Speaker 1: Hey, before we get started, I want to give a
Speaker 1: big shout out to our newest Patreon members Sarah, marag,
Speaker 1: Alison E, Ryan, s Marina, Ashley, and Karen M. Thanks
Speaker 1: so much to all of you, and thanks so much
Speaker 1: to all of our Patreon members. If you'd like to
Speaker 1: experience being a Patreon member and all the benefits that
Speaker 1: come with it, go to One You Feed dot Net
Speaker 1: slash join. I'm really so curious about why we have
Speaker 1: leaned into generationally these choices to other each other. I
Speaker 1: wonder if maybe it would just be too overwhelming to
Speaker 1: truly love everyone. But I'd like to see what would
Speaker 1: happen if we tried. Welcome to the one you feed.
Speaker 1: Throughout time, great thinkers have recognized the importance of the
Speaker 1: thoughts we have, quotes like garbage in, garbage out, or
Speaker 1: you are what you think ring true, And yet for
Speaker 1: many of us, our thoughts don't strengthen or empower us.
Speaker 1: We tend toward negativity, self pity, jealousy, or fear. We
Speaker 1: see what we don't have instead of what we do.
Speaker 1: We think things that hold us back and dampen our spirit.
Speaker 1: But it's not just about thinking. Our actions matter. It
Speaker 1: takes conscious, consistent and creative effort to make a life
Speaker 1: worth living. This podcast is about how other people keep
Speaker 1: themselves moving in the right direction, how they feed their
Speaker 1: good wolf. Thanks for joining us. Our guest on this
Speaker 1: episode is Sophia Bush, an American actress, activist, director, producer.
Speaker 1: You may know her name from playing Brooke Davis in
Speaker 1: the show One Tree Hill or as Aaron Lindsay in
Speaker 1: the NBA see police drama series Chicago p D. She's
Speaker 1: known for her philanthropy work, social activism and what she
Speaker 1: has is a really amazing mind, which you are about
Speaker 1: to hear. Hi, Sophia, Welcome to the show. Hi Eric,
Speaker 1: how are you. I am doing very well. I am
Speaker 1: really happy to have you on. We're going to have
Speaker 1: a wide ranging conversation about a lot of different things today,
Speaker 1: but we'll start like we always do, with the parable.
Speaker 1: In the Parable, there is a grandmother who's talking with
Speaker 1: her granddaughter and she says, in life, there are two
Speaker 1: wolves inside of us that are always at battle. One
Speaker 1: is a good wolf, which represents things like kindness and
Speaker 1: bravery and love, and the other is a bad wolf,
Speaker 1: which represents things like greed and hatred and fear. And
Speaker 1: the granddaughter stops and she thinks about it for a second,
Speaker 1: and she looks up at her grandmother, and she's a grandmother.
Speaker 1: Which one wins? And the grandmother says, the one you feed.
Speaker 1: So I'd like to start off by asking you what
Speaker 1: that parable means to you in your life and in
Speaker 1: the work that you do. It means a lot of
Speaker 1: things to me. I think one of the most important
Speaker 1: is this notion that both of those extremes, both ends
Speaker 1: of the emotional spectrum, are within us all the time,
Speaker 1: and that I think there's an incredible opportunity for redemption
Speaker 1: and for growth in the notion of which one you feed,
Speaker 1: because I think it works much more like a pendulum
Speaker 1: than something that's just black and white. And if you've
Speaker 1: had a day that's filled with frustration or anger, if
Speaker 1: you find yourself feeling terrified or competitive, you can feed
Speaker 1: the gratitude. You can feed the curiosity, you can feed
Speaker 1: the humanity, you can feed the willingness to learn something.
Speaker 1: And I think that the reason that that parable really
Speaker 1: resonates with me, and I would imagine with so many people,
Speaker 1: is that it reminds you that you always have the
Speaker 1: chance to begin again and feed the best of yourself.
Speaker 1: I love that idea that we always have the chance
Speaker 1: to begin again. One of the things I love about
Speaker 1: the parable is that it sort of makes it sound like,
Speaker 1: you know what, both these things are going to be
Speaker 1: here on a pretty regular basis, And so it normalizes
Speaker 1: the human element of that. And so when we realize
Speaker 1: we've been feeding one and we go, okay, I can
Speaker 1: just change direction, like you said, start again. Yeah, Because
Speaker 1: I think there's a desire and I don't mean to
Speaker 1: dismiss our desires to be good, but there is a
Speaker 1: desire that I think can feel a bit juvenile to
Speaker 1: be perfect, to only be positive. You hear conversations about
Speaker 1: toxic positivity now in the same way that we're talking
Speaker 1: about toxic masculinity and systems of oppression, and this idea
Speaker 1: that we're only bright and shiny is actually, I think
Speaker 1: quite dangerous to us, this idea that we're supposed to
Speaker 1: ignore or turn away from. The quote bad emotions, you know,
Speaker 1: from our fear, from our anxiety, from our jealousy, or
Speaker 1: our feeling of being lost or small at times. I
Speaker 1: think that's what makes those feelings into foundations. When you
Speaker 1: have a thought and it's bad, and so you keep
Speaker 1: it as a secret. Secrets solidify things, and so I
Speaker 1: think part of my journey as an adult is to
Speaker 1: find the places where I have been angry or fearful
Speaker 1: and try to nurture that part of myself. It feels
Speaker 1: very young, that part, but I think if we can
Speaker 1: accept quote the bad, it ceases to be a boogeyman
Speaker 1: and it's just, you know, it's another like kid in
Speaker 1: the room. I think about adulthood as learning to be
Speaker 1: the pilot of the station wagon of all the younger
Speaker 1: versions of yourself. You've piled them all in the car,
Speaker 1: and if you make the quote unquote bad into the
Speaker 1: one you try to keep in the trunk, you turn
Speaker 1: it into a monster rather than just another passenger. Yep.
Speaker 1: And I think you speak to that really well in
Speaker 1: your podcast, and when I've heard you speak in different places,
Speaker 1: the line you said something along the lines of everyone
Speaker 1: wakes up in the morning and wishes they looked a
Speaker 1: little different than they do and wishes they had a
Speaker 1: little more energy than they do. And I think that's
Speaker 1: such a normalizing concept to hear it from people, that
Speaker 1: a lot of folks would look up at you and think, oh, well,
Speaker 1: she has it all right. And I love this idea
Speaker 1: that we all have that element in us of going,
Speaker 1: you know what, I can always wish I looked a
Speaker 1: little bit better. I can always wish I felt a
Speaker 1: little bit better. I can always wish I was a
Speaker 1: little less afraid. But these are just part of being
Speaker 1: human and we're never exempt from them. Exactly in a way,
Speaker 1: it's gamified, and it's gamified because if we're insecure, we
Speaker 1: want to buy more stuff we don't need. And it's
Speaker 1: gamified because we all live on our phones. We we
Speaker 1: swipe through screens, we toggle um the social media even
Speaker 1: like a video game, and we look at all these
Speaker 1: flat versions of people and we think, well, that person
Speaker 1: really has it together. Their family seems great, their career
Speaker 1: feels awesome. And yet everyone you talk to who's a
Speaker 1: three dimensional human in their world says, oh, yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: completely terrified about this and I'm anxious about that. And
Speaker 1: working on this thing has been so stressful, fulfilling, and
Speaker 1: I feel grateful, but man, it was hard, and you
Speaker 1: realize there's just so much more color and reality to it.
Speaker 1: And what's very interesting for me as a person who
Speaker 1: believes vulnerability is important to us as humans. And also
Speaker 1: who lives a partially public life because of what I
Speaker 1: do for work is I see how easy it is
Speaker 1: for me to gamify other people's two dimensional profiles, and
Speaker 1: I'm on the receiving end of how painful it can
Speaker 1: be when people do that with me, because what I
Speaker 1: see is this very understandable opening for where people are
Speaker 1: in pain, where they say, oh, well, that person's got
Speaker 1: at all. So I'm going to send them a really
Speaker 1: ship message. I'm going to knock that person off their pedestal.
Speaker 1: But a pedestal is something other people put you on.
Speaker 1: It's not something you feel that you're on at all.
Speaker 1: You're just a three dimensional person in your life, whatever
Speaker 1: your life is. And so I'm I'm really fascinated by
Speaker 1: where we find ourselves in this moment of evolution and
Speaker 1: expansion in terms of consciousness and the way that we
Speaker 1: have been reared in an environment that has these psychosocial
Speaker 1: storytelling tendencies that can make us not see each other.
Speaker 1: To me, that's that's the wolf I don't want to feed.
Speaker 1: Do you find any challenges in presenting sort of all
Speaker 1: the versions of yourself and also promoting the work that
Speaker 1: you do out in the entertainment world. Yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: I'm curious how you navigate sort of those challenges because
Speaker 1: the nature of a public life as an actress, as
Speaker 1: a podcaster much less so, right, is that we are
Speaker 1: sort of promoting our work, yet also underneath it, there's
Speaker 1: so much more to us than sort of that image
Speaker 1: that gets pushed out. My work is what I do,
Speaker 1: and I really love it, but it isn't who I am.
Speaker 1: And I find that it's quite impossible to only promote
Speaker 1: work because then I feel like a sideshow act, you know,
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm a performer in a circus rather
Speaker 1: than a person. And for me, in my human experience
Speaker 1: and in experience as I've been able to investigate and
Speaker 1: share and discuss with so many people, one of the
Speaker 1: things that I think is most painful as a human
Speaker 1: is to feel unseen, to feel erased, And so I
Speaker 1: am unwilling to participate in my own erasure. And there
Speaker 1: are people who want me to behave like a sideshow
Speaker 1: act for their entertainment who really don't like that. I
Speaker 1: own my spaces and my channels as places where I
Speaker 1: freely express thought and learn in public and I am
Speaker 1: open for discourse. People really don't like when I set boundaries.
Speaker 1: I had a very far right group decided to really
Speaker 1: put a target on my back just after the New year,
Speaker 1: and so I shut down my comments section, and people
Speaker 1: really didn't like that either. But for me, that was
Speaker 1: protective of my energy, my space, and my boundaries and
Speaker 1: also my safety. So I see what people don't like
Speaker 1: about a person who's willing to be as wholly themselves
Speaker 1: as possible or is comfortable in their own space, and
Speaker 1: then also change the rules when they see fit. But
Speaker 1: I like less just standing up and saying, hey, this
Speaker 1: project is great, this show is cool. I don't feel
Speaker 1: fulfilled by that, and so I love to go out
Speaker 1: and talk about the work because every time I do work,
Speaker 1: I'm learning about people, and I crave spaces where there
Speaker 1: are deep connections and deep conversations. It's the reason I
Speaker 1: started a podcast, because soundbites from interviews always felt so
Speaker 1: shallow to me. You know, you'd talk to someone for
Speaker 1: thirty minutes and then you'd read three sentences of a
Speaker 1: hundred that you uttered in the article and go, oh,
Speaker 1: that feels weird. I guess I say all of this
Speaker 1: just to say, I find myself at a point where
Speaker 1: I understand that there's an ebb and flow to that
Speaker 1: to how comfortable I feel with it, how safe I
Speaker 1: feel doing it, and also to how empowered I can
Speaker 1: feel by choosing to be more whole out in the world.
Speaker 1: And then you know, there are things I try to
Speaker 1: keep to myself. I try to keep my family more
Speaker 1: for me. I try to keep my private life at
Speaker 1: least somewhat private, so that I have something that only
Speaker 1: has my hands on it that makes sense. I want
Speaker 1: to pivot to something that I heard you say in
Speaker 1: a conversation, and I love this, and it was sort
Speaker 1: of framed up in the sense of church, but you
Speaker 1: uttered this line that I thought was beautiful. It was
Speaker 1: what's my house of worship? Nature and what feels like
Speaker 1: church to me? Showing up? Can you share a little
Speaker 1: bit more. I was struck by those couple of lines.
Speaker 1: So I'm always amused at how expansive and thoughtful humans
Speaker 1: can be, and also how sometimes small our brains like
Speaker 1: to be. This idea that this is our planet and
Speaker 1: that we made it, this is our world. I just
Speaker 1: find hilarious the million of years of evolution that it
Speaker 1: took for us to be exactly here. And even if
Speaker 1: you come from a spiritual tradition where you believe that
Speaker 1: this was created by a person who we would, you know,
Speaker 1: give the visage of man that it wouldn't be miraculous
Speaker 1: the complete system, not just the human body, but the
Speaker 1: planet that it lives on and every creature on it,
Speaker 1: and and the way that they all worked together. I mean,
Speaker 1: I just spent a week on a nature reserve in
Speaker 1: New Mexico, and what they're finding is that if the
Speaker 1: ecosystem is not perfectly imbalanced, the entire thing falls apart.
Speaker 1: A type of trout in this New Mexico river system
Speaker 1: was on the verge of extinction because the wolves had
Speaker 1: been hunted out of New Mexico and without the predators
Speaker 1: for the elk, the elk had destroyed the river banks,
Speaker 1: and the river bank collapse was killing all of the trout.
Speaker 1: To me, what a perfect lesson in the fact that
Speaker 1: as man, as humankind, we want to control our environment
Speaker 1: so much that we destroy it. To me, there's nothing
Speaker 1: more holy or clarifying than getting out in an ecosystem
Speaker 1: and seeing how perfectly balanced it is and we're a
Speaker 1: part of it. We are not the controllers of it.
Speaker 1: We are not meant to harm it, we are not
Speaker 1: meant to bend it to our will. So yeah, nature,
Speaker 1: the environment that to me feels like a true house
Speaker 1: of worship. There's no bastardization of it or influence of
Speaker 1: money on it. And it's not lost on me that
Speaker 1: many organized religions have been controlled by finance and again
Speaker 1: by attempts at control, and largely by attempts at controlling women,
Speaker 1: rather than working in any kind of systematic or systemic flow.
Speaker 1: And I think that struck me as a kid who
Speaker 1: grew up in a family that is full of Catholics
Speaker 1: and Jews and Agnostics, and I went, hold on, how
Speaker 1: do all these people live together? And what do we
Speaker 1: really believe? And so studying Catholicism and then Christie anity
Speaker 1: deeply and Judaism deeply led me to study Islam deeply,
Speaker 1: led me to study Eastern traditions deeply, to learn transcendental
Speaker 1: meditation at three two, read the Upanishads and the rig
Speaker 1: Vedas and the data ching, and point of all of
Speaker 1: it is to be a steward of your natural community.
Speaker 1: And so for me, I think, if we can get
Speaker 1: out of these boxes, we put ourselves in and I'm right,
Speaker 1: you're wrong, and really pay attention to humans and our
Speaker 1: place on this earth, not our control of it. I
Speaker 1: think we would feel both more holy and more free.
Speaker 1: I see God everywhere when I'm in nature. I feel
Speaker 1: like humans want often to use God to control other humans,
Speaker 1: and so the difference in the energy and in the
Speaker 1: flow of those things feels really really clear to me.
Speaker 1: And I find the most holy interaction with other humans
Speaker 1: when I show up for them, and when I feel
Speaker 1: shown up for and again it feels like a way
Speaker 1: to stand and uphold someone's right to be a creature
Speaker 1: on this planet. Those for me, when I'm really at
Speaker 1: my best self, those feel like the places where spirituality
Speaker 1: and activism and being a good neighbor, you know, whether
Speaker 1: to my next door neighbor or the folks across town
Speaker 1: or the folks across the country. That's where those things
Speaker 1: feel really true for me. That term spirituality is used
Speaker 1: a lot of different ways. Is it a term that
Speaker 1: is personally meaningful to you? And if so, what does
Speaker 1: it mean to you? Yeah, spirituality feels incredibly meaningful to me,
Speaker 1: and I think also for me allows me to relinquish
Speaker 1: some desire for control or for an answer. There's so
Speaker 1: much wisdom and so much tradition that I think we
Speaker 1: could learn a lot from. Uh. I think we're seeing
Speaker 1: incredible flexibility and opening in a lot of these realms
Speaker 1: and spaces, whether it's interfaith groups or the incredible healing
Speaker 1: work we see, you know, scientific organizations like MAPS doing
Speaker 1: with psychedelics. You know, they're carrying veterans through PTSD, they're
Speaker 1: carrying women through deep sexual trauma. It's almost laughable to
Speaker 1: me because I grew up in an era where you know,
Speaker 1: I looked at the bad kids doing drugs and was like,
Speaker 1: and now I go, oh right, the Earth makes medicine
Speaker 1: that helps people heal from the things that people do
Speaker 1: to each other. Interesting, Okay, not lost on me. Not
Speaker 1: lost on me that some of those incredible traditions come
Speaker 1: from cultures that are indigenous, and that our indigenous population
Speaker 1: on planet Earth currently is estimated to be five of humans.
Speaker 1: Yet indigenous tribes are the stewards of of the planet's
Speaker 1: bio diversity. So for me, again, it just it just
Speaker 1: seems like a lightbulb, an indicator of a place to
Speaker 1: go and learn. And I'm enamored by modern science, and
Speaker 1: by literature and by all of these things. And yet
Speaker 1: I think there's also incredible wisdom in the spiritual traditions
Speaker 1: of communities that have historically cared for the earth as
Speaker 1: sacred and for me. And again, I know there's a
Speaker 1: million times a million kinds of belief sets in the world,
Speaker 1: But for me, real spirituality is holistic and includes nature
Speaker 1: and offers again and again the opportunity to feed the
Speaker 1: best of us. I want to turn learned that towards
Speaker 1: a phrase I heard you use. Again. I never remember
Speaker 1: where I hear these things, but you said something I
Speaker 1: thought was really interesting, and you described maturity as tenderness.
Speaker 1: Can you elaborate on that. That's a really interesting idea. Well,
Speaker 1: I think about that, even as it pertains to your
Speaker 1: previous question. For me, spiritual maturity is incredibly tender for
Speaker 1: the world around me and also holds space for not knowing.
Speaker 1: For me, anyway, as a kid who was always very
Speaker 1: anxious and very into solving problems and understanding outcomes, being
Speaker 1: okay with not having an answer requires some real maturity
Speaker 1: for me, holding space for so many things to be
Speaker 1: true at once, and so many things to be true
Speaker 1: that I don't even know yet requires a maturity, and
Speaker 1: I think when I can do that, when I really
Speaker 1: i'm leaning into that best part of myself, I find
Speaker 1: that my judgments are less judgy with myself and other people.
Speaker 1: I find that my anger, even at things that would
Speaker 1: make anyone justifiably angry, like injustice or suffering, my anger
Speaker 1: is less immediately fiery. And so for me, I really
Speaker 1: think that the capacity to be more tender, even in
Speaker 1: response to things that have caused me pain, the willingness
Speaker 1: to be curious as to why someone might harm another
Speaker 1: those things signal again, just for me, a maturity and
Speaker 1: real expansion of my emotional tool belt. Because it's less
Speaker 1: this makes me happy, this makes me angry, that makes
Speaker 1: me furious, and this feels exciting, and it's much more complex.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm much more capable of holding many questions and
Speaker 1: thoughts and feelings at the same time. I'm capable of
Speaker 1: spending time at a maximum security prison with the Anti
Speaker 1: Recidivism Coalition and sitting with groups of men who have
Speaker 1: done unspeakable harm to other people and seeing the absolute
Speaker 1: beauty and their humanity and in the work that they're
Speaker 1: doing to heal from their own generational emotional trauma to
Speaker 1: understand how they inflicted that trauma on their communities. That
Speaker 1: might sound like an extreme example, but we've all experienced that,
Speaker 1: you know. Even now, I'm working on a reunion project
Speaker 1: with some of my girlfriends who were my very first
Speaker 1: coworkers in the business, and and we talked about how
Speaker 1: we didn't have the vocabularies, we didn't have the emotional
Speaker 1: maturity as kids to not get caught up in certain things,
Speaker 1: to lead with vulnerability and just ask each other certain questions.
Speaker 1: We just didn't have it then and and we have
Speaker 1: it now. And what an amazing journey we've been on together,
Speaker 1: and what an amazing opportunity for deepening of a friendship.
Speaker 1: And I think in so many arenas, we can all
Speaker 1: look at ourselves and say, ah, I understand why that
Speaker 1: might have triggered me, or that might have made me
Speaker 1: suspicious of that person, or whatever fits in the fill
Speaker 1: in the plank, right, But to be able to look
Speaker 1: back with wisdom and with tenderness for yourself and for others,
Speaker 1: and to change your story. You know that that to
Speaker 1: me feels like maturity, That feels like healing, and and honestly,
Speaker 1: it feels spiritual because to undo the residue of what
Speaker 1: you've carried. You hear people say, especially in circles of
Speaker 1: women now, talking about unpacking this, you know, dangerously patriarchal society.
Speaker 1: People say, you know, if you heal it now, you
Speaker 1: heal it up your mother's lineage. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: conversation around changing what women and carry, and I think
Speaker 1: that that's honestly true for all of us as people,
Speaker 1: because I'm sure Eric that for you as a man,
Speaker 1: there are things that you carry that you want to undo,
Speaker 1: that you want to heal as well, just to be
Speaker 1: able to be an even more whole version of you.
Speaker 1: I don't want to generalize, but I do think after
Speaker 1: all the wonderful conversations I've been able to have in
Speaker 1: rooms I've been so privileged to be in, I think
Speaker 1: we all have stuff to unpack just from being little
Speaker 1: human beings alive on this big planet. I had a
Speaker 1: conversation with Rhysma Mannequin recently. He wrote a book called
Speaker 1: My Grandfather's Hands about racialized trauma, and what's really striking
Speaker 1: to me in the book is he talks about the
Speaker 1: trauma of being an African American here in the US.
Speaker 1: But he says, in order to understand that, you've got
Speaker 1: to go back to the trauma that white folks were
Speaker 1: inflicting upon white folks throughout the history of Europe, and
Speaker 1: so that that trauma started way back when and has
Speaker 1: been rolling downhill ever since. And so when we talk
Speaker 1: about intergenerational trauma, you know, he made a point said,
Speaker 1: most of the people who came to America were fleeing,
Speaker 1: and when you're fleeing something, it's generally because something not
Speaker 1: good has been happening to you. He wasn't doing it
Speaker 1: in a making excuses for thing. It was a holistic
Speaker 1: scene of, hey, you know, the trauma to your point,
Speaker 1: it just keeps kind of coming downhill, and everybody has
Speaker 1: some of it to unpack, and that if we can
Speaker 1: do that, I've often thought early in my life. My
Speaker 1: son graduated from college recently, but when he was young,
Speaker 1: I was so focused on just like, can I not
Speaker 1: pass on what my family has been carrying for generations?
Speaker 1: You know? Can I break that chain? It is kind
Speaker 1: of wild, isn't it? To consider the ways that human
Speaker 1: beings have for millennia harmed each other. For lack of
Speaker 1: a better term, it seems like it's our our species
Speaker 1: cross to bear. The visual that comes to mind is
Speaker 1: just it's like we're repeatedly smashing our head into the walls.
Speaker 1: I don't understand why we can't wake up to the
Speaker 1: fact that nothing except a healthy relationship to each other
Speaker 1: on this planet is real. I read this incredible book
Speaker 1: preparing for the TV show I'm Getting Ready to Go do.
Speaker 1: I'm playing a cardiothoracic surgeon, and so I went really
Speaker 1: deep into medical books and so much research, which for
Speaker 1: me was so fun. And I started with this book
Speaker 1: that Bill Bryson wrote, called The Body, because I loved
Speaker 1: the idea of starting with this, you know, history writer
Speaker 1: talking about systems and how would he get into real science.
Speaker 1: And he talks about at one of the labs he visited,
Speaker 1: sitting with a doctor who off of a cadaver, sliced
Speaker 1: a little postage stamp size square of skin that was
Speaker 1: and I might be misquoting because now I read this
Speaker 1: book a year and a half ago, but I think
Speaker 1: he's had something like seven or eight sheets of paper
Speaker 1: thick and when you held it up to the light,
Speaker 1: completely translucent. He had no idea what color this person
Speaker 1: was there was no way to tell. And he was
Speaker 1: so surprised by that. And the doctor looked at him
Speaker 1: and said, isn't that crazy. We've killed each other for
Speaker 1: generations over this. That's all it is, you know, past
Speaker 1: a few sheets of paper, it doesn't exist. And it
Speaker 1: it reminded me immediately of you know, when we were
Speaker 1: having these debates which I still can't believe, we had
Speaker 1: to have over marriage equality at the Supreme Court, and
Speaker 1: there was that photo that went around the internet, an
Speaker 1: X ray of two people kissing. So you just saw
Speaker 1: the skulls and you know, the little skeleton hands holding
Speaker 1: the faces. And the whole point was, you don't know
Speaker 1: who these people are. You don't know if this is
Speaker 1: a man and a man, or a woman and a woman,
Speaker 1: or a woman and a man, or two non binary folks.
Speaker 1: You don't know, and it doesn't matter. That's not the
Speaker 1: point of loving someone. I'm really so curious about why
Speaker 1: we have leaned into generationally these choices to other each other.
Speaker 1: I wonder if maybe it would just be too overwhelming
Speaker 1: to truly love everyone. But I'd like to see what
Speaker 1: would happen if we tried. Yeah, And I'm kind of
Speaker 1: curious as to whether we're evolving in that direction or not.
Speaker 1: For all the love of indigenous societies, which we should have,
Speaker 1: because there's a lot to revere there. You know, old
Speaker 1: societies were very much tribal in both the positive and
Speaker 1: the negative aspects of that word. There's some very positive
Speaker 1: aspects of that word. There's some negative aspects of that word,
Speaker 1: which is like you're either in or you're out, you know.
Speaker 1: And so I wonder whether it's something that we might
Speaker 1: be evolving towards. And I guess that's maybe a broader
Speaker 1: question to ask you, do you think as humans were
Speaker 1: getting better? Well, I think the issue is, Look, change
Speaker 1: is scary for people, whether it's good or bad. You know,
Speaker 1: there's all these studies that show that change causes stress,
Speaker 1: even if you've gotten a promotion, you know it's a
Speaker 1: good change. So I think it's understandable why we have
Speaker 1: such a hard time leaving our bad baggage outside the
Speaker 1: door and carrying only our good baggage through, you know,
Speaker 1: as we evolved, of as we age, as we move
Speaker 1: through generations. I get it. You know, I'm not trying
Speaker 1: to say I just have no idea why we're like this.
Speaker 1: But I also think we are on a natural trajectory
Speaker 1: toward enlightenment, a deepening education, more understanding. Even if you
Speaker 1: think about the advancements of science since you and I
Speaker 1: have been born, our understanding of things like dinosaurs and
Speaker 1: dark matter, and the societal effects of traumatic systems, the
Speaker 1: psychological research. I mean, even the way my mom talks
Speaker 1: to me about how I, as an eventual parent, will
Speaker 1: be armed with information that my parents generation just never
Speaker 1: had available. It makes me think of Dr King saying
Speaker 1: the moral arc of the universe is long, but it
Speaker 1: bends toward justice. We're meant to evolve for the better.
Speaker 1: So whether we're talking about feudal societies who used to
Speaker 1: you know, war in fields, we're not supposed to do
Speaker 1: that forever, I don't think. I think we're meant to
Speaker 1: trust the facts and the science and the social science
Speaker 1: and the psychological evolution of how to be better to
Speaker 1: each other while preserving the best of us, like knowledge
Speaker 1: of plants and the planet, how to keep ecosystems healthy,
Speaker 1: how to to harken back to my friends in the river,
Speaker 1: how to fish for what you need, not for excess
Speaker 1: so that you do harm. You know, I think that's
Speaker 1: the point. But it seems like we have a really
Speaker 1: hard time letting go of the bad and leaning into
Speaker 1: the good. And maybe that's the next wave. Maybe that's
Speaker 1: the job of our moment, is to unpack why we're
Speaker 1: so afraid to shed our bad baggage. You know. Maybe
Speaker 1: it's my kids generation that is going to undo another
Speaker 1: layer of that. I don't really know, but I do
Speaker 1: think we are evolving into a more or tender, into
Speaker 1: a more inclusive, into you know, hearts and years first society.
Speaker 1: And I think you can see that by this sort
Speaker 1: of death knell, you know, violent thing happening right now
Speaker 1: of the old guard, by this lean into authoritarian politics
Speaker 1: and into election interference and into voter suppression and into
Speaker 1: medical assault on oppressed people's. I mean to have historians
Speaker 1: say they've not seen anything like what's happening in America
Speaker 1: right now, like the actual era of Jim Crow. That
Speaker 1: is meaningful, that that's not based on a feeling, that's
Speaker 1: based on data and information, that's based on historical study.
Speaker 1: And I think that our movement toward justice, even if
Speaker 1: it feels like a very center, just this for a
Speaker 1: lot of people. I think the largest voter turnout in
Speaker 1: history and an America where people support universal background checks
Speaker 1: and believe in a woman's right to choose, and believe
Speaker 1: that oppression and systemic sexism and racism are bad. I
Speaker 1: think that terrifies the Old Guard, and I think, upon
Speaker 1: further inspection, the folks in the Old Guard, guys like
Speaker 1: you know, Mitch McConnell, who are literally trying to take
Speaker 1: America apart so they can remain in power. You need
Speaker 1: to have a real moment of self interrogation, because I
Speaker 1: bet you at the root of a lot of that
Speaker 1: is a he makes a lot of money, you know,
Speaker 1: being in power the way he is. So I'm sure
Speaker 1: that's part of it. But I also would imagine that
Speaker 1: at the root of the of that route, there's a
Speaker 1: part of him that's afraid that will do to him
Speaker 1: what he's done to us. Is he afraid that if
Speaker 1: the women are in charge or black people are in charge,
Speaker 1: that will do to him? You know, this old white
Speaker 1: guy who's been oppressive, who poses for photos in front
Speaker 1: of Confederate flags, does he ink will do to him
Speaker 1: what he's tried to do to us, what he's done
Speaker 1: to us? And if that's the fear perhaps it's time
Speaker 1: for him to admit that he shouldn't be in charge
Speaker 1: because he's been unjust. So it's a big question. I
Speaker 1: don't know if it's a clear answer, but I do
Speaker 1: believe in us, and I am not taking lightly the
Speaker 1: way our evolution for the better is being fought in
Speaker 1: policy right now. I've I find it to be really scary.
Speaker 1: You talked earlier about being able to hold two things
Speaker 1: in mind at the same time, and I often feel that.
Speaker 1: I feel like if I look at the arc of
Speaker 1: history as a whole, I look and I go, I
Speaker 1: think we're becoming better people, you know, I mean two
Speaker 1: hundred years ago, three hundred years ago, we would have
Speaker 1: had a debate about whether torture is okay broadly on
Speaker 1: a human scale, And now I think by and large
Speaker 1: most people would go, no, you shouldn't torture. There might
Speaker 1: be some subset would say, well, you know, there's a
Speaker 1: couple of situations where the ends justify the means, but
Speaker 1: broadly no, or just you know, when you look at
Speaker 1: there's still way too many people in slavery today, but
Speaker 1: in comparison historically, it's a completely different amount. So how
Speaker 1: do you hold on one hand, Okay, we seem to
Speaker 1: be getting better. And then at the same time what
Speaker 1: you said, which is to remain every bit engaged in
Speaker 1: making that evolution happen, Well, I think we have to
Speaker 1: be really clear about what we want to believe, because again,
Speaker 1: the data shows that there's actually more enslaved people on
Speaker 1: Earth now than there were when the Transatlantic slave trade
Speaker 1: was operating. There are people all over the country and
Speaker 1: all over the globe who work in indentured servitude, people
Speaker 1: who have had their passports taken away by their quote employers.
Speaker 1: There are millions of people, especially people of color in
Speaker 1: this country who are enforced labor camps in prison. And
Speaker 1: you know, even just last week, when we're recording this anyway,
Speaker 1: there was an art iCal about how Russia is going
Speaker 1: to start forced labor in its prison system again. And
Speaker 1: the article said, just don't call it a goolag, and
Speaker 1: a bunch of people shared it and said, has anyone
Speaker 1: been paying attention to what happens in the private prison
Speaker 1: system in America? Who do you think makes our license plates?
Speaker 1: Where where do you think so many things in this
Speaker 1: country come from? And so I think it's really important
Speaker 1: for us to be willing to be honest about the
Speaker 1: ways these systems haven't actually ended or reduced. They've just
Speaker 1: changed clothes. And I think being willing to sit in
Speaker 1: that discomfort and that frustration. I know for me just now,
Speaker 1: when I thought about that, I felt so helpless. I
Speaker 1: felt that feeling of helplessness in my chest, like, how
Speaker 1: are we going to fix this? This is such a
Speaker 1: big system. How do we change it? But we keep going,
Speaker 1: We keep putting all of our weight and our might
Speaker 1: at at the tip of the spear to bend it.
Speaker 1: And I think that it takes again some real maturity
Speaker 1: to say, oh, I might not see an entire system
Speaker 1: change this year. Because when I was twenty, I thought
Speaker 1: we could do that. I thought, oh, we're going to
Speaker 1: win an election and then everything is going to change.
Speaker 1: I didn't understand enough about policy and systems. So now
Speaker 1: I think, what would be the greatest thing we could
Speaker 1: do this decade? Yes, every year there's an urgent fight,
Speaker 1: but what will it look like to keep our foot
Speaker 1: on the gas and to change this thing, to to
Speaker 1: move the needle incrementally and steadily. And I think that
Speaker 1: I don't have all the answers, but I believe that
Speaker 1: if enough of us are willing to lean into facts
Speaker 1: and and fight for truth and fight for each other
Speaker 1: that we can do a lot. And you know, I
Speaker 1: think we also have to keep the pressure up and
Speaker 1: demand that our leaders not negotiate with people inciting terrorists
Speaker 1: in our country. You know, I I really think we
Speaker 1: can't act like one group bringing a knife to a
Speaker 1: knife fight and the other group showing up with a
Speaker 1: newsy or doing the same things. And at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, upholding our democracy, upholding voting rights, making
Speaker 1: sure everyone gets to participate, that should be bipartisan, and
Speaker 1: I think that might be the real fight of this
Speaker 1: year for us. And my hope is that moving forward,
Speaker 1: if we can turn down some of the insanity, and
Speaker 1: by the way, it's insanity that's been stoked by people
Speaker 1: again who want to make money on it, like Trump
Speaker 1: was making money on this stuff. Mitch McConnell makes money
Speaker 1: on this stuff. Fox News makes a lot of money
Speaker 1: on this stuff. If we can stop these coordinated disinformation campaigns,
Speaker 1: and we can just as people agree that there are
Speaker 1: some baseline facts, like everyone should get to vote, people
Speaker 1: of color should not have their ballots thrown out, you know,
Speaker 1: things that that should feel basic. I think we could
Speaker 1: move forward. I think if we could understand that our
Speaker 1: democracy is supposed to be bipartisan, and also that protecting
Speaker 1: the climate like that shouldn't be controversial, That shouldn't be
Speaker 1: a thing that Democrats want to do and Republicans don't.
Speaker 1: I mean, the very notion that the quote Conservative Party
Speaker 1: is the most anti conservationalist, like burn it all down,
Speaker 1: you know, for our for our benefit today, but who
Speaker 1: cares what happens to our grandkids. I'm like, guys, come on,
Speaker 1: this has become comical. It's become almost ridiculous that the
Speaker 1: truth has been so weaponized, that science has been so
Speaker 1: weaponized that we're debating over this stuff. I mean, I
Speaker 1: talked to my mom last night about what a revolution
Speaker 1: the polio vaccine was when she was a kid, and
Speaker 1: the kids she knew who got polio and the people
Speaker 1: who died, and how scared everyone was. And you know,
Speaker 1: my Mom's like, if you tell me I have to
Speaker 1: get a flu shot that has a COVID booster in
Speaker 1: it every every three months, I'll do it. You know,
Speaker 1: if it's if it's once a year, fine, I get
Speaker 1: a flu shot once a year. Anyway, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: advances in medical science understanding of weather patterns, meaning that
Speaker 1: if we bolster our mangroves and our wetlands on the coasts,
Speaker 1: we will keep the coasts safe from hurricanes, but we
Speaker 1: also will create better weather patterns for our farmers in
Speaker 1: Middle America. These are just facts, and wouldn't it be
Speaker 1: nice if we could establish a base where we can
Speaker 1: meet there and then debate about how best to achieve progress.
Speaker 1: One of the things we say at the One You
Speaker 1: Feed a Lot is that there's no shortcut to lasting happiness. Right,
Speaker 1: We've got to do the work to improve our lives,
Speaker 1: but this can be really challenging to do without some support.
Speaker 1: Our lives are busy, there's a lot of things clawing
Speaker 1: at our attention, and we might have ways of working
Speaker 1: with our thoughts, emotions and behaviors that are not very
Speaker 1: good for our well being. So if you'd like help
Speaker 1: working on any or all of those things, I've got
Speaker 1: a couple of spots that have just opened up in
Speaker 1: my one on one coaching practice. You can book a
Speaker 1: free thirty minute call to talk with me, no pressure,
Speaker 1: and we get to know each other. At One You
Speaker 1: Feed dot net slash coach. When I get overwhelmed by
Speaker 1: the state of our politics. That's where I most feel despairing,
Speaker 1: is when I feel like we can't even agree on
Speaker 1: the nature of reality. I mean, we can debate the
Speaker 1: deepest nature of reality, right, but to your point, there
Speaker 1: are some things that are just very clear and we
Speaker 1: just can't seem to agree there. And that makes it
Speaker 1: really hard to have discussions about policy, because I think
Speaker 1: solving the problems that we face that is complex, because
Speaker 1: we are a complex world in a complex society. There's
Speaker 1: a lot of us, but we can't even agree on
Speaker 1: what they are that we want to solve, and that
Speaker 1: that's where I start to feel slightly overwhelmed. But I
Speaker 1: don't want to leave us in overwhelmed because I want
Speaker 1: to bring up something that you said that I thought
Speaker 1: was really helpful. And you were talking about activism, and
Speaker 1: you said, we need everybody to be all in on something.
Speaker 1: Nobody has to do everything, but everybody has to do something.
Speaker 1: And you just suggested pick your thing, whatever your cause,
Speaker 1: whatever the thing you care about is, don't worry about
Speaker 1: solving everything, but put your energy and attention deeply in there. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I really think, Look, everybody's got a gift. I'm a
Speaker 1: good public speaker, so I can get up at the
Speaker 1: rally and talk to an audience. I can introduce folks.
Speaker 1: I can spend the privilege of my community and platform
Speaker 1: with my podcasts and interview activists and thought leaders and
Speaker 1: storytellers on work in progress and and share their stories wide.
Speaker 1: Some people really don't like to talk to other people.
Speaker 1: They like to draw, and those are the people we
Speaker 1: need to create the posters for the marches and create
Speaker 1: the art campaigns that go viral on the internet so
Speaker 1: that the policymakers pay attention. You know, everyone, no matter
Speaker 1: what end of the spectrum they fall on, has the
Speaker 1: ability to to do great work and show up and
Speaker 1: to give their gifts. We need incredible writers and researchers,
Speaker 1: copy editors, folks who will go in and do the
Speaker 1: fact checking on something so that when we're advocating, we're
Speaker 1: doing it exactly right. Everyone has a part to play,
Speaker 1: and I think, going back to that earlier idea of
Speaker 1: wouldn't it be nice if we could agree on some foundations,
Speaker 1: I also think there's something everyone can do. I do
Speaker 1: this every Monday. I have a calendar appointment, and every
Speaker 1: Monday I call my senators every single Monday. I spend
Speaker 1: ten minutes. If it's a big week, maybe I spend fifteen.
Speaker 1: And I talk about currently the Voting Rights Act. I
Speaker 1: talk about abolishing the filibuster so that we can get
Speaker 1: things done. I talk about climate change. I let them
Speaker 1: know what is important. And I think it would be
Speaker 1: incredibly powerful if we all started to do that, because
Speaker 1: if they started to realize that, whether we're talking quote
Speaker 1: unquote Blue states or Red States, everyone's calling to talk
Speaker 1: about climate it would be really meaningful. And so I
Speaker 1: think there are some things we can all do that
Speaker 1: are the same, that don't take a ton of time,
Speaker 1: but that have a ton of impact. And then I
Speaker 1: think there are things arenas ways of participating, where we
Speaker 1: can all lean into what we're really good at, what
Speaker 1: our sort of callings are, what our spiritual gifts are,
Speaker 1: and we can use those things to show up for
Speaker 1: each other. And again, it's that showing up that to
Speaker 1: me it feels really spiritual. I love that idea of
Speaker 1: just having a standing date to your your senators. I
Speaker 1: make those phone calls as particular issues come up, but
Speaker 1: it's not a steady every week. And look, some weeks.
Speaker 1: I miss it. Sometimes I'm on a plane, sometimes i'm working,
Speaker 1: but I really really try to keep that up. Do
Speaker 1: they know you? I know they're like, oh hi, Sophia,
Speaker 1: it's you again, just at the office. It's funny how
Speaker 1: often you'll get a machine and I'm like, I wonder,
Speaker 1: I wonder if the person who talies these like has
Speaker 1: you know, has a little like thing by my name
Speaker 1: and just like keeps the lines going and she's called
Speaker 1: this many times And they probably don't, but I like
Speaker 1: to think they do. That makes me feel special as
Speaker 1: a way to start to head into the home stretch here.
Speaker 1: I'm always curious what lesson do you think is taking
Speaker 1: you the longest to learn in your life. I think
Speaker 1: it's taken me a really long time to understand that
Speaker 1: the constant critical figure in my head does not need
Speaker 1: to be in charge and also doesn't need to be
Speaker 1: listened to. And a lot of people are really surprised,
Speaker 1: you know, when they find out the way my angs
Speaker 1: it presents, or or how self critical I am. I
Speaker 1: often met with, oh, you seem so confident, and I
Speaker 1: always offered to people I'm really confident for us. I'm
Speaker 1: confident to go out and advocate for a cause, for
Speaker 1: my community to talk about showing up for us things
Speaker 1: that are just for me. That arena is the one
Speaker 1: I am least apt to participate in or have ownership over,
Speaker 1: and that has been a dichotomy I have had to
Speaker 1: learn about by doing some serious you know, self exploration
Speaker 1: and self interrogation, and for me to learn that the
Speaker 1: little you know, parrot on my shoulder that tells me
Speaker 1: that I'm doing it wrong or that I'm failing every
Speaker 1: second of every day is a parasite, not a leader.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. I heard a joke yesterday. What was it?
Speaker 1: I lost my obese parrot. It was a great weight
Speaker 1: off my shoulders. Pretty bad, isn't it? But I get it.
Speaker 1: I do get it. We really can get bogged down
Speaker 1: by things, and in this sort of self inquiry of
Speaker 1: where that comes from, I've really had to also learn
Speaker 1: that as humans, and especially you know, folks who are
Speaker 1: wired like me, who are a little anxious and who
Speaker 1: love to read and love research, we can find the
Speaker 1: proof of any story we're telling ourselves. So if the
Speaker 1: story is I'm a failure, and today is going to
Speaker 1: be the day that everyone in my life has been
Speaker 1: pretending to love me all this time? Is going to
Speaker 1: tell me they don't and they want me to leave.
Speaker 1: You'll find evidence of it. And so a really interesting
Speaker 1: arena for me to step into now is, Oh, what
Speaker 1: if I write on the board in front of me,
Speaker 1: I'm doing the best I can. I have deep love
Speaker 1: in my life. I've worked very hard and plan on
Speaker 1: continuing to do so and do my best for others.
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel clammy saying that out loud to
Speaker 1: you and to the folks listening at home. That feels
Speaker 1: uncomfortable for me, But it's also not untrue. And so
Speaker 1: what if that's the story I look for evidence of.
Speaker 1: And what I think is so good about that is
Speaker 1: that those affirmations are ones that you might say, well,
Speaker 1: I it's a little bit of a stretch to believe it,
Speaker 1: but not really, because there's lots of evidence that. There's
Speaker 1: been a bunch of studies on affirmations, and they seem
Speaker 1: to show that the people they work the best for
Speaker 1: the people who don't need them. So the people who
Speaker 1: can look at themselves in the mirror and go I
Speaker 1: am beautiful, they work well for those people because they
Speaker 1: just think they're beautiful. Right for other people though. Affirmations
Speaker 1: can be helpful, but they have got to be in
Speaker 1: the realm of believability, and the ones that you just
Speaker 1: listed are great examples of that. I work really hard,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to continue to work hard, like that's
Speaker 1: an affirmation that you can go okay, all right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I can believe that, and something I've thought about as well.
Speaker 1: And I think this comes from some of the wonderful
Speaker 1: spaces I've been in. I made this film with Alana Glazer,
Speaker 1: and the movie is really dark, but Alana is like
Speaker 1: pure light and goodness. And we've talked so much about
Speaker 1: the experience because we just had a premiere, which, after
Speaker 1: you know, a year and a half in the house,
Speaker 1: feels crazy to finally be at at a moment where
Speaker 1: we're safe enough to do that. And she was so
Speaker 1: generous with me when we were just together in New York,
Speaker 1: and she shared with me that she learned a lot
Speaker 1: from me while we did this project together. And I'm
Speaker 1: looking at her, going, you wrote this, you produced it,
Speaker 1: you created, you started, and what do you think about
Speaker 1: You've learned something from me? But I took her feedback
Speaker 1: and I listened to it and I actually took a
Speaker 1: picture of some of the feedback she sent me in
Speaker 1: a text message, and I put it in a little
Speaker 1: folder in my phone and I called it for me.
Speaker 1: And when I finished my pilot, my incredible show runner,
Speaker 1: Katie Wesh sent me this long paragraph about what I
Speaker 1: did on our show and the way that I lead
Speaker 1: our set. You know, there's a thing in my industry
Speaker 1: called the number one on the call sheet, and when
Speaker 1: you're number one on the call sheet, like you're the
Speaker 1: captain of the ship. And she talked about the way
Speaker 1: I lead the set as a number one and the
Speaker 1: things I did, and I took a picture of that,
Speaker 1: and I put it in my little album, and every
Speaker 1: once in a while I'll go in and I'll read
Speaker 1: this little collection of these things, and I realized, oh,
Speaker 1: here's here's evidence of the truth. So it's on me
Speaker 1: to tell myself a true story. Yeah, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I've heard that said in a slightly different way, which
Speaker 1: is sort of like, why am I so willing to
Speaker 1: believe of my internal narrative? But I'm not willing to
Speaker 1: listen to and pay attention to the external narrative that
Speaker 1: people are telling me about myself And so you're kind
Speaker 1: of doing that, you know, Yeah, let me start to
Speaker 1: let what other people are saying about me in and
Speaker 1: not the nonsense. You know, you also have to think
Speaker 1: about who are the judges you trust. Yes, because some
Speaker 1: random troll on the Internet is not a judge I
Speaker 1: trust for anything. But if they say something terrible about myself,
Speaker 1: I think is that true? Yet I don't trust the
Speaker 1: good feedback from the people I respect most in my life.
Speaker 1: You know, we have to do the work to change
Speaker 1: those things. That's where I think some of our emotional
Speaker 1: maturity has to come in. Because for years, when I
Speaker 1: was younger and I had less tools, it was really
Speaker 1: easy to hide that these were things I was afraid of,
Speaker 1: and then I was just hiding from people. Then I
Speaker 1: just didn't really talk to people. I didn't open up
Speaker 1: to people. I didn't have friendships that are as deep
Speaker 1: as the friendships I have now. And so I had
Speaker 1: to grow up a little bit and make some space
Speaker 1: for my fear and let people in on that, and
Speaker 1: and also choose to lean into what is true from
Speaker 1: people whose judgments I believe in um rather than you know,
Speaker 1: some strange peanut gallery that doesn't really deserve to take
Speaker 1: up any space in my emotional world, right, and then
Speaker 1: the internal peanut gallery because we all have all of
Speaker 1: those things. We all do, we all experience this stuff
Speaker 1: in our own ways, and and I think it's really
Speaker 1: hopeful to know that that's universal. And I think if
Speaker 1: you're really doing the work, understanding that this is a
Speaker 1: universal struggle puts you in the position to look in
Speaker 1: the mirror and be like, all right, you gotta get
Speaker 1: over yourself. Like you're not special, that you're scared, that
Speaker 1: you're bad. Everyone is, so get over What are you
Speaker 1: gonna do with it? Like, get over it? And and
Speaker 1: I've I've had to give myself a little bit of that.
Speaker 1: That's been a bit of my journey as well. Is
Speaker 1: like being the auntie I wished I had had, being
Speaker 1: like girl, what are you doing? Like stop stop it,
Speaker 1: stop wallowing. It's it's annoying, Like get over it and
Speaker 1: get out and do something. And I have had to
Speaker 1: find that humor because otherwise it's just like it's too
Speaker 1: cerebral and emotional. And I can be cerebral and emotional
Speaker 1: all day. I got to lean into the funny too. Yep, yep,
Speaker 1: absolutely well. I think that is a wonderful place for
Speaker 1: us to wrap up. Thank you so much for agreeing
Speaker 1: to come on the show, and it's been a real
Speaker 1: pleasure talking with you. Thank you, it's been so nice.
Speaker 1: I love the way that you ask questions and ponder
Speaker 1: what we're all doing here. You're a person who is
Speaker 1: so calming and inviting. I think you do such a
Speaker 1: beautiful job of giving so many people permission to be
Speaker 1: a little more themselves. So thank you for including me
Speaker 1: in that. Thank you so much. This has been so fun. Thanks.
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