Speaker 1: On the beck dol Cast, the questions asked if movies
Speaker 1: have wenen inum, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
Speaker 1: or do they have individualism? The patriarchy zef in best
Speaker 1: start changing it with the Bedel Cast. Oh I wish
Speaker 1: I pretend I'm opening a can of Mike's Hard. Hello,
Speaker 1: and welcome to the Bechdel Cast retro version. My name
Speaker 1: is Jane. I haven't drank Mike's during a Bechtel Cast
Speaker 1: episode in literally a year and a half. It's been
Speaker 1: a while, but I had two cold bruise this morning,
Speaker 1: and so I'm just I'm like a young Judy Garland.
Speaker 1: I'm just upping and downing all damn day and I'm
Speaker 1: going to die before in fifty I think that that
Speaker 1: all tracks that works for me. How are you, Caitlin?
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want you to die ever. Thank
Speaker 1: you stay alive. I think that the world I forget
Speaker 1: what that article said. I think the world's gonna die
Speaker 1: when I'm like forty seven. The world will die before
Speaker 1: we do. Yes, so that's great anyway. Hi, I'm Caitlin Dron.
Speaker 1: This is the Bechtel Cast. This is our podcast about
Speaker 1: women in movie, and we use the Bechdel test to
Speaker 1: initiate a larger conversation. I think most of the things
Speaker 1: we just said past you did say Mike's hard lemonades Mike.
Speaker 1: We don't know how Mike that's true. I don't. I don't.
Speaker 1: I honestly don't even know if Mike is a person
Speaker 1: or an idea. Wow makes you think that's right? And also,
Speaker 1: how does the world how does the planet Earth identify? Genderless? Icon?
Speaker 1: That's what I say anyway, So the Pectel test requires
Speaker 1: that a movie, for example, has two named female identifying
Speaker 1: characters who must speak to each other about something other
Speaker 1: than a man. And our version is just a two
Speaker 1: line exchange. That's all the needs to happen. And you
Speaker 1: know some movies do it and some movies don't. Let's
Speaker 1: let's try it. Okay, Okay, here we got here's a
Speaker 1: Bextel test test. Hey, Caitlin, Hey Jamie, you know what
Speaker 1: I love when it happens in a movie. Tell me
Speaker 1: when New York is not just a place but a character.
Speaker 1: I how does New York identify, Oh my god, as
Speaker 1: a fucking asshole? I don't know. There. I just love
Speaker 1: when New York That's my favorite piece of film criticism
Speaker 1: when they're like, the location is actually also a character, um,
Speaker 1: which you know, I love that. I think it's just
Speaker 1: a gorgeous, very thoughtful original definitely, and it's it's what's
Speaker 1: crazy about this is that New York City because it's
Speaker 1: a character is my best friend? Wow? I love that.
Speaker 1: Well that passed, We did it. It doesn't have to
Speaker 1: be a good exchange. That's always the lesson. Um. I'm
Speaker 1: so psyched for today's episode. It's been uh request we've
Speaker 1: gotten quite a few times. Yes, we have hatten this
Speaker 1: request for quite a few times. And I'm so thrilled
Speaker 1: to have our guests on today. Good one of my Yes, dude,
Speaker 1: what a delight she is. She's an art critic, she's
Speaker 1: a comedian. She's got a book coming out called Aesthetical
Speaker 1: Relations It's Christina Katherine Martinez. Can I talk now? You
Speaker 1: can't remove. We have ganged you. I'm so excited. Welcome,
Speaker 1: thank you, thanks for being here. Uh. And today we
Speaker 1: were talking about the I guess it's kind of hard
Speaker 1: to tell when this movie came out. People say between okay,
Speaker 1: it was released, you know what is closed? We're talking
Speaker 1: about Frances Hay today. The way I think most people
Speaker 1: met Gertie Gerwig, you know, I ever heard of her
Speaker 1: is confusing. It does have a lot of early vibes
Speaker 1: to it, having come out in twelve and I think
Speaker 1: this movie to me, I like, this movie came out
Speaker 1: while I was in college, so and this is people
Speaker 1: in college bait uh because it's it comes out. But honey,
Speaker 1: it's in black and white. So you're like, so I
Speaker 1: go into this movie and I'm ready to think real hard. Sure, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's a black and white movie. Um directed by
Speaker 1: Noah bomb Boch and written by him and Gretit Gerwig,
Speaker 1: who I think by the time this movie comes out
Speaker 1: are an item, which they are to this day. Good
Speaker 1: for them. Yeah, he left who did he leave for? Grenford?
Speaker 1: Jason Lee? Really? Did she have his baby? No, that
Speaker 1: was Tom Brady left his pregnant. Oh god, Bridget moynihan.
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, my god, I mean this Trump supporter.
Speaker 1: So we don't know, we simply can't with Tom Brady
Speaker 1: difficult difficult. Yeah, I wish it made me mad, the like,
Speaker 1: of course he left his wife for a younger lady.
Speaker 1: But I'm like, they work really well together. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: it's just I mean, two very cool women that he's
Speaker 1: been in at least a public relationship that no, I
Speaker 1: okay that no, now we're not let's just promise to
Speaker 1: never talk about Tommerty. No, but I don't know, no
Speaker 1: a bomb back, you know, I think what you want
Speaker 1: about him? He s datedd some cool ladies. But yeah,
Speaker 1: this is I feel like, um, does this movie qualify
Speaker 1: as mumblecore? I feel like it's adjacent to it, but not.
Speaker 1: There's more plot to it than mumblecore, although there's not
Speaker 1: all that much plot. I would call this, oh, you
Speaker 1: know what we haven't said in a while. This is
Speaker 1: really a tone poem that was I thought goes all
Speaker 1: the way back to our Josh Fadum episode. Yes, it
Speaker 1: really is a tone poet and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: horny tub and it's an actor's film. It's mumble adjacent.
Speaker 1: I haven't because Greta Gerwigs character is pretty Jeremy. But
Speaker 1: I have seen a clip of her acting in an
Speaker 1: actual mumblicore movie and she's literally in a bathtub with goggles,
Speaker 1: you know, spouting her friend like why you know, can
Speaker 1: we connect? It's mumblecore, is starting five sentences and not
Speaker 1: finishing any of them. Sure, right, and this mumblecore, I
Speaker 1: mean I had quite a bit of contempt for that genre,
Speaker 1: and I feel like everyone has dated a douche bag
Speaker 1: who is two into mumblecore. And like my college boyfriend was, like,
Speaker 1: you haven't seen the puffy chair, Like the puffy chair,
Speaker 1: the puffy chair. I guess I don't know what really
Speaker 1: classifies literally just about like it's like Italian neo realism
Speaker 1: but bad. It's like it's usually about people in Brooklyn,
Speaker 1: usually a white hetero couple in Brooklyn, or brothers or
Speaker 1: like brothers working through their issues together. It's always really long,
Speaker 1: it's semi scripted. It's what else is there? I think
Speaker 1: it's it's yeah, plot lists, semi scripted, and I think,
Speaker 1: in an effort to come off as naturalized, I think
Speaker 1: the dialogue tends to be overly awkward, you know, like,
Speaker 1: give people some credit. People are articulate in real life
Speaker 1: at some points. Right, Um, Okay, I'm looking at a list.
Speaker 1: I don't recognize a lot of these moves. Oh, Jeff
Speaker 1: who lives at home? I've saying that I've seen drinking buddies.
Speaker 1: These are on this list, those are yeah, and I
Speaker 1: feel like Francis Ha and the two movies you just
Speaker 1: mentioned are on the more scripted side of that genre
Speaker 1: because like early, like Gregia Garwood got her start in
Speaker 1: mumblecore movies, and most of her early stuff and most
Speaker 1: early mumblecore in general is I feel completely unwatchable and annoying. Oh,
Speaker 1: Before Sunset is on this list, I don't think that's
Speaker 1: it doesn't make this Wikipedia page that before the Before
Speaker 1: Sunset to me is like the opposite. It's so stylized
Speaker 1: because their their dialogue is so pithy. And I love Sunrise.
Speaker 1: I hate it, but I still wouldn't call it mumblecore.
Speaker 1: But I think Francis Hall, I think is maybe one
Speaker 1: of the more polished, if you could even call it,
Speaker 1: of the genre. I wasn't really sure. I don't think so.
Speaker 1: I think it's her graduation from Bolkore. She's you know,
Speaker 1: collaborating with it. I was going to say, real filmmaker,
Speaker 1: that's a horrible put it, you know, like because he's
Speaker 1: a man. I don't know if you were an m R. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I'm an enemy to my own sex and
Speaker 1: I will just maybe stay off the bat. I like
Speaker 1: this movie. I do. So what's what's your history your
Speaker 1: relationship with this movie? I think I saw it in
Speaker 1: the theater and I thought it was amazing, and I
Speaker 1: was I've been subject to a lot of movies with
Speaker 1: like a manic Pixie dream character kind of thing, so
Speaker 1: I was ready to like totally hate it, but because
Speaker 1: I think it was a little more subtle than I
Speaker 1: was expecting, I freaking loved it. And then I watched
Speaker 1: it again this week years later, maybe liked it slightly less.
Speaker 1: There was a few cringing moments of like, here's here's
Speaker 1: a sincerity egg pie in your face. But but I
Speaker 1: really it's it's charming, it's you know, it's the coming
Speaker 1: of age story. But also I think the main thing,
Speaker 1: which is why it's fun to talk about on this podcast,
Speaker 1: is the romances between, like is a female friendships, and
Speaker 1: so I think it's a lot even the more stylized moments,
Speaker 1: like if they had these montages of like playing and eating,
Speaker 1: and if they had that with a straight white couple,
Speaker 1: it would be so bar bar horrific. Yeah, but there
Speaker 1: is something kind of sweet that it's just two friends
Speaker 1: and you don't really see that kind of intimacy too
Speaker 1: much in films. Well, that's because movies don't like to
Speaker 1: have women in them no more, only in certain ways.
Speaker 1: I yeah, I did. Like. My history with this movie
Speaker 1: is I saw it. It It came out when I was
Speaker 1: in college and I went to uh film school and
Speaker 1: everyone was pause it really, did you go to film
Speaker 1: school twice? Though, Jamie, No, I did. I wasn't quite
Speaker 1: that financially reckless. I I was, it was, and I
Speaker 1: did go to film school twice. It's not movie school,
Speaker 1: it's still I actually go a step further and I
Speaker 1: call it cinema school. I would like cinema. I go
Speaker 1: a step further. I just stayed in French. I went
Speaker 1: to an call the cinema. It's like and it sounds
Speaker 1: like there's less debt involved when you say it that way.
Speaker 1: Point of that being that everyone I knew at this
Speaker 1: time I saw this movie loved this movie, and I
Speaker 1: was like, I don't know. I was like kind of
Speaker 1: an edge lord about it. And I remember watching it
Speaker 1: and being like, it's dumb. She's dumb, Like I didn't,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I I didn't like it when I
Speaker 1: first saw it. I think because I had it in
Speaker 1: my head. I was like, oh, these are umblecore people.
Speaker 1: I don't like it very much. Um, even though I
Speaker 1: liked the squid in the whale, but whatever. But yeah,
Speaker 1: and I just didn't take it very seriously and I
Speaker 1: didn't under and I genuinely didn't understand most of the
Speaker 1: character's motivations. And then I rewatched it this week with
Speaker 1: a friend of the cast, Melissa Losatta Olivia, and we
Speaker 1: both we both hadn't seen it since college, were the
Speaker 1: same age, and this time we're pretty much the same
Speaker 1: age as the protagonist of the movie. And it made
Speaker 1: a lot more sense to me this time. The whole
Speaker 1: vibe of like, I feel insecure and like lesser than
Speaker 1: to my friends. I'm just gonna put a reckless vacation
Speaker 1: on credit card because I'm feeling uncomfortable with myself makes
Speaker 1: a lot more sense to me than it did when
Speaker 1: I was nine. Um, and I got more out of
Speaker 1: it this time. I thought, I, I I, you know, it
Speaker 1: has it has its things, and they are are like
Speaker 1: definitely cringing moments, but I feel like I get it now,
Speaker 1: all right. I saw it probably sometime around m I
Speaker 1: think I was in Boston still when I watched half
Speaker 1: of it. It popped up on that'slex at some point,
Speaker 1: and I think it's probably never left. It's been on
Speaker 1: Netflix for nine ers. Yeah, so it's a guy maybe
Speaker 1: saw it in like watched the first half of it.
Speaker 1: And it's not that I wasn't enjoying myself, but I
Speaker 1: wasn't like super fully engaged and then got sidetracked and
Speaker 1: then never felt compelled to finish it. So I had
Speaker 1: only seen half of this movie before prepping for the episode.
Speaker 1: And uh, yeah, I guess I wasn't very compelled by it.
Speaker 1: Because I've said it before, I'll say it again. I
Speaker 1: love a good romp. I would not call this movie.
Speaker 1: He's not quite a romp. It's not like a shaggy
Speaker 1: dog story, but just sort of like a shaggy teacup poodle. Also,
Speaker 1: I paid it's on Netflix because I paid to watch
Speaker 1: this on Amazon Prime. Christine, it's been on Netflix for
Speaker 1: six years. Do you guys have an expense account? Is there? Like?
Speaker 1: Um no, Actually that's unacceptable. I think that that people
Speaker 1: would be like, Wow, this is the first time anyone's
Speaker 1: rented this movie in five years. Can I just like
Speaker 1: kicked up some server in Iowa that like this hasn't
Speaker 1: made a move in years. Can I give you a
Speaker 1: tip and all of our listeners a tip. There is
Speaker 1: an app called just Watch. This is not an ad.
Speaker 1: By the way, this is not an ad. We're not
Speaker 1: sponsored by just Watch. But if you want to buy
Speaker 1: smart food popcorn, if you download this app called just
Speaker 1: Watch and type in the name of any movie or
Speaker 1: TV show or anything like that, it will tell you
Speaker 1: what platforms it is streaming for free on. It'll tell
Speaker 1: you where you can rent it, and it tells you
Speaker 1: where you can buy it. That's amazing. I feel like
Speaker 1: i'm dB should be doing that right. There's a few
Speaker 1: movies you can watch for free on IMDb. You can
Speaker 1: watch Paddington One on i amdb for free. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: think they're going to become the new Amazon. They're going
Speaker 1: to start something's I mean, capitalism is all around us
Speaker 1: and there. So if you can get anything for free,
Speaker 1: do it? Do Yeah? Touch, I d to install take
Speaker 1: my fingerprint, Lord Bezos. Yes, everyone pause and he yes,
Speaker 1: please take my identity and identify me, Lord Bezos. So yeah,
Speaker 1: should I just should we go into the recap? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Go from there, which is difficult because there's kind of
Speaker 1: no plot. I was trying to figure this out. You're
Speaker 1: not wrong. Also, the one thing I was surprised at
Speaker 1: that I totally forgot about from my first watch of
Speaker 1: this movie is Adam Driver Fedora. It is weird now
Speaker 1: to watch early Adam Driver knowing he is now an
Speaker 1: animatronic at Disney World and be like a mirror six
Speaker 1: or seven years ago he was Fedora guy in a
Speaker 1: Noah bomb Box movie, A man we were used to
Speaker 1: coming on. Lena Donham is now an animatronic. Truly a
Speaker 1: marvel you Also, did you notice that the other roommate
Speaker 1: is the husband, the crappy husb and from Marvelous Mrs
Speaker 1: Mazel No I have Yeah, okay, well I just added
Speaker 1: myself as a watcher of that show. Thank you, Lord Bezos.
Speaker 1: Christina is sponsored by Jeff Beezza. She's actually a mot
Speaker 1: that he made incredible. Alexa is actually based on Christina. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's just my brain. It's just there's a little
Speaker 1: Alexa in there. Talk about the Ultimate Mannic Pixy, dream Girl,
Speaker 1: Alexa girl. Yeah, there is a movie about Alexa. Validate
Speaker 1: me artistically. Yeah, what happens in the movie, because not
Speaker 1: really anything I'll do my best. So Francis is a
Speaker 1: young woman living in New York City ever heard of it,
Speaker 1: and her roommate and best friend is Sophie. Shout out
Speaker 1: to our super producer Sophie who shares the same name,
Speaker 1: who's played by Mickey Sumner, who was not familiar with,
Speaker 1: and Francis is of course Greta Gerwig Gerberg, who co
Speaker 1: wrote the movie. Francis's boyfriend Dan asks her to move
Speaker 1: in with him, but she would rather continue living with
Speaker 1: Sophie and just do everything with Sophie really, so this
Speaker 1: this causes her and Dan to break up in a
Speaker 1: very sne that I watched twice because I was like,
Speaker 1: are they really? Are they? Very where? He was such
Speaker 1: a He was just like, well, then maybe we shouldn't
Speaker 1: be together anymore. I was like, jeez. He's also talking
Speaker 1: about wanting to get cats, like two cats for the
Speaker 1: both of the expensive together, to be fair, But that's
Speaker 1: a very real point in a relationship that maybe, like
Speaker 1: as a young nineteen year old, you could not relate to,
Speaker 1: but like, you know, especially when you're you're late twenties.
Speaker 1: I think this character is twenty seven, which just maybe
Speaker 1: still too early for this talk. It's kind of like, yeah, well,
Speaker 1: if we're not going to move in together, then what's
Speaker 1: the point of keeping going? Yeah? Who splits custody with
Speaker 1: a dog? I've had that breakup, you know that, Like, well,
Speaker 1: we're not going to get married, so why are we here?
Speaker 1: Why are we How much longer will this happen? If
Speaker 1: we're not going to share cats together? Then what's the
Speaker 1: fucking point? Yeah? The cats are are a metaphor. Cats
Speaker 1: do have eight nipples. This is cat facts with Caitlin.
Speaker 1: She didn't seem too broken up about the breakup though, No,
Speaker 1: it seems like it was. That was like one of
Speaker 1: the interesting scenes that I that I enjoyed of Like
Speaker 1: it was like a weird like whose idea wasn't to
Speaker 1: break up? They sort of just mutually we're like, well,
Speaker 1: I like that. I like she's kind of like he
Speaker 1: says this isn't working, meaning the discussion of them talking
Speaker 1: about moving in together, and she interprets that is like
Speaker 1: our relationship isn't working. And then he's like, oh, okay,
Speaker 1: I guess we're going to break up then if that's
Speaker 1: how you feel about it, And then she thinks about
Speaker 1: it for a second she's like, yeah, that's fine, and
Speaker 1: then later Sophie is like, when you know, like Greta
Speaker 1: Growingg's character, Frances I'm gonna keep calling her Greta growing
Speaker 1: GRETI Growig is like, well, like I only broke up
Speaker 1: with Dan because I thought we were going to keep
Speaker 1: living together, and Sophie kind of immediately is like, that's
Speaker 1: not the only reason that Greta is like, no, I
Speaker 1: guess not right. So she wanted to bring out this
Speaker 1: the good. I want to get into this later, but
Speaker 1: Francis is codependent behaviors will just oh they are. And
Speaker 1: that's the first scene where we see her apologize a
Speaker 1: hundred times, which is a type of visibility. I feel
Speaker 1: like this is one of the good Like mumble Corey
Speaker 1: elements is she apologizes like seven times for no reason
Speaker 1: in that scene, But you don't get to see female
Speaker 1: characters do a lot even then. That's something that like
Speaker 1: we're hardware to do do Yeah for passing the Bechdel test.
Speaker 1: She does say I feel bad all the time in
Speaker 1: the movie, Yeah, yeah, which is like, I mean there's different,
Speaker 1: Like I feel like there's a big pressure on female
Speaker 1: characters to set an example and it's kind of like
Speaker 1: nice and refreshing to see a character who's just kind
Speaker 1: of reflecting a certain type of women at a moment
Speaker 1: in time. And I liked, I mean, the constant apologizing
Speaker 1: can relate. Yes, So she and Dan have broken up,
Speaker 1: and then one day Francis and Sophie are on the
Speaker 1: train together and Sophie is like, I want to move
Speaker 1: in with my friend Lisa and it's great apartment that
Speaker 1: we found in Tribeca. Hey, Francis, are you okay with that?
Speaker 1: And Francis is clearly not okay with that, but she's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm okay with that. And then so this is the
Speaker 1: beginning of their friendship crumbling. So now that for now.
Speaker 1: So now that Francis is single, she goes on a
Speaker 1: date with this guy Lev that's Adam Driver's character. This
Speaker 1: doesn't go anywhere romantically, but she does move in with
Speaker 1: him and his friend Benji, just like sleeping on their couch.
Speaker 1: Who is and Benji is Beni from Marvel's Missus Me.
Speaker 1: I'm sure a lot of our listeners will know. We
Speaker 1: just haven't seen it. Yeah, cute is a button? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I don't care. She's moved in with them.
Speaker 1: She has not seen that much of Sophie recently. And
Speaker 1: then Sophie finally does come over to Francis's new place,
Speaker 1: but she's like, all judge, she has stay very long.
Speaker 1: She's got this boyfriend Patch that she like hangs out
Speaker 1: with a lot now and Francis is having some money struggles.
Speaker 1: She's in this dance company because she does ballet or
Speaker 1: she's an understudy I guess in the dance company, and
Speaker 1: she's thinking that they'll be able to use her in
Speaker 1: this Christmas show and that will make her that will
Speaker 1: earn her more money. But they're not able to use
Speaker 1: her after all. So she's proud of herself for asking.
Speaker 1: So she doesn't have this money that she thought was
Speaker 1: coming in. And then she and Sophie getting this big
Speaker 1: fight and Sophie seems to be withdrawing from their friendship
Speaker 1: more and more. Meanwhile, the roommate Benji keeps calling Frances
Speaker 1: totally undateable, which is like one of the eye rolly
Speaker 1: elements of that yeah stuck out is like a little yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we can we can have that talk about that was
Speaker 1: like one of the funds like this didn't age well,
Speaker 1: this isn't as cute as I thought it was. And
Speaker 1: then Francis can't afford to stay with Levi and Benji anymore,
Speaker 1: so she goes to stay with her friend Rachel from
Speaker 1: the dance company, who clearly does not seem to really
Speaker 1: like is a Kazan Because sorry, I'm not, That's just
Speaker 1: what we're saying in the art work on Christina is
Speaker 1: our representative from the art work, and so if we
Speaker 1: if we're sucking it up, let us or just put
Speaker 1: the emphascists on a different syllable or pedestrian heathens. I'm
Speaker 1: sorry you meant to. So she is hanging out with
Speaker 1: Rachel and Rachel's friends and she finds out from these
Speaker 1: people that Sophie and her boyfriend Patch are moving to
Speaker 1: Japan in a few weeks, and Sophie hasn't told this
Speaker 1: directly to Francis, so she's like, oh, no, some of
Speaker 1: these problems are so bronn that you're just like, sure,
Speaker 1: my boyfriend and I moving to Japan in a few weeks.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Francis. They're just like sure. I do take
Speaker 1: this movie as like Brooklyn Gospel. Maybe that's totally misguided,
Speaker 1: but I'm like, oh, I feel like that happens all
Speaker 1: the time, that you would go on a date with someone.
Speaker 1: If it doesn't work out, you can just become roommates. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think so. So then Francis decides to spontaneously go
Speaker 1: to Paris, and it's basically a wasted trip because she
Speaker 1: like sleeps the whole time accidentally and doesn't do anything.
Speaker 1: That's the part Melissa and I started crying. This is
Speaker 1: actually we could go into there. I think this is
Speaker 1: the best part of the movie. This is when it's
Speaker 1: actually kind of subverting its own romanticism. Sure locked up
Speaker 1: this character is yeah, let's let's talk about that. Let's
Speaker 1: put a pin in that um And then so really quick,
Speaker 1: I meant rachel I confuse my Kazan's and my gummers.
Speaker 1: Grace Gummer plays rachel A k A. What is a
Speaker 1: gummer a Meryl Streep's daughter is what it is? Sorry,
Speaker 1: Meryl Streep or Maryle Meryll st welcome and take a
Speaker 1: left onto Meryl Street. Well, last season two might be
Speaker 1: over by the time streets. Okay, So she's in Paris,
Speaker 1: and then very French Sophie calls her to finally tell
Speaker 1: her that she's moving to Japan. Their conversation, it's very tense.
Speaker 1: And then she gets back to the US. She has
Speaker 1: a meeting with a dance company owner and she thinks
Speaker 1: she's going to be made a part of the touring company,
Speaker 1: but instead she has offered an office job, which she
Speaker 1: turns down immediately. Also a devastating I don't know. That
Speaker 1: seems also like devastating, but I also like that because
Speaker 1: she was like, no, I don't want that job. I
Speaker 1: know what I want, and I'm gonna immediately stand up.
Speaker 1: She turns it down. Yeah, but that was a tough
Speaker 1: scene to watch her process what was happening, because she
Speaker 1: she had already started telling people She's like, I'm going
Speaker 1: to be worring soon, and she's like, god, as someone
Speaker 1: who has jumped the gun before. And then it was
Speaker 1: even sadder because her saying touring company was playing down
Speaker 1: her own expectations, like, oh, I'm definitely going to join
Speaker 1: the company, but probably just a touring right, And then
Speaker 1: she doesn't even get that. Yeah. I think gret Growing
Speaker 1: is really good in this movie the way she's like yeah.
Speaker 1: So then we cut to Frances having moved to Poughkeepsie
Speaker 1: to be an r A at the college where she
Speaker 1: went to school. Um, and she worked. I think, is it?
Speaker 1: That's what I saw and that's what the Wikipedia said.
Speaker 1: All colleges east of the Mississippi kind of blend together
Speaker 1: for me. Yeah, it's very it's it's very like Neil
Speaker 1: the Family. You're like, oh, this is a female friendly space.
Speaker 1: It's she it's she returns to vassor her Almo my tear?
Speaker 1: Is that how you say it? Mam? Well we have fun. Um.
Speaker 1: So she's at this school in Pokeepsie a k mass her.
Speaker 1: She is working various events around campus to make money,
Speaker 1: and at one of them, Sophie and Patch are in attendance,
Speaker 1: and like Francis is lurking around until she overhears Sophie
Speaker 1: say that she and Patch are engaged, and she's like, what,
Speaker 1: you're gay, right, because she's she's a She's lurking around
Speaker 1: because she's a caterer and she doesn't want to be
Speaker 1: exposed as working as a caterer. But then like record scratch, Yeah,
Speaker 1: well well what what that really is? How them find out?
Speaker 1: She actually does a triple take with Neon sunglasses and
Speaker 1: just the sunglasses are in color. Yeah, it's kind of
Speaker 1: it's kind of like she loves listening. That way go on,
Speaker 1: So she and Sophie get to talking. At this event,
Speaker 1: Sophie is drunk. She and Patch are not getting along.
Speaker 1: And then later that night, Sophie shows up to Francis's
Speaker 1: dorm room and they kind of rekindle their friendship a
Speaker 1: little bit. And then Sophie said, is that she wants
Speaker 1: to leave Tokyo. She wants to leave Patch. She wants
Speaker 1: to move back to New York. Yes, I think I'm
Speaker 1: going to leave you are New York. I think I'm
Speaker 1: going to leave Patch because I just figured out New
Speaker 1: York is a character in the movie, and I want
Speaker 1: to leave Patch, but I don't want to leave my
Speaker 1: friend character New York. I couldn't help, but wonder was
Speaker 1: New York my boyfriend? It sounds like a Carrie Bradshaw
Speaker 1: us over. That's exactly what I was trying to um.
Speaker 1: And then sometime later, Frances has moved back to New
Speaker 1: York City. She is choreographing dances she puts on a show.
Speaker 1: All of her friends are there, including Sophie and Patched,
Speaker 1: who have gotten married. Her old roommates Leve and Benji
Speaker 1: are there. Her the dance company instructor owner person is there,
Speaker 1: and then that's when I stopped writing down my version
Speaker 1: of the recap. And then I don't know if anything
Speaker 1: happens after that, so if there's any blanks to fill
Speaker 1: in it, the only thing that I alsought that was
Speaker 1: a little I thought it was a really lovely ending
Speaker 1: in terms of, you know, it was because it's a
Speaker 1: movie about like an artist finding themselves but also within
Speaker 1: the limits of her own artistic capacity, which is like
Speaker 1: her coming to grips with that she's not she's not
Speaker 1: going to be the great dancer that she wants to be,
Speaker 1: but she's actually has a voice as a choreographer, and
Speaker 1: it's this adjacent thing which feels like a compromise. That
Speaker 1: is why she resists it. But then you know there's
Speaker 1: something in the end is the only time you actually see,
Speaker 1: you know, a piece of her work, so it kind
Speaker 1: of celebrates that, and I think that and then the
Speaker 1: I guess where she the storyline about her and her
Speaker 1: friendship with Sophie ends is that they like I think
Speaker 1: they're on the subway again and they're talking about like,
Speaker 1: oh what if we got apartments like really close to
Speaker 1: each other, but they live alone yeah, it seems like
Speaker 1: I thought the ending was lovely. Yeah, there is what
Speaker 1: I remember. There's a little bit of a shoehorning of
Speaker 1: a romantic element, and that her and Benji connect again
Speaker 1: and he's like, I'm saying all and she's like, ah,
Speaker 1: me too, and I guess we're on your ball. And
Speaker 1: then it's implied that they're going to get together. But
Speaker 1: the ending ending is a moment that Francis refers to
Speaker 1: during the dinner party, you know, half an hour earlier,
Speaker 1: about you know, what she wants out of a relationship,
Speaker 1: and she's like talks about this was a little cringe
Speaker 1: e and hard to watch, but it's true, and it
Speaker 1: made me very uncomfortable to watch it. She's like, you know,
Speaker 1: talking about like, you know, when that feeling like when
Speaker 1: you're at a party and like you and your person
Speaker 1: are both being charming and amazing and then you just
Speaker 1: catch each other's eye, you share a moment and it's
Speaker 1: just you and your person having your own little world
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. Yeah, and it's cute callback because she
Speaker 1: has that moment with Sophie and that's the end of
Speaker 1: the movie. Okay, got it? Yeah, it's yeah, I liked.
Speaker 1: I mean in like, I feel like this movie, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I'm like, even seven years later, I wonder
Speaker 1: if like the Benji of it all would have gotten
Speaker 1: the attention that it does at the end. But it's
Speaker 1: it stays pretty well within the bounds of like the
Speaker 1: friendship is where the emphasis is, which feels like it belongs.
Speaker 1: And we can talk more about that right after this
Speaker 1: break break. Okay, so a few things right at the jump.
Speaker 1: I mean, this also takes place in an all white
Speaker 1: New York City. Like many movies like New York is
Speaker 1: it is not the true reflection of he was like
Speaker 1: hold on a second um, which is I think like
Speaker 1: one of them more glaring like things about it this movie,
Speaker 1: Like there are class elements addressed in it that I
Speaker 1: thought were kind of cool and where it's I feel
Speaker 1: like this movie brings up something that not a lot
Speaker 1: of movies or really people do, which is like kind
Speaker 1: of like what the difference between being broke and being
Speaker 1: poor is? And this movie calls that out pretty directly,
Speaker 1: where like Francis ha is broke but not poor per se,
Speaker 1: where like she's a struggling artist, but we see, you know,
Speaker 1: in Sacramento ak gretitor Wig cannon Um. She has a
Speaker 1: loving family who it we think that you know and
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, we're sorry, we can't help you out more.
Speaker 1: But like, worst case she's got a support system. Worst
Speaker 1: case she can move home. And I think that that's
Speaker 1: like a cool thing to see reflected also the fact
Speaker 1: that she's she's the most broke of her friend group,
Speaker 1: but the fact that I mean it even speaks to her.
Speaker 1: I guess like talent or drives and like, wait a minute,
Speaker 1: you're a full time dancer, you know, with no day
Speaker 1: job in New York City and you have a roof
Speaker 1: over your head's a miracle. And Benji has maybe only
Speaker 1: his true function is to call her out on that.
Speaker 1: She talks about being poor and he's like, you are
Speaker 1: not poor. He's like, there are four people in New
Speaker 1: York and you are not one of them. Exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And like that scene of it was like kind of
Speaker 1: a relief to see that addressed, because it's like, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I've been the brokest of But there's there's
Speaker 1: a difference. There's definitely a difference of having no alternative.
Speaker 1: Like what we're seeing in her with her is like
Speaker 1: she's definitely struggling, but it's more of an X like
Speaker 1: it's worst case she could pony up and take the
Speaker 1: office job, you know, like exactly. I also see, yeah,
Speaker 1: the I'm ambivalent about the people who sort of refuse
Speaker 1: to get day jobs because like I'm an artist and
Speaker 1: this is I mean, there's something that I want to
Speaker 1: say is admirable about that, But it's also a privilege.
Speaker 1: Just so, yeah, you can only do you simply can't
Speaker 1: do anything else. It's people who and we know plenty
Speaker 1: of them here in you know, l A. But I
Speaker 1: mean the people who are able to do that come
Speaker 1: from a place of privilege, and people who have ane
Speaker 1: where can actually deal with a lot more scarcity day
Speaker 1: to day just knowing that it's there. It's a psychological thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like having having the option of I mean, like I've
Speaker 1: always been kind of scanted, but like worst case, i
Speaker 1: could go back to Brockton, Massachusetts and live in my
Speaker 1: Pappy's house. You know, Like that sort of thing, which
Speaker 1: is like a sort of privilege that is not checked
Speaker 1: in movies very often. Definitely Pappy's shack and literally in
Speaker 1: Pappy's crumbling home. It's a Peppy s anyone who's ever
Speaker 1: been to my Pappy's crumbling home. Pappy shatew Jamie's safe
Speaker 1: space every time I called my father gently takes out
Speaker 1: of his teeth and says, it's always an option, um,
Speaker 1: to remove your to have no teeth, you know, to
Speaker 1: move back into his crumbling check all that to say,
Speaker 1: it is an option, and I am fortunate to have it, certainly,
Speaker 1: And it is kind of like I felt checked in
Speaker 1: that way too, and I was like, yes, like that
Speaker 1: is not something that's called out very often. Good. This
Speaker 1: is I think pretty standard for this genre. But so
Speaker 1: many movies that you know, take place in New York
Speaker 1: and or are about artists or otherwise future people who
Speaker 1: appear to be so abundantly wealthy that you're just confused
Speaker 1: about how how do you afford this apartment? And so Yeah,
Speaker 1: the fact that it's even her you know, struggling financial
Speaker 1: situation is called attention to in the through line of
Speaker 1: the plot is just yeah, her her real estate struggles,
Speaker 1: because I think the plot is separated by the different
Speaker 1: locations that she has to live. Yeah, it's address next
Speaker 1: act right there. The money aspects of this movie that
Speaker 1: were like more realistic than most things you would see
Speaker 1: because that one of the scenes that like hit for me,
Speaker 1: I think when I first saw it, even more so
Speaker 1: than now, was her having to remind her wealthier roommates
Speaker 1: like yeah, that she's paying less and that they agree
Speaker 1: read to that, because I think that was maybe the
Speaker 1: only thing I related with this movie the first time around,
Speaker 1: was like she it's implied that Adam Driver and the
Speaker 1: guy from Marvelous Mrs Maizel are like to kind of
Speaker 1: trust fund babies who don't have much to worry about,
Speaker 1: and they're artists too, so their peers, but they're not
Speaker 1: really class wise because she's from kind of like a
Speaker 1: middle class family who support her but can't support her,
Speaker 1: and so she has to remind them from the couch
Speaker 1: that she's only paying nine fifty and that they said
Speaker 1: that that was okay, right, And then it's like this
Speaker 1: awkward interact like I was like, oh, yeah, I forgot okay.
Speaker 1: So I'm like, wow, who has like an extra three months, right,
Speaker 1: which I mean Adam Driver. I like him. I like him.
Speaker 1: Are you trying to convince yourself still? No? I don't
Speaker 1: want to like him. I want to because his career
Speaker 1: trajectory is fucking baffling. He was in the army. He
Speaker 1: puts on operas for the army tremor so like, I'm like,
Speaker 1: is he like a testament to male mediocrity? And if so,
Speaker 1: why do I like it? Like he it's just weird,
Speaker 1: but whatever, I like it, And I think he's a
Speaker 1: good He does a good job in this movie. I
Speaker 1: think he might. I think he's on track to be
Speaker 1: our our nation's next Kanu. Interesting. Yeah, we're like, well,
Speaker 1: I think he's like Kanu in that, And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if he's good, but I never hate
Speaker 1: to see him. Yeah, there's he's so compelling and for
Speaker 1: being sort of a big star, there's actually something still
Speaker 1: kind of enigmatic. He's about Oscar nominated as like that.
Speaker 1: I'm just like, we've gone too far. Maybe he shouldn't
Speaker 1: have been nominated for an Oscar. What was he nominated?
Speaker 1: Nominated for Black Klansmen. I didn't know Adam Driver. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't even know he was in Black Klansmen. You
Speaker 1: hate to see it, but he is. There's a moment.
Speaker 1: I think it's at the end of the day, the
Speaker 1: one day that of Adam Driver's character and Francisco on.
Speaker 1: He basically tries to give her not a surprise kiss,
Speaker 1: but it's like a surprise touch on her shoulder and
Speaker 1: she just goes and then like tightens up, and which
Speaker 1: is like one of the many moments in this movie
Speaker 1: where we're like, that was a little too man like
Speaker 1: Pixie Dreamgirl on the execution, but I appreciate what you
Speaker 1: were doing. He was exaggerated, but I have, you know,
Speaker 1: pulled that move. Sure, I'm not trying to say that,
Speaker 1: like the aartriistic merit of this movie is completely predicated
Speaker 1: on me relating to it, but I have listen, Okay,
Speaker 1: like I'm a cancer survivor, but like nothing really prepares
Speaker 1: you for being diagnosed as quirky. And I think that's
Speaker 1: something that every woman in this room has struggled with. Yes,
Speaker 1: you know, we're all recovering, we're all recovering adorables all,
Speaker 1: we're all recovering, not like the other girls. It's funny
Speaker 1: because I felt like that was a good It was
Speaker 1: maybe exaggerated, but I thought that was a really real
Speaker 1: moment in that I feel like most encounters, if they're
Speaker 1: not if they are consensual, but you're not on the
Speaker 1: same page, they're not very articulate, where it's like may
Speaker 1: I touch you here? And then it's like yes. It's
Speaker 1: usually someone having the sense through body language that this
Speaker 1: is not okay, and sometimes that can like erupt in
Speaker 1: awkward ways. Well, what we always see. I don't even
Speaker 1: mind her reaction, um, and I would like to get
Speaker 1: into the kind of like you know, Manning Pixie discussion
Speaker 1: of this. But what I enjoy is that we see
Speaker 1: so much in movies a you know, surprise kiss or
Speaker 1: surprise touch, which is framed as being this like wonderfully
Speaker 1: romantic moment that happens even though only one party is
Speaker 1: privy to what's about to happen and no one has
Speaker 1: given consent. But it's like to look like a gesture
Speaker 1: and not a yet right, not a like you know,
Speaker 1: borderline sexual assault kind of thing. Yeah, So I like
Speaker 1: that she gives like a reaction because you know, she
Speaker 1: didn't consent and and she reacts appropriate. I think that
Speaker 1: whole scene with their date, though, I enjoyed in general
Speaker 1: because I like he is a master at being at
Speaker 1: as acting like a Brooklyn douchebag and is playing in
Speaker 1: that part masterfully and in this scene and like made
Speaker 1: me laugh at a lot of different points because he's
Speaker 1: playing this douchebag that she's like kind of visibly not
Speaker 1: impressed by. Where there's that whole thing where he you know,
Speaker 1: he's showing herself on his phone. It's so cringe e.
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, this meal into a basketball game once.
Speaker 1: You like basketball, right, And she's like, oh, I went
Speaker 1: to a game once, and he's like yeah, anyways, motorcycle. Yeah,
Speaker 1: anyways is me and jay Leno keeps and then she
Speaker 1: goes back to his apartment. I love the way the
Speaker 1: way the male characters kind of flattened, but they're like kids,
Speaker 1: like showing her their toys, Like when they go back
Speaker 1: to the apartment, Benji's always showing her like, look at
Speaker 1: these things. I go, look at my old camera. It's
Speaker 1: so it's showing like traditional flirting tactics that I think
Speaker 1: in a different movie would be made out to seem
Speaker 1: like really cute or cool, and it like makes them
Speaker 1: look kind of pathetic in this context. And it's kind
Speaker 1: of nice to see like a Brooklyn trust fund boy
Speaker 1: look pathetic because they very often are. Or like when
Speaker 1: she she insists on paying for dinner for their date,
Speaker 1: and it is very funny because it's like that's another
Speaker 1: way that her brokenness comes into play because her card
Speaker 1: gets rejected, she has to like go pay a three
Speaker 1: dollar fee at an a t M, which is a
Speaker 1: triggering experience we've all had. But then he like is
Speaker 1: also a dick about that in a way where he's like,
Speaker 1: you know, a sleepie right, and she's like what and
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, I'm just pretending to be a liberated woman,
Speaker 1: and and then and she's like and she's like ha
Speaker 1: ha okay, Like I don't know. The way that date
Speaker 1: scene played out, I thought was like at least, I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess that's kind of the point of movies like this.
Speaker 1: Like in a movie where the female character is there
Speaker 1: to set an example for other women, she would be like,
Speaker 1: you're full of shit. But in a movie that I
Speaker 1: think that it's reflecting an awkward situation that has happened
Speaker 1: to lot of people. She's kind of just like whatever,
Speaker 1: like and trying to get through it, which is cool
Speaker 1: to see. Two in terms of I mean movies, I
Speaker 1: mean even not having a style as a style, so
Speaker 1: it's like you have to like pick and shoes when
Speaker 1: your character is going to have the like the articulate breakthrough,
Speaker 1: and that's like, that wasn't the moment for it, because
Speaker 1: it's not about her relationship with minutes about her relationship
Speaker 1: with her friends. So that's why her big articulate moment
Speaker 1: is that this dinner party talking about a hypothetical relationship
Speaker 1: and it turns out it's with her. Yeah, can we
Speaker 1: talk more about that. Let's talk about it in conclusion.
Speaker 1: Adam Driver is Milady. The character Mr Good good job
Speaker 1: my man anyway has a motorcycle. I think, yeah, they
Speaker 1: have kind of a weird I just wrote down. Francis
Speaker 1: is codependent behavior. It is definitely contrasted, obviously in the
Speaker 1: first two scenes where she's like, I can't move in
Speaker 1: with you because I have to stay with my friend,
Speaker 1: and the whole just just just the apologizing and the
Speaker 1: I feel bad, I feel bad, I feel guilty. It's
Speaker 1: so but her friend, and I know she's sort of
Speaker 1: maybe the Sophie character. I feel like it's flattened to
Speaker 1: be a little more like, not as artsy or weird,
Speaker 1: but she's definitely more self possessed in that, you know,
Speaker 1: she has her own thing that she wants to do,
Speaker 1: and it's like checking in with Francis, but it is
Speaker 1: like I'm going to do this. I want to move
Speaker 1: out because I've o my dream of living in this neighborhood,
Speaker 1: which is maybe longer than I've known you, is like important,
Speaker 1: So I'm checking in, but I'm telling you this is
Speaker 1: what I want. And that's something that I didn't understand
Speaker 1: about the movie when I first thought that I understand
Speaker 1: now of just like I guess, just like this friendship
Speaker 1: as adorable as it is in the opening, but it's
Speaker 1: like they're twenty seven years old. They need boundaries, and
Speaker 1: that's something that I think that Sophie recognizes first. And
Speaker 1: so it's weird because I think when I first watched
Speaker 1: this movie, you sort of view her as like, oh,
Speaker 1: why is she hurting francis Is feelings the sex? But
Speaker 1: then it's just like no, she just like it's not
Speaker 1: that she's breaking off the friendship. She just needs to
Speaker 1: change the boundaries of it. And that makes sense for
Speaker 1: what we see in the opening sequence. Yeah, the first
Speaker 1: you just her she's the unsympathetic, non artsy character and
Speaker 1: there's a really low moment I thought it was actually
Speaker 1: kind of mean where frances Is like, oh, Sophie's not smart.
Speaker 1: She doesn't even read, and I was like, so mean
Speaker 1: she does at work. A big thing is like because
Speaker 1: the character like Patch, like Sophie's kind of crappy boyfriend.
Speaker 1: That's sort of in the background, the fact that Sophie's
Speaker 1: character just continues to stay with him, and it's not
Speaker 1: so flattened that it's like he's horrible. It's just that
Speaker 1: Frances doesn't like him, and it's probably implied he doesn't
Speaker 1: like him just because she takes up right, which I
Speaker 1: also didn't recognize on first watch. The whole just that
Speaker 1: she recognizes what Frances doesn't like about her boyfriend, and
Speaker 1: it's just like okay, noted, like I'm staying with this person.
Speaker 1: And there's a cute moment kind of where she's just
Speaker 1: finally like I do like you, like I like you too,
Speaker 1: And it's like that complicated, Like Frances, she is not
Speaker 1: totally wrong about Patch, but she's saying it for the
Speaker 1: wrong reasons. She's expressing it for the wrong reasons, and
Speaker 1: that does play out where like Sophie and Patch don't
Speaker 1: end up together, so Ifie ends up like a lot
Speaker 1: of like everyone's had a friend's significant other that you're
Speaker 1: not crazy about, don't Sophie and Patch they do end
Speaker 1: up together. Didn't they get married? Oh wait, she says
Speaker 1: she's going to leave. Then she doesn't, but then we
Speaker 1: cut till later and they're like, yeah, we got married,
Speaker 1: Which is funny because it makes me feel like that
Speaker 1: sort of behavior something maybe like that comes up with
Speaker 1: Sophie just when they're together. They like to have this.
Speaker 1: They do their like little New York fantasy thing when
Speaker 1: they're together, and then when they were apart, she's like, well,
Speaker 1: maybe I should just like be with this dude. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was like super cool to see not like a
Speaker 1: merry Sue female friendship where like and again it's it's
Speaker 1: just like the kind of movie this is where some
Speaker 1: movies you want to see a perfectly functioning female friendship,
Speaker 1: like in Captain Marvel, that's what you want to see
Speaker 1: because it is a setting example of movie. This is
Speaker 1: more of like a Marble Corey realist thing, and it's
Speaker 1: nice to see a friendship between women that is like complicated.
Speaker 1: There are different points in their hand and in their life,
Speaker 1: and it's just like more of a reflection of and
Speaker 1: as much as like there are some of the very
Speaker 1: Sioux friendships that I really enjoy. But in a way,
Speaker 1: I feel like it's a little bit limiting in that
Speaker 1: it just leads to the idea that all female friendships
Speaker 1: have to be perfect, which of course they're not. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's the testament that even like, even if your feelings
Speaker 1: change about the movie, like we all, I think we
Speaker 1: all feel a little bit differently from the first time
Speaker 1: we saw it years ago too, now that it's uh,
Speaker 1: it's more nuance. It's not like the real the friendship
Speaker 1: is horrible or toxic either. It's just it's freaking there.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're they're growing as people at different rates.
Speaker 1: Like you said, there's like Sophie realizes that maybe they're
Speaker 1: too codependent for she's the first one to realize this,
Speaker 1: or that she like they've just sort of entwined each
Speaker 1: other in their lives a bit too too much all
Speaker 1: that stuff. They've been character development wise developed enough that
Speaker 1: you know, they've been given these nuances that we don't see.
Speaker 1: It's it's cool, I mean, and just like in general
Speaker 1: of any gender seeing a friendship that is like, yeah,
Speaker 1: like not completely black and white toxic, but just like
Speaker 1: these characters are growing apart a little bit is something
Speaker 1: that happens to people all the time that I feel
Speaker 1: like it's really hard to communicate on screen, Like it's
Speaker 1: hard to dramatize like the natural you know, widening of
Speaker 1: friendship or someone who's like feeling a little bit left behind,
Speaker 1: or the other person who's feeling a little frustrated and
Speaker 1: being like, why don't you get it? Like I mean,
Speaker 1: I just still happened to me sometimes just in my
Speaker 1: personal life, where I have a friend that I just
Speaker 1: kind of don't want to be friends with anymore, and
Speaker 1: there's no it's sorry, Jamie, I started telling you that
Speaker 1: I don't want to be your friend. Anywhere she told me,
Speaker 1: people grow apart or there maybe their interests were never
Speaker 1: that similar to begin with, but you end up in
Speaker 1: a friendship with someone. But there's no etiquette for like
Speaker 1: breaking up with a friend that hasn't been established in
Speaker 1: in the world, or even like renegotiating the boundaries of
Speaker 1: a friendship. Right it only takes one person to do
Speaker 1: that though. I mean, however the other person reacts, is
Speaker 1: that's true? Sure? Have you ever had to do something
Speaker 1: like that? I'm really I'm doing it with like five
Speaker 1: different people right now, Well, what I end up doing
Speaker 1: is just basically what Sophie does is just to kind
Speaker 1: of withdraw and like avoid the person and like just
Speaker 1: not share as much with them. And then so I
Speaker 1: really feel bad for the people who are on the
Speaker 1: receiving end of this, which in this movie Francis is,
Speaker 1: which is like and that's a sign, but that's a
Speaker 1: sign of codependence as well. Is that when someone else,
Speaker 1: not even saying that the Sophie after was doing it
Speaker 1: in exactly the perfect or sensitive way that codependent people
Speaker 1: will react to other people's boundaries with offense and you know,
Speaker 1: we'll be just reactionary and take everything personally right, and
Speaker 1: it's like and it is it was a little like
Speaker 1: I've only successfully done those ones or twice, but like
Speaker 1: when you do sort of like say like this is
Speaker 1: my new boundary, like whatever, and then seeing like you're like,
Speaker 1: I know I'm hurting this other person but you never
Speaker 1: see it. But in France of how you see it
Speaker 1: and you see her going the sad vacation and you
Speaker 1: see her be like like it's just a lot of
Speaker 1: this movie truly, Like watching it with my friend, it
Speaker 1: was like tough to watch, but then after we stopped
Speaker 1: watching it and it was over, like we were talking
Speaker 1: about it for a full hour, and I was just like,
Speaker 1: I feel so I feel bad after watching that. She's like,
Speaker 1: I think it's because we understand it's hard to make
Speaker 1: the Sophie character sympathetic when it's like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe she's the healthy one. I mean obviously not. No
Speaker 1: one's perfect. Quick shout out to Mickey Sumner. I don't
Speaker 1: know what she did after this movie. Just the actress
Speaker 1: who played Sophie. She was so good. She's really really good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I I let me see it. I don't know what
Speaker 1: she's done since, but I mean I saw She's Nandy Gales.
Speaker 1: It was even weirder. I watched it with my boyfriend,
Speaker 1: like in bed, and I don't know why that was.
Speaker 1: And especially there's a part where she's she does her
Speaker 1: big thing about like, you know, finding your person, which
Speaker 1: is weird because it's very Gray's anatomy. Isn't that to
Speaker 1: like dogs, Like you know, when I talk about like
Speaker 1: my dog being too anxious or attached. He's like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you're just her person, And I'm like, yeah, that's a
Speaker 1: thing for dogs, no for people. It's tight. Yeah, like
Speaker 1: this is I don't know. This was like a way
Speaker 1: more effective coming of age story than I remembered it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and especially because it's it's for the second coming of
Speaker 1: age that people do, because most coming of age stories
Speaker 1: are around like Tea means like oh I'm the high Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then interesting, which she did later with like Ladybird.
Speaker 1: I think Melissa said up and where she was like,
Speaker 1: oh so like lady Bird is like the prequel to
Speaker 1: Frances Ha and Lady Bird eventually becomes Francis Hall because
Speaker 1: we've already seen her family in Sacramento and she like
Speaker 1: started to galaxy headcanon right there. We got to take
Speaker 1: another quick break, but then hey, guess what, We'll come
Speaker 1: right back. Can we talk Frances undateable really quick? Because
Speaker 1: that was like the one part of this movie other
Speaker 1: than like the I mean it was the fly in
Speaker 1: my soup of the cinematic experience. Yes, like it was.
Speaker 1: I didn't like the implied potential romance with what's his
Speaker 1: name Benji. I didn't like that, but it remained in
Speaker 1: the background enough of the movie that it wasn't like distracting.
Speaker 1: It certainly didn't ruin it for me. But the whole
Speaker 1: like them trying to catch fright, Like, haven't she said
Speaker 1: this before that like a character as like a living
Speaker 1: studio note. It feels like maybe that's like, you know,
Speaker 1: someone at Prison Pictures was like, well, there has to
Speaker 1: be some kind of you know, he love story in there.
Speaker 1: I want to give Greta Gerwig the credit and say
Speaker 1: that I don't think that this was her idea, like,
Speaker 1: because the focus of the movie from the most part
Speaker 1: remains on Francis and Francis and Sophie's friendship and like
Speaker 1: Francis sort of having to accept that compromises a part
Speaker 1: of life. But with the Benji stuff, yeah, like it
Speaker 1: does sort of he serves. The best part of him
Speaker 1: I thought was him pointing out that she's not as
Speaker 1: like extremely poor she makes herself out to be. That
Speaker 1: was like a cool, valid use of him. But then
Speaker 1: like I didn't like the scenes where they're supposed to
Speaker 1: be flirting there because he's into each other and they're
Speaker 1: making it seem like whoa may be. But at the
Speaker 1: time we at the time we see them together here
Speaker 1: he's totally nugging her. And then there's that weird scene
Speaker 1: where they're talking and he's in there, oh God, and
Speaker 1: it's like I've I mean, I feel like a lot
Speaker 1: of people have had an experience like this that is
Speaker 1: just very uncomfortable, where the guys, like, you know, everyone
Speaker 1: says we should date and then you're like, oh really
Speaker 1: he's like yeah, but I was like no, she's just cool.
Speaker 1: And like that whole scene, I mean, maybe bros Right,
Speaker 1: maybe cringe because it's like, you know, I've had that experience.
Speaker 1: But then but then the fact that they still kind
Speaker 1: of present him is romantically viable after you find out
Speaker 1: he's that kind of like weird guy just didn't feel great.
Speaker 1: And the fact that he's constantly nugging her as what
Speaker 1: I think the movie frames as a flirtation technique for him,
Speaker 1: he's like, oh yeah, just by implying that he's still
Speaker 1: on the table. I feel like that it's funny, like, OK,
Speaker 1: let's try to reframe this as artistic merits. So what
Speaker 1: isn't isn't it? So like true to life though that, like,
Speaker 1: you know, even though she finds her voice artistically, which
Speaker 1: in and of itself is a compromise of what she
Speaker 1: saw as her artistic she still end up she still
Speaker 1: might end up with like just some guy some like naggy,
Speaker 1: tiny little man like kind of you know, teases her,
Speaker 1: and probably the more successful as she gets as a choreographer,
Speaker 1: he's gonna like it's gonna be a little weirder and
Speaker 1: more resentful. Where I decided I was done with that character. Officially,
Speaker 1: it was when he was like, you should leave your
Speaker 1: door open, like with that part when he at the
Speaker 1: end of the scene where he's been nagging her the
Speaker 1: whole time, he's like, we should date, but no, we
Speaker 1: shouldn't like that whole fucking I mean truly coming from
Speaker 1: I I have here's my deep shame. I have dated
Speaker 1: a Brooklyn trust fund boy. His father used to be
Speaker 1: the president of something called um and Ron. No, it
Speaker 1: was like called the Patriotic Millionaires. It was really bad,
Speaker 1: it was some of it was a very troubling seven
Speaker 1: weeks of my life. Anyways, like most trust fund boys
Speaker 1: in Brooklyn, he very abruptly married a graphic designer. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: you just you go to the you go to the wing.
Speaker 1: They put him all in the window. You go to
Speaker 1: the wing. All the graphic designers are just kind of
Speaker 1: lined up in the window like puppies. They have a
Speaker 1: little cut up newspaper from the play around her and
Speaker 1: he's past and you're like that one eat, yeah there
Speaker 1: she is. So anyways, wish him the best whatever, But
Speaker 1: like that that like a whole that whole vibe being
Speaker 1: presented as like maybe this will work out. I'm just like, no,
Speaker 1: this shouldn't even for like a realist movie. Please, let's
Speaker 1: just like let's let's spare Francis has the potential funny.
Speaker 1: I felt a little bit the opposite in that moment
Speaker 1: that after he was a dick, the one even though
Speaker 1: it was didn't come off right. The one nice thing
Speaker 1: he said was like, I'll leave it open in case
Speaker 1: you need anything, And I was like, okay, see I
Speaker 1: hated that she's she said closed, and then he convinced
Speaker 1: her to leave it open like he was she because
Speaker 1: he was like open her, open her clothes and she's
Speaker 1: like probably close and he's like, well but what if
Speaker 1: you need me? Right? And then she and then she's
Speaker 1: like okay open like that, I was just like, oh,
Speaker 1: you tried a newspaper to play around. And I was
Speaker 1: done with him as soon as he said, yeah, my
Speaker 1: buddy at SNL is going to get me a job.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's so upset. We all have a
Speaker 1: buddy at SNL. Literally everyone in this room has a
Speaker 1: buddy at SNL and we're not to Yeah, and like,
Speaker 1: guess what, they're not getting you a job. I mean
Speaker 1: that at least that was Yeah, that sort of posturing.
Speaker 1: You're just like, yep, that man exists. It was such
Speaker 1: a good character portrait though, we're just like, here's me
Speaker 1: floating through life. Yeah, it's going to happen. That doesn't happen.
Speaker 1: Then you know this other thing that I'm doing, different
Speaker 1: takes on. Then that's the thing. This movie does a
Speaker 1: really good job at showcasing mostly unlikable people because well,
Speaker 1: maybe this is the time to get into like Francis
Speaker 1: as a Manning pixie dreamgirl type, but she because she
Speaker 1: is a more realistic, less exaggerated version of this trouble
Speaker 1: because I actually, I mean, she has those tendencies, but
Speaker 1: I feel like I know people basically just like her,
Speaker 1: So it didn't feel like she was like this caricature. Yeah.
Speaker 1: What sucks is it suffers because I think it did
Speaker 1: a pretty good job of just creating a sort of
Speaker 1: slightly eccentric character. But that is living under this looming
Speaker 1: shadow of this broad, shitty archetype that we've lived with
Speaker 1: for so long. I did. I did do a bit
Speaker 1: of homework. I wrote something now, please Please, which I
Speaker 1: think this is like some weird noah bum back. I
Speaker 1: don't know whose idea. It is, like sort of easter
Speaker 1: egg as to like, this is this is the key
Speaker 1: to the movie, sort of please Okay. The opening montage
Speaker 1: where it's sort of like the Friendship montage. They're kind of,
Speaker 1: you know, hanging out, they're playing in the park, they're talking,
Speaker 1: and I think this is on purpose. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of moments where it just shows them talking, but the
Speaker 1: dialogue is unintelligible. And then there's one moment where they're
Speaker 1: sitting on the couch and Frances like looks at from
Speaker 1: a book. She goes, oh, this is interesting. Listen to this,
Speaker 1: and this is the quote she reads from the book
Speaker 1: that she's reading, which I don't know if it was
Speaker 1: made up for the movie or it's actually from something,
Speaker 1: but she says, to praise a work of literature by
Speaker 1: calling it sincere is now at best a way of
Speaker 1: saying that although it may be given no esthetic or
Speaker 1: intellectual admiration, and then it cuts off into the next shot.
Speaker 1: So I'm kind of like it's a weird thing to
Speaker 1: bring up with a lot of qualifiers about like although
Speaker 1: or that sincerity is now an excuse for basically I
Speaker 1: think it's saying that, like to say that sincerity is
Speaker 1: a compliment is to just sort of um, you know,
Speaker 1: avoid the question of like intellectual or aesthetic merit. So
Speaker 1: to say something says something has artistic merit by dint
Speaker 1: of just being sincere is basically just say it's not
Speaker 1: good any other way. It's like if you're describing person
Speaker 1: who is like very boring, you say, oh, but they're
Speaker 1: really nice, they're really down to earth. But she also,
Speaker 1: like it also cuts off the quote. It's implied that
Speaker 1: there's a whole other clouds of that sentence for this author,
Speaker 1: who may or be real or someone they invented for
Speaker 1: the shot, is going to explain or finish that thought,
Speaker 1: or just like these guys that they're tricky. I mean,
Speaker 1: I wonder if that's in response to like maybe one
Speaker 1: of Noah bombox previous movies having been called sincere, and
Speaker 1: he's like, well, here's what I think about I'm gonna
Speaker 1: I'm going to rewatch Squid in the Whale I hated
Speaker 1: I saw when I was like fifteen. I feel like
Speaker 1: that might be why I liked it. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I remember that someone masturbates in a library in that movie,
Speaker 1: and that's legitimately all I remembers. The coolest thing. I'm like,
Speaker 1: they masturbated on screen, and it's about divorce. I'm masturbated.
Speaker 1: My parents are divorced. I'm good for me. I had
Speaker 1: i f C Channel. Not to bragging in this subscribe listen, Honestly, canonically,
Speaker 1: if you had the I f C Channel when you
Speaker 1: were in middle school, high school, you will end up
Speaker 1: dating a Brooklyn Tussac someday. It's unfortunately one of the
Speaker 1: sad facts of life. I washed my hands of them. Yes,
Speaker 1: moving right along. I think that Francis. Another thing that
Speaker 1: I picked up on a second watch was that I
Speaker 1: feel like she's kind of in some ways, she's kind
Speaker 1: of supposed to be annoying, Like there's there's that whole
Speaker 1: dinner scene that at the time when I first saw it,
Speaker 1: I was like, Oh, this is like Manic Pixie dream girl, boring, dumb.
Speaker 1: But if she were a true manic Pixie dream girl.
Speaker 1: People would be very charmed and really like her, or
Speaker 1: they would be like or they would be painted as
Speaker 1: like broad like asshole, so that you sympathize with the character,
Speaker 1: but you're you're like on the side of the people
Speaker 1: who have to endore whatever for weird. They're like nice
Speaker 1: people trying not to let this girl like ruin their
Speaker 1: dinner party. And then there's another scene where I think
Speaker 1: it's Rachel, her Dan's friend who she stays with. She's like,
Speaker 1: I guess trying to find a new best friend because
Speaker 1: Sophie is effectively another thing that happened. And then so
Speaker 1: she's like, Okay, you're my new best friend, Rachel. Let's
Speaker 1: play fight. And Rachel's like what And then she keeps
Speaker 1: like kind of trying to push her and do this
Speaker 1: like playfight thing that she and Sophie used to do
Speaker 1: that we saw, but like Rachel is not into it
Speaker 1: at all. She's just like, dude, what the hell? Because
Speaker 1: she like pushes her out of friend and it's so
Speaker 1: awkward and it's like, oh, you're just hitting a woman,
Speaker 1: and she does, You're you're striking another grown adults, and
Speaker 1: like Rachel's being like I don't want to do this,
Speaker 1: please stop, And then she's just like very annoyingly continuing
Speaker 1: to do it. So, yeah, that's just like Frances go
Speaker 1: to alan On, come on there. Yeah, it's it's a
Speaker 1: unique low. At least, I don't know, quit wearing leggings
Speaker 1: under dresses. If you're not going to go to alan
Speaker 1: On and recover from Coat of Fantasy, at least, I'll
Speaker 1: just go to L Labo there. I don't know what
Speaker 1: that is. You don't know the cult of La Labo.
Speaker 1: Just like Christina shows me everything she brought she brought
Speaker 1: me to Moogie for the first time. I don't know
Speaker 1: what that is either. All I know is that, like,
Speaker 1: if you're a woman and you live in Brooklyn and
Speaker 1: you have any money whatsoever. Actually, even if you don't
Speaker 1: have money, you like you're supposed to wear scent from
Speaker 1: La Labo. It's just like fancy perfume. Specifically, if you
Speaker 1: walk through like bush Wick or Ridgewood, you're just gonna
Speaker 1: get this general vibe. But it was just thick with
Speaker 1: the waft of us of something that you can't quite
Speaker 1: put your finger on, and it's it's on to all
Speaker 1: thirty three. Oh, there's trends in perfume. Yeah, and it's
Speaker 1: only means so much coming from pack a flock of
Speaker 1: women who live in Los Angeles. But I'm very glad
Speaker 1: I don't live there. Hey, I read the cut there, listen.
Speaker 1: I read the cut and run out of five three
Speaker 1: articles and I hardly stop. You are not getting five
Speaker 1: dollars a month, no, ma'am um. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I think that it is like what I first interpreted
Speaker 1: to be a manic pixie dream girl, I think is
Speaker 1: actually more interesting, which is a woman who seems to
Speaker 1: be like kind of aping manic pixie dream girls and
Speaker 1: it being annoying to see, which is kind of cool
Speaker 1: because I feel like a lot of young women, I mean,
Speaker 1: and I can't speak to it right now, but it's
Speaker 1: like I definitely had friends in like high school and
Speaker 1: college who were going for that that it did not
Speaker 1: you know, they saw Garden State and they're like, oh
Speaker 1: what if I'm like that. They're like, what if it does?
Speaker 1: Made no sense? And like you just and you see
Speaker 1: you see people have to course correct and have to
Speaker 1: like kind of like friends. Does she has to grow up?
Speaker 1: I think that's a that's a big part of like
Speaker 1: anyone's artistic awakening is realizing that you can't just act
Speaker 1: like an artist or be eccentric as a way of
Speaker 1: like masking your right the can we talk about the
Speaker 1: you have to earn it, okay, And of course there's
Speaker 1: like of the I feel like a lot of tropes
Speaker 1: are commented on in this movie in a way that
Speaker 1: I think it's like really cool and interesting, like it
Speaker 1: seems like in retrospect them. I feel like the manic
Speaker 1: Pixie dreamgirl trope is pretty heavily commented on in this
Speaker 1: movie in a way that I thought was generally pretty effective.
Speaker 1: One of the things that I just I'm just exhausted
Speaker 1: by and it will be done forever is just like
Speaker 1: New York as a character, and I it is my
Speaker 1: understanding based on some bare bones research that the scene
Speaker 1: there's like really the only scene I remembered from this
Speaker 1: movie was GREGI Grewig dancing in the crosswalk to Modern Love,
Speaker 1: which I guess is paying homage to a different movie.
Speaker 1: Every time I go into a crosswalk in New York,
Speaker 1: I end up punching a car. Why But yeah, so
Speaker 1: so the whole, Like I feel like the whole this
Speaker 1: movie would have been cool to see, like New York,
Speaker 1: the whole New York is a character trope, like commented
Speaker 1: on more thoroughly, but it didn't really And I don't know,
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean New York is one character in
Speaker 1: movies all the time. We were talking about the like
Speaker 1: because I was watching my boyfriend and we were trying
Speaker 1: to think of, like, is there an l A equivalent
Speaker 1: to this movie? Just like a low key I mean,
Speaker 1: there's so many movies set in and about l A
Speaker 1: with like l A is a character, but they're they're
Speaker 1: fucking crazy, And I think like the best ones that
Speaker 1: are about l A, like Maholland Drive and Repo Man,
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, they got it, but but where's the
Speaker 1: one that's just like maybe it would be too bad,
Speaker 1: Like yeah, white kids lolling around talking about their dreams
Speaker 1: and like not in a way that's making fun of
Speaker 1: people who want to be actors. Like I don't know,
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if this is a good example,
Speaker 1: but like Ingrid Goes West does that sort of I
Speaker 1: think I think I think that the commentary was a
Speaker 1: little hamphased because but I thought, yeah, I feel there's
Speaker 1: a few visually they got the lifestyle pretty good, you know, um,
Speaker 1: I don't know, there's well Christina, is there not a oh,
Speaker 1: there's a well it's There's a really good three hour
Speaker 1: video essay by this filmmaker Tom Anderson called Los Angeles
Speaker 1: Plays Itself and it's a really beautiful commentary about how
Speaker 1: Los Angeles is depicted in movies, kind of large. L
Speaker 1: A is a character, but also l A disguised as
Speaker 1: other cities, which is a big part of making movies here.
Speaker 1: But it's amazing because the whole movie, it's three hours
Speaker 1: and it's completely cut from other movies, with Tom Maison
Speaker 1: just sort of narrating and analyzing over it. That's really cool.
Speaker 1: And we don't need we don't need that movie about
Speaker 1: New York. So I feel like it's made itself over
Speaker 1: and ever, well, we'll tweet out a link to that.
Speaker 1: That sounds. Yeah, I'm excited. Isn't it just like Philip
Speaker 1: at The equivalent would be like a Philip Ross novel.
Speaker 1: I don't know, speaking of of cities that play themselves
Speaker 1: in movies constantly at nausea him Gretig Garwood goes to
Speaker 1: Paris in this movie. I feel like it's really new
Speaker 1: York and Paris are the cities that do it to
Speaker 1: the point where you're like, I just never need to
Speaker 1: see this again in my entire life, or at least
Speaker 1: the kind that is presented. But I feel like in
Speaker 1: this movie, Paris as a character is commented on where
Speaker 1: this was one of the four like this, yeah, we
Speaker 1: were talking about like this was a scene that I
Speaker 1: think I was. I don't really remember, but I didn't.
Speaker 1: I definitely didn't understand the point of her going to
Speaker 1: Paris by herself and being miserable. And I think my
Speaker 1: first read of it when I was much younger, was like, oh, like,
Speaker 1: what a whiner she's in Paris, Like this is so cool,
Speaker 1: And then I like the way that it's framed in
Speaker 1: the movie now though, where it's clear that she can't
Speaker 1: afford to be doing this, it seems to be a
Speaker 1: knee jerk reaction to her feeling insecure about her place
Speaker 1: in life. She's just going into debt kind of for
Speaker 1: no reason to seem like she's doing better than she is. Well,
Speaker 1: it seems like I thought that it was even smart
Speaker 1: and that like she's going because she's seen too many
Speaker 1: movies where people find themselves in Paris, and she does
Speaker 1: this immediately after she hears from someone else that Sophie
Speaker 1: is moving abroad to Tokyo. So she's like, well, I
Speaker 1: can go somewhere else too, is what it feels like
Speaker 1: she's doing. And the lesson is, wherever you go, you're
Speaker 1: still there. And so she sleeps through almost the entire
Speaker 1: time that she's because she like stays up all night
Speaker 1: because she's like probably has like whatever, she's on a
Speaker 1: different time zone. She stays up way too late, doesn't
Speaker 1: do anything. She's just like hanging out in the apartment,
Speaker 1: and then she sleeps to like four pm the next day,
Speaker 1: and like has wasted pretty much the whole day, and
Speaker 1: then she's calling her friend who's there can't get ahold
Speaker 1: of her, so like essentially does nothing the last minute
Speaker 1: when she's already on her way back to New York,
Speaker 1: Like it's I think the worst part, and I think
Speaker 1: this speaks to her codependent behavior. The only reason why
Speaker 1: her trip is so short because she's blowing all her
Speaker 1: money on the plane ticket she has a free place
Speaker 1: to stay, is she's like, I have to go now,
Speaker 1: but I have to be back Monday at three pm
Speaker 1: to have this important meeting with my boss and she
Speaker 1: can't even doesn't even have the wherewithal to reschedule it
Speaker 1: ahead of time. And even when she gets here, her
Speaker 1: boss is like, I almost canceled it this morning, but
Speaker 1: like I had gas or whatever. Yeah, God, that that done.
Speaker 1: That I rushed back from somewhere to be disappointed and
Speaker 1: dismissed like it, or just to be at a thing
Speaker 1: that you felt was more important than the other person.
Speaker 1: Did that, like it could have been changed. Oh, it's
Speaker 1: so embarrassing, Like, wait, you flew back from Paris to
Speaker 1: be at business meeting. It all has to do with
Speaker 1: the fact that her character has not fully grown up.
Speaker 1: Even though she has seven she's still rather immature. She's
Speaker 1: not very self aware. She needs to have a second
Speaker 1: coming of age. As you know, many people, it would
Speaker 1: be adorable, right right, but maybe because she's a handful
Speaker 1: of years older, it starts to look I don't know,
Speaker 1: I mean, but that was what I really like. Something
Speaker 1: I really liked about the video is like, I mean,
Speaker 1: having to learn how to head your expectations. We talked that,
Speaker 1: and I mean we talked about this here and there,
Speaker 1: but representation of female mediocrity. But we will not achieve
Speaker 1: equality until mediocre are as interesting as mediocre men. Exactly totally,
Speaker 1: which is like most of these Brooklyn movies as mediocre
Speaker 1: men feeling bad for themselves. So almost not the goodest
Speaker 1: denim company in New York, I don't know. Oh yes
Speaker 1: there is. There was one called Making It in America
Speaker 1: and it was about two It was a show. It
Speaker 1: was on HBO about two guys trying to start a
Speaker 1: denim company. I feel sick, gritty, you know, crime ridden
Speaker 1: denim company a really ground breaking but they do the
Speaker 1: distressing by just firing a K forty seven's at it um.
Speaker 1: But like, how crazy would it be to pitch a
Speaker 1: show about like a woman trying to start an etc.
Speaker 1: Store in Brooklyn? I mean, but have it not be
Speaker 1: a joke. This is a very serious light. Have you
Speaker 1: seen the show Girl Boss? Well it was bad. It
Speaker 1: was canceled off. It was but it was like that
Speaker 1: was I mean, that movie was that. I mean that
Speaker 1: show was dogship, but it was it was female media,
Speaker 1: but it was dogshit just because everyone did a bad
Speaker 1: job on it. The idea itself is not horrible, like
Speaker 1: I like seeing and I feel like again it's it's
Speaker 1: like representing women in movies should not be this hard,
Speaker 1: but it is where I feel like we have sort
Speaker 1: of had in recent years and influx of hashtag inspirational
Speaker 1: Mary Sue type characters who we need to see succeed
Speaker 1: at the end of the movie, because that is the
Speaker 1: first step of representation, is seeing someone in the most
Speaker 1: perfect light possible to justify their existence at all, Right,
Speaker 1: and then and then and trickle down to more nuanced representations,
Speaker 1: right and then in this way, it's like it does
Speaker 1: still feel like it's like, well, we can only see
Speaker 1: it when it's like a pretty like western beauty standards,
Speaker 1: middle class white lady. But you still see like a
Speaker 1: more nuanced female character than you normally would. You are
Speaker 1: allowed to see her fail and like struggle with that
Speaker 1: and need to like it's cool. I don't know, I do,
Speaker 1: like I think about this a lot, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: the wider, wider question is like and I think it
Speaker 1: just gets to the heart of like the idea of
Speaker 1: the individual in a western social manager And is that like,
Speaker 1: why do I have to see myself reflected in media? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And that is but that is so deep. I don't
Speaker 1: think we'll ever go to the point where we can
Speaker 1: actually interrogate that because it is important. But and now
Speaker 1: we're at the point where you kind of have to
Speaker 1: just cherry pick at one at the time, like, okay,
Speaker 1: Francis Hawk, Okay, we're gonna have a character that's like
Speaker 1: kind of doesn't succeed and it's about compromise. But she
Speaker 1: has to be like blond and cute, the like if
Speaker 1: she's maybe a person of color, well then well we
Speaker 1: gotta like up it here, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: It feels like I don't know if we're obviously we're
Speaker 1: not there because even when it happens, it feels like
Speaker 1: a balancing acts of like I have to check these
Speaker 1: boxes and unchecked these to make this cultural product palatable
Speaker 1: and marketable. I mean, we kind of talked about that
Speaker 1: on the Book Smart episode where they like they clearly
Speaker 1: had like a quote wokealist where it's like, all right,
Speaker 1: we want to talk about these things as it as
Speaker 1: it pertains to you know, women and feminism and things
Speaker 1: like that. But then they like erased women of color
Speaker 1: from the whole movie. So it's like, if you know,
Speaker 1: and that's the question of like ethics versus artistic merricks.
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, well, if you're going to make there's
Speaker 1: a reason why we make fun of after school specials
Speaker 1: because their morality plays like they are moral statements disguised
Speaker 1: as entertainment. And there was a fine line between creating
Speaker 1: like equitable representation versus like, well, I'm just checking the
Speaker 1: like the morality boxes at the expense of you know,
Speaker 1: but maybe that's bullshit too, because if if the whole
Speaker 1: history of the medium is predicated on exclusion, then the
Speaker 1: question of good or bad does become moral as well.
Speaker 1: You sound like such a scholar. I wrote this down.
Speaker 1: I was having a text I think this is true.
Speaker 1: I was having a text conversation with my boyfriend. We
Speaker 1: were arguing about like craft and no boys allowed. Sorry
Speaker 1: my headeral life partner supplied to me by Lord Bezos
Speaker 1: what saying. I was just getting so mad, I mean,
Speaker 1: and he I don't know how this started, but we
Speaker 1: were he was like trying to buy a rug from Afghanistan.
Speaker 1: Then we got into this whole argument about ethics and art,
Speaker 1: and I just tried to like end it by saying,
Speaker 1: like the ethics of art is just a mobia strip
Speaker 1: of necessary and good on one side, and then the
Speaker 1: immoral on the other side, and history just kind of
Speaker 1: paints them both different colors until they bump into each other. Like, dude,
Speaker 1: I saw the Avengers with you. We both know that's
Speaker 1: how Robert Downey Jr. Invinced time travel. I mean, these
Speaker 1: things are, it's it's also historically determined. So who knows,
Speaker 1: like twenty years from now, this movie or book smart
Speaker 1: are going to seem like so pat and cloying, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, when we're still doing the podcast from now
Speaker 1: a garbage can fight, But my sugar crystals are actually
Speaker 1: just parts of the barrier reef of they melt in
Speaker 1: my coffee. We'll have a little generator and a floaty
Speaker 1: and it's gonna be Isaac on a bicycle. That's how
Speaker 1: we run the and that's our feminism at this point,
Speaker 1: that men are electricity. Now there. It's I think it's
Speaker 1: interesting that you're describing almost as a scale or of like, well,
Speaker 1: if this is true, and this needs to because it
Speaker 1: does seem like female representation in general, Like it is
Speaker 1: like if if these things are flawed, then these things
Speaker 1: need to be quote unquote not flawed. And like, I mean,
Speaker 1: could you make a movie like Francis hot with a
Speaker 1: non white character at this time. I don't know that
Speaker 1: that would have experienced success in the same way that
Speaker 1: this movie did, or that it would have been accepted
Speaker 1: in the same way this movie did. And that's worth discussing.
Speaker 1: And I think that that is like something that is
Speaker 1: still present in as much as I like enjoyed it
Speaker 1: and I thought it was a fun ramp of a
Speaker 1: movie like Book Smart to me felt like to an extent,
Speaker 1: like kind of a checklist kind of movie. And the
Speaker 1: good thing about that means that at least hitting some
Speaker 1: points like that is now marketable and is now like
Speaker 1: something that people will give you money to make if
Speaker 1: you're a very famous white lady already. But you know,
Speaker 1: it's like, at least the idea of movies that feature
Speaker 1: women that are flawed to an ext gent as marketable
Speaker 1: is really cool and indicates progress. And I don't know,
Speaker 1: I feel like this movie, like Francis House, almost like
Speaker 1: a little bit of an outlier. I mean, it also
Speaker 1: helps that it was really cheap to make. Is three
Speaker 1: million dollar budget, yea, so super super cheap. You know,
Speaker 1: no one in this movie was really famous. Yet I
Speaker 1: feel like Noah bomb Back is most likely the reason
Speaker 1: that this got made because he had had a few
Speaker 1: successes already, and it was like, I think it's her
Speaker 1: first movie that she co wrote. That let me just
Speaker 1: assuming a lot. She probably think did she write any
Speaker 1: of these mumblecore Also, she's a very good actress, because
Speaker 1: I think this movie, I just felt like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: she's just being sort of awkwardly herself. But then I
Speaker 1: saw twentieth Century Women, I'm like, oh, Gretor, she's a
Speaker 1: real actress because she plays a much more also a
Speaker 1: weird artist, but more articulate kind of together. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: a character that I don't conflate with Gretor gerwigs. So
Speaker 1: I don't know. Her first credited writing thing is like
Speaker 1: because she made a bunch of Joe Swanberg movies. So
Speaker 1: for those Joe Swanberg was like Mr Mumblecore. He lived
Speaker 1: in Chicago. He made that shitty Netflix show Easy, so
Speaker 1: if you liked it, I thought it was shitty, but whatever.
Speaker 1: He made a bunch of these early mumblecore movies. So
Speaker 1: her first credited writing credit was on a two thousand
Speaker 1: seven movie called Hannah Takes the Stairs. Haven't seen it,
Speaker 1: but that was can and then she directed her first movie.
Speaker 1: She directed a mumblecore movie in OH eight that she
Speaker 1: wrote as well. But this is I mean it was
Speaker 1: Lady Burden on her first director. I thought that was
Speaker 1: her directorial debut. But I'm gonna go ahead and say
Speaker 1: I think no Uh and Greta greater than the some
Speaker 1: of their parts. Oh, I agree, because I like this
Speaker 1: better than Lady Brod and I definitely liked it better
Speaker 1: than anything Noah bum Box has done. I definitely like
Speaker 1: this is my favorite. I mean, I've only I'm pretty
Speaker 1: sure I've only seen two or three. He made that
Speaker 1: shitty movie with Ben Stiller, right, Greenberg? Is that right? Okay?
Speaker 1: I mix up Noah Bomba and Joe Swanberg all the
Speaker 1: time because I just really don't know what makes more money.
Speaker 1: That's true. That's true, and for a man, we gotta
Speaker 1: hand it to them. Greta Gerwiggs directorial debut was a
Speaker 1: mumblecore flop with Joe Swanberg, but it was made for
Speaker 1: fifteen dollars um, so you know, like I think Lady
Speaker 1: Bird was her like her big her. It's yeah, it's
Speaker 1: credited solo directorial debut directed in a way either way
Speaker 1: this was. This was Greta Gerwig's big break. I think
Speaker 1: is like it's viewed as and I think that that
Speaker 1: is that is a great and a slight, a very
Speaker 1: slight tip of the hat to know a bombok for
Speaker 1: um really featuring her and giving her the credit she deserves,
Speaker 1: because it seems like there's if this movie. I would
Speaker 1: guess if this movie was just written by Noah Bamba,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't have had the focus on the female friendship,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't have had the focus on her, and it
Speaker 1: wouldn't have reflected her experience as well as it does. Um. No,
Speaker 1: it's funny. I remember when it came out reading an
Speaker 1: interview with Noah bum Back, which if I remember correctly,
Speaker 1: it's funny that they was a magazine piece just about
Speaker 1: Noah Bumba for the release of this movie, of course,
Speaker 1: but he did say that, yeah, it was kind of
Speaker 1: he had to coax her into writing it because at
Speaker 1: that time in her life, I think she was probably
Speaker 1: like twenty seven or maybe in her maybe a little later,
Speaker 1: almost thirty, and she was sort of venting about these
Speaker 1: frustrations in her own career, and he was just like,
Speaker 1: that's fascinating write it down, but so um, which is
Speaker 1: the point. The point is that like you need a
Speaker 1: man to point out to what's interesting about you and
Speaker 1: what's worthy about you artistically in order to put it
Speaker 1: out into the world. And I feel like it's almost
Speaker 1: a reflection of the Okay, I'm going to give an
Speaker 1: example from a friend that who may or may not
Speaker 1: have been on this podcast previously, but I don't know
Speaker 1: if she wants me to put her in blast that way,
Speaker 1: but an example of like how I think women very
Speaker 1: often are are trained to underestimate themselves for things that
Speaker 1: men will just be like, oh, of course I can
Speaker 1: do this, And how at times having a male ally
Speaker 1: to tell you, you know, no, you are ready to
Speaker 1: do this is important and I think, like that is cool.
Speaker 1: Like my, but my, my, my dear friend was considering
Speaker 1: running for office inside of like this social group that
Speaker 1: she had she had been a part of for almost
Speaker 1: two years, but then was repeatedly saying like, I don't
Speaker 1: know if I'm ready. I don't know if like people
Speaker 1: think seriously enough, I don't know if I've proven myself
Speaker 1: in this group quite enough. And then when they were announcing, Okay,
Speaker 1: who's going to run for this position. Three guys who
Speaker 1: had been there less than a month. We're like, I
Speaker 1: think I'm ready. And so then that was what comms
Speaker 1: sort of like, no, I've fucking been ready for this.
Speaker 1: All these people who just got here think that they're ready,
Speaker 1: and so I mean, for better or worse, that's the
Speaker 1: real thing, and that's important, Like yeah, slide props to
Speaker 1: to know a bomb box for you know, saying what
Speaker 1: does it really needed to be said? Because she was ready.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna I'm gonna go onto the street and
Speaker 1: ask all the dudes if I'm ready, only they will
Speaker 1: be able to tell you. Well, all I have to
Speaker 1: say if you are a man with any power or
Speaker 1: influence that is in a position to you know, encourage, Yeah,
Speaker 1: lift up, produce put that Yeah, like put the spot
Speaker 1: on the money who deserves it, that hasn't had it
Speaker 1: go down on without expecting anything in return. Don't always
Speaker 1: choose the person who has exactly your experience, or nothing
Speaker 1: will ever happen. Ding Uh. One little just quick thing
Speaker 1: I wanted to point out is in the beginning, when
Speaker 1: Francis and Sophie are still getting along splendidly, um, they're
Speaker 1: talking about their futures and the things that they want,
Speaker 1: and they're like, yeah, we'll do this, and I think
Speaker 1: this is when this it's did a point in the
Speaker 1: movie where they're getting along and they're close, they say,
Speaker 1: we'll have lovers and no children. And I just appreciate
Speaker 1: visibility for women who don't want to have kids. As
Speaker 1: someone as a woman who does not want to have children,
Speaker 1: it's always refreshing to see that represented. Yeah, so the end,
Speaker 1: I like it. I like at all? Is there is
Speaker 1: there anything else that anyone wanted to hit on before me?
Speaker 1: I've been to Paris there, How could you have gone
Speaker 1: this far into this announce So I just wanted to
Speaker 1: say that as someone who kind of found herself in
Speaker 1: Paris at one point actually a year for this movie.
Speaker 1: I mean, it couldn't have happened, but it was the
Speaker 1: kind of thing where I got off the plane and
Speaker 1: I remember thinking, oh my god, like it actually does
Speaker 1: look Paris looks like Paris. It looks like exactly like
Speaker 1: every postcard and movie and thing you've seen. And there's
Speaker 1: something deeply sad about that. And I just I haven't
Speaker 1: I haven't recovered. I have to go back every month,
Speaker 1: absolutely so well, luckily you have that free place to stay.
Speaker 1: And I like to blurt that out at dinner to Paris.
Speaker 1: Just I mean, honestly, Yeah, if if we're out and
Speaker 1: more than two seconds passes, she says, it's any any
Speaker 1: love silence in the car. I've been to Paris. Do
Speaker 1: you have an iPhone charge where I can use? May
Speaker 1: I just say that I've been to parents money, I've
Speaker 1: been to Paris. If you lose on a slot machine,
Speaker 1: I've been to Paris, knocked the whole thing over. May
Speaker 1: I just say that I've been to Paris. There can
Speaker 1: only be one female protagonists fight each other. Regretfully, I
Speaker 1: went in two, so I went there first. Okay, well clearly, yeah,
Speaker 1: someone who does things the first time is the only
Speaker 1: time that it matters. So okay, I can see thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you so much, thank you so much. Who won
Speaker 1: the podcast today is a question? Um? Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: that was all I had to say about the failed
Speaker 1: I just I guess. Yeah. This was one of the
Speaker 1: few examples in the history of this podcast that I
Speaker 1: have gone back and rewatched a movie and looked on
Speaker 1: it fonder than I did when I first watched it.
Speaker 1: I did want to say I mean, I had a
Speaker 1: fabulous time when it was really great discussing movie. It
Speaker 1: was pretty low on my list, yes for five options,
Speaker 1: and this was like the probably fifth and I was like, really,
Speaker 1: we already did dressing the pussy Cat. I thought, I
Speaker 1: looked at the thing, well you've done, and we have
Speaker 1: to guests had to save me Lord Bezos. She just
Speaker 1: got themes up. Yeah, ship Now I'm glad we reviewed
Speaker 1: this though, and I think, yeah, I'm glad we did
Speaker 1: it to those who requested it. I hope you enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: But ladies, does it pass the Bechtel test? Oh? I
Speaker 1: don't think no yet, I think so. Yeah, there's some
Speaker 1: really quirky grading passes in the Bechtel tested, just a
Speaker 1: new subsection of the test. Is it a quirky pass
Speaker 1: but there is a lot of But yeah, it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, Sophie and Francis are talking, Rachel and Francis
Speaker 1: are talking. It passes in like the first ten seconds, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and continues to do. She's like, I wouldn't eat a
Speaker 1: dog and he's like, yeah, you add Oh. The last
Speaker 1: thing I did want to say is I liked representation
Speaker 1: of a failed attempt at being a guy's gal for
Speaker 1: a couple of months. I have also I've also tried
Speaker 1: to be a guy scale first band of months. It
Speaker 1: never ends well. And I was like, make me not
Speaker 1: like other girls exactly. She is, Oh, it is nice
Speaker 1: to see a girl like I'm not like the other
Speaker 1: girls and see it be like, oh, it would actually
Speaker 1: be really chill if I could hang out with my
Speaker 1: friend who's a girl again. Um, much much better. Um
Speaker 1: it does pass. And shall we just a little rating,
Speaker 1: get a little rating? Sure, nip scale. Yeah, so we've
Speaker 1: we've got a nipple scale zero to five nipples. Based
Speaker 1: on its representation and tree mint of women, i'd sam
Speaker 1: between like a three and a three and a half
Speaker 1: on this where largely the movie is about a female friendship, which,
Speaker 1: as we've said before and we'll see again, is not
Speaker 1: the focus of most movies. So it's because most movies
Speaker 1: the focus is either a hetero relationship between a man
Speaker 1: and a woman or it is two boys. The boys
Speaker 1: are there and they're having a friendship. So nice to
Speaker 1: see female friendship celebrated, and as we've discussed, in a
Speaker 1: way that is not like a perfect Mary Sue kind
Speaker 1: of thing where it's just like, oh, look how awesome
Speaker 1: these women are and they're just so they get along
Speaker 1: so well, because that is not representative of real life.
Speaker 1: So we get to see these two different characters grow apart,
Speaker 1: come back together again, all this stuff because of their
Speaker 1: you know, individual nuances and issues that they have and
Speaker 1: are you know, trying to grow from and move through
Speaker 1: and all that stuff. So nice to see fairly well
Speaker 1: rounded characters and in their friendship and that be the
Speaker 1: focus of the movie. Um, you know, female mediocrity is
Speaker 1: something that we do appreciate. And Frances, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm like, she's not mediocre. She's just had
Speaker 1: to accept that she's not good at everything and had
Speaker 1: to find out what she was good at and accepted. Yes,
Speaker 1: that was cool and again realistic. Yes, yes, so I'm
Speaker 1: addicted to accepting my limitation. Just kidding. Very refreshing to
Speaker 1: see you on screen. Yeah, but the but then you
Speaker 1: know there's some issues and that it's you know, oh boy,
Speaker 1: is it a white movie. There's they they don't have
Speaker 1: any friends who are people of color, and uh, I
Speaker 1: don't think that I remember seeing not to open a
Speaker 1: can of worms, But like, is that that's kind of
Speaker 1: like a moral fear. But is it an artistic failure
Speaker 1: because these kind of people probably don't don't have friends
Speaker 1: of color, right, Yeah, I just feel like there's always
Speaker 1: they're always in a position just to do a little
Speaker 1: boring too. It's just boring. Yeah, I mean I would
Speaker 1: like a like a Brooklyn Trust Front bro have like
Speaker 1: a black friend. I don't know, maybe not, but why
Speaker 1: are we making movies about people like that? Then? I
Speaker 1: just any all Wight New York movie. I'm just like
Speaker 1: you were in a creative position to make this not
Speaker 1: the game, right, Yes, So I feel like the most
Speaker 1: diverse scene we saw was when she's teaching the ballet class,
Speaker 1: her ballet class. The little girls were It was a
Speaker 1: very diverse group of little Ballerina's cute. So yeah, I
Speaker 1: think I'll think I'll settle on a three point five
Speaker 1: and I'll give one to Greta, I'll give one to
Speaker 1: the actor who plays Sophie. I'll give one to our
Speaker 1: super producer Sophie. And I'll give my fine half nipple
Speaker 1: to the hairless cat that maybe maybe the boyfriend and
Speaker 1: up getting maybe No, we don't know. I'm going between
Speaker 1: three and a half feels right, but I don't I'm
Speaker 1: tempted to go for four. I don't know. I guess
Speaker 1: I'll for the for whoever's making the Wikipedia page, you've
Speaker 1: put down three and a half or four, up to you,
Speaker 1: I'll give you the editorial power because I do agree
Speaker 1: that I think, you know, whenever there is a director, writer,
Speaker 1: you're you're in a position to be inclusive, and when
Speaker 1: you make the choice not to, that choice should be
Speaker 1: justified in a way that's more than like, well it
Speaker 1: wouldn't you know, like it just kind of like a
Speaker 1: Wincy kind of response to it doesn't really it just
Speaker 1: seems like it's kind of like, I don't know, it
Speaker 1: doesn't work for me. But but but I I got
Speaker 1: this movie wrong the first time, and I have grown
Speaker 1: to really appreciate it. There were parts of this movie
Speaker 1: that were genuinely ficult for me to watch because I
Speaker 1: saw elements of myself or my own friends or just
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that it is a pretty accurate
Speaker 1: depiction of a like I and and I hesitate to
Speaker 1: put the word millennial into this podcast at all, but
Speaker 1: we're out into the world further. But like, but someone
Speaker 1: who has been you know, grew up being told they
Speaker 1: could do anything, uh, then encounter the financial and personal
Speaker 1: obstacles that make it clear that that is kind of
Speaker 1: an empty promise, and navigating their way and finding their place.
Speaker 1: It is something that is really hashtag relatable um to
Speaker 1: a lot of women and also people. I think that
Speaker 1: this is like that men can also take a lot
Speaker 1: away from this movie and it's not specifically a women's movie,
Speaker 1: which is really cool. And I think Gredi Gerwig does
Speaker 1: a great job. It's like mumblecore ish in a way
Speaker 1: that isn't like distracting to me, And I don't know,
Speaker 1: I think it was like just the right amount of
Speaker 1: pathetic in a way that made me uncomfortable for hours afterwards,
Speaker 1: because everyone is a little bit pathetic and seeing it
Speaker 1: on screen is not a not a comfortable experience. But one. Um,
Speaker 1: so I'll go with a three and a half or
Speaker 1: a four, and you know, let's let history decide which
Speaker 1: I chose. I'll give I'll give one to Francis Hall,
Speaker 1: give one is so Fie. I'll give one to the
Speaker 1: lady that Greti Garwick works for, who's like, I don't
Speaker 1: even remember my workout. I don't even remember. It's my
Speaker 1: work after it happens, uh arge the woman in charge, um,
Speaker 1: and then I'll give half a nipple to the City
Speaker 1: of New York, or I have a nible orful nipple,
Speaker 1: depending on who. Okay, Christina, all right? Quadron nipples. One
Speaker 1: nipples for Nickey Summer, one nipple for Benjie's friends at
Speaker 1: s one nipple, one nipple for taking the whole crew
Speaker 1: to Paris to film a three minutes seem Half nipple
Speaker 1: for saying the name of a movie in the movie
Speaker 1: all the way at the very end, and you're like
Speaker 1: and obligatory half nipple tithing to my Lord and Savior
Speaker 1: Jeff Bezos. Oh I love it, Christina, thank you? Where
Speaker 1: can we try shopping for myself? Did you? We? We
Speaker 1: genuinely did clap when Frances hug and we're like, yes,
Speaker 1: it all makes sense. Come together. Oh, it's like when
Speaker 1: they say the Winter Soldier. You're like, like you you
Speaker 1: want to know where you can find me on the lear?
Speaker 1: Where are you follow me on Instagram? I put everything
Speaker 1: there links to Usually if I write something or I'm
Speaker 1: doing shows, I put it all there. I'm bad at
Speaker 1: updating my website, but there's my comedy videos and writing there,
Speaker 1: which is linked from Instagram anyway, so it's at us.
Speaker 1: The at symbol ex Tina underscore Catherine with a C
Speaker 1: because Christina Catherine doesn't fit in the user name box.
Speaker 1: See but that's good stuff. You should follow me, please follow.
Speaker 1: You can find us on All the All the Stuff
Speaker 1: Facebook and the Twitter on Instagram. At bachtel Cast you
Speaker 1: can find our patreon a Matreon Patreon dot com slash Bytelcast.
Speaker 1: Five dollars a month, we'll get you two extra episodes
Speaker 1: and access to the full back catalog. What a darn
Speaker 1: good special. You can also check out our merch store
Speaker 1: at t public dot com slash the Bechtel Cast Class.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, the Betel Class. Konda, back to class.
Speaker 1: Do you see where I was going? The econoclassy? Is
Speaker 1: it a lurch store? There is a lady merch go on?
Speaker 1: Am I? Am I doing it right? Yes? This is feminism. Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you for listening. As always in Rushi next week,
Speaker 1: See you next week, Abbey