Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: tuning in. We've got some hectic energy today. We've got
Speaker 1: some good vibes going on. Uh, we're gonna have a
Speaker 1: riotous uh time. Yeah, we probably it was probably ill
Speaker 1: advised for us to snore all that BC powder before
Speaker 1: we started today. Let's think, right, I agree with you? Then?
Speaker 1: Oh yes, Noel, I agree with you. There's our super producer,
Speaker 1: Casey Pegram, who supports us despite our frankly problematic beast
Speaker 1: e powder habits, our behavior in general, it really is
Speaker 1: is not on uh abhor it abhorent exactly. We are abominations,
Speaker 1: if you will, podcast abominations. Uh. But you know what,
Speaker 1: today we're gonna have a good old fashioned straw hat
Speaker 1: riot riot. You don't have to do anything that would
Speaker 1: be Super Producer Casey Pegram was pointing out just before
Speaker 1: the show that whenever there's uh, you know, anything riot
Speaker 1: two words, immediately your brain goes to the famed cherry
Speaker 1: popping Daddy's seminal what do you Do? He called swing
Speaker 1: dance hit? Well was it though? Because it was post
Speaker 1: Brian sets or orchestra. Well he was like a harbinger.
Speaker 1: It was a re revival, is what it was, right,
Speaker 1: because there was the revival was I mean even love
Speaker 1: Cats by the Cure as kind of uh a swing song.
Speaker 1: Robert Smith got there before, and then Brian Sets, Sir,
Speaker 1: and then Cherry poppin Dad these there was another Daddy's.
Speaker 1: There was a big bad voodoo Daddy. I had their
Speaker 1: had their now squirrel nut Zipper kind of no, no,
Speaker 1: I know, don't let let me finish. They they I
Speaker 1: would not rank as swing revivals, but the studios and
Speaker 1: especially outlets like MTV wanted to package them together. They
Speaker 1: were weirder though, Yeah, well they were more. Uh. I
Speaker 1: don't far be it from me to accuse any of
Speaker 1: the swing musicians of being somewhat insincere, But squirrel nut
Speaker 1: Zippers they were in it. They were of it. They
Speaker 1: were like, why should I buy CDs when I wanted it? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Question by c d s when I already have a grammophone. Exactly.
Speaker 1: We record exclusively on wax cylinders, sir, or Madam record executive.
Speaker 1: And that's the thing about it, to your note about revivals,
Speaker 1: that's the thing I love about revivals, because once you
Speaker 1: have one, it's always still it's now. It's just a
Speaker 1: continual version of revival. We're acting. They're distinct, but they're
Speaker 1: just positive between. It's like once you start clapping until
Speaker 1: you die, you're never not clapping. They're just pauses between
Speaker 1: when you're clapping. Once you pop, you can't stop. I know,
Speaker 1: pringles right just so, And you know what else can
Speaker 1: have revivals been with fashion? Hey, turn to the left.
Speaker 1: You don't have to. You can turn to the right
Speaker 1: if you wish. But it's true. Fashion has revivals and
Speaker 1: it can be you know, might be considered a fad
Speaker 1: for a minute, but then if it really takes off,
Speaker 1: it takes hold, that gets this clause into the zeitgeist,
Speaker 1: it really becomes a full blown revival. And that's kind
Speaker 1: of what we see. Um, I don't know, maybe I'm
Speaker 1: maybe I'm overset in the case a little bit. But
Speaker 1: with the straw hat riots of nineteen twenty two, which
Speaker 1: is a real thing. You don't just have to believe us,
Speaker 1: but we will prove it to you. Yeah. Fashion. Fashion
Speaker 1: is a complex, multilayered means of aesthetic expression, but it's
Speaker 1: also a means of social identification right even back to
Speaker 1: like if you think the fashion rules about when to
Speaker 1: wear white shoes and such are are strange and complicated,
Speaker 1: now we have to consider that throughout human civilization there
Speaker 1: have been real legal fashion crimes, like wearing purple when
Speaker 1: you're not royalty, having the wrong haircut, which which is
Speaker 1: the deal with labor day? And white? You're not supposed
Speaker 1: to wear before? Or is it after? I always get
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know why. Is it only shoes
Speaker 1: or is it any white? I I just I think
Speaker 1: it's shoes, but I I don't know. I U. I
Speaker 1: learned that rule is how unplugged I am from fashion friends.
Speaker 1: I learned that rule by watching a film called Serial
Speaker 1: Mom who it's about a mom who's also a serial killer.
Speaker 1: That's yeah, I thought it was cool. And that's when
Speaker 1: I learned something about when you wear when you should wear? Uh,
Speaker 1: white shoes? What is it? I typed in into Google
Speaker 1: instant doing its job as usual as listening. I typed
Speaker 1: in white shoes A and we immediately get the Google
Speaker 1: Instant too. White shoes after labor day, white shoes after
Speaker 1: labor day? Movie third one, white shoes after labor Day cereal.
Speaker 1: Um great, google gets. I think she murders somebody for
Speaker 1: wearing white shoes after Labor Day because she's a she's
Speaker 1: a real stickler for these fashion rules. She's kind of
Speaker 1: type A. And that's what today's show is about. It's
Speaker 1: about fashion rules. Yes, yeah, so hats used to be
Speaker 1: a way bigger deal than they are now. Right, and
Speaker 1: we want to read just an excerpt from the New
Speaker 1: York Times articles. So it's pretty good, you have it. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'll do this when you do that next one. Uh,
Speaker 1: gangs of young hoodlands ran Riot and various parts of
Speaker 1: the city last night, smashing on seasonable straw hats and
Speaker 1: tramplaining them in the street. In some cases, mobs of
Speaker 1: hundreds of boys and young men terrorized whole box. Stop
Speaker 1: the presses, who's that. It's not Vicky Vale, it's unseasonable
Speaker 1: straw hats coming in. Yeah. That's the part that made
Speaker 1: me chuckle, is like, these are some pedantic young hooligans,
Speaker 1: aren't they. As you can tell right from the onset
Speaker 1: that this was an issue of them being appalled in
Speaker 1: some way by someone wearing the hat out of season
Speaker 1: by just a couple of days, right, that's the important part. See,
Speaker 1: we figured out what was happening thanks to thanks to
Speaker 1: some fantastic articles, one of which was on History Naked
Speaker 1: dot com straw hat Riots of And it turns out
Speaker 1: that there was this rigorous tradition amongst the male members
Speaker 1: of the population at the end of the nineteenth century
Speaker 1: and into the beginning of the twenty and it was
Speaker 1: all centered on dressing and what was deemed appropriate for
Speaker 1: this season. This makes sense because there wasn't central a
Speaker 1: c or heating, right. Sure, I'm picturing you know, boat shoes, uh,
Speaker 1: light docker shorts. No, this probably isn't true, but we
Speaker 1: do have are these very light and airy straw hats
Speaker 1: and maybe a nas learen sup nice lien SUCs. That's right,
Speaker 1: they wouldn't. Shorts would have been way too untoward. You
Speaker 1: couldn't have out in a way with shorts. You probably
Speaker 1: would have been stoned to death in the streets, which
Speaker 1: is one of my favorite pastimes, as you know from
Speaker 1: MAVs episode. But yeah, straw hats it was very much
Speaker 1: fashionable to wear during the summer months. Um, both fashionable
Speaker 1: and comfortable because it would shade you from the sun
Speaker 1: and it wasn't the thick kind of felt hats that
Speaker 1: you'd wear during the more wintry times of the year
Speaker 1: that were also considered very fashionable. Um, but here's the thing.
Speaker 1: After the fifteen of September, Uh, it was essentially fashion mandate,
Speaker 1: unwritten fashion mandate to switch to those heavier felt hats. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is this is strange, right, because no one was
Speaker 1: considered fully clothed essentially without a hat, and you would
Speaker 1: wear a felt hat until May fifteen. And after May
Speaker 1: fifteen you could switch to the straw hat and that
Speaker 1: would be fine. In September, you have to put away
Speaker 1: your straw hat. You have to break out the felt
Speaker 1: hat again. And will betide those who do not follow
Speaker 1: this rule. Yeah, you're essentially opening yourself up to a
Speaker 1: light mugging or at the very least, you know, being
Speaker 1: accosted by young fashion conscious Ruffians who really started taking
Speaker 1: this very seriously, possibly a little too seriously. They were
Speaker 1: described as a group of over eager boys who began
Speaker 1: to do the old swipe and smash, you know, or
Speaker 1: you knock somebody's hat off, a very disrespectful move to
Speaker 1: begin with, not to mention stomping it into the filthy street. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't abide by that kind of behavior. My friend, Well,
Speaker 1: I I think the three of us are pretty easy
Speaker 1: going when it comes to how other people want to dress.
Speaker 1: If it makes you feel good, wear it. If you
Speaker 1: flip my hat, I'm gonna we're gonna have a good
Speaker 1: old fashioned throw down. Yeah, the flip, the flippers will
Speaker 1: be flipped. That's what happens, exactly. The script gets flipped always. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know what, all of those things, this is a
Speaker 1: real combination of factors that lead to an out and
Speaker 1: out street brawl. Um. Because here's the thing. Uh. Initially,
Speaker 1: you know these hooligans were h find a couple of bucks,
Speaker 1: of five bucks. This wouldn't have been you know, a
Speaker 1: paltry sum in those days. Because after all, this is
Speaker 1: a form of assault uh and destruction of private property
Speaker 1: right right right, it's illegal to smash hats. Uh. And
Speaker 1: it's weird because we get a lot of information about
Speaker 1: this event from the New York Times. Uh. We we
Speaker 1: have another quote from one magistrate Peter A. Hatting, no
Speaker 1: pun intended, that's his real name. I'm going to take
Speaker 1: the pun as just right and natural. You know, it
Speaker 1: really sets the tone for the story. It is against
Speaker 1: the law to smash him my an's hat, and he
Speaker 1: has a rat to wear it in a January snowstorm
Speaker 1: if he's so wishes. I mean, this judge a bit
Speaker 1: of a little fog horn. Yeah, well you know it's
Speaker 1: it's all the linnen, the fine linen suits. We were
Speaker 1: talking about her. Yeah, and he goes on right. This
Speaker 1: is to me, you could crystallize this quote down to
Speaker 1: like the ultimate uh in righteousness and good like this
Speaker 1: is like this guy laying down the law of what
Speaker 1: it means to be Just to hit a man's hat
Speaker 1: is a simple assault, and in this court it will
Speaker 1: be a treated as such. And I want you to
Speaker 1: spread this wood amongst all who would smash hats. It's
Speaker 1: reminded me of like a Mississippi I love this voice
Speaker 1: is remind me of like a Mississippi five, specifically that
Speaker 1: tent preacher and true detective. He's he's your true face.
Speaker 1: To me, it's more like a Mississippi breeze, you know,
Speaker 1: gently brushing the hair from their forehead. Yeah, Mississippi breze.
Speaker 1: That's the uh. I think that's one of the casey
Speaker 1: pegram lines of signature. Perfumes. I think you're right Mississippi Breeze.
Speaker 1: You know about that sleece. Yes, that is the line.
Speaker 1: So why was this such a big deal. Why was
Speaker 1: The New York Times the most prominent paper in the nation,
Speaker 1: reporting on this so heavily. Well, it's because they sort
Speaker 1: of created the fire, or they definitely stoked the flames
Speaker 1: that would lead to out and out madness in the streets.
Speaker 1: They had said that when they were explaining September, which
Speaker 1: was known as felt Hat Day at the time, they
Speaker 1: said that it was indeed a mandatory thing and that
Speaker 1: any person who wore straw hat after this date may
Speaker 1: even be Bolshevik communal enemy, potential subverter of the social order. Uh,
Speaker 1: that we are populating The New York Times was some
Speaker 1: great character. So people were it was like it was
Speaker 1: like the way people treat pleaded pants sometimes, right, It
Speaker 1: was just, uh, it was terrible to wear it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: But I got a question for you, do you is
Speaker 1: it pants? Could you refer to as a pant? You can't?
Speaker 1: Yeh is Stacy London who says a pant? She's a
Speaker 1: fashion a fashion designers say pant. I love a good pant. Yeah. Um,
Speaker 1: a pair of pants that has always struck me as
Speaker 1: odd because you can't really just have one, I mean
Speaker 1: a pair. It's not a pair. A pant would be
Speaker 1: just a single leg. If it's a pair of pants,
Speaker 1: well you've gotta have to pant to make a pair. Well,
Speaker 1: would you say a pair of scissors, I would call
Speaker 1: it a scissor. I don't like a pair of scissors.
Speaker 1: If it's just it's a scissor, it's but if you
Speaker 1: detach it, then it's just it's a knife. That's right, right, exactly,
Speaker 1: Just so, Ben, it's a pair of knives bolted together.
Speaker 1: That's what we're going to call scissors from now on.
Speaker 1: There's just a pair of knife. Pair of knives. By
Speaker 1: the way, not to get two d your other. I'm
Speaker 1: really excited when I get home. I've been traveling. When
Speaker 1: I get home, in the mailbox waiting on me my
Speaker 1: first ever Damascus steel kitchen chef's knife. Hey, congrats man,
Speaker 1: thanks Bud. Looking forward to maybe chopping off the tip
Speaker 1: of my finger by accident, like all the pros. Yeah, man,
Speaker 1: you gotta earn it. It's like yakuza rules and home
Speaker 1: chefs and also the other rules. You gotta cook with
Speaker 1: the tip. You don't get to put the tip back on.
Speaker 1: It just goes into your your spaghetti and your spaghetti
Speaker 1: whatever whatever you're making. Question for you, Ben, sure, have
Speaker 1: you heard of a tradition in the U s Senate
Speaker 1: called seal suckle Thursday? I have? Yeah. Is that the
Speaker 1: same as sucker free Sunday? Uh, they're related, Probably they're
Speaker 1: both in English. Tell me about seersucker Thursday. Searsucker Thursday
Speaker 1: is the scene in the US Senate where people wear
Speaker 1: sear sucker suits. They're awesome. I I highly recommend them.
Speaker 1: I cut one myself. What makes it a seer sucker?
Speaker 1: Is that a pattern? Or is it the fabric? You
Speaker 1: know what it's Uh, it's cotton and it's a type
Speaker 1: of I guess weave of cotton. It's also known as
Speaker 1: railroad stripe. Is that right? So it maybe does have
Speaker 1: a bit of a textured appearance to it addestion to
Speaker 1: being breathable and comfortable. And that is an example of
Speaker 1: this kind of focus on uh, seasonal wear and tradition
Speaker 1: that has maintained this day. Searsucker Thursday is a popular
Speaker 1: thing in the US Senate. Hats, of course, were a
Speaker 1: big part of this kind of thinking back in the day, Um,
Speaker 1: the hats aren't really so much part of the you know,
Speaker 1: you don't really see senators wearing hats anymore, not not anymore.
Speaker 1: But back then, of course in the twenties, Yeah, everybody
Speaker 1: wore hats. Uh. And the weird thing is this September,
Speaker 1: this felt hat. They no one knows why that day
Speaker 1: was chosen. It just suddenly became a rule, and it really, uh,
Speaker 1: the logic really breaks down when you consider that summer
Speaker 1: doesn't end until September one, so for some arbitrary reason,
Speaker 1: they the Zeitgey said September was the day you could
Speaker 1: no longer wear a straw hat. You know what it
Speaker 1: reminds me of there there's a thing that's kind of
Speaker 1: conspiratorial in the fashion world where apparently, I think once
Speaker 1: a year, once a season, these different luminaries of fashion
Speaker 1: and modeling meet up and they decide which colors are
Speaker 1: going to be the cool colors. Have you heard about that?
Speaker 1: I mean, I have no doubt that there are these
Speaker 1: private fashion Illuminati type meetings that going to this day.
Speaker 1: I hope they're descended from the people who did this
Speaker 1: bs with these hats. I bet it is. I mean,
Speaker 1: that's exactly what you're saying at the top of the show.
Speaker 1: Bend the idea of fashion curation. It really is an
Speaker 1: almost hierarchical kind of aesthetic thing, whereas look at today,
Speaker 1: like some of the clothes that you know, Gucci and
Speaker 1: Versacci and some of these really luxury fashion lines put forward,
Speaker 1: they're kind of bizarre and ridiculous looking. Let's be honest,
Speaker 1: I'm not functional or comfortable in the least, So this
Speaker 1: kind of goes into that. I mean, heavy suits weren't
Speaker 1: really comfortable, those kind of hats, you know, there was
Speaker 1: a certain stuffiness to it all that maybe meant, you know,
Speaker 1: I am my station dictates that I must constantly be
Speaker 1: a little bit uncomfortable and to lean into staying comfortable
Speaker 1: wearing that straw hat past the point of no return.
Speaker 1: That was an affront this entire arrangement, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it reminds me. Did you ever see thirty Rock? Oh? Yeah, yeah?
Speaker 1: Were you a dirty rock fan? Casey? I actually never
Speaker 1: saw it. Oh man, you are infra retreat. Uh. There's
Speaker 1: there's a character played by Alec Baldwin who has a
Speaker 1: great line. Uh. Liz Lemon played by Tina Fey walks
Speaker 1: up and she finds him dressed in a tucks and
Speaker 1: she goes, why are you wearing a tuxedo? And he goes,
Speaker 1: it's after six lemon? What am I a farmer? So
Speaker 1: these kind of people were very vulnerable to these sort
Speaker 1: of these mandates in the world of fashion. And of
Speaker 1: course the idea is pretty pretty obvious. You stick out
Speaker 1: like a sore thumb if you are, uh, still wearing
Speaker 1: your straw hat when autumn starts. People think you don't
Speaker 1: get it, your naive or your a rube. You're kind
Speaker 1: of a dumb dumb And this was taken so seriously
Speaker 1: in multiple US cities that police had to intervene. Pittsburgh
Speaker 1: Press said uh in nineteen ten that police were protecting
Speaker 1: straw lidded pedestrians and it was it was acceptable for stockbrokers,
Speaker 1: like your friends can knock off your hat, yeah, like
Speaker 1: you know, just as a playful kind of josh and
Speaker 1: punch in the shoulder kind of move, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: But strangers, especially young hoodlums, I say, I say no, sir,
Speaker 1: that will not stand. And that Pittsburgh Press article went
Speaker 1: on to say if the informality should become general, there
Speaker 1: will sure to be a number of obstinate gentlemen, most
Speaker 1: likely with English blood in their vege, who will coolly
Speaker 1: proceed to treat the fund making as a physical assaults
Speaker 1: and defend themselves in a manner which will spoil the
Speaker 1: fun for all concerned. The press at it. You gotta
Speaker 1: love the uh, the casual eurocentric racism here the implication like, well,
Speaker 1: Irish people are gonna be fine with this, you know,
Speaker 1: but watch out, watch out for the English because we
Speaker 1: all know how they are. They're humorless, is what they are,
Speaker 1: and joyless and they they just can't take a joke
Speaker 1: and apparently they're ready to fly off the handle at
Speaker 1: any given mold hot tempered, hot temper, hot blooded. Oh
Speaker 1: I'm just kidding English friends out there. We we know
Speaker 1: that you're all coolest cucumbers or prone to anxiety and
Speaker 1: violence just as much as any of us. Here we go,
Speaker 1: glass half full, half empty. Uh yeah, uk, listeners, let
Speaker 1: us know where that stereotype comes from. And uh you know,
Speaker 1: we'll still be your friends if you have a straw hat,
Speaker 1: regardless of what they of the year. It is. So
Speaker 1: that was Pittsburgh, but the straw hat stuff really reaches
Speaker 1: a breaking point in New York and the Big Apple
Speaker 1: because like this is right. So, there's twelve years after
Speaker 1: that Pittsburgh article. The entire time, people have been obeying
Speaker 1: this straw hat rule, and it has become so accepted
Speaker 1: that it's just understood that you can't really walk down
Speaker 1: the street after felt hat day with a straw hat
Speaker 1: without some kid snatching it off, stomping it in front
Speaker 1: of you, and the kid will get away clean. No
Speaker 1: one cares. Let's just point out too that this took
Speaker 1: a hot minute to reach critical mass. Right, it was
Speaker 1: a good twelve years before the this kind of playful
Speaker 1: hat flipping you know, um started, uh that a full
Speaker 1: blown zoot suit riot went into effect. I'm sorry, excuse me,
Speaker 1: straw hat riot. It's tough, casey, you really really messed
Speaker 1: this up on this one. I have brain poisoned. Everybody
Speaker 1: brain poison that's great, case on the cave. So on
Speaker 1: September nineteen twenty two, just two days before this straw
Speaker 1: hat band was supposed to go into effect, young men
Speaker 1: jumped the gun. They started grabbing and stomping the straw
Speaker 1: hats of factory workers in this specific section of Manhattan
Speaker 1: Mulberry Bends. And then the gang tried to do the
Speaker 1: same stunt on a bunch of dockworkers. But dock workers
Speaker 1: like the Wu Tang clan are nothing to f with.
Speaker 1: And the men didn't say, oh my god, you got
Speaker 1: our house. What what on earth are we to do? No,
Speaker 1: they started laying hands, they started swinging. A fight broke out,
Speaker 1: a literal street brawl. We know it was in the
Speaker 1: street because we we heard, we read that it stopped traffic. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, no small task, but I don't know, like
Speaker 1: New York traffic moves at the snail's pace anyway. But
Speaker 1: this definitely was a disruption, right. It was on the
Speaker 1: Manhattan Bridge and police um actually had to make arrests,
Speaker 1: break up the what's a good what's a good word
Speaker 1: for for the fracas brew haha, Indeed they had to
Speaker 1: break it up. Um. And I'm sorry this isn't from
Speaker 1: a Mental Flaws article, and I think this is there
Speaker 1: with the words of the writer there a Mental Flaws
Speaker 1: Mark Mancini. Scores of rowdies on the East Side and
Speaker 1: in other parts of the city started smashing hats. Oh
Speaker 1: that's from the Times. That's of course, that that sounded
Speaker 1: like a little bit of anachronistic language. The rowdies, I
Speaker 1: like that. Scores of rowdies on the East Side and
Speaker 1: in other parts of the city started smashing hats. Police
Speaker 1: reserves were called out, straw hat bonfire sports started, uh
Speaker 1: and seven men were convicted of disorderly conduct in the
Speaker 1: men's night court. Okay, full stop there the Men's night Court.
Speaker 1: I love this. I don't know what it is, but
Speaker 1: I just I like the concept of the night court.
Speaker 1: I'm just very pro night court because of that sitcom.
Speaker 1: I never really watched a whole bunch of it at
Speaker 1: an age where I could understand it. But man, I
Speaker 1: love that theme song. I think I'm not alone in that.
Speaker 1: I think a lot of us say we like sitcoms,
Speaker 1: but we actually just dig the theme song. You know,
Speaker 1: has the theme song goes lyrics? No, No, it's it's
Speaker 1: got the it's it's this really cool instrumental that starts
Speaker 1: with the bass or something like that. Right. Why am
Speaker 1: I thinking? I'm thinking of the Law and Order theme
Speaker 1: for obvious reasons. That one's pretty bass heavy to write, yeah,
Speaker 1: and that one's got a more serious the diving guitar, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and the you know the law and order of theme
Speaker 1: that we don't use anymore. Stopped coming after as Dick
Speaker 1: Wolf straw hats off. Um, that's not featured in the
Speaker 1: theme at all. It's its own thing. I thought that
Speaker 1: a missed opportunity. It's so cute. Yeah, it's its own cute.
Speaker 1: The first sound is Dick and the second sound is Wolf.
Speaker 1: You know, I want to meet the guy. I want
Speaker 1: to say that I know someone named and I would
Speaker 1: I want to refer to them as the Dick Wolf casey,
Speaker 1: I see you're itching to say something. There's a guy
Speaker 1: on that show. I think he's either a or a writer. Yeah, Speedweeks.
Speaker 1: There's two classic names. Just you know, it's a murderer's
Speaker 1: row of great names on that show. It's in every credit,
Speaker 1: like since the beginning of the show. You got your
Speaker 1: Dick Wolf and he got your speed Week. Yeah. Also,
Speaker 1: the guy who composed that theme is a guy named
Speaker 1: Mike Post. If you look at his credits, he's just
Speaker 1: like every memorable theme you can think of for from
Speaker 1: a certain era. He's he's pretty much responsible for. If
Speaker 1: he's still alive, would be fantastic to interview him. He is, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's still around Wikipedia page right now, do you think
Speaker 1: he did the Perfect Stranger's theme? I mean, it's the
Speaker 1: amazing It's an amazing theme. It's a huge roster of
Speaker 1: of stuff. It's like Lawn Order, Lawn Order, SVU, The
Speaker 1: A Team and YPD, Blue Renegade, Rockford Files, l A Law,
Speaker 1: Quantum Leap, Magnum p I. I love the Quantum Leap. Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's great. That's a good one. Oh my gosh, that's
Speaker 1: a really good one. What happened? Man? Sitcomb at themes
Speaker 1: and music like those theme songs used to be so engaging. Ben.
Speaker 1: You know I've been I've been pushing you and bugging
Speaker 1: you about how you gotta watch The Leftovers. This might
Speaker 1: do it for you. Maybe it has a Perfect Stranger's
Speaker 1: tie in and one episode in this in the last
Speaker 1: season they change out the theme song for every episode.
Speaker 1: One episode is the Perfect Stranger's theme song that I
Speaker 1: will definitely watch that episode. No, I'll give it a go.
Speaker 1: I'll give it a go. Um. Okay, but apologies for that,
Speaker 1: for that slight derailment. I'm gonna give us one more
Speaker 1: twist and turn. Gentlemen, what do you think our odds
Speaker 1: of success would be if we wrote to Dick Wolf
Speaker 1: himself and said, hey, we're huge fans. We do uh,
Speaker 1: we do this little podcast and we would love your
Speaker 1: permission to use this awesome sound cue because we talk
Speaker 1: about you all the time. Well, someone did hit us
Speaker 1: up on Facebook, right, and they said that that little
Speaker 1: dung dung sound it's apparently like a preset on a
Speaker 1: on a sampler, so it's you know, arguably you could
Speaker 1: kind of like you know, recreated or something and probably
Speaker 1: be mostly in the clear. I still need to find
Speaker 1: I tried to google it and I couldn't find too
Speaker 1: much on it. But um, whoever whoever told us that,
Speaker 1: thanks for the thanks for the note, and we will
Speaker 1: try to figure it out. Yeah. I gotta say, though, Casey,
Speaker 1: I kind of prefer your Casey fied version though you know,
Speaker 1: it's more personal and as more of a personal touch,
Speaker 1: and I think it just makes the audience and us
Speaker 1: feel closer to you. It's got to be weird for
Speaker 1: people who have not heard the older episodes so they
Speaker 1: only know the new queue. And is that I love
Speaker 1: how you kind of you kind of like done yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I uh yeah, I know. Let's let's see if we
Speaker 1: can reach out if we can. I'm sure we can
Speaker 1: figure out a way to do it legally, but it'd
Speaker 1: be nice to have the blessing of the dick Wolf.
Speaker 1: I actually know a couple of folks who have been
Speaker 1: like guest spots on episodes of of Law and Order,
Speaker 1: like back in the early nineties. But honestly, that's like
Speaker 1: every actor in the in the world. Yeah, maybe that's
Speaker 1: it's a particularly special connection. We're of the age now
Speaker 1: where some of our friends, at least some of my
Speaker 1: friends of my peer group are appearing on the Law
Speaker 1: and Order stuff that's still running, like SVU write the
Speaker 1: weird one enormously popular iced tea who has John Mullaney
Speaker 1: points out, is continually baffled every time he learned something
Speaker 1: that people in s VU should already know totally. Isn't
Speaker 1: Vincent den afreda in that one? Or is he in
Speaker 1: another series? There's so many of those. I think he's
Speaker 1: in and see I asked, maybe connected, They're all kind
Speaker 1: of they all bleed together. Now he did it for
Speaker 1: me as Kingpin and the Daredevil Netflix series is quite
Speaker 1: a good job. He was awesome. But straw Hats especially
Speaker 1: doing a good job of getting back to straw Hat.
Speaker 1: Longest diversion ever, but honestly a personal favorite and a
Speaker 1: career highlight. It was worthwhile. I think you know, Casey,
Speaker 1: I am always learning a lot from you. So this
Speaker 1: night of September thirt traffic has stopped. There is, as
Speaker 1: you said, Nola's street brawl. The New York Times reports
Speaker 1: the next day on September that straw Hat riots embroiled
Speaker 1: the east Side. And this is where we see that
Speaker 1: quote from Magistrate Hatting again that is his real name,
Speaker 1: And people are calling for civility, calling for an end
Speaker 1: to the violence. They are unsuccessful in this because the
Speaker 1: riots continue the next day, and then the day after
Speaker 1: that they moved from the east Side to the Upper
Speaker 1: west Side. There are some people who say, you know what,
Speaker 1: We're gonna wear these hats until the fifteen, because that's
Speaker 1: the rule we live in a society. Fight me and
Speaker 1: mobs of hundreds of boys and young men again for
Speaker 1: that quote. They terrorized entire blocks. The kids, the teenagers
Speaker 1: started roaming the streets with sticks that that literally had
Speaker 1: nails on the end. This is just this is some
Speaker 1: next level mischief, is what this is. This is Lord
Speaker 1: of the flaw it is. But but what's what's it
Speaker 1: play here? Ben? Is it a is it a class
Speaker 1: divide situation? Are these youngster is potentially of a lower
Speaker 1: class and they resent the fashionista elites and perhaps that's
Speaker 1: why they're they're just looking at them as easy targets.
Speaker 1: Because I'm not I'm not sensing, I'm not quite clear
Speaker 1: on like what the operating principle is here, Like, I
Speaker 1: think the kids just wanted to mess with some rich
Speaker 1: people and then it got out of hand. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: don't have a lot about the possible class motivations. That's
Speaker 1: what I think makes this sort of shining example of
Speaker 1: ridiculous history. It feels like it just got out of control.
Speaker 1: They just slippery sloped into this box of bananas. Wait wait,
Speaker 1: but we haven't even gotten the police mandated spankings yet.
Speaker 1: That's the thing, alright, So we do want to say
Speaker 1: those uh, those nails on the ends of the sticks,
Speaker 1: they weren't to puncture people's heads. They were to help
Speaker 1: hook the straw hats off. Clearly, of course you're gonna
Speaker 1: do that. So police did ultimately intervene, and as you said, um,
Speaker 1: there were kind of gangs of these roving thugs going
Speaker 1: from the east side of the Upper West Side. Um,
Speaker 1: Amsterdam Avenue was supposedly just like the whole block was
Speaker 1: full of you know, straw hat enthusiasts. So here's the thing.
Speaker 1: A lot of these these boys, these were they were kids.
Speaker 1: They were under the age of fifteen. UM, So they
Speaker 1: weren't arrested because they weren't of I don't know, I
Speaker 1: guess he could have sent him to you know, Juvie
Speaker 1: or whatever. But the cops came up with a different
Speaker 1: attack for um, their disciplinary measures, didn't they been Yeah, problematic,
Speaker 1: highly problematic by today's standards. Yeah. Yeah, So a lot
Speaker 1: of these a lot of these anti straw hat people
Speaker 1: were children. They were under age fifteen, and they weren't arrested. Uh.
Speaker 1: Instead they were spanked. That that they were given a thrashing.
Speaker 1: And so we know, and at least a few instances
Speaker 1: that police in New York in the at the height
Speaker 1: of the riots, when they would catch these these scamps,
Speaker 1: the scalawags doing their hat related crime, they would capture
Speaker 1: and probably you know, yank them by the collar of
Speaker 1: their neck and then probably by the ear, possibly by
Speaker 1: the ear, it was that era. And then they would
Speaker 1: invite the fathers of the boys to come to the
Speaker 1: station and spank them instead, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Which how humiliating if you're fourteen or fifteen in public,
Speaker 1: a public spanking, right, Yeah, it'd be hard to come
Speaker 1: back from that. But you know, the thing is the
Speaker 1: most impressive to me about this is these uh, these
Speaker 1: young hoods, they seem pretty organized. You know. It really
Speaker 1: was like an act of domestic terrorism. We'll albeit pretty
Speaker 1: you know, low grade domestic terrorism. But like some of
Speaker 1: them would like hide in doorways before like leaping out,
Speaker 1: like some sort of jumping spider boy shaped spider and
Speaker 1: attack the men and knocked their heads off. There was
Speaker 1: a report from Ripley's dot com that man by the
Speaker 1: name of E. C. Jones made the claim that one
Speaker 1: thousand teenagers were participating in a quote roaming mob there
Speaker 1: on Amsterdam Avenue. So it's like, how how are they
Speaker 1: communicating with each other? Was it just like organically it
Speaker 1: just kind of organically happened. It was just something in
Speaker 1: the air that we just have to seat, search and
Speaker 1: destroy these offending straw hats. Again, it's difficult to explain,
Speaker 1: really difficult. It's almost like one of those Salem witch trial.
Speaker 1: It's hysteria is almost you know. I mean, obviously nobody
Speaker 1: was hanged or burned or anything, but it's still a
Speaker 1: little a little strange. It makes me think of that question.
Speaker 1: I believe it may have come from Family Guy, but
Speaker 1: it's origin's ruled the whole question of realistically, if you're
Speaker 1: if you're listening, you're an adult. Realistically, how many five
Speaker 1: year olds do you think you could successfully take in
Speaker 1: a fight? You don't think this through, and I'm not
Speaker 1: none of us are condoning violence against Children's entirely a
Speaker 1: thought experiment, like what if they're six year olds? That
Speaker 1: changes that they're a little more agile. Here's what you do, though,
Speaker 1: find yourself a narrow hallway where they come running at you,
Speaker 1: they can only hit you one at a time, and
Speaker 1: you just kind of punt them. That's what they say
Speaker 1: in Family Guy. No way, no way? Is it? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Are you sure? I just pull that out of my Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's exactly it's either. Yeah, I think it's exactly what
Speaker 1: they say in Family Guy. Well, that's parallel thinking right there,
Speaker 1: My friends, I have not seen this episode of Family
Speaker 1: I think I think it's Family Guy but that is
Speaker 1: that is in that show the correct answer. And this
Speaker 1: was a real life problem. During the straw hat riots
Speaker 1: didn't have any five year old necessarily, but you know,
Speaker 1: definitely had children. Yes, one man who was twenty five
Speaker 1: was kicked and beaten by these kids so badly that
Speaker 1: he had to go to the hospital. And uh, police
Speaker 1: officers were also victimized. One detective sergeant was his hat
Speaker 1: was stolen and he was trying to chase the kids
Speaker 1: like you dirty scamps, and then he tripped and fell
Speaker 1: into a gutter full of trash. And every time the
Speaker 1: authorities were take up a gang, the kids who scattered
Speaker 1: would just go find another neighborhood and join up with
Speaker 1: more people. This did work out very well for one group,
Speaker 1: one very small group in New York, the hat store owners,
Speaker 1: because I guess everyone needed new hats after they had
Speaker 1: been stomped. I gotta get a felt hat. Oh okay.
Speaker 1: So there was either that or maybe you double down
Speaker 1: and you're like, you know what, no one's gonna stomp
Speaker 1: my straw hat. I'm gonna go buy me a fresh
Speaker 1: eet right now. Um. But as things tend to do,
Speaker 1: fashion moves in cycles, you know, you've got like like
Speaker 1: much like the Cherry Pop and Daddy's and the the
Speaker 1: zoot suit revolution revival um, not not so much revolution,
Speaker 1: that's not correct at all, more of a revival um.
Speaker 1: Straw hats fell out of favor, didn't they. They were
Speaker 1: replaced by things like Panama jack hats, which are infinitely
Speaker 1: less dorky. Uh yeah, because after the straw hat riots
Speaker 1: twenty two, this hat snatching tradition phenomenon can tinued for
Speaker 1: a few more years. No one died in the nineteen riot,
Speaker 1: but one man was according to reports, one man was
Speaker 1: killed in Nino while he was trying to fight back
Speaker 1: against some hats stompers. And Calvin Coolidge. President Calvin Coolidge
Speaker 1: was spotted one time wearing now try to restrain your
Speaker 1: your your scandal here he was spotted wearing a straw
Speaker 1: hat on September. This got covered on the front page
Speaker 1: of the Times. How dare you Coolidge? Sort of like
Speaker 1: what Obama wore that people just lost their minds. So
Speaker 1: after he so he may have played a role in
Speaker 1: the history here because after he said, you know, after
Speaker 1: he said I'll wear a straw hat when it once
Speaker 1: people eventually started following his example, and hat smashing died out.
Speaker 1: As he said, the Panama hat became much more fashionable.
Speaker 1: And I do want to say that it is tempting
Speaker 1: for us to look back and think, oh, how silly,
Speaker 1: how susy, and how like a young adult or roll
Speaker 1: doll novel this is. But the truth of the matter
Speaker 1: is these arbitrary opinions about fashion, like I believe you
Speaker 1: said earlier to know, they continue today. For instance, h
Speaker 1: I was thinking of hats stereotypes, and one of the
Speaker 1: big ones is that the Trilby or the Fedora, right,
Speaker 1: has become associated with what are called nice guys on
Speaker 1: the internet. Right. Well, I don't know, it's just is
Speaker 1: the euphemism or it just means kind of like vanilla
Speaker 1: dorky guys, like uh, creepy edge lord, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm talking about, Casey, It's yeah, it's it didn't start
Speaker 1: kind of with the whole pickup artist thing and then
Speaker 1: that kind of blood over Mr I thing, and then yeah,
Speaker 1: now it's just sort of like shorthand for I don't know,
Speaker 1: certain kind of guys. I'll tell you where it really
Speaker 1: started was with justin Timberlake. He he really turned the
Speaker 1: Fedora on its hat. He can pull it off. Though,
Speaker 1: I think it's like I think the problem was the
Speaker 1: problem was for people who objected to those hats that
Speaker 1: they needed a quick shorthand way to identify different demographics.
Speaker 1: Right to Casey's point, you name three prime examples. And
Speaker 1: then they also were irritated that people would wear these
Speaker 1: hats but then also be wearing like a T shirt
Speaker 1: and cargo shorts. Again, we fall very much on this
Speaker 1: side of letting people do and wear what they want
Speaker 1: as long as they're not hurting someone else. Uh, to
Speaker 1: to do otherwise is just it's just not on. It's
Speaker 1: ridiculous to tell people what they can or cannot wear.
Speaker 1: But thank god, you know, I don't even own a
Speaker 1: straw hat. Do you do? You have a straw hat?
Speaker 1: And I traffic exclusively in baseball hats or trucker hats.
Speaker 1: Case you're not a straw hat guy. No, Although, um,
Speaker 1: there is like a good practical reason for having them
Speaker 1: if you have to do a lot of outdoor work
Speaker 1: or something. So even on like film shoots and that
Speaker 1: kind of thing, sometimes you'll see people with straw hats,
Speaker 1: and uh, it's a smart thing to do. Usually it's
Speaker 1: accompanied by giant smears of sunscreen directly under the eye exactly.
Speaker 1: And if you really want to complete the ensemble, you
Speaker 1: get the piece of straw between your teeth. That's kind
Speaker 1: of you know, lean into it. And we want to
Speaker 1: hear your opinion on hats. Uh Are their hats? E love?
Speaker 1: Their hats? That you hate? Is the straw hat set
Speaker 1: for a revival just like swing music? What do you
Speaker 1: call that kind of hat that you're wearing this very moment?
Speaker 1: Then this is a flat cap, a flat cap sort
Speaker 1: of like the type you'd see a London cabby wearing. Perhaps, yes, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's the approachable working class UK hats like this was
Speaker 1: a gift, So it's a it's a lucky hat in fact, yes,
Speaker 1: and it seems to be working for you because you
Speaker 1: I've always considered you to be a pretty lucky do.
Speaker 1: It's also kind of similar to the type of hats
Speaker 1: that uh Um Samuel L. Jackson wears, usually of the
Speaker 1: Kangle brand. Yeah, he's also known as scalie caps. Uh
Speaker 1: In the US we call it uh driving cap. My
Speaker 1: favorite name for it probably comes from New Zealand, where
Speaker 1: it's called a cheese cutter. Love it cheese cutter. So
Speaker 1: uh yeah, we want to hear. We want to hear
Speaker 1: about your taste in hats. We want to hear whether
Speaker 1: you think the straw hat will return, and we want
Speaker 1: to hear more about your ideas for the silliest riots
Speaker 1: that ever occurred. Uh you can tell us any number
Speaker 1: of ways. We're all over the internet. You can find
Speaker 1: us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter. We specifically like to recommend
Speaker 1: our Facebook page ridiculous historians. Sure all you gotta do
Speaker 1: is conjure the names of myself, Ben or Casey Pegraham's
Speaker 1: super producer that he is, or a pun of some kind,
Speaker 1: or just let us know that you're not a Russian
Speaker 1: bot or a bot of any other nationality. We we
Speaker 1: don't discriminate against bots, we just don't want them on
Speaker 1: our Facebook page. You can also find this as individuals
Speaker 1: on social media. I am on Instagram exclusively at how
Speaker 1: Now Noel Brown, and I am on Instagram at Bennon
Speaker 1: bulland you can also find me on Twitter, where I'm
Speaker 1: talking all kinds of trash on at Ben bolland hs W.
Speaker 1: Thanks as always to Alex Williams who composed our track.
Speaker 1: Thanks to you, Casey Pat Group and we're gonna follow
Speaker 1: up on that tip stuff. Thanks to Gabe, of course,
Speaker 1: of course, where would we be without Gabe Loser, our
Speaker 1: research associate. Thanks to Jonathan Strickland, a k a. The
Speaker 1: Quister for constantly keeping us on our toes uh and
Speaker 1: for being gosh. I sound like I'm being very friendly
Speaker 1: towards Jonathan. That's not true. I hate him. I'm kidding.
Speaker 1: He's all in act. He's a good friend of ours.
Speaker 1: But thanks to him for resetting our our count for
Speaker 1: the year, right, that was nice. You didn't have to
Speaker 1: do that. He didn't have to do that. He also
Speaker 1: owns a straw hat. I bet he does. He seems
Speaker 1: like the siding dude. Let's not get off his head.
Speaker 1: Let's do it. What's the next time? M HM. For
Speaker 1: more podcasts from My Heart Radio, visit the I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your
Speaker 1: favorite shows.