Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you very much for
Speaker 1: tuning in. Astute listeners of this program will have no
Speaker 1: doubt noticed by now that this is not the voice
Speaker 1: of Ben, this is not the voice of NOL. This is,
Speaker 1: in fact, the voice of super producer Casey. I'm I'm
Speaker 1: filling in on intro duties today, a little peek behind
Speaker 1: the curtain. We recorded this Salvador, Dolly and Walt Disney episode.
Speaker 1: It was about an hour long, and we decided, hey,
Speaker 1: let's make it a two parter, and then we promptly
Speaker 1: forgot to record the necessary intro outros to make that happen.
Speaker 1: So to set the scene, it is December, it's the afternoon.
Speaker 1: I'm here in our Atlanta studios and Uh, I'm editing,
Speaker 1: and I realized, yeah, we don't have that piece been
Speaker 1: an all are spread across the globe. Let's say so, Uh,
Speaker 1: this feels like the scene in the movie where I'm
Speaker 1: by myself in the cockpit and Uh, Ben a Koll
Speaker 1: are like in a radio tower somewhere and they're kind
Speaker 1: of trying to walk me through how to land this thing.
Speaker 1: So we'll see if I can walk away from it.
Speaker 1: But I'm not gonna say too much up top. We're
Speaker 1: just going to join the conversation already in progress. And
Speaker 1: just to add an extra layer of convoluted nous. If
Speaker 1: you are listening to these episodes in order, you will
Speaker 1: have already heard me do the outro for the first episode.
Speaker 1: So there's really not even a reason for me to
Speaker 1: be doing this. But you know, it just feels like
Speaker 1: tradition to say something at the top of the show.
Speaker 1: But we will now join the conversation the episode already
Speaker 1: in progress. So World War two ends, Disney did some
Speaker 1: of his employees back, uh. He and Dolly make good
Speaker 1: on their promise and their bromance, and he begins working
Speaker 1: on this this short end. Like you said, Noel, as
Speaker 1: soon as he started, he threw himself in relentlessly and
Speaker 1: holding nothing back. From January nine, for eight months, he
Speaker 1: was traveling back and forth from Pebble Beach to Burbank, California.
Speaker 1: He was writing outlines like a madman. He was trying
Speaker 1: to clarify his ideas, and he was like, what makes
Speaker 1: a story different when it's live action versus when it's
Speaker 1: a static painting. I want to work with uh, I
Speaker 1: want to work with everybody. We need to crowdsource this.
Speaker 1: He works closely with a guy named John Hench right
Speaker 1: h E n C H on this collaboration. Again, a
Speaker 1: lot of this is coming from Walt Disney dot Org. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's interesting because, um, we haven't really talked much
Speaker 1: about what his fee might have been. Um. But again,
Speaker 1: this was a guy that was very much a maverick.
Speaker 1: He highly valued his his skills and his creativity and
Speaker 1: thought pretty highly of himself. He's very much an outspoken
Speaker 1: fan of Salvage or Tally. When you re interviews with him, um,
Speaker 1: he you know, would not stop short of saying he
Speaker 1: was a genius essentially right, he was one of those types. Um. So,
Speaker 1: while we don't know exactly how much money he was
Speaker 1: getting paid, Disney, at one point um did say that
Speaker 1: he was quite expensive. Yeah, and it's you could see
Speaker 1: why because he's aiming for photo realism, and again imagine
Speaker 1: Disney most likely doesn't see this is just paying quote
Speaker 1: unquote an animator. He is investing in animation as an
Speaker 1: art form, and getting this world famous artist to work
Speaker 1: with him on an animated short is could be huge coup.
Speaker 1: So eventually, through these eight months in the studio, uh
Speaker 1: Dolly has made twenty two paintings, a hundred and thirty
Speaker 1: five story boards. The film is on track. And again,
Speaker 1: you know, at least in this case, you get what
Speaker 1: you pay for it because he's expensive. But he's so prolific,
Speaker 1: he's working like mad. However, it's not all you know,
Speaker 1: trumpets and angel farts and then harpsichords and stuff. There
Speaker 1: is a little bit of a little bit of creative
Speaker 1: difference that rears its head. There's an article in The
Speaker 1: l A Times from April seven wherein Dolli describes this
Speaker 1: story as a magical exposition of life in the labyrinth
Speaker 1: of time. What does Disney describe it as? Yeah, Disney
Speaker 1: is a little more spartan with his language, a little
Speaker 1: ass flowery. But honestly, that's the thing that's so interesting
Speaker 1: to me. Um going to give you the quote. But
Speaker 1: Disney as a person was very much like a product
Speaker 1: of its time. He felt like a businessman, you know,
Speaker 1: like very matter of fact. Did not strike you as
Speaker 1: an out there creative, you know, genius. He very plain spoken,
Speaker 1: very no nonsense, to seem like more like the kind
Speaker 1: of guy that would run like a car dealership rather
Speaker 1: than like the creative genius that we know he was.
Speaker 1: So he described this as a simple love story, boy
Speaker 1: meets girls, so right, because he's thinking more about the
Speaker 1: business end too, exactly. And you and I understand that
Speaker 1: side of things. There's a really interesting balance between what
Speaker 1: is something that is going to be creatively engaging and
Speaker 1: challenging versus what is something people are actually going to
Speaker 1: co sign on and pay to see or even you know,
Speaker 1: listen to for free as a free podcast. Oh boy.
Speaker 1: You know, while we're speaking of animation, it always reminds me.
Speaker 1: I think one excellent metaphor for any new endeavor uh
Speaker 1: comes from animation. It's when our protagonist, whomever they may be,
Speaker 1: walks off a cliff and continues walking through the air.
Speaker 1: Just don't look down, you know what I mean, Just
Speaker 1: don't look down if you're doing something amazing. That's the
Speaker 1: classic Wiley coyote scenario. You know, I wonder if that
Speaker 1: was the first one to do that. Probably not, but
Speaker 1: it's sure it was the most iconic. Yeah, that's the
Speaker 1: one that was the break up. Yeah, and that's that's
Speaker 1: a good metaphor. For anything. Once you've got critical mass
Speaker 1: and momentum, just keep going. The moment you consider where
Speaker 1: you are and what you're actually doing, that's when you
Speaker 1: lose it. Yep. And here's when Disney loses Dolly because
Speaker 1: the suite listeners who were called and we said eight months.
Speaker 1: He worked on this for eight months? Was he done
Speaker 1: in eight months? You may be asking yourself, how did
Speaker 1: I never hear of this? We never heard of it
Speaker 1: because after eight months Disney did the math and said,
Speaker 1: we cannot afford to keep paying this brilliant matt Man.
Speaker 1: We owe four point three million dollars to the bank.
Speaker 1: I also think the packaged anthology films or maybe on
Speaker 1: the way out, and then maybe their egos were chafing
Speaker 1: one another a little bit because according to animators like
Speaker 1: Thomas and Holly Johnston, neither of them were completely satisfied
Speaker 1: aesthetically with how this short was shaping up. And you
Speaker 1: can read their account of that, those animators Thomas and
Speaker 1: Johnston in Disney Animation The Illusion of Life. According to them,
Speaker 1: because of these reasons, the project was put on the
Speaker 1: back burner and they just didn't revisit it. So they
Speaker 1: had I think only eighteen seconds of film footage. Gotta wonder,
Speaker 1: so we'll definitely chalk it up to too expensive hemorrhaging money. Um,
Speaker 1: the company itself is in debt, having a hard time
Speaker 1: turning a profit. It was tough times in general, just
Speaker 1: because of all the wartime stuff got that. I would
Speaker 1: argue Disney thought it was too weird. Dolly thought it
Speaker 1: wasn't weird enough. I could definitely see that. I think
Speaker 1: that's I think that's fair. And then what was also
Speaker 1: thinking about how to package this? He's like, this is
Speaker 1: too weird to sell on its own as a short film, right,
Speaker 1: But I also don't know how I can fitted in
Speaker 1: to the other other stuff I was making. Here's my question,
Speaker 1: had hated ed Walt Disney actually looked in his Salvador
Speaker 1: Dali's art. I mean he he should have known what
Speaker 1: he was signing up for. I mean, this guy, he's
Speaker 1: he's a very strange person with a pencil than curly
Speaker 1: mustache um who makes melting psychedelic landscapes and weird giants
Speaker 1: that are like mountains with like teeth made of small
Speaker 1: naked people and stuff. I mean, it was it's not
Speaker 1: exactly you know, accessible, Shall we say to an American
Speaker 1: mass theater going audience, right. Yeah, by way of just
Speaker 1: an improvised comparison, it's fair to ask, is this similar
Speaker 1: to someone saying I love this experimental Polco player and yeah,
Speaker 1: I make top forty radio hits, but they're both music.
Speaker 1: Let's work together, and then you know, coming back a
Speaker 1: few months later and saying, wow, there's a there's a
Speaker 1: lot of weird accordion in this. I don't I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't know how this is going to hit billboard,
Speaker 1: you know. So, like you said, they basically canceled the project.
Speaker 1: I've seen it referred to as an indefinite hiatus, which
Speaker 1: is essentially, you know, they still own the materials, they
Speaker 1: paid for it, um, but they're not gonna make it anymore.
Speaker 1: So Dolly goes his own way. But apparently Walt and
Speaker 1: and Salvador remained very good friends, and this wasn't exactly them,
Speaker 1: you know, budding heads in a friendship torpedoing kind of way.
Speaker 1: I mean, they definitely kept being pals um. But thirty
Speaker 1: seven years after Disney Walt Disney passed and thirteen years
Speaker 1: after Salvador Dali's death, there became kind of a renewed
Speaker 1: interest in some of those materials that were archived in
Speaker 1: in the Disney by the Disney family. Trust. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: the thing. This is cool because it's I wouldn't say
Speaker 1: it's a cover up, but it's a neat story of
Speaker 1: disc every because nobody really knew about this project. It
Speaker 1: was it was a secret until you know, as you said,
Speaker 1: like at least fifty years later, in roy E Disney,
Speaker 1: the nephew of Walt Disney, is working on Fantasia two thousand,
Speaker 1: which I'm sure we all remember, and then he accidentally
Speaker 1: just stumbles across it. And The Atlantic has a pretty
Speaker 1: great article about this. But just imagine you're, you know,
Speaker 1: you're you're trying to figure out what we're gonna do,
Speaker 1: how we're gonna revivify if I'm just making upwards the
Speaker 1: the Fantasia experience for a new millennium, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden you run up against something that looks
Speaker 1: like nothing else in these shorts. It's photo realistic, it's
Speaker 1: it's hyper experimental. And they decide that they are going
Speaker 1: to resume working on this collaboration after no as you said,
Speaker 1: almost forty years after Disney's death thirteen years after Dollies
Speaker 1: and It's so cool. You might remember we dropped a
Speaker 1: name rather in passing, a guy by the name of
Speaker 1: John Hench, who is a legend in and of himself.
Speaker 1: Disney and the Disney Walt Disney Company is comprised of
Speaker 1: so many moving parts an incredible artists that go on
Speaker 1: to contribute to the vision in the esthetics of a
Speaker 1: lot of these films. Just for example, there's an artist
Speaker 1: by the name of Ivan Earl who Disney brought on
Speaker 1: to create the look of Sleeping Beauty, which is very
Speaker 1: much of a departure from the rest of the Disney
Speaker 1: cannon at to that point. Um, this guy that we're
Speaker 1: talking about, Hinch, was a little bit more of a
Speaker 1: utility player, but he was the best. He was absolutely
Speaker 1: a trusted confidante of Walt Disney. UM and he was
Speaker 1: an artist and art supervisor. Um worked on animation, effects,
Speaker 1: special effects, art direction, story boarding. UM from everything from
Speaker 1: Fantasia Dumbo, some of those package films like The Three
Speaker 1: Caballeros Make Mind Music, fun and fancy for uh, one
Speaker 1: of my favorites, The Adventures of Ikobad and Mr Toad.
Speaker 1: UM worked on Cinderella, which was when they got out
Speaker 1: of those package films and got more back into the narrative.
Speaker 1: Alice in Wonderland. He was art supervisor on that and
Speaker 1: Peter Pan and he was the one who was working
Speaker 1: hand in hand with Dolly while he was developing this
Speaker 1: thing um and they brought him back. Yeah, he worked
Speaker 1: for Disney for nearly sixty five years. Only a portion
Speaker 1: of that was working with Dolly. But when Roy finds
Speaker 1: this hidden gym, he gets Hinch back on the team.
Speaker 1: Hinch is ninety years old, and you know what he says, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll do it. In fact, he ends up being credited
Speaker 1: as the film's co authors. So Roy Disney, Disney the
Speaker 1: nephew is is in love with this idea. He puts
Speaker 1: together a secret crew of animators. He gets a director
Speaker 1: from France in case you can't see it. But I
Speaker 1: don't know why. I just pointed like you were going
Speaker 1: to co sign that, and uh he says, okay, Uh.
Speaker 1: The budget is one point five million, keep it a secret.
Speaker 1: Let's let's figure out how to how to make this happen.
Speaker 1: And so, by god, they did it. They did do it.
Speaker 1: One point five millions seems like a lot for a
Speaker 1: short don't that it does. But also it's Disney and
Speaker 1: it's Disney. Yeah, and not to mention, they had to
Speaker 1: reconstruct this like from the original uh, you know, like
Speaker 1: story boards and source material, and if I'm not mistaken,
Speaker 1: they had to actually use some pretty interesting three D
Speaker 1: computer technology to keep as close to the original vision
Speaker 1: as humanly possible. Um. So, fifty seven years after this
Speaker 1: Disney Dolly collab had been birthed from from these genius brains, um,
Speaker 1: Destino saw the light of day. Yeah. It was released
Speaker 1: on June second, two thousand three. At uh. It was
Speaker 1: nominated for the Academy Award for Best Animated Short Film.
Speaker 1: It got honored in multiple exhibitions. Also, there's some amusing
Speaker 1: math here. So it's one point five million that's the
Speaker 1: budget to create this thing, and it's probably it's about
Speaker 1: six ish minutes long. It's worth a watch. It's beautiful.
Speaker 1: If you do the math, that means that it costs
Speaker 1: two hundred sixty six thousand, six hundred sixty six dollars
Speaker 1: and sixty seven cents per minute. That's wild. Casey, do
Speaker 1: you know much about animation budgets? I do not, although
Speaker 1: you know the hand drawn stuff I know, it's super
Speaker 1: expens This wouldn't have been a hand draw on though.
Speaker 1: This is this. If you look at it, it really
Speaker 1: does have the vibe of sort of a CG kind
Speaker 1: of like Pixar kind of thing, but not it's different.
Speaker 1: It's it's sort of looks like computer rendered to d animation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's very smooth. It's really smooth. It employs some really
Speaker 1: cool kind of shutter effects where there's like missing frames
Speaker 1: and they'll be kind of a blur sometimes. But it
Speaker 1: really does look like dollies body of Work come to life.
Speaker 1: It's really really cool and striking. I recommend everyone check
Speaker 1: it out. Um. You can actually get a glimpse of
Speaker 1: it on YouTube. Um just search for Walt Disney's and
Speaker 1: Salvador Dolly's Destino. There's actually a ten A DP version
Speaker 1: of it on there if you check out. I can't
Speaker 1: believe the Walt Disney Company has not stricken that from
Speaker 1: the internet. I think maybe Roy just said it's a
Speaker 1: labor of love. So what Without too many spoilers, we
Speaker 1: can tell you what Dostino is about. Still, please, folks,
Speaker 1: I urge you to check it out. It's more than
Speaker 1: worth the six minutes might be the best six issue
Speaker 1: minutes of your day, you know, depending on how your
Speaker 1: day is going. So in the film, it turns out
Speaker 1: that both Disney and Dolly's descriptions are somewhat accurate. They
Speaker 1: were just coming at the story from different angles. It's
Speaker 1: the story of Chronos, the personification of time. In the story,
Speaker 1: Chronos falls in love with a mortal and they float
Speaker 1: across landscapes painted by Lee. This is a wordless animation, right,
Speaker 1: and uh, it's it's following as you said. No, it's
Speaker 1: following the beats of the song, you know, as much
Speaker 1: as the visual story. And I think Dizney was simplifying
Speaker 1: it a little when he said boy meets girl. It's
Speaker 1: a simple love story. Um, but but they're both right.
Speaker 1: Dahlia is mortal, just woman, and Chronos is you know,
Speaker 1: Chronos is like a doctor Manhattan figure basically. Should also
Speaker 1: note this may be familiar to fans of mythology. Yes, uh,
Speaker 1: there is Chronos k r O n O s who
Speaker 1: is the titan who does swallow his offspring. But this
Speaker 1: sticks to the love story between him and Dahlias. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So so yeah, that's right. So there's Chronos with a
Speaker 1: k You also see it as Chronus with the U
Speaker 1: s or Chronos with a C. So yeah, interesting, that's
Speaker 1: so this must be that I believe Saturn is the
Speaker 1: Roman equivalent. Is that is that the deal like there's
Speaker 1: there's usually a Roman and Gag version, and there there's
Speaker 1: usually similarity. The Greeks came first, the Romans did the
Speaker 1: gritty reboot. That's right, they are grittier. It's much more
Speaker 1: like the grim fairy tale versions of the Disney movies.
Speaker 1: So a funny reverse of that. This is just such
Speaker 1: an inspiring story. Gives me one of the three emotions
Speaker 1: I experienced a year. So then I don't know, you've
Speaker 1: been experiencing a little more emotion lately. I feel like
Speaker 1: you might be over your quota. Oh man, it is
Speaker 1: the end of the year though. It's like when you
Speaker 1: got to use those flexible health spending account dollars for
Speaker 1: the end of the year. Yeah, exactly, so you can,
Speaker 1: you can, you can feel feels some feels, ben, thanks man. So,
Speaker 1: uh so it is true that Disney and Dolly remained
Speaker 1: friends throughout their lives. Disney had dollies paintings all over
Speaker 1: his home in uh Palm Springs. Uh. He had Dolly
Speaker 1: and his wife over during their vacation UH to California
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty one, and then later Disney and his spouse
Speaker 1: went to Spain to visit DOLLI in nineteen fifty seven. Like,
Speaker 1: these guys kicked it. They were actual friends totally. You know,
Speaker 1: been a lot of Dolly paintings I r l are
Speaker 1: quite small. Yeah, oh yeah, I didn't realize that. I
Speaker 1: went to My favorite museum in the country is the
Speaker 1: Art Institute in Chicago, UM, and they have that most
Speaker 1: probably most famous Dolly image of the melting clocks, and
Speaker 1: it is like the size of like a thirteen inch
Speaker 1: laptop screen or like an iPad or something like that.
Speaker 1: It's very, very small. A lot of people feel that
Speaker 1: way when they see things like the Scream, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. I remember being in Chicago and seeing
Speaker 1: the persistence of memory. UM that's the multi clock painting,
Speaker 1: and uh and thinking, wow, it's smaller than I thought,
Speaker 1: but it looks so vivid. It's surprising it was made
Speaker 1: one and it's still the layering of color is really interesting.
Speaker 1: That that's the kind of thing you don't see in
Speaker 1: a print as much as you do when you really
Speaker 1: take a look at it in a gallery. So if
Speaker 1: anyone's in Chicago, highly recommen and checking out the Art Institute.
Speaker 1: It's a really cool building. And they also have an
Speaker 1: entire gallery of miniatures. It's one of the coolest things
Speaker 1: I've ever seen, as a whole room of just these
Speaker 1: like scale models of various periods in history, and they're
Speaker 1: like you you can like, it's just they have all
Speaker 1: the depth and there's things outside the window, and they're
Speaker 1: just like some of the coolest things I've ever seen.
Speaker 1: Wes Anderson is a big fan. There's like a little
Speaker 1: plaque of him describing how it inspired him to make
Speaker 1: Fantastic Mr. Fox and all that stuff. Wes Anderson, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he likes to control the environment. I guess, so it
Speaker 1: makes sense. So we have a special we have a
Speaker 1: we have a special thing to to sew up here
Speaker 1: on today's episode, which is, as you know, we're we're
Speaker 1: film buffs, and we often defer to our pal Casey,
Speaker 1: who has an encyclopedia knowledge of these sorts of tales.
Speaker 1: And Casey a little bit earlier off Mike, you were
Speaker 1: you were telling us that there's there's something more to
Speaker 1: the story of Dolly and Disney, not to Dolly in Disney,
Speaker 1: but just that Dolly had our kind of made his
Speaker 1: stamp in the world of cinema. Prior to you know,
Speaker 1: meeting or or working with Disney, he had worked on
Speaker 1: some early short films of Louis Been well, uh Uncian Andalou,
Speaker 1: which is an Andalusian dog, and then Lodge Door, which
Speaker 1: is the Golden age um Unciana Andalou. If you're a
Speaker 1: fan of the Pixies, they referenced it in their song Debase.
Speaker 1: Or there's a very exactly a very famous, very uncomfortable
Speaker 1: look at shot of an eyeball being sliced up, which
Speaker 1: is I believe was actually a cow's eyeball that they
Speaker 1: used for the for the movie. It really gives you
Speaker 1: the willies. And then also um Dolly designed a dream
Speaker 1: sequence for Alfred Hitchcock in the movie Spellbound, which is
Speaker 1: super super cool. So yeah, he you know, the thing
Speaker 1: with Disney didn't come fully to fruition, but he did
Speaker 1: have you know, he still left his mark on cinema
Speaker 1: as well. What year would that Hitchcock film have been? Yeah,
Speaker 1: so that was right, or he was That was why
Speaker 1: he was in town, I believe when he and uh
Speaker 1: and uh, Disney met at that dinner party. Yeah, pretty cool,
Speaker 1: Casey on the case, and this, I believe draws our
Speaker 1: tail to a close. Perhaps a poor choice of words
Speaker 1: on my part, but not as poor as the terrible
Speaker 1: thing I'm about to say. We opened the episode uh me.
Speaker 1: Finally getting a chance to use upon, I wrote that
Speaker 1: I have absolutely no use for Imagine combining the U,
Speaker 1: one of the most iconic voices in country music, with
Speaker 1: one of the most amazing mustaches in the world of surrealism,
Speaker 1: and you end up with Salvador Dolly Parton. Alright, I'll
Speaker 1: show myself out. Yeah, now you can stay. Then you
Speaker 1: should stay. That there's a band. I've never heard them,
Speaker 1: but my friend has their t shirt and they're called
Speaker 1: Guantanamo Baywatch. That's great, that's up there with I was
Speaker 1: trying to one of our friends does some work with
Speaker 1: PBR and I had been hanging out with them, and
Speaker 1: I was trying to pitch them on making some art
Speaker 1: that was perhaps blue gibbon. Uh, negotiations wrong, going yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know these are ben at least Salvador Dolly Parton
Speaker 1: and GUANTANAMOBEI watch there before and after a wheel of Fortune, clothes,
Speaker 1: before and after. It was a Wheel of Fortune category
Speaker 1: where it's always like a thing and then another thing
Speaker 1: that becomes the second thing before and after. Right, these
Speaker 1: are more interesting than the Wheel of Fortune ones. I agree,
Speaker 1: but it's a it's a form. Absolutely Yeah. Well I
Speaker 1: I you know, I gotta say I. I really want
Speaker 1: to be positive and hopefully I'm wrong about this. I
Speaker 1: haven't watched much Real of Fortune because they don't trust Pat. Say, Jack,
Speaker 1: what do you have against Pat? Nothing? I just don't
Speaker 1: trust him. He is kind of an ageless vampire. It's weird,
Speaker 1: you know. I have grudging respect for Alex Trebek, who
Speaker 1: seems like a really nice guy. But one thing that
Speaker 1: turned me off Alex Treck when I was a kid
Speaker 1: was I thought, you don't know those answers you have cards.
Speaker 1: Don't say don't see the rubicon like you knew it
Speaker 1: was the rubicon. And certainly, don't be smug when someone kids,
Speaker 1: who do you think you are? Alex Trebeck? You're reading
Speaker 1: off a card. But he's you know, he's he's a
Speaker 1: nice guy. He is uh, he's cancer survivor. Pat Sageack
Speaker 1: apparently had some health issues recently. A bit of a
Speaker 1: health scare and it caused him to not be able
Speaker 1: to shoot for a week, and Vanah White did both jobs.
Speaker 1: She turned over the letters and hosted the show. Nice, Yeah,
Speaker 1: good on you, Good on, Vanna. She's a bit of
Speaker 1: an Angels vampire herself. Yeah. I would say thanks to
Speaker 1: all the game show communities for teaching us new and
Speaker 1: unexpected things, even if I have some trust issues. Uh.
Speaker 1: Thanks of course, as always the casey pegroma or super producer.
Speaker 1: Thanks to Alex Williams, who composed this very theme that
Speaker 1: you're hearing tickling your ear holes right now. Thanks to
Speaker 1: Christopher Haciotis, who I had a lovely little hang with
Speaker 1: just last night in New York that we happened to
Speaker 1: be there at the same time and we got to
Speaker 1: catch up and he just loves being on the show
Speaker 1: Ben and we need to have him back. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was. I was supposed to be in New York
Speaker 1: but had to change my schedule, so I would have
Speaker 1: been hanging to We would have been sad that we
Speaker 1: couldn't make it, but yeah, Christop Rosciodas. Thanks also to
Speaker 1: Game News. Yeah, thanks to Eve's Jeff Coo. Thanks to Dali,
Speaker 1: Thanks to Disney. Thanks to you for listening. You know what, No,
Speaker 1: thanks to you, because, uh, my compatriot here just hopped
Speaker 1: an early plane to fly in to record this episode. Boy,
Speaker 1: or my arms tired? Let's see nicebox for more podcasts.
Speaker 1: For my heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.