Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcasts, where we
Speaker 1: focus on all things mental health, personal development, and all
Speaker 1: the small decisions we can make to become the best
Speaker 1: possible versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy Harden Bradford,
Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. To find more information
Speaker 1: and to get resources, visit the website at Therapy for
Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com. And while I hope you love
Speaker 1: listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not
Speaker 1: meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a
Speaker 1: licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, welcome to Session five
Speaker 1: of the Therapy for Black Girls Podcasts. I appreciate you
Speaker 1: tuning in for another episode and really appreciate all the
Speaker 1: conversations I've been having with you over on social media.
Speaker 1: It's been really cool to see how you're taking in
Speaker 1: the information and sharing it with your circles, So please
Speaker 1: keep it up and remember to use the hashtag TBG
Speaker 1: in session. So today we have another on the Couch episode,
Speaker 1: and I think you'll enjoy this episode just as much
Speaker 1: as you enjoyed the Being Mary Jane episode. So today
Speaker 1: you'll be hearing the conversation I had with licensed independent
Speaker 1: clinical social worker Jehan Met June Johan is the owner
Speaker 1: of the Fulfillment Project in Washington, d C. And she
Speaker 1: is passionate about working with women who want to do
Speaker 1: the following things. Find relief from depression, anxiety, and past trauma.
Speaker 1: Learn how to relax and cope with stress, identify blind
Speaker 1: spots in relationships, gain clarity about career, passion and purpose,
Speaker 1: and cultivate self acceptance and self compassion. Johan earned her
Speaker 1: Bachelors of a Science degree and family studies at the
Speaker 1: University of Maryland College Park, and then earned her Masters
Speaker 1: of Social Work at Howard University. So Johanna and I
Speaker 1: talked about a bit of a throwback character UM. So
Speaker 1: we talk about Joan Carol Clayton, and those of you
Speaker 1: who are Girlfriends fans will recognize her. So if you
Speaker 1: have not caught up with Girlfriends, or if you're a
Speaker 1: little young and weren't um of age to be watching
Speaker 1: Girlfriends when it was on the c W, you can
Speaker 1: still catch it until some of the episodes are on
Speaker 1: YouTube and then I believe seasons two through eight or
Speaker 1: on an app called c W the seed UM and
Speaker 1: all this information will be included in the show notes
Speaker 1: so that you know where to find it. UM. But
Speaker 1: it was really a stellar series and really UM you know,
Speaker 1: like was one of those things where you got all
Speaker 1: your girls together and everybody sat together and watched Girlfriends.
Speaker 1: So I think you'll really enjoy this episode. So Johanna
Speaker 1: and I talked about a couple of different things. We
Speaker 1: talked about some expectations of what our lives should look like,
Speaker 1: and we talked about the use of art therapy when
Speaker 1: working with clients. We also talked about some of the
Speaker 1: difficulties we have as women about saying no and setting
Speaker 1: boundaries and one of the main struggles that Joan had,
Speaker 1: which was this pressure to um have your life look
Speaker 1: a certain way by the age of thirty. So I
Speaker 1: definitely think you'll enjoy this conversation and I'm looking forward
Speaker 1: to hearing your feedback after you listen. Thank you so
Speaker 1: much for joining us today, John, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1: So tell us which character you are going to be
Speaker 1: talking about today. So I'll be talking about Joan from Girlfriends,
Speaker 1: which was a TV show I want to say in
Speaker 1: the early two thousand's centered around UM for women of
Speaker 1: color in Los Angeles, and they're all kind of in
Speaker 1: there like late twenties and everyone you know at different
Speaker 1: phases in their lives and own is a lawyer. She's
Speaker 1: really smart, she's a leader, she's one of those people
Speaker 1: who looks really good on paper. Is a very good friend,
Speaker 1: but she's like a go to person for her friends
Speaker 1: to like fix their problems, build them out. And on
Speaker 1: top of that, she feels like she needs to be
Speaker 1: married by age thirty. Oh okay, okay, Yeah, she's got
Speaker 1: a lot on her plate, right right, So tell us
Speaker 1: what are some of the things she's struggling with that
Speaker 1: you think might lead her to therapy. So she's tired
Speaker 1: of being, you know, that go to for her friends.
Speaker 1: You know, she's tired of bailing her friends out. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, she struggles with finding time for herself and
Speaker 1: really has problems with setting healthy boundaries and being as
Speaker 1: being able to assert herself effectively and communicate what her
Speaker 1: needs are, particularly in relationships, so not only with friends,
Speaker 1: but within romantic relationships. Um. And So she's feels like
Speaker 1: she's kind of hitting a wall in terms of people
Speaker 1: meeting where meeting her where she is, and she feels
Speaker 1: like she has to settle for what she has got you. So,
Speaker 1: how often would you say you see someone like Joan
Speaker 1: in your current practice? So I see this type of
Speaker 1: client very frequently. Um. I am based in Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: So you know, DC culture has kind of conditioned people
Speaker 1: to be very career driven and always be looking for
Speaker 1: their next move and be in a relationship just have
Speaker 1: like every uh checkbox marked off career family relationship, like
Speaker 1: everything has to be perfect, and that can create a
Speaker 1: lot of pressure on someone and can be you know,
Speaker 1: very intimidating and unfortunately, it can turn into kind of
Speaker 1: a comparison game where always looking to someone else to see, okay,
Speaker 1: like they feel they seem like they've got it together.
Speaker 1: Why don't I have it together? What's wrong with me?
Speaker 1: And the expectation is that you can't feel and you
Speaker 1: know you have to be uh you know, seeing it
Speaker 1: as worthy in someone else's eyes. Okay. So that definitely
Speaker 1: is something very interesting. I think we want to touch
Speaker 1: on more. UM. So you're kind of also alluding to
Speaker 1: like this fullmal culture, like fear of missing out. So
Speaker 1: so talk with me a little bit about what that
Speaker 1: might look like, UM, in your practice. So if someone
Speaker 1: was coming in and kind of doing all of this
Speaker 1: constant comparison and things what kinds of things would you
Speaker 1: do with them in therapy? So I think part of
Speaker 1: it is, UM, you know, when we're looking to other
Speaker 1: people to dictate how we should be, we don't really
Speaker 1: have a very strong sense of self. We don't know,
Speaker 1: we're not very clear on you know, what is how
Speaker 1: do we identify? Like how do we show up in
Speaker 1: the world? Who are we like? You know, what are
Speaker 1: our values, our beliefs, our interests? You know, what are
Speaker 1: the things that like, um, make us curious and you know,
Speaker 1: inspire us and give us hope because we're like so
Speaker 1: busy looking at people's Instagram feeds and you know which
Speaker 1: is all very you know, glossy and um, you know,
Speaker 1: picture perfect and so that UM, it's like a never
Speaker 1: ending game. So UM being clear about getting clear about
Speaker 1: you know, who you are and who is the person
Speaker 1: that you want to be and and learning to accept,
Speaker 1: um the person that you are, and like learning how
Speaker 1: to be your own friend, to enjoy your own company, um,
Speaker 1: you know, to feel strong about what you believe in,
Speaker 1: what you value, and you know, learning how to UM
Speaker 1: let that person show up in relationships instead of the
Speaker 1: person that you think should show up got you? So
Speaker 1: what are some exercises that you might use in therapy
Speaker 1: to help them to kind of get closer to this goal.
Speaker 1: So I love to use art. I think art is
Speaker 1: like a great modality because it taps into kind of
Speaker 1: your unconscious feelings. It's all very intuitive, and that's the
Speaker 1: thing that you know, people who are struggling to be
Speaker 1: themselves are not using their intuition UM. And so it's
Speaker 1: being able to tap into that kind of inner wisdom
Speaker 1: that we all that we all possess, and art is
Speaker 1: a great way to experiment with that. You know, kids
Speaker 1: are you know always you know, down to color and
Speaker 1: you know, experiment with paint, and that speaks to their
Speaker 1: you know just you know spontaneity and natural you know
Speaker 1: freedom and just you know, not caring and so being
Speaker 1: able to let go of like social constructs and you know,
Speaker 1: things that limit us. UM. So I love to use
Speaker 1: art UM. And then you know, I'm definitely someone who
Speaker 1: UM likes to use body based interventions UM. A lot
Speaker 1: of people are disconnected from their bodies and live in
Speaker 1: their heads, and so being able to tune in to
Speaker 1: your body and and and be able to sense like, Okay,
Speaker 1: how does my body feel like? You know, when I'm
Speaker 1: in um, you know, overwhelmed, like what's going on in
Speaker 1: my body and figuring out, Okay, if I feel the sensation,
Speaker 1: what does this sensation need? What is it trying to
Speaker 1: tell me? Or um, get my attention around and being
Speaker 1: able to listen to that and say, okay, any rest
Speaker 1: or you know, I'm feeling anxious like I need to
Speaker 1: ground myself. So you know, that's another part of my
Speaker 1: work with clients is being able to incorporate mindfulness and
Speaker 1: being able to cultivate their ability to be present UM
Speaker 1: in the present moment UM. And I do that through
Speaker 1: breathing exercises, grounding techniques, UM, and just being able to
Speaker 1: tap in UM to your wisdom of thin. Wow, that
Speaker 1: sounds really powerful and wonderful. So I'm wondering, UM, from
Speaker 1: your experience, how easy is it to kind of get
Speaker 1: some of your black women clients to participate in those
Speaker 1: kinds of like body intuitive exercises and things like that.
Speaker 1: So UM, I think it all starts with the relationship
Speaker 1: UM that we have with one another. And I think
Speaker 1: you know something that I always tell people is that
Speaker 1: we heal in relationships. So you know, I may be
Speaker 1: your therapist, but this is this is a healing uh
Speaker 1: you know relationship where you can practice you know, being
Speaker 1: yourself and letting go of you know, things that hold
Speaker 1: you back and um, so being able to like developed
Speaker 1: that rapport with that person and you know, just being
Speaker 1: able to feel comfortable and establishing a sense of trust
Speaker 1: and safety. And so when there's safety, people are able
Speaker 1: to kind of let their guard down, let their walls down, um,
Speaker 1: and be able to kind of be more experience experimental
Speaker 1: and be more kind of flexible, um and willing to
Speaker 1: try new things. Got you, got you? Yeah, I was
Speaker 1: definitely thinking, um, you know, because you talked a little
Speaker 1: bit about the DC culture right which I'm thinking, um,
Speaker 1: really requires people to kind of always be on you
Speaker 1: can always be operating at you know, tip top shape,
Speaker 1: and some of the things that you're mentioning trying to
Speaker 1: do in therapy would require them to really come out
Speaker 1: of that mode exactly. So sometimes it's just focusing on
Speaker 1: the breath, you know, just pausing for a minute and
Speaker 1: just you know, listening to the sound of your breath.
Speaker 1: You know, is does it feel constricted? Is it shallow?
Speaker 1: And what is that telling us um? And you know
Speaker 1: the you know, breath is life. So UM, I think
Speaker 1: people are able to kind of make that connection that Wow, yeah,
Speaker 1: I am really anxious and you know I'm not breathing
Speaker 1: and I really need to focus on this UM to
Speaker 1: better experience life. So you also mentioned, UM that Joan
Speaker 1: could use a lot of help around boundary setting. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: So talk to us about what that would look like
Speaker 1: in therapy. How would you help her tos at better boundaries? Sure?
Speaker 1: So um, looking at you know, what's okay and what's
Speaker 1: not okay? Like what is your yes and what is
Speaker 1: your no? And um? You know, I think a lot
Speaker 1: of people have a negative connotation with the word no.
Speaker 1: So looking at okay, what words, images, feelings, symbols, um,
Speaker 1: maybe memories that you associate with the word no. And
Speaker 1: sometimes people will come up with, you know, things in
Speaker 1: their childhood, maybe thinks something memory that they had UM
Speaker 1: in a you know, dating scenario and you know, the
Speaker 1: resulting feeling was like, you know, negative, and so they
Speaker 1: now feel afraid to say no to people. So looking
Speaker 1: at like how do they view the words no and yes?
Speaker 1: And you know, looking at okay, how does that impact
Speaker 1: their ability to set appropriate boundaries and like getting clear
Speaker 1: on what is there no, Like, are there things that
Speaker 1: you've been wanting to say no to but fear that
Speaker 1: people will abadden you or reject you because you'll say no? So, like,
Speaker 1: what do they see as the repercussions or the consequences
Speaker 1: of saying no and saying yes? And being able to
Speaker 1: kind of get a really end of picture of what
Speaker 1: that really means to them um and um. You know,
Speaker 1: once they have that clear picture, you know, they're able
Speaker 1: to be aware of, you know, why they're having certain
Speaker 1: feelings or why they're feeling pressured to say yes when
Speaker 1: they really don't want to say yes. Um, And how
Speaker 1: that can create you know, a whole host of of
Speaker 1: feelings like resentment and exhaustion um, and how that's really
Speaker 1: impacting you know, their self care and you know also
Speaker 1: there um, they're self worth you know if I say
Speaker 1: no or this person value me? Um, well this person
Speaker 1: liked me? Um And really determining, Okay, what's most important here? Um.
Speaker 1: So being able to look at what people's you know, uh,
Speaker 1: priorities are and what's really most important in those moments. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I do think that's important to look at and I
Speaker 1: often hear with some of my clients the idea that, um,
Speaker 1: seeing no means that I'm going to be hurting somebody's feelings, right, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Are there other other issues that have come up around
Speaker 1: that you mentioned? Fear of abandonment and fear of not
Speaker 1: being liked? Are there other reasons people give you for
Speaker 1: being afraid to say no? Those are the top ones.
Speaker 1: I mean I think, Um, you know, some people fear that, Okay,
Speaker 1: maybe I'll lose my job if I say no. So
Speaker 1: it's like, okay, you know if I say no, well
Speaker 1: this person you know view me. Uh, you know, it's
Speaker 1: not being a team player. Um, because I want to
Speaker 1: be up for a promotion and if I say no,
Speaker 1: I may not get that promotion. So um, you know
Speaker 1: it does have that. There are some real fears around
Speaker 1: the world. No, Um, but I think it's important to
Speaker 1: kind of really like, you know, dissect that and really
Speaker 1: look at Okay, um, what does this really mean for
Speaker 1: you in your life? So the other thing you mentioned
Speaker 1: related to Joan was this pressure that she feels to
Speaker 1: be married by the age of thirty. Yes, yes, I
Speaker 1: don't know. There's something about like when for a lot
Speaker 1: of women, you know, when they're in high school. It
Speaker 1: sounds it feels like, you know, they imagine, you know,
Speaker 1: their future lives and it's you know a lot of
Speaker 1: people say, oh, I'll be married by age and you know,
Speaker 1: I'll have kids at this age, and so they've like
Speaker 1: scripted their entire lives and and and it doesn't include
Speaker 1: any kind of adversity or challenges, like everything's going to
Speaker 1: be good. So there's all these like very like rigid
Speaker 1: expectations of how their life it's supposed to go. And
Speaker 1: so when it doesn't UM, when that expectation is not met,
Speaker 1: then anxiety ensues and it's like, I'm not needing my timeline.
Speaker 1: I was supposed to be married by you know this date,
Speaker 1: it's not happened. What's so something must be wrong with me? UM.
Speaker 1: And you know a lot of that is UM. You know,
Speaker 1: societal UM constructs that kind of help inform people. And
Speaker 1: you know, also you know, social media UM is also
Speaker 1: not helpful. You know, I think a lot of my clients,
Speaker 1: you know, will scroll through scroll through their Facebook feed
Speaker 1: and see like all these like ring in summer weddings
Speaker 1: coming up, and you know they internalize that is well
Speaker 1: why don't I have that? And why am I not
Speaker 1: getting married? Um, and internalize that as something deficient with
Speaker 1: themselves and um, thinking that a partner is is like
Speaker 1: the marker of you know success and you know life success,
Speaker 1: and that a partner will then make them happy and
Speaker 1: fulfill their needs like they can't um separate like Okay,
Speaker 1: this is my relationship and this is me. It's like
Speaker 1: all one and the same. I can't be happy until
Speaker 1: if and when I get married and have kids, you know,
Speaker 1: and and have the house you know with the dog. Um.
Speaker 1: So it's it's this um kind of you know, dependent relationships.
Speaker 1: My happiness depends upon if I achieve X, y and z.
Speaker 1: When happiness is is attainable and in any moment um
Speaker 1: and not in these kind of like status um status
Speaker 1: is that people put out there. Yeah, that definitely is
Speaker 1: a big thing to try to break through. I mean
Speaker 1: the societal constructs that have been developed for us around
Speaker 1: marriage kind of being the ultimate goal, and no matter
Speaker 1: how much success you've had academically or career wise, it
Speaker 1: really kind of boils down to like okay, when is
Speaker 1: she going to be married with some kids kind of
Speaker 1: things um, and and a lot of times that really
Speaker 1: starts with family, UM, and so it's a long held belief.
Speaker 1: So so what kinds of strategies would you even be
Speaker 1: able to use to kind of chip away at some
Speaker 1: of that in there? So I think you know you
Speaker 1: mentioned a really great, UM, really important part of this
Speaker 1: is family. And you know, families, UM are where we learn, UM,
Speaker 1: you know, what we value and what our beliefs are.
Speaker 1: So looking at the family of origins, you know, what
Speaker 1: did that your family value growing up? And you know
Speaker 1: what beliefs you know we're um, you know, promoted within
Speaker 1: your in your family. And are those beliefs and values
Speaker 1: something that you want to carry on into your life
Speaker 1: or something? Or or are some of those beliefs and
Speaker 1: values uh that something that you want to leave behind? UM?
Speaker 1: So looking at that and like, okay, what are my uh,
Speaker 1: what are my core beliefs? So you can kind of
Speaker 1: you know, split that into you positive core beliefs and
Speaker 1: negative core beliefs and look at, okay, which ones you
Speaker 1: know do the negative outweigh the positive? UM? And looking
Speaker 1: at okay, how does that? How do these beliefs impact
Speaker 1: my self esteem and my self worth and how I
Speaker 1: see myself? UM? And how others see me as well.
Speaker 1: And so you know that's you know, take some processing
Speaker 1: and you know, just some dissecting. But I think it's
Speaker 1: it's a really important lesson absolutely. And you also mentioned, um,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of springing summer wedding season. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that definitely was a prominent theme on Girlfriends. Right, So
Speaker 1: when Tony got engaged and prepared for the wedding, I mean,
Speaker 1: Joan really had a very difficult time like that and
Speaker 1: it caused a lot of friction in their relationship. So
Speaker 1: can you talk maybe a little bit about what that
Speaker 1: might look like if you have like some jealousy around
Speaker 1: a friend who seems like she's kind of having all
Speaker 1: the things that you'd like to have, and how you
Speaker 1: might manage that. Yeah. I think the first way to
Speaker 1: kind of deal with that is having self compassion for
Speaker 1: yourself and saying to yourself, Okay, this is a difficult
Speaker 1: this is a difficult moment for me, um, and this
Speaker 1: is difficult for these reasons, UM, and identifying you know,
Speaker 1: your feelings associated with that. Um. You know, so if
Speaker 1: you're feeling jealous, okay, so if someone's feeling jealous, um,
Speaker 1: there's an unmet need there. UM. Jealousy is a feeling
Speaker 1: UM when a need is UH, when a need is
Speaker 1: not being fulfilled. Right, So what need UM is needing
Speaker 1: to be met? So for someone who's jealous, that need
Speaker 1: might be UM, a relationship or closeness or intimacy or UM.
Speaker 1: You know, understanding UM. You know, it could be a
Speaker 1: number of things, and being able to look at, Okay,
Speaker 1: what are my feelings and needs in this moment and
Speaker 1: being able to you know, get clear on that UM.
Speaker 1: Being able to be aware of your thoughts and feelings
Speaker 1: so that you know you're not UM putting you know,
Speaker 1: your negative feelings, and being triggered onto your friend UM.
Speaker 1: And that's where you know, this is where self compassion
Speaker 1: really plays a really big role UM, because it's hard.
Speaker 1: I mean, it can be really triggering when you see
Speaker 1: someone you know finding the very thing that you want
Speaker 1: in your life UM and being having to accept that Okay,
Speaker 1: I don't have that right now, but it's not something
Speaker 1: that I won't ever have, you know, until being able
Speaker 1: to UM positively affirm yourself and you know, speak intentionally
Speaker 1: and affirmatively about the things that you do want in
Speaker 1: your life. I really like that because I think the self, compassion, peace.
Speaker 1: We often miss, um and we don't want to sit
Speaker 1: with the fact that it can be a very difficult time,
Speaker 1: you know. So I feel like there is already like
Speaker 1: a lot of shame, Like, oh, I shouldn't feel jealous,
Speaker 1: and you know, I should be happy for my friend,
Speaker 1: but it's also okay for you to feel really sad
Speaker 1: and disappointed what may not be happening for you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And that's the thing about shame is that you know,
Speaker 1: it's often felt in secret, and so you know, you
Speaker 1: if you acknowledge it, you know, and you bring light
Speaker 1: to it, then you can actually heal it and overcome it.
Speaker 1: So by you know, recognizing, okay, this is hard, Um,
Speaker 1: this is you know, going to be a hard situation
Speaker 1: for me to kind of get through. But knowing that, um,
Speaker 1: that your feelings are normal and that it's okay that
Speaker 1: you have those feelings and that you know, you not
Speaker 1: judge yourself. UM, where we can be really hard on ourselves.
Speaker 1: So UM, compassion you know is essential here. Yeah, absolutely
Speaker 1: So are there other issues that you um saw Joanes
Speaker 1: struggling with that you felt like you wanted to talk
Speaker 1: a little bit more about. I think, UM, you know,
Speaker 1: I think, you know, the boundaries is really big. I think, UM,
Speaker 1: you know, being able to tune into you're uh feelings
Speaker 1: and needs UM. You know, relying on you know, your
Speaker 1: inner wisdom or your intuition is really important. UM. You know.
Speaker 1: I think for Joan, I think, you know, I think
Speaker 1: we all have like these kind of learned responses when
Speaker 1: like things get overwhelming or we're stressed out. And I think,
Speaker 1: you know, looking at Joan is maybe looking at Okay,
Speaker 1: what are her coping skills that have worked for her
Speaker 1: in the past, and being able to UM utilize that,
Speaker 1: you know, you know, kind of like putting together her
Speaker 1: coping skills toolbox and being able to teach her new
Speaker 1: coping skills that she can integrate. UM. You know, when
Speaker 1: life gets hectic, you know there's there's life is full
Speaker 1: of ups and downs and the front challenges, and the
Speaker 1: more options she has to be able to respond to
Speaker 1: those challenges, UM, the better she can bounce back and
Speaker 1: be more resilient UM and feel you know, good about
Speaker 1: herself and ability to handle and manage like you know,
Speaker 1: life UM stressors. You bring up an interesting point about
Speaker 1: the coping strategies because it seems like one of Jones's
Speaker 1: coping strategies and probably in some ways in her life
Speaker 1: this worked, and in some ways it probably was not
Speaker 1: super effective. But she definitely was a bit of a
Speaker 1: control freak. Yes, it seems like when she really got stressed,
Speaker 1: she would really kind of threw herself into kind of
Speaker 1: trying to take control over something else. So can you
Speaker 1: talk about like how that might be effective but then
Speaker 1: maybe not so effective? Yeah, I think you know, the
Speaker 1: feeling of being out of control UM can be very
Speaker 1: anxiety provoking for people, so, you know, trying to throw
Speaker 1: themselves in being productive or maybe some you know, destructive
Speaker 1: behaviors UM can take place. So looking at okay, what
Speaker 1: behaviors like? So if if she's if she's engaging in destructing,
Speaker 1: destructive behaviors or unhealthy behaviors, Okay, what function do these
Speaker 1: behaviors serve for me? You know? Is this a way
Speaker 1: for me to like mediate my anxiety UM and to
Speaker 1: like self soothed myself um? And so if that's the case, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm doing this in an attempt to soothe and mediate
Speaker 1: my anxiety. What are some other alternative ways in which
Speaker 1: I can mediate my anxiety? And so that's where, like
Speaker 1: the other coping skills can come into But this all
Speaker 1: has to start with, you know, observing and being a
Speaker 1: witness to yourself and observing how you interact and these
Speaker 1: types of situations and being been able to like pause
Speaker 1: and say, Okay, I'm feeling anxious, I'm getting ready to
Speaker 1: do this like not so great. Um behavior, Um, let
Speaker 1: me slow down, let me do some deep breathing, and
Speaker 1: let me make a better choice here. I love that.
Speaker 1: I love that. So you have already offered us so
Speaker 1: many tips, but are there are there any other tips
Speaker 1: that you might have for our listeners who may be
Speaker 1: struggling with some of the same things that Joan struggled with.
Speaker 1: I think it's always important. Uh, And this can and
Speaker 1: anyone can do. This is just being able to tune
Speaker 1: into your body. Tune into what is your body trying
Speaker 1: to tell you. You know, how do you feel easically?
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, if we don't feel good physically,
Speaker 1: chances are we don't feel good emotionally. So you know,
Speaker 1: looking at okay, what what is trying to get my attention?
Speaker 1: You know, like just being in tune with your breath
Speaker 1: and you know the signals that your body gives you um,
Speaker 1: and being very attuned to that UM, I think, um,
Speaker 1: you know, we have a tendency to push through things
Speaker 1: and ignore you know, a little eggs and pains. But
Speaker 1: those little eggs and pains are I have a lot
Speaker 1: of information in them that that are really important for
Speaker 1: us to know. So just listening um, so I think
Speaker 1: you know, and and being curious about yourself, you know,
Speaker 1: just um, having an attitude of curiosity about how you
Speaker 1: interact with people, how do you talk to yourself, how
Speaker 1: do you do with stress? Um? How do you care
Speaker 1: for yourself? And you know, I think starting there, um
Speaker 1: is a good step in the right direction. Got you,
Speaker 1: got you? So are there any resources that you might
Speaker 1: suggest for our listeners, Any books that you love to
Speaker 1: kind of refer to our websites? Yes, so, UM, I
Speaker 1: love all of Bernie Brown's books, The Gifts of Imperfection,
Speaker 1: Rising Strong. UM. I also really love Kristin Neff's book
Speaker 1: called Self Compassion, which I think we all really need. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, the world is full of snap judgments and um,
Speaker 1: you know, harsh criticism for people, and so just being
Speaker 1: able to look at you know, how do you talk
Speaker 1: to yourself? Is really port and UM. And another one
Speaker 1: of my favorites UM is Radical Acceptance by Tara Brock UM.
Speaker 1: She UM has a wealth of resources on her website,
Speaker 1: which is Tara Brock dot com, and she has meditations
Speaker 1: and lectures UM in addition to the books that she's
Speaker 1: written UM and I on my website have a list
Speaker 1: of you know, book recommendations UM that people can look at. UM.
Speaker 1: I've recently have gotten really into podcasts, I want to say,
Speaker 1: in the last couple of years. So UM. I really
Speaker 1: like The Relationship a live podcast UM. It's hosted by
Speaker 1: Neil Satin and he interviews a lot of UM therapists
Speaker 1: and relationship experts UM. You know about a whole host
Speaker 1: of topics from emotional manipulation UM you know to like
Speaker 1: how to build better communication with your partner. UM. I
Speaker 1: think that's a great UH podcast to check out. Another
Speaker 1: great podcast UM actually UM that kind of targets women
Speaker 1: of color is called Black Girl and Own UM and
Speaker 1: that's O M like the Yoga own UM. That's a
Speaker 1: really great UM podcast. They also have a website with
Speaker 1: a lot of great resources and UH women and Women
Speaker 1: in Depth UM, and that's hosted by Laura's Yatto. She's
Speaker 1: another UM therapist based out of Las Vegas, and she
Speaker 1: also interviews a lot of of therapists and other UM
Speaker 1: you know, you know, helping professionals regarding topic related to
Speaker 1: women's I think those three podcasts aren't really great to
Speaker 1: check out, UM. Yeah, And I mean I think, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, just being able to UM, just being able
Speaker 1: to be open um to the different resources out there
Speaker 1: is really great. And looking at like what's going on
Speaker 1: in your local community and what workshops might be available
Speaker 1: UM is a great way to kind of get involved
Speaker 1: in touch upon some subjects that you might be curious about,
Speaker 1: maybe before you you UM go into therapy, or you
Speaker 1: know you're thinking about therapy. UM. I think these podcasts
Speaker 1: are are great ways to start that process. Those are
Speaker 1: some amazing resources, John, and I had not heard about
Speaker 1: a lot of those, so I have to check those
Speaker 1: out myself. Yeah. I really enjoyed them. And these will
Speaker 1: all be included in the show notes, so you don't
Speaker 1: have to worry about trying to write all of this down.
Speaker 1: If you're listening, UM, I'll include all of these in
Speaker 1: the show notes. So tell us a little bit more
Speaker 1: about your work. I think that you have a pretty
Speaker 1: amazing website, and I think that your practice is a
Speaker 1: very cool thing. Um. So your practice is called the
Speaker 1: Fulfillment Project. So can you tell us a little bit
Speaker 1: more about your practice and where we can find you
Speaker 1: all across social media? Sure? So, UM, I started the
Speaker 1: Fulfillment Project um uh for two reasons. One for myself
Speaker 1: because I was searching for fulfillment in my own life
Speaker 1: and I wanted to be able to UM, to be
Speaker 1: able to give that to other people, to help people
Speaker 1: find their own mice. Fulfillment and fulfillment can come through
Speaker 1: many different ways, but I think the UM the most
Speaker 1: important ways to come your own your own fulfillment, you know,
Speaker 1: being happy with yourself um. And so uh, my work
Speaker 1: revolves around working with women uh and mostly in their twenties, thirties,
Speaker 1: and forties, and you know, working through all of the
Speaker 1: issues that we've kind of touched upon today, you know,
Speaker 1: you know, building a strong sense of self and purpose um,
Speaker 1: looking at the things that you value and looking at
Speaker 1: your belief systems, you know, looking at the things that
Speaker 1: are blocking you, um from change. UM. And I mean
Speaker 1: when I talk about change, positive change and um, you
Speaker 1: know doing that through you know, building uh relationships, like
Speaker 1: building a good relationship with each other so that you
Speaker 1: can transform your relationship with yourself and then in turn
Speaker 1: transform your relationships with the people in your life. So,
Speaker 1: you know, I, as I think I mentioned before, I
Speaker 1: use ART, I use cognitive behavior therapy. I use some
Speaker 1: elements of you know, somebody based interventions and um, you
Speaker 1: know enjoy also using um, you know, any kinds of
Speaker 1: means in which you know, you express yourself and being
Speaker 1: able to bring that into the therapy room and you know,
Speaker 1: work through uh the things that are important to you wonderful.
Speaker 1: And what about social media? I know a lot of
Speaker 1: people will want to kind of look you up after
Speaker 1: they hear this, So where can we find you on
Speaker 1: social media? So uh on social media, I have uh
Speaker 1: Instagram and Facebook pages under it's just the Fulfillment Project.
Speaker 1: And I have a Twitter account and that's at Life
Speaker 1: Points blog and yeah, that's all of my that's yeah,
Speaker 1: there's so many ways you can't get in with me
Speaker 1: perfect and I will include those in the show notes
Speaker 1: as well. Well. Thank you so much to Han. This
Speaker 1: has definitely been an excellent conversation. I think that our
Speaker 1: listeners will be able to get a lot of great
Speaker 1: information about what you share today, so I really appreciate that.
Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. You're very welcome. So, as
Speaker 1: you heard, Johanna and I had a great conversation about
Speaker 1: a lot of the issues that Joan struggled with, which
Speaker 1: are some of the same issues that a lot of
Speaker 1: black women are still struggling with. I'd love to hear
Speaker 1: your feedback about the episode. Let us know what you thought.
Speaker 1: Remember to find us on social media where on Instagram
Speaker 1: and Facebook at Therapy for Black Girls, and you can
Speaker 1: find us on Twitter at Therapy for the Number four
Speaker 1: p Girls. And if you have any questions or feedback,
Speaker 1: you can also send us an email at podcast at
Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls dot com. Looking forward to continue
Speaker 1: in this conversation with you real soon. Take care,