Aaron: This episode of the Cascadian Beer Podcast has been made possible by the
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Aaron: ca. Welcome to the Cascadian Beer Podcast. My name is Aaron
Aaron: and I'm at Cascadia. In this podcast series, I profile
Aaron: the breweries around Cascadia, a region that has a strong
Aaron: presence in the international beer scene. If this is your
Aaron: first time here, welcome. I hope you enjoy this episode.
Aaron: I do hope you subscribe wherever you listen to this
Aaron: podcast, that way you'll never miss an episode. And feel
Aaron: free to share it with your friends. That's how this
Aaron: podcast series grows and we help support our local breweries.
Aaron: In today's episode of the podcast, I'm focusing on a
Aaron: single community on Vancouver Island. The city of Port Alberni
Aaron: is located pretty much in the center of Vancouver Island.
Aaron: With the drive time being just over an hour from
Aaron: the Nimmo, I'll be speaking with both breweries who've opened
Aaron: up here in recent years. First up, a brewery who
Aaron: is established in 2016. It's Twin Cities Brewing.
Aaron Colyn: My name is Aaron Colyn. I am the owner and
Aaron Colyn: brew master of Twin City Brewing in Port Alberni, BC.
Aaron: Port Alberni. Beautiful. It was a beautiful drive up today.
Aaron Colyn: It is a pretty cool drive, especially going through Cathedral
Aaron Colyn: Grove around Cameron Lake.
Aaron: A lot of people at the lake today. I can only imagine
Aaron: that gets pretty busy in the summertime.
Aaron Colyn: Oh, yeah. It does. It's basically highway straight through Port
Aaron Colyn: Alberni all the way to Tofino and it's always been
Aaron Colyn: a lot of people making that trip.
Aaron: Well, I mean, the question that I like starting off
Aaron: with is how did beer find you?
Aaron Colyn: I think beer was an escape for me. During university,
Aaron Colyn: I was going to Vancouver Island University and the Nimmo. And I
Aaron Colyn: was doing microbiology and trying to do undergraduate stuff for
Aaron Colyn: medical school. Just so happened to find most of my weekends
Aaron Colyn: and evenings hanging out in the pub with friends. Longwood
Aaron Colyn: was close by and that was kind of the time
Aaron Colyn: where things are really taking off in BC as far
Aaron Colyn: as ... Especially on the island, Phillips was doing a lot
Aaron Colyn: and (inaudible) and Driftwood were really just starting to
Aaron Colyn: show what they can do. I just was telling someone
Aaron Colyn: about all the beers I used to drink and Red
Aaron Colyn: Racer IPA was just like an epiphany to try that
Aaron Colyn: compared to some of the beers that people were used
Aaron Colyn: to. So it was something started to pull me in
Aaron Colyn: that direction and I think it was the science behind
Aaron Colyn: it. Some of the stuff that was like, " Well, it
Aaron Colyn: might be a cool hobby to try home brewing. I
Aaron Colyn: wonder if I can make beer as good as some
Aaron Colyn: of my favorites that I'm enjoying right now." You know,
Aaron Colyn: bombers were huge. Everyone had seasonal bombers coming out. It
Aaron Colyn: was the battle of who could make the coolest new
Aaron Colyn: beer. It just seemed like a different landscape for beer
Aaron Colyn: back then. But looking back, it was kind of planting
Aaron Colyn: the seeds. I think for a lot of people that
Aaron Colyn: were like, " Man, the beer industry is really cool. Making
Aaron Colyn: beer is really cool." It's a fun thing to be
Aaron Colyn: a part of the events. Just the people involved are
Aaron Colyn: just great. I can't speak any more highly than I
Aaron Colyn: do about how great the industry is and what it's
Aaron Colyn: like getting to do events and things with those kind
Aaron Colyn: of people. I think that was it for me. Something started to
Aaron Colyn: tapped me on the shoulder going, " Hey, you're really liking
Aaron Colyn: this stuff and the stuff that goes into it." I basically
Aaron Colyn: decided third year into my undergraduate degree, I'm like, " I'm
Aaron Colyn: going to finish this degree but med school isn't for
Aaron Colyn: me. Just my heart isn't in it." And pretty much
Aaron Colyn: decided really quickly after that, that I wanted to move
Aaron Colyn: back to my hometown where I was born and raised.
Aaron Colyn: I want to do something cool in the community and
Aaron Colyn: provide a space for people to enjoy really good beer
Aaron Colyn: and hang out and kind of come together as a
Aaron Colyn: community. I think that was something that Port Alberni was maybe lacking.
Aaron Colyn: It just all of a sudden sparked this passion. It
Aaron Colyn: was like, " Oh, yeah, Port Alberni needs a space where people
Aaron Colyn: can come together and just hang out and plan the
Aaron Colyn: amazing things they're going to do in their community, events
Aaron Colyn: and fundraisers and things like that. Just meeting a friend
Aaron Colyn: over a beer." I think I used to say, there's so
Aaron Colyn: many times you can look back in history, it was
Aaron Colyn: like people met over a beer, chat about something. It
Aaron Colyn: was the ...
Aaron: I've met a lot of cool people over beer.
Aaron Colyn: Yeah. It's the small beginnings for a lot of really cool
Aaron Colyn: stuff. So providing that space, doing something that I was passionate
Aaron Colyn: about and really letting people enjoy that and create this
Aaron Colyn: welcoming, comfortable environment.
Aaron: Right. Around that time when you're thinking about this, there was just nothing
Aaron: between the Nimmo and Tofino, right? Tofino brewing was open and then
Aaron: some stuff and then Nimmo and that was it, right?
Aaron Colyn: Yeah. That's really, I mean, I loved what Longwood was
Aaron Colyn: doing because they really ... I wasn't involved in the Victoria
Aaron Colyn: beer scene too much. I know Spinnakers has brought a
Aaron Colyn: lot of that English style beer to people and to
Aaron Colyn: their community. And then Nimmo was that kind of for
Aaron Colyn: me, because that's just ... I didn't end up going that far
Aaron Colyn: south when I was really getting into beer. So that
Aaron Colyn: introduction to all these English styles and some of the
Aaron Colyn: history behind it. Yeah, there wasn't really anything like that.
Aaron Colyn: It took a really long time even for private liquor
Aaron Colyn: stores to pick up on the craft beer trend in
Aaron Colyn: Port Alberni and it's just something we weren't seeing. So
Aaron Colyn: getting those crumbs that made you want more and then
Aaron Colyn: you could chase down what was really happening in craft beer.
Aaron: Right. Around what time was this? Like how many years
Aaron: ago when it has the ...
Aaron Colyn: This is about eight years ago.
Aaron: Right. Then from idea until breaking ground, what was that
Aaron: timeframe like?
Aaron Colyn: That was a roller coaster. I finished my degree and
Aaron Colyn: I started working on a business plan. I was like, "You know
Aaron Colyn: what, brewery is what I want to do. Let's start there."
Aaron Colyn: I started a business plan, I ended up pouring a
Aaron Colyn: lot of time and energy into this thing. It was
Aaron Colyn: 30 pages. It was as much detail as I could
Aaron Colyn: think of, I just wanted to be scrupulous. I realized
Aaron Colyn: really quickly that the type of brewery I wanted to
Aaron Colyn: be was going to be something that the community got
Aaron Colyn: behind, something that they supported and they felt like a
Aaron Colyn: part of. What I did is I started a crowdfunding
Aaron Colyn: campaign to buy a pilot system. I was using a
Aaron Colyn: Coleman Igloo cooler mash time and a turkey fryer stockpot. I
Aaron Colyn: was home brewing the way a lot of people start
Aaron Colyn: home brewing and I was like," You know what? I think my
Aaron Colyn: beer is good." Everyone around you tells you your beers good
Aaron Colyn: because they're like drinking it for free.
Aaron: Yeah. Hey, buddy.
Aaron Colyn: Yeah. Exactly. Show up at a party with a couple
Aaron Colyn: of kegs and people aren't going to tell you it's bad.
Aaron: I mean, if somebody doesn't think that, you're not their
Aaron: best friend I mean when you turn up with kegs
Aaron: at a party.
Aaron Colyn: Exactly. Yeah. We decided, " You know what? Let's really gauge the
Aaron Colyn: community's reaction to this idea. Let's see if they're going
Aaron Colyn: to support it." You don't really know what the community's
Aaron Colyn: response is going to be like, especially when it comes
Aaron Colyn: to an alcohol establishment and what people perceive that to
Aaron Colyn: be. So we did this Indiegogo crowdfunding campaign and we're
Aaron Colyn: like, "You know what? The goal is we're going to raise money,
Aaron Colyn: we're going to buy a pilot system that is really ..."
Aaron Colyn: It's a way for us to build our recipes and
Aaron Colyn: hone the skills to make them transferable to large scale.
Aaron Colyn: So we can go, " Okay, we're down to the science
Aaron Colyn: on this. We know we're making this type of beer.
Aaron Colyn: We can easily scale that up and it will work
Aaron Colyn: in our community." The Indiegogo thing was cool. We had over
Aaron Colyn: 100 contributors to it. Ended up raising over $7, 000 which
Aaron Colyn: bought this really nice pilot system. People were able to
Aaron Colyn: get T- shirts, bottle openers, all sorts of coasters and
Aaron Colyn: things like that just for being a part of it.
Aaron Colyn: It really helped us cement some of the support in
Aaron Colyn: what our plan would end up being. That was cool
Aaron Colyn: because then people knew what we basically said what we
Aaron Colyn: were going to do and the community could hold us
Aaron Colyn: accountable. After that, everything was kind of serendipitous. I mean,
Aaron Colyn: we found this space and it just lined up perfectly
Aaron Colyn: to buy so we bought the building. I started doing
Aaron Colyn: weekend and evening rentals until I thought I was gonna
Aaron Colyn: go crazy on my own with no money. Just shopping
Aaron Colyn: that business plan around, looking for the right people to be involved
Aaron Colyn: with. You know, a fresh out of university student that
Aaron Colyn: has no ...
Aaron: Never owned a business before.
Aaron Colyn: Never owned a business, but we were really passionate and we really thought
Aaron Colyn: we had a tight plan. We ended up just getting
Aaron Colyn: the right people involved over time and they, to this
Aaron Colyn: day, have all been so great to us. It helped
Aaron Colyn: us get things to the next level. It helped us
Aaron Colyn: rethink some ideas that we thought we knew, but maybe
Aaron Colyn: we needed to re- plan a bit. By the time
Aaron Colyn: we ordered the equipment, I was so confident in what
Aaron Colyn: we were doing. We opened our doors and just never
Aaron Colyn: looked back. That was three years ago coming up on
Aaron Colyn: the 24th.
Aaron: All right. 24th of March?
Aaron Colyn: Yeah.
Aaron: Well, happy early, at the time of taping, anniversary here.
Aaron: About that equipment. What is the size of the brew
Aaron: house back there?
Aaron Colyn: We have a 1, 200 liter brew system. It is Chinese. We
Aaron Colyn: were, like I said, trying to do things in a
Aaron Colyn: way that wasn't going to break the bank. We basically
Aaron Colyn: were on a shoestring budget opening and we tried really
Aaron Colyn: hard to make the most of that. We did buy
Aaron Colyn: from China. We really did a lot of shopping when
Aaron Colyn: it came to our brew house and our tanks. I
Aaron Colyn: think it worked for us. I don't know if it'll work
Aaron Colyn: for everyone. We just kind of figured, "You know what? If we're careful
Aaron Colyn: enough, we know what the limits of it. We can
Aaron Colyn: make good beer if we're clean enough and we're watching
Aaron Colyn: things carefully." Yeah, it's been great.
Aaron: Well, with that system, do you have some challenges like if
Aaron: parts are breaking and stuff like that, has there been downtime as a
Aaron: result or you're able to resolve that?
Aaron Colyn: Yeah, a little bit. I mean, the one thing is
Aaron Colyn: we brought all this equipment in and then it showed
Aaron Colyn: up and our electrician told us none of it was certified
Aaron Colyn: for use in Canada. So we had a mini heart
Aaron Colyn: attack. But we actually ended up getting someone involved that
Aaron Colyn: was able to certify the equipment. They looked at it
Aaron Colyn: all and they're like, " Oh, no. This is actually visceral parts that
Aaron Colyn: are used in North America. It's not like they were
Aaron Colyn: using really cheap stuff." They're like, " Yeah," they looked it
Aaron Colyn: over. They looked over all the circuits, they looked over
Aaron Colyn: everything before it was hooked up and they put their
Aaron Colyn: stamp on it and it was certified. So it wasn't
Aaron Colyn: as big of a headache as we thought. But that was
Aaron Colyn: one of the challenges. I mean, we tried to think
Aaron Colyn: ahead and be ... Our kettle is electric. So extra elements,
Aaron Colyn: please send us spare sets of everything you can imagine.
Aaron Colyn: We always have something in the back waiting in case
Aaron Colyn: we had any issue. But for the most part, we've
Aaron Colyn: had a lot of help from places like Specific Mechanical,
Aaron Colyn: they've been able to kind of augment our needs. We're still very happy
Aaron Colyn: that we have someone local like that who can splice for things
Aaron Colyn: when an emergency arrives. Yeah, t's been pretty good so far.
Aaron Colyn: We've been very fortunate.
Aaron: Right. Then the ingredients, where are they coming from? Are
Aaron: they being sourced from the island at all?
Aaron Colyn: We try to when we can. I mean, most of
Aaron Colyn: our ingredients are coming from (inaudible) because it's super
Aaron Colyn: convenient. They have access so much for us. We've really
Aaron Colyn: been happy with everything we've gotten. We do make a
Aaron Colyn: couple of beers that we feel are very location dependent.
Aaron Colyn: We make a British pale ale and for us, it's like, "No,
Aaron Colyn: you got to use the imported Maris Otter and you
Aaron Colyn: got to bring in the the hops from the UK.
Aaron Colyn: We just feel like it's just creating that diversity across
Aaron Colyn: our beers so that things don't all take taste the same.
Aaron Colyn: That being said, we, for a very long time never
Aaron Colyn: did any lagers because we just thought that was what
Aaron Colyn: everyone was going to expect. To us at the time, it
Aaron Colyn: wasn't the most exciting thing we could make. That being
Aaron Colyn: said, we never said we wouldn't. So we started dabbling
Aaron Colyn: in some longer term lagering and some cool historic beer
Aaron Colyn: styles. For that, as well, we wanted to reach out
Aaron Colyn: and get those ingredients from where they originally were made
Aaron Colyn: and malted and stuff like that. So German pilsners, we bring in the German malt to use that, we're
Aaron Colyn: bringing in the hops to do that. We just really
Aaron Colyn: want to showcase a variety in our beer. I think
Aaron Colyn: as a small community brewery, we're kind of in this
Aaron Colyn: position where we feel forced to have to do everything
Aaron Colyn: good. You know what I mean? We can't be the
Aaron Colyn: sour brewery, we can't be the Belgian brewery, we can't
Aaron Colyn: be the hazy brewery. We're catering to a community that
Aaron Colyn: has a lot of diverse tastes and doesn't have access
Aaron Colyn: to a huge diverse market.
Aaron: And also tourism dependent, too. Right?
Aaron Colyn: Exactly. We take that challenge and we enjoy it. You
Aaron Colyn: know, right now, I mean, we've got a sour, we've
Aaron Colyn: got a hazy, we've got a Munich helles. We've got
Aaron Colyn: a lot of different varieties on our beer list but
Aaron Colyn: that's fun, that keeps it interesting and we find out
Aaron Colyn: the stuff we really like. If it has a cool
Aaron Colyn: story behind the style, if it has a cool story behind the
Aaron Colyn: ingredients or the technique used to make it, that's exciting
Aaron Colyn: to us. We relay that excitement to our customers and
Aaron Colyn: be like, " This is why this beer is exciting. This is why
Aaron Colyn: we're excited to make it." That's pretty cool to be
Aaron Colyn: able to curate that list of beers for the community
Aaron Colyn: and yeah, it's been really great. We've got a lot
Aaron Colyn: of new stuff on the way. We're really excited about
Aaron Colyn: this coming spring and summer where it's going to be
Aaron Colyn: pushing our production heavily. We're excited for that. To really
Aaron Colyn: push the limits of styles we do and how many
Aaron Colyn: seasonal beers we can crank out of our small brewery.
Aaron Colyn: So it's exciting.
Aaron: Yeah. Then how was the community's response when you finally opened?
Aaron Colyn: The community's response was awesome. I mean, we had people
Aaron Colyn: knocking on our door way before we were open. The
Aaron Colyn: way with opening a brewery, and I'm sure a lot
Aaron Colyn: of people have had this happen to them, the goalpost keeps moving
Aaron Colyn: as far as when you're going to open.
Aaron: Did you make the mistake of printing a sign saying, "
Aaron: Coming this spring," and then you opened in the fall
Aaron: or put ...
Aaron Colyn: We said, " Coming soon." That was appropriate. I don't think by
Aaron Colyn: many people's standards, that was really soon by the time
Aaron Colyn: we actually opened. We really purposely avoided a hard date.
Aaron Colyn: Our idea was when things are perfect, we will open.
Aaron Colyn: I don't want to be forced, by the community. I
Aaron Colyn: don't want to be forced by our financial needs. I don't want to
Aaron Colyn: be forced by anything to open. I just want everything
Aaron Colyn: to be perfect and has to be happy with it.
Aaron: And open with more than one or two beers on
Aaron: tap here.
Aaron Colyn: Exactly, yeah. We were able to open with our four
Aaron Colyn: core beers on and a full kitchen menu. It wasn't like, "
Aaron Colyn: Food's coming soon." It was like, " No, these are the
Aaron Colyn: foods we do and we're doing them just as good
Aaron Colyn: as we will in the next couple months," right on
Aaron Colyn: day one.
Aaron: Right. In that time, what have you learned from the
Aaron: community's response?
Aaron Colyn: So much, so much. I think, as an owner, I've
Aaron Colyn: taken a hardcore fast crash course on everything you can
Aaron Colyn: imagine. I know how our pizza oven works and I
Aaron Colyn: know how to replace parts on that. A lot of
Aaron Colyn: plumbing, electrical, and brew house related things that I wouldn't
Aaron Colyn: have really been technical enough to know, I just know.
Aaron Colyn: I know our mill, taking our mill apart, taking our
Aaron Colyn: heat exchanger apart. The things that like you don't realize
Aaron Colyn: but you become an expert on the things that break
Aaron Colyn: really frequently or cause you hiccup. There's a lot of
Aaron Colyn: that technical knowledge. But I think we have a team
Aaron Colyn: now of 19 people here and working with such a
Aaron Colyn: dynamic team. There's so many different people, they communicate differently,
Aaron Colyn: they have different needs, they don't all respond the same
Aaron Colyn: way. I mean, it's a beautiful thing because it's what
Aaron Colyn: makes our team so lively and engaging for our customers
Aaron Colyn: too, because we have such deep relationships with a lot
Aaron Colyn: of the regulars that come in here. Working with that
Aaron Colyn: many people, everyday is a learning process. There's so many opportunities
Aaron Colyn: to figure out the best ways to communicate with people
Aaron Colyn: and the best ways to tackle any conflicts or issues
Aaron Colyn: that arise. It's something every business owner has to deal
Aaron Colyn: with. I'm really happy with our team and how we
Aaron Colyn: really look out for each other and see everything from
Aaron Colyn: each other's point of view. That's been really inspiring, as
Aaron Colyn: well as just this huge opportunity to learn these people
Aaron Colyn: skills that you might not have had access to otherwise.
Aaron: Right. Then what about the beer then? Are you packaging anything sending
Aaron: it anyway or is it just out of here?
Aaron Colyn: We made the decision really early on with help from
Aaron Colyn: a couple other breweries on the island that really pointed
Aaron Colyn: us in the direction of what model makes sense right
Aaron Colyn: now. For us, it was no packaging. So we were
Aaron Colyn: really inspired by those breweries that just worked so hard
Aaron Colyn: to keep their local community happy. I have to give
Aaron Colyn: a shout out to Cumberland Brewing Company because they've been
Aaron Colyn: doing this for a very long time. They have such
Aaron Colyn: a close knit community. They have the mountain biking community
Aaron Colyn: over there and they're so supportive of each other. It
Aaron Colyn: just builds this relationship where the community loves them and
Aaron Colyn: they love spending time there and they love the food.
Aaron Colyn: That was what we wanted. We wanted our local community
Aaron Colyn: to support us and we'll be looking out for them
Aaron Colyn: and they'll be looking out for us and everything else
Aaron Colyn: is just a cherry on top. In the tourism heavy
Aaron Colyn: season, we're very excited that new people are going to
Aaron Colyn: experience things and we love everyone coming and stopping in. We
Aaron Colyn: take care of our community and they'll take care of
Aaron Colyn: us. That was our model and that included before shipping
Aaron Colyn: pallets of cans or pallets of bombers across the province,
Aaron Colyn: I think, for some breweries that really works well, for
Aaron Colyn: us, I think it's a big loss of control. I
Aaron Colyn: feel I don't know what's going to happen with that
Aaron Colyn: beer, how it's going to be stored, how it's going to be
Aaron Colyn: perceived. I don't get to talk to the person that's
Aaron Colyn: taking a sip and tell them what went into it
Aaron Colyn: and why it's cool or why we're excited about it. It's
Aaron Colyn: just that opportunity to have a conversation and tell a
Aaron Colyn: story with people. That they try our beer is something we
Aaron Colyn: love. So if you come in, we're going to tell
Aaron Colyn: you about every single one of our beers, we're going
Aaron Colyn: to let you try them. We're going to tell you
Aaron Colyn: what went into them and we love that relationship with
Aaron Colyn: our customers. That being said, we have looked into perhaps
Aaron Colyn: doing limited runs because we have more and more people
Aaron Colyn: that want to take ... It's not about us sending, it's
Aaron Colyn: about people wanting to take it and show their friends
Aaron Colyn: and families. They're going on trips and they can't bring
Aaron Colyn: a growler and they would love some ...
Aaron: Or they would go into the coast and ...
Aaron Colyn: Exactly. They want to be a little more lightweight when
Aaron Colyn: they're bringing beer around than a growler. But so that's
Aaron Colyn: something we're looking into and it might be something that
Aaron Colyn: we end up looking at.
Aaron: Like a crowler option or something like that?
Aaron Colyn: Yeah. A lot of people are doing the crowler thing.
Aaron Colyn: I'm on the fence about crowlers just because I'm such a stickler
Aaron Colyn: for that repeatable, consistent, low oxygen. I want the beer
Aaron Colyn: to be in the best condition it possibly can be. Again, because
Aaron Colyn: once it leaves the building, we no longer have control
Aaron Colyn: over that experience when someone has the beer. I think,
Aaron Colyn: I've always liked ... 473 milk cans might be something we
Aaron Colyn: look at in the future.
Aaron: All right, cool. Well, if somebody was wanting to go down the
Aaron: path of opening up a brewery themselves would piece of advice you
Aaron: could give them?
Aaron Colyn: I think the biggest piece of advice I can give
Aaron Colyn: is who are you doing it for? Is it for
Aaron Colyn: the local community? Is it so you can send beer
Aaron Colyn: across BC? Across Canada? Figure out who the people are
Aaron Colyn: that you want to keep as your customers and figure
Aaron Colyn: out why. I think, a lot of people now we're
Aaron Colyn: getting to the point where there's a lot of breweries and you have
Aaron Colyn: to be very careful about what your plan of attack
Aaron Colyn: is for opening. What need are you filling? Where do
Aaron Colyn: you see yourself in the market? Are you pushing other
Aaron Colyn: people out or you're finding a new spot that isn't
Aaron Colyn: being ... A new kind of section in the market that's
Aaron Colyn: not being met? I just think it's now the time
Aaron Colyn: that we need to be careful about what kind of breweries
Aaron Colyn: we open or we're going to see more and more closing.
Aaron: If somebody was to come and visit Port Alberni, what's
Aaron: one of your favorite things to do around here when
Aaron: you're not here at the brewery?
Aaron Colyn: There's a lot of cool stuff here. This is the thing that I
Aaron Colyn: always push to people when they come to Port Alberni, if
Aaron Colyn: they're making like a trip out of it, something really
Aaron Colyn: neat is there's a tugboat that has been converted into a
Aaron Colyn: bed and breakfast. It sits down at the harbor. A
Aaron Colyn: lovely couple, Dan and Bushra, own it. They do a
Aaron Colyn: dinner party where you can buy seats to this three-
Aaron Colyn: course, four- course dinner. They only see 12 people a
Aaron Colyn: night. It's not like a menu you get to choose
Aaron Colyn: from, you just get what they make. She is a
Aaron Colyn: classically trained French Moroccan chef. The food is amazing. It's
Aaron Colyn: a cool experience. Dan is very into Belgian beers. He's
Aaron Colyn: got some really neat stuff in his collection. It's just
Aaron Colyn: always, just an amazing time that you wouldn't expect to
Aaron Colyn: have in a small community like Port Alberni. It's really
Aaron Colyn: classy and it's so weird to be on a tugboat
Aaron Colyn: having that experience but it's very cool. It's called Swept
Aaron Colyn: Away Inn. That's something that I always like people to
Aaron Colyn: at least do some research on and look into it
Aaron Colyn: because it's so cool.
Aaron: All right. Brilliant. Thanks, Aaron. First double double Aaron episode
Aaron: that I've done.
Aaron Colyn: Aarons, yeah.
Aaron: I know, right.
Aaron Colyn: Right.
Aaron: Thank you so much for your time.
Aaron Colyn: Yeah. Thanks for having me.
Aaron: Big thanks to Aaron for his time. Had a great time
Aaron: there and I had a great lunch as well. I'm
Aaron: really looking forward to going back and visiting the brewery
Aaron: again. All right, time to check out the second brewery
Aaron: that's located in Port Alberni. I stopped by Dog Mountain Brewing.
Andy Richards: Andy Richards, President and Co- Owner of Dog Mountain Brewing.
Robin Miles: Robin Miles, Vice President and Head Brewer at Dog Mountain Brewing.
Aaron: All right. Dog Mountain in Port Alberni, beautiful location. How
Aaron: long have you guys been open for?
Andy Richards: We opened on December 28th, 2019.
Aaron: Right. So just a few weeks.
Andy Richards: Yeah. A couple months.
Aaron: Couple of months.
Robin Miles: 10 weeks to be exact.
Andy Richards: Right. At the time of taping.
Aaron: At the time of taping, yes. How long is this project been in
Aaron: the works for?
Andy Richards: We purchased the building in June of 2018. Then went
Andy Richards: through our permitting process and renovations and all that. It
Andy Richards: took about a year and a half from when we
Andy Richards: started the planning to opening day.
Aaron: How did beer find you?
Robin Miles: Well, the very first thing, I guess, to say about how beer found us
Robin Miles: is for Christmas, 2015 maybe, I bought Andy a very
Robin Miles: low quality Mr. Beer Home Brew Kit and he made
Robin Miles: a terrible Mexican lager. Like the (inaudible) people we
Robin Miles: are, we drank it and it was really bad. But
Robin Miles: it was a lot of fun and we really liked
Robin Miles: creating beer. Even before that, we both really liked drinking
Robin Miles: beer. I guess that's how this whole project found us.
Aaron: I mean, that's quite a leap from a Mr. Beer
Aaron: to a brewery. I mean, was there anything in between that?
Andy Richards: Yes. We were living in Alberta for ... I was there
Andy Richards: for nine years and I'm from the islands so we
Andy Richards: knew we wanted to move back here at some point.
Andy Richards: We decided, while we were in Alberta, that Robin would
Andy Richards: need something to do when we moved out here and jobs
Andy Richards: can be a little more difficult to get here so
Andy Richards: we kind of knew we had to open our own
Andy Richards: business. We really had a decision to make on what
Andy Richards: we wanted it to be and what we wanted to
Andy Richards: do with our time. We love beer and Robin's a
Andy Richards: scientist so we decided Robin would go to school and
Andy Richards: become a brewer.
Aaron: A beer scientist.
Robin Miles: Well, I have a biological science degree from the University
Robin Miles: of Alberta. While I was there, I managed a yeast
Robin Miles: biotechnology lab. So I learned a lot about the process,
Robin Miles: just yeast in general, everything about it. And I interacted
Robin Miles: with a lot of very, very smart people there. I
Robin Miles: learned a lot there. Then yeah, I ran a store
Robin Miles: at the U of A, a central store as well, departmental, inside
Robin Miles: sales kind of thing. So I had a little bit
Robin Miles: of sales and purchasing kind of experience.
Aaron: Inventory.
Robin Miles: Yeah, yeah. Then when we moved, leaving Edmonton, we were like, " Well,
Robin Miles: we can't move directly to the island. We had no
Robin Miles: jobs or anything." Andy was lucky enough to get a
Robin Miles: good transfer within his company to a different section to
Robin Miles: Surrey. So we moved to Maple Ridge, which was beautiful
Robin Miles: but not at all what we were going for. We
Robin Miles: wanted to move out of Edmonton to get to live
Robin Miles: on the beautiful island and live the island life. While we were
Robin Miles: there, Andy worked and paid all the bills and I
Robin Miles: went to SFU and I did the Craft Beer Fundamentals Program, which
Robin Miles: was fantastic. While there, we both met some really great
Robin Miles: people through the Van Brewers actually and made some connections
Robin Miles: and I got a job offer at Russell. I went
Robin Miles: on as the third assistant brewer only for maybe four
Robin Miles: months, because in that time, we were looking for this
Robin Miles: building and we found it and we moved immediately. We only
Robin Miles: lived in Maple Ridge for six months and we got the heck
Robin Miles: out of there.
Aaron: All right. You said from the island, so Port Alberni is your
Aaron: original home?
Andy Richards: I grew up in Victoria. I lived in Victoria until
Andy Richards: I was 25. Then I was studying to be a
Andy Richards: heavy duty mechanic so I went to college at Camosun
Andy Richards: College in Victoria and decided that ... At that time, the
Andy Richards: market in Alberta was strong in the oil and gas
Andy Richards: sector so I went out there and did my apprenticeship out
Andy Richards: there in that sector and ended up managing a shop and
Andy Richards: having a few employees that way and kind of getting
Andy Richards: my feet wet in the management side there and then
Andy Richards: I got into sales selling truck engine parts to truck
Andy Richards: dealers. That was about it. We moved out to the
Andy Richards: mainland and the rest, I guess is history.
Aaron: Right. Was there any other communities on the island that
Aaron: you were looking for a brewery spot at?
Andy Richards: Yeah. We looked everywhere on the island. I followed real
Andy Richards: estate prices in all areas of the island for the
Andy Richards: entire time I was gone because I knew we were
Andy Richards: going to come back. Then we actually had plans to
Andy Richards: go to Cumberland and we had a purchase lined up
Andy Richards: for a building there that ended up falling through. We
Andy Richards: didn't really plan to come to Port Alberni, it was
Andy Richards: just like here and their building popped up and the price
Andy Richards: was right so we quickly came here and looked at
Andy Richards: it. Actually, the realtor brought me out back and showed
Andy Richards: me what the view could be from the patio. Just
Andy Richards: as he was saying the words rooftop patio, it dawned
Andy Richards: on me that this was the perfect building for us
Andy Richards: to buy and build a giant rooftop patio on.
Aaron: And it is a giant rooftop patio. Yeah, yeah. What do
Aaron: you have squeezed in the back there, Robin, in terms
Aaron: of the brew house and stuff?
Robin Miles: Well, we got a really a good deal on some (inaudible)
Robin Miles: equipment. We put in a seven barrel brew house.
Robin Miles: It's a three vessels system so we have a great big
Robin Miles: HLT that's good for all our hot water needs. We
Robin Miles: have five, well, I guess you would call them seven
Robin Miles: barrel fermenters but we jam as much in there as
Robin Miles: possible. We often have very messy blowouts. Yeah, it's all
Robin Miles: electric. We had to do some major, major upgrades for
Robin Miles: the electrical to the building. We have 800 amps coming to
Robin Miles: the building now, but it's worth it because the system
Robin Miles: is fantastic. No makeup air or anything like that. We
Robin Miles: have a little test batch system that we love to
Robin Miles: use. That's what we were brewing on when we were home brewing, too.
Robin Miles: It's a little 10 gallon system. We have a lot
Robin Miles: of fun with that.
Aaron: Did you have a certain style of beer in mind
Aaron: when you were opening and has that changed since opening?
Robin Miles: I would say that we decided quite early on ... Even
Robin Miles: though there are a lot of really fantastic crazy beers
Robin Miles: out there that a lot of people like, we found when
Robin Miles: we did our market research that the island might be
Robin Miles: a little bit of a different market just based on
Robin Miles: the breweries that are here. You can forget about Victoria
Robin Miles: because they're a totally different animal. But everywhere else craft
Robin Miles: beer is still quite new and we didn't want to
Robin Miles: come up here and assume that everybody wanted to have
Robin Miles: milkshake IPAs, which are great but it's a different market
Robin Miles: here. So we decided that we really wanted to make
Robin Miles: beer that people want to drink, beer that everybody can drink.
Robin Miles: We do have people coming in here that are like, "
Robin Miles: I drink Lucky, what can I have?" We have a
Robin Miles: really great lager on tap and we plan on having it
Robin Miles: all the time, year round, always in the tank. That's
Robin Miles: kind of, I guess, the direction we're taking. All that
Robin Miles: being said though, Andy just designed a really nice recipe
Robin Miles: to make a dry hops sour this morning. So we
Robin Miles: are going to be making other beers but to get
Robin Miles: off the ground, just a good solid lineup. A lot
Robin Miles: of these beers that we have on now, we have room
Robin Miles: for 12 taps. We plan on carrying a lot of
Robin Miles: them, maybe four of them all the time. It's hard
Robin Miles: to say which ones for sure just because we've only
Robin Miles: been open for a couple of months, but ...
Aaron: Spring tourism season (crosstalk)
Robin Miles: Yeah. It's going to be a little different and harder to keep up
Robin Miles: with some of the tourists that come in, I think.
Aaron: Are there plans to package your beer or is it
Aaron: just going to serve the taproom? What are you doing?
Andy Richards: We're focused mostly on ourselves because we have a small
Andy Richards: system for brewing and a large capacity on our rooftop
Andy Richards: patio. Packaged product is definitely secondary for us. We've started
Andy Richards: selling to some hospitality customers. We haven't really chased it
Andy Richards: too hard. I mean, we're new but our thing is
Andy Richards: kind of taking care of ourselves first. And we don't
Andy Richards: want to sign on a bunch of people on draft
Andy Richards: accounts and then disappoint them in the summertime when we
Andy Richards: can't meet that demand anymore.
Aaron: Yeah, because you just haven't experienced that yet.
Andy Richards: Yeah, exactly. Ourselves first and then if we can ... My
Andy Richards: goal is to have a couple draft accounts in each
Andy Richards: town along the island but we have no plans to
Andy Richards: can a bunch of beer and ship it to the
Andy Richards: interior or trans province or anything like that.
Aaron: Right.
Robin Miles: We do however have a very well- used single can
Robin Miles: seamer that we canned all of our homebrew stuff in
Robin Miles: and a pallet of tall cans and labels that have
Robin Miles: been approved. So we do have this little fridge here.
Robin Miles: We're going to be offering cans to go from here
Robin Miles: only. We are the last spot to pick up any
Robin Miles: liquor on the way to Bamfield. They got to drive
Robin Miles: up this road. We're going to maybe start pushing that
Robin Miles: here if we can get some cans in the fridge.
Robin Miles: I think that would be a ... You know, not making us a whole bunch of money
Robin Miles: but I think it's a really good service to offer to people
Robin Miles: then we'll get them coming back when they come back through.
Aaron: I mean, it's only been a few weeks but how's
Aaron: the community's response been?
Andy Richards: Really, really good. Yeah, it's been awesome. Yeah, we're just
Andy Richards: so happy with how the community has embraced us. We
Andy Richards: weren't from here. We came here specifically to do this
Andy Richards: project and it's been really great. While we were doing
Andy Richards: construction, we would have people driving by yelling at us
Andy Richards: and honking their horns. It's such a great community. When
Andy Richards: you come to a small town like this, they really
Andy Richards: embrace you, and you're probably not going to get your
Andy Richards: picture in the paper in Vancouver if you open another
Andy Richards: brewery. It's just it's been really great here.
Aaron: Then along with your beers, you do have this kitchen
Aaron: in the back. What are you serving up out of the kitchen?
Andy Richards: We have a fairly simple but delicious menu. Our mainstay
Andy Richards: is our donair that we make ourselves in house. We have
Andy Richards: the donair, we have a bunch of grilled sandwiches and stir
Andy Richards: fry Buddha Bowl and pretzel and beer cheese. It's all
Andy Richards: really good stuff. Butcher quality meats, bakery, breads, really local
Andy Richards: produce. It's great.
Robin Miles: I do want to say that we do have vegan
Robin Miles: and gluten- free options. That was something that, as we were opening, people
Robin Miles: on social media and friends were telling us we needed
Robin Miles: to do all this stuff. Everybody's full of all this
Robin Miles: advice, and you're like, " Oh, my God. Stop. I need
Robin Miles: to plan the business." We thought that people were ... I
Robin Miles: didn't believe that we would have as many vegetarian people
Robin Miles: or vegans or people that needed gluten- free. I'm really
Robin Miles: glad that we did listen to a few of those
Robin Miles: people so we do have those options now and it turns
Robin Miles: out it's quite important to have. Andy and I both are
Robin Miles: meatatarians. It's one of those things where I was like, " Nobody will
Robin Miles: want a vegan sandwich." Well, it turns out they do
Robin Miles: so I think that's good to know.
Aaron: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally. The patio is not 100%
Aaron: done yet, but how many people can you get up
Aaron: there? And are there going to be any attractions in
Aaron: the summer that you're doing up there?
Andy Richards: Yeah. So we have a capacity of 124 on the
Andy Richards: rooftop patio. We currently have seating for 50 to 60.
Andy Richards: We have integrated some benches around the outside and we
Andy Richards: have a bunch of picnic tables under cover. It's about
Andy Richards: 40% covered and heated. Then we're in the process of
Andy Richards: building seating for another about 40 people. So we should
Andy Richards: comfortably seat our capacity of 124. Whether or not we
Andy Richards: allow it to get to that and are able to
Andy Richards: serve enough beer and food for that many people comfortably
Andy Richards: is yet to be determined.
Aaron: Yeah. I should know there is a downstairs bar and
Aaron: an upstairs bar so you don't have to keep going
Aaron: up and down, up and down.
Andy Richards: Yeah. It was really the focus of our project, was
Andy Richards: building that rooftop patio. Well, we definitely put far more
Andy Richards: into building the patio than we did the interior of
Andy Richards: the building. So the interior is kind of utilitarian and
Andy Richards: the patio is very nicely finished and rustic, finished with
Andy Richards: style. We have a bar with the same 12 taps
Andy Richards: as we do in the tap room. We have two
Andy Richards: bathrooms, we have the provisions for live music, which is
Andy Richards: going to be a staple of the summertime. It's just
Andy Richards: going to be great.
Aaron: The sunset is right on your patio, too.
Andy Richards: Yeah. The sun sets directly in front of us and
Andy Richards: we have a view of the Alberni Valley and the
Andy Richards: inlet that is absolutely stunning.
Aaron: Yes. Yes, it is. If somebody was to come here
Aaron: and visit, what would be the experience you want them to
Aaron: leave with? The idea stuck in their mind?
Robin Miles: Wow. That's kind of hard to say. We've had a
Robin Miles: lot of people come through and they come in the
Robin Miles: tasting room and it's full and they're a little disappointed.
Robin Miles: Then once we say, " Well, there's room on the patio," and everybody
Robin Miles: is very surprised. They go up there and, nowhere to
Robin Miles: lie, everybody is amazed. They walk around that corner from
Robin Miles: the stairs and they see the cover and the lighting
Robin Miles: and the tables. We really hit that part, I think.
Robin Miles: For us, I want people to come here and frankly,
Robin Miles: maybe some low expectations. It doesn't look extraordinary down here.
Robin Miles: Our draft tower is pretty cool down here.
Aaron: That's a very creative venue, too so (crosstalk)
Robin Miles: But then I want them to leave amazed. They're going
Robin Miles: to go upstairs, they're going to be like, " What?" Then
Robin Miles: they get table service so that's a different thing we
Robin Miles: do upstairs, too. We really are focused on customer service
Robin Miles: up there. Not standing at the bar, waiting for your
Robin Miles: drinks and things like that. Sit down, get comfortable, enjoy
Robin Miles: the view. We'll bring you beer. I want them to
Robin Miles: leave surprised, to be like they never expected this. Because
Robin Miles: there's nothing else like it here. There's not very many
Robin Miles: places like that. Specifically our patio on the island and
Robin Miles: we really tried to be different and we want people
Robin Miles: to leave remembering that and thinking that.
Aaron: Yeah. Well, cool. If somebody was wanting to open up a
Aaron: brewery themselves, what would be some advice you can give them?
Andy Richards: I would say, find a community that you know is
Andy Richards: going to embrace you and maybe doesn't have a lot
Andy Richards: of breweries in it already. Choose a spot that is
Andy Richards: in the worst location that you can find so that
Andy Richards: you get a good deal on your real estate and
Andy Richards: try to buy the building. That has been the footing
Andy Richards: of our business. It's allowed us to have more stable
Andy Richards: and favorable loans. It's going to build you wealth over
Andy Richards: the long term and it's just a better investment than
Andy Richards: making some landlord rich in downtown Vancouver.
Aaron: Yeah. Robin, as a yeast specialist, do you have any
Aaron: special strains back there that you haven't used yet or
Aaron: any particular yeast that you're going to work in the
Aaron: mix here?
Robin Miles: Well, I don't know. I would just say that we're very lucky
Robin Miles: that we were able to modify some of our recipes
Robin Miles: that we had already been home brewing and test batching
Robin Miles: and use a lot of the new Norwegian strains that
Robin Miles: are out there. It's hard for breweries that are already
Robin Miles: established. Possibly, tasting rooms haven't been around, the lounges for a
Robin Miles: very long time and they're all stuck doing a lot
Robin Miles: of production so they can't just change their recipe and
Robin Miles: use a yeast that makes your beer grain to glass
Robin Miles: in five days. We're doing a lot of work with
Robin Miles: different strains, really having a lot of fun with that.
Robin Miles: But other than that, not really. There's nothing really weird
Robin Miles: back there. We're staying away from things like Brettanomyces. We
Robin Miles: try to have, like I said, a lot ofvery clean,
Robin Miles: sessionable beers, low alcohol and God forbid, we did get
Robin Miles: an infection, it's just not ... We're not interested in doing that.
Aaron: Because a very tiny space, it'd be rampant quickly back there.
Robin Miles: Yes. We have a very strict cleaning protocol. If you
Robin Miles: saw it, it's tight back there. We got to keep things
Robin Miles: clean and organized.
Aaron: All right. Well, thank you very much for your time. Really
Aaron: appreciate it. Definitely going to come back when the patio
Aaron: is completely finished and really enjoy that. But I mean, I'm going to enjoy it
Aaron: now in the sunshine. I mean, I'd be ridiculous if
Aaron: I ran away.
Robin Miles: Awesome.
Andy Richards: Right on. Thank you.
Robin Miles: Thanks for coming.
Aaron: Thanks to Andy and Robin for their time. Really appreciate
Aaron: it. It was a beautiful day there and that was
Aaron: such an awesome patio. I cannot wait to go back
Aaron: and see that patio fully done and be able to enjoy
Aaron: the view and just look down the valley with some
Aaron: really nice beer and something from their awesome kitchen as
Aaron: well. We're really looking forward to going back and visiting both
Aaron: Twin City and Dog Mountain Brewing. Just before we go,
Aaron: I want to thank the BC Ale Trail again for
Aaron: making this episode possible. Check them out. As well as
Aaron: the other new app at bcaletrail. ca. If you like
Aaron: what you heard today I do hope you get subscribed wherever you've
Aaron: been listening to this podcast. If you want more details
Aaron: about other Brewery's past episodes, anything of that matter, go
Aaron: to the website, cascadian. beer. Thank you so much again
Aaron: for your time and listening to this podcast series. I
Aaron: really do appreciate it. And until next time, remember, support
Aaron: your local.