Speaker 1: Hello, peasants. I am Robert Evans, the grand Damn of
Speaker 1: the podcasting scene, the Queen of England of casting Pods,
Speaker 1: here to welcome you back to the internet's premier podcast,
Speaker 1: the only good podcast on the Internet, Behind the Bastard.
Speaker 1: I have a serious question that somebody bully you into
Speaker 1: watching Britain on Netflix. I don't know what any of
Speaker 1: those words mean, but I know that none of them
Speaker 1: are in the Bible. I'm such a good comeback. I
Speaker 1: have nothing to say. Christopheropher is here, This is great here.
Speaker 1: How are we doing? I good? I I had a
Speaker 1: moral spiritual crisis. We're writing the second part of this episode.
Speaker 1: But whether I was going to do the thing I'm
Speaker 1: about to do, and so I'm gonna just do it
Speaker 1: to you. So I love it when people do things
Speaker 1: to me. We're just We're just We're just gonna do it. Robert,
Speaker 1: have you ever fallen down the gladiol rabbit hole? Oh god, Now,
Speaker 1: let me tell you about this, Christopher, because I think
Speaker 1: about gladius Is all the time, and the big question
Speaker 1: in my mind is, right, do you go with an
Speaker 1: original Italian pattern? Okay? Or do you go with like
Speaker 1: the Iberian pattern, which most people will agree is a
Speaker 1: superior stabbing weapon UM, but doesn't have quite as much
Speaker 1: of the historic cachet because right, like, that's not the
Speaker 1: first fucking punic warp weapon. So I don't know. I
Speaker 1: think I'm probably just gonna get several different gladius is um,
Speaker 1: and I think that that's probably going to be be
Speaker 1: good for me. But but everyone needs a Gladius um.
Speaker 1: It's the ultimate bisexual killing weapon because it's it's it's
Speaker 1: double edged um and extremely sharp on all sides. And
Speaker 1: and so I think that, you know, everyone, we have
Speaker 1: to stand a bisexual weapon of imperialist aggression. And that's
Speaker 1: that's why I support the Gladius. You know, Okay, I
Speaker 1: I think I think if I if you forced me
Speaker 1: to buy one Gladius, I think I would go with
Speaker 1: the tradition and one because again, like you know, I
Speaker 1: mean that that is in Chris's contract, right, that's all
Speaker 1: of our cools unemployees are legally required to own a Gladius.
Speaker 1: Otherwise you can't draft you to take over. Because Chris,
Speaker 1: when we have to go take back and burn Carthage
Speaker 1: to the ground, what are you gonna do without a Gladius. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean here's here's here's but you've got you've got
Speaker 1: strong Prinka Pie energy too, So I feel like a
Speaker 1: polarm would work well for you. Well, I mean, this
Speaker 1: is this is the thing, right because you're you're okay,
Speaker 1: you your sword if if someone has gotten close enough
Speaker 1: to you to use a sword, right like this is
Speaker 1: this is this is your sort of like last resort
Speaker 1: of personal defense weapon. But a pike now prink energy yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and so and so you know my my my thesis
Speaker 1: on this, right is this allows you, this allows you
Speaker 1: to get to get a more traditional original pattern of
Speaker 1: Italian Gladius. Right because the thing that the thing that
Speaker 1: you are depending on right for your life is the pike.
Speaker 1: And that means the Gladius doesn't is the symbolic importance
Speaker 1: of the gladi is Chris is able to shine through.
Speaker 1: When we hired you, I thought to myself, this here
Speaker 1: is an individual who doesn't go by the cucked post
Speaker 1: Marian reforms, Republican military and and that's that's why you're
Speaker 1: on this team, because you understand that you need Tree
Speaker 1: Yi and has Jotti and Prinka Pie in order to
Speaker 1: like oh sorry, it was Tree area with a once
Speaker 1: with polearms. Anyway, I fucked up this whole pri Marian
Speaker 1: Reforms Roman Republican military joke by getting the kind of
Speaker 1: infantry you were supposed to be wrong. Yes, stop talking,
Speaker 1: Chris episode Okay, okay, So Gladio, all right, Gladio Yeah,
Speaker 1: how how how much do you know about this? So? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean a modest amount, Like gladiol was the c
Speaker 1: I A being like, oh no, this Italy and some
Speaker 1: other areas might vote for leftists, so we should set
Speaker 1: up a series of stay behind networks to repeatedly murder
Speaker 1: left wing media and political and organizing figures and wage
Speaker 1: what is effectively like an extended insurgent campaign in countries
Speaker 1: that are quote unquote allies of ours on paper. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that's well, okay, that that that's most of it.
Speaker 1: There's there's a thing on Twitter where if you mentioned
Speaker 1: this about that, there's like, am this is one of
Speaker 1: a number of things you don't want to have a
Speaker 1: conversation about on the twitters. Yeah, and you know, okay,
Speaker 1: we're we're we're we're gonna get more into the part
Speaker 1: of this. It involves the rogue Masonic Lodge in a
Speaker 1: bit Um now okay, yeah, so so this is this
Speaker 1: is the yeah, the the sort of Yeah, Gladio is
Speaker 1: the code name specifically of the Italian version of these
Speaker 1: stay behind networks. There's there's These things are the originally
Speaker 1: established by Allied Command after World War Two and then
Speaker 1: they get armor and tramped by the CIA. And you know.
Speaker 1: The other theory behind this, right is it like, Okay,
Speaker 1: if the USSR invase Europe, the Allies are like, well,
Speaker 1: we're gonna lose because the USR has a better land
Speaker 1: army than we do. Um. You know, but the theory
Speaker 1: is that they're going to have this network of like
Speaker 1: guerilla units in place to start and commentry existence. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna read the act. Well, I'm going to read
Speaker 1: from the National Security Directive tend TO that authorized this
Speaker 1: whole thing. So it authorizes a vast program of propaganda,
Speaker 1: economic warfare, preventative direct action, including sabotage, anti sabotage, demolition
Speaker 1: and evacuation measures, subversion against hostile states, including assistance to
Speaker 1: underground resistance movements, guerrillas, refugee liberation programs, and supportive indigenous
Speaker 1: anti communist elements to be done so that any U
Speaker 1: S government responsibility for them is not evidence to unauthorized
Speaker 1: persons that, if uncovered, the U S Government can plausibly
Speaker 1: deny any responsibility, so that the US, the US in
Speaker 1: the foundation many different like things that are official government
Speaker 1: documents include the phrase, so the US is possibly denied responsibility.
Speaker 1: That's just good, that's just good for us, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is how, this is how
Speaker 1: you know the program is going to go incredibly well
Speaker 1: and there's going to be zero problems with it ever, yep.
Speaker 1: And yeah, So there's a bunch of these things across
Speaker 1: Europe there and there's one in Belgium, there in Denmark,
Speaker 1: dre In, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, no Way, Portugal, Spain, Turkey, Austria, Finland, Sweden,
Speaker 1: and Switzerland, and also the UK. I don't know why
Speaker 1: the UK so much didn't mention this. I'm fine with
Speaker 1: that one. I'm just in generally okay with US fucking
Speaker 1: with the UK. But everywhere else, everywhere else, So they
Speaker 1: kill like an enormous number of people. Um they're composed
Speaker 1: of a lot of these people are literally just fascists
Speaker 1: who they were like, hey, you don't like this, We'll
Speaker 1: hand you a gun. There's there's there's much of anti communists.
Speaker 1: They have you know, they have people in the state
Speaker 1: security services. So you've got like your soldiers, your cops,
Speaker 1: your spies, they're all involved in this. And you know,
Speaker 1: you can already see the sort of similarities to Conjure
Speaker 1: from last episode, right like this, this is a parallel
Speaker 1: network of soldiers, spies, and paramilitaries that the regular government
Speaker 1: A doesn't know about and B is being run sort
Speaker 1: of is being like the internationally coordinated covertly. And these
Speaker 1: networks are heavily armed by weapons caches that are spread
Speaker 1: around all of these countries. And these things have they've
Speaker 1: got a guns and then they've got explosives, they've got borders. Okay,
Speaker 1: don't let's I feel like you said weapons caches like it,
Speaker 1: like in a negative way, and I just don't think
Speaker 1: that's very fair. Well, you know, there's there there's Look,
Speaker 1: the only way to stop a bad guy with a weapons.
Speaker 1: Cash is a good guy with a weapons. But but unfortunately,
Speaker 1: and this is just the real problem here is that
Speaker 1: the Soviet Union were pussies for the entire Cold War.
Speaker 1: It didn't give everyone weapons caches. So they didn't what
Speaker 1: everybody says about the Soviet Union, it did not give
Speaker 1: enough people weapons cash. That what it did it was
Speaker 1: coward absolute cowered stuff. So okay, come on a right, yeah, look,
Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta give you gotta give you guys
Speaker 1: something man like you just sending out scorpion machine pistols
Speaker 1: like they're fucking candy and your like, like the USSR
Speaker 1: is like making you buy their A K forty seven's like,
Speaker 1: come on, not only money where we're gonna buy. It's
Speaker 1: terrible stuff. Now, okay, not nominally these things they're supposed
Speaker 1: to fight like a communist invasion, but like the actual
Speaker 1: thing they're gonna do, is it just like fight any
Speaker 1: leftist of any kind from like electoral social democrats like anarchists. Again,
Speaker 1: I mean this, this is this is very much a
Speaker 1: proto Operation Condor. It's the same goals, the same tactics,
Speaker 1: and the same command structure and like, so the command
Speaker 1: structure is left behind. In Greece, for example, it becomes
Speaker 1: own as Prometheus, and it pays. It plays a huge
Speaker 1: role both in the Greek Civil War and also in Greece.
Speaker 1: His nineteen seventy n seven right wing military coup. We
Speaker 1: never talked about that, Yeah, we never do. It's really
Speaker 1: like the whole the whole history of Greece from that
Speaker 1: period of the military coup. It's like, yeah, like Churchill,
Speaker 1: world War two is happening, and then Churchill was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, the Communist are gonna win, and so
Speaker 1: he just like put the Nazis back in charge, and
Speaker 1: Nazi started to get the Holocaust again. Yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: there's there's a very fun history of Churchill in Greece
Speaker 1: that is yeah, fine, it's fine and good, and nothing
Speaker 1: bad ever happened from it. There wasn't another terry dictatorship.
Speaker 1: They didn't like kills people and and you know there's
Speaker 1: also like there's stuff here. Part of what's going on
Speaker 1: here is uh, I'm just gonna read this from Mick Sherry.
Speaker 1: Washington insisted on a secret clause in the North Atlantic Treaty.
Speaker 1: This is the treaty that forms NATO, requiring the secret
Speaker 1: services of all joining nations to establish their own branches
Speaker 1: of the secret army and opposed communist influence even if
Speaker 1: the population voted for communists and free elections people, that's
Speaker 1: that's good ship, that's good freedom. Nothing says freedom and
Speaker 1: democracy like secret armies. Yeah. Well, and I actually mentioned
Speaker 1: it's not formally part of of Like it's not formally
Speaker 1: like one of the things that's considered part of gladiol
Speaker 1: or like the stay behind networks. But they do literally
Speaker 1: the same thing in Japan to that's where the Japanese
Speaker 1: ruling party modern really Party comes from. And oh boy
Speaker 1: do they stay behind networks opposed communism and free elections.
Speaker 1: They radio elections in Greece, then the radio elections in
Speaker 1: Eli's and the Communists can't win. And but you know,
Speaker 1: like while all this is happening, where on a macro level,
Speaker 1: what is happening here is that the CIA is giving
Speaker 1: a bunch of Nazis guns and high explosives. And when
Speaker 1: I say Nazis, like what I mean is that, to
Speaker 1: take a random example, the state behind network in West
Speaker 1: Germany literally hired Klaus Barbie and was composed of x mess.
Speaker 1: We have talked about that because Klaus Barbie was also
Speaker 1: integral in the creation of the modern CIA for some
Speaker 1: similar reasons. Yeah, and then also and then also as
Speaker 1: also showed up doing a cocaine coup funded by the
Speaker 1: Moonies and a bunch of other worlds people. It is good,
Speaker 1: it was good and fine. Um yeah. And in Italy
Speaker 1: in particular, this whole like give fascist guns thing goes
Speaker 1: exactly as badly as you would expect it to. Um in,
Speaker 1: someone sets off a car bomb in a small Italian
Speaker 1: village called Petition, and originally this is blamed on the
Speaker 1: Red Brigades, who are this the sort of like a
Speaker 1: just like urban gorilla group that later turns out to
Speaker 1: be infiltrated to like all hell. But we're not actually
Speaker 1: gonna get into the Rebrigades here because if we did,
Speaker 1: and if if I actually had done the Morrow kidnapping
Speaker 1: to this episode, this episode will be like thirty five
Speaker 1: hours long. And also I'd be found dead in my
Speaker 1: driveway like that about three weeks you'd be you'd be
Speaker 1: found covered in shrapnel made out of pasta. Because it's Italians,
Speaker 1: you know the thing about this, Like I am joking
Speaker 1: about this, but they're they're legitimately were like a not
Speaker 1: insignificant number of people who tried to write about this
Speaker 1: and we're killed. So with Gabba Google jump jammed down
Speaker 1: their throat. Now choke to death on a what's something
Speaker 1: else that's Italian? Um um um pepperoni pepperoni. Yeah, murdered
Speaker 1: by being historically bad at fielding cavalry. That's also very Atalian.
Speaker 1: That was a Roman Empire joke. I'm really proud of
Speaker 1: you for not bringing up spicy meatball. Uh just sp
Speaker 1: you know, my, my, my, my. My original plan for
Speaker 1: this was I was just going to read every single
Speaker 1: name in an Italian accident, do no other Italian jokes.
Speaker 1: But because luckily I have Robert here to do the
Speaker 1: Italian jokes, bro, my life is an Italian joke based mhm,
Speaker 1: and I guess terrible Italian bread. Yes, so okay, so
Speaker 1: they was bombing, right, it kills kills the people specifically,
Speaker 1: it's like target against the police and okay, so so
Speaker 1: the Rebrigads get blamed for this, and the immediate responsive
Speaker 1: Italian government is they did do a mass cracked down
Speaker 1: on the left, they rest hundreds of communists. And now
Speaker 1: it turns out, Robert, that bombing not done by the Rebrigades,
Speaker 1: instead actually done by a fascist group named or di
Speaker 1: Narevo or a New Order. I think the guy responsible
Speaker 1: for this, Vincent d. V Guara, was tried by an
Speaker 1: Italian judge in the eighties and uh revealed some stuff.
Speaker 1: And by some stuff, I mean it turns out that
Speaker 1: the bombing was done by C four taking from Gladia
Speaker 1: weapons caches, which the prosecutors knew about because they immediately
Speaker 1: covered it up to blame someone else. See that's very
Speaker 1: Italian of them. Yeah, I mean, although Chris, you do
Speaker 1: have to take into account given the way C four looks,
Speaker 1: this may have been an accidental bombing because it looks
Speaker 1: a lot like pasta dough. They might have just been
Speaker 1: trying to make They might have just been making a ravioli,
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes you make the ravioli and you blow
Speaker 1: up the carbonogy Italians, So so I turned out the bombing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so it's it's done with. It's done with Gladia weapons
Speaker 1: cashes is almost certainly was directed by the Italian governments.
Speaker 1: And this, this, this becomes the opening cell of almost
Speaker 1: don't as a strategy of tension, which is the government
Speaker 1: carrying out terrorist attacks from the fascist right and then
Speaker 1: staging attacks that are claimed to be from the communist
Speaker 1: anarchus left. You get people, you know, scared enough to
Speaker 1: trust the government and reject the edibly powerful Italian Left,
Speaker 1: which they spend this whole time like smearing as terrorists
Speaker 1: and in this this this has all come down to
Speaker 1: us today and the fact that anytime people on the
Speaker 1: left do something cool and illegal, uh, you get a
Speaker 1: bunch of assholes on Twitter being like this is an
Speaker 1: Operation Gladiol style false flag. The thing, the thing I
Speaker 1: need to point out about this to be people who
Speaker 1: believe this. If you go back and look at the
Speaker 1: history of what these guys are doing, it wasn't like
Speaker 1: they weren't like graffiti ing someone's driveway, like they were
Speaker 1: doing train bombings. Yeah, they were bombing. They were hundreds
Speaker 1: of people. Like, like, the guys, guys, the level of
Speaker 1: things that they're doing is just it's not even remotely
Speaker 1: applicable to what's happening now subjectively bad as opposed to
Speaker 1: stuff that's subjectively based. Yeah, like they don't they don't
Speaker 1: do anything cool. They only they only just the only
Speaker 1: thing that the thing that they do specifically in order
Speaker 1: to scrabt left just kill civilians. And so I don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe maybe like look, if if you want to
Speaker 1: get all conspiracy brain about it, like I don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe massacurring civilians, bad no matter what side of the like, like, okay,
Speaker 1: if they're the only thing I want to point out
Speaker 1: is that, like, okay, so there were a bunch of
Speaker 1: conspiracy theories in Italy in the seventies and ages is
Speaker 1: happening when this is happening, right, And they're the conspiracy
Speaker 1: theory they have that the Red Brigades don't exist, and
Speaker 1: they're like, they're entirely fictitious and the government has made
Speaker 1: up a group of fake terrorists and this is not
Speaker 1: true at all. The Red Brigades were a real thing.
Speaker 1: They were. They got all the conspiracy theories, who were
Speaker 1: living in like the most conspiracy written part of like
Speaker 1: the history ever, all got it completely wrong. So you
Speaker 1: guys also don't have it right. And the things that
Speaker 1: this is we're we're we're not We're not literally living
Speaker 1: in exactly the same thing of American Claudio. It's not
Speaker 1: the same thing. Please stop. Oh by the way. Also,
Speaker 1: the Italian Red Brigades not named the Red Brigades because
Speaker 1: of communism, but because of pasta sauce. Yeah, definitely there.
Speaker 1: They were also called the marian Nara Brigades, the Marinaro
Speaker 1: brigades because because yah, yes, just because they turned people
Speaker 1: in the chunky Marin era. So the list Viji Guerra,
Speaker 1: who's who's the guy who who is put on trial
Speaker 1: for this bombing claims that New Order is actually a
Speaker 1: cat's ball for NATO in the CIA, which like okay,
Speaker 1: so like partially he's doing this because he's been arrested
Speaker 1: for a bombing and he's like, how do I get
Speaker 1: out of this? At the CIA told us too, but
Speaker 1: you know, but also on the other hands, right, the
Speaker 1: bombs that he used to make this are from CIA,
Speaker 1: Gladiol cash is, So draw your own conclusions about who's
Speaker 1: responsible for this and how we got ahold of a
Speaker 1: bunch of weapons from u C I a NATO stay
Speaker 1: behind network cashes um. And it turns out that that
Speaker 1: New Order and another fascist group called Avangaria Nationale. Yeah,
Speaker 1: these people are also heavily involved in Operation Condor. And
Speaker 1: when I say heavily involved, what I mean is that
Speaker 1: so one of the one of these, one of the
Speaker 1: members of actually I think's a member both groups. Um,
Speaker 1: is this guy named Stefano. Yeah that his name has
Speaker 1: two eyes in it, and there's a vowel in the middle. Look,
Speaker 1: it's Italian names, comprehensive names. So this guy, Pino Schet
Speaker 1: met with him personally to talk about the assassination that
Speaker 1: he was trying to do. Um And one of the
Speaker 1: the assassination that he's trying to do is the failed
Speaker 1: assassination of Crystal of Christian Democratic politician Bernando Layton um
Speaker 1: And this is the Christian Democrats are kind of weird
Speaker 1: here because like the Lean Christian Democrats originally support the
Speaker 1: coup against all End, but then like Pinochet takes over
Speaker 1: and they were like this whole Pinochet thing, maybe it's bad,
Speaker 1: and so they turned against Pinochet um and and here here,
Speaker 1: here's here's McSherry And what happened next. Avant Gardia Nationale
Speaker 1: and ord Noevo also collaborated in condor operations. Assassins from Avangari,
Speaker 1: the terrorist organization if Italian neo fascist Stefano de Laciani
Speaker 1: attempted the Latent assassination in Rome. They left the couple
Speaker 1: for dead after gunning After gunning them down in the street,
Speaker 1: the couple was severely wounded but survived. I don't know
Speaker 1: to the side the leader of Order um or a
Speaker 1: den in the way off and avan Gariae boasted that
Speaker 1: Diciani and his his Italian fascists coordinated with the Chilean
Speaker 1: National Intelligence Directorate as well as the secret services of
Speaker 1: the Franco regime in Spain, and admitted that his forces
Speaker 1: carried out the Latent attack at Dina's request. So Stefano
Speaker 1: d uh Stefano Deliciani, by the way, uh so, while
Speaker 1: wanted by the Italian police for this assassination, shows up
Speaker 1: at the Latin America UH Anti Commuist confederations meeting in
Speaker 1: baless Arius. And this is like a recurring theme for
Speaker 1: for for these people, for Italian fascist terrorists. What of
Speaker 1: New Orders, Like highest ranking members was this guy named
Speaker 1: Elia Massagardi who's like he did a bunch of terrorist
Speaker 1: attacks and like bank robberies and it both Italy and
Speaker 1: UH France. And so he flees to Paraguay after another
Speaker 1: judge attempts to sort of like prosecute these New Order guys,
Speaker 1: and uh he winds up getting shot like while he's
Speaker 1: his car stuck in a traffic m in Rome. And
Speaker 1: at this point um uh Elion Massegari just like runs
Speaker 1: away and now he goes to Paraguay, and then he
Speaker 1: shows up as part of the European delegation of the
Speaker 1: World Anti Communist League's meeting in a Sucion in ninety nine.
Speaker 1: And again while he's at this meeting, he is act
Speaker 1: he's like near the top of the Interpol Most Wanted
Speaker 1: list and he's just he's just at this meeting like chilling. Now.
Speaker 1: The other part of what's going on here, and this
Speaker 1: is the part that like actually breaks people's brains, is
Speaker 1: an organization called the Pichi Masonic Lodge or Propaganda due
Speaker 1: so God, okay, so, so I should make this clear
Speaker 1: from the top. P two is a rogue Masonic lodge
Speaker 1: that was expelled by the Masons before they do the
Speaker 1: stufferre about to talk about um and it's it's ran
Speaker 1: by this guy named Lesio Quelli, who's like he's an
Speaker 1: an old old school fascist like this. This is a
Speaker 1: guy who at seventeen years old went to went to
Speaker 1: Spade and fought for Franco in the Pantat Civil War
Speaker 1: and then like join the s S and Pichu operates.
Speaker 1: This is kind of like shadow state inside the Italian state.
Speaker 1: It has like a bunch of members and sort of
Speaker 1: various parts of the Italian government, including the military intelligence services.
Speaker 1: It buys the country's largest newspaper, and by like the
Speaker 1: late seventies and like the very beginning of the eighties,
Speaker 1: it's basically running the Italian states. But hilariously in nice
Speaker 1: Nati one, the Italian police are raiding this guy's house
Speaker 1: for like completely unrelated corruption stuff, and they find a
Speaker 1: briefcase that just literally has the pizza organization's planned to
Speaker 1: take over the government in it. And they also find
Speaker 1: uh Inlicia Grelly is like like an apartment. When they
Speaker 1: rate it later they find a list that has everyone
Speaker 1: in the organization. And the people on this in this
Speaker 1: in this thing are wild. There's the heads and deputy
Speaker 1: heads of four different Italian intelligence services, that the chief
Speaker 1: of the General staff of the army. There's a bunch
Speaker 1: of people who are like very senior members of the
Speaker 1: Argentinian Junta. Um. The guy, yeah, the Stefano delician A,
Speaker 1: the fascist we've been talk thinking about about the world
Speaker 1: communistly meeting, he's in this. Uh, the guy who founded
Speaker 1: Triple A that the Argentinian desk off from last episode
Speaker 1: also in this. And then the most famous member of
Speaker 1: this group is a guy named Silvio Berlsconi. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's great. Great. He was part of the secret Roade
Speaker 1: Masonic lodge that took control of the government and which
Speaker 1: like planning to do a fascist uh coup and take
Speaker 1: everything over, to destroy communism and to to to get
Speaker 1: an indication if you if you want like a sneak
Speaker 1: peak of where this is eventually going and who wins
Speaker 1: this whole war. He is uh. Sylvia Barrosconi was the
Speaker 1: longest serving prime minister in the history of Italy. Well
Speaker 1: okay postwy longest serving prime minister after Benito Mussolini. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so this this is going great. The Pichi stuff is
Speaker 1: like all over the place. It's really hard to sort out,
Speaker 1: like who exactly did What's like there are evidence from
Speaker 1: some of these trials that are like happening now like
Speaker 1: two evidence is still coming out. What we can say
Speaker 1: is that they seem to have been involved in the
Speaker 1: only a train bombing which kills eighty five people into
Speaker 1: another two hundred people. And because it's a bombing, it
Speaker 1: was originally initially played by anarchist but lo and behold,
Speaker 1: evidence now suggests it was actually Fascist using Gladio explosives
Speaker 1: backed by P two's contexts and Italian intelligence. There's like
Speaker 1: they do other stuff that there there there's decent evidence
Speaker 1: they planted a fake story about Jimmy Carter's brother and
Speaker 1: beating PLO leader yasa Era fat in the US press
Speaker 1: is trying to get Ronald Reagan elected. Oh yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: and really they could just well, we'll talk about the bank,
Speaker 1: the crime bank that Jimmy Carter was affiliated with later,
Speaker 1: but that's another story for another well speak speaking speaking
Speaker 1: of crime banks, I'm not going to talk about I'm
Speaker 1: not going to talk about Brinko Bunco Brosiano and Robert Calvey,
Speaker 1: the man known as God's Banker, turning up dead under
Speaker 1: blackfires Bridge, because if I talk about this, I'll be
Speaker 1: here until like seven And also three thousand people will
Speaker 1: just like fall from the ceiling with knives and assassinate me.
Speaker 1: So but what what what I can say about this
Speaker 1: is that Gladio, you know, as much as people sort
Speaker 1: of exceptionalized with Gladio is Gladio is basically a mirror
Speaker 1: version of of the U s's own parallels or to
Speaker 1: stay behind networks abroad, and these are things like the
Speaker 1: First Observation Group which is a U. S Special Forces
Speaker 1: group that was deployed to do terrorism in South Vietnam,
Speaker 1: like back in the fifties with the US astill, you know,
Speaker 1: doing this whole thing that they claimed they weren't in
Speaker 1: South Vietnam. Um. Yeah, and this is literally anyway whatever, Robert,
Speaker 1: you know what else is a model for fascist desk squads.
Speaker 1: Oh well, this podcast actually so. And when Sylvie and
Speaker 1: I sat down to plan how behind the Bass which
Speaker 1: is gonna work? You know, first question we asked was like,
Speaker 1: how are we going to organize the division of labor
Speaker 1: to make this work? And both at the same time,
Speaker 1: it was amazing, instantly looked each other right in the
Speaker 1: eye and said at the same time, fascist death squads.
Speaker 1: And that's why we still use that organizational method today
Speaker 1: for this show. Yeah, and this is this is this
Speaker 1: is this is why we're sponsored by A and the
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, primarily UM elements of the UM
Speaker 1: all united in operation of fascist death squads, which we support.
Speaker 1: Here Behind the Bastards the Dead Squad podcast notes. Thank you, Sophie,
Speaker 1: we're back. Ah. And you know, thinking about fascist death
Speaker 1: squads makes me think about death squads. You just really
Speaker 1: wanted to do it. I did. I did. You know what,
Speaker 1: I love making our editor bleep things I do, I do,
Speaker 1: I do it. I do it just for you, Sophie. Well,
Speaker 1: it's really but it's really no big deal for me.
Speaker 1: I just type an edit note. I know, I know.
Speaker 1: I just want you to I just want you to
Speaker 1: feel like you're part of the team, Sophie. I run
Speaker 1: the team, Robert, I am the team. That doesn't sound
Speaker 1: like something I'd hear because I so that's very confusing
Speaker 1: to me because I take a lot of credit for
Speaker 1: running the team. So, you know, pretty weird you're sitting
Speaker 1: on the bench most of the time. But okay, well,
Speaker 1: speaking of benches, uh uh, babe, Ruth, you saw somebody
Speaker 1: list that on the Twitter thread that I approached it
Speaker 1: about you knowing a sports reference that doesn't count. Okay, Well,
Speaker 1: let's return to the story. You know, I I could
Speaker 1: do a baby your segway here, but I'm just not
Speaker 1: going to. So what all of this stuff is going
Speaker 1: on in Italy? The league is getting up to just
Speaker 1: some other unfathomable atrocities across Latin America, and one of
Speaker 1: the main engines of these atrocity it turns out is
Speaker 1: the KMT back in Taiwan. Now, Now, last episode we
Speaker 1: talked about how the KMT was the original Des Squad
Speaker 1: Party UM and the time when these spend most of
Speaker 1: the Cold War using the World Anti Communist League to
Speaker 1: sort of export their model of anti communist Des Squad
Speaker 1: Party abroad. UM. The CAMC called this. There's sort of
Speaker 1: like there they have like a method, right, they have
Speaker 1: this stuff that they have this thing, and the method
Speaker 1: is called political warfare, and this is essentially political warfare.
Speaker 1: Is the KMT basically going Okay, so like what if
Speaker 1: we do what if we did like like like almost
Speaker 1: like a part over the top parody of communist indoctrination
Speaker 1: or but like like to our own people for for
Speaker 1: anti communism, like they have they have Soviet style communists
Speaker 1: like literally still like commissars whose job it is to
Speaker 1: like maintain the ideological and party discipline in the military,
Speaker 1: but they're anti communists this time, like everyone is trained
Speaker 1: to spy on each other. Yeah, it's it's great. It's
Speaker 1: like we we've defeated communism by taking every bad aspect
Speaker 1: of like anything you can find in a communist state
Speaker 1: and just doing it for anti communism, can't question Mark.
Speaker 1: They developed this model of like war called the War
Speaker 1: of the Masses, which is literally their version of Mao's
Speaker 1: guerrilla warfare. Um, it is awesome how all of these
Speaker 1: guys like Crib particularly from Mouth, a bunch of the
Speaker 1: ones in the United States, because there's a clearly it works. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he was really good at He was really really good
Speaker 1: at he was You gotta give it, you gotta give
Speaker 1: mau credit where it's due. Yeah, the man had his
Speaker 1: areas of expertise. Yeah, it was exactly that, and nothing
Speaker 1: else to do with agriculture or famous famously good at agriculture,
Speaker 1: the guy who reads Starving Ghosts. Yeah. Yeah. The KMT
Speaker 1: is like it's like it's it's it's like a right
Speaker 1: wing parody of what it commist police it is, but
Speaker 1: it's anti communists. And and they're they're also huge on
Speaker 1: this thing called counter terror. And I think most people
Speaker 1: listening to this the You're gonna hear counter terror and
Speaker 1: assume what I'm talking about like some counter terrorism thing,
Speaker 1: and like kind of like that there are kind of
Speaker 1: terrorism stuff that is just counter terror. But I've known
Speaker 1: a lot of professional counter terrorism people and and Hung
Speaker 1: out with them while they did counter terrorism and boy
Speaker 1: it looks a lot like terrorism. Yeah. Well and about
Speaker 1: the iraqis yeah, counter terrorism forces. Well, the thing with this,
Speaker 1: right is counter terror. Counter terror is just cutting out
Speaker 1: the whole sort of middleman thing. Counter terror terror is
Speaker 1: just the state go literally going weird. The terrorists now
Speaker 1: are planned to win this war is We're going to
Speaker 1: terrorize the population, do kidnapping, assassinations and massacres until they
Speaker 1: don't support gerrillas Anymorey. Yeah, then this is I mean,
Speaker 1: the k MT are like pioneers of this. The the U. S.
Speaker 1: Army teaches this to people, and everyone we're about to
Speaker 1: talk about is just obsessed with kind of terror like
Speaker 1: this is like this is like eight percent of what
Speaker 1: they do is oh my god, what what what if
Speaker 1: we did every atrocity we're accusing our enemies of, but
Speaker 1: like significantly worse. And you know, one of the places
Speaker 1: they learned this stuff is the Political Warfare Academy in Taipei,
Speaker 1: which is you know, it starts taking students from militaries
Speaker 1: all across Latin America. And this is this is why
Speaker 1: don't we have a political warfare Academy? Sophie that's true.
Speaker 1: We should have one. We should, we should, we should.
Speaker 1: It's in the budget for next year. Okay, alright, good,
Speaker 1: that's that's good. Okay, Sophie. We we have to make
Speaker 1: this very clear right now. I am going to run
Speaker 1: the Political Warfare Academy so that when all the officers
Speaker 1: that I treat we were personally loyal to me, so
Speaker 1: that I can sucessfully overthrow Robert in a military coup. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this seems. This seems like a good plan for me.
Speaker 1: It's so funny that you would think that he would
Speaker 1: need to be the one that's overthrown when I am.
Speaker 1: I've always just I've always just been the figurehead of this.
Speaker 1: I don't know, just think I want to be the fingerhead.
Speaker 1: I don't want to do the actual work, which is
Speaker 1: why I'm not overthrowing Sophie. I want to be like
Speaker 1: that seems awful, dear god. I just want to be
Speaker 1: the podcast equivalent of what was one of the guys
Speaker 1: who was just a figurehead? Um um, late what's his name?
Speaker 1: I was thinking Star Wars, the fake the faith Queen
Speaker 1: Ammi dolla, Yes, I was gonna say with Star Wars,
Speaker 1: I want to be the the I don't even know
Speaker 1: enough about Star Wars whatever, let's continue, Okay, So okay,
Speaker 1: so you have this Tiwny School the America's thing, and like, okay,
Speaker 1: so there are a lot of people who get trained
Speaker 1: in a lot of like you know, schools to do
Speaker 1: counter terror. But like, okay, even people who have been
Speaker 1: to the School of America's of the Americas, like they
Speaker 1: talked to people who come back from political with were
Speaker 1: if you're training and are like, those guys got weird,
Speaker 1: Like they're like two into this, you see, just like
Speaker 1: people who are in des squads, like we'll talk to
Speaker 1: we'll like talk about people who are like came back
Speaker 1: from Taiwan and really like those guys are a bit weird.
Speaker 1: These guys are like those guys are a bit much
Speaker 1: And you know the camp she starts like exploining this model. Um,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote from inside the league here about like
Speaker 1: what they were doing. First. Through its liaisons in the league,
Speaker 1: the camp identified the political party in the Latin country
Speaker 1: that was the most militantly anti communist. The party chosen
Speaker 1: to be represented in the League is invariably the one
Speaker 1: that has already proven as anti commuist medal or displays
Speaker 1: the ability or displays the ability and will to do so.
Speaker 1: Following the KMTE model, the chosen party establishes a nationwide
Speaker 1: intelligence and counter terror network. These paramilitary groups are then
Speaker 1: gradually incorporated into the nation's armed forces. This is usually
Speaker 1: accomplished when in a moment of national crisis, the army
Speaker 1: turns to these civilian bands for support when it is
Speaker 1: too impotent to curb them. Um. One of the parties
Speaker 1: they choose is the MLN in Guatemala, which is founded
Speaker 1: by this guy named Mario Salvador Alacrone. And this is
Speaker 1: a guy who wants said that sounds like that sounds
Speaker 1: like an airport Italian restaurant right there. I mean, he's
Speaker 1: definitely he's definitely fascist enough to be an Italian UM
Speaker 1: or to work at an airport Mayeah, both too incredibly
Speaker 1: fascist places. This is a guy, Okay, I'm gonna read
Speaker 1: this quote from him. I could perhaps accept the label
Speaker 1: of fascist, Sandoval told a French reporter in nineteen eight
Speaker 1: one in the historical sense of the word, were it
Speaker 1: not for the fact that it refers to a type
Speaker 1: of socialism, albeit national socialism. So this is a guy
Speaker 1: who fascism is too socialist for him. Okay, buddy, it's incredible.
Speaker 1: And uh, this is the guy who is the head
Speaker 1: of the Guatemalan after the Nazi Party from the right. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: that's literally his thinking. This is the guy used the
Speaker 1: Guatemal and like the head of the Guatemalan chapter of
Speaker 1: the Nati Communist League for like, basically his entire life,
Speaker 1: Um Mario Sandoval out of Chrome was. He he's an
Speaker 1: old school like Guatemalan right winger. Like he's one of
Speaker 1: the guys who like did the nineteen in j Bat
Speaker 1: coup against the democratic he elected to Kobo Rbens, so
Speaker 1: like he's been around. And he's also one of the
Speaker 1: people behind the White Hand, which is basically they're the
Speaker 1: most fear and bloodthirsty desk out in Columbia until like
Speaker 1: the army fully makes over and starts doing that. That
Speaker 1: the genocide stuff against the Maya population. And now, lest
Speaker 1: you think, lest you think Sandoval out of Kron did
Speaker 1: not do the genocide, he absolutely is. Anytime you read
Speaker 1: anything about the genocide, like the first part of the
Speaker 1: genocide is I'm talking about like the stuff that he
Speaker 1: did in the sixties and seventies. Um including just like
Speaker 1: the White Hand. They have this fairly famous thing where
Speaker 1: like in the nineteen seventies there there's all these like
Speaker 1: agricultural co operative co operaters forming and the White Hand,
Speaker 1: and again these are just people like forming coops and
Speaker 1: the White Hand just walks in and slaughters them all um.
Speaker 1: And Okay, I haven't been able to figure out the
Speaker 1: exact extent to which he was involved in the full
Speaker 1: on genocide a starch um. I mean, there's there's no
Speaker 1: way he didn't want the genocide to happen. But the
Speaker 1: thing about it that's weird is it like his political
Speaker 1: enemies are in power when the genocide starts, and I
Speaker 1: mean you know that this is in some sense like
Speaker 1: a reflection of how deeply just like genocidal the entire
Speaker 1: sort of guatemal and political classes, right because like his
Speaker 1: enemies gonna put in power and they still do what
Speaker 1: they still do. A n aside, but I mean he's
Speaker 1: definitely still killing people, Like there's definitely his esquadras on
Speaker 1: burning people in the streets. It's kind of unclear exactly
Speaker 1: how involved he was in the army just like exterminating people.
Speaker 1: But do you know who was actively involved at on
Speaker 1: the level of directly back in the military the KMT. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: you were doing an ad plug and to say, the
Speaker 1: products and services that support this podcast, which probably yes, like,
Speaker 1: but yeah, the KMT specifically here. So so all right,
Speaker 1: I guess I I previewed this last episode when I
Speaker 1: was talking about, um, the whole thing about how the
Speaker 1: US like refused to recognize the People's Republic of China
Speaker 1: is legitimate government of China until nineteen seventy nine, and
Speaker 1: at seventy nine, the US finally flips and like recognizes
Speaker 1: the PRC as legitimate government of China instead of recognizing
Speaker 1: like the KMT s rump government in Taiwan and almost
Speaker 1: all of the world old like rump. Yeah, look like
Speaker 1: almost all the countries in the world recognize the PC.
Speaker 1: One of the ones that doesn't, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: and the people who don't, it's like it's like Rhodesia
Speaker 1: and like South Africa, like apartheid South Africa. And one
Speaker 1: of the other countries is Guatemala, and so Taiwana Guatemala
Speaker 1: remain are incredibly close political allies. Um, the Guatemalan Army
Speaker 1: like sends ah, but there's I mean, they're so have
Speaker 1: such directly tied interests Taiwan Guatemala both, well, they both
Speaker 1: really like killing communists. Specific that that is, that's that's
Speaker 1: that's the thing that they really like killing communists. And
Speaker 1: so yeah, they're going on army sends a bunch of
Speaker 1: officers to Twant's Political Warfare Academy Taiwan, sells them weapons
Speaker 1: and says military advisors and trainers to Guatemala. And so there,
Speaker 1: I just I love you know, it's there's just it's
Speaker 1: always beautiful when when people come together around and shared interests. Yeah,
Speaker 1: international solidarity between starity. Okay, probably I'm gonna start going
Speaker 1: to start a rousing chorus and the people's flag is
Speaker 1: deepest read that's right. Oh and yeah and so and
Speaker 1: so one of the things that what ends up happening
Speaker 1: here is that there's a bunch of Taiwanese military advisors,
Speaker 1: there's Taiwanese political warfare pamphlets like flooding around everywhere, and
Speaker 1: all of this is going on. When when the government,
Speaker 1: when the Guatemalan government starts doing the genocide lm Ao
Speaker 1: Sorry wait, that's not an l m Ao situation. So
Speaker 1: it's real bad. I mean, we'll we'll we'll get to
Speaker 1: something that's kind of lm ao in a second, but
Speaker 1: in the immediate thing here by, by the end of
Speaker 1: the genocide, the Guatemala government has killed two hundred thousand
Speaker 1: people and wipe like in their entire like cultures that
Speaker 1: are gone, like their whole languages that are just wiped out.
Speaker 1: Like it's like if you've ever insably horrifying, spend any
Speaker 1: time in Guatemal and talk to some like older people,
Speaker 1: like there are there are towns, significant chunks of them
Speaker 1: where like the army is still not allowed in like
Speaker 1: they are effectively like autonomous because um the genesis. Yeah,
Speaker 1: as a result of like the fucking genocide, like fucking
Speaker 1: an experience you will regularly have, or at least ten
Speaker 1: years ago you regularly have. Is like turning a street
Speaker 1: corner and there's just forty or fifty people lining the street,
Speaker 1: all missing legs and arms and hands. Um. And it's
Speaker 1: not because they all had separate accidents. Um. Yeah, Like
Speaker 1: it's Guatemala is fucking dope. Is ship Guatemalan people very nice? Uh?
Speaker 1: The degree to which that country got fucked over, um
Speaker 1: is one of the things that makes me angriest in
Speaker 1: the world. Yeah, it is. It is particularly horrible. And
Speaker 1: as a side note here, when the U N does
Speaker 1: do you and eventually in the nineties does doesn't investigation
Speaker 1: of the genocide and Taiwan refuses to cooperate and you
Speaker 1: just day. To the best of my knowledge, the documents
Speaker 1: about exactly what Taiwan was doing the genocide are still classified.
Speaker 1: So that's fun, that's great. Yeah, So Mario sent up
Speaker 1: all Autocron's recruitment into the league, like it wasn't just
Speaker 1: about sort of Taiwanese diplomatic relations. He's brought in as
Speaker 1: and they literally call him the grandfather, the godfather of
Speaker 1: death squads. Like everyone just calls him the godfather. It's
Speaker 1: fucking Italians, okay, sure. And and so you know, he's
Speaker 1: brought in the train other deat squad leaders and one
Speaker 1: of those guys is Roberto. See this guy is a
Speaker 1: French name. I think it's I think it's Debussan something
Speaker 1: like that, Robert. And he so he he is a
Speaker 1: guy who would say things like and he said this
Speaker 1: to a journalist quote, You Germans are were very intelligent.
Speaker 1: You realize that the Jews were responsible for the spread
Speaker 1: of communism and you began to kill them, m boy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so his nickname is blowtorch Bob. And yeah, do
Speaker 1: you want to guess why his nickname is blowtorch Bob?
Speaker 1: I really don't want to guess. I'm gonna be I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be fair with you. I will prefer not to
Speaker 1: guess on that. I will just tell you it's because
Speaker 1: he was famous for just using blowtorch torture prisoners. Oh, well, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's he's actually a similarity that he has with with
Speaker 1: our our producer Sophie. I don't use a blowtorch. Okay,
Speaker 1: well it's a can of hair spray with a lighter
Speaker 1: Sophie works similarly. Well, at least get your facts straight
Speaker 1: if you're going to accuse me of something. This is
Speaker 1: this is how we handle problems like that time. I
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't know where I'm going with this joke.
Speaker 1: Please continue. So Rovirtual like so, he goes to the
Speaker 1: league's meeting in Buenos Aires night eighty and he asked
Speaker 1: for help running desk squads, and he becomes send of
Speaker 1: all out of krons like Protege and this he He
Speaker 1: also goes to Taiwan and spends time at the Camties
Speaker 1: Political Warfare Academy. Here here's here's from inside the league
Speaker 1: about his time there. In an interview with a French
Speaker 1: reporter in nineteen eight seven, they have Buston said that
Speaker 1: the courses he took in Beto, which is Betos, a
Speaker 1: district in Taiwan. Yeah. Yeah, we're a bunch of people
Speaker 1: who came over from China, like wind up that this
Speaker 1: is where the academy is. In ninety seven was quote
Speaker 1: the best class I ever studied. Those lessons are what
Speaker 1: I applied when I organized, We started organizing civic groups.
Speaker 1: Political war is different from military war. It is different
Speaker 1: in its space. The political war is defined in three
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty degrees. The military war is a war
Speaker 1: in space. But there is one military front, one theater
Speaker 1: of operation. In the military war, the young people could
Speaker 1: participate young men, especially in political warfare. Everyone participate. Bates
Speaker 1: political warfare. The abusion said, it is psychological warfare against
Speaker 1: the enemy. I started psychological warfare against the Communists. I'd
Speaker 1: announced the program, their treason, their infiltrations into governments. The
Speaker 1: political warfare was a compliment to the armed fight. And
Speaker 1: so Taiwan is not the only country that's appointing this guy. Um.
Speaker 1: At that same League meeting in nineteen eighty, he meets
Speaker 1: with representatives of the Argentinian police state to like ask
Speaker 1: for more training to like fund his death squads. And
Speaker 1: you know, we should go back to Operation Condor for
Speaker 1: a second, because remember, like this is this is how
Speaker 1: Condor started, right, Contra starts with a bunch of people
Speaker 1: at at cl meetings like coming together and going, hey,
Speaker 1: we should go communist together. And you know the thing
Speaker 1: about Condors that Condor had originally been a project of
Speaker 1: what's called the Southern Cone, which is like a region
Speaker 1: of Latin America covering like Argentina, Chile, Uruguay and sometimes
Speaker 1: like Paraguay and part of Brazil. Um. And what this
Speaker 1: meeting of the Cil was doing was exporting a new
Speaker 1: version of Condor into worth to Central America. This is
Speaker 1: sending it to Al Salvador, to Honduras, to guadam to Nicaragua. UM.
Speaker 1: Here's from the predatory state. The nineteen eighty w a
Speaker 1: c L and meeting Anti Communist League meeting in Buenos
Speaker 1: Aures seemed to have been a defining event, and exporting
Speaker 1: the Condour system from the Southern Cone. The meeting brought
Speaker 1: together various right wing forces, intelligence agents, and military official officers,
Speaker 1: including many involved in Condor, to strategize about ways to
Speaker 1: accelerate the world anti communist crusade. In March nineteen eighty,
Speaker 1: the cent in East and Media announced that the CIA
Speaker 1: was interfering in Nicaragua and Al Salvador and training former
Speaker 1: National Guard troops in Honduras. So Debusion like gets his
Speaker 1: DEAs Squad training, and a year later, in nineteen eighty one,
Speaker 1: he founds Arena, which is his own sort of Salvadorian
Speaker 1: des Squad party. And then he he also does something
Speaker 1: that puts him in a very rare category of bassard.
Speaker 1: He kills a saint. Oh had they been sainted when
Speaker 1: he killed them? Or getting murder or just how he
Speaker 1: became a saint? Dope? Well, did the guy I mean
Speaker 1: kind of did him a favor. Yeah, maybe I feel
Speaker 1: like he would rather have been alive than a dead saint.
Speaker 1: But well, I don't know, I don't, I don't, I
Speaker 1: will not. I will not claim to understand the mind
Speaker 1: of the high level Catholic clergy. I was about to say,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna guess not because that's like being the le
Speaker 1: bron James. Okay, now we're just repeating, Yeah, we gotta
Speaker 1: give you more, we gotta give you more names, see
Speaker 1: a better talking points. I just need to watch that
Speaker 1: Adam Sandler movie again with the footballs and the tall
Speaker 1: guy and he's Spanish. It's a good movie. Should watch it.
Speaker 1: It's a pretty good movie, Sophie. So that that that
Speaker 1: saint is a guy you might you probably actually have
Speaker 1: heard of. That is Archbishop Oscar Romero. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: He lived a long left but between a win did
Speaker 1: ucon had assassinated and uh, you know spec Sherry points out,
Speaker 1: like his assassination really looks like a condor killing, like
Speaker 1: it has it has all of the sort of elements
Speaker 1: of it, and you know it seen like has taken
Speaker 1: his lesson as to heart really fast. And this whole
Speaker 1: project that he's doing, this whole thing and we're trying
Speaker 1: to get everyone she's been doing the sort of like
Speaker 1: training desk squads to help him make his own desk coads.
Speaker 1: This works incredibly well. His desk goads are trained by
Speaker 1: Argentina and Taiwan, ventured by Mario Santava of Krone they
Speaker 1: killed something like forty thou people during this story Civil War. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like and for forty thod is like a kind is
Speaker 1: a kind of low estimate. It's possible it was much.
Speaker 1: I've seen I've seen people blame I mean, okay, so
Speaker 1: like there's a question as to like how many people
Speaker 1: were killed by the desk calls and how may people
Speaker 1: were actually killed with the military. And I've seen estimates
Speaker 1: are like twenty thousand people higher than this because they're
Speaker 1: attributing like all of the people killing. It's death squad
Speaker 1: numbers are like when people ask me how many beers
Speaker 1: I've had at like three thirty in the morning numbers, Right,
Speaker 1: you're gonna be off by a margin and under yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're you're almost certainly you almost certainly there's more of them.
Speaker 1: And you know, so this is uh, what will we
Speaker 1: call in the trade extremely bad now, Robert, as you
Speaker 1: well know, Ronald Reagan and his staff sold weapons to
Speaker 1: a RAN to secure prisoner releases and fund Nicaraguan death squads.
Speaker 1: But do you know who else sold weapons in questionable
Speaker 1: arm steels to fund death squads? Our sponsors the uh
Speaker 1: huh that's right, uh, with the we believe pandas are good,
Speaker 1: and so is arming paramilitary groups and people people. I
Speaker 1: I think most people think that I'm joking here. I'm
Speaker 1: actually literally not. They actually literally did this so article
Speaker 1: and it was seven countries death squads and seven I
Speaker 1: think it was seven countries I've ever looked, Chris, I
Speaker 1: don't like death squads being in seven countries funded by
Speaker 1: the Yes, how you sound? Yeah? All right, here's ads
Speaker 1: We're back. Do you like my my Chris voice? Chris, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I feel I feel like I feel like I feel
Speaker 1: like my registers slightly do slightly higher than that. It is.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be honest, the same as my Soviet voice.
Speaker 1: I have one voice that I do for people. This
Speaker 1: is why you're a professional. This is why I'm the professional.
Speaker 1: This is exactly right, this is why I'm the I'm
Speaker 1: the I'm the the leader of this junta speaking of
Speaker 1: Runto's actually not speaking for you. I don't think. I
Speaker 1: don't think it's well, they're they're there. I guess the
Speaker 1: Argentinian junta is gonna be involved later. But when we
Speaker 1: left off, the US was about to get involved in
Speaker 1: this series of incredibly sketchy arm deals with Iran and
Speaker 1: has billah in to find dest squads. But that's what
Speaker 1: you like to hear. Unfortunately, before we can know it's
Speaker 1: it's yeah, it's not I mean, I guess, I guess
Speaker 1: you could probably find people on the left or like
Speaker 1: a Rand contrat was good because they were funding because
Speaker 1: they were giving weapons who Iran. But then there's the
Speaker 1: whole funding the conscious thing. So it's kind of like
Speaker 1: it is fun. There's a lot of like when you
Speaker 1: like look at I don't know, the the kind of
Speaker 1: lazy left wing analysis of of the like the tanking style,
Speaker 1: like shitty left wing analysis where like you know everyone
Speaker 1: wants you know, they're clear set good guys and bad guys.
Speaker 1: And when you look at the reality, which is like boy,
Speaker 1: China and the United States wound up backing a lot
Speaker 1: of the same militant groups during the Reagan years. It's
Speaker 1: kind of kept happening over and over again. Weird, weird
Speaker 1: the Reagan administration. Anyway, whatever it's it's it's a good time. Um.
Speaker 1: But before we before we can get you further inter
Speaker 1: Rand contract, we have to introduce the last major world
Speaker 1: ute Communist League figure we're talking about, and also a
Speaker 1: Rand contract co conspirator Major General John K. Sig Lab
Speaker 1: So John K. Sig Lab is he is the most
Speaker 1: spooked out spook whoever tortured indocent civilian. Um he boy,
Speaker 1: there is competition for that. What wait wait too, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm not even gonna like I I literally can't do
Speaker 1: his entire resume here because it would take up like
Speaker 1: four like like the entire episode would just be me
Speaker 1: reading his resume. Um. He starts as an OSS guy
Speaker 1: behind Nazi lines in World War Two, and then he
Speaker 1: gets transferred at the Pacific to teach Chinese forces guerilla
Speaker 1: tactics against the Japanese. And would that he had died
Speaker 1: a hero there because his next posting is as the
Speaker 1: CIA Desk chief for China. Um somehow, And there's a
Speaker 1: lot of his things in his career that I read
Speaker 1: and don't make any sense to me. Um. He somehow
Speaker 1: also was involved in uh the establishment of the Ranger
Speaker 1: Training Center at Fort Benning. Um. He then becomes the
Speaker 1: deputy Station chief of the CIA and South Korea during
Speaker 1: the Korean War. And this is the thing I don't
Speaker 1: understand it all. So he's the deputy Station chief of
Speaker 1: the CIA, right he somehow also is commanding a combat battalion.
Speaker 1: I have no idea how this work. Don't ask me.
Speaker 1: It's baffling, I I I don't get it. That's a
Speaker 1: little odd, Okay, I have no idea. Um, this guy
Speaker 1: is just like the spook. Spook. Um here's from inside
Speaker 1: the leaguebout what he got up to next. As commander
Speaker 1: of the Joint Unconventional Warfare Task Force known as Max
Speaker 1: Sog great acronym by the way, Max Sog really sing
Speaker 1: Lab was one of the on site commanders of Operation Phoenix,
Speaker 1: the American directed assassination and counter terror program. And Robert,
Speaker 1: do you remember that episode that Garrison did on Eel Horse.
Speaker 1: I do, I do, although I will tell you a
Speaker 1: fan came up to me during one of the live
Speaker 1: events I did recently and informed me that there's a
Speaker 1: specific kind of um antibiotic that they give. This fan
Speaker 1: is a horse, a horse person. Um. She told me
Speaker 1: there's an antibiotic that they give horses that h if
Speaker 1: you eat the meat, it will give you a horrible
Speaker 1: cancer immediately. So yeah, that's that's gonna that's gonna limit
Speaker 1: the number of I was going to just steal a
Speaker 1: horse from somebody's horse farm. Um, you know, just capture
Speaker 1: one horse and eat it. But now I feel like
Speaker 1: I have to be careful to make sure it hasn't
Speaker 1: been given this this antibiotic that will turn it into
Speaker 1: cancer meat, because I mean that'll probably be a bad Yeah.
Speaker 1: But on the other hand, what a way to go
Speaker 1: I ate cancer and some like this? This is this,
Speaker 1: This is something somebody like two dies of Yeah, Chris
Speaker 1: actively encouraging Robert to eat cancer meat so that he
Speaker 1: can overthrow him. I was gonna make Garrison eat most
Speaker 1: of them. This is called political warfare, Sophie. I know,
Speaker 1: I see it happening. I'm and I'm proud. Yeah, doing
Speaker 1: the horse meat Gladioli. Yeah, So, so remember the part
Speaker 1: about the So the thing I remember about that that
Speaker 1: episode about eel horse was Garrison stopping me after a
Speaker 1: meeting and saying, Chris, have you have you ever is there?
Speaker 1: Have you ever heard of an ancient Chinese remedy of
Speaker 1: people sticking eels up their grasses? And the only thing
Speaker 1: I could think of that involved East Asia and people
Speaker 1: with eels was the thing about how uh the people
Speaker 1: people would rape people with eels and dream of Vietnam War.
Speaker 1: Oh yes, yeah, so that was this guy. That's him.
Speaker 1: He's the guy, right deal with Eels um and and
Speaker 1: you know this, this is this is this is this guy.
Speaker 1: The thing he's doing Project Phoenix. Their job is specifically
Speaker 1: to assassinate civilians. It's defined civilians who are horse sympathetic
Speaker 1: to Dorth Vietnam. It's like North Vietnam and just killed them.
Speaker 1: And that that that's what he's doing. Um, a bunch
Speaker 1: of the work from Project Phoenix, which again like he's
Speaker 1: the guy running. Um if I just way into this
Speaker 1: Army manual, let's pass out the school the America's that's
Speaker 1: about like how did you terrorism and how to assassinate people?
Speaker 1: And eventually that gets leaked there's a huge scandal, but
Speaker 1: doesn't affect him at all. Um. He eventually goes back
Speaker 1: to the Army at some point, and this is there.
Speaker 1: He flips randomly back and forth between the CIA, the
Speaker 1: Army and like the Rangers, and I don't I don't
Speaker 1: know what's going on with this guy's career. It's it's
Speaker 1: incredibly bizarre spook ship. Um. But and so he's made
Speaker 1: the Chief of Staff of US Forces in South Korea,
Speaker 1: but he gets like incredibly piste off that Carter wants
Speaker 1: to pull troops out, so he like publicly denounces the president,
Speaker 1: and Carter is just like, you can't do that, like
Speaker 1: you're a general, you know, and so he just fires him.
Speaker 1: But this of course makes him like incredibly popular with
Speaker 1: the US right, and he eventually helps found a new
Speaker 1: American chapter of the World Anti Communist League and becomes
Speaker 1: the head of the league. Here here's the inside the league.
Speaker 1: The New American Chapter of the United States Council for
Speaker 1: World Freedom uh us CWF terrible acronym terrible was born
Speaker 1: like cow cawl is a good acronym. The U s
Speaker 1: c WF terrible zero at attend Jesus Christ, come on.
Speaker 1: So the U s c WF was born facilitated by
Speaker 1: a loan of nearly twenty dollars from Taiwan. But sing
Speaker 1: Lab was able to create was a body of you
Speaker 1: could really make money go further back then? Oh yeah, no,
Speaker 1: like you could you could do a rand contra with
Speaker 1: twenty dollars. Yeah, Like I mean Sophie and I recently
Speaker 1: put twenty dollars into a series of militant endeavors and
Speaker 1: we barely assassinated the former Prime minister. But hey, podcast
Speaker 1: finish episodes, not even not even on that one. Nearly
Speaker 1: got us in trouble on that one, pulled it out
Speaker 1: though nobody. Nobody fine dodging dodging prosecution like Neo and
Speaker 1: the Matrix. That's right, Why how do you look dodging
Speaker 1: prosecution like shinzo Abe didn't dodge anyway. What Chris so
Speaker 1: single Lab is able to create like a powerfum respected
Speaker 1: body of American conservatives, the likes of which the League
Speaker 1: had never seen before. As the USCWF grew, this new
Speaker 1: League chapter came to include high ranking former officers of
Speaker 1: the American Army and intelligence community. Lieutenant General Daniel O. Graham,
Speaker 1: former director of the Defension Intelligence Agency, became its vice chairman,
Speaker 1: while the retired Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Albert Kayon was
Speaker 1: his treasurer. On the advisory board was General Lewis Walt,
Speaker 1: former commander of Marine Corps forces in Vietnam, and Race Sleeper,
Speaker 1: retired Air Force colonel. So there's new American chapter. Somebody
Speaker 1: needs to do an r M song like a like
Speaker 1: a parody of an r M song about Race Sleeper
Speaker 1: using the r M song day Sleeper to talk about
Speaker 1: it anyway, that that is not the r M periody.
Speaker 1: I thought you were going to go for that, that
Speaker 1: sleeper day Sleeper, which is a great r M song
Speaker 1: to get me wrong, but it would also be a
Speaker 1: funny anyway the figure it out. Yeah, someone else do that. UM,
Speaker 1: And you know, this is like the most fitted out
Speaker 1: organization I've ever encountered. And UM sing Leap had already
Speaker 1: been like a liaison to the raising Reagan administration. UM.
Speaker 1: In nineteen seventy nine, he another CIA guy named Daniel
Speaker 1: Grant went to Guatemala to convince Reagan to back the government.
Speaker 1: So Reagan does, and I guess what DEA squad killings
Speaker 1: immediately increase, and you know, everyone else in the Republican
Speaker 1: Party sort of falls in line. I'm like, oh, this
Speaker 1: is fine, and uh here here's here's what happened next.
Speaker 1: The election of Reagan coincided with the bloodiest outbreak of
Speaker 1: Guatemalan desquad actions in history. Almost five hundred deaths a month,
Speaker 1: almost all attributed to the right, were being recorded by
Speaker 1: the American were being reported by the American embassy, but
Speaker 1: even that figure was considered low by most other monitoring groups.
Speaker 1: Piles of mutilated corpses were being discovered every morning throughout
Speaker 1: the country, and a considered campaign to eliminate the centrals
Speaker 1: parties was underway in Guatemala City. From July June, seventy
Speaker 1: leaders of the Christian Democratic Party and ten officials of
Speaker 1: the Social Democratic Revolutionary Front. We're assassinated were most were
Speaker 1: murdered by gunfire from passing cars. The trademarker of the MLN.
Speaker 1: And this is all happening at the same time as
Speaker 1: the genocide, which Reagan is like, yeah, no, go ahead
Speaker 1: and do this. Um. And so Reagan's Reagan's big things
Speaker 1: that he wants to expand descard activity everywhere. It's primary
Speaker 1: target of Nicaragua. UM. And I guess we should probably
Speaker 1: explain why they hate Nicaragua so much. So in at
Speaker 1: seventy nine, the left of Sandinista's finally outs of the
Speaker 1: US back to Summosan dictatorship and tried to end the
Speaker 1: literally centuries old reign of genocidal landowning oligarchs. And this
Speaker 1: is that, you know, because because all of the rest
Speaker 1: of the Latin American worlding classes also genocidal landowning oligarchs.
Speaker 1: This sparks at off what we we're talking about. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like that, the genocide Guatemala, the massacres now Salvador. A
Speaker 1: lot of this stuff was was triggered by the right wingers,
Speaker 1: just sort of like seeing someone else being like, hey,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe you guys shouldn't have the total literally power
Speaker 1: of her life and death and the ability to murder
Speaker 1: anyone you want in order to keep your land. And
Speaker 1: they just they just lose it and start doing genocides.
Speaker 1: And another country that they turned into a war zone
Speaker 1: is hunters now. The man larger responsible for this, at
Speaker 1: least initially, was Christovo Alvarez Martinez, a School the America's
Speaker 1: graduate who was also trained by the Argentinian junta and
Speaker 1: their own sort of dirty war stuff. Um Christovo Alvarez
Speaker 1: Martinez is floating around the same sort of like cl
Speaker 1: mel Lou you as like all the other desquad guys
Speaker 1: who talked about UM and at that same ninety eight
Speaker 1: conference of the League and bueno sorry, so he asked
Speaker 1: and gets help for from from the Argentinian army. But
Speaker 1: what what what makes what makes um Gristoval average Martine
Speaker 1: is different from the other des Squad leaders that we've
Speaker 1: talked about is that, you know, because so he's absolutely
Speaker 1: doing des squads along the sort of Argentina and Dirtey
Speaker 1: war model, like right down to like like right down
Speaker 1: to the sort of Argentinian like triple threat of kidnapping,
Speaker 1: electroshocks are torture and throwing people out of helicopters. But
Speaker 1: he's also attempting to get training for a bunch of
Speaker 1: nick rock when like excellent Nicaraguan National Guard people who
Speaker 1: fled across the border in Hunduras after like losing the war.
Speaker 1: And this is enormously successful, like literally everyone is just
Speaker 1: like falling over themselves to train these people to to
Speaker 1: a new army. Of contrast, and in nineten eight eight one,
Speaker 1: he gets made the head of Hundura's armed forces, and
Speaker 1: this is where all the sort of threads start to converge,
Speaker 1: both both the Chileans and Argentinians help of Resmontina's training
Speaker 1: unit that becomes known as Battalion three six three DASH sixteen,
Speaker 1: which was in charge of killing quote enemies of the state.
Speaker 1: After Alvarez Martinez made formal of sort of secret contact
Speaker 1: with the conscious aside Nicaragua itself, he starts like coordinating
Speaker 1: intelligence with them, and the Argentinians also helped start like
Speaker 1: training the Army of contrast in the in the camp
Speaker 1: and hunduras Um. The Argenti Argentinians also started working even
Speaker 1: closer with the CIA, which is pretty incredible, but they
Speaker 1: gets closer. Um here's from predatory states. General Guillermo Suarez Mason,
Speaker 1: the powerful commander of Argentina's First Army Corps, was instrumental
Speaker 1: in the creation of the Extra Territorial Task Force or
Speaker 1: the GTE, a unit of Battalion six O one that
Speaker 1: carried out secret intelligence operations outside of Argentina. Sanchez Rissier
Speaker 1: said that the GTE was based in Florida with the
Speaker 1: authorization of the CIA. Sarves, based on himself, presided over
Speaker 1: the Fourth Congress of the Latin American Anti Communist League
Speaker 1: will Anti Communist League affiliates in nineteen eighty and the
Speaker 1: w A, the World Anti Communist League, reportedly donated eight
Speaker 1: million dollars to pay for the deployment of Argentine officers
Speaker 1: to Central America. UM. Sarves Mason fled argentina transition to
Speaker 1: democracy in nine and, according to one human rights organization,
Speaker 1: all over North arranged a false visa for him to
Speaker 1: enter the US. North had been discussing with him the
Speaker 1: formation of a continental counterinsurgency force, a concept that again
Speaker 1: evokes Operation Condor. So this is great. The Argentina, Argentina's
Speaker 1: assassination units running out of Miami. Right, Oliver North is
Speaker 1: giving this guy like who almost certainly would have just
Speaker 1: been like shot I like, yeah, enters in the US.
Speaker 1: You know what's fun about Oliver North now that you're
Speaker 1: saying all this, is that I watched him on TV
Speaker 1: every night on Fox News when I was a kid. Yeah,
Speaker 1: big only North fans. Yeah, it's it's it's great that
Speaker 1: he did so many crimes and he's just still around
Speaker 1: today doing bad stuff. So not not not wanting to
Speaker 1: be left out of this des squad party. Taiwan also
Speaker 1: sends military advisors to train the Contrast and the Captain
Speaker 1: Hun Duras. It's really like everyone is there, Like the
Speaker 1: Moonies are there. The soldier of Fortune magazine is playing
Speaker 1: weapons in like lablay there and a couple of them
Speaker 1: it killed in the helicopter to get shot down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a really really fun story of some Soldier of
Speaker 1: Fortune guys getting the fun mrked out. It's um. Also
Speaker 1: there's a pretty good uh song from a Canadian country
Speaker 1: music artists that like old student Visas that's about this period.
Speaker 1: Check it out. I don't know, I just I always
Speaker 1: just like I just like I want to imagine, like
Speaker 1: like just think about, like what is it like in
Speaker 1: these camps. It's like like bohey pok because like the
Speaker 1: Moon's lieutenant is like showing up there and you know
Speaker 1: he see like he just like sees some guy from
Speaker 1: I don't know, he sees like some CIA guys like hey, Bob,
Speaker 1: I haven't seen you since since we did the we
Speaker 1: did the Cocaine cou and Bolivia. It's like all every
Speaker 1: single person who's ever funded at ES squad it's just
Speaker 1: simultaneously running around these camps and it's like and you know,
Speaker 1: part of part of what's going on here is that
Speaker 1: sig Lab, like through through the sort of CIL networks
Speaker 1: we've been talking about that that are funding all these squads,
Speaker 1: like gets the Reagan administration like fully in touch with
Speaker 1: which which involved in trade with training these contracts as well.
Speaker 1: On the Reagan administration is so heavily involved in this
Speaker 1: stuff that Mario Salvador Alacrone literally shows up at his
Speaker 1: inaugural ball in nine, which is great. And the c
Speaker 1: meanwhile is so heavily involved in the contracy camps in
Speaker 1: Honduras that quoting McSherry Alvarez, who's who's the hunter and
Speaker 1: intelligence guy who's now having the military running this stuff,
Speaker 1: was so close to the CIA station chief and Honduras
Speaker 1: Douglas Winters that Winters asked him to be the godfather
Speaker 1: of his adopted child. It's incredible, and Ronald Reagan later
Speaker 1: awarded him the Legion of marrit three. So this is
Speaker 1: love love Ronald Reagan, a guy who never did anything wrong,
Speaker 1: and to nineteen eighty four, this was going great. And
Speaker 1: by going great, I mean the CIA, Argentina, Taiwan in
Speaker 1: the moodies are like having a great time partying in
Speaker 1: the jungle and like murdering communists in Honduras itself. The
Speaker 1: Nicaraguan contras have just straight up turned into their own
Speaker 1: desk squads who are murdering people, you know, Okay, So
Speaker 1: like that there are descuad that's supposed to murther people
Speaker 1: in Nicaragua, right, but they're also just murdering people in Honduras.
Speaker 1: And then they also just like start killing people like
Speaker 1: in the in the the Nicaragan refugee camps in Honduras.
Speaker 1: So this is a good time. And back back in
Speaker 1: the US Congress actually does something for once ever and
Speaker 1: it's like Reagan, you can't give money to these guys
Speaker 1: who are burning children alive, which you know fairly sensible.
Speaker 1: Thing is so immediately everyone mob comes for the child burners. Yeah. Look, look,
Speaker 1: if burning and burn burning children is a is a god,
Speaker 1: I can't remember. I can't remember the name of the
Speaker 1: thing that part of American tradition in history, it is
Speaker 1: American culture. Yeah, what were you not supposed to burn
Speaker 1: children to death? Who's since whome? Since when? That's what
Speaker 1: I gotta ask. Our forefathers burned children to death, there
Speaker 1: for death. One of these days will burn children to death.
Speaker 1: If we're lucky, it'll be great. So wow, Sophie noted
Speaker 1: anti American, you are falling down on the job. S
Speaker 1: Goody Pippin. Unfortunately it's a visual gag. But Robert just
Speaker 1: got a towel thrown at him. It was extremely funny. Yeah.
Speaker 1: One of our one of our corporate mandates is that
Speaker 1: someone always has to be in the room with me
Speaker 1: to get angry when I say things that I did
Speaker 1: that with my mind, that was so cool. You're really
Speaker 1: professor Xaviered that one. That's another famous basketball player. Oh
Speaker 1: my god. Okay, Chris. So, as we talked about in
Speaker 1: our episodes with the Moodies, this is the moment that
Speaker 1: Reverend Moon truly becomes the father of Iran Contra by
Speaker 1: personally throwing money and supplies at the Honduran camp to
Speaker 1: like keep them in the fight when the CIA couldn't.
Speaker 1: And this is also where John sig Lab, like currently
Speaker 1: the head of the World Anti Communist League, becomes incredibly important.
Speaker 1: Um he starts doing the series of fundraisers all over
Speaker 1: the world. He like goes to hunts, he's like in
Speaker 1: these contract camps, he's like flying in weapons and supplies
Speaker 1: with the soldier fortune guy, and you know he is
Speaker 1: actually raising somebody from the Contras. But this whole thing
Speaker 1: is really a sharati And this is this is a
Speaker 1: key part of how it Ran Contra works because you
Speaker 1: know you have this figurehead guy who any CIA money
Speaker 1: can just sort of like go through, and and you
Speaker 1: know it looks to all the world like, oh hey,
Speaker 1: this guy is raising money for freedom fighters. And you know,
Speaker 1: as as like kind of silly as this whole thing is,
Speaker 1: this part of the operation is so successful that like
Speaker 1: no one finds out about it until like the Iran
Speaker 1: end of Iran contract falls apart completely and people start
Speaker 1: like following the money trails around, and sync Lab is
Speaker 1: like deeply involved in this enough that like he's like
Speaker 1: his liaison like to the Reagan administration, is he's just
Speaker 1: talking to all over North and and you know duringing
Speaker 1: in later investigation that there's a real attempt to go
Speaker 1: after his organization, the US, the United States Council for
Speaker 1: World Freedom, which again is the US after the World
Speaker 1: to Communstately, they try to go after they don't quite
Speaker 1: get it, but you know it's in the documents, um,
Speaker 1: and you know what what Well, while all of this
Speaker 1: is going on, UM, sig Labs like trying to do
Speaker 1: a rebrand of the league because it turns out that
Speaker 1: having a bunch of people who if you talk to
Speaker 1: him will immediately start screaming about Zionist communism and Jewish conspiracies.
Speaker 1: Is I mean, I guess now it's good for recruiting,
Speaker 1: but like back then it was not great for greeting people.
Speaker 1: And you know the goal of this is to bring
Speaker 1: in more mainstream conservatives. And one of the one of
Speaker 1: these mainstream conservatives is John McCain, who is better known
Speaker 1: for other work like telling a reporter quote, I hate
Speaker 1: the gooks. I will hate them as long as I live. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he said that no one ever talks about it because
Speaker 1: you know, antientation racism wasn't real until two thousand and twenty.
Speaker 1: It was invented by Donald Trump. Uh, it wasn't like
Speaker 1: the previous two people they ran before him were also
Speaker 1: like unbelievably fucking racist and so okay. But like that
Speaker 1: this whole sort of like like campaign to like clean
Speaker 1: the League up. Like you know, it does do one thing,
Speaker 1: which is that sign Lab finally kicks out the c L.
Speaker 1: I think it's like nineteen eighty three. He like finally
Speaker 1: kicks them out. But you know, all the dest squad
Speaker 1: people like somehow keep showing up to their meetings. The
Speaker 1: only people who actually get kicked out of the techos
Speaker 1: because they're just like two openly anti semitic. Um here's
Speaker 1: from inside the League about how like deeply these changes
Speaker 1: actually went. Still there were problems in selling this new
Speaker 1: and improved league, for not very much has changed. John Kosak,
Speaker 1: the Belarusa Nazi collaborator, remains chairman of his delegation. The
Speaker 1: Creation Liberation Movement. The International Eustacea Brotherhood that Anti Pavlovic
Speaker 1: established in Argentina in ninety six was still the official
Speaker 1: Croatian League chapter, as was the Bulgarian National Friends, which
Speaker 1: I had been formed in n seven by the Bulgarian
Speaker 1: Legion Legionnaires who had advocated the extermination of the nation's Jews.
Speaker 1: Mario Salvador a l crone, the grandfather of Central American
Speaker 1: death squads, was in attendance, and although Yaroslav Stetko, the
Speaker 1: Ukrainian premi year who had officiated over the murder of
Speaker 1: approximately seven thousand residents of Levov in one week in
Speaker 1: nineteen one, was too ill to come, his wife Slava
Speaker 1: was there to represent the Ukrainian Nazi collaborators. I was
Speaker 1: really worried for a second when he said he was
Speaker 1: too ill to come, but I'm glad she was able
Speaker 1: to make that. Yeah. Yeah, you know, this new league,
Speaker 1: it's exactly the same as the old leagu except the
Speaker 1: scale of operations increases right, um, alongside running around contra
Speaker 1: like anti communist rebelutions from across the world to start
Speaker 1: showing up in placing orders from weapons. Um, I'm pretty
Speaker 1: sure they give weapons to Charles Taylor, although that one
Speaker 1: was slightly gets Yeah, it's fun. Um. They definitely send
Speaker 1: weapons to a bunch of of of like right wing,
Speaker 1: like incredibly weird guys in Bozambique who they give like
Speaker 1: surface to air missiles, guns and bazookas. Um. And if
Speaker 1: you remember how we talked about how Reverend Moon backed
Speaker 1: pol Pot and how that aid was like mostly propaganda
Speaker 1: but a bit of money. So the same Cambodian soldiers
Speaker 1: allied with pull Pot like come to the League and
Speaker 1: the League just like gives him a bunch of guns
Speaker 1: and weapons. So they're they're they're funding they're funding pull Pot.
Speaker 1: The League is also like constantly raising money from the
Speaker 1: bujer Hitdi in Afghanistan, where sig Lab also winds up
Speaker 1: doing like liaison and for the CIA. And it really
Speaker 1: looks like this whole thing is sort of just accelerating
Speaker 1: into it. By the way, quick note, because this can't
Speaker 1: be referenced enough. Everybody likes to say, oh when we
Speaker 1: armed the Mujia Hittie, and we were just giving weapons
Speaker 1: to the Taliban. No, we were giving weapons to the
Speaker 1: people who molested children on such a grand scale that
Speaker 1: it allowed for the takeover of of Afghanistan by the Taliban.
Speaker 1: Get it right, folks, Yeah, that was the Pakistani's yes, yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: well yeah, so yeah, you know, it looks like like,
Speaker 1: you know, it looks like this whole thing is accelerating
Speaker 1: into like a new, even more bloody phase of the
Speaker 1: Cold War. And you know that this is what the
Speaker 1: the authors of his and also decide the League writing
Speaker 1: this nine, and you know, this is what this what
Speaker 1: they think it's gonna happen. You know, the League's gonna
Speaker 1: play an even more central role in the Cold War.
Speaker 1: And then they won the sovietning withdrew from Afghanistan. The
Speaker 1: collapse the CID At East has felt the Mozambique bat
Speaker 1: In Marxist Leninism. Vietnam, which was already on its way
Speaker 1: to become a capitalist market economy, with drew from Cambodia,
Speaker 1: which is also now a capitalist market economy. The Vietnam's
Speaker 1: Glorious People's Security Forces regularly trained with American police officers,
Speaker 1: from a variety of states, including yeah, and also I yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm about sure they get trauma. The Israelis too, because
Speaker 1: it's yeah, I mean honestly yeah. Um who doesn't am
Speaker 1: I right? Um? So it's it's all good. I do
Speaker 1: want to make one quick note, which is that Mozambique
Speaker 1: is my favorite country in terms of like the word
Speaker 1: for people who come from that country, because I find
Speaker 1: saying Mozambican to be incredibly satisfying. Spelling it's even better.
Speaker 1: I love that word. I don't know why, it just
Speaker 1: feels it. Try it. Try it for yourself. Spell Mozambican.
Speaker 1: I cannot feel good. It's easier to spell Mozambican than
Speaker 1: it is mozambiquecause you know that weird fucking Q in there.
Speaker 1: Check it out. People spell mozambecon improve your day. That's
Speaker 1: not a joke, that's just a real thing. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: the guys who assassinate Yugoslavia ambassadors lived long enough to
Speaker 1: see Yugoslavia fall. The the small guerrilla groups that were
Speaker 1: in Guatemalo, El Salvador, and Honduras all exterminated. The government
Speaker 1: that comes after Pinochet private privatizes even more state owned companies,
Speaker 1: that Pinochet did. Reverend Moon opens a card company in
Speaker 1: North Korea. China is now the world's second largest capitalist
Speaker 1: economy and like even Cuba has special economic zones. So yeah,
Speaker 1: adrift in this sort of new world of their own creation,
Speaker 1: the League changes its name to the World League for
Speaker 1: Freedom and Democracy, but the organization is a rump of
Speaker 1: its former self. But it's still mes in Taiwan, even
Speaker 1: though Taiwan like overthrew the CAMT but you know, it's
Speaker 1: still meets there. But again, like the like you know,
Speaker 1: the even time one were like the the cam T
Speaker 1: s like miilter your kidship felts like while they're still
Speaker 1: a capitalist economy, and that's because we live in their
Speaker 1: world now. We we live in the world where all
Speaker 1: of these people, all of these fucking Nazis, got everything
Speaker 1: that they ever wanted. And it sucks ass and it's
Speaker 1: going to stay that way. It's going to stay that
Speaker 1: way unless m hm al right, Well here's the thing, folks,
Speaker 1: you know how to stop this from happening. Shoot all
Speaker 1: of the Nazis. Would you win the war that hiring
Speaker 1: the Nazis when the same lesson with Confederates, Right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the real the lesson there's there's the lesson from World
Speaker 1: War Two and the lesson from the US Civil War
Speaker 1: is the same, which is, when you beat a bunch
Speaker 1: of racists in a war, kill a lot more of
Speaker 1: them than you think you're gonna need to. You're gonna
Speaker 1: wanna kill as many of them because we're gonna forgive
Speaker 1: and move on. Now, kill a funkload more of them.
Speaker 1: Like everybody sit down right after you when the worst
Speaker 1: sit down? What is this fucking voice you keep doing?
Speaker 1: It's so bizarre. What it's my voice that I do
Speaker 1: when I'm being other people? It's like zombie Mickey Mouse.
Speaker 1: I'm sophied. I don't like Robert's voices. Who la doo
Speaker 1: la do? That's how you sound with another I know
Speaker 1: I did. That's my mom again. What's really key is
Speaker 1: after you say whatever you're saying in the fake voice
Speaker 1: for the person, then you got to say who doola do? Mhm. Anyway, Well,
Speaker 1: this was a great episode, Chris Um. Thank you for
Speaker 1: writing it and for allowing me to have a vacation
Speaker 1: where I went and shot machine guns in the desert.
Speaker 1: Um that was necessary at home, for listening to the
Speaker 1: podcasts that we make and until next time. Remember I
Speaker 1: am the Jesus Christ of podcasting. How's that, Sophie. We're good,
Speaker 1: You're fired. I've really been on one today it's really
Speaker 1: been wild, and today I don't know what's what's going on?
Speaker 1: Vacation Robert having a vacation. I'm on a pretty heavy
Speaker 1: dose to create. I'm going to be honest with you here.
Speaker 1: Um it's good stuff. It's good stuff. Anyways, all I
Speaker 1: ever wanted vacation? Does vacation Robert? No, Yes, vacation Robert
Speaker 1: has the book to plug? What what? What book is
Speaker 1: vacation Robert plugging? That's a great question, Sophie. Scholars debate
Speaker 1: what book I wrote, but a lot of them seem
Speaker 1: to believe that it's called after the Revelue Ocean. And
Speaker 1: then you can find it if you if you google
Speaker 1: a k Press after the revolution, or if you go
Speaker 1: to the thing that I'm looking up by trying to
Speaker 1: find where it is on our subreddit because somebody said
Speaker 1: that I should plug these guys and they were right. Um,
Speaker 1: you can get it everywhere, like all of the places
Speaker 1: that that books are sold. So if you're somewhere in
Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere, you can you can have the
Speaker 1: Jeff Bezos ship get them, or you can look it
Speaker 1: up on buck I'm having to scroll quite a bit,
Speaker 1: you can what a what a massive failure for me. Well,
Speaker 1: while you do that, I'm gonna plug our our good
Speaker 1: friend Props new cold Brew terra Form cold brew dot com.
Speaker 1: Oh hell yeah, definitely checked that ship out. It's gorgeous
Speaker 1: and uh and listen to hood Politics and stream Props
Speaker 1: music and follow prop. This has just turned into like
Speaker 1: a huge prop plug. I think it's bookshop dot org. Yeah,
Speaker 1: go to bookshop dot org. You can find my book there.
Speaker 1: You can probably find PROPS book there. Let me look
Speaker 1: it up. Let me look at Props book on book
Speaker 1: Bookshop dot Also look Terraform on bookshop dot org, which
Speaker 1: connects you to indie bookstores. Boy, there's actually yes, PROPS
Speaker 1: book is on there, along with the book Terraforming Mars
Speaker 1: by some guy I've never heard of terra Form and
Speaker 1: Action by Scott Winkler, which has what looks like an
Speaker 1: Ottoman janissary on the front. Not really sure what's going
Speaker 1: on there anyway, A bunch of weird books, go check
Speaker 1: them out. Behind the Bastards is a production of cool
Speaker 1: Zone Media. For more from cool zone Media, visit our
Speaker 1: website cool zone media dot com, or check us out
Speaker 1: on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.