Speaker 1: Pushkin. This is Talk Easy. I'm Samforgo so welcome to
Speaker 1: the show. Hey everyone, thanks for being here today. I
Speaker 1: am joined by actor Glenn Thurman. Now, Glenn has been
Speaker 1: acting since the age of twelve, when he landed a
Speaker 1: role in Lorraine Hansbury's seminal play A Raisin in the Sun.
Speaker 1: You'll hear about that moment. Since then, Urman has been
Speaker 1: your kind of consummate working actor on Broadway, in Hollywood,
Speaker 1: in TV shows and movies. He's done it all. From
Speaker 1: his breakout performance as Preach and Cooley High to his
Speaker 1: latest turn as Doctor Senator in the new season of Fargo.
Speaker 1: Terman has been a quiet force, but most recently he
Speaker 1: delivered a potent performance in Ma Rainey's Black Bottom, based
Speaker 1: on the August Wilson play. It's about the legendary blues
Speaker 1: woman recording an album of her greatest hits on a
Speaker 1: hot Chicago day in nineteen twenty seven. Urman, in the
Speaker 1: role of Toledo the Piano Player, stars alongside Viola Davis,
Speaker 1: Coleman Domingo, and the late Chadwick Boseman. Here's a clip
Speaker 1: from the trailer for what two You Know What to Do?
Speaker 1: Let's be an empty world without the blues. I tried
Speaker 1: to take that emptiness and fill it up, but they
Speaker 1: want to call it mother blues. That's all right with me,
Speaker 1: and don't hurt nohe man outside, where's the horn player?
Speaker 1: I got a friend rehearse like everybody else. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: give me a band and make me some records. I
Speaker 1: knows how to play real music, not just jug ban
Speaker 1: shit playing music. I know what I'm doing. No want
Speaker 1: to fire me. I don't care. When I got that.
Speaker 1: I ain't begun to say. That's to get the people's attention.
Speaker 1: That's when you and slow drag come in with a rhythm,
Speaker 1: park me and color player on the break. Now. Terman
Speaker 1: is one of those actors you've seen on screen for
Speaker 1: DAK But what I wanted to do in this talk
Speaker 1: was to better understand that man on the screen, where
Speaker 1: he comes from and how he got here, his marriage
Speaker 1: with the late Arita Franklin, a family tragedy he's had
Speaker 1: to live with. A producer of ours said that this
Speaker 1: talk felt like termin and I sitting in a diner.
Speaker 1: When a young person and an old person could reasonably
Speaker 1: sit in a diner. It moves quickly and slowly oscillating
Speaker 1: back and forth between past and present, rose colored reflections
Speaker 1: of youth, followed by memories that feel at times almost
Speaker 1: too heavy to speak of, and then memories that feel
Speaker 1: almost too joyous not to speak of. Termin reveals himself
Speaker 1: and fits and starts. He is in this brief exchange
Speaker 1: as human as I've experienced on the show, Grateful for
Speaker 1: him sitting with me, so thank you for being here.
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoy And without further ado, here is
Speaker 1: Glenn Turman. What do you prefer as an introduction? Generally?
Speaker 1: Do I go, mister Urman? Do you want me to go? Gle?
Speaker 1: What is? What do you prefer? Emmy Award Winning Actor? Glenn?
Speaker 1: They asked me, what, so, how did life change for
Speaker 1: you after you won the Emmy? I said, well, now
Speaker 1: I don't have to go through my entire catalogue of
Speaker 1: movies and shows that I've been a part of, so
Speaker 1: that my introduction can now just go Emmy Award winning Actor.
Speaker 1: So it's deserved, and I'm glad. I'm glad to have
Speaker 1: you here. Tell me your first name again? Sam? Sam? Yes,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Sam, Thank you. Here's where I want to start.
Speaker 1: You're on location filming in Mississippi right now, right right,
Speaker 1: women of the movement. We are talking on a holiday,
Speaker 1: which is fairly unusual. But I think it speaks to something,
Speaker 1: which is this quote you have. You said, I'm a
Speaker 1: blue collar guy, a blue collar actor. I go to
Speaker 1: work with the lunch pail, punch out at the end
Speaker 1: of the day and go home. Where do you think
Speaker 1: that mentality comes from for you? Well, you know, I
Speaker 1: started working with Sidney Potier and Ruby d and Lorrain
Speaker 1: Handsbury and Lloyd Richardson, the director of original production of
Speaker 1: A Raisin in the Sun. I was a youngster in
Speaker 1: this production. So if I was late, I heard it,
Speaker 1: and I heard it from everybody. You know it again,
Speaker 1: you know if I would if I was missing my que,
Speaker 1: if I was late from my queue, oh boy, you
Speaker 1: know I heard about it. So I developed a sense
Speaker 1: of the import of that pretty early in my career.
Speaker 1: You were aged twelve when you got that job. I
Speaker 1: think that's around nineteen fifty nine. I don't think they
Speaker 1: let twelve year olds be late to work when now
Speaker 1: no no back Maybe they do now. Back then, I
Speaker 1: don't think they did, because your mom would take you
Speaker 1: to work right for a moment for a minute, but
Speaker 1: not after I got going, No, not after the show
Speaker 1: was running on Broadway. I go to work by myself
Speaker 1: on the train, do the show, and get out at night,
Speaker 1: go back home. As a twelve year old again, this
Speaker 1: is the late fifties, early sixties. You're twelve years old
Speaker 1: with no parents. You're working with Sidney Potier and Ruby d.
Speaker 1: Did you ever think, Wow, a lot of my friends
Speaker 1: really aren't doing this, this is unusual. Not really. No,
Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, I was thinking just the opposite.
Speaker 1: I was thinking, what are my friends doing? What are
Speaker 1: they doing? I want to go get in trouble with them,
Speaker 1: you know, that's that's the more fun thing to do.
Speaker 1: This was repetitive, but it had its own sense of
Speaker 1: fun as well. But it was an adult world. You
Speaker 1: were acting while you secretly wanted to be Jackie Robinson.
Speaker 1: You know. Sports was the more common thing, certainly going
Speaker 1: to work, and even if you work in going to work,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean as a kid, I had a
Speaker 1: shoeshine box and all that kind of stuff. Everybody kind
Speaker 1: of had a hustle that they that they did. You know,
Speaker 1: carried groceries for people from the supermarket, that kind of
Speaker 1: thing to make an extra book or an extra quarter.
Speaker 1: I think the more luring thing was the notion that
Speaker 1: I would get to travel to overnight on a train
Speaker 1: to Chicago and would be able to stay in Chicago
Speaker 1: for at and also that we were going to go
Speaker 1: to Philadelphia and we were going to go to New Haven.
Speaker 1: So I think the idea of traveling was the more
Speaker 1: luring thing rather than the performing in all of those
Speaker 1: different things that came with it. Why was that Because
Speaker 1: I was I always liked the thought of traveling. You know.
Speaker 1: I would venture outside of my neighborhood, even as a youngster.
Speaker 1: I remember my mother told me that that I got
Speaker 1: lost one day and drove everybody crazy. They wondered what
Speaker 1: had happened to me. I was gone all day, as
Speaker 1: like a seven or eight year old, and then I
Speaker 1: showed up back at the house and they said, oh,
Speaker 1: they were furious, you know, and I said, I was
Speaker 1: at a rocky mountain and I didn't know. I didn't
Speaker 1: know how to tell them. I didn't know how to
Speaker 1: explain to him where this rocky mountain was. You know
Speaker 1: that we lived one hundred and forty seventh Street and
Speaker 1: the Amsterdam Avenue. After all of that, A year later,
Speaker 1: we were in a car and we drove past a park.
Speaker 1: But then I pointed out, that's Rocky Mountain. So they
Speaker 1: realized at seven years old, I had vanished. Somehow, I
Speaker 1: made it twenty blocks away from the stoop, you know,
Speaker 1: the neighborhood, the building that we lived in, all the
Speaker 1: way down to twentieth Street, from one hundred and fiftieth
Speaker 1: forty seventh Street. I think that's when I got the whipping.
Speaker 1: You know. So you were this curious kid, and after
Speaker 1: you do a Raisin in the Sun, you continue to
Speaker 1: work throughout your teenage years, but then in nineteen sixty seven,
Speaker 1: at the age of nineteen, the work slows down. You
Speaker 1: get married, you have a kid, and to make ends meet,
Speaker 1: you take a nine to five job as a driver
Speaker 1: for a furniture store. At that point, did you think
Speaker 1: it was possible that your dreams of acting may be deferred?
Speaker 1: I was. I was always looking for acting work. You know.
Speaker 1: Backstage is the paper that you read as an actor
Speaker 1: to see what jobs are being auditioned for. So I
Speaker 1: was always reading backstage. And one of the things about
Speaker 1: this furniture company that you have to understand is that
Speaker 1: it was a stop for many actors. The big thing
Speaker 1: that it bragged about was the fact that Steve McQueen
Speaker 1: used to work there. So I wasn't the only actor
Speaker 1: working for this furniture company. You know. There were a
Speaker 1: couple of guys, Buddy, I mean with Jack English, he
Speaker 1: worked there. There were enough guys to talk about acting
Speaker 1: or what jobs were going on and so on and
Speaker 1: so forth, as there were guys to talk about, you know,
Speaker 1: sticking up gas stations and that kind of thing, because
Speaker 1: it was a it was a pretty rough environment down
Speaker 1: on the docks. It was. It was the environment on
Speaker 1: the waterfront. Remember the movie on the waterfront of course,
Speaker 1: the meat hanging and all in the hooks. You know, well,
Speaker 1: let's Ganzivod. It was down around Ganzivord before Gansvot became
Speaker 1: so chic. And the good thing about it was that
Speaker 1: the owner of the company, Julie Kay, would not get
Speaker 1: so pissed. You couldn't. You didn't have to necessarily lose
Speaker 1: a job because you took time off to go for
Speaker 1: an audition. So I had a little leeway, a little clout,
Speaker 1: you know, I was able to do that. I was
Speaker 1: always searching for the next acting game. At nineteen twenty,
Speaker 1: going out for these auditions, working these nine to five jobs,
Speaker 1: were you ever nervous about your future or uncertain about
Speaker 1: where you were going to go with the responsibility of
Speaker 1: having a kid. It was no laughing matter, you know.
Speaker 1: It was for life dealing out the cards, and some
Speaker 1: of those cards were not favorable. How do you get
Speaker 1: through that? Two things ignorance and hard headedness. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm hard headed because my mother would say stay on
Speaker 1: the stoop and play right here, and I'd end up
Speaker 1: down one hundred and twenty first Street. That kind of
Speaker 1: behavior may help me pursue beyond my boundaries, go beyond
Speaker 1: my boundaries, no matter what the consequence. And certain ignorance
Speaker 1: is bliss, you know, naivete, it was too hard headed
Speaker 1: to quit? What were you ignorant of? Oh the consequences.
Speaker 1: The consequences are that you have a family, You've got
Speaker 1: they've got to eat, You've got to keep a roop
Speaker 1: over your head. How are you going to do that? Well,
Speaker 1: anybody who's got any sense of smarts about them would
Speaker 1: say that's you know, this is not an easy situation.
Speaker 1: But the point is, how badly do you want what
Speaker 1: you're pursuing? And I wanted it badly? Was it hard
Speaker 1: to remain optimistic? No, because I knew it was possible.
Speaker 1: Don't forget. I started out on Broadway. I started out
Speaker 1: at the top, so I knew where the top was
Speaker 1: and I knew I belonged there. It was a place
Speaker 1: that I could not foreign to me. It was a
Speaker 1: place that I could strive for. It was accessible, so
Speaker 1: it wasn't a pipe dream for me. Do you remember
Speaker 1: the moment where you thought, Okay, I think I think
Speaker 1: this is going to happen. Yeah, As you said, I
Speaker 1: was a truck driver and saw in the paper that
Speaker 1: there was a job a play being directed by Lloyd Richards.
Speaker 1: Lloyd Richards was the man who hired me on for
Speaker 1: Raising in the Sun. So I was actually driving the
Speaker 1: truck when I read that in the backstage and went
Speaker 1: with the truckload of guys to that audition and audition
Speaker 1: with the guys in the trucks screaming and holing and
Speaker 1: cussing me out because I left them stuck in the
Speaker 1: truck while I ran in for this audition and then
Speaker 1: came back out and I got the job, and I
Speaker 1: was rehearsing and gave my notice at the truck and
Speaker 1: company and guys, Julie and all of them, they wish
Speaker 1: me luck and you're on your way kid. Congratulations, you know,
Speaker 1: and the kid's gonna make it. The kids. We got
Speaker 1: a big time movie style man, that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: You know. It was just a great moment, I said
Speaker 1: to myself doing rehearsal, you know, with Stella cast, Barbara
Speaker 1: and Tear, you know, and Roger Robinson and when Hammon
Speaker 1: was the producer of this went having from the American
Speaker 1: Place theater, so it was a notable company opening night.
Speaker 1: On the way to the theater, Sam, back to our
Speaker 1: original point, I was so elated because it was half hour.
Speaker 1: It was gonna be half hour, and I was going
Speaker 1: to make sure that I wasn't late for half hour.
Speaker 1: And I looked into a store window to see the time,
Speaker 1: and I was just a block away from the backstage
Speaker 1: and I saw that I'm on time. I'm good and
Speaker 1: this is opening night. Sam, I shit you not, it's
Speaker 1: opening night. And two cops were standing in that doorway
Speaker 1: and I took two more steps and one of them
Speaker 1: said said, hey, yo, get over here, and I said,
Speaker 1: what say you get over here, Get over here, I said,
Speaker 1: but oh, up against the wall, I said, up again, Oh,
Speaker 1: I said, oh no, no, no, no, no. So I
Speaker 1: can't do this today, not tonight, not now. I can't
Speaker 1: play tonight. I can't do this. This is not the
Speaker 1: time for that game. Okay, up against the wall. They
Speaker 1: put me up against the walls and they frisked me.
Speaker 1: And it was the timings in the early sixties, so
Speaker 1: they had a thing called a civilion Review Board because
Speaker 1: a lot of that harassment was going on at that time,
Speaker 1: like it's not now, And because they had the Civilian
Speaker 1: Review board, I asked the officer badge number seventeen seventy.
Speaker 1: I asked him why he was stopping me, and that
Speaker 1: I needed to have his badge number. And boy o, boy,
Speaker 1: what did I say that for? That pissed him off,
Speaker 1: and he took that stick and he bounced that stick
Speaker 1: off my little skinny legs and threw me in a
Speaker 1: car and took me to the precinct. And that was
Speaker 1: opening night of a play that I was starring it,
Speaker 1: and that night right down the street at the American
Speaker 1: Place theater. So yeah, as soon as I said to myself,
Speaker 1: I think I can make the living doing this life
Speaker 1: read its head again and said, yeah, well there are
Speaker 1: a few, a few caveats, a few things that are givens,
Speaker 1: you know, So don't forget this lesson. Isn't that something
Speaker 1: that these two realities can sit right next to each other.
Speaker 1: You feel you've made it, and yet the world you
Speaker 1: were living in said not so fast. Well that's that's
Speaker 1: a lesson that you learn. You know, you The point
Speaker 1: isn't about making it. The point is the journey. The
Speaker 1: journey is what makes the experience worthwhile. It's not getting
Speaker 1: to be anyone in particular. It's who you are when
Speaker 1: you get there as a result of the journey. That night,
Speaker 1: when you were supposed to be on stage, h who
Speaker 1: did you call? I called the theater, and of course
Speaker 1: they were furious because as I was being searched on
Speaker 1: the street, the mint coats were walking right past me.
Speaker 1: They were on their way to the theater to see me,
Speaker 1: the little laze with the blue hair and the whole thing.
Speaker 1: And I'm up against the wall, you know. So I
Speaker 1: called Win Hammond and Lloyd backstage and told him that
Speaker 1: I was arrested. They're gonna book me downtown. Then I
Speaker 1: called my wife and then I called my aunt and
Speaker 1: they I told my wife, don't try to come give
Speaker 1: me that my aunt would get me because where they
Speaker 1: were gonna take me down to the court was not
Speaker 1: too far from where she lived. And when it told me,
Speaker 1: don't worry, he'd come down and he'd bailed me out,
Speaker 1: which he did, but I was furious. I'm laughing now,
Speaker 1: but I was. You want to people get chips on
Speaker 1: their shoulders. That became a major chip, a major chip
Speaker 1: for a long time. Growing up in the era that
Speaker 1: you did and in the household that you did. Again,
Speaker 1: I think it's for context. People must know in your
Speaker 1: childhood home you had people like James Baldman around. How
Speaker 1: conscious were you of race in that moment? Oh, I
Speaker 1: was very conscious of it. At the moment I moved
Speaker 1: from Harlem to the village, we became very aware of
Speaker 1: race because there were very few black kids in my neighborhood,
Speaker 1: in the village at that time. So even though the
Speaker 1: village was a very progressive area, you know, it's not
Speaker 1: uncommon to see black and white couples at that time,
Speaker 1: you know, down there wasn't it wasn't uncommon to see
Speaker 1: gay or lesbians or you know, couples in the area.
Speaker 1: It was known for that kind of leniency the village
Speaker 1: as it's still to a large degree. But the people
Speaker 1: who were like the nuts and bolts of the community,
Speaker 1: the superintendence of the buildings and so and so forth,
Speaker 1: were still some first or second generation or third generation
Speaker 1: Irish shore Italian. So there was still a lot of
Speaker 1: elbowing for your space. The in words, the other negative
Speaker 1: words to describe people flew around pretty easily, not going
Speaker 1: to gain the fact that after the fight, you know,
Speaker 1: you might become great friends, but you had to stake
Speaker 1: your claim for it to end in any kind of fairness.
Speaker 1: These kind of dynamics you're describing between your friends and
Speaker 1: the environment you came of age in play Out in
Speaker 1: the film Coolly High. This is a movie that came
Speaker 1: out in nineteen seventy five. But why do you think
Speaker 1: this film and you're working it has endured as it
Speaker 1: has because it's it's it's it's just not only did
Speaker 1: it make me a folk hero, but it in itself
Speaker 1: was like the ballad you know that goes along with
Speaker 1: being a folk hero. You know, it's it's that song
Speaker 1: it's folklore has its John Henry song, or it's this song,
Speaker 1: or it's that song, you know, And that's what Kuihai is.
Speaker 1: It is that song. It is that folk song that
Speaker 1: gets being passed down from generation to generation. I'm no,
Speaker 1: I'm no good you are? What can't I dode? Baby? Baby?
Speaker 1: Do so much? That can on you? Bombardy being? You
Speaker 1: can't see no bases on the start Tenner thro you'd
Speaker 1: be bark? Do you be Basin? Preach? Stay out of him. Hey,
Speaker 1: he's glass still whip. I'm gonna check out on the
Speaker 1: luxury brother. Hey, hey, hey, hey man, when you get
Speaker 1: this wrong, don't worry about it. Dad Like, hey, y'all
Speaker 1: come on, not me and be cool. Man, what's wrong?
Speaker 1: You're scared? Scared? Nick? Come on, hey, preach, I know
Speaker 1: you ain't job. Nick, Come on, God, you get them turkeys?
Speaker 1: It is bad right right? And I knew with what
Speaker 1: it was going in. I had worked with both the
Speaker 1: play Right and the Rector before, and I knew their
Speaker 1: integrity in their work, so I felt I would be
Speaker 1: a part of something that everyone was doing their best. Well.
Speaker 1: I was excited. It was my first lead role in
Speaker 1: a motion picture. You have a quote you said when
Speaker 1: I was a young man starting out, Some said that
Speaker 1: if it had been a different era when it came
Speaker 1: to acknowledging black performers for awards, that's what I would
Speaker 1: have received back in the day. But back then they
Speaker 1: weren't giving us our propers. That little story I told
Speaker 1: you about being arrested on the first day, Opening day,
Speaker 1: opening night, let me know an important lesson. Things are
Speaker 1: going to be the way they are going to be.
Speaker 1: Your job is to keep on keeping all. So that's
Speaker 1: all I do, is I keep on keeping all. I
Speaker 1: don't have time to worry about what was going to be,
Speaker 1: or what I should have deserved, or what I should
Speaker 1: have gotten, or how it would have worked out if
Speaker 1: it if it was fair or not. I don't do that.
Speaker 1: Have you passed that mentality onto your kids, I believe so.
Speaker 1: I don't know if they got it from me, But
Speaker 1: if if they did, I know that they're all they're
Speaker 1: all troopers, and they've all kept on going, you know,
Speaker 1: and things have not always been easy. In two thousand
Speaker 1: and eight, you're in a very special episode of in Treatment,
Speaker 1: which is how we now must refer to you as
Speaker 1: Emmy Award winning I'm my apologies if I did not
Speaker 1: properly announce you that way. It's okay, don't let it
Speaker 1: happen again, Sam, Okay, Okay, yeah, you gotta hold me
Speaker 1: accountable here. I bring this episode up Emmy Award winning
Speaker 1: actor Glenn Turman because I was making sure you're listening.
Speaker 1: I was. I was making sure you weren't check it out. Hey, look,
Speaker 1: we gotta laugh because so much of this has been
Speaker 1: so serious, and I know this performance is a serious one,
Speaker 1: and I know it is one that has not just
Speaker 1: meant a lot to your career afterward, but spoke to
Speaker 1: all kinds of parts of you and your past. Is
Speaker 1: that fair to say when you're doing that work and
Speaker 1: I know it demanded that you dig deep into your
Speaker 1: past and yourself as a human being, how do you
Speaker 1: make that performance and how do you relive the pain
Speaker 1: that that work must have caused? You hit the key
Speaker 1: word as a human being. If you look up the
Speaker 1: word human being, one of the definitions is existing in
Speaker 1: a perfect state, lacking no essential characteristic. The characteristics of
Speaker 1: the characters that I play, I try to tap into
Speaker 1: that human part of them, and that's what we have
Speaker 1: in common because That's what's going to translate to everyone
Speaker 1: in the audience, is that human element. That human being
Speaker 1: transcends race, creed, color, all the bullshit. So that's what
Speaker 1: I dedicate myself too. And yes it's it's painful, and
Speaker 1: yes it's sometimes cathartic and sometimes detrimental, but it's what I,
Speaker 1: as the profession i'm in, took an to do as
Speaker 1: best I could. That human being part of it is
Speaker 1: the main ingredient. Sam, I go to that human place.
Speaker 1: What you did in that performance and what you've done
Speaker 1: throughout your career. And I'm sure you know this, but
Speaker 1: you know people use art to not only better understand themselves,
Speaker 1: but to get by To keep going, as you've said,
Speaker 1: is your kind of mantra. You just keep on what
Speaker 1: I'm trying to ask you, and I'm doing a sort
Speaker 1: of stumbling job at it. How do you get past
Speaker 1: and process losing a son as you have and putting
Speaker 1: that into your work, Well, you don't get past it.
Speaker 1: That's that's the thing. You never get past it. I
Speaker 1: wouldn't get past it even if I weren't an actor.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't get past it. You learn to live with it,
Speaker 1: and in learn to live with it. It can be
Speaker 1: in my particular business, it becomes I don't want to say,
Speaker 1: a tool, but it becomes a part of my creative process.
Speaker 1: I don't ignore it. I don't run from it. It's
Speaker 1: usually at my fingertips and it's there whether I want
Speaker 1: it to be or not. It's in my life, whether
Speaker 1: I want it to be or not. But you don't
Speaker 1: get past anything. No, it's it's as fresh now as
Speaker 1: it ever was. You live with it. Yeah, and how
Speaker 1: do you think you have lived? It's taken its toll.
Speaker 1: It's taking its toll. It's like the same thing that
Speaker 1: happens with soldiers come home from war takes its toll,
Speaker 1: and it takes a toll on you and loved ones
Speaker 1: and strangers. But it's a it's a it's who you are.
Speaker 1: This year, this pandemic has forced everyone to really concer
Speaker 1: what do you want to do with your time? Because
Speaker 1: it doesn't go forever. What has this past year done
Speaker 1: for you? What does it mean you think about? There
Speaker 1: are a few different components to the situation. One thing
Speaker 1: is I grew up an only child, so I'm not
Speaker 1: unfamiliar with spending a lot of time pretty much alone.
Speaker 1: You know what I mean. I don't get lonely easily.
Speaker 1: I kind of know how to fill my time. Sometimes
Speaker 1: it's with too much thought in my own head, but
Speaker 1: that was what as a kid made me have such
Speaker 1: a vivid imagination. So that imagination is served with time
Speaker 1: like this, or it is called into play in time
Speaker 1: like this. One thing that's been great is I've been
Speaker 1: playing the piano it stems from mul Rainey's black Bottom,
Speaker 1: and playing the character Toledo. I just continue to go
Speaker 1: on with that and having a wonderful time developing that character.
Speaker 1: My wife and I have had a great time together.
Speaker 1: We really do still like each other. We were so far,
Speaker 1: so good. You know, we just celebrated twenty nine years
Speaker 1: married yesterday as a matter of fact. And she's still
Speaker 1: all right. She's still an okay kid, you know, not
Speaker 1: a bad girl, you know. So that's been wonderful to
Speaker 1: to come to know. You know, I'm on location now
Speaker 1: and Missa dearly, and I've got the grandkids and they
Speaker 1: just keep popping out. I guess they've My kids have
Speaker 1: had a lot of time to themselves to pop so
Speaker 1: suddenly here come all these little ones. You know, in
Speaker 1: this last year say, oh, okay, I see what this
Speaker 1: covid Q you guys, and I've never heard a parent
Speaker 1: describe their kids having kids is I think they've had
Speaker 1: a lot of time on their hands, you know. So
Speaker 1: you know that's that's great, you know, to see all
Speaker 1: of that that's happening. The work continues to come, and
Speaker 1: that's a great thing. So here I am writing it
Speaker 1: out like everyone else before we get out of here,
Speaker 1: because I know we have to go. We've talked a
Speaker 1: lot about your work, but I'd be remissed to not
Speaker 1: mention the late Arita Franklin and all that she brought
Speaker 1: into this world. I know you two were married for
Speaker 1: a time and remain close until her passing, So if
Speaker 1: you're open to it, I wanted to watch this performance
Speaker 1: with you, all right, Lucy. This is Aretha Franklin in
Speaker 1: twenty fifteen at the Kennedy Center honoring Carol King what
Speaker 1: the song called a natural woman, who can I all
Speaker 1: the morning rain? I ain't to be so on? He inspired,
Speaker 1: and I knew I had a face, enough breath so timeous.
Speaker 1: Before the camm in you, I was so unkind. You
Speaker 1: are the kid my piece of Well, what do you
Speaker 1: think when you see that, well, there's so many moments
Speaker 1: and instances I can look at from perspectives that I
Speaker 1: have not been captured on film, So I think of
Speaker 1: that one is a wonderful moment. But it put in
Speaker 1: mind another instance that I was there for when she
Speaker 1: and I were married, when she went to sing for
Speaker 1: the Queen Mother of England. That moment was amazing as
Speaker 1: well as was this, but not captured. And I think
Speaker 1: there are not many who can relay it. But I'll
Speaker 1: tell you sam because I like, we were in Europe
Speaker 1: for her performance with the Queen Mother and in the
Speaker 1: audience was Prince Charles and Lady Diana and Sammy Davis
Speaker 1: Junior was making the announcement to introduce Aretha. And I
Speaker 1: never forget this introduction, Sammy said, ladies and gentlemen, Queen Mother,
Speaker 1: it's wonderful to be here with the royalty, Britain's royalty,
Speaker 1: but we have royalty of our own in America. We
Speaker 1: have the Duke of Ellington, we have the Count of Basie,
Speaker 1: and ladies and gentlemen, the Queen of Soul. That's Aretha Franklin.
Speaker 1: And she came on and told the house down, so
Speaker 1: it was a wonderful moment and that put me in
Speaker 1: mind of that that's wonderful. My last question for you,
Speaker 1: because that video, I have to say I've watched it
Speaker 1: probably a hundred times, and every time I watch it
Speaker 1: it is like how I felt watching your work in
Speaker 1: Ma Rainey or something in that performance and in treatment
Speaker 1: or even we go back to Cooley High. There is
Speaker 1: something in that that is so human and that is
Speaker 1: the power of of all this. I guess what I'm
Speaker 1: trying to ask you is are you proud of what
Speaker 1: you've done? M That's a beautiful question. Sah, yes, there,
Speaker 1: I am, Yes, I am. I was. I was given
Speaker 1: a gift. My wonderful mother saw it before I did,
Speaker 1: steered me in that direction, and I hope I've done
Speaker 1: her problem in this journey. Glenn Turman, thank you very
Speaker 1: very much for doing this something say. It was a pleasure.
Speaker 1: Good meeting you. Please stay safe and that's our show
Speaker 1: special thanks this week to the good people at the
Speaker 1: Anderson Group. I'd also like to thank mister Glenn Turman.
Speaker 1: His latest role is in Ma Rainey's Black Bottom, which
Speaker 1: is available to stream on Netflix right now. To learn
Speaker 1: more about Glenn and his work. You can visit our
Speaker 1: show notes at www dot talk easypod dot com. If
Speaker 1: you'd like to hear other conversations with brilliant actors, I'd
Speaker 1: recommend our talks with Sam Waterston, Keith David Matthew McConaughey,
Speaker 1: Edward Norton, Laura Dern, Holland Taylor, and Pam Greer. You
Speaker 1: can listen and subscribe to our show on Spotify, Apple Podcasts,
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Speaker 1: for new listeners to find our program. If you'd like
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Speaker 1: as always, our show is made possible each week by
Speaker 1: our incredible team. Our executive producer is Jennick Sobravo. Illustrations
Speaker 1: by Christia Schanoy. Our associate producer is Nicky Spina. Our
Speaker 1: lead editor is Andre Lynn. Our editor for today's show
Speaker 1: is David Harding. Our assistant editors are Joshua Siegel, Kevin
Speaker 1: cor and Clarisse Givara. Music by Dylan Peck. Our interns
Speaker 1: are Caitlin Dryden, Claire Hardwick, Chili Harold, Patrice Lee and
Speaker 1: Grace Perkins. Video and graphics by Ian Chang, Derek gaberzach
Speaker 1: O'rian Huang, Ian Jones and Ethan Seneca. And the show
Speaker 1: is produced by Caroline Reebok. I'm Sam Fragoso. Thank you
Speaker 1: for listening to Talk Easy. I'll see you back here
Speaker 1: next week. Until then, stay safe and so long. Who
Speaker 1: will be