Speaker 1: Pushkin does is talk Easy. I'm saying for Goso. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the show today. I'm joined by actor and musician
Speaker 1: Alana him Alana is one third of the pop rock
Speaker 1: band Highum, created by her and her two older sisters,
Speaker 1: Danielle and Esti Hiham. Since creating the group in two
Speaker 1: thousand and seven, they've released three records to public and
Speaker 1: critical acclaim, including Days Are Gone, Something to Tell You,
Speaker 1: and Women in Music Part Three. They've also toured throughout
Speaker 1: the US and abroad, and were recently nominated at the
Speaker 1: Grammys for Best Rock Performance for the Steps An Album
Speaker 1: of the Year, making them the first all female band
Speaker 1: to be up for that award. Each of the three
Speaker 1: sisters and their parents appear in the new film Liquorice Pizza,
Speaker 1: directed by Paul Thomas Anderson. In it, Alana plays Alana Kane,
Speaker 1: a rutderless twenty five year old living with their parents
Speaker 1: working as a photo assistant in the San Fernando Valley
Speaker 1: circa nineteen seventy three. It's on the job at a
Speaker 1: high school photo picture day that we meet Alana. There
Speaker 1: she meets Gary Valentine, played by Cooper Hoffman, son of
Speaker 1: the late Great actor Philip Seymour Hoffman, who was a
Speaker 1: herring figure in Anderson's filmography, but here back. In this scene,
Speaker 1: Cooper plays Gary, this precocious fifteen year old who, after
Speaker 1: a protracted conversation with Alana waiting in line for his
Speaker 1: class photo, invites on a date. She rebuffs his advances,
Speaker 1: but then later says yes to dinner. After sharing a meal,
Speaker 1: they walk and talk. Here's a little bit from that
Speaker 1: scene from Liquorice Pizza, now out in theaters. If I
Speaker 1: as for your phone number, would you give it to me?
Speaker 1: Why should I give you my phone number so I
Speaker 1: can call you? I don't know, Gary? Why not? Hey,
Speaker 1: you're gonna remember it's only seven numbers seven five eight
Speaker 1: four six eight six seven five six four six eighty
Speaker 1: six five eight four six say sex alright though racles
Speaker 1: don't call me all the time. Okay, we're not boyfriend
Speaker 1: and girlfriend. Remember that. Even in that brief clip, you
Speaker 1: can hear the film's beating heart. As writer Lauren Wilford describes,
Speaker 1: Licorice Pizza is a warm tribute to a kind of
Speaker 1: relationship we stuff in the back of a mental drawer.
Speaker 1: The ill advised crush turned achingly mutual transmuted not into
Speaker 1: a romantic relationship, but into an ambiguous, charged entanglement. And
Speaker 1: it's that charged entanglement that powers the film, and most
Speaker 1: of its voltage comes from Alanna's dynamic performance, her first,
Speaker 1: by the way, in a feature film. We talk about
Speaker 1: that in this conversation, but we also walk through the
Speaker 1: parts of herself she saw in this character, growing up
Speaker 1: in the valley, falling in love, how the stars aligned
Speaker 1: in the making of this movie, and what she hopes
Speaker 1: for herself and him in the year ahead. I hope
Speaker 1: you enjoy I didn't need breakfast. Now I'm realized that
Speaker 1: I didn't need breakfast. I had coffee, coffee for breakfast. Okay,
Speaker 1: you had a cookie and I had a cookie. You're
Speaker 1: gonna be okay. We're definitely not gonna put this in there.
Speaker 1: M a loan of him. Hi, how are you doing?
Speaker 1: Doing great? I'm really happy to be here. I'm very excited.
Speaker 1: You came all the way out to Highland Park. I did.
Speaker 1: I love Highland Park. I live in in on the
Speaker 1: east Side. This is just a hop, skipping a jump.
Speaker 1: No one ever says that when they come here it's
Speaker 1: always like a big journey for everyone. Oh no, I
Speaker 1: love it, this whole movie you're in and your part
Speaker 1: in it. I know it's a whirlwind. But I think
Speaker 1: to understand how this even happened, we have to go
Speaker 1: back to the late seventies early eighties, where your mother,
Speaker 1: who's in her early twenties, moves from Philadelphia to California
Speaker 1: and gets a job assisting an art teacher at a
Speaker 1: private school in Sherman Oaks called the Buckley School. What
Speaker 1: happens next, A very crazy thing happened. So my mother
Speaker 1: got this job assisting a teacher at Buckley because she
Speaker 1: needed hours for her credential. And one day she was
Speaker 1: assisting this very lovely older woman. This said woman had
Speaker 1: a heart attack in the parking lot of the school
Speaker 1: and unfortunately passed away in the parking lot. How Paul
Speaker 1: describes Buckley, and I've had conversations with him, is that
Speaker 1: a lot of the teachers at Buckley were older, had
Speaker 1: like gray hair. You know, I feel like if you
Speaker 1: searched clip art teacher on like word, it's like an
Speaker 1: old lady with like gray hair and like a ruler.
Speaker 1: Maybe those are the teachers at Those are the teachers
Speaker 1: at Buckley at that time. My mom was in her
Speaker 1: early twenties, and I guess in the school system here,
Speaker 1: you don't actually need a teaching credential to teach in
Speaker 1: private school, which is telling a little crazy. Did not
Speaker 1: know that, and instead of finding a certified teacher, they
Speaker 1: just asked my mother if she would just join the
Speaker 1: team be the teacher. And my mom, of course was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: for sure, it's a pay raise. I'm actually gonna get paid,
Speaker 1: and all I want to do is teach. And so
Speaker 1: my mom completely transformed the classroom almost overnight, like brought
Speaker 1: her record player in, her instruments, her guitar that she
Speaker 1: had gone when she was sixteen. It was a Yamaha
Speaker 1: and nylon string that she had gotten and she had
Speaker 1: saved ember. She used to tell me that she used
Speaker 1: to take old bicycle tires and cut them up and
Speaker 1: make stamps out of them. That was like a big,
Speaker 1: you know, our project that she loved doing every year.
Speaker 1: She was resourceful, super resourceful, super like hippie mom, like
Speaker 1: love just letting her kids that she taught run free.
Speaker 1: And one of her students was Paul Thomas Anderson. He
Speaker 1: was very young, he was like six seven or eight,
Speaker 1: and she always talked about how Paul was super just
Speaker 1: really creative, like she could never tell him what to do.
Speaker 1: It was like, okay, we're making stamps out of bicycle tires,
Speaker 1: and he would be off somewhere just doing whatever he wanted.
Speaker 1: And she loved that. She loved any sort of creativity,
Speaker 1: and he was kind of in love with her. I mean,
Speaker 1: he says that, I don't know if he's actually in
Speaker 1: love with my mom. I mean, I think the thing
Speaker 1: is that my mom was so completely different to all
Speaker 1: the teachers that were at Buckley. She looked like me,
Speaker 1: and in comparison to the clip art version of a teacher,
Speaker 1: my mom probably looked like an angel to a young
Speaker 1: Paul Thomas Anderson. But she was miss Rose. She wasn't
Speaker 1: miss him. She hadn't even met my dad yet, which
Speaker 1: is like, come on for a name for an art teacher,
Speaker 1: Miss Rose Clams Honey, Yeah, it Selelia Matilda. So when
Speaker 1: you grew up and you all would be watching his
Speaker 1: early movies, wouldn't she be commenting on them like totally?
Speaker 1: I mean we would watch like the TBS version of
Speaker 1: Boogie Nights, which is like the highly edited version. I
Speaker 1: think it's like ten minutes long. Yeah, it's like ten
Speaker 1: minutes long. I can't even imagine it now. But it's
Speaker 1: very highly edited and bleeped, and you know a lot
Speaker 1: of you know, censory. But anytime we would see anything
Speaker 1: about Paul, even in the news or you know, if
Speaker 1: he had a movie coming out, we'd always my mom
Speaker 1: would always be like, I taught him, you know, I
Speaker 1: taught him. And there was never really like evidence, like
Speaker 1: there was a yearbook that you know, Paul was in
Speaker 1: it and so was my mom, and like we could
Speaker 1: assume that my mom taught him, but like I'm always
Speaker 1: just like, come on, Mom, like, did you actually teach him? That?
Speaker 1: Three of you were skeptical though very skeptical, I mean
Speaker 1: we're always skeptical about anything, but yeah, no, when we eventually,
Speaker 1: one day we got a call from my friend Asa
Speaker 1: to Con who's an electric guest, this band, electric guest
Speaker 1: who actually gave me my first job. One of my
Speaker 1: first jobs when I was sixteen was to sing jingles
Speaker 1: for companies and I would get fifty dollars a session,
Speaker 1: which was a big deal for a sixteen year old.
Speaker 1: To have fifty dollars was like for Comcast, it was
Speaker 1: ce oh, mc a st that's what I would do
Speaker 1: about sixteen. I mean, I didn't get an allowance. My
Speaker 1: parents weren't giving me money, and like, of course, you know,
Speaker 1: I wanted to get into some trouble. So having fifty
Speaker 1: dollars as a sixteen year old was I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know where I'm going. I don't even know
Speaker 1: where the jingle is, like you somewhere, it's this podcast,
Speaker 1: it's now, it's on this podcast. But you know, no,
Speaker 1: I would show up and I would give fifty dollars
Speaker 1: at the end of the session. But ASA then eventually
Speaker 1: fifty dollars. That's so much money. That's too much money
Speaker 1: for a sixteen year old. I think they were ripping
Speaker 1: you off. Oh I was like so excited, fifty dollars
Speaker 1: for Comcast. I guess I don't even really what is Comcast.
Speaker 1: I don't even really know what it is. Maybe I
Speaker 1: should go back and sue them for child labor. They're
Speaker 1: actually a sponsor of the show. Oh shit, we love
Speaker 1: Comcast completely okay, good, But so ASA called this one
Speaker 1: day and said Paul Thomas Anderson reached out to me,
Speaker 1: because this is how Paul explains it. Paul, I guess,
Speaker 1: had heard Forever on the radio and he had looked
Speaker 1: at our liner notes and had seen that we had
Speaker 1: thanked Asa on our first record because he gave me
Speaker 1: my first job, so we thanked I mean, I also
Speaker 1: love him, but we thanked him on our record. And
Speaker 1: Paul knew Asa through the Lonely Island because ASA's brothers
Speaker 1: yormatkone and then called us through as and was like,
Speaker 1: you know him, give them my email, which is a
Speaker 1: crazy and Asa got us the email, and it took
Speaker 1: us like three days to message him back, not because
Speaker 1: we didn't want to, but just because we didn't know
Speaker 1: what to say, like what do you how do you
Speaker 1: write an email toil like an icon? You're like okay,
Speaker 1: And then finally we emailed him and he had invited
Speaker 1: us to his house in Tarzana, and we showed up
Speaker 1: and really like we really weren't going to tell him
Speaker 1: about mom, because my mom is a baby angel, like
Speaker 1: she honest, it's so hard to hate my mom. But
Speaker 1: I grew up hating all my teachers like I hated authority,
Speaker 1: and so I was just like, maybe we shouldn't tell Paul,
Speaker 1: because who knows he might have not liked mom. And
Speaker 1: we showed up an see immediately just said hi, my
Speaker 1: mom taught you. And he was like, who is your mom?
Speaker 1: Because he kind of felt the same way, like, oh God,
Speaker 1: who is your I hated all my teachers. We said
Speaker 1: my mom was Miss Rose and he said no way,
Speaker 1: and his eyes brightened and he went into his son's
Speaker 1: room and he took out this painting of the mounds
Speaker 1: from Close Encounters of the Third Kind and he's like,
Speaker 1: I painted this with your mom and I've kept it
Speaker 1: all these years. And that was like the beginning of
Speaker 1: our friendship was he's like, I loved your mom. And
Speaker 1: then we obviously talked about the valley for fifteen million
Speaker 1: hours and music and everything and we just became friends.
Speaker 1: So in between then and now, the four of you
Speaker 1: make a handful of music videos. Yes, you have this
Speaker 1: working relationship inside this movie, which is set in the
Speaker 1: San Fernando Valley. Nineteen seventy three, I think the years
Speaker 1: you're playing this woman in her early twenties. We meet
Speaker 1: her as a photographer assistant on the job. You meet
Speaker 1: and began to develop a friendship with this high school
Speaker 1: student named Gary who's fifteen precocious, ambitious. As a film
Speaker 1: play out, it's clear she has some arrested development. There's
Speaker 1: a clear age gap between the two of you, but
Speaker 1: you both feel like the same age. And I wanted
Speaker 1: to start inside the movie with this because you've had
Speaker 1: a long standing theory as I understand it, that you think,
Speaker 1: whoever we are in seventh grade, yes, is who we're
Speaker 1: going to be forever. Where do those two dovetail for
Speaker 1: you between that theory and this movie. I do believe
Speaker 1: that because I do feel like I have the same
Speaker 1: confidence as I did when I was in seventh grade.
Speaker 1: And when I say I have the confidence of somebody,
Speaker 1: that means I have zero confidence. It means that I'm
Speaker 1: like literally the girl at the party, like everyone's playing
Speaker 1: spin the bottle and no one wants to make out
Speaker 1: with me kind of energy. I just think it was
Speaker 1: such a formative year of my life. I mean, bomb
Speaker 1: It's for season. If we're talking about Jewish vocabulary, Bombits
Speaker 1: with season was very life changing scene for me, but
Speaker 1: a lot of cane. It's interesting because when you meet her,
Speaker 1: I mean, she has a job, she seems like she
Speaker 1: kind of knows what she's doing, and then you scratch
Speaker 1: the surface, like just a little bit, and it's like, no,
Speaker 1: she lives with her parents still, and she has no
Speaker 1: idea what she's doing, and she's very confused about life.
Speaker 1: And she meets Gary, who on the surface is a
Speaker 1: teenager who doesn't seem like he has anything going on
Speaker 1: for his life. And then actually he has a job
Speaker 1: that's way better than Alana's. He takes care of his
Speaker 1: brother while his mom is off doing pr for the
Speaker 1: hacienda in Las Vegas, and he's kind of actually the
Speaker 1: more mature one, which is so interesting to me because
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm the baby of the family, so I
Speaker 1: have two sisters that basically have taken care of me
Speaker 1: my whole life. Even though I'm almost thirty, I still
Speaker 1: feel again like I'm in seventh grade. I never and
Speaker 1: I never will change. When you've decided to say yes
Speaker 1: to this, how much of yourself did you see in
Speaker 1: this character? I saw a lot of myself in the
Speaker 1: fact that she is kind of thrown into these crazy
Speaker 1: jobs and the way that she really does adapt quickly.
Speaker 1: I think you see it mostly when she's with Joel Wax.
Speaker 1: I think at that point with Alana Kane, she really
Speaker 1: needs to get her life together. I mean she's just
Speaker 1: driven a U haul backwards down you know, the hills
Speaker 1: with Tarzana almost you know, just escaping life, you know,
Speaker 1: by an inch, and she realizes, Okay, it's time, like
Speaker 1: I need I need to get my life together. And
Speaker 1: you see her getting introduced as just like a junior person,
Speaker 1: and then very quickly she becomes Joel Wax's right hand
Speaker 1: girl that you know, he trusts her and cares for
Speaker 1: her and wants her to succeed. And I think that
Speaker 1: I really do see myself in that sense that I've
Speaker 1: worked a million jobs and I really do fall a
Speaker 1: head first and I really want to do a good job,
Speaker 1: and I am really hard working in that sense. I
Speaker 1: also just love that she knows how to sell a
Speaker 1: water bed, like I mean, my parents grew up selling
Speaker 1: T shirts on the boardwalk of Wildwood, and so I
Speaker 1: feel like I have this Schmata business kind of running
Speaker 1: through my veins. I can sell anything, and I definitely
Speaker 1: could sell a water bed. I don't think I could.
Speaker 1: And really, you can sell a water bed, I'll sell
Speaker 1: you a water bed. Go ahead, Do you want to
Speaker 1: lay in some liquid luxury? The motion of the ocean.
Speaker 1: I have motion signals, so that this is not for you. Actually,
Speaker 1: I'll sell you a bean bag check. You know you
Speaker 1: can tell me what dramamine. I'm doubt I can. I'll
Speaker 1: tell you some tram amine. But even like even other
Speaker 1: than that, I mean, I think the thing that I
Speaker 1: love about Alanta is which I really do connect with,
Speaker 1: is that she is incredibly protective of the people that
Speaker 1: she loves. She'll go to the ends of the earth
Speaker 1: for anyone that she loves and anyone that's on her team.
Speaker 1: And I feel very much though the same way. Putting
Speaker 1: a pause on the conversation for a second, we'll be
Speaker 1: right back with Alana Heim after this quick break. Before
Speaker 1: the break, you were talking about your side of this story,
Speaker 1: the Alana character. But on the other end, we have
Speaker 1: Gary played by Cooper Hoffman. For him, your character represents
Speaker 1: that first true love or whatever we think love is
Speaker 1: at that age. And he's fifteen years old, and it
Speaker 1: makes me think back to you at fifteen years old,
Speaker 1: where I think you fell in love for the first time.
Speaker 1: There's a high school house party and growing up your parents,
Speaker 1: very respectful, decent people say wherever you go, you have
Speaker 1: to bring a gift. Yes, And so to a high
Speaker 1: schooler's house party, you bring I bring a cake? How
Speaker 1: embarrassing is that? See? But now do you understand what
Speaker 1: I say? Like I still feel like I'm in seventh
Speaker 1: grade because literally I was fifteen, so I was two
Speaker 1: years out of you know, I was. I was a
Speaker 1: sophomore in high school. And the same ange is Gary,
Speaker 1: the same age is Gary. And I'm thinking, Okay, it's
Speaker 1: my first high school party. Like imagine me getting ready
Speaker 1: for my first high school party. I'm like putting my
Speaker 1: makeup on, I'm picking out it off, and I go,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I don't have a gift to bring
Speaker 1: to this high school party. I must make a baked
Speaker 1: good because that is is good. That's like my version
Speaker 1: of bringing a bottle of wine when I'm like older.
Speaker 1: Some people are worried about fits you were worried about
Speaker 1: I was like worried about Like how embarrassing is it
Speaker 1: going to be that everyone is going to bring a
Speaker 1: gift and I'm the one that's going to be the
Speaker 1: asshole that doesn't bring a gift. Like the host will
Speaker 1: look at me and just be like, how dare you
Speaker 1: step into this house where I have offered drinks and
Speaker 1: fun and you bring me nothing. You are empty handed?
Speaker 1: How dare you? And So I made a cake with frosting,
Speaker 1: literally boxed cake, frosted it sprinkles, bring it to this
Speaker 1: high school party, and of course you know it's not
Speaker 1: a shocker that everyone was like, why did you bring
Speaker 1: this cake? Again? I did not go out very much.
Speaker 1: This is making me sound so insanely crazy, but I
Speaker 1: was very proud of this cake, to the point where
Speaker 1: I needed to serve this cake to the partygoers that
Speaker 1: were probably stoned and drunk. But I never partook it that.
Speaker 1: I was like, I have this cake so oblivious to
Speaker 1: everything going on around me U and I served a
Speaker 1: piece of the cake to my first boyfriend. The only
Speaker 1: person that's really interested in the cake is Sam. I'll
Speaker 1: say the same as Sam, Same Sam. His name is Sam.
Speaker 1: That was not plan. It was an off plan. I
Speaker 1: wasn't gonna say it, but then I felt like it
Speaker 1: was fitting. But this experience of falling in love at fifteen,
Speaker 1: I want to sit with this because that's happening in
Speaker 1: this movie. It's literally set in the valley where you
Speaker 1: also grew up. What is that like? As the past
Speaker 1: kind of converges with this fictional world of a movie.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think the thing that is so crazy
Speaker 1: is like watching the movie as a whole now, because
Speaker 1: while you're making we were shooting on film, there's you know,
Speaker 1: there was not a lot of instances where I could
Speaker 1: see what we had done, you know, played back to me.
Speaker 1: It's very hard to do that, or at least that's
Speaker 1: what Paul told me, and I never asked. It seems
Speaker 1: very hard to play back of something film, you know,
Speaker 1: And so I didn't really not like we would be
Speaker 1: shooting this obviously need the succession of the film, and
Speaker 1: I knew you know, where what parts went where, But
Speaker 1: when you actually see it for the first time, I mean,
Speaker 1: I thought about, Sam, what did you think? I think
Speaker 1: it's such so crazy to think about a love that
Speaker 1: you had when you had no walls, and it only
Speaker 1: happens once in your life. I truly believe that it
Speaker 1: only happens once in my life, once in anyone's life,
Speaker 1: because it's the first time. It's the first cut, The
Speaker 1: first cut is the deepest. Obviously the song was right,
Speaker 1: but you think about this kind of love that's like
Speaker 1: that has no walls. You're falling down a rabbit hole
Speaker 1: that has you know, you feel like you're drowning and
Speaker 1: you have no air and you feel like it's gonna
Speaker 1: last forever. And I did. And just so everybody knows,
Speaker 1: this isn't even gonna me sound even crazier and I'm
Speaker 1: getting so fucking real with you right now. That relationship
Speaker 1: lasted three months. Three months, that was it. It wasn't
Speaker 1: even like I said I love you, because we never
Speaker 1: even said I love you to each other. But it
Speaker 1: was the first time I had ever looked at someone
Speaker 1: said I like you and then they said back, I
Speaker 1: like you too. And it was the craziest feeling. It
Speaker 1: felt like fireworks going off in your body. You're like,
Speaker 1: I had only said I like you to a handful
Speaker 1: of people before that, and there was never oh, I
Speaker 1: like you too. It was oh hm, well, okay, interesting, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go to the bathroom really quick. Like it
Speaker 1: was very much like that. And so even having that
Speaker 1: happened for the first time, I mean, it's crazy. It's
Speaker 1: a crazy feeling. And I mean, at least for me,
Speaker 1: you can only go through it once and it never
Speaker 1: happens again. You don't know, I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I mean I haven't, I haven't since. And also this
Speaker 1: is embarrassing, Like me and Sam are actually friends' actually
Speaker 1: very close friends. Now he's going to be very embarrassed
Speaker 1: if he ever listens to this. But I love him.
Speaker 1: I think he's great, and he's he's a great friend now.
Speaker 1: But when I think about that time in my life
Speaker 1: when I was so young and had no walls, it
Speaker 1: was it was a very cherished time. I do think
Speaker 1: the joy of the movie is that it does capture
Speaker 1: that boundless feeling where two people don't know any better
Speaker 1: except your character kind of does know because she's older.
Speaker 1: Gary at fifteen like you at fifteen, they're just winging it. Well.
Speaker 1: I think the things that's really important with the Gary
Speaker 1: and a lot of relationship is it's not really a
Speaker 1: lot about this crazy love connection. I think it's more
Speaker 1: about like the universe. This is how I look at it.
Speaker 1: I mean, even talking about how I met Paul, the
Speaker 1: crazy story that I just talked about, I mean I
Speaker 1: have a crazier story meeting Cooper, which I will divulge
Speaker 1: right now. Meeting Cooper was insane because me and my
Speaker 1: siblings were doing music videos for a second album, and
Speaker 1: we had to do a music video for a Little
Speaker 1: of Your Love, and of course, in true high and fashion,
Speaker 1: we had no time. We had like put it off
Speaker 1: on the back burner. And also we had asked Paul
Speaker 1: and he was like, I mean, I'm in editing for
Speaker 1: Phantom Threadling, please I need to just do my thing.
Speaker 1: And finally I got to the point where we hadn't.
Speaker 1: I mean, we were freaking out and we had tried
Speaker 1: to shoot a music video and it didn't work out.
Speaker 1: And finally we just texted Paul with our tail between
Speaker 1: our legs, being like please, like begging him, like please,
Speaker 1: can you just do this music video? Like we're lost?
Speaker 1: And he was like okay, fine, like come to the
Speaker 1: editing house and we'll figure it out. And so we
Speaker 1: went to the Phantom Threat editing house, which was in
Speaker 1: the valley. Of course, I walked in the door and
Speaker 1: there was Paul and his editor Andy and this very
Speaker 1: large chair and a young man sitting in the chair
Speaker 1: and it was Cooper. But I didn't know that yet.
Speaker 1: I just like, who's this kid? And Paul had gotten
Speaker 1: you know, he had to go do something, but he
Speaker 1: had Cooper with him, but Cooper was hungry and Paul said,
Speaker 1: you know, can you just handle Cooper? Can you just
Speaker 1: get him something to eat? I was like sure, and
Speaker 1: it was Misi and Danielle were like what do like
Speaker 1: I think he was thirteen or fourteen at the time.
Speaker 1: We're like, what do thirteen or fourteen year olds like?
Speaker 1: What did they like to eat? Like? We were like
Speaker 1: down the street from the original Kidsuya in the Valley
Speaker 1: and we were like, sure, we're just staying to get
Speaker 1: some sushi, and we like sat down and I remember Coop.
Speaker 1: He's gonna come me for saying this, but I remember
Speaker 1: Cooper had like a retainer and he like check out
Speaker 1: his retainer and it was like, I mean, like put
Speaker 1: it down on this like gen Napkin, just disgusting. And
Speaker 1: the second that that retainer was out, it was like,
Speaker 1: so what are we having? You want? You want some coach?
Speaker 1: Should we order some coasts? You want some sushi? What
Speaker 1: do you like sushi? Mean? Do you like Niger? It's
Speaker 1: just like going through like like Gary very Gary Valentine,
Speaker 1: and I was like what. I was like, who is
Speaker 1: this kid? He's looking us all in the eye asking
Speaker 1: his questions. So you know, what do you what do
Speaker 1: you like to do on your days off? Like things
Speaker 1: like that, just like insanity. And I remembered that dinner
Speaker 1: so vividly. I mean, I this was years before we
Speaker 1: had even thought of li ursh Pizza. And so when
Speaker 1: we were casting for Gary, because Paul had asked me to,
Speaker 1: you know, do this movie and we needed to find
Speaker 1: a Gary, I had auditioned with so many Garis at
Speaker 1: that point, Like there was so many Garies that you know,
Speaker 1: obviously were actor, real actors, like real kid actors that
Speaker 1: had an IMDb page, like full credits beyond like way
Speaker 1: beyond me. I mean I had never been in anything,
Speaker 1: so like one credit was more credits than me. I know, no,
Speaker 1: it's truly literally, like the only thing I had to
Speaker 1: my name was music videos. And I remember just wanting
Speaker 1: this overwhelming feeling of like, oh, you're you're my Gary,
Speaker 1: and I never got it with all these other people.
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden one day, Paul kind
Speaker 1: of turned to me and said, you know, like what
Speaker 1: about Cooper And the fact that he could say Cooper's
Speaker 1: name and me know exactly who it was. I mean
Speaker 1: we only had met once. Basically, I immediately had this
Speaker 1: like burst of like, oh, yes, Cooper, this is yes Cooper,
Speaker 1: and we flew to New York. We read with Cooper.
Speaker 1: I got that overwhelming feeling and the thing that I
Speaker 1: always go about, which I've been thinking a lot about two,
Speaker 1: especially since like me and Paul have such a crazy,
Speaker 1: you know, universal thing where it felt like we were
Speaker 1: like kind of orbiting around each other but not colliding,
Speaker 1: and then finally we did. It kind of felt that
Speaker 1: way with Cooper two, where it was like at that point,
Speaker 1: if we had never shown up to this phantom thread
Speaker 1: editing house, if Paul didn't get the call that he
Speaker 1: had to leave, if Paul didn't ask us to grab
Speaker 1: Cooper food, like all these things that were like, if
Speaker 1: that day just never happened, I would have never met Cooper,
Speaker 1: and I honestly don't feel like licorice pizza would have
Speaker 1: ever been made. And that's what I think that's so
Speaker 1: important about Gary and Alana's Like they meet at Gary's school.
Speaker 1: She's working for this dick that's a fucking photographer that
Speaker 1: like slabs her on the ash. She's obviously does not
Speaker 1: like this job. And she meets this guy and she
Speaker 1: doesn't know it yet, but you know it by the
Speaker 1: end of the movie. Like you meet so many people
Speaker 1: in this world and you never know who's gonna stick
Speaker 1: with you. And that was there, like, Oh, they didn't
Speaker 1: know that their lives were gonna get changed, but their
Speaker 1: lives were changed. They're these like two magnets that like refuse.
Speaker 1: Every time you try to pull them apart, the universe
Speaker 1: just pulls them back together. It's like the making of
Speaker 1: the movie and then the story of the movie are
Speaker 1: cosmically aligned about the same yeah, which is your life
Speaker 1: can change an instant one hundred percent. When I think
Speaker 1: back on my life and I think about the people
Speaker 1: that changed my life, you never know until like way later,
Speaker 1: it makes me very emotional. It's a crazy scenario. Why emotional.
Speaker 1: It just makes me emotional in this sense, like how
Speaker 1: rich my life is with such amazing people, Like I'm
Speaker 1: so grateful to meet someone like Paul and to meet Cooper, Like,
Speaker 1: look at this thing that we made that we're so
Speaker 1: proud of, and it's all because of like these weird
Speaker 1: cosmic instances that brought us together. Like it feels like
Speaker 1: a movie in itself, the way that we've all met
Speaker 1: and it makes me emotional because I'm just so happy
Speaker 1: that I have these two people in my life. And
Speaker 1: also my family feels the same way, even the people
Speaker 1: that are involved in the movie. I mean, Cooper's whole
Speaker 1: families in the movie, Paul's whole family is in the movie,
Speaker 1: My whole family is in the movie, and like, we
Speaker 1: all kind of joined in as this nuclear family for
Speaker 1: this whole process and it's amazing. Well, why don't we
Speaker 1: sit with a scene from the movie for a second.
Speaker 1: This is between you and Cooper Hoffman as his character
Speaker 1: Gary believes he's on a first date. What are your plans?
Speaker 1: I don't know, but your future looked like I don't know.
Speaker 1: How do you like working a tiny toes? I hate
Speaker 1: working at tiny toes? You should start your own business.
Speaker 1: What business should I be in? I don't know. What
Speaker 1: do you like? I don't know. You're an actress. You
Speaker 1: should be an actress. So how do you become such
Speaker 1: a hotshot actor. I'm a showman. It's my calling. I
Speaker 1: don't know how to do anything else. That's what I'm
Speaker 1: meant to do. I mean, ever since I was a kid,
Speaker 1: I've been a song and dance one. Ever since you
Speaker 1: were a kid song and dance. Man, where are your parents?
Speaker 1: My mom works for me. She does in my public
Speaker 1: relations company, in your public relations company. Because you have
Speaker 1: that yes, and you're an actor, yes, and you're a
Speaker 1: secret agent too. Well, No, I'm not a secret agent.
Speaker 1: That's funny. That was a clip from Liquorice Pizza, directed
Speaker 1: by Paul Thomas Anderson. We've been talking about all the
Speaker 1: ways in which you Alana and then the character Alana
Speaker 1: are similar, but in thinking about that scene, the one
Speaker 1: place where you too diverge is that from an early
Speaker 1: age you had some idea of what you wanted to do.
Speaker 1: You and your sisters created Higham in two thousand and seven.
Speaker 1: You're fifteen sixteen at the time. I think, yeah, I
Speaker 1: was sixteen. Five years later, in twenty twelve, you three
Speaker 1: are touring around the world and after one particular show
Speaker 1: in New York, you do this interview and there's this
Speaker 1: quote that I wanted to sit with. Oh God, that's scared.
Speaker 1: What did I say? The fact that huge bands like
Speaker 1: this invited us to perform with them is the biggest
Speaker 1: compliment we could get. It's still hard for me to
Speaker 1: believe because when we're touring We're always onto the next show.
Speaker 1: But sometimes I stopped to think about it for a
Speaker 1: moment and say to myself, God forbid. Kids my age
Speaker 1: are still in college thinking about what they want to
Speaker 1: do in life, while I'm twenty one. I'm playing with
Speaker 1: Florence the Machine and Mumford and sons. I said that,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's true. I mean, I'm not gonna lie
Speaker 1: to you. When Hyams started, it wasn't like a very
Speaker 1: easy like, oh you know, he started this band and
Speaker 1: it was a montage plays of like all the cities
Speaker 1: and crowds, and you know, it's like, it's not an
Speaker 1: almost famous like montage. Oh I haven't actually seen the
Speaker 1: Queen movie, but I'll take your word for it. But yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it definitely wasn't like that. I mean, there was like
Speaker 1: a point where my parents sat me down, and it
Speaker 1: was right before I was about to graduate high school.
Speaker 1: They were like, what are you doing? Didn' Yelle was
Speaker 1: already off playing with bands as he was in college,
Speaker 1: as he was at UCLA. I did and get good
Speaker 1: enough grades to go to college, and I really just
Speaker 1: shipped the bed on that one. Unfortunately. I wish, I know,
Speaker 1: I wish I was smarter in high school and really
Speaker 1: paid attention, but I just couldn't. And they asked, like,
Speaker 1: what are you gonna do? And I was like, I
Speaker 1: want to be in high AM. This shocked face that
Speaker 1: they had, like they really wanted me to know, like
Speaker 1: just so you know, like yeah, you want to be
Speaker 1: in high HIGHAM might not happen. And it's just like
Speaker 1: that weird thing when you're like younger and you have
Speaker 1: this like blind optimism, like I want to be in
Speaker 1: HIGHM and you're like, uh, my parents were like, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I open your eyes a little bit. And so I
Speaker 1: actually at that point really didn't know what I was
Speaker 1: going to do graduating high school. And I think after that,
Speaker 1: you know, I went to Valley College, of course, and
Speaker 1: I worked at Crossroads Trading Company. I was also in
Speaker 1: nanny you know, I just like kind of did my
Speaker 1: thing for a while until dn' yell came home and
Speaker 1: that's when we really focused on him. But even then,
Speaker 1: so at that point then we actually played for like
Speaker 1: another five years. No one wanted to sign us in America.
Speaker 1: We were told crazy things like you guys, should you know,
Speaker 1: dress up like schoolgirls, like you should have like a stick,
Speaker 1: like the amount of crazy ship people used to tell
Speaker 1: us like when we were coming up, which was terrifying
Speaker 1: to be like, no, we don't want to have a
Speaker 1: stick thing. We just are very adamant about having our
Speaker 1: own path and we just kind of stuck to it
Speaker 1: and we went to south By Southwest. We were like
Speaker 1: one of those bands went to south By Southwest and
Speaker 1: we started out playing to like one person and then
Speaker 1: I think we played three shows a day for a
Speaker 1: week and by the end of that week there was
Speaker 1: a line around the corner. And like even after that,
Speaker 1: we were like, oh my god, this is crazy. We're
Speaker 1: doing it, and still no one wanted to sign us. Still,
Speaker 1: like we had heard that our songs being played on
Speaker 1: the radio in the UK, and then we were like, well,
Speaker 1: why don't we just go to the UK? And so
Speaker 1: we basically moved to the UK for a couple of
Speaker 1: years and just toward the UK and Europe nine times
Speaker 1: and then put out a record. Do you remember the
Speaker 1: moment when your parents said to you, I think this
Speaker 1: is gonna work. They were definitely skeptical. I mean I
Speaker 1: think when we were on SNL for the first time,
Speaker 1: that was a huge deal. Oh you know, I've never
Speaker 1: watched it. Its cry, I've never watched way too nervous
Speaker 1: to watch it. Why this is I am performing? Don't
Speaker 1: save me on s. That's so funny. I've never seen
Speaker 1: that before. I've always been too nervous. And you know what,
Speaker 1: I was probably right, even though you say you're nervous.
Speaker 1: You looked a little nervous there. But I've seen you
Speaker 1: perform before. You know how you were talking about. Anytime
Speaker 1: you go to a party, you have the confidence of
Speaker 1: a seventh grader. Yes, when you're performing, does that change? Oh? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean not on live television obviously, is what we
Speaker 1: just heard. Live television is different, um, but no, Like
Speaker 1: I mean, playing live is my favorite part of being
Speaker 1: in a band. When there's not a camera on me,
Speaker 1: it's the most free that I've ever been in my life.
Speaker 1: That's like where I'm most confident. But I think it
Speaker 1: just has to do with like the reaction that you
Speaker 1: get from like a crowd. It's very new, Like playing
Speaker 1: to big crowds is new or do you know it?
Speaker 1: In the moment when you're performing, can you feel like
Speaker 1: a different version of yourself? One hundred percent? And it's
Speaker 1: like an addicting feeling being on stage, and I feel
Speaker 1: like any person that you talked, I mean, at least
Speaker 1: for me. Maybe people don't like touring, but for the
Speaker 1: people that do like touring, it is like an addicting
Speaker 1: feeling being on stage because you get such a rush
Speaker 1: and there's so much energy, to the point where like
Speaker 1: when I step off stage, like I'm drenched in sweat,
Speaker 1: and I also like have zero energy. I don't know
Speaker 1: how the rock stars of the eighties were throwing TVs.
Speaker 1: I mean it's probably drugs, but I don't know how.
Speaker 1: After a show, for me, I'm like, I have maybe
Speaker 1: ten steps in me before I need to just be
Speaker 1: in a bed and passed out, because the anticipation of
Speaker 1: being on stage, even like is crazy. It's the hardest part.
Speaker 1: It's funny enough. Five minutes before I always go through
Speaker 1: the same ritual of like I have the most anxiety,
Speaker 1: and it's like the time where like I talk myself
Speaker 1: out of everything where I'm like, why do I do
Speaker 1: this to myself? Like this is so terrible, Like I'm
Speaker 1: so nervous just telling myself the worst things, just being
Speaker 1: like you're terrible, this sucks. I'm so scared how do
Speaker 1: I do this? Like, how am I going to step
Speaker 1: on stage? How am I going to do this? And
Speaker 1: then this second that I step on stage, it is
Speaker 1: like the line the Witch and the wardrobe. You're stepping
Speaker 1: through the wardrobe and you're a completely different person. So
Speaker 1: some part of the art helps you transcend past your
Speaker 1: own limitations. Yeah, totally. Like it's weird stepping on stage
Speaker 1: and having this weird wave of calm when five minutes
Speaker 1: before you're like having a full blown panic attack. But
Speaker 1: didn't you have a similar experience on your first day
Speaker 1: of shooting Liquorice Pizza. Oh my gosh, that was the
Speaker 1: craziest day. I mean, our first day of filming was
Speaker 1: with John Peters played by Bridley Cooper. The first time
Speaker 1: I saw Briley Cooper was the first time I heart action.
Speaker 1: And we like showed up to set. It was me
Speaker 1: and Coop his like band of guys that were his friends,
Speaker 1: and it felt like there was pure chaos. It kind
Speaker 1: of felt like I like turned my head and I
Speaker 1: turned back and everyone was gone. All our group of
Speaker 1: kids looked around like what's going on? And then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you just hear action and Briley Cooper's
Speaker 1: walking out in his costume and You're just like, oh shit.
Speaker 1: And then we were off to the races and it
Speaker 1: was like you either sank or you swim. And the
Speaker 1: first take I just saw the water. I just fully drowning.
Speaker 1: You know, Luckily with movies that I love is you
Speaker 1: can do as many takes as you know the director wants,
Speaker 1: which is great. I mean with music, if you fuck up,
Speaker 1: you gotta keep going, and you know you gotta wait
Speaker 1: for the next show. In a recent interview, you said
Speaker 1: I had to drive a U haul backwards down along street.
Speaker 1: You Alana, probably wouldn't normally be able to do that. No,
Speaker 1: we got through day one and I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: and now it's my turn, and I'm in this seventies
Speaker 1: U haul. Cooper is in the middle, Bradley Cooper is
Speaker 1: on the far right, and we have a film camera
Speaker 1: strapped to my side of the door. We have really heavy,
Speaker 1: big lights strapped to the front of the truck. I
Speaker 1: hardly could see. But of course I've got into this
Speaker 1: zone of I can do this because Paul, of course
Speaker 1: gave me like a pep talking was like, you can
Speaker 1: do this if Paul thinks I can do this. I
Speaker 1: think I can do this. And we drove through, you know,
Speaker 1: the hills of Tarzana and it was so terrifying. The
Speaker 1: thing is is like you go through it once and
Speaker 1: you're like, huh, I made it, and then it's like,
Speaker 1: all right, let's turn it around, let's do it again,
Speaker 1: and like I did it all night. But by the time,
Speaker 1: you know, Cooper talks about it all the time, we're
Speaker 1: like in the beginning, I was like shaking it. And
Speaker 1: by the end of it, I had like a walkie
Speaker 1: talkie and I was like, Gabby, we're in first, We're
Speaker 1: ready to go. Break is off. Here we go and
Speaker 1: I'm waiting for action. Fully just went for it. I
Speaker 1: was very comfortable by the end of it. You made
Speaker 1: it to the other side of this movie. I did,
Speaker 1: and then was scary and daunting. And also, I know
Speaker 1: the first experience, you didn't have your sisters for most
Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, how do you feel on the other
Speaker 1: side of something like this? You know, for the first time,
Speaker 1: I feel older, which is a weird feeling. I mean,
Speaker 1: I've been the baby of my family for a very
Speaker 1: long time, and when everyone with my sisters, I'm the
Speaker 1: baby of the family. So I kind of feel like
Speaker 1: this scrappy younger sister. I mean, I'm affectionately called Baby
Speaker 1: High and that's my nickname. And throughout this process, I
Speaker 1: feel like I have this new dictionary of life experiences.
Speaker 1: It feels like an inside out when like a new
Speaker 1: land opens up in the girl's brain and there's a
Speaker 1: new set of emotions. And that's kind of how I
Speaker 1: feel after doing this movie. They still have the confidence
Speaker 1: of the seventh grader, but I have a little bit
Speaker 1: more confidence about, you know, doing things on my own.
Speaker 1: And how does that feel? To go back to my
Speaker 1: point about seventh grade? So nice to know that, like
Speaker 1: you can grow older, but you know, you still feel
Speaker 1: like you're thirteen, young in heart, young in heart. Next
Speaker 1: year you go back to your day job, of I do.
Speaker 1: It's weird to talk about it, like as it's like
Speaker 1: my day job, like as if it's like back to
Speaker 1: the day job. Like no, I'm like so excited. I
Speaker 1: love being in high I love playing shows. I know,
Speaker 1: I'm very lucky. I'm a very lucky girl. It's not
Speaker 1: lost on me, believe me. Since many people haven't gone
Speaker 1: back to concerts yet. I know knock on wood please.
Speaker 1: I really need to go on tour. I miss it
Speaker 1: so much this record. Women in Music Part three, you
Speaker 1: said we made this record to be playing live. That
Speaker 1: was our mission statement for the whole album. What song
Speaker 1: from there are you most excited to play? Selfishly, it's
Speaker 1: kind of basic because it's like one of the singles.
Speaker 1: But the last couple of shows that we've done, We've
Speaker 1: played a couple shows and we opened the show with
Speaker 1: the steps and the energy of just hearing three snare
Speaker 1: hits like bra It reminded me of why I love
Speaker 1: doing this. I remember looking at my sister thinking about
Speaker 1: those like life moments where you're looking around and you're like,
Speaker 1: how the fuck did we get here? Hearing those three
Speaker 1: snare hits it's so simple, and watching my middle sister
Speaker 1: play the drums, we were all kind of like looking
Speaker 1: at each other, asking each other like, how the fuck
Speaker 1: did we fucking get here? Our life could have taken
Speaker 1: so many different turns. Did y'ell could have just kept
Speaker 1: going on and being a touring musician. Se could have
Speaker 1: gone on and done you know, she was at UCLA,
Speaker 1: she could have done whatever the fuck she wanted. I
Speaker 1: was kind of confused. I didn't know what I was.
Speaker 1: I was in Nanny, I was doing comcast jingles. Who
Speaker 1: would have known? And it really is not lost on me.
Speaker 1: I mean we say that sentence every show. We're like, damn,
Speaker 1: I can't believe it. It's unbelievable. This is the steps
Speaker 1: by him off Women in Music Part three. Every time
Speaker 1: the step, the step. But every day, Yeah, liked for myself,
Speaker 1: I know I should I don't even go. Do you
Speaker 1: my last question? Next week you turn thirty. By the
Speaker 1: time this comes out, you will be thirty. What do
Speaker 1: you hope for in this chapter? Turn? Oh my goodness,
Speaker 1: I mean damn. I like I said I was gonna
Speaker 1: get emotional, I'm like really getting emotional on this podcast
Speaker 1: right now. I feel like Jesus Christ, you're getting something
Speaker 1: out of me. But the thing that I learned in
Speaker 1: these first thirty years of life is that, honestly, it's
Speaker 1: a fucking roller coaster. There is really high highs and
Speaker 1: really low lows, and there's some days where you are
Speaker 1: just feel like you're drowning, and there's some days that
Speaker 1: you feel like you're floating. And my favorite thing that
Speaker 1: I've learned is that when you're in your high high,
Speaker 1: which happens rarely, I mean, but it does happen. You
Speaker 1: got to celebrate your winds, because it's hard sometimes to
Speaker 1: celebrate your wins because you know, like you're just like, oh, okay, cool,
Speaker 1: like and you move on and you don't really like
Speaker 1: sit with it and just be like, wow, what I
Speaker 1: just did was fucking rotten. I was happy, even if
Speaker 1: it's like I made a really good cup of coffee
Speaker 1: today and I'm fucking stoked, like my day has started
Speaker 1: off on a great moment. Celebrate that wind. There were
Speaker 1: some pretty amazing moments that happened in my life, especially
Speaker 1: with my siblings that we kind of just skirted over
Speaker 1: and we're just like like so stressed out all the time,
Speaker 1: just like on to the next. And I feel like
Speaker 1: celebrating your highs is really important. So when you're at
Speaker 1: your lows, your lows don't feel so low anymore. And
Speaker 1: I just, you know, hope I carry that on into
Speaker 1: my thirties. I think you will. And I want to
Speaker 1: thank you for sharing the highs and the lows. I
Speaker 1: know the highs were you know this movie. The lows
Speaker 1: were me bringing that cake to the seventh to the party.
Speaker 1: It was a nice gesture though it was such and
Speaker 1: it was a good cake. It was fun Betty, so
Speaker 1: I hope they enjoyed it. I mean, Sam did not
Speaker 1: me the way you But next time I'll bring I
Speaker 1: mean you brought me a cookie. Next time I'll bring
Speaker 1: you a cake. Our team brought you a cookie. I
Speaker 1: will not take credit for it. I appreciate it. Congratulations
Speaker 1: on the movie, speaking of a high thank you and
Speaker 1: best of luck on the tour. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I'm very excited, Alana Hi, thanks for coming in. Thank you,
Speaker 1: and that's our show special thanks to Tory com narrative PR,
Speaker 1: Gillian Smith, Chang, Camille Goldman, and of course Alana Higham.
Speaker 1: You can find screenings of Liquorice Pizza and upcoming shows
Speaker 1: from Hium in our show notes at talk easypod dot com.
Speaker 1: If you enjoy today's conversation and want to hear more
Speaker 1: like it, I recommend our talks with Steven Soderberg, Vicky Creeps,
Speaker 1: Janelle Money Lord, Kevin Abstract, Philip Baker, Hall, Laura Dern,
Speaker 1: Titus Burgess, and many many more. To hear those and
Speaker 1: other Pushkin podcasts, listen on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcast, Spotify,
Speaker 1: or wherever you do your podcasting. You can also follow
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Speaker 1: want to drop us a line, feel free to email
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Speaker 1: find Talk Easy. Speaking of this show would not be
Speaker 1: possible without our incredible team. Talk Easy is produced by
Speaker 1: Caroline Reebok. Our executive producer is Janick so Bravo. Our
Speaker 1: associate producer is Caitlin Dryden. Today's talk was edited by
Speaker 1: Clarisse Gavara and mixed by Andrew Vastola. Our engineer is
Speaker 1: Tim Moore, and we tape out of your recording here
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, California. Illustrations are by christ Chenoi. Video
Speaker 1: and graphics by Ian Chang, Derek Aberzack, Ian Jones and
Speaker 1: Ethan Seneca. Special thanks to Patrice Lee, Kylin Ung, Shiloh Fagan,
Speaker 1: Niki Spina, and Callie Syringis. I'd also like to thank
Speaker 1: the team at Pushkin Industries, Justin Richmond Heller, Faine, Mia LaBelle,
Speaker 1: Maggie Taylor, Nicole Morano, Maya Kanig, Carly Migliori, Jason Gambrel,
Speaker 1: Jacob Weisberg, and Malcolm Gladwell. I'm San Fragoso. Whether you're
Speaker 1: returning to Talk Easy after our brief hiatus or joining
Speaker 1: us for the first time, thank you for being here.
Speaker 1: We'll be back next week with New York Times journalists
Speaker 1: as reclined. Until then, stay safe and so on.