Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to stuff.
Speaker 1: I've never told your production of I Heart Radios how
Speaker 1: stuff work. Do you know what today is, Samantha? What
Speaker 1: is today? I don't know? Wait what, but it's time
Speaker 1: for another female first. That was really anti colomatic. I
Speaker 1: wasn't really hoping it was. Of course, it is a
Speaker 1: big day. That is the biggest day. It's true. It's true. However,
Speaker 1: I thought that was something else added. Maybe that's actually
Speaker 1: I'm not well, you know what next time, Kate Champagne,
Speaker 1: we'll do it right, Yes, we'll do it right. Expectations
Speaker 1: are huge. Yes, we're going to build it up every time.
Speaker 1: But that means we are joined once again by our
Speaker 1: friend and co worker Eves. Eves. Hello, Hi, I'm good,
Speaker 1: but I have a request. If there is cake next time,
Speaker 1: can it be cheesecake? Because I'm not a hugest fan
Speaker 1: of other kinds of cake. So if can do if
Speaker 1: I can be that person and request that comes. No,
Speaker 1: that's perfect because I'm the same way. And so my
Speaker 1: birthday is this month, y'all just heads up. And since
Speaker 1: I was fourteen years old because I did not like
Speaker 1: regular cake, my birthday cake has always been cheesecake. So
Speaker 1: every year I missed a couple of years and so
Speaker 1: I couldn't go home. My mom would make me a
Speaker 1: fancy homemade cheesecake for my birthday. So I like that. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: we will do cheesecake. Are you in on the cheesecake game, Tony?
Speaker 1: I am. But I actually have a very funny story
Speaker 1: about cheesecake because I once when I was in middle school,
Speaker 1: I bought an entire cheesecake from Krogerant. It was a
Speaker 1: different chocolate flavor every slice, that little special try. Me
Speaker 1: and my friend ate the entire thing while we were
Speaker 1: watching the Stargate movie with Kurt Russell James Spader, and
Speaker 1: we got very sick. Yeah, and so I have an ass.
Speaker 1: I just have to get past it. Like every time
Speaker 1: I have the first bite, it's good, but you know
Speaker 1: there's that like nervousness and that's not like that's not good.
Speaker 1: But you are the winner. You get to make the request. Okay,
Speaker 1: it will be a cheesecake. Do you like the toppings
Speaker 1: or do you like playing cheesecake. Let's make a pretty
Speaker 1: good cheesecake. I will say that playing or strawberry, I
Speaker 1: don't really get much more interesting in it. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: the reason I fell in love with cheesecakes because I
Speaker 1: watched my mom make it and I helped to make it.
Speaker 1: It's like these mini chocolate chips with the chocolate crust.
Speaker 1: That is my all time favorite. I don't like anything
Speaker 1: over that. Like, I can do some strawberries and all
Speaker 1: of that, but I don't want to be I'll fancy
Speaker 1: with like Heathcliff ribbon bar type of thing that will
Speaker 1: make my teeth fall out. It's an orphan thing. Oh no,
Speaker 1: I know, y'all. Well, you're welcome. Cheeseake a side. I
Speaker 1: used to be where my parents in college would be
Speaker 1: like me, does that the cheesecake factory? And I'd be like, Okay,
Speaker 1: that's fancy. I know, super fancy. Book. It overwhelms me.
Speaker 1: It's too much. I agree with you. There, we're on
Speaker 1: the same page. But today we are not talking about
Speaker 1: just cheesecake. Fine, fine, we'll return to that topic later.
Speaker 1: Who did you bring us as our female first of
Speaker 1: the day. Well, today's female first is Norma Merrick s Clark,
Speaker 1: and she has a lot of first to her name,
Speaker 1: like a lot of them, but one of the biggest
Speaker 1: ones is that she was well she was one of
Speaker 1: the first black female licensed architects in the US. She
Speaker 1: wasn't the first one. A lot of places list her
Speaker 1: as the first, but she probably wasn't the first UM
Speaker 1: in the US. But she was the first black woman
Speaker 1: to be licensed as an architect in New York and
Speaker 1: in California. And she was the first black woman to
Speaker 1: be a member of the American Institute of Architects. And
Speaker 1: she was the first black woman to be appointed a
Speaker 1: Fellow of the American Institute of Architects. So this one
Speaker 1: is UM, I guess a little bit different than previous
Speaker 1: first just because she died in twelve, so that wasn't
Speaker 1: that long ago. I think a lot of the people
Speaker 1: we've covered in the past kind of like stuck to
Speaker 1: But I think it's important to show that, like this
Speaker 1: was the first that happened not too long ago, and
Speaker 1: this is still a field that is very The number
Speaker 1: of black women, black people in general, lit alone black
Speaker 1: women in the field of licensed architects in the United
Speaker 1: States is very small and disproportionate UM, and it's something
Speaker 1: that's growing, but like it's still it's still a small
Speaker 1: number of black women in the field. And yeah, so
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about Normal today, which is she was,
Speaker 1: you know, a pioneer in the field, and her story
Speaker 1: is pretty interesting. Yeah, it is pretty telling that. Um
Speaker 1: it's such a recent first. And normally when we do these,
Speaker 1: I get a bunch of bullet points and I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 1: here's the things that they've done. And this one is
Speaker 1: three pages. She did a lot, right, Yeah, yeah, So
Speaker 1: I guess well, let's get started, let's get into you already. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so ready. So Normal was born on April fifteenth nine
Speaker 1: in Harlem, and her father's name was Walter Merrick. He
Speaker 1: was a doctor, and her mother was Amy Merrick, and
Speaker 1: she was a seamstress. And they were both immigrants there
Speaker 1: from Trinidad, and she was their only child. And so
Speaker 1: she was raised during the Great Depression. Her family moved
Speaker 1: from Crown Heights in Brooklyn when she was a child,
Speaker 1: or excuse me, her family moved to Crown Heights in
Speaker 1: Brooklyn when she was a child, and her father got
Speaker 1: a medical degree from Howard University. UM. So when she
Speaker 1: was a child, she was already exhibiting all these signs
Speaker 1: that like would lead towards architecture. I don't know about y'all.
Speaker 1: But like, architecture is very interesting too. I could never
Speaker 1: I could never do it, like like, but I think
Speaker 1: it's amazing, um and just something that's grown, like become
Speaker 1: so innovative so quickly. Um. But just like it has
Speaker 1: so many different elements of things, and like there's the art,
Speaker 1: there is the math, there are the visuals, and like
Speaker 1: you know, just so many the physics of it, like
Speaker 1: so many different things that go into it. And so
Speaker 1: as a child, she exhibited all these signs of being
Speaker 1: good in all these different areas. So she had this
Speaker 1: art thing. She sketched, she painted, and she drew, and
Speaker 1: she did carpentry work, she worked on furniture. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so she was really a cool gal when she was young.
Speaker 1: And she went to a public girls school called Hunter
Speaker 1: College High School. And she was a good high school
Speaker 1: student too in some of those same fields. She said
Speaker 1: that her grades were pretty good and pretty much everything
Speaker 1: I love it, I know. But she was really good
Speaker 1: at art, the sciences, and math, which is still pretty
Speaker 1: much everything good in general. But it was her father
Speaker 1: who suggested to her that maybe you should do architecture.
Speaker 1: And obviously then as there aren't now there weren't many
Speaker 1: black people who were in the profession, but that didn't
Speaker 1: keep her from pursuing it. So she wanted to go
Speaker 1: to Howard like her father did, but her father didn't
Speaker 1: want her to. Her parents wanted her to stay closer
Speaker 1: to home, and so to prepare for a Columbia University's
Speaker 1: architecture program, she took liberal arts courses at Barnard College,
Speaker 1: and Barnard College was associated with Columbia University, but it
Speaker 1: was for women like it was for women, as Columbia
Speaker 1: didn't accept women's students. So she went through that those
Speaker 1: courses and then she got into the Columbia University School
Speaker 1: of Architecture. So she remarked on how her first year
Speaker 1: there was super hard, but that didn't keep her from
Speaker 1: coming back after the summer. She came back in the
Speaker 1: fall because like many of her classmates were World War
Speaker 1: Two veterans UM some have bachelor's and master's degrees, so
Speaker 1: basically they had people around them and they already had
Speaker 1: all this experience to be able to help them through
Speaker 1: the process of getting through these Amazingly, I can't even
Speaker 1: imagine how difficult courses they were. UM. So those people
Speaker 1: would kind of work on assignments together, but she had
Speaker 1: this situation where she was commuting to school sometimes had
Speaker 1: to finish her work on her commutes or at home alone.
Speaker 1: So that kind of having we know, like having how
Speaker 1: having that support system is important when you're going through school.
Speaker 1: She got her Bachelor of Architecture degree in nineteen fifty
Speaker 1: and she was one of two women in her class
Speaker 1: and the only black one. After that, she applied to
Speaker 1: nineteen architectural firms. She said in the interviews, like I
Speaker 1: won't forget that number nineteen, but was turned down to
Speaker 1: every one of them. Yeah, and she got hers on
Speaker 1: the she got the twentie um. This is a quote
Speaker 1: that she said. She said, I don't know if the
Speaker 1: rejections were because I was a black person, because I
Speaker 1: was a young woman, or because of the economic recession
Speaker 1: at the time, but she said that those places weren't
Speaker 1: hiring women are black people. So I think we can
Speaker 1: go to kind of go like we know what the
Speaker 1: issue was here. Yeah, So she her twenty one. That
Speaker 1: was when she went to work in the City of
Speaker 1: New York's Department of Public Works as what she says
Speaker 1: as a junior draft person, and she didn't like that
Speaker 1: job because she couldn't really be creative in it UM,
Speaker 1: so she wasn't there long. She took the New York
Speaker 1: State Architects Licensing exam and she passed it on the
Speaker 1: first time, which everybody doesn't do UM, even though it
Speaker 1: was a really tough days long test, And she became
Speaker 1: a licensed architect in nineteen fifty four, and that was
Speaker 1: when her first first comes along. She became New York
Speaker 1: State's first black woman licensed architect. So she was hired
Speaker 1: by a private architectural firm at that point after she
Speaker 1: quit her job with the city. Even though her supervisor
Speaker 1: gave her a bad reference and her relationship with that
Speaker 1: supervisor with her boss wasn't there wasn't anything wrong with it,
Speaker 1: so he but he said that she was lazy, she
Speaker 1: got to work late a lot, that she didn't know
Speaker 1: an anything about design and architecture, and that she socialized
Speaker 1: a lot. So he had a lot of really negative
Speaker 1: things to say about her, even though she never had
Speaker 1: any issues, and she thought it had to do with
Speaker 1: the fact that her boss wasn't a licensed architect and
Speaker 1: was older, and she was a younger black and licensed architect. UM,
Speaker 1: so she still got the job, she was a threat. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure like old dude is like, man, I've
Speaker 1: done nothing. We feel this way similarly, but we don't
Speaker 1: lash out at recommendation. Right. So, even though she got
Speaker 1: out of her old job because she felt like she
Speaker 1: was wasting her potential, she was still doing small tests
Speaker 1: like designing bathroom layouts, so she still kind of felt,
Speaker 1: you know, a way about that. She spent a year
Speaker 1: at that small firm, and in nineteen five she joined
Speaker 1: the office of skin Moore, Owings and Meryll. She ended
Speaker 1: up working there until nineteen sixty, so that was a
Speaker 1: pretty big firm. And as that major firm, she was
Speaker 1: working on large scale projects and teaching evening architecture courses
Speaker 1: at New York City Community College. And so around this
Speaker 1: time she was a single mother of two children. She
Speaker 1: had already been married and been divorced, and her mother
Speaker 1: took care of her children while she worked, so she
Speaker 1: did have a support system. Is not like nobody was
Speaker 1: there while she was doing all this stuff. And in
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine, she became the first black woman to
Speaker 1: be a member of the American Institute of Architects BOOM.
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty That's when she moved to California, and
Speaker 1: there she took a job at Gruin and Associates in
Speaker 1: Los Angeles. And just a side note about Gruin, Victor
Speaker 1: Gruen was the person who was credited with kind of
Speaker 1: being a pioneer in the American shopping mall. He did
Speaker 1: a lot of work in that area. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I talked about him recent because we were talking about
Speaker 1: food courts on the other show. I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: why you pointed me, I don't know that one. You're
Speaker 1: not flooring. Yeah, shopping malls are I feel. I don't
Speaker 1: know how sad I am about them leaving, but I
Speaker 1: do have I do remember the glory days of going
Speaker 1: into the Disney stores and into the jewelry stores and
Speaker 1: then having the double layers and then you see stories
Speaker 1: on top, trying to fig out where to go getting
Speaker 1: a cookie in between, always feeling like you were this
Speaker 1: close to like falling over the edge because they always
Speaker 1: had those on the top level of the white glass,
Speaker 1: and I would always be scared. I'm like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: there's no perfume. Everything so funny. The things you're saying,
Speaker 1: I think no one else would say. It was like
Speaker 1: a plus of mall. You could look down. I think
Speaker 1: you could smell. You're like a little kid in a
Speaker 1: small town and all you see with three aisles and
Speaker 1: you come to a giant mall that is like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I went out. Well you've been to China. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure if you you have, but they had a million
Speaker 1: shopping I don't. They have so many malls it is ridiculous.
Speaker 1: And they're huge, like there there's a basement, and there's
Speaker 1: a basement under the basement. Like they're so organized, so organized,
Speaker 1: like they would name what the categories of things are
Speaker 1: on each floor. When you got to that floor, I
Speaker 1: was like, wow, this is that makes sense. This is
Speaker 1: very organized and I like it. Anyway that go to
Speaker 1: malls in China, you'll be there for the next ninety years.
Speaker 1: So when she was at Gruing, she recognized how much
Speaker 1: scrutiny she was getting from her boss. There. She didn't
Speaker 1: have a car, and she got rides with one of
Speaker 1: her colleagues who was a white man, to get to work,
Speaker 1: and later she said in an interview, it took only
Speaker 1: one week before the boss came and spoke to me
Speaker 1: about being late. Yet he had not noticed that the
Speaker 1: young man had been late for two years. My solution
Speaker 1: was to buy a car, since I, the highly visible employee,
Speaker 1: had to be punctual. And uh, I think it's funny
Speaker 1: how she said highly visible employee. I feel like that's
Speaker 1: definitely skating around saying, oh I was a black woman.
Speaker 1: They wanted me to see me my mistakes. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: we we get the subtext there. She got her architecture
Speaker 1: license in California in nineteen sixty two, and so she
Speaker 1: was the first African American woman to have one in
Speaker 1: California and she remained the only one for twenty years. Eighties. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was weird noise. We're all about it today. Sorry,
Speaker 1: speaking of weird noises, we should follish for an out
Speaker 1: of right back and we're back, thank you sponsoring. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: she she becomes the first another first, another first black
Speaker 1: woman architecture in California and state that way for a
Speaker 1: very unfortunate eies. Yeah. Yeah, and she was at that
Speaker 1: firm for a while too. After six years at that firm,
Speaker 1: she became the director of architecture there and she hired
Speaker 1: people and oversaw staff and coordinated the technical aspects of
Speaker 1: some really big projects. And so some of her projects
Speaker 1: were California, mart Fox Plaza, Pacific Design Center, San Bernardino
Speaker 1: City Hall, and the US Embassy in Tokyo. And her
Speaker 1: son said that she thought designing the building was the
Speaker 1: actual easy part of the job, while the production of it,
Speaker 1: all the other nuts and bolts that went into it,
Speaker 1: was the real work of the job. I feel like
Speaker 1: it's easy to downplay when you're you've worked that hard
Speaker 1: to get to somewhere and it's such a major position,
Speaker 1: it's easy to downplan sing, Yeah, I just knew what
Speaker 1: I was. You know, that's the easy part. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I get how things like that have so many different
Speaker 1: moving parts, so everybody's job is important. But yeah, so
Speaker 1: she got she got to that point, and for a
Speaker 1: lot of her career she actually served as a project
Speaker 1: manager rather than a design architect, which was actually the
Speaker 1: case with many women architects who worked who worked in
Speaker 1: corporate firms. So she didn't design most of the big
Speaker 1: projects that she supervised. And Marshall Pernell, who was a
Speaker 1: former president of the ai A, the American Institute of Architects,
Speaker 1: told The l A Times that she could design large projects,
Speaker 1: but that it was unheard of to have an African
Speaker 1: American female who was registered as an architect. You didn't
Speaker 1: try that person out in front of your clients and
Speaker 1: say this is the person designing your project. So Marshall Parnell,
Speaker 1: who was a former president of the ai A, told
Speaker 1: the l A Times that she could design large projects,
Speaker 1: but quote, it was unheard of to have an African
Speaker 1: American female who was registered as an architect. You didn't
Speaker 1: trot that person out in front of your clients and
Speaker 1: say this is the person designing your project. She was
Speaker 1: not allowed to express herself as a designer, but she
Speaker 1: was capable of doing anything. That's what Marshall Purnell said.
Speaker 1: Either way, she was a really good project manager. And
Speaker 1: she stayed with Grewin until nineteen eighty and she got
Speaker 1: She was married several times throughout her life. During the
Speaker 1: time where she was at Grwin, she married Ralph s. Clerk,
Speaker 1: an associate at Gruen who died in nineteen eighty four,
Speaker 1: so he died years after they married. In nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: Here's another first. She became the first black woman appointed
Speaker 1: to the College of Fellows of the ai A, and
Speaker 1: she was the first woman in the Los Angeles AI
Speaker 1: a chapter to be given that honor. That same year,
Speaker 1: she became vice president at the Los Angeles firm Walton
Speaker 1: Beckett Associates. So she was a project director on Terminal
Speaker 1: one at Los Angeles International Airport, which was a fifty
Speaker 1: million dollar project that she finished before the start of
Speaker 1: the Olympics. M hm. This is another part of her
Speaker 1: life which I think YouTube will really appreciate. She co
Speaker 1: founded the women owned firm Siegel's, Clerric and Diamond with
Speaker 1: Margot Siegel and Katherine Diamond, and that was the largest
Speaker 1: completely women owned architectural firm in the US at the time. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Like that. She was the first African American woman to
Speaker 1: co own an architectural practice. Yeah, so many first yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The firm made a bunch of proposals, that made proposals
Speaker 1: on five projects and it got all of those commissions.
Speaker 1: So they worked on the Tarzana Promenade, which was a
Speaker 1: ninety thousand square foot medical and retail center, and a
Speaker 1: remodeling of the Lawndale Civic Center. And they worked on
Speaker 1: additions to schools and other institutional buildings. So this was
Speaker 1: after her previous husband died, she married Dr Cornelius Welch,
Speaker 1: so another marriage in her life, and she left Seagulls,
Speaker 1: Clerk and Diamond in nineteen eighty nine, even though it
Speaker 1: was a really cool thing to do, because even though
Speaker 1: they had these fifty million dollar projects, they couldn't get
Speaker 1: the large scale projects that she really wanted, and she
Speaker 1: missed that kind of challenge and the money that came
Speaker 1: with those projects, which is totally understandable. Yeah. She became
Speaker 1: the principle of project management at the Jarity Partnership, which
Speaker 1: was a firm that was known for his design of
Speaker 1: public spaces, and while she was there, she helped design,
Speaker 1: mine and construct the Mall of America back. I've never
Speaker 1: been to the Mall of America. I have not. I've
Speaker 1: seen the Mary Kayton Ashley short ed. Okay, now, I'm
Speaker 1: just annoyed. You've seen that, but not anybody Gables. I've
Speaker 1: seen it multiple times. I'm not insisticated you Okay, I'm old.
Speaker 1: I'm also shot because a lot of the dates are
Speaker 1: in my lifetime accomplished, and I'm just like, wow, it
Speaker 1: took that long for her to be awarded and honored
Speaker 1: as she should have been. That's crazy. It is. Well,
Speaker 1: we have a little bit more for you, but first
Speaker 1: one more quick break for word from our sponsor, and
Speaker 1: we're back. Thank you sponsor. So I'm all of America.
Speaker 1: Future destination for Mary Kate and Ashley big project is
Speaker 1: the point, I think, Well, that's why she worked on it.
Speaker 1: For Mary. Of course, it was a big set for
Speaker 1: their little mini series, The Adventures of Mary Kaye Absolute
Speaker 1: because they don't around and get lost again. I don't
Speaker 1: really remember much other than the coaster, remember, like you
Speaker 1: watch it every day, you're like that Mary Kate and
Speaker 1: Nashley video. I just gotta I gotta hold onto the
Speaker 1: old daisys. I don't need your judgment of what I
Speaker 1: gotta do. I oh no, I'm just saying like, it's
Speaker 1: not like we're that fresh. I'm not that fresh up
Speaker 1: on it, because I imagine it wouldn't be a thing
Speaker 1: that you go back to every day a lot. Oh no, never,
Speaker 1: of course, not. Well, maybe you do, no judgment. She
Speaker 1: retired from that practice in nineteen two. But you know,
Speaker 1: she had a long, illustrious career, and she also did
Speaker 1: a ton of other things. Besides that career, she also
Speaker 1: taught at the University of California, Los Angeles and served
Speaker 1: as a director of the University of Southern California Architects
Speaker 1: Skilled and she was a member of the Commission of
Speaker 1: the California State Board of Architectural Examiners. Yeah, and what
Speaker 1: I'm outful mouthful. In the nineteen nineties, she lectured at
Speaker 1: Howard University, Columbia University, and other schools, and she held
Speaker 1: seminars for people who were taking the Architecture Licensing exam
Speaker 1: So she kind of worked as this mentor to other people.
Speaker 1: She said that she didn't have any mentors and or
Speaker 1: like role models growing up, but was happy to be
Speaker 1: one to others, which I feel like it's an important
Speaker 1: thing to remember, like left as you and I guess
Speaker 1: that would be a huge problem for anybody who's the
Speaker 1: first How do you find them in when you're the
Speaker 1: one that's paving the way and to remember when once
Speaker 1: you have, let's teach others to do so. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: a big I guess you have. You definitely have to
Speaker 1: have a lot of resilience to be a person breaking
Speaker 1: down marries like that, especially feel that is dominant even
Speaker 1: now by pretty much mel people. People articulate as always
Speaker 1: that's us, but that's one of those words. I love
Speaker 1: the word people because it just automatically makes you sound smarter,
Speaker 1: money dumb when I say people. That's how I say it.
Speaker 1: No want to, I'm giving this. I'm getting these endearing
Speaker 1: all from YouTube right now. Now it's getting more concerned.
Speaker 1: Don't worry about it, don't worry about so. Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 1: that's got to be really hard to come into a
Speaker 1: field that is still predominantly male based and male dominated
Speaker 1: and trying to lead away, trying to do siminars. That's
Speaker 1: phenomenal as a black woman just paving her way through.
Speaker 1: She felt that quote architecture should be working on improving
Speaker 1: the environment of people in their homes, in their places
Speaker 1: of work, and their places of recreation. It should be
Speaker 1: functional and pleasant, not just in the image of the
Speaker 1: ego of the architects. I think that's good insight into
Speaker 1: how she felt about the work that she did once
Speaker 1: she retired. I like this part. She lived with her
Speaker 1: family in southern California and she had garden parties in
Speaker 1: the springtime, which is not really fancy. I don't know
Speaker 1: if I've ever been to a garden party before, but
Speaker 1: I would love to go to one. I've been to
Speaker 1: one and it was sponsored by a gin company and
Speaker 1: it was beautiful. There was there a lot of gin
Speaker 1: there so much. I feel like is the thing that
Speaker 1: you drink at garden parties? Though, No, you drink like
Speaker 1: um type of thing. And that's more. Isn't that whiskey
Speaker 1: and bucket? Yes, and stuff? So more on those lines.
Speaker 1: Maybe a little bit of lemonade and tees of sorts.
Speaker 1: But that would be what I would think of as
Speaker 1: a garden party. But if it was my garden party, yes,
Speaker 1: it would have a lot of gin. I think we
Speaker 1: can make our own rules when it comes to the
Speaker 1: garden party. I think so. I think there's a lot
Speaker 1: of like that croquet game again, which I can reference
Speaker 1: to Heathers. I've never oh too people. We're letting Samantha
Speaker 1: down on the river find friends here if you if
Speaker 1: you keep naming things to be fair, you guys also
Speaker 1: had a SpongeBob reference. I was like, what it's true. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I will watch Heathers eve and I yes, let's have
Speaker 1: a party. Let's have a garden party. Actually that was
Speaker 1: a name party for that at one of the restaurants
Speaker 1: in Atlanta. They all came dressed up. I don't know
Speaker 1: what it was for, but it was really cute. They're
Speaker 1: really cute all stuff like that. Yeah, we can, we
Speaker 1: can make it work. Okay, please have a there like
Speaker 1: the Heather. Is it like this is the sporty Heather?
Speaker 1: Is it like Spice Girls? But with Heathers No, it's
Speaker 1: just who's the leader? Okay, So I can't just pret
Speaker 1: like scary Heather or whatever. You could be scary Heather
Speaker 1: would be one on a writer's character, not a Heather.
Speaker 1: She's oh, Bianca, Oh, I can't do that. That's what
Speaker 1: I can't really take that out because if I don't
Speaker 1: know my coming for you, they're gonna get me. Um.
Speaker 1: But Heather, I want to know the writer's character is
Speaker 1: the dark haired one. In comparison, she had a Doherty,
Speaker 1: isn't it? As well? As well questions later what a cast?
Speaker 1: She was still really active in all the architectural things
Speaker 1: going into, you know, the later years of her life.
Speaker 1: In two thousand three, she was appointed to the California
Speaker 1: Architects Board, where she served on the Professional Qualifications Committee
Speaker 1: and the Regulatory Enforcement Committee. I was really hoping you
Speaker 1: that she was just the She started as the whole Committie.
Speaker 1: I really wanted her to beat someone. I am. I'm
Speaker 1: here for it. And she was on a bunch of
Speaker 1: other boards and committees to which wouldn't even go into.
Speaker 1: In two thousand eight, the AI gave her the Whitney M.
Speaker 1: Young Junior Award, which is an award that recognizes an
Speaker 1: architect or an organization that embodies the profession's responsibility to
Speaker 1: address social issues. And she died four years later in
Speaker 1: twelve of heart failure at her home in California, when
Speaker 1: she was eighty five years old. Yeah, but she was
Speaker 1: clearly you know, recognized for the work that she did
Speaker 1: while she was alive. But she has got an aposthumous
Speaker 1: award as well. Just this year, in July twenty nineteen,
Speaker 1: she became the first black woman to be given the
Speaker 1: American Institute of Architects Los Angeles Gold Medal, and that
Speaker 1: Gold Medal is given in recognition of a significant body
Speaker 1: of work with lasting influence on the theory and practice
Speaker 1: of architecture. And that's the highest honor that the organization awards.
Speaker 1: So she's as many people are and have been awarded
Speaker 1: things posthumously as well. So it's good to know that
Speaker 1: a person. You know, we talk about giving people their
Speaker 1: flowers while they're still alive and for them to be
Speaker 1: awarded while they're alive, but also important to remember people
Speaker 1: after they've gone and the work that they've done, especially pioneering.
Speaker 1: It feels like this and kind of opening up like
Speaker 1: she acted as a mentor to opening it up to
Speaker 1: other people who may think that they don't have a place,
Speaker 1: and and feels like this. And I think about this
Speaker 1: all the time when it comes to you know, being
Speaker 1: a first or being a black woman to pioneer spaces
Speaker 1: that a lot of people may think of as white spaces,
Speaker 1: but they are are are male spaces. White spaces are
Speaker 1: spaces for men. Uh and not having a kind of
Speaker 1: path or not seeing a path or a way forward
Speaker 1: for you because you can't see yourself in that organization.
Speaker 1: But there are you know they're there, you know they're
Speaker 1: they're there. And I think having, you know, being able
Speaker 1: to look back at a legacy like hers and being
Speaker 1: able to continuously honor her legacy is important when it
Speaker 1: comes to remembering that we can continue forward on the
Speaker 1: path that she created. There can be more black women
Speaker 1: architects in the field. They can you can be licensed.
Speaker 1: You know, you can fail when you can apply somewhere
Speaker 1: nineteen times and the twentieth one will be the one
Speaker 1: that you get. So I think that's why I think
Speaker 1: it's important to look back at a legacy like hers.
Speaker 1: It's very well put. Eaves. I agree. I think we
Speaker 1: talked about on the show a lot the power of
Speaker 1: seeing yourself somewhere and how much that can impact you,
Speaker 1: especially when you're young, like when you're a child and
Speaker 1: you don't if you don't see anybody that looks like you,
Speaker 1: then you kind of think, well, that must not be
Speaker 1: for me. So I'm glad that we have people like this,
Speaker 1: we have our female First that are being examples and
Speaker 1: being mentors. Oh yeah, and on Female First, I wanted
Speaker 1: to shout out a couple of other people because I
Speaker 1: know I mentioned in the beginning that she was not
Speaker 1: the the first licensed black female architect in the US.
Speaker 1: So the first black architect period to become a member
Speaker 1: of the AIA was Paul Revere Williams in ninete and
Speaker 1: before Norma there were Beverly Lorraine Green and Georgia Louise
Speaker 1: Harris Brown, and they were also thought to be licensed
Speaker 1: as architects. In nineteen forty two and nineteen forty nine respectively,
Speaker 1: in both of them were registered in Illinois, and so
Speaker 1: both of their stories are interesting as well. And I
Speaker 1: felt like we talked about this a lot first and
Speaker 1: how there was a path for a person to get
Speaker 1: to a first, there were so many other hands involved,
Speaker 1: especially when it comes to inventions and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: that a person's first wasn't isolated, and also continuing to
Speaker 1: put into perspective and context why a first is important
Speaker 1: in terms of like, well, other people had access and
Speaker 1: there weren't barriers for them necessarily, but you know, it's
Speaker 1: there were leading up to her becoming having her first,
Speaker 1: there were other people who came before her, and Beverly
Speaker 1: and Georgia were two of those people, and so their
Speaker 1: stories are really interesting as well. And Brown recognized the
Speaker 1: bearer she faced because she was a black woman trying
Speaker 1: to work in architecture, So she learned Portuguese and he
Speaker 1: moved to Brazil in nineteen fifty three because she kind
Speaker 1: of realized there was a burgeoning, growing architecture seeing there
Speaker 1: and she later got her architectural license there as well.
Speaker 1: In Brazil, and she moved there knowing about all those
Speaker 1: advancements that were being made, and she was also kind
Speaker 1: of seeking racial democracy because there was this kind of
Speaker 1: propaganda machine going on right now saying, look at us,
Speaker 1: we have this really open, you know, racial situation going
Speaker 1: on in Brazil, but without needing to go into the
Speaker 1: details of like the racial yeah, like maneuvers of everything
Speaker 1: that happened and still is happening in Brazil right now. Like, um,
Speaker 1: it wasn't obviously as rosy as that propaganda made it seem,
Speaker 1: so you know, that was the thing. But she also
Speaker 1: was successful when she got to Brazil and started working
Speaker 1: their architecture. But yeah, those are stories as well. If
Speaker 1: anybody wants to go on that path and continue looking
Speaker 1: at all these architectural first and pioneering women in it,
Speaker 1: and you've got a bonus female first listeners, like a
Speaker 1: mini female first within the female FIRS homework homework. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've always wanted to assign homework. If we can see
Speaker 1: your opportunity, it's time listeners go out and find more
Speaker 1: female first for us and send them away. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: I think that's a about what we have to say
Speaker 1: about Norma. Thank you so much, as always a used. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a joy being here. So that's a pleasure. Okay,
Speaker 1: we do. We love it when you come here. We do,
Speaker 1: and we would love for listeners to be able to
Speaker 1: find you because you do other things than this. You
Speaker 1: have a lot of other stuff going on. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: feel like I never know where I can tell them
Speaker 1: to find me, but I will say that I also
Speaker 1: host Unpopular, which is a show about people in history
Speaker 1: who stood up to the status quo and did things
Speaker 1: and were often persecuted for it. You can find Unpopular
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Speaker 1: one right now. And you can also hear me on
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Speaker 1: of the social media things, and also on the podcast
Speaker 1: also on the podcast that thing that you're used to
Speaker 1: listen if you're look up the phone and I don't
Speaker 1: know that. I don't do a good at mid mid central,
Speaker 1: midwestern whatever that old accident is talking about. Trans Atlantic Yeah,
Speaker 1: that thing, get London on the phone. I'm pretty good
Speaker 1: at it. I don't want to hear any critiques because
Speaker 1: it's perfect and that's the only thing they say over
Speaker 1: and over London, just London in general, because I like it,
Speaker 1: like that. We're not here to criticize, You're going to
Speaker 1: validate to it all to thank you, just to call London.
Speaker 1: I want to call London. I've been waiting my whole
Speaker 1: life in London to debut that impression. So thanks everyone.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that that works. You can also email
Speaker 1: us at Stuff Media, mom Stuff at iHeart media dot com.
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Speaker 1: as always to our super producer Andrew Howard Andrew, and
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