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Speaker 1: That's s o f r EP dot com. Ah beat force.
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Speaker 1: listening to software radio, special operations, military news and straight
Speaker 1: talk with the guys and the community. Okay, stop at radio,
Speaker 1: on target, on time. And this week I've got very
Speaker 1: special guest. I meand White or the big building, the
Speaker 1: adult building, I call it, it's the head Shed. And
Speaker 1: I'm with a very special guest on my show today,
Speaker 1: Johnny Mercer. MP. John is that is that your official title?
Speaker 1: Field Marshal Mercer is one that's just getting through the
Speaker 1: system at the moment, and it's on time, on target, target,
Speaker 1: on time. I'll just I'll put that in there just
Speaker 1: to see if you notice you know what I means
Speaker 1: absolutely on pointless gleansers. I'm telling you there's nothing gets
Speaker 1: passed our Johnny. This role that you've got with the
Speaker 1: let's have a quick chat about the role that you've
Speaker 1: got government. What are you doing? What are you so?
Speaker 1: I obviously left because I wasn't happy to in the
Speaker 1: relationship between political and the military. I was with two
Speaker 1: nine my parent unit commander im Plymouth, very little, amazing
Speaker 1: little place. Because I became an MP and the Member
Speaker 1: of Parliament of Plymouth, and then when Boris Johnson became
Speaker 1: Prime Minister, he asked me to set up the UK
Speaker 1: is all. I established the UK's first Office of Veterans Affairs,
Speaker 1: and essentially we're on task to reset this country's relationship
Speaker 1: with her veteran community. And that covers everything from mental
Speaker 1: health care provision through to the narrative around veterans, which
Speaker 1: I think needs a little bit of work, through to
Speaker 1: vexatious prosecutions and things like that. So it's a very
Speaker 1: broad portfolio. It's a lot of time, a lot of effort,
Speaker 1: but I think we'll make real progress. The ones that
Speaker 1: jump in straight wid and obviously Soldier if if I
Speaker 1: interviewed you and didn't mention soldier, if I'm going to
Speaker 1: get absolutely ripped the pieces by people, where are we
Speaker 1: with that? What is so with these cases? Right? I
Speaker 1: can comment on the like generalities of the policy and stuff,
Speaker 1: I obviously, because I'm a government MINISTERTA can't comment on
Speaker 1: individual cases with legislation. Look, well, we're not seeking to
Speaker 1: do is shut the door on prosecuting anybody who has
Speaker 1: committed a crime in uniform. And if they have committed
Speaker 1: a crime in uniform, then we have a duty to
Speaker 1: prosecute these individuals. What we are looking to do is
Speaker 1: bring to an end the kind of vexatious mass marketing
Speaker 1: of claims that we saw under people like Phil Shina
Speaker 1: in the I HAT process that in my view goes
Speaker 1: on to this day from other theaters and bring forward
Speaker 1: legal protections to make sure that people who serve their
Speaker 1: country can't be chased into old age simply on the
Speaker 1: off chance they can't remember something and lawyers try and
Speaker 1: make it prosecutions. There's a lot of cases that have
Speaker 1: been brought up, had been dealt with previously, but now
Speaker 1: this is the issue, this is the issue where there
Speaker 1: is no new evidence. The Prime Minister was very clear
Speaker 1: that he will not allow veterans and service personnelity be
Speaker 1: to be chased by these people and we will bring
Speaker 1: forward legislation to make sure that's the case. And so
Speaker 1: taking that on the other side is obviously that when
Speaker 1: you've got the fact that these for want of a word,
Speaker 1: Irish people were given letters of comfort, do you think
Speaker 1: we would ever get the same sort of thing where
Speaker 1: where we be issued a letter of comfort to say
Speaker 1: that it's not gonna to you anymore, or do you
Speaker 1: think that would be what will eventually happens, will get
Speaker 1: an agreement past which will say you won't be hounded. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean I'd like to be in a position where
Speaker 1: there is certainty for veterans, and whether that's a letter
Speaker 1: or anything else. I want to be in a position
Speaker 1: where people who know that they've served their country and
Speaker 1: have done nothing wrong have nothing to fear from a
Speaker 1: certain investigations years and years later. So yes, some sort
Speaker 1: of certainty. You know, these letters have come for a
Speaker 1: bit of a contentious subject because yes, some people were
Speaker 1: given them. Are they legally binding? No? But have people
Speaker 1: been prosecuted in the civilian courts and they haven't been
Speaker 1: brought forward? So if a civilian claims, and yes, it's
Speaker 1: a different matter. So it's kind of it's not black
Speaker 1: and white in that respect. Get to a place where
Speaker 1: we have certainty for veterans and whether that's a letter
Speaker 1: or anything else is neither here nor there. It's that
Speaker 1: certainty that I'm not okay, so that that that's what
Speaker 1: we're after. And obviously Forest has come across the support
Speaker 1: in those sorts of ideas, so hopefully we'll put something through.
Speaker 1: It gonna happen, We'll put that to bed. That's going
Speaker 1: to happen. Because what I work on every day, absolutely
Speaker 1: and so things are you know, the Brian wouldn't. He'll
Speaker 1: be aware of Brian Wood's case. You know, Brian Wood's
Speaker 1: situation could not happen today, okay, And that's that that
Speaker 1: that on itself is coming and they know that that
Speaker 1: sort of direction. And you know, it's not just veterans
Speaker 1: that I bring this up for as well. Obviously I
Speaker 1: represent a lot of so serving soldiers with with what
Speaker 1: I do with my stuff as well. And obviously my
Speaker 1: sons are serving and they won't know that they're going
Speaker 1: to be looked after as well. Absolutely, there's a really
Speaker 1: important message here about guys who serve on operations. This
Speaker 1: law fare, the pernicious nature of law farish you like,
Speaker 1: does have an operational impact in what we're doing, what
Speaker 1: we ask our people to do. So you know, it's
Speaker 1: not only about the veteran community, a big part of
Speaker 1: it is, but it's about how we conducts operations today.
Speaker 1: And that's why it's suf You know, on a personal level,
Speaker 1: if I was still operating now and I felt that
Speaker 1: the constraints were such that I might be held to court,
Speaker 1: held to bear later in something that I couldn't defend
Speaker 1: myself against, it would affect my capability as an operator,
Speaker 1: and I just to think about it anyway. Look, let's
Speaker 1: just say that the Boris is doing is best with
Speaker 1: that and I do genuinely believe that. So you know,
Speaker 1: people have asked me to raise that, and I have
Speaker 1: mental health. Mental health is a it's raised its ugly head.
Speaker 1: It's not the first time, you know, you go back
Speaker 1: in history, it's been something that's dogged armies of the centuries. Really,
Speaker 1: you know, where are we mental health? What? What what
Speaker 1: he's been? So what's ondergoing at the moment is a
Speaker 1: fundamental shift in this country between the mental health challenge
Speaker 1: being met in our veteran community by a series of
Speaker 1: charities with an underlying commitment from the NHS, but not
Speaker 1: something people can reliant to, a fundamental shift towards the
Speaker 1: state guaranteeing that provision through a series of services, three
Speaker 1: of them, one called TILLS which is a transition in
Speaker 1: the Aisian service, one called a complex Treatment service, and
Speaker 1: one called a high Insensity service. And that triangle makes
Speaker 1: up the bedrock of this nation's responsibilities to her veterans
Speaker 1: when it comes to mental health. And this Prime Minister
Speaker 1: is absolutely determined to do whatever is required to make
Speaker 1: sure that they meet the need. Now does that therefore
Speaker 1: mean that, you know, charities and others don't have role,
Speaker 1: Of course not. These services have to be run by
Speaker 1: people on the ground, and that's where any charity can
Speaker 1: bid into the NHS procurement process and run, for example,
Speaker 1: combat stress run cts in the in the Northwest, Walking
Speaker 1: with the Wounded, are involved in East Handard, you know.
Speaker 1: But it's the framework, it's the leadership, it's the direction
Speaker 1: that people have been calling for for a long time
Speaker 1: in mental health treatment, because we have to get away
Speaker 1: from this place where people keep saying they do not
Speaker 1: know where to turn. That is not good enough. The
Speaker 1: primus is very clear, that's not good enough. And so
Speaker 1: I'm engaging a job of work to make sure that
Speaker 1: not a single veteran I meet out there in the
Speaker 1: country can honestly come to me and say they did
Speaker 1: not know where to term. We've got a speech at
Speaker 1: King's College on Thursday. We're launching this officially in April.
Speaker 1: It's going to completely redesign mental health in this country.
Speaker 1: Be called a program. Haven't come up with a name
Speaker 1: for it yet, but it's gonna be called the the
Speaker 1: you know, the film program, whatever is like, and my
Speaker 1: ambition is every veteran in this country and serving personnel
Speaker 1: knows about it and knows where to massively important because
Speaker 1: in the cases that I've looked at quite closely, the
Speaker 1: thing that's been the most difficult to do is to
Speaker 1: get the guy to speak in the first place. And
Speaker 1: very often when he has spoken, he'll say, well, I
Speaker 1: didn't know where to speak, so we can present some
Speaker 1: story because he goes between different agencies the whole time
Speaker 1: he's retelling a story, and by the second or third time,
Speaker 1: he's like, well, you know, hey, it's very difficult to
Speaker 1: tell the story anywhere and be clearly like I'm getting
Speaker 1: nowhere because you guys don't even talk to each other.
Speaker 1: The service in the past has been unacceptable. Made that
Speaker 1: very clear, and that's why I got into politics. I
Speaker 1: want to change this, and I think now we are
Speaker 1: on the cusp of having a genuinely world class offering
Speaker 1: to our veterans. But it requires work, requires change, It
Speaker 1: requires everybody to come along from for the journey. Whether
Speaker 1: it's a statutory provision in the NHS or third sector
Speaker 1: charity operating. There is room for everybody, but that leadership
Speaker 1: that underlying guarantee of commitment from this nation comes from
Speaker 1: the NHS, who have veterans who are citizens. Ultimately, you
Speaker 1: and I are in our citizens. We may have served,
Speaker 1: but we are citizens and the responsibility for that healthcare
Speaker 1: comes from the NHS, and we will guarantee that with
Speaker 1: veterans specific services in the NHS. I'm Brandon Webb for
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Speaker 1: But I think the government's responsibility has been shown in
Speaker 1: the fact that they've got someone now like you, working
Speaker 1: dedicated on veterans matters. Boris was the first part Naster
Speaker 1: to come in and talk about this stuff right. He
Speaker 1: set up on office with veterans. At first, we were
Speaker 1: the last five eyes gone tree to have an office
Speaker 1: for Veteran's Affairs. He's come in and talked about vexatious
Speaker 1: prosecutions and committed himself to a hundred day timeline, which
Speaker 1: is Wednesday next week. You know, he is the first
Speaker 1: guy who's come in and given us the political space
Speaker 1: to get this right. And it's my job to enact that.
Speaker 1: And I will see. Do you think seriously when when
Speaker 1: you look at some of the other parties around just
Speaker 1: so for instance, you aren't the party that's in seat forever,
Speaker 1: which you probably won't likely be. All right, that's the way.
Speaker 1: Do you think that other parties will pick up on this,
Speaker 1: see what you've done and go right, I'll tell you
Speaker 1: what we'll do. We'll go with the flow on this one.
Speaker 1: We'll continue where you leave it. My objective was just
Speaker 1: too strategically alter the conversation around veterans and those who
Speaker 1: served in this country. And I think we are achieving
Speaker 1: that objective. Yes, no one is going to be able
Speaker 1: to come in and shut down the Office of Veteran's
Speaker 1: Affairs right, it's going nowhere politically that is not sustainable. Yes,
Speaker 1: we we are making significant progress and the key is
Speaker 1: to kind of get everybody to understand because all right,
Speaker 1: you and I are talking about it here in London,
Speaker 1: in my office and in the MD about service to quit.
Speaker 1: The key thing that has changed is that I judge
Speaker 1: everything in this department not by what we put out
Speaker 1: and how much money put into it. How it feels
Speaker 1: for a private soldier in Plymouth who wants to access
Speaker 1: mental healthcare, or how it feels for private soldier who
Speaker 1: has left the army in Liverpool and needs the Armed
Speaker 1: Forces covenant to make sure he's on the housing list
Speaker 1: at the correct level because his child's got SC requires
Speaker 1: SCND education or what it may be. So it's a
Speaker 1: fundamental turning around the telescope, not talking about how much
Speaker 1: we're putting into this system, but asking what is it
Speaker 1: actually like to be a veteran or serving person, and
Speaker 1: that is fundamentally changing our output Armed Forces. Is it
Speaker 1: working in some areas, yes, in some areas no. I
Speaker 1: think the experience across the country is far too disparate.
Speaker 1: It's a bit of a postcode lottery. And that's why
Speaker 1: you know, part of the veteran's pledge that this Biame
Speaker 1: Minister signed up to was to enshrine the Armed Forces
Speaker 1: coming into law so that no individual can be disadvantaged
Speaker 1: because of their military service. That's what it was there
Speaker 1: to do. At the moment, it's a kind of nice
Speaker 1: to have, right people aspire to it. There's nothing, really
Speaker 1: guys a truthless tiger, because it's there in feeling companies.
Speaker 1: Actually there's a fair point. So is it a truthless tiger?
Speaker 1: I think that's a bit too strong. I do think
Speaker 1: though that there is a lack of empowerment on the
Speaker 1: people that's designed for the military community investments for them
Speaker 1: to actually use it. What I want to do is
Speaker 1: trying it into laws so that if they are disadvantage
Speaker 1: because of their military service by a public sector organization,
Speaker 1: they can take remedial legal action. They can rectify the situation.
Speaker 1: You know. It's it's about empowering the guys and girls
Speaker 1: and making the arm forces coming to mean something to them,
Speaker 1: not to me or the Prime Minister, but something to them,
Speaker 1: and then we will have achieved our objective. And I
Speaker 1: think also unique the employers, it needs to be something
Speaker 1: for them as well. They need to look some employers
Speaker 1: are amazing. They go above and beyond. They do incredible stuff.
Speaker 1: And you're right, some other employers will have the same
Speaker 1: sort of mark armed Forces comment friendly or whatever and
Speaker 1: won't do the same stuff. And there is a challenge
Speaker 1: around leveling up that offer to people in Britain. And
Speaker 1: so we're seeen a few choses lately. There was an
Speaker 1: income tax thing. Can explain that. Yeah, so well that
Speaker 1: means it's basically when when you go and you take
Speaker 1: someone on as an employer, you obviously pay their National
Speaker 1: Insurance constributions. What we're saying is that is that employees
Speaker 1: won't have to pay those for the first year if
Speaker 1: it's a vesteran they're taking on. So what you know,
Speaker 1: I'm very deterring to get people to understand that having
Speaker 1: a job is the single biggest driver of life chances
Speaker 1: that you can have when you leave the military. I
Speaker 1: just want to make sure that that opportunities going to
Speaker 1: work is as wide as it can possibly be, so
Speaker 1: this as many people can get through it. Part of
Speaker 1: that is the National Insurance announcement this week. Do you
Speaker 1: think that the resettlement that the Army receives at the moment,
Speaker 1: or the services of the whole receiver or certain packages,
Speaker 1: do you think that's enough to launch people at the
Speaker 1: city street moment, because I always have this thing whereby
Speaker 1: I say that you've got recruitment, retention, and we settlement,
Speaker 1: and if one of those is out of kilter, the
Speaker 1: rest will follow point and in. But so we settlement
Speaker 1: can always be better, right, it can always be better.
Speaker 1: There's errors in this country where it's done very well.
Speaker 1: There's areas where it's not done so well. Recruiting is
Speaker 1: actually a new story at the moment, and that guy's
Speaker 1: down there have done an amazing job. People like that, Okay,
Speaker 1: they you know, in peace, time to hit your recruiting
Speaker 1: targets two months early as an extraordinary snowfloat campaign was
Speaker 1: extremely successful. Absolutely a real challenge at the moment's retention.
Speaker 1: Too many people in my view of leaving, and they're
Speaker 1: leaving for reasons that I'm not happy with the impact
Speaker 1: of service life on their families. The offer, the offer
Speaker 1: is something I'm absolutely determined to protect and say yes.
Speaker 1: Recruitment is a challenge because the retention when a guy
Speaker 1: gets out because he wasn't happy. When a guy gets out,
Speaker 1: he's resettlement is harder, but he takes with him a
Speaker 1: story that puts people off joining. This is just what
Speaker 1: I mean. So that's that's where the three hours for
Speaker 1: me is absolutely so important that you get it right
Speaker 1: the whole time spot. And you know, I'm not being funny,
Speaker 1: but it's it's the same issuear around veteran suicide. Right.
Speaker 1: Every one of those is of see a tragedy for
Speaker 1: the individual, for their family and friends. It's unimaginable. But
Speaker 1: for us as an institution, as a tragedy, for us
Speaker 1: as an institution, the people go away from this career
Speaker 1: and take that course of action. I'm absolutely determined to
Speaker 1: do more on this. Suicide is a really difficult issue.
Speaker 1: Comparatively to our peers America, for example, we're you know,
Speaker 1: we are streets ahead comparatively to our civilian cohorts. We
Speaker 1: are streets ahead, but that's not good enough because we
Speaker 1: know where these people are and one of these is
Speaker 1: one too many. So we're doing a lot of work
Speaker 1: on it. I've commissioned a lot of data. We started
Speaker 1: from a bad place on data. I totally accept that,
Speaker 1: but we are now improving that and we will Because
Speaker 1: the figures were very sketchy, weren't they, And yeah, they
Speaker 1: were sketchy. They were sketchy and it wasn't good enough.
Speaker 1: Our data set was not good enough. But from what
Speaker 1: we're seeing and what we're finding now, our data tells
Speaker 1: us that you are less likely to take your own
Speaker 1: life if you served in service. You the suicide rats well.
Speaker 1: In civilian life it's thirty two and hundred thousand. In
Speaker 1: service life is eight and a hundred thousands. You compare
Speaker 1: this to America, they're on an average of twenty suicides
Speaker 1: a day, and veterans this is a huge problem for
Speaker 1: them and it is a significant challenge. But the way
Speaker 1: we teach people after we leave, if that was improved,
Speaker 1: that would have an effect, because I get this feeling
Speaker 1: that some of the guys that are committing suicide have
Speaker 1: this void when they leave. Now you have to feel
Speaker 1: that void, and I'm realistic about it. You have to
Speaker 1: go out and find something to do that you enjoy
Speaker 1: and that you can actually get on with so you
Speaker 1: can progress with your life. But do you think that
Speaker 1: the army tease But I'm a strong believer that your
Speaker 1: settlement starts on the day join the army, and at
Speaker 1: the very early age you should be learning about credit cards,
Speaker 1: You've learning about the health system, all the things you leave.
Speaker 1: I never knew that. When I got out, I knew nothing.
Speaker 1: And my Mrs has taught me more than the Army
Speaker 1: had ever taught me because she was a thing. Your
Speaker 1: experience now be fundamentally different. So one of the things
Speaker 1: we're working on is getting peak used professional qualifications whilst
Speaker 1: you're in service right, so that literally your your resssment starts.
Speaker 1: You know, it's tough because you do on the narrative
Speaker 1: to be you're preparing to leave all the time. You
Speaker 1: absolutely you always seven start today, today you join, and
Speaker 1: you know, qualifying yourself up and getting these things right
Speaker 1: is a hugely a little bit more cross pollination for
Speaker 1: me if actually when I was a soldier, and it
Speaker 1: might have changed slightly, but when I was a soldier,
Speaker 1: you very much is there cities and they're serving, and
Speaker 1: there's a there's a line there, a definite line there.
Speaker 1: And I never went across that other line until the
Speaker 1: day I got out, and all of a sudden, I
Speaker 1: found myself going the cities, you know, And I think
Speaker 1: that line needs to be spunged a little bit. And
Speaker 1: also there's bit of work to be done on our
Speaker 1: side of the fans in terms of serving community as well,
Speaker 1: trying of understanding that being in the military is a
Speaker 1: part of your life, but it's not your whole life.
Speaker 1: It's not going to be your whole life. You're an
Speaker 1: individual in your own right. It will be a part
Speaker 1: of your life. You are a citizen who has served.
Speaker 1: You know, you're not joining the legions is legions of
Speaker 1: veterans who are stand alone communities. Yes, we are a
Speaker 1: special community, and we're very lucky, and we've had some
Speaker 1: amazing experiences, but ultimately we are, you know, drawn from
Speaker 1: society into a re return. Yeah, and it's not None
Speaker 1: of these problems are new either, rather, do you know.
Speaker 1: I mean, Rodya Kuiplin was writing about them years ago,
Speaker 1: you know, and all the rest of it. So cool,
Speaker 1: we're coming at the end of it. Look, thanks for
Speaker 1: having me. Anytime you are anything for you, I could
Speaker 1: talk to you for ours, Johnny, I really could. I
Speaker 1: know that in sometime in the future, hopefully we'll go again.
Speaker 1: Anything you need, just kind of I want to see
Speaker 1: the progress being made. Obviously, you know we've spoke about
Speaker 1: quite a few things, and you need to hold me
Speaker 1: to account. There's no point me doing this job and
Speaker 1: being in this position if the community that I'm doing
Speaker 1: it for don't feel the benefits, so you need to
Speaker 1: help hold me to account. Thanks very much for your times.
Speaker 1: That's that's Johnny Mercer MP giving me a fair, an
Speaker 1: accurate account of what he's up to and what he's
Speaker 1: doing and what he's trying to achieve, which I think
Speaker 1: is absolutely super And thank you very much for your time. Pleasure.
Speaker 1: All right, buddy, Thanks you've been listening to self reply.
Speaker 1: New episodes up every Wednesday and Friday. Follow the show
Speaker 1: on Instagram and Twitter at soft Red Radio