calling. And that's another thing that the natives down
Speaker 1: there singing or more Westerners are having this calling to
Speaker 1: where they're going back to the jungle. And and that's
Speaker 1: good because now the natives are like, well, maybe nature
Speaker 1: is my calling. You know the West, you know, this
Speaker 1: western digital landscape is not where everything is like I've
Speaker 1: had people in Africa tell me that anxiety is American
Speaker 1: or a Western construct. Yeah. Yeah, I've heard a lot
Speaker 1: of these mental health issues. They think this, well, and
Speaker 1: here's the thing I'll throw at you when it comes
Speaker 1: to schizophrenia, schizophrenia, all this stuff, bipolar disolder personality disorder.
Speaker 1: Some of the shaman and I've read up on this,
Speaker 1: they think that's they see that as a positive sign
Speaker 1: because they think that's somebody who can be a shaman
Speaker 1: because they're communicating with spirits in another world. There's an
Speaker 1: interesting book it actually had kind of a big impact
Speaker 1: on me, called The Divi Itself by Rde Lange and
Speaker 1: Um he was a psychologist and he he was of
Speaker 1: the opinion that schizophrenia is not a mental disease, but
Speaker 1: what it is is that people are unable to live
Speaker 1: in the modern world, and so they they're like, basically,
Speaker 1: it's a defensive posture that they're taking. They're inventing these
Speaker 1: like false personalities to put between themselves and the horror
Speaker 1: of this world we live in. Yeah, I mean, look
Speaker 1: at all these kids that let's say they're they have
Speaker 1: mental health issues, and they're like, well, this kid has
Speaker 1: a mental health, he can't communicate, but he's a genius.
Speaker 1: Well maybe it's us. And the shamans see that as
Speaker 1: this person can communicate with other spirits. So that's a
Speaker 1: they say, as a shaman and training, that's what they
Speaker 1: We tend we tend to be a little dismissive and say, well,
Speaker 1: that person is crazy. Well they're not crazy. They're just
Speaker 1: living in an unlivable world. It's a very difficult place
Speaker 1: that they're in. And once you get down in the
Speaker 1: plant medicine psychedelics what they call in the West. And honestly,
Speaker 1: some of these people are trying to get away from
Speaker 1: psychedelics because they're trying to get this legalized, for example
Speaker 1: in Oakland, so on and so forth. They they see
Speaker 1: this is uh, you know, this is nature, and this
Speaker 1: is normal. You're supposed to use these plants. These plants
Speaker 1: were given us to use. And again going back to
Speaker 1: the ayahuasca, going down to Prou, I had to coach
Speaker 1: the same deal. She talked to me uh over the
Speaker 1: phone for an hour, We did some breathwork over the phone.
Speaker 1: Um and so we went down. There is a bunch
Speaker 1: of veterans, special operations veterans, and I think it was filmed,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be they We had a guy, a writer
Speaker 1: or journalists with us who actually participated in the ceremony
Speaker 1: with us, and a film guy who just took pictures
Speaker 1: but he filmed some of it. And and the journalist
Speaker 1: is Heinrich. I can't remember his last name. He's gonna
Speaker 1: kill me, but whatever, but uh, you know, and for him,
Speaker 1: it's hard to write about it. You can't write it.
Speaker 1: You gotta do it. And that's why people ask, so
Speaker 1: what is it? It's like, listen, everybody's experience is different.
Speaker 1: You just gotta do it. And so that was the
Speaker 1: best advice I can give anybody. Just go down there,
Speaker 1: do it. You can go to YouTube and you can
Speaker 1: go to the Joe Rogan stuff and you know, listen
Speaker 1: to that. But it's just so subjective. Just do it.
Speaker 1: So when we interviewed, uh, Jeff Nichols about it, and
Speaker 1: he'd talked about like he experiencing God and it's like,
Speaker 1: what do you mean how? But I understand it's difficult
Speaker 1: to put that to words. Well, you know, now you
Speaker 1: bring out the g man. You know. Uh, I know
Speaker 1: some people that were atheist and they went through and
Speaker 1: they're not atheists anymore. And you know, yeah, I experienced
Speaker 1: I talked to you know, I would talk to Here's
Speaker 1: this voice would come up, especially the eyebel gain and
Speaker 1: he just talk all this stuff. And I was like,
Speaker 1: who are He's like, God does that to you? He's
Speaker 1: like yeah, you know and yeah, And I was like yeah,
Speaker 1: and uh, I've heard from other parent we've had experience
Speaker 1: like he had. He's hilarious and he has like this
Speaker 1: this personality. But that's when that book I read about
Speaker 1: the biologists who took hiyahuasca, he said that that the
Speaker 1: entity he met was like making fun of him. Yes,
Speaker 1: now that you bring that up. Yes, the guy next
Speaker 1: to me who was throwing up and the first real
Speaker 1: voice of this higher entity talking to me, God or
Speaker 1: whoever you want to call it. He goes your friend
Speaker 1: over there and having much fun? Is he? Yeah? It's
Speaker 1: like no, he's not. And he goes, well, he started talking.
Speaker 1: He's like, listen, humans are trying to be too complicated.
Speaker 1: You'll need to get back to nature. Nature has all
Speaker 1: the answers. You're trying to be too complicated. It's not
Speaker 1: working out. You're and he just started talking about like
Speaker 1: that's that's where the plants are here is to heal y'all,
Speaker 1: and you need to and you just go over and
Speaker 1: over about that. Uh And then when I did the ayahuasca,
Speaker 1: he appeared again, the same entity, the same, the same entity. Well,
Speaker 1: and when I was with that boogain he would change
Speaker 1: his voice and everything. It's like, as like God is.
Speaker 1: People are gonna ask questions and stuff, and you know,
Speaker 1: and they're gonna say, it's not like, why are you
Speaker 1: changing Who's He's like, I'm God, I can do whatever
Speaker 1: I want. And uh so he changed his voice. I
Speaker 1: was like, okay. So, uh so I went with ayahuasca
Speaker 1: and I had more questions and that's the thing, you
Speaker 1: ask questions all that. And again some of these people
Speaker 1: I talked to who are atheists and everything there, they're like, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're not an atheist anmore, especially after doing this, you know.
Speaker 1: And uh so I did Iowasta. I did three ceremonies,
Speaker 1: not four, because my mind got blown so much on
Speaker 1: the first night. The shaman who is if you need
Speaker 1: a need a great place to go do ayahuasca, especially
Speaker 1: going to tear go to Prue Terra PoTA to Prue
Speaker 1: Live Medicina. Chris Odle awesome guy. I was skeptical of
Speaker 1: him because he's a Westerner. I thought he was a
Speaker 1: scam and I was worried about that because somebody said
Speaker 1: Western Peru. You know, I'll go into that. I'll go
Speaker 1: into that later because that was one of my questions.
Speaker 1: And Hew down a little bit. He was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: you've had enough for tonight. Like yeah, my second night,
Speaker 1: he's like, hey, he took me off and you know it.
Speaker 1: And that shows his professionalism because there are people out
Speaker 1: there who will try to probably blow your mind to
Speaker 1: take more money out of you or whatever. He was
Speaker 1: strictly professional. He cared about healing you and not milking you,
Speaker 1: and he was he was like, hey, this is it.
Speaker 1: And he's also he was also kind of a coach
Speaker 1: to ground you. So we all went in our first night.
Speaker 1: I'd already done some stuff before that, but other people
Speaker 1: had not. And my first night, Uh, I went in
Speaker 1: fast because I think I already had some previous experience.
Speaker 1: As I was. I believe I was the first one.
Speaker 1: You got it. Yeah, I was open to it, and
Speaker 1: I kind of knew, like, okay, so there's something something's
Speaker 1: definitely gonna happen. And I started breathing to start doing
Speaker 1: breathing exercises to push it through my system. So I
Speaker 1: went down and just it's just first my hand, my
Speaker 1: hands and feet started going numb. And then Chris was like, hey,
Speaker 1: that's how are you doing over there because they could
Speaker 1: hear me breathing. It's like the William half breathing is
Speaker 1: what I was doing stuff like that, And he's like,
Speaker 1: I feel my hands and feet there there, you know,
Speaker 1: they're going numb. And then later it came back around
Speaker 1: like how you feeling. I was like, I feel everything,
Speaker 1: and then I start seeing I was in the university
Speaker 1: and all these colors. Is it's really like looking at
Speaker 1: some of the artwork people because there are artists ayahuasca
Speaker 1: artists who take Ayahuaska that they go under and right
Speaker 1: when they come out they start painting what they see.
Speaker 1: And it was like some of the artwork is I
Speaker 1: was in the university, show me everything and all this stuff.
Speaker 1: Now you like remember like it's not a dream, Like
Speaker 1: you know when you wake up from a dream, you
Speaker 1: can't really remember, like you you know, I was literally
Speaker 1: I could like if you came up, you could paint. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you could see some of the stuff and paint it.
Speaker 1: It's crazy. And so I was under and I could
Speaker 1: feel myself I was loud laughing. I was laughing a lot,
Speaker 1: and and with the five mm oh, i'd laugh with
Speaker 1: that as well. And I have and I've been told
Speaker 1: I've had, you know, I don't really perge. I have
Speaker 1: great experiences. Mine is more of like knowledge and information.
Speaker 1: That's what I get out of mind have questions. So
Speaker 1: I started, I was late. I laid down and I
Speaker 1: could feel myself looking my head going back and forth,
Speaker 1: and I was just looking in this universe, all this stuff,
Speaker 1: all these colors, news uh, and just this is so
Speaker 1: beautiful you couldn't is breathtaking. And then I started just thrashing,
Speaker 1: just moving around, kicking everything. And I didn't know why
Speaker 1: that was, but started kicking around. But not to go
Speaker 1: too much into it, because I mean, I did a
Speaker 1: write up on it, because I came out and wrote
Speaker 1: everything after my whole experience. It was six pages and so,
Speaker 1: and I had questions. The first night was kind of
Speaker 1: just breaking me in to the ayahuasca because I boga
Speaker 1: as seen as the father and ayahuasca as the mother,
Speaker 1: and I boga is very jealous. It doesn't like to
Speaker 1: use be used in conjunction with the ayahuasca, So you
Speaker 1: have to do them separate. You can't combine. It's just
Speaker 1: how nature does. It's it's not my rules, guys, and
Speaker 1: don't kill the messenger. So we're lead. Yeah, and so
Speaker 1: I uh and and again in the environment. Uh, it's
Speaker 1: it's not only doing the medicine. You have to have
Speaker 1: the right shaman. You have to be with it's a
Speaker 1: whole process and you can't break the process if you're
Speaker 1: gonna cook it up in your garage. And I was
Speaker 1: even told because uh, after this, I went to Zig Cafe.
Speaker 1: I know I'm bounced around, but I know we don't
Speaker 1: have much time. And I'm trying to give you everybody
Speaker 1: all experience because if people do go down this road,
Speaker 1: they know what's right and what's wrong, so there's not
Speaker 1: an accident and you're not taking advantage of So I
Speaker 1: talked to somebody else in Tarapoto, Peru who's been there
Speaker 1: while and a second opinion, and it's z I Go Cafe.
Speaker 1: If you're ever there, go They're awesome food, organic everything,
Speaker 1: and he can lead you to other or stuff as well.
Speaker 1: And his name's Arnold, and he said, some of these
Speaker 1: people who don't go through the process, they don't nothing
Speaker 1: happens to him. It's because they're not respecting the plants.
Speaker 1: You have to respect the process, respect the plants. And
Speaker 1: he even told me they don't even like some of
Speaker 1: these hippies, these shaman because if you do ayahuasca. Again,
Speaker 1: we did a study before we went in, and it's
Speaker 1: you you have to diet, no drinking, no sex, no drugs,
Speaker 1: at least four or five days before you go in. Well,
Speaker 1: some of these people who don't respect the process, they
Speaker 1: do all this before they go in, and then they
Speaker 1: don't see any visions. And it's like I didn't see anything. Well,
Speaker 1: you didn't do the process. And so when I'm in
Speaker 1: this environment with these other people, were in the what's
Speaker 1: called them maloca in the jungle, and with these other
Speaker 1: soft veterans, and there's some international saft veterans, and you
Speaker 1: hear the crickets, you hear the bugs here at nature
Speaker 1: here everything, and we go through the process. The singing.
Speaker 1: There's mused again there that the shaman is saying, Chris
Speaker 1: is singing and that's also to bring you back because
Speaker 1: you may leave your body and you may start floating,
Speaker 1: and they and it's to bring you back into your body.
Speaker 1: And so again that's his experience. And when I was
Speaker 1: under I didn't do it my second night because my
Speaker 1: mind was blown. And they're like they too, like, listen,
Speaker 1: you've done too much. A plant medicine is such a
Speaker 1: short amount of time. You've done a lot, so we
Speaker 1: gotta ground you and bring you back. So the second ceremony,
Speaker 1: I just stayed in the in the environment and didn't
Speaker 1: do ayahuasca. And that like not doing it, but witnessing
Speaker 1: everybody else doing it. It's you know, it's still it's
Speaker 1: still a powerful experience. I was still seeing some geometric
Speaker 1: shapes and everything. And the last night I took ayawaska,
Speaker 1: but there was another guy in there and he didn't
Speaker 1: take ayawaska, but he just smelled the bottle and he
Speaker 1: started going back in the space and started going back
Speaker 1: in and seeing ametric shapes and all this other stuff.
Speaker 1: So and that's what they say. Once taiyahuasca is in you,
Speaker 1: it's in you for life. The spirit. Now it can leave.
Speaker 1: You can ask it to leave, but nobody really wants
Speaker 1: it to you know what I mean. Because it helps you.
Speaker 1: So what's the difference between hiahuasca and the d m
Speaker 1: T and the was the eiebo Gain. I mean, why
Speaker 1: would you take these different ones? There's there is there
Speaker 1: one that's for treating a certain things. Yeah, they treat
Speaker 1: they treat different things, and that it's they say it's
Speaker 1: great to do iboga and aiahuasca iboga or eyebo gain
Speaker 1: in ayahuasca because they complete each other. You got the male,
Speaker 1: we get the female. And they say that's why it's
Speaker 1: good to do. They complete, they work on different things,
Speaker 1: and I can attest to that. I mean, it's just
Speaker 1: it was a different it's a different physical physically, it's
Speaker 1: a different experience. Ibo gain, you're gonna go under for
Speaker 1: for a long time. Ayahuasca you do separate ceremonies over
Speaker 1: separate nights. It's a longer process. So it's harder for
Speaker 1: people to do because they gotta go down to like
Speaker 1: Peru for for a lot of it. Um. But I
Speaker 1: personally enjoyed going up down to Prue. I'm glad we did.
Speaker 1: Peru is a great place, especially when you're in the jungle,
Speaker 1: and that's where they say, especially the shaman, the spirits
Speaker 1: are and all that, and do we tell you the
Speaker 1: story about the old sham too. So my coach uh
Speaker 1: Evan ozmat Uh, he heard a story about there's this
Speaker 1: old shaman and he they know who he's dying. It's
Speaker 1: inevitable he's getting old. And you know that the village
Speaker 1: was depressed, like you have all this knowledge, you're such
Speaker 1: a great shaman. You know where are we gonna do?
Speaker 1: And he goes, hey, it's fine. When I die, wrap
Speaker 1: me up in the ayahuasca vine and you will get
Speaker 1: that knowledge. And the vine will go through me and
Speaker 1: get my knowledge. And so when you cook the vine
Speaker 1: and drink it, you will get that knowledge. And that's
Speaker 1: what about your wife, because I see a lot of
Speaker 1: the wives to the shaman's wives stuff like that. They
Speaker 1: become there in the space too. So he told her,
Speaker 1: when my wife dies, planter at the bottom of the vine,
Speaker 1: and you will get her knowledge as well. And they're
Speaker 1: like okay, and supposedly, and that's what happened. They did that,
Speaker 1: and they got yeah, good. Yeah, they're like, yeah, it
Speaker 1: sounds good. And listen, when you're when you start getting dabbling,
Speaker 1: you get into this stuff. You believe it because you
Speaker 1: you see this stuff, and there's uh, the spirit molecule.
Speaker 1: There's a doctor. He he did a lot of different
Speaker 1: tests of these people, is different studies, and everyone was like, no,
Speaker 1: that happened when I went under, I saw something. It
Speaker 1: is real. It wasn't a dream, is real. And that's
Speaker 1: what you see believers, you know. And and these aren't
Speaker 1: in the the network different networks. I'm in their special operations,
Speaker 1: So they're believers. These aren't just a bunch of you know,
Speaker 1: gullible idiot bunch of hippies. Yeah, there are a bunch
Speaker 1: of hippies. And these are guys that have a lot
Speaker 1: of strong energy and a strong ego. Yeah, and you
Speaker 1: know what, And here's the thing. Some guys don't want
Speaker 1: to do it because it's gonna crush your ego, especially ayahuasca.
Speaker 1: It's gonna go there and crush it because it makes
Speaker 1: you feel like um or like humbles you, right it humbless,
Speaker 1: you like you're just a spec in the universe. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're just aspect in the universe. And you know what,
Speaker 1: the reason you are overcompensating. Listen, how many guys in
Speaker 1: special operations went into special operations because they're insecure. They
Speaker 1: want to hide a bunch of behind a bunch of
Speaker 1: tabs and all this stuff. Insecurity is huge with with
Speaker 1: our our community quote unquote is the insecurity. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: hide behind a bunch of tabs, you know, beat their chest.
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, they're just a child,
Speaker 1: you know, hurt child deep down. Something happened in their
Speaker 1: childhood and their adolescence that put them on this path. Well,
Speaker 1: you go down, you do the planet Eibel, gain ayahuasca.
Speaker 1: It's gonna tell you exactly what happened, and it's gonna
Speaker 1: break you down. And with the ayahuasca again, I really
Speaker 1: didn't experience much of pain, but my second night I
Speaker 1: did and it was I literally I felt like I
Speaker 1: was I don't know, dying or transforming, but I felt
Speaker 1: every cell in my body was on fire. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: it's an intense pain. And you know, this higher being
Speaker 1: was there and I talked to him my first night too,
Speaker 1: and he you know, and the second night he was
Speaker 1: there too. I could call him at any point. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I could feel it coming on, this sickness and it's
Speaker 1: just I didn't know if I was gonna throw up.
Speaker 1: And then I started feeling every cell in my body
Speaker 1: and it's just on fire, and oh my god, you know,
Speaker 1: like what's going on? God? You know God, Like I'm scared,
Speaker 1: Like what's He's like, no, no, no, let go, I'm here.
Speaker 1: You're okay, you need to do this. And that's what
Speaker 1: they call a lot of these people they die and
Speaker 1: you're reborn and you were born this new person without
Speaker 1: all this baggage. So that happened, and then I started
Speaker 1: talking to you know him and other stuff. And then
Speaker 1: what's weird is when everybody started coming out of their experience.
Speaker 1: The candle comes on, everybody starts coming out because I
Speaker 1: mean you have people in there just screaming, ah, like
Speaker 1: going like puking, like throwing up. I mean, it's loud.
Speaker 1: And when everybody the candel comes on a few hours
Speaker 1: later and everybody starts coming out of their experience, then
Speaker 1: God was like, okay, now we work on you talking
Speaker 1: about me. And then I went into it and I
Speaker 1: got intensely sick again, and but it's more intense, and
Speaker 1: I started like kicking around, moving around, and uh, I
Speaker 1: know one of the guys there was was filming it
Speaker 1: or what have you. But when he does a documentary
Speaker 1: will probably Yeah, it looks like that. I could feel
Speaker 1: every cell in my body just on on fire. And
Speaker 1: Chris comes over and he goes, Miles, are you okay?
Speaker 1: And it was it was like it wasn't even me.
Speaker 1: It's just like, yes, I'm transforming, you know, and you know,
Speaker 1: and then I went into the space. I end up
Speaker 1: sleeping in there that night, and I traveled a little
Speaker 1: bit and talked to him, you know a little bit,
Speaker 1: and you know, and and this godlike figure he talked
Speaker 1: to me and he actually told me to thank my
Speaker 1: coach Jamie. You know, he gave me messages. He's like, hey,
Speaker 1: thank Jamie, and thank Evan Ozmatt. You're he led you
Speaker 1: to this point and tell him. I said, thank you,
Speaker 1: and tell Jamie thank you for taking care of you.
Speaker 1: And I told him that message, and they were like
Speaker 1: after I got out of the jungle and they're like, yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you, you know, like they were very appreciative, and
Speaker 1: because I was, and remember I mentioned I was skeptical
Speaker 1: about the shaman because he's Western. He's a white guy, right.
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, here's this food gage, this phony,
Speaker 1: you know, like you know, snake oil salesman and he's like, no, uh,
Speaker 1: he's good. That's why I led you to him, and
Speaker 1: and he was good, dude. We had nothing but good
Speaker 1: things to say about Chris. And uh and that's why
Speaker 1: again you got to go to Peru. I can say
Speaker 1: we had a great experience with him, and go to
Speaker 1: him if you're if you want to really go through
Speaker 1: the press. What was this other experience you're telling me
Speaker 1: about where you went like deep into the jungle, I'll
Speaker 1: go after that. That was like apocalypse now deal, you know.
Speaker 1: Uh So the third night was the culminating uh my
Speaker 1: third ceremony, but everybody's fourth ceremony for the most part.
Speaker 1: Some people didn't go all the way through just because
Speaker 1: if your mind's blown, they tried value back because Chris,
Speaker 1: after you had that experience of being transformed or what. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: because everybody pretty much dies. It's a painful experience, the
Speaker 1: whole thing. But it's when you're going through this, you're
Speaker 1: bonding with everybody in there. And the last night, I
Speaker 1: I couldn't get into the space and I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, you know, I want to blast off.
Speaker 1: I want to blast off. I want to have a
Speaker 1: great experience. My last night, you know, just like anything
Speaker 1: else in life. He said, your last day at disney
Speaker 1: World or whatever, and you want to just blow it out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and uh and then it just nothing was happening.
Speaker 1: And then everybody was coming out of theirs a few
Speaker 1: hours later, and I was just sitting there was like, man,
Speaker 1: you know, I was just laying there. I was just
Speaker 1: trying to I could feel myself on the landing pad,
Speaker 1: but it was just wasn't going anywhere. And then then
Speaker 1: God goes again, Okay, now we work on you. Everybody's gone.
Speaker 1: There's no distractions. And I went to sleep, and when
Speaker 1: I woke up, I was I just every I don't
Speaker 1: know if I was in my body, out of my body, whatever.
Speaker 1: I could feel every cell, everything of my being was
Speaker 1: electrified and I was one with nature. And then these
Speaker 1: these voices start talking to me and they're like, come
Speaker 1: with us, Come with us. And I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know this is where we go? Where are we going?
Speaker 1: And uh? Then I talked because I could always summon him,
Speaker 1: and I was like, who is this? Can I trust them?
Speaker 1: It's like yeah, I go with them. That's nature, you
Speaker 1: can trust them. And I went with them. They took
Speaker 1: me to this other world. They were talking to me,
Speaker 1: and they just started telling me about everything. I talked
Speaker 1: to them about the Aztecs and all the ancients because
Speaker 1: I started listening to it's a guy that comes on
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan all the time, and maybe people come on here,
Speaker 1: but Graham Hancock investigates, Yeah, investigates ancient civilizations, and he
Speaker 1: takes Ayahwaska. He's in this space. I started talking to
Speaker 1: them about these ancient civilizations. How is it? And every civilization,
Speaker 1: every society that's built the first thing, what do they do?
Speaker 1: They build a temple and you know, again talking to
Speaker 1: this higher being. He said, yeah, I talked to their talk.
Speaker 1: I spoke to their leaders, and that's why they built
Speaker 1: all this stuff. And then when I talk to nature,
Speaker 1: they're like, yeah, God created us, and we created the
Speaker 1: plants and we put the visions in the plants. And
Speaker 1: that's how we speak to all these people to create
Speaker 1: all these things. The aspects the INCA is the Mississippi
Speaker 1: Valley with the with the Indian mounds that have the
Speaker 1: temples on them and the snake mounds in Ohio. There's
Speaker 1: no connection between them. But how is they build these things?
Speaker 1: And they're all similar, Like, yeah, we's the visions in
Speaker 1: the plants. That's how we did it. And this is
Speaker 1: like a very common part of the experience that people
Speaker 1: have when they take Hiawaska, isn't it. Yeah, some people,
Speaker 1: a lot of people see the same thing. I know
Speaker 1: two people there they saw pyramids and stuff. They saw
Speaker 1: similar stuff. And uh, mine was just my especially my
Speaker 1: last night. It was a lot of talking, a lot
Speaker 1: of dialogue with this nature and they just they just
Speaker 1: want to tell you about this stuff. Yeah, it's just like, hey,
Speaker 1: we we want to help the humans. We created. We
Speaker 1: created the plants to help the heat to heal the humans,
Speaker 1: and we wanna we want to help more humans, you know,
Speaker 1: we create the plants to heal you of everything. And
Speaker 1: again it was just like what God said, you know,
Speaker 1: nature has and that's what they said. I think it's
Speaker 1: a God is like saying, it's like nature has all
Speaker 1: the answers. It's just super interesting that the people who
Speaker 1: take these plants and go through this experience that it's
Speaker 1: like a two way conversation, a dialogue that you're having
Speaker 1: with this with this plant medicine. And then and then
Speaker 1: there's also this other entity that's that is also inside
Speaker 1: your brain, coaching you through it. And sense who said
Speaker 1: you could talk to him anytime you want. I could
Speaker 1: summon him at any time, and and I asked him
Speaker 1: one time, It's like who are you? Who are you God?
Speaker 1: It's like, I'm the universe. I created everything. That's what
Speaker 1: he said. Because I hear Alex Jones, believe it or not,
Speaker 1: Alex Jones and Joe Rogan. A lot of stuff he
Speaker 1: said was right when it came to the psychedelics and
Speaker 1: stuff and a lot of stuff. And I was like,
Speaker 1: how does he know that? Well, he has a breathing
Speaker 1: issue where some of these people, as I was described before,
Speaker 1: with the breathwork, you can go back into space. And
Speaker 1: I think that's how he knows about some of this stuff,
Speaker 1: because you only know if you've been into the space.
Speaker 1: And that's why I tell people. It's like when you
Speaker 1: listen to no matter what you know, a lot of
Speaker 1: people come on Joe Rogan what they talk about. That's
Speaker 1: true because I would I research for when is like,
Speaker 1: what the hell is all this stuff? And then listening
Speaker 1: to them, I was like, yeah, they they some of
Speaker 1: these people have been in the space, you know, and Uh,
Speaker 1: especially when you know the guy you mentioned about God,
Speaker 1: you know, he had a sense of humor, has a
Speaker 1: you know, a great sense of humor, and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: and I asked him about, you know, all the suffering
Speaker 1: and all this, so why do you do all this?
Speaker 1: He's like, it's all a test. This is all a test,
Speaker 1: you know, and uh, you know, and you know coming
Speaker 1: out that last night, going to this other place and
Speaker 1: talk to these other I mean, it was just a phenomenal.
Speaker 1: I've never felt an experience like that before in my life.
Speaker 1: No high, but my body was electrified. I felt every
Speaker 1: cell and I was just traveling and they were taking
Speaker 1: me all these other places. And I went into a
Speaker 1: room where it looked like a lot of these stone
Speaker 1: statues you seeing, like fickles, a lot of ghost or
Speaker 1: anything's like, that's what it looked like. And I was like, wow,
Speaker 1: you know, this is phenomenal. And that's why again when
Speaker 1: people talk about the ancients, like I saw some of
Speaker 1: that stuff and I didn't even know about it. Some
Speaker 1: of the stuff I didn't even I had never even
Speaker 1: thought about some of this stuff, and it showed me
Speaker 1: my subconscious because it's alms, like you know, people are
Speaker 1: gonna say this to my subconscious and and this being
Speaker 1: showed me my subconscious and he goes, here's your subconscious.
Speaker 1: Look how stupid your thoughts are? Like, yeah, they're pretty stupid,
Speaker 1: you know. And uh came out the next night, and
Speaker 1: I stayed in Tarapoto a couple more nights, just investigating.
Speaker 1: You go into the city and it's all this artwork
Speaker 1: of ayahuasca. Artwork is beautiful. And I hang out that
Speaker 1: Zygo cafe and and then that's where I found about
Speaker 1: this other uh, this, this other shaman and UH named
Speaker 1: I think as Roberto as a pull us out, Yeah Alberto,
Speaker 1: and he uh he was a healer. His grand grandfather
Speaker 1: and his father were healers. And it's just and again
Speaker 1: with these shaman, the natives of Peru, it's just passed
Speaker 1: down from generation to generating be doing it for like
Speaker 1: a thousand years. So I I wanted to find this
Speaker 1: guy and see what's up with this guy, you know,
Speaker 1: like what's going on, you know. And I'm there for
Speaker 1: a few days. So I got my taxi cab driver.
Speaker 1: We're in like rick Shaw and we're just going around
Speaker 1: and we and we go through this other town and
Speaker 1: then we go through the jungle, not far in the
Speaker 1: jone goald. But we go into like this village just
Speaker 1: like Apocalypse now or something, and uh, nobody's there, and
Speaker 1: we'll just walk around. And I'm with my taxi cab driver.
Speaker 1: He doesn't speak any English. He's missing a lot of teeth.
Speaker 1: He's trying to give me like I think, like cot
Speaker 1: or like coca leaves or something, all the time trying
Speaker 1: to feel I was like, no, man, I'm not into that.
Speaker 1: You know, I've found my plant. And uh. So we
Speaker 1: go in and and nobody's there in this little this
Speaker 1: and here literally huts, grass huts and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: And you could tell there's a maloca there where he
Speaker 1: held ayahuasca. And I could tell, like, okay, this is
Speaker 1: the spot. And so I go back behind one of
Speaker 1: these buildings and I see two guys out near like
Speaker 1: a creek, and they're they're cooking something. I go out
Speaker 1: there and I go Alberto. He's like, see he don't
Speaker 1: speak Spanish, just speak English. I don't speak Spanish, my
Speaker 1: tax crider. So I see this guy sitting in a
Speaker 1: a uh just sitting around this white guy. I go,
Speaker 1: h do you speak English? Like yeah, and I detected accent.
Speaker 1: He we started, he starts train. It's like I go,
Speaker 1: what who are you? And he's his name is like
Speaker 1: you're a French. He's like yeah, yeah, yeah. And I
Speaker 1: was like, how long have you been here man? Because
Speaker 1: he looked weathered. He's like, I've been here ten years.
Speaker 1: And uh I was like, oh my gosh, Like what
Speaker 1: are you doing here? He's like, I'm an apprentice, like
Speaker 1: ten years and you're still an apprentice, you know. I'm
Speaker 1: like Jesus and uh so he just translated just talking
Speaker 1: to him and and um, you know, I just talked
Speaker 1: to him. And the mosquitoes are horrendous down there too,
Speaker 1: and they just and his broad daylight. It's hot and
Speaker 1: they're just eating me alive. So how's this guy? And
Speaker 1: I'm like, man, how are the mosquitoes not eating y'all?
Speaker 1: You know and all this stuff. He's like, hey, man,
Speaker 1: what's He just tells me you have a lot of
Speaker 1: sugar in your blood and that's why the mosquitoes and
Speaker 1: all that stuff's attracted to it. Once you the ayahuasca
Speaker 1: gets in your blood, they don't want to eat you.
Speaker 1: They don't want to they're not attracted to you as much.
Speaker 1: And some of these guys I've just heard you know
Speaker 1: you they call him dietas where you go into the
Speaker 1: jungle and a shaman just feeds you ayahuasca every second
Speaker 1: day or whatever and you're just one with nature and
Speaker 1: it can be eight days long a month. This frenchman
Speaker 1: he did a dieta is over a year long. He
Speaker 1: just went to the jungle. I was like, man, you're
Speaker 1: hardcore bro, much harder than me. And uh, I've heard
Speaker 1: some of the shaman. You go up the river, hike
Speaker 1: five days through a jungle and you just uh, you
Speaker 1: see some of these shaman they'll do it for free
Speaker 1: because they just they want to heal you. They're called
Speaker 1: healers and you can stay there a month and they
Speaker 1: just do whatever. But I hear it gets kind of well,
Speaker 1: I guess some would say dangerous. But when you're in there,
Speaker 1: you're in the area with the snakes, mosquitoes, by yourself,
Speaker 1: you're in there with nature. And some people have died.
Speaker 1: And what I've heard is some of the shamans say,
Speaker 1: well that's their destiny. They're one there with the spirit world.
Speaker 1: Now from like the hydration and well, just you know,
Speaker 1: snake bite or whatever, you know, something like that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but it's they're just like, hey, that was that was
Speaker 1: his destiny because they say, you know, there are no coincidences.
Speaker 1: What they say, you know, it's uh, it's all a plan,
Speaker 1: that is what they say. Pretty yeah, yeah, I probably
Speaker 1: would not be doing that, you know, I don't. I
Speaker 1: have a feeling that's not my plan. So uh yeah
Speaker 1: that all I can say is that it has been
Speaker 1: a great experience, all of the experiences. Uh. One thing
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about because I don't like to
Speaker 1: talk about a lot, but I have noticed this trend,
Speaker 1: especially with the decriminalization in Oakland, Denverse getting in on it.
Speaker 1: It's a and Trump no matter, you know, not to
Speaker 1: get in the political set, but he just he just
Speaker 1: v a proof ketamine. That's major, major, And this is
Speaker 1: happening at light speed. And one reason I want to
Speaker 1: talk about is that I'm in these other networks and
Speaker 1: everybody's moving towards plant medicine and and somebody even say, uh,
Speaker 1: in theogen's and that's that's meant to be spiritual. And
Speaker 1: some people go to this stuff off for it's like
Speaker 1: a spiritual awakening. There's a tribe. I think it's the
Speaker 1: the Boeti tribe or something. And they live in this
Speaker 1: this uh, this area in western Africa. It's like Roman Catholic.
Speaker 1: It's not Ethiopia's Western Africa. And they they take iboga
Speaker 1: for a spiritual journey. It's part of their religion. When
Speaker 1: Easter comes around, they take a boga and they travel
Speaker 1: and they talk to this god. Uh. And it's it's
Speaker 1: similar to what again, I'm from Mississippi, so you go
Speaker 1: to the Mississippi Valley. They were monotheistic and somehow they
Speaker 1: took some hallucinogenics and they talked to a god too.
Speaker 1: So and in America and uh, some of these places. Uh,
Speaker 1: I think there's a religion in America where they're exempted
Speaker 1: from uh the laws because this is part of their religion.
Speaker 1: It's a spiritual awakening. And that's how they pitched it
Speaker 1: to the government. Has been approved on and I think
Speaker 1: even with some the guys who are active duty, they
Speaker 1: can get exemptions on polygraphs because it's a spiritual it's
Speaker 1: part of your religion. So I think some active duty
Speaker 1: guys are pursuing that as well. Uh. And you know what,
Speaker 1: a more more power to them because it will make
Speaker 1: you more effective. I'm more Uh, I feel more dangerous
Speaker 1: after doing that dangerous but a clear, concise creativity, imagination everything. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and you go to Silicon Valley, a lot of
Speaker 1: people are doing that, especially computer programmers, because of it's
Speaker 1: their imagination. They get more work done, and they've started
Speaker 1: micro docing and what's micro docing? Mushrooms, psilocybin m D
Speaker 1: M A, so on and so forth. So it's just
Speaker 1: it really just once you open up this box to
Speaker 1: the plants, it just it does so many things. In
Speaker 1: these shaman They'll makes the plants up with different stuff
Speaker 1: because you just come up to them and say, hey,
Speaker 1: I have this happening with my life, and they're like, okay,
Speaker 1: we're gonna mix you up with this. We're gonna blow
Speaker 1: your heart open, you know, to make you more approachable
Speaker 1: for people and more loving for people and so and
Speaker 1: so forth. Uh. But yeah, it's uh, it's it's definitely
Speaker 1: something that is moving at light speed. And I wanted
Speaker 1: to kind of describe the process because there's a right
Speaker 1: way to do it, there's a wrong way. And I've
Speaker 1: heard about some phonies out there, and I know in
Speaker 1: my network. Everything's legit, it's been vetted. But with for example,
Speaker 1: when I was down there in Zygo Cafe in Terra Poto,
Speaker 1: there was a guy down there I met. He was
Speaker 1: an American and he was a military. He's one of
Speaker 1: these civilians and he's just going to one of these
Speaker 1: like weekend camps where they do ayahuasca. It's not and
Speaker 1: it wasn't a real ayahuasca experience where you go deep.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like a vaca, you know, like a
Speaker 1: country club. Yeah, you just go take a pill, make
Speaker 1: things better. Yeah yeah. I mean, honestly, if I had
Speaker 1: to do ayahuaska again, I want to go. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: do a dieta if I can. It's just it's a
Speaker 1: it's a lot of time because you gotta travel to
Speaker 1: Peru to take like a week and do at least
Speaker 1: eight days by yourself, and the shaman comes to every
Speaker 1: second day and gives you ayahuasca, and you do not
Speaker 1: talk to anybody, You do not encounter electronics, you do
Speaker 1: not use anything that's not organic deodorant, bug spray, anything,
Speaker 1: and you just sit there and you just travel and
Speaker 1: you're one with nature and all that stuff, and a
Speaker 1: lot of the I've heard Peruvians they it's healthy to
Speaker 1: do a diet at least once a year. What was
Speaker 1: the other thing that we're talking about? The frog? The
Speaker 1: frog is the five mm o d m T. Okay,
Speaker 1: so the d MT is derived from the frog. Well
Speaker 1: at the five m e o. There's other d m
Speaker 1: T that's not from the tip. The five m e
Speaker 1: o the toad. That's what it did twice and the
Speaker 1: one that you smoked, Yeah, the one I smoked. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and uh I felt it go my lungs and you
Speaker 1: pass right out. Um, you know. And everybody has a
Speaker 1: different experience. Um again mine has been uh, nothing but
Speaker 1: good things. So like what would if what would you
Speaker 1: suggest people go to? I mean, and I guess it
Speaker 1: depends on what the experiences or problems you're having in
Speaker 1: your life. Like, let's just take something we're familiar with.
Speaker 1: Veterans shows up has issues with PTSD. Would you push
Speaker 1: him towards hiahuasca or would you push him towards the
Speaker 1: d m T or like where do you where would
Speaker 1: you even begin with all of this? I think it's
Speaker 1: if if you have veterans with PTSD, they've probably already
Speaker 1: been fed a bunch of pills. They've seen all that
Speaker 1: therapist and you know, it just doesn't work. I mean,
Speaker 1: look at the suicide epidemic with the veteran community. I mean,
Speaker 1: we've spent more money on it in the suicide especially
Speaker 1: in special operations through the room. There's a guy from
Speaker 1: our bittalion. I wouldn't say his name here, but his
Speaker 1: sister came to me just like a couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 1: and this guy died. He was one of them. He
Speaker 1: was one of the privates in my company when I
Speaker 1: got back from Rangers school, young guy younger than me
Speaker 1: and you, and he died unexpectedly, and I'm like, what
Speaker 1: the hell is going? Like our peer group, you and
Speaker 1: I are peer group because we were young rangers together.
Speaker 1: Our peer group is it feels like they're dying young.
Speaker 1: A lot of our dying young. And it's only going
Speaker 1: to accelerate because as you get older, you have the
Speaker 1: injuries come back and now you're you're you can't work out,
Speaker 1: You're not that stud You're seeing as like the old
Speaker 1: angry veteran freak show you here all the time, like
Speaker 1: I'm not as cool as I used to be. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And you know, what those were my best years. It's
Speaker 1: probably best if I just go away. And another thing
Speaker 1: interesting about that is I talked to some Chris and
Speaker 1: some of these other shaman. A lot of these veterans
Speaker 1: might want to pursue going down in the jungle to
Speaker 1: become to help out the shaman. Maybe they can become shaman.
Speaker 1: And you know, that's funny. Another thing about Chris too,
Speaker 1: not only this god like person vouched for him, but
Speaker 1: nature also said they blessed him too. They said we
Speaker 1: blessed him. That was actually pretty cool. And so but
Speaker 1: you know, for example, we had an intern down there
Speaker 1: who's just interning for the summer. And if you are
Speaker 1: a veteran who pretty much you're you're gonna do the deed,
Speaker 1: and most veterans who do the deed, they don't tell anybody,
Speaker 1: They just go and do it. Before you do it,
Speaker 1: I suggest just flying down to Peru and going into
Speaker 1: the jungle and doing ayahuasca because at that point you've
Speaker 1: got nothing to lose, buddy, you've got nothing to lose.
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you right now, it's gonna be a
Speaker 1: great experience. I mean, for me, I wanted to stay
Speaker 1: down there, but it told me, ayahuasca. No, you've got
Speaker 1: work to do. Go back to the city. And for
Speaker 1: someone who's feeling suicidal, what what does the hiauaska? Dude?
Speaker 1: This is just like it helps them like make connections
Speaker 1: between things in their life or piece of uh first
Speaker 1: off her resets. You may have a t b I.
Speaker 1: It will help you out with your traumatic brain injury.
Speaker 1: I've heard it's even it's even helped out older people
Speaker 1: with the Parkinson's and stuff, and so it's a reset.
Speaker 1: It helps answer questions from your adolescence that are plaguing you.
Speaker 1: It can cure the depression all that stuff. So if
Speaker 1: if a veteran came to you with PTSD, suicidal tendencies,
Speaker 1: those sorts of things, that's kind of the direction you
Speaker 1: would push. Yeah, I'm gonna put Yeah, that's where I
Speaker 1: push him, honestly, because he's If somebody's coming to you,
Speaker 1: it's because they're on their last leg. They don't want
Speaker 1: to admit that they've tried everything. They're coming to you
Speaker 1: because this is it. And that's when you know, because
Speaker 1: I've dealt with enough guys and everything and just saying
Speaker 1: I'm pretty observant and you know, just dealing with people,
Speaker 1: and a lot of people come to me that if somebody,
Speaker 1: especially a guy who's a stud, who's has a lot
Speaker 1: of pride and he's opening up like that, it's pretty
Speaker 1: much he's on his last leg. If you ignore him,
Speaker 1: if you don't answer his call, he's pretty much gonna
Speaker 1: do the deed. Um. Yeah. We had a ranger in
Speaker 1: third Bat he had like ten deployments and he was
Speaker 1: like as Evan, he went off somewhere else and uh
Speaker 1: he killed himself, you know, and uh it's uh, it's
Speaker 1: societal pressure, it's everything, just everything coming around his shoulder.
Speaker 1: I just say, hey, you need to go go down
Speaker 1: to Peru and uh go go see Chris, or go
Speaker 1: see one of these shaman and they'll and uh I've
Speaker 1: heard from other buddies. Uh buddy Mi I was talking
Speaker 1: to the other day. There was a team guy who
Speaker 1: went down and he was just uh, he was in
Speaker 1: a bad spot. And this was years ago, and he
Speaker 1: went down to Peru and uh, he had gained a
Speaker 1: bunch of weight. He was just like he was an
Speaker 1: asshole and he went down there to do Ayawaska. He
Speaker 1: stayed down there for a while, helping out the shaman.
Speaker 1: He came back, lost a bunch of weight, was reborn
Speaker 1: and it's a completely different person, nice, productive, everything, And
Speaker 1: that's what kind of switched on my other team buddy
Speaker 1: to kind of be like, well, what's really going on?
Speaker 1: And that's how it was too. What's going on down there?
Speaker 1: And when you look at it, we're spending billions on
Speaker 1: PTSD treatment all this other stuff. It's not working. And
Speaker 1: not only is it not working for veterans, America is dying.
Speaker 1: We're being hollowed out. It's dying. We're dying suicide rates
Speaker 1: through the roof opioid epidemic. People are using opioid to
Speaker 1: numb their lives, and it's the American culture is dying.
Speaker 1: And right now, I see that's the biggest national security
Speaker 1: issue I see right now. I mean, I mean, how
Speaker 1: many how many people as ice is really killed of
Speaker 1: American the last year, and let's put it the veteran
Speaker 1: numbers and opioid epidemic that's killing more America than anything else.
Speaker 1: All of these young men who have this sort of
Speaker 1: like postmodern nihilism in their lives, like that nothing matters,
Speaker 1: just like destroy the world, and they end up becoming
Speaker 1: with school shooters, and shooting up nightclubs whatever, whatever the
Speaker 1: funk it is. But I mean, there's this profound sense
Speaker 1: of nihilism that nothing really matters, and like, this is
Speaker 1: the one thing I'm gonna do that's gonna make me special.
Speaker 1: Let's go murder a bunch of innocent people. Well yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's like, you know what, I'm miserable. I don't
Speaker 1: make everybody else miserable. And uh, the plants may give
Speaker 1: you purpose to You may be on the on the
Speaker 1: fence about where I need to go with my life
Speaker 1: what I need to do. I'm you know where, and
Speaker 1: I'll tell you this is what you need to do.
Speaker 1: This is where you need to go. And I've heard
Speaker 1: that from a lot of people. People are on the fence.
Speaker 1: They're just like, I don't know what I'm I'm scared,
Speaker 1: I need to do this. I'm just pull the trigger
Speaker 1: on this or yeah yeah, And when you come back,
Speaker 1: they'll be like, this is what I'm doing for my life,
Speaker 1: and they're much happier. And again going back, not only
Speaker 1: are these veteran networks going to the plants, but also
Speaker 1: the federal government. I was down in d C talking
Speaker 1: to some people, talking to politicians and they're not only interested,
Speaker 1: uh for the is helping out with the opioid epidemic,
Speaker 1: mental health issues. And it's just so much cheaper. But
Speaker 1: also I'm from Mississippi. The farmers to the farmers need
Speaker 1: a new cash crop. So you look at ayahuasca takes
Speaker 1: seveny years to mature before you can cut at it.
Speaker 1: And when you cut ayahuaska's eva it's a vine. It's
Speaker 1: a vine, but you mix it with another plant, but
Speaker 1: it's very it's evasive growing vine. It takes seven years
Speaker 1: to mature. And from the time you cut it to
Speaker 1: actual process to drink, you're looking at twelve to eighteen hours.
Speaker 1: That's nothing. But here's another thing. When it comes to
Speaker 1: processing ayahuasca to drink, it has to be done a
Speaker 1: special way. Nobody can do it. I had this is
Speaker 1: years ago. Now. I was talking to another guy in
Speaker 1: other special Operations vet UH, former ranger. I will say
Speaker 1: his name here people would actually recognize who he is.
Speaker 1: But he was telling me about how he went down
Speaker 1: to Peru and did hiawuaska and this was five years
Speaker 1: ago and um, and he was saying he stayed down
Speaker 1: there and took like kind of they're like graduate level
Speaker 1: course where they have you like run around the jungle
Speaker 1: and gather up the components for the aahuaska and learn
Speaker 1: how to produce it. And he was like, it's so complicated,
Speaker 1: Like how in the hell did these ancient people ever
Speaker 1: come up with this, Like we're gonna mix this and
Speaker 1: that and turn it into Like how did how in
Speaker 1: the hell did they figure all this out? I think, honestly,
Speaker 1: the first person or whatever, I think the first solution
Speaker 1: to you know, first time somebody did ayahuasca, I think
Speaker 1: the instructed them how to do Because you go in
Speaker 1: there and you have questions, you're like, how's this, how's this?
Speaker 1: It'll show you like this, how you do this this
Speaker 1: and uh, and it may tell you, hey, you're you're
Speaker 1: not gonna die. I just try it out, feel it out.
Speaker 1: You're not gonna die. Blah blah blah. So yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's you just can't grow it and then cut it
Speaker 1: and cook it and do your thing. You need a professional.
Speaker 1: And that professional it's probably gonna be somebody whose family
Speaker 1: has been doing it for a thousand years. You know,
Speaker 1: It's it's not it's not just you. We're gonna bottle
Speaker 1: this and put it in a Walmart. You know, Um,
Speaker 1: it's a special way to do it. And uh, that's
Speaker 1: another thing again coming on and tell us like, listen,
Speaker 1: guys who were just want to grow it in Central
Speaker 1: Park and cut it. You know, it's not it's not
Speaker 1: gonna happen. Uh. And he's again, these farmers, if we
Speaker 1: can grow it, because uh is decriminalized in Oakland, It's
Speaker 1: gonna be legalized in other look hous. Not only Democrats,
Speaker 1: but Republicans are like both sides of the owl. There's
Speaker 1: a Republican in Iowa. He's like, hey, let's let's look
Speaker 1: at psychedelics. Let's do this, let's do that. It's coming
Speaker 1: on even AOC, and no matter what you think about AOC,
Speaker 1: she has a massive following. She has a huge following
Speaker 1: on social media, just to take politics out of this equation.
Speaker 1: And she tried to push something through Congress for psychedelic
Speaker 1: for psychedelics, Listen, it's it's gonna come, it's gonna be legalized,
Speaker 1: but let's do it right, and let's let everybody know.
Speaker 1: You just can't grow it. You just can't. Not everybody's
Speaker 1: gonna be a shaman. Listen. I met a guy down
Speaker 1: in Peru. He was on the fence. He really got
Speaker 1: kicked out because he'd been down there for two or
Speaker 1: three years. He dedicated his life, he quit his job.
Speaker 1: He's like, I guess this is my calling to be
Speaker 1: a shaman. And he had one more shot and he
Speaker 1: passed his little shaman test or whatever, and he was
Speaker 1: so relieved because two and a half years of your
Speaker 1: life wasted in the jungle. So when you say, like
Speaker 1: pastor shamans, like, what is a shaman? I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's well, first off, nature has to like bless you
Speaker 1: the spirits is what they say. It has to bless
Speaker 1: you because you're calling on these higher beings and all
Speaker 1: this other stuff. And you have to work well with
Speaker 1: the plant. You have to work well with the plant.
Speaker 1: You have to know how to treat it and know
Speaker 1: how to do stuff. And uh, it's uh, maybe I
Speaker 1: can have him on and talk about that and that's
Speaker 1: his subject matter expert. I'll let him know if you're interested.
Speaker 1: So um, but yeah, not everybody's gonna be a shaman. Uh.
Speaker 1: You have to be chosen. You have to be the
Speaker 1: mentor everything. And I think again, growing it is another
Speaker 1: wave to make money for these farmers another cash crop,
Speaker 1: but you're gonna have to have a shaman process it,
Speaker 1: and only they can do it. So like we uh,
Speaker 1: we talked about this on a on a previous episode
Speaker 1: and uh, and I brought this story up in my
Speaker 1: my personal feelings about psychedelics and how they came about
Speaker 1: from reading that book. I was saying, and then there's
Speaker 1: another ranger that we both know. Uh. And we were
Speaker 1: in the barracks and I was telling him about that book.
Speaker 1: I read The Cosmic Serpent, and I was like, it
Speaker 1: got me really interested in psychedelics. And he had done
Speaker 1: I guess a lot of acid back in the day,
Speaker 1: and he was like, dude, don't do it. Don't do
Speaker 1: it like you'll you'll kill somebody. Like what would you
Speaker 1: say to somebody like me who's like on the fence
Speaker 1: about it as far as like I would be afraid
Speaker 1: of having a bad trip and like the stuff that
Speaker 1: would come out of me if if I did that.
Speaker 1: You know, I hear that all the time, but everybody
Speaker 1: as well. Yeah, I mean, but the thing is you,
Speaker 1: it's your deal. You gotta I don't try to push people.
Speaker 1: I tell them, hey, this is it, you know, And
Speaker 1: some guys, I do kind of push because they keep
Speaker 1: asking me what did you see or what's going on
Speaker 1: or what's this? Listen, you just jump in. If you're
Speaker 1: so interested, you keep on harassing Go do it. Stop
Speaker 1: harassing me. You know you want to do it. Your
Speaker 1: your toes in the water, jump in. And again, you're
Speaker 1: with a lot of tough people, a lot of hard
Speaker 1: people in these networks, the special operations networks, and uh,
Speaker 1: you know there you know it worked out for them,
Speaker 1: you know, and they have a lot of inner demons. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean we're, like I said, we're we're
Speaker 1: bound pretty tight. Uh, a lot of a lot of
Speaker 1: monkeys on our backs. And you had all these guys
Speaker 1: go down there, and it sounds like, almost to a
Speaker 1: man or to a woman, they all say that it
Speaker 1: was a positive experience. Yeah. And I had a participant
Speaker 1: down there too who went through it. She actually did
Speaker 1: an ayahuasca experience in the US, and she said it
Speaker 1: didn't even compare to what happened in Peru, Like it
Speaker 1: was like point zero one of what actually happened in Peru.
Speaker 1: Peru is on another level. So again, uh, maybe the
Speaker 1: process was wrong or whatever, but there is a process
Speaker 1: you have to follow, and if you don't, nothing may happen.
Speaker 1: You may take it and just nothing happens. So that's
Speaker 1: why you have to go to credible, credible people who
Speaker 1: know what they're doing. And uh, and I always go
Speaker 1: with a group of people. I know. It's interesting that
Speaker 1: like the plant cannot be divorced from the ceremonial aspects
Speaker 1: of it. It's like they have to work in tandem. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's all part of nature. And that's what they told
Speaker 1: me under it's in you know, this higher being. Get
Speaker 1: back to nature. And then Nature said, you know, we
Speaker 1: put the visions in the plants and we're here to
Speaker 1: heal you. And uh, you know, I think I talked
Speaker 1: to this higher being is like, well who created you know,
Speaker 1: it's like who's more powerful? Nature or you or whatever?
Speaker 1: He's like, well who created nature? It's like, uh, you're clever,
Speaker 1: is you? And you're yeah, you know, and that's even
Speaker 1: nature reinforcements like yeah, he created us, and we created
Speaker 1: the plants, and the plants are here for you. Eat yell.
Speaker 1: Are trying to be too complicated with all these pills
Speaker 1: and all this technology and magnet helmets and and you know,
Speaker 1: you deal with a lot of guys who it's a
Speaker 1: lot of gimmicks out there with this technology. Hey we'll
Speaker 1: do this, and we'll do that, and we'll put you
Speaker 1: through this m R machine to do X Y Z,
Speaker 1: and it's a scam. It's millions of dollars wasted, where
Speaker 1: all you had to do was buy a plane ticket
Speaker 1: and spend maybe a thousand dollars to go down there,
Speaker 1: and you're reborn. That's it. That's the thing they said repeatedly.
Speaker 1: It's not complicated. You are trying to be too complicated
Speaker 1: about this healing and stuff. It does seem a bit
Speaker 1: much that you know, if you have somebody who's afflicted
Speaker 1: with PTSD or anxiety or depression, that recovering from that
Speaker 1: has to be like a lifelong endeavor of seeing like
Speaker 1: a psychotherapist every week of your life, like puppets. And
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm also I would also be skeptical of like,
Speaker 1: you know, you go and do this this plant and
Speaker 1: and you're you're healed for life. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: like does it have to be a lifelong process to
Speaker 1: like deal with your issues? I mean, there's got to
Speaker 1: be some other techniques. It's like they're milking you for something,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, like, hey, come back, spend
Speaker 1: some more money, do x y Z. You may do
Speaker 1: I boogain once and never want to touch it again.
Speaker 1: You're good. Ayahuasca. I met one guy I went to UH.
Speaker 1: He did a podcast. He may be speaking at Columbia
Speaker 1: for some veterans in the fall. I'm trying to get
Speaker 1: him up there to speak to a lot of veterans.
Speaker 1: He did ayahuasca once, does he He does holotrophic breathing.
Speaker 1: That's how he gets into the space. And he was saying,
Speaker 1: you know, some of these Buddhists, they meditate and they
Speaker 1: blast off into space when they're out there in the woods.
Speaker 1: They're not in the woods. They're in another realm. And
Speaker 1: and UH had another seal buddy of mine. He was funny,
Speaker 1: He's like, man, if I want to go to space,
Speaker 1: I just close my eyes. I mean, I don't want
Speaker 1: to be an astronaut. You know, Like that's we're trying
Speaker 1: to be too complicated. Again. It goes back to what
Speaker 1: higher being and nature was saying, and and but no,
Speaker 1: back to the therapy. It's and some of these therapists
Speaker 1: they don't know what they're talking about they don't know
Speaker 1: what's going on. It's and again they want you to
Speaker 1: come back for to give more money. Now, some people
Speaker 1: would say, what about the coaches. You talked to the coaches,
Speaker 1: they're not looking, they're not My coaches have been fully honest.
Speaker 1: I don't have to go back to them again. But
Speaker 1: I like going back to them because when I meditate,
Speaker 1: they take me to a higher level. Okay, now try
Speaker 1: this lucid dreaming for example, you know, dropping out, dropping
Speaker 1: out of your body where it goes numb, and then
Speaker 1: coming back in and stuff like that. You take your meditate,
Speaker 1: it's it's like peeling back the onion, but you never
Speaker 1: hit the core. You just keep going. You're called leveling up,
Speaker 1: and that's what the coaches they Okay, now you reach
Speaker 1: this level, Okay, we're gonna take you to the next level.
Speaker 1: And it's like wow, it's like going into a video game,
Speaker 1: you know, like Okay, I got this new weapon. Okay,
Speaker 1: I got another weapon. You know, not with like therapy
Speaker 1: where it's like okay, let me, you know, where's the
Speaker 1: all where the bad men touched here, Like here's these
Speaker 1: sock puppets or hey know here you know, it's just
Speaker 1: it's not the same. Actually, I had a therapist here
Speaker 1: through Columbia. Uh it's the Hope Deane Center. They give
Speaker 1: free therapy to veterans at Columbia. Awesome. I would I
Speaker 1: would still tell people to go to it, just because
Speaker 1: as a veteran at Columbia, you can talk to him
Speaker 1: about anything because you're surrounded by a lot of like
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes children and stuff. You know, you know,
Speaker 1: the antics there and you can't be who you want
Speaker 1: to be and you know, you want to say some
Speaker 1: stuff that's not PC. So having to center yourself in
Speaker 1: the classroom though that Yeah, that never happened. So my
Speaker 1: therapist actually was brought up in my eyebew gain experience
Speaker 1: and this god like figure said that he put my therapist,
Speaker 1: uh caused him to move to another state because they
Speaker 1: were still in the military, to PCs to go to
Speaker 1: another state. As my therapist was losing his way. New
Speaker 1: York was getting to be too much and he was
Speaker 1: losing his way, so he put him in the middle
Speaker 1: of nowhere, like Alabama. So he do stuff like that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and uh you know again he you know, like I said,
Speaker 1: he told him about my coaches, you know. Thank them
Speaker 1: because you know Jamie. You know she'll take it from here.
Speaker 1: When it comes to like Ezra, you know, Jamie will
Speaker 1: take it from here. And he also told me about
Speaker 1: you know, hey, y'all are like the with the grouper
Speaker 1: with you all like the ayahuasca vine. You're all are
Speaker 1: all interconnected if you'll ever needed to help help each
Speaker 1: other out. I suspect also there needs to be a
Speaker 1: lot more research done into all of this because it
Speaker 1: could be not necessarily one or the other. But you know,
Speaker 1: taking some of these plants may open you up and
Speaker 1: make therapy more effective. So maybe it's you know, doing
Speaker 1: doing them in tandem. I don't know. I'm not a doctor.
Speaker 1: I can't say. But if I still had my therapist,
Speaker 1: if he wouldn't have moved PCs, I'd still see him
Speaker 1: because I like him, I like hanging out. But you
Speaker 1: know I didn't pay for at all is free through Columbia.
Speaker 1: So uh, it's honestly what makes what you're comfortable with,
Speaker 1: you know. And I'm not saying drop your therapist. Uh uh,
Speaker 1: you know, go back to your therapist. But at the
Speaker 1: very least, I know a lot of the guys got
Speaker 1: off medication a lot of a lot of the guys
Speaker 1: don't drink anymore, they don't smoke. Some of them don't
Speaker 1: smoke marijuana anymore, they don't smoke cigarettes. It's like it's
Speaker 1: pretty much the silver bullet for a lot of them.
Speaker 1: All it sounds like, you know, dramatic improvements and dramatic.
Speaker 1: I I don't drink coffe anymore. I haven't drink coffee
Speaker 1: in six weeks. I purged one time with the ayahuasca. Uh.
Speaker 1: Through all my experiences, a lot of people purge. Uh.
Speaker 1: You know, they may defecate, may they may throw up.
Speaker 1: I purged once, and my purge is this brown sludge.
Speaker 1: And it was and it was the second ceremony, and
Speaker 1: the third ceremony asked natures like why did I purge?
Speaker 1: I thought it wasn't gonna purse. We had to get
Speaker 1: rid of all the poisons and toxins out of you
Speaker 1: is the processed foods and stuff. And I've lost since
Speaker 1: I started doing all this, like fifteen, around twenty pounds. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So a lot of guys lose weight. Uh, because they're
Speaker 1: masking with food or drugs or alcohol, they lose weight.
Speaker 1: And uh it it's definitely everybody I've noticed had a
Speaker 1: dramatic improvement and also with their professional life as well.
Speaker 1: So so what's the next step? I mean, you mentioned
Speaker 1: there's some stuff going on the policy side that this
Speaker 1: may be legalized in the United States, you know, over
Speaker 1: the next one decade or so, what about what about
Speaker 1: for you? I mean, do you have any plans to
Speaker 1: Is there some other crazy toad that you're gonna lick
Speaker 1: or I was like, I was around the Central Park
Speaker 1: looking at plants. I'm not going on. I'm just kidding
Speaker 1: and uh no, not right now, there's nothing really going on.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's when it comes to the plants,
Speaker 1: it's just helping people out they come to for advice.
Speaker 1: And that's one reason I want to talk to you
Speaker 1: all is the process, because I noticed there's a huge
Speaker 1: tidle of like Jeff spoke about it, it's just not
Speaker 1: like a guy like Jeff and he he's you know,
Speaker 1: he's a social media influencer. He's there, but you know,
Speaker 1: I'll listen to bits and pieces of it. He's Craig,
Speaker 1: not that he needs my validation, but he uh, in
Speaker 1: a wrong way. There's a right way and a wrong way,
Speaker 1: and and Jeff was right on the money. It's like,
Speaker 1: this is professional, this is how it's done. And I'm
Speaker 1: not saying there needs to be regulation because I mean
Speaker 1: it's how do you regulate a shaman. That guy has
Speaker 1: been doing this four years, you know, like get your
Speaker 1: shaman life. I mean it takes longer to get there,
Speaker 1: like it takes you know, it's easier to become a
Speaker 1: doctor for ten years. Ten years, Like wow, well I
Speaker 1: will never be an apprentice. Okay, So uh it's I
Speaker 1: think it's more more mostly word of mouth, because I've
Speaker 1: heard in those environments if somebody is not legitimate, then
Speaker 1: they will get purged from like the shaman circlespicially like
Speaker 1: Terrapodo Peru, they'll get pushed out and they'll get run
Speaker 1: out of town. If you're doing it the right way, well,
Speaker 1: and then people won't go to you don't make any money,
Speaker 1: you know, it's just this very word of mouth. And
Speaker 1: I think it's gonna be I think two years possibly
Speaker 1: we're looking at a lot of their stuff being legalized.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean you just had there's a company
Speaker 1: a t A, a psychedelic medicine biotech company. They're investing
Speaker 1: millions in this stuff. Now psilocybin's into m D n
Speaker 1: M A, and now that they're seeing that, you know,
Speaker 1: the the herbal remedies and all the good that's coming out,
Speaker 1: and you're talking about eliminating the opioid epidemic in some
Speaker 1: cases heroin attics going cold Turkey like that, and the
Speaker 1: pharmaceuticals too. I mean, I know you've met people as well.
Speaker 1: You know, veterans who are on antidepressants and stuff, and
Speaker 1: the pills are almost worse than the treatment is worse
Speaker 1: than the disease. For a lot of people, it doesn't
Speaker 1: make they don't feel like themselves anymore. Yeah, they don't
Speaker 1: feel and some would even say it makes them suicidal.
Speaker 1: And someone even say that, um not to get Alex
Speaker 1: jones e here, but uh, you know we're not talking
Speaker 1: about the gay frogs, but you know, they would say
Speaker 1: that it makes them. And then you have a lot
Speaker 1: of veterans who I was injured, They get on oxy codon,
Speaker 1: they get on the hydrocdeon, get all. They get addicted
Speaker 1: to it and they need something to get off. And
Speaker 1: he's like, okay, here's Iboga go down to Costa Rica
Speaker 1: before we wrap up. Could you go through it one
Speaker 1: more time as far as like the legitimate um sources
Speaker 1: that people should go to if they're interested in following
Speaker 1: up on this uh Peru. I would say, if you're
Speaker 1: going to prue uh. For me and my network, we
Speaker 1: like a guy you're gonna go to Terra PoTA to
Speaker 1: prue La Medicina Chris Odal Westerner. But I mean he's
Speaker 1: we were We all had nothing but good things to
Speaker 1: say about him. He's a professional in the environment. He's
Speaker 1: into professional and if you need other stuff, he can
Speaker 1: help help you out with other shaman down there, uh
Speaker 1: being true to you. The coaching service ran by d
Speaker 1: n Adamson. She created this but because she was kind
Speaker 1: of in the space she was a therapist and she
Speaker 1: saw no other stuff works. I'm not. My dad's a
Speaker 1: pharmacist and he's been a pharmacist for forty years. I asked.
Speaker 1: My Dad's like, dare we still feed these kids? Appeal?
Speaker 1: But I was on riddling adderall in high school all
Speaker 1: that UF He's like, Oh, yeah, we're still feeding kids
Speaker 1: all these pills like seven or eight, you're getting them
Speaker 1: like riddling and adderall and all this other stuff. Dopen
Speaker 1: them up. It's like, oh, my gosh. Still he's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: what what's your dad think of? Uh? Another thing about well,
Speaker 1: my dad is actually pro a lot of this stuff
Speaker 1: because here's the thing being from the South to a
Speaker 1: lot of us used to use herbal remedies a lot
Speaker 1: of the farms. You didn't go to the doctor. You
Speaker 1: went to the pharmacy. Deep South, deep dirty, deep and
Speaker 1: dirty and well used to we used to tour the
Speaker 1: indie amounts, go out of school and just go hang
Speaker 1: out in the inn emails. And I've also heard when
Speaker 1: doing ayahuasca, another great experience is to go to these
Speaker 1: ancient places and do ayahuasca ceremonies to touch on those spirits.
Speaker 1: I've heard about that. Maybe we can do a radio
Speaker 1: show from there was some time, you know, down in
Speaker 1: like Peru or Biloos or something. But my dad, Uh,
Speaker 1: back in the day, growing up, I'd see all these
Speaker 1: these jars where grind up stuff. And that's how it
Speaker 1: used to be. Back in the day. You'd get plants
Speaker 1: grinding up, and you wouldn't go to the doctor. You
Speaker 1: go to the pharmacist. And I've heard through the grapevine
Speaker 1: big Pharma who has a lot of heat on it
Speaker 1: because they've just been busted, you know, with the oxy
Speaker 1: cotones and all this stuff they knew was addictive. They
Speaker 1: put in this uh you know, the this the pr saying, oh,
Speaker 1: all these herbal remedies are bunk, it's not real, when
Speaker 1: actually it was real. And that's why we got away
Speaker 1: from it. And my dad is actually open to a
Speaker 1: lot of it because he's seen what all the pills
Speaker 1: and all the stuff has done. It was down in
Speaker 1: Mississippi and Louisiana. You have a Haitian influence, you have
Speaker 1: Creole and well you have the Indians, uh back in
Speaker 1: the day who had their own herbal remedies. See back
Speaker 1: in the day eighteen hundred seventeen hundreds, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of intermixing between the natives and colonialists or Southerners all
Speaker 1: that stuff. And then you have the Africans come over
Speaker 1: as slaves. They would bring over their herbal stuff too.
Speaker 1: So right now, even some of uh black people in Mississippi,
Speaker 1: they they do is called pick up, so they eat
Speaker 1: dirt to clean them out. And that's something that's been
Speaker 1: passed down from generation to generation. Pick it that was
Speaker 1: where they eat dirt, specific dirty just like I guess
Speaker 1: it's like Yeah, it's like just dirt or whatever, and
Speaker 1: they do stuff like that. So you have all these
Speaker 1: old herbal remedies and some would say witchcraft. It's still
Speaker 1: done very spiritual and all that stuff, you know. And Uh,
Speaker 1: I've been getting into uh if you if you need
Speaker 1: to learn transmidental meditation, I went to David Lynch Foundation. Uh,
Speaker 1: there's it's here. It's just that for you all if
Speaker 1: you want to do that, but it's free for veterans.
Speaker 1: And also I was in there with uh a female
Speaker 1: she's originally from Jamaica and her church would do stuff
Speaker 1: too that was very spiritual. And so you go down
Speaker 1: the deep South, they still I'm not sure they put
Speaker 1: you in a they put you in a church for
Speaker 1: three days blacked out. You're in pitch black, and then
Speaker 1: you they bring you food, all that stuff, and then
Speaker 1: they'd show you the show you light and suppose the
Speaker 1: like once the sun hits you, it turned. It's like
Speaker 1: an intense d m T experience when it hits you.
Speaker 1: And especially ancients would also put people in caves and
Speaker 1: for like a month and then the back like a
Speaker 1: caveman times. And not only that, well, also you mentioned
Speaker 1: funny you mentioned that caveman times whatever. When you come
Speaker 1: out of that cave at night, they put you on
Speaker 1: a mountain. So when this their sunrise, when the sun
Speaker 1: hits you and it interacts with the melanine in your skin,
Speaker 1: it creates an intense d m T experience. You start,
Speaker 1: you start traveling a journeying again. So you know, that's
Speaker 1: that's another way to to replicate d m T. There's
Speaker 1: so many different ways. And then what's the place in
Speaker 1: Costa Rica that people should if for the d M
Speaker 1: that's kind of that's on the download, right, Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: kind of on the download. But I will as we
Speaker 1: progress towards other stuff, like I'll let y'all know about that.
Speaker 1: So uh but yeah, my my coach again just to
Speaker 1: say them again, is Evan Ozmatt great Abu Gang coach.
Speaker 1: And I think he he lived in a Buddhist temple
Speaker 1: for like a year, meditating and all this other so
Speaker 1: he knows all the meditating, all the mushrooms, all that stuff.
Speaker 1: Jamie Learner, she's an ayahuasca goddess. I guess he could say, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, not to defend the spirits. So but she
Speaker 1: lived in Terra PoTA, Peru, for four years. She knows
Speaker 1: what she's doing. I mean, the people I do that
Speaker 1: this experience is not just like hey did ayahuasca, I
Speaker 1: can coach you, I can do this. You know. It's
Speaker 1: not like that. You know, and you know that I
Speaker 1: am Waska may tell you like we want you to
Speaker 1: do X y Z, we want you to go down
Speaker 1: to you know. It's it's a calling, is what they say. Intuition,
Speaker 1: and uh yeah, it's just it's just another one of
Speaker 1: those experiences for you know. I sugges everybody definitely, especially
Speaker 1: in this town. You know. And that's why I've heard
Speaker 1: a lot of people in finance, finance bros and uh
Speaker 1: tech people take people, especially the more open but a
Speaker 1: lot of the finance people are getting into that they're
Speaker 1: going to Connecticut and all these other places because the
Speaker 1: stress of this town and they've done all the peals
Speaker 1: and the drugs. They're like, hey, I'm just gonna do this,
Speaker 1: especially with Joe Rogan coming out and you know, all
Speaker 1: these other guys coming out saying they're doing it. So
Speaker 1: it's wild man. Yeah, it's a whole new world. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a whole new world. And uh, I guess to
Speaker 1: plug a nonprofit especially you know hero Carts has done great,
Speaker 1: great things. Uh, you know, donate to them. And also
Speaker 1: another one, I help out Military Assistance Foundation. It helps
Speaker 1: veterans getting the top tier institutions. I know a lot
Speaker 1: of the Sault veterans are going through it because it's
Speaker 1: just not only processes them for getting into an institution,
Speaker 1: but helps them transition to that institution and also the
Speaker 1: jobs on the back end of career aspect as well.
Speaker 1: And since you spent so much time at Colombia, I mean,
Speaker 1: do you have I know a lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of guys get down on it, and and I even get
Speaker 1: criticized for having gone to that college because I'm a
Speaker 1: pinko liberal commy and all. Yeah, but I mean I
Speaker 1: encouraged you to go, and you're definitely not a pinko
Speaker 1: liberal com I encouraged you to go because I just
Speaker 1: thought it was a good stepping stone for you to
Speaker 1: go through in life. And I mean you've been up
Speaker 1: there longer than I was, because you went to got
Speaker 1: your master's degree. Also, I mean, do you have any
Speaker 1: any suggestions for other veterans who are thinking about pursuing
Speaker 1: Ivy League educations? Yeah? Do it a lot of guys
Speaker 1: do you select themselves, especially special operations too. I know
Speaker 1: a lot of guys in Ranger, Bad Team, whatever, Seal guys,
Speaker 1: they're just like, I can't do it. It's like apply,
Speaker 1: you just apply. I hope you out. I'll go through
Speaker 1: the process, I'll coach you. Um a lot of guys
Speaker 1: just don't know what's out there. If I had to
Speaker 1: do all over, I'll do it again. I mean, there's
Speaker 1: no And you got the g I bill too, So
Speaker 1: you got the g I Bill. I used to voke
Speaker 1: rehab and paid for everything I had injuries, have a
Speaker 1: battery inside of me, so I was approved for vocational
Speaker 1: rehab and um uh. And it's just go to it.
Speaker 1: Do it. And because if you don't do it, you
Speaker 1: don't supply you're regretted for the rest of your especially
Speaker 1: special operations. I mean, like I said, the g I
Speaker 1: Bill is there. I mean, and this is what I
Speaker 1: think I told you two is. I mean, use it
Speaker 1: the better yourself. I mean, make use of it, get
Speaker 1: the most out of it you possibly can. You know, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you're gonna regret it if you don't. And besides,
Speaker 1: what else are you gonna do? Come apply to Columbia.
Speaker 1: If you get in, especially if you don't know what
Speaker 1: to do next, that's what you should do. You should
Speaker 1: go to go to college, use a g I bill,
Speaker 1: and you've got four years to figure at the fun out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you have a place like Columbia, which is probably
Speaker 1: one of the most VET friendly, not only VET friendly,
Speaker 1: but they want you to be successful because you are
Speaker 1: like an ambassador. It's the same with the military. You're
Speaker 1: an ambassador even though look at all these Seventniversity of
Speaker 1: D Day, these old guys are still carrying around their
Speaker 1: unit colors and everything. You're an ambassador of your unit
Speaker 1: till the day you die. And it's the same with Columbia.
Speaker 1: They realize that. So Columbia understands the game. They're switched on.
Speaker 1: They want you to be successful, and that's why they're entertained,
Speaker 1: meaning the film program undergrad film because they see a
Speaker 1: lot of veterans are not going into it's not as
Speaker 1: successful in finance just because the environment. They want to
Speaker 1: be content creators and go to movies. Look at what
Speaker 1: happened after World War Two. Not to go on a
Speaker 1: tangent and I'm kind of I started doing my own thing,
Speaker 1: not to be competition. But doing some podcasting, I have
Speaker 1: the trans Human Broadcast and go to the instagram the
Speaker 1: trans human and the trans Human Broadcast because I just
Speaker 1: kind of play on words the trans human, because I
Speaker 1: have all this machinery inside of me, and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: I guess I'm trends and uh, you know, I don't
Speaker 1: see I don't see a parade for me. You know,
Speaker 1: I don't see machinery. I guess I go to you know,
Speaker 1: some gaming convention, you know. So Uh, but they see
Speaker 1: they're they're intelligent. They see that, you know, a lot
Speaker 1: of these veterans they need to go maybe be content creators.
Speaker 1: Going to the entertainment industry. And at Columbia, your g
Speaker 1: I billill pay you. How to write a script, Uh,
Speaker 1: hold a camera, how to do a document they have,
Speaker 1: how to shoot a documentary, how to do all of this.
Speaker 1: And now you're in New York. You you have these
Speaker 1: opportunities to actually do do your own stuff, be a
Speaker 1: content creator. And you look after World War Two, we
Speaker 1: talked about Lee, Marvin, Charles Bronson, all these great actors
Speaker 1: who were just men. And I think that if I
Speaker 1: recall correctly, the School of General Studies at Columbia was
Speaker 1: created after World War to get veterans because Eisenhower was
Speaker 1: the president of the school. Uh, to get veterans into
Speaker 1: the into the courses. And I'm glad you brought that
Speaker 1: up too, because a lot of people have that opinion
Speaker 1: that all these these fucking liberal professors and it's like
Speaker 1: that's the insecurity speaking. It's like, no, they're very veteran
Speaker 1: friendly up there. Nobody's gonna spit on you, Okay, like
Speaker 1: get over yourself and go get your education. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I have granted, you know, I'm not a pink
Speaker 1: o liberal. I think we all know this. And uh
Speaker 1: but a lot of my professors they knew where I
Speaker 1: was where us did. But there's still cool with me.
Speaker 1: You still hang out Judith Russell, very far liberal friends
Speaker 1: with Hillary Clay. You know Judith telln't you you've probably
Speaker 1: heard of her as she's yeah, she's like, you know,
Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton, that's her girl, all that stuff. But her
Speaker 1: dad was a pow in World War two and he
Speaker 1: was in the Pacific. Uh, my grandfather was in the
Speaker 1: Pacific two. And you're just gonna have a great experience
Speaker 1: in a sense, you're gonna be challenging. You're gonna see
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff. Listen. One thing Columbia knows how
Speaker 1: to do that's protest. You're gonna see a lot of protests.
Speaker 1: You know. Uh, you're gonna see a lot of stuff.
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I feel like I'm back in Thailand
Speaker 1: so much. I see, you know, so many guys that
Speaker 1: are wearing dresses like am I back in Thailand? You know?
Speaker 1: But uh, you know, I'm not judging here, so but
Speaker 1: you're gonna see some stuff. But and again, especially the
Speaker 1: ranger bad guys up there, a lot of them. You know,
Speaker 1: they love their second amment. They're they're not on the
Speaker 1: left of the scale, so to speak, but they cannot
Speaker 1: deny the experiences, the opportunity ease all that stuff. That's awesome. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I feel the same way. I mean, I think it's
Speaker 1: a it's a good experience overall. Yeah, couldn't when it
Speaker 1: opens you up to the New York network too, And
Speaker 1: now with so many other people, especially in the psychedelic space,
Speaker 1: starting to get into New York, that's another thing for
Speaker 1: veterans to to kind of explore that from Colombia University,
Speaker 1: it kind of opens up that next step um, and uh.
Speaker 1: And honestly, with all the resources here, whatever, every anything
Speaker 1: you're dealing with, New York can kind of take care
Speaker 1: of whatever you're dealing with. To the resources here here,
Speaker 1: you know, you're not gonna find that out in the
Speaker 1: you know, unfortunately, you're not gonna find that in the
Speaker 1: middle of some of these states, some of these state colleges. Uh,
Speaker 1: you're just not gonna have it. It's true that there
Speaker 1: is a huge network here, and there is a big
Speaker 1: support infrastructure out there for people who are looking for it.
Speaker 1: It's just it's actually there's so much of it and
Speaker 1: so many not for profits and everything, it's kind of
Speaker 1: a question of where to start. Um, which is why
Speaker 1: I'm glad you came on here today to talk about
Speaker 1: at least the psychedelic stuff. Um. So people have a
Speaker 1: you know, they know where to look to. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's and I got that's the thing I see,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm I'm in the scenes. I have my
Speaker 1: fingers and you know, different networks, and I see where
Speaker 1: they're going, and the networks are doing the right thing.
Speaker 1: But now I'm starting to notice the people who aren't
Speaker 1: in the networks trying to like figure out stuff themselves,
Speaker 1: and I don't want a guide to do something stupid
Speaker 1: and ruin it for the rest of everybody else, you know.
Speaker 1: So it's uh, you know, it's it's it's something that
Speaker 1: has to be handled professionally, and it can't be just
Speaker 1: cooked up like in a meth lab in your garage.
Speaker 1: You know, this aahuasca in your dorm room in Colombia. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's uh, you know, I don't want
Speaker 1: you doing bass salts, you know, or something, you know
Speaker 1: with ayahuasca. It's like that's not gonna help out. So
Speaker 1: but yeah, it's uh, you know. And and and the
Speaker 1: thing is the private sectors taken off. People are investing
Speaker 1: in it. Politicians are interested on both sides of the owl,
Speaker 1: which is it's starting to turn into kind of a
Speaker 1: biperson issue. When you got Trump approving ketamine, uh, and
Speaker 1: you look at uh, I think his chief of staff mulvaney,
Speaker 1: he approves of Creatum maybe because create Um from Thailand. Uh,
Speaker 1: createim episode, Okay, you know more than I did then.
Speaker 1: And yeah, it's a pain like they used to in
Speaker 1: in Thailand. It was helping out in the thirties. Uh,
Speaker 1: and then they banned it because they helped out too much.
Speaker 1: The government was like, whoa, we kind of want people
Speaker 1: in these opioids and stuff. And then now they're looking
Speaker 1: at bringing I think it's legalized again in Thailand, I believe,
Speaker 1: or they're going through the process and it's just another
Speaker 1: plant that helps people out. And then when you have
Speaker 1: the Chief of staff, he's opening that stuff. You have Trump,
Speaker 1: no matter what you say, unconventional whatever, he is opening
Speaker 1: that door. Then you're seeing the mad that's look at
Speaker 1: CBD oil that's passed through Agriculture Bill, and now that
Speaker 1: you see ayahuasca and i boga can be grown for
Speaker 1: money as a new cash crop for for farmers who
Speaker 1: are struggling right now. You could see that past through
Speaker 1: Agriculture Bill as well. And then it eliminates the opioid epidemic.
Speaker 1: You know, it covers all bases who would have thought Trump,
Speaker 1: well not Trump, but I mean just us as Americans
Speaker 1: in general, that this could become um a medicine that
Speaker 1: you know, your your your doctor or somebody says, hey,
Speaker 1: yeah you need to go try this. Yeah, it's uh,
Speaker 1: it's it's something that you can't put the genie back
Speaker 1: in the bottle. It's out now, it's trying to be responsible.
Speaker 1: Was it's growing rapidly? You can't, big farmer can't say
Speaker 1: and big farmers on the ropes they what were they
Speaker 1: gonna say? Well, this doesn't work well. Listen, even feeding
Speaker 1: opioids to everybody for since the nineties and he knew
Speaker 1: was addictive. And some of these guys are going to
Speaker 1: prison rightfully. So uh and uh again with Oakland, if
Speaker 1: you read that whole story, I think it was a
Speaker 1: guy in politics there he just did. Uh. I think
Speaker 1: there's mushrooms or something. He he blasted off to another
Speaker 1: realm and he's like, wow, this is real and they
Speaker 1: got it decriminalized there. And again it's just you're just
Speaker 1: gonna see or more so damn well, Miles, can I
Speaker 1: can I plug? Can I do a shameless plug or whatever?
Speaker 1: I'll plug away? Don't don't edit this. Uh again, I
Speaker 1: wanted to say, you know, being true to you, the
Speaker 1: coach Evan Ozma Abu Gain, great guy, Jamie Lerner, I
Speaker 1: you know, great opportunity there and uh Jesse Gold hero
Speaker 1: hero a Carridge Project, thank you for letting me go
Speaker 1: to Peru and Military Assistance Foundation. Uh. They're great for
Speaker 1: veterans getting the top tier institutions. And also check out
Speaker 1: uh no Competition to y'all. Y are the alpha, the yard,
Speaker 1: the omega of this podcast. You know the trans Human
Speaker 1: broadcast on Instagram and uh podcast and also the trans
Speaker 1: Human on Instagram. But uh, yeah, guys, and uh, you
Speaker 1: know Chris Odelet telling said, Hi, if you ever go
Speaker 1: to Peru to do Ayahuascam, which I'm assume Jack, you
Speaker 1: will be going and doing a lot of this. Here's
Speaker 1: I might I might be willing to go give it
Speaker 1: a try. I don't know if I'm how deep down
Speaker 1: that rabbit hole i'd go, but I'll say I'm open
Speaker 1: to the idea. Yeah, it's I mean, look at me.
Speaker 1: I won't even drink alcohol. Still, I hate it. I
Speaker 1: hate it. I know I've never seen you drink in
Speaker 1: my life. Yeah, nobody really has. And I hate alcohol.
Speaker 1: I hate all the smoking people like cigars. Somebody trying
Speaker 1: to ask for scars, like, get that garbage away from me,
Speaker 1: you know. And it's like, not to be pretentious, but
Speaker 1: I just I've never had a taste for it. But this, yeah,
Speaker 1: but yeah, yeah, thank you for having me. And you know,
Speaker 1: I hope. Uh, it opens up more doors where people
Speaker 1: are more responsible to go to the right places to
Speaker 1: get it. So yeah, anytime, Miles, I'd love to have
Speaker 1: you back on. All right, thank you, Well that was interesting.
Speaker 1: I wanna thank your friend, Miles grant them. Um, Jeff
Speaker 1: opened our eyes to this and Miles blew the doors. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it took us the rest of the way. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's wild stuff. Um, I mean I I has I
Speaker 1: don't want to say it's crazy stuff and and be uh,
Speaker 1: you know, dismissive of it. I mean, it is pretty
Speaker 1: wild I opening for sure. Um, just the fact that
Speaker 1: he got into way more detail than than Jeff did. Jeff,
Speaker 1: you know, just kind of mentioned it in passing and
Speaker 1: then luckily you caught on and asked, you know, follow ups.
Speaker 1: But we were at the you know, halfway through two Thursday,
Speaker 1: right through the interview, so it was kind of you know,
Speaker 1: he just he broached the topic for us, and then
Speaker 1: Miles said he heard a little bit of it, and
Speaker 1: he was like, oh, I can tell you guys about
Speaker 1: like my experience, and we'd be idiots to pass obviously
Speaker 1: when you guys, yeah, and I mean it's no bullshit
Speaker 1: like Miles. I've never seen him drink in my life.
Speaker 1: And I me and Miles have known each other since
Speaker 1: two thousand five, maybe two thousand four, two thousand five
Speaker 1: him for a while. Uh, and I've never seen him
Speaker 1: drink a drop of alcohol. Does not drink at all,
Speaker 1: I mean he said he doesn't, you know, no, no
Speaker 1: smoking of any kind rarely, and it's just a shot
Speaker 1: to appease people. Yeah. So for for Miles to like
Speaker 1: go down this road taking d M T in Hiauaska
Speaker 1: is like, holy sh it, man, Yeah, this guy isn't
Speaker 1: some hippie who was playing hackensack in the quad, you know. Uh,
Speaker 1: So I I have to think that there's something to it.
Speaker 1: And um, you know, if if guys like Jeff and
Speaker 1: Miles are going down there and doing this and it's
Speaker 1: improving their lives, I mean I'm all for it, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean that's two guys on the podcast. We're two
Speaker 1: for two with with positive reactions. Yeah. Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 1: if if it's there's only positive things coming out of it,
Speaker 1: you know, then then why not support it and encourage
Speaker 1: other people to consider it? Absolutely? Um, I mean he
Speaker 1: spoke for over an hour and a half. I don't
Speaker 1: think there's much that needs to be set on our part.
Speaker 1: You guys, are you the listener, You'll be enjoying this.
Speaker 1: This was this was fun. Yeah, and he was he
Speaker 1: was passionate about I mean, he was in studio with
Speaker 1: us like that was that was very enjoyable and especially like,
Speaker 1: I know you haven't tried it. I I haven't. But
Speaker 1: the more people we talked to about this, the more
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, him talking about them, like having
Speaker 1: questions to ask. That part intrigued me. It was like
Speaker 1: going there with some thought and be like, you know
Speaker 1: what happened here? Like he was. He had mentioned some
Speaker 1: stuff to me off off air and it was like, oh,
Speaker 1: you can ask questions like that and he was like,
Speaker 1: oh absolutely, and he's like in the in the higher
Speaker 1: being will answer that for you. And it's like that's yeah,
Speaker 1: that's crazy, not not not dismissive crazy, but it's obviously
Speaker 1: not like other you know, drugs quote unquote um that.
Speaker 1: That's what's interesting about it to me is that like
Speaker 1: you go under and it's like you're having a conversation
Speaker 1: with this plant, medicine whatever, whatever it is. It is
Speaker 1: a two way. I think the plant medicine is such
Speaker 1: a better term than psychedelics that just has such a
Speaker 1: negative connotation, Like plant medicine sounds not not all. There's
Speaker 1: a such thing as like synthetic D M T and
Speaker 1: M d M A. I think it is. Also it
Speaker 1: is synthetic, So I mean it's not all plant medicine. Um,
Speaker 1: but I understand the difference between the two. Um. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that that's gonna wrap up episode seventy. I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: do ad reads quick. Um. For seventy one, we're gonna
Speaker 1: have on. We know we we're gonna have on. Joe.
Speaker 1: We thought we're gonna have him on this episode. Miles
Speaker 1: just took it and ran with it. Luckily Joe was
Speaker 1: cool enough to Uh, I don't want to say bump him,
Speaker 1: but he's gonna let us. He's gonna let us up. Well,
Speaker 1: just some people know what we're recording two episodes back
Speaker 1: to Oh, I didn't know if we wanted to ruin
Speaker 1: the surprise, but you know we can take the fourth
Speaker 1: of July worked up. We're doubling up. Yeah, yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so yeah, so our next episode is gonna be jog
Speaker 1: a fave and I'm gonna call uh he should be available.
Speaker 1: We'll call him and see if he replies or not.
Speaker 1: My friend Joshua, who has been on the show maybe
Speaker 1: once or twice, um to talk about some stuff with
Speaker 1: the American Legion and we'll talk a little bit about
Speaker 1: the Fourth of July and the Revolutionary War on the
Speaker 1: next episode for our Fourth of July special. Great. I
Speaker 1: like that title, the fourth of July Special. UM, So
Speaker 1: thank you to Miles. Incredible, very very eye opening stuff.
Speaker 1: He was passionate about it. I mean, I feel like
Speaker 1: when the people are passionate about what they're talking about,
Speaker 1: it makes for a better podcast. So just let me
Speaker 1: get through some ad reads and then uh we'll send
Speaker 1: you guys on our way. Hopefully you enjoyed this episode
Speaker 1: and you'll be hearing Miles and uh oh no, this
Speaker 1: was Miles. You'll be hearing Joe and Joshua next Yeah, Friday,
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Speaker 1: episode four seventy Thank you guys for listening. Tune back
Speaker 1: in episode four seventy one Joe La fave Jack's buddy Josh.
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