Speaker 1: Hello the Internet, and welcome to Season two thirty four,
Speaker 1: Episode four of Hi Guys production of My Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: This is a podcast where we take a deep dive
Speaker 1: into American's share consciousness. And it is Thursday, April um,
Speaker 1: which of course means it is national take your Kids
Speaker 1: to Work Day. Um. I don't know what that means
Speaker 1: right now for people. I mean, I guess some people
Speaker 1: are at workplaces, probably not taking their kids to work
Speaker 1: would be my did you ever do that? Did your
Speaker 1: did your parents never take you to their work for work?
Speaker 1: I mean like, yeah, I would just go to like
Speaker 1: the gym because my dad was a basketball coach, So
Speaker 1: I would just like show up and hang out whenever
Speaker 1: I could. But um, okay, shoot some threes. Yeah she
Speaker 1: was some threes. Show the players how I was done. Um,
Speaker 1: but I didn't. It was never like a formal thing.
Speaker 1: Now now I feel like the kids like when it happened,
Speaker 1: because I remember being in school and like people like, yo,
Speaker 1: we're so and so, and they're like, oh, they went
Speaker 1: to like take your kid to work day. They went
Speaker 1: to Nashville, take your kids to work there? Yeah, And
Speaker 1: like my mom didn't go to a office because she
Speaker 1: was like a freelance writer. So she worked at home
Speaker 1: or like would be out and then my dad's like
Speaker 1: a you know, all over the place. I didn't really
Speaker 1: there wasn't a place to go. But anyway, a decorated artist.
Speaker 1: By the way, congratulations to your dad. Oh the focus
Speaker 1: on me, man, focus on bro. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: What is the award your dad just won? Did he
Speaker 1: just went an award? I don't know something all right, Well,
Speaker 1: he must be out here. You know. There's a whole
Speaker 1: other episode about why I'm not keeping up with my
Speaker 1: dad right now. But uh now I'm working with you.
Speaker 1: I know he I know he won an art prize
Speaker 1: to go to Oh yeah, the one at Rome he wanted.
Speaker 1: My dad used to not he he was his art
Speaker 1: crew was so different when I was a kid. He
Speaker 1: was like he gave up on art because he's like, man,
Speaker 1: I gotta put it, like you need to go to school.
Speaker 1: And he's like, I can't just shoot Bobby Brown album
Speaker 1: covers and then like think that's gonna pay the bills
Speaker 1: all the time. And now he's having a renaissance, so yeah,
Speaker 1: shout out to him. Renaissance. Man. Um. Well, my name
Speaker 1: is Jack O'Brien, ak, pretty woman, you're moving to the street,
Speaker 1: pretty woman. I see my help you need, Pretty woman,
Speaker 1: I really do not mind helping you move. I'm sorry
Speaker 1: which floor? Oh no, it's cool, oucha pretty woman. Won't
Speaker 1: you pardon me? Pretty woman? I'm laying down here on
Speaker 1: the street, pretty woman. I swear I'm strong as strong
Speaker 1: can be. Could you please just call my mommy? That
Speaker 1: is courtesy Christie. I'm a Gucci Man based on the
Speaker 1: story I told on yesterday's episode where I tried to
Speaker 1: help somebody move spur the moment. She was just like, hey,
Speaker 1: can you help me with this dresser? And it ended
Speaker 1: with me on the ground on the street with my
Speaker 1: back thrown out, um and not feeling very cool anyway. Anyway,
Speaker 1: shout out to the great Christie. I'm a Gucci Man,
Speaker 1: and I am thrilled to be joined as always by
Speaker 1: my co host, Mr Miles grad. There once was a
Speaker 1: school covered in Ivy, built by money straight from slavery.
Speaker 1: The students were served by slaves at night and learned
Speaker 1: eugenics by day. Soon may reparations come tap that endowment
Speaker 1: fifty bill young their commitments a tiny fraction a hundred
Speaker 1: mills seems low, and that is in response I think
Speaker 1: we're talking about trends. Harvard saying they're gonna spend a
Speaker 1: hundred million dollars to what was it a tone for
Speaker 1: their connection to slavery, but not telling anybody any money. No, no, no, no, Well,
Speaker 1: and like going far enough, we'll see going far enough
Speaker 1: to identify like sixty three black slaves and seven eight
Speaker 1: of American people who were in working in bondage for Harvard.
Speaker 1: And they're like, we're gonna look into that. It's like,
Speaker 1: you know what I spend, why don't you give them
Speaker 1: that fucking money? If you know who they are. It's
Speaker 1: pretty easy right there. Just figure out who descended their boom.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna do a lot of research about what
Speaker 1: we should be paying them. But holy shit, Um, by
Speaker 1: the way, was that a Was that a shanty? Yeah?
Speaker 1: That was a shanty? Oh yeah yeah, shout out Scouty
Speaker 1: Magoo on the discord, who you know, turned up a
Speaker 1: story about Harvard's relaxed racism. The enjoyed the shantiness of
Speaker 1: it all. Well to give it that shanty treatment. We're
Speaker 1: thrilled to be joined by a very funny actor and
Speaker 1: writer who you've seen on Keenan Indebted a Black Lady
Speaker 1: Sketch show, Shrill, the movie Desperados, just all over the
Speaker 1: place killing it. It is the brilliant and talented Nicole
Speaker 1: Thurma Oh, welcome, welcome back. You know, we got a
Speaker 1: lot of you know, so vocalized air horns. That might
Speaker 1: have been the best. Thank you. That's like a weird
Speaker 1: skill that I have. I feel like people always say
Speaker 1: that when I do it, I'm just like, somehow right works.
Speaker 1: A lot of people do that pume same. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you got a good ear. Musicians. I could just listen
Speaker 1: to that for the rest of the episode. That's other
Speaker 1: people would but simple remember hamhorn. Yeah. But then they
Speaker 1: had to change it because like NBC suited him because
Speaker 1: they're like, you can't have that sound bite in it
Speaker 1: when it just go hey am. But now it's all right,
Speaker 1: well that yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What's new with you?
Speaker 1: How have you been. I've been good. I've just been
Speaker 1: kind of chilling. I was working a lot and now
Speaker 1: I'm like unemployed, but in the way that I'm really
Speaker 1: excited about because I get to like I'm gonna travel,
Speaker 1: I'm going to go to New York for a few
Speaker 1: weeks and just chilly, and I've been just kind of
Speaker 1: enjoying life. I've been frantic, you know, just staring into
Speaker 1: the abyss of the news every day and working to
Speaker 1: not let it affect us. So yeah, my god, I
Speaker 1: feel like I've been a little bit less in touch
Speaker 1: with social media lately, and that's helped me a lot.
Speaker 1: Especially Twitter. Twitter is just why I'm always like, wait,
Speaker 1: what is happening? Okay, you know what, let me just
Speaker 1: close my computer, And like, you guys don't have that
Speaker 1: choice because you have to talk about it every day.
Speaker 1: But it's like sometimes I'm like, yeah, let's just close this,
Speaker 1: throw it over, you know, over me, burn it whatever,
Speaker 1: just get it away from me. It's too much dunk
Speaker 1: my head in a bathtub for five hours. And yeah, pretend, well, uh,
Speaker 1: we're going to get to know you a little bit
Speaker 1: better in a moment. First, we're gonna tell our listen
Speaker 1: to a couple of things we're talking about today. Uh,
Speaker 1: and you know, up top, we're going to talk about something.
Speaker 1: You might want to tune back into Twitter because it's
Speaker 1: about to get really good. Because Elon Musk is buying
Speaker 1: Twitter and so we're just gonna talk about some of
Speaker 1: the responses to that. Um, we're gonna talk about We're
Speaker 1: gonna talk about Russia. They're like, they just don't give
Speaker 1: a funk. I think I think Russia was ahead of
Speaker 1: ahead of the game, and kind of showed us how
Speaker 1: little effort you had to put into lying on the internet. Um,
Speaker 1: they did a neo Nazi raid on, like some people
Speaker 1: who were critical of Putin, where they like the frame
Speaker 1: up is just lazy. It's it's not it's not altogether convincing.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna talk about that. Uh, we're gonna talk
Speaker 1: about a astronomer going looking for alien technology in the
Speaker 1: South Pacific, which is exciting to me. Uh. And then
Speaker 1: I want to talk about NPRS weird, weird tone. Uh
Speaker 1: just generally, Uh, nothing new about it. It's been it's
Speaker 1: been the same. I just I think I I stopped
Speaker 1: listening for a long time and then it'll like just
Speaker 1: popped on my car radio and I was like, what
Speaker 1: the fuck is this? Um, So we'll talk about plenty more,
Speaker 1: but first, Nicole, we like to ask our guest, what
Speaker 1: is something from your search history? Listening for my search history,
Speaker 1: it's always funny when you guys asked me this, Because
Speaker 1: I am so crazy, I google everything, and so I
Speaker 1: always have to be like, okay, listen, Nicole, you can't
Speaker 1: go on a day to really sad. Guys can't be
Speaker 1: telling them okay. But one thing I did google is
Speaker 1: I've been thinking a lot about people pleasers and how
Speaker 1: because I'm not, I don't think I'm much of a
Speaker 1: people pleaser. I think I kind of like go like
Speaker 1: straddle the line of like I'm going to please you,
Speaker 1: but until it's until I want to just say no
Speaker 1: because I've gotten better at saying no. But I think
Speaker 1: that people pleasers are fascinating because to me sometimes it
Speaker 1: almost feels like they they're lying to themselves and to
Speaker 1: everyone they know, and I try I'm like, so I
Speaker 1: was just like googling, like is there a correlation or like,
Speaker 1: what's the deal with people pleasers? Are they always kind
Speaker 1: of lying? So that's what I was googling. Wow, was
Speaker 1: that just look inward or you're experienced with someone who's
Speaker 1: a people pleaser? Because I see it a lot in
Speaker 1: the dating context to like, you start dating people, they
Speaker 1: tell you everything you need to hear and then like oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was just kind of saying stuff that whole time,
Speaker 1: And you know, I may be wrong, but maybe it's
Speaker 1: because I date men. I feel like men do it
Speaker 1: more often than women because they want to be easy,
Speaker 1: but then they end up kind of like pushing everything
Speaker 1: down and not really saying it makes them happy until
Speaker 1: they like explode. I feel like I just see that
Speaker 1: more with men and you're like wait, And I think
Speaker 1: that women don't even notice it until it's too late.
Speaker 1: But I've tried to get better at like paying attention
Speaker 1: to that and being like, yo, what do you really want?
Speaker 1: Like what is your real opinion on this? With friends
Speaker 1: and with everybody, because I think that it's like it
Speaker 1: sucks to think that you'd be having a friendship or
Speaker 1: a relationship with somebody and you're not. You're you're pissing
Speaker 1: them off, but you don't know it because they're just
Speaker 1: everything you say. I think, like the extreme people please
Speaker 1: are certainly like yeah. My era of going all in
Speaker 1: on just saying everything that people wanted to hear was
Speaker 1: that I was unable to actually express any of my
Speaker 1: inner experience out loud, so rather than to be in
Speaker 1: a situation where like I was like oh, I don't
Speaker 1: know how I feel about this. I'm like, yeah, that's cool. Cool, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would love that too, because that felt like a
Speaker 1: way to be like, oh, this person, I'm presenting myself
Speaker 1: as an easy going person. Meanwhile, I don't know how
Speaker 1: to say half the shout I need to. And then
Speaker 1: you're six months or a couple months deep into something
Speaker 1: You're like, yeah, actually, like I've been stifling, like I
Speaker 1: hate Harry Potter. I'm also have terrible commitment issues, and
Speaker 1: I've just been saying it because I didn't want to
Speaker 1: make it hot. I don't even like Sam and you
Speaker 1: make famine because I told you I like that. I
Speaker 1: don't even like it's like yeah, it's like stuff like that,
Speaker 1: and they're like, all of a sudden, they're exploding because
Speaker 1: I don't want to watch another Harry Potter. And you're
Speaker 1: like whoa, whoa, what's that? Like what you said, You're
Speaker 1: all about her mind? Like what's going on? You know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like it really does feel like that,
Speaker 1: and I feel like it is because people don't. I
Speaker 1: just feel like there's such a culture of politeness just
Speaker 1: in general with like America. I don't know if it's
Speaker 1: an American thing or just people in general. But they
Speaker 1: feel like it's the better way to be. But honestly,
Speaker 1: like I would rather have someone telling me, like, I
Speaker 1: don't like that thing you did, I don't like that
Speaker 1: shirt you're wearing. What you're saying, you know, likes, because
Speaker 1: we're wasting time by lying about what we do like like,
Speaker 1: or what we do and don't want to do right.
Speaker 1: And I have, like, you know, I have single friends
Speaker 1: who are, you know, in their mid thirties, and they're
Speaker 1: like dudes who are like, I don't know, like you know,
Speaker 1: I just didn't work out this or that, And half
Speaker 1: the time I'm hearing them talk, I'm like, you're not
Speaker 1: really coming with your whole self in any of these situations.
Speaker 1: So the person you're interacting with isn't quite learning who
Speaker 1: you are. They're they're learning a projection of who you are.
Speaker 1: And then when the rubber has to meet the meat
Speaker 1: hit the road, y'all are skinning because there wasn't any
Speaker 1: real grip to it because you were you know, I
Speaker 1: just I don't understand your needs because you're not expressing
Speaker 1: your needs accurately. It's the same thing that I've been
Speaker 1: also thinking about a lot lately just in general, like
Speaker 1: we don't know how to deal with Greek. We don't
Speaker 1: grow up learning how to deal with grief, how to
Speaker 1: deal with relationships, how to really communicate with people so
Speaker 1: that we get our needs met. Stuff like that sounds
Speaker 1: of therapy, Like, but this is like the ship I
Speaker 1: think about like lately because it's just like why don't
Speaker 1: we learn that ship? Why do we learn, you know,
Speaker 1: the Pythagorean theorem in in school, you know what, We
Speaker 1: don't need to know that sh So it's it's fascinating
Speaker 1: to me, and I'm trying to just I'm trying to
Speaker 1: learn how to interact with different types of people better
Speaker 1: so that so that I can I can help you know,
Speaker 1: them feel more comfortable or something. Yeah, yeah, so that's
Speaker 1: what that's my wormhole as of late has mostly been
Speaker 1: like interpersonal ship. Yeah, the therapy like you kind of
Speaker 1: need to sound like therapy because like I think people
Speaker 1: who suffer from this, And I'm speaking completely as an
Speaker 1: outsider because I don't at all like I would never,
Speaker 1: for instance, agree to do something harmful to my body
Speaker 1: because somebody seemed nice and needed my help, such as
Speaker 1: like carry a giant chest up for flights of stairs
Speaker 1: because I thought somebody would like me more. Um, but
Speaker 1: like I don't to, Like I'm realizing I don't even
Speaker 1: know how I feel most of the time, like in therapy,
Speaker 1: like and so like that's that's how buried that ship is.
Speaker 1: And then like so that that's a process too, like
Speaker 1: and yeah, just being like that's not true. They might
Speaker 1: not even realize it's not true, they being other people
Speaker 1: and not me, because again, I am emotionally in touch
Speaker 1: with myself at all times. I'm good at communicating it
Speaker 1: very advanced, man, I mean these are such they're so ingrained,
Speaker 1: like you know, just culturally through you know, patriarchy whatever
Speaker 1: about where like we start off as kids seeking the
Speaker 1: approval of adults. That's just that's our bread and butter
Speaker 1: as children. Oh look at you, you did that. Well,
Speaker 1: you're so cute. Oh you're so smart, And then that
Speaker 1: becomes your currency. And if you don't realize that ship,
Speaker 1: you get stuck in this loop of just chasing smiles
Speaker 1: and positive responses at the fucking total detriment to yourself
Speaker 1: and other self to you, like you're like to like
Speaker 1: your gut, Like I'm sure that people that are doing
Speaker 1: that just like have this like pit in their stomach
Speaker 1: sometimes because it's just like they're not getting what they want,
Speaker 1: they're not saying anything, or you don't realize that, or
Speaker 1: you don't realize you've been doing it so long that
Speaker 1: there is a pit because you've been doing that, you're like, no,
Speaker 1: people like me, but it's like, but I don't know
Speaker 1: if mine needs have been met ever at all. Ye know,
Speaker 1: but I don't feel happy, but I don't know it
Speaker 1: seems happy around me. What's going on? Yeah, And I
Speaker 1: think it's the same with even like little things like
Speaker 1: making plans, Like if someone doesn't want to do something,
Speaker 1: they'll maybe say like, oh sure, and it's like, well,
Speaker 1: I don't say sure, you say yes or no you
Speaker 1: don't want to do it? Saying no, that's totally fine,
Speaker 1: Like we can totally adjust. And it's like you just
Speaker 1: start to realize that. Like I don't know, I've been
Speaker 1: calling people out on that ship more because I'm just like, yo,
Speaker 1: I don't want to I don't want to drag you
Speaker 1: to something you don't want to do, but I don't
Speaker 1: want to make you feel uncomfortable. You know. It's amazing
Speaker 1: how much I admire people who are just like, nah,
Speaker 1: I don't really want to do that fun kind of
Speaker 1: dark magic is that I'm telling you. You know, the
Speaker 1: first time I did it was when I lived in
Speaker 1: New York. People used to come people come visit New
Speaker 1: York all the time, and they all want to hang out.
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter who they are. It can be somebody
Speaker 1: who haven't talked to you since you're like where calling me.
Speaker 1: And the first time I did is that this guy
Speaker 1: was like, I'm going to be in town for a week.
Speaker 1: We hadn't talked since like oh six, and I was
Speaker 1: just finally because I was like, you know what, Instead
Speaker 1: of telling him every single day all sorry, I kind
Speaker 1: of I'm taking a nap, I can't hang out or whatever.
Speaker 1: Instead of every single day trying to think of an excuse,
Speaker 1: I literally just said, you know what, I have a
Speaker 1: great trip. Now is not a great time to see
Speaker 1: each other. Um, you know, I hope you have a
Speaker 1: fabulous time in New York and it and he seemed
Speaker 1: a little salty about it, but he got the point
Speaker 1: and I didn't have to wear myself out trying to
Speaker 1: say no fifty times. You know, And I do think
Speaker 1: your point that like, Uh, men are particularly guilty of this.
Speaker 1: Like I I just watched the The Batman last night,
Speaker 1: and like, this dude has his feeling so buried and
Speaker 1: like say, he's so out of touch with them. Uh,
Speaker 1: And like I was thinking back to The Joker where
Speaker 1: he's just like laughing with like tears streaming down his face,
Speaker 1: like just doesn't know how the funk he feels at all, um,
Speaker 1: and everyone was like, yes, I am the Joker. That
Speaker 1: is totally me. I feel like that's not good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm that I'm not right. If you see yourself reflected
Speaker 1: in the joke or something is wrong, and maybe just
Speaker 1: go talk to somebody, you know, yeah I could help. Yeah.
Speaker 1: What is something you think is overrated? Uh? Oh, this
Speaker 1: is an interesting one. I just thought of, um sharing
Speaker 1: music with friends like this is surprising to me, but
Speaker 1: I was just thinking about this recently. I feel like
Speaker 1: if you connect on one level, like you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: you really like this artist. I really like this artist,
Speaker 1: but then you start to like be like, oh if
Speaker 1: you like this and you might like this people, people
Speaker 1: don't be getting it right, and so I just like
Speaker 1: I think it's a little bit overrated. I like I
Speaker 1: think it's nice when people send you like a little mixtape,
Speaker 1: like I care about you hear some music, but I
Speaker 1: rarely like the music that people think I'm gonna like
Speaker 1: and I appreciate it, but I don't. I don't think
Speaker 1: it really does anything. Yeah, I think sometimes it depends
Speaker 1: on how much you're like, really you've really funk with music,
Speaker 1: because you can, you can have a really diverse taste,
Speaker 1: but if you're not able to say like, Okay, I
Speaker 1: have a feeling that they're responding to these very specific
Speaker 1: musical elements of this track, because I think most people
Speaker 1: like I like that band. I also like this band
Speaker 1: that miss means you were on a ven diagram. Yeah,
Speaker 1: mus like this band too. Rather than like being like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know what, like the best music like suggestions I
Speaker 1: get are from people who like are like really kind
Speaker 1: of get the nuanced of like nuances of the art
Speaker 1: of it, and they're like, Okay, you'll like this because
Speaker 1: it has like a good strong backbeat and like thumping
Speaker 1: bass and like falsettos or whatever. I'm like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: different genre, but you identified that. So Miles is basically
Speaker 1: saying that may be true of other people, but when
Speaker 1: you when you're talking about me, because you know, some
Speaker 1: people don't be have in the ears, some people can't
Speaker 1: do the because they don't have that miless I do.
Speaker 1: I mean because it's like when you when you really
Speaker 1: understand me, that you listen to it, you'll notice like
Speaker 1: it's like I used to feel like people. I don't
Speaker 1: know if this is exactly a one to one, but
Speaker 1: like people used to be like, oh, you like the
Speaker 1: Knife and you'll like the x X, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't like the x X and there and people
Speaker 1: have recommended them to me so many times, just from
Speaker 1: other bands that don't even sound like them. And yeah,
Speaker 1: it's one of those things where I'm like, no, they
Speaker 1: might have been from the same time period, but the
Speaker 1: music is actually so different that it's like, that's not
Speaker 1: something that I would we're not hearing that the same way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that I agree with you. It has to be
Speaker 1: like the specifics of the music that make it something
Speaker 1: that you like, like a tone or the you know,
Speaker 1: the the arrangement of it, or the background vocals or
Speaker 1: the you know, even like the major versus minor key
Speaker 1: I don't know, like little stupid thing. And this is
Speaker 1: making me sound like an asshole, and I totally am
Speaker 1: hearing myself talk right now, but I think you're right.
Speaker 1: When I was a band geek, you know, I grew
Speaker 1: up studying a lot of music theory, so you know,
Speaker 1: and there's everyone, look you, everyone's gonna engage with the
Speaker 1: art form however they want to. But I think I'm
Speaker 1: just I get really specific and I and I think
Speaker 1: it it made this thing, especially when before the Internet,
Speaker 1: discovering music was really difficult, so I had to really
Speaker 1: know how to be able to describe what I wanted
Speaker 1: to hear or know what I wanted to hear, so
Speaker 1: then when I heard it, I could be like, yes,
Speaker 1: more of this, more of this, more of this, And
Speaker 1: the Internet only just made it super easy once you know,
Speaker 1: every like it. You know, you could access anything from
Speaker 1: any time, any place. But definitely whatever. But I take
Speaker 1: everyone's music suggestion. It's always worth It's always interesting to
Speaker 1: hear when someone thinks you'll like to and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: that's interesting, Like oh that it is really interesting, because yeah,
Speaker 1: but I don't mind getting them. But I'm always like,
Speaker 1: it's not really doing it for me. But it's the
Speaker 1: same thing as like it is. It's to me, like
Speaker 1: a lot of people hate it, but I kind of
Speaker 1: like when somebody says, like, you look like this person,
Speaker 1: and it's interesting to me because then I'm like, oh, wow,
Speaker 1: so that's what I look like in your eyes, Like
Speaker 1: that's what I don't anything like that, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I feel like that I should just want to hear
Speaker 1: anytime somebody has looked like for me, I should want
Speaker 1: to hear about it. Because I also feel like lookalikes
Speaker 1: are like people who are like, you look like this person.
Speaker 1: Like that determines what people think about you for like
Speaker 1: the first hour that you know them so much. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're like judging you based on some weird character. What
Speaker 1: is uh? What's something you take is under radar? What
Speaker 1: did I say it is under You know this is
Speaker 1: gonna be so random. But a couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 1: I went on a cruise. Yeah, cruises are funky. We've
Speaker 1: talked about the merits of cruises in the past couple
Speaker 1: of weeks for some really Yeah, it's funny too because
Speaker 1: I just saw a girl on TikTok who was doing
Speaker 1: like a bunch of videos from a cruise ship and
Speaker 1: she's she was on a cruise by herself, and I
Speaker 1: was like, I mean cruising, I don't know. I went
Speaker 1: on a four day cruise out of l A. I
Speaker 1: live in l A. So I just you know, it
Speaker 1: wasn't that hard to get there, and it was like
Speaker 1: so much fun. So it's just like an opportunity to
Speaker 1: embrace the corny, ist, cheesiest, dumbest things, but to not
Speaker 1: nobody on the boat gives a funk, And that's the
Speaker 1: best part of it to me. It's just like they're
Speaker 1: wearing that the ugly tight eyed t shirts with the
Speaker 1: city name on it that they just visited, Like they're
Speaker 1: buying all the tree kids and crab and like they're
Speaker 1: waiting in line for sales at these weird silver stores
Speaker 1: or whatever. It's just anything about it. I mean, I
Speaker 1: do feel like the cruises that make the news is
Speaker 1: over the past, like decades have all been disasters, I
Speaker 1: mean and going back centuries with the Titanic, Like we
Speaker 1: don't hear the positive stories about people just being like, man,
Speaker 1: I really funk with cruises, uh, And like I've just
Speaker 1: through having kids who are obsessed with the ocean and
Speaker 1: boats and stuff, like just seeing cruise ships through their
Speaker 1: eyes for the first time, I'm like, wow, those are
Speaker 1: that's wild that that exists, like even at all, And
Speaker 1: like so I'm probably headed down a path towards the
Speaker 1: cruise at some point in my life and coming a
Speaker 1: cruise person. That's the thing too. I think it's a
Speaker 1: whole culture. But yeah, it's like how yeah, how does
Speaker 1: it exist? There's this huge insane boat with like a
Speaker 1: water slide on it, Like what are you doing? Somehow
Speaker 1: it works? And like the place I stayed in, we
Speaker 1: stayed in a room that had a balcony and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, this is the life. So you just
Speaker 1: sit out there and watch the ocean go by, And yeah,
Speaker 1: it was I don't It's like I genuinely couldn't tell
Speaker 1: if I was just very burnt out from work. I
Speaker 1: just really needed a vacation. But I really do think
Speaker 1: that cruises. I think people more people should take cruises,
Speaker 1: especially if you live in a city where there's a port,
Speaker 1: just go for a four day cruise. Like it's still
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I'm I'm constantly at odds with like
Speaker 1: the how like not good cruises are like ethically and
Speaker 1: from a pollution standpoint, but I also have to battle
Speaker 1: the inner old black man within me who wants to
Speaker 1: be on a cruise ship all the time. My grant like,
Speaker 1: and I said this in the past episode, my grandparents
Speaker 1: loved cruises, And I was just like, I get it.
Speaker 1: You don't you pay one thing and then you could
Speaker 1: eat whenever, whenever, whatever exactly you paid. I paid three
Speaker 1: d fifty dollars. I have four days of food and
Speaker 1: drink NonStop and sunshine and pool. Oh it was. It was.
Speaker 1: It was and the and the and the worst shows
Speaker 1: I've ever seen in my life, but in the best way.
Speaker 1: I mean, come on, they're literally playing like unwritten by
Speaker 1: Natalie Natasha Benningfield before the show starts, and it's like
Speaker 1: everything about it was that energy the whole show. Oh
Speaker 1: Q described the show like, what was it? I'll tell
Speaker 1: you one show I went to it. I was dying.
Speaker 1: I was dying. There was a show called eighty eight Keys,
Speaker 1: and so I was like, oh, okay, so it's probably
Speaker 1: like dueling pianos. There's something kind of like piano skills. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we went to the show. Uh, there was a man
Speaker 1: playing the piano, but like maybe ten minutes into the show,
Speaker 1: I realized he was not really playing the piano, Oh
Speaker 1: pantomime the piano, and it was just playing over a track.
Speaker 1: At one point, this dude and they were playing it
Speaker 1: as it was real, like they were acting like this
Speaker 1: man was really playing the piano, but I was sitting
Speaker 1: on a balcony. I was like, that dude is not playing.
Speaker 1: And so then at one point he genuinely he just
Speaker 1: stood up while the piano was still playing and walks away,
Speaker 1: and like it wasn't a joke, it wasn't like they
Speaker 1: made it a bit. It was just like they just don't.
Speaker 1: They just gave up the conceit at one point like
Speaker 1: he's not playing, you know whatever, who cares? And it
Speaker 1: just it killed me. They were like singing like a
Speaker 1: bunch of pop songs, and you know, they were very
Speaker 1: cute and they were they were having the time of
Speaker 1: their lives. Also they're doing the cheesiest shows ever, but
Speaker 1: they don't care. And that's what's so great about it,
Speaker 1: you know, like everybody's just like leaning into it. Eight
Speaker 1: eight keys was really something else. I mean, I was
Speaker 1: like screaming. I was like, we were like looking down
Speaker 1: at his hands and he's just going like this, like
Speaker 1: really and he's not even touching the key. He was
Speaker 1: really good at first, so I never would have known.
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, I was like, wait
Speaker 1: a second, Yeah, he started doing the just like slamming
Speaker 1: hands down on right, right, right, fake keyboard, and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, he's not even playing the piano.
Speaker 1: I love I love a fun nest fake instrument playing.
Speaker 1: I love it. It was. It was really fun. All right,
Speaker 1: let's take a quick break and we'll be right back.
Speaker 1: And we're back and uh, yeah, let's talk. You know,
Speaker 1: I think the consensus among the people I fall on
Speaker 1: Twitter is that we're fucked now the Delon Musk has
Speaker 1: purchased successfully purchased Twitter. Um, and what what what are
Speaker 1: we hearing from? I mean I think we kind of are,
Speaker 1: but like, what how are other people reacting with? Uh?
Speaker 1: There's I mean, there's all kinds of I think everyone, yeah,
Speaker 1: rightly is focused on this guy who's keeps talking about
Speaker 1: freedom of speech, who clearly doesn't know what the funk
Speaker 1: that means, has bought the bird app and what does
Speaker 1: that mean? Um, there's a few different things. There's this
Speaker 1: one piece by this like sort of like tech critic
Speaker 1: Shiva Vadia. Nothing in Slate, who's just talking about like
Speaker 1: who sort of brings up an interesting point of like
Speaker 1: Twitter as a business is not a good opportunity, Like
Speaker 1: that's not something you want to buy as a as
Speaker 1: an investment in general. Um. And you know, look, just
Speaker 1: talking about how has a business it has been like
Speaker 1: just pretty much they've they haven't figured out how to
Speaker 1: make it profitable or to scale it. You know, the
Speaker 1: many wonderful world's words of Wall Street, and they put
Speaker 1: it up for sale a few times, and people haven't
Speaker 1: really ever bought it. And I think that just when
Speaker 1: obviously there is this whole element of yes, Ellen could
Speaker 1: bring all the unsavory ship bags back and open up
Speaker 1: the gates. Um. But there's just just narrowly, there is
Speaker 1: one potential benefit to that, which is all of that
Speaker 1: conservative tech money that was spent on those free speech
Speaker 1: platforms like truth and Ship would become a fucking would
Speaker 1: become moot the second he opened up the gates, because
Speaker 1: that's what the whole reason people all the people like
Speaker 1: that fled to those other sites or like there's no
Speaker 1: lives here. So if they're allowed back on Twitter, they're like,
Speaker 1: why am I using this ship again? Um? So that
Speaker 1: would potentially that that that is a one fear on
Speaker 1: like the conservative tech side, which is like man if
Speaker 1: Trump comes act and this, that's going to be bad
Speaker 1: news for these smaller apps. But that's not even like
Speaker 1: the big picture is there is there are are any
Speaker 1: of those flourishing and like really a threat to I mean,
Speaker 1: you know you hear about horrible things being said on them,
Speaker 1: but I don't. I don't know, like is there no
Speaker 1: not in this sense, like you know, especially we've talked
Speaker 1: about truth social like that this thing is dead in
Speaker 1: the water. Um and even til they're still waiting to
Speaker 1: be let in the door, many people you're not getting
Speaker 1: in that club. Um. But again like sort of put
Speaker 1: just looking at Twitter though, just as like a business entity,
Speaker 1: you know what exactly is Elon must trying to do it?
Speaker 1: Does he actually wanted to help to grow it or
Speaker 1: does he want it to be profitable? Because what was
Speaker 1: the purpose of buying it? Like, well, I think on
Speaker 1: one side it's like, yeah, I guess you literally own
Speaker 1: the libs by buying Twitter or something. But what you
Speaker 1: know as a business person, because you're always talking about
Speaker 1: your business acumen, like what is the goal here? Now?
Speaker 1: I get that. One version is he just doesn't give
Speaker 1: a funk he wants He'll let it melt down into
Speaker 1: a total cess pit of like hate, you know, hate speech. Um.
Speaker 1: But on the other side of that is like is
Speaker 1: it growth? Is it profitability? Because the things that he
Speaker 1: has talked about aren't necessarily going to reshape the app
Speaker 1: or bring more people in. Like yeah, the edit button. Sure,
Speaker 1: people are like, oh that would be cool. That's like
Speaker 1: a bone free one for like the people who are
Speaker 1: on Twitter. But that's going to take a lot of
Speaker 1: time and effort to actually bring that to you know,
Speaker 1: bring that to a reality. The human authentication thing to
Speaker 1: keep bots off. Sure, but many points to the fact
Speaker 1: that you know, you could just invest more in proper
Speaker 1: content and user moderate ration and you know, keep things
Speaker 1: moving in that sense. But I think the other thing
Speaker 1: is that he's if he's you know, by buying it
Speaker 1: and takes a private he's not beholden to shareholders at all.
Speaker 1: So like a lot of people are trying to speculate
Speaker 1: what how do you game this out? Like is it
Speaker 1: going to be just a downward spiral? Is it going
Speaker 1: to be you open it up, you bring all these
Speaker 1: angry people away are angry people back on the platform,
Speaker 1: which would drive away other users, which isn't going to
Speaker 1: help anything for like the value of Twitter. So I
Speaker 1: think really we can, like even even in the worst
Speaker 1: case where you know, Trump's back and all these other
Speaker 1: things are happening, those would be like those wouldn't necessarily
Speaker 1: benefit Twitter in the end, I think, because they're also
Speaker 1: not really innovating as a platform. You know, Twitter is
Speaker 1: not even the top ten social media platforms. There's there,
Speaker 1: you know, there's the fully the potential for something else
Speaker 1: to come up that people like, oh, this seems more
Speaker 1: reasonable now than this other thing. So it's a bit
Speaker 1: of like a wait and see thing. And then on
Speaker 1: the on the DC side of it, you have a
Speaker 1: Republicans say it would be bad if if Trump got
Speaker 1: back on or like, oh I don't know if if
Speaker 1: we need Trump back on or that could be bad.
Speaker 1: But again I think that there's a twofold problem there.
Speaker 1: One is that they don't want Trump back because it
Speaker 1: would complete he would revitalize his like stranglehold on the
Speaker 1: party by him being back on Twitter it or he
Speaker 1: would take over the political conversation again. Um. And then
Speaker 1: the also thing is that they they fear that if
Speaker 1: he's back on that helps Democrats do their really tired
Speaker 1: as political strategy, which is just gesture to Trump and
Speaker 1: then be like, so y'all vote in blue, right and
Speaker 1: right not do it ends there? Yeah, because without Trump
Speaker 1: they've done so much so um well, I think they're
Speaker 1: I think they realized they can't get bullied in real
Speaker 1: time from Twitter like he used to like as things
Speaker 1: are happening, I think it's more for them. They liked
Speaker 1: that they didn't have to fear the Trump tweet anymore. Yeah,
Speaker 1: time interested to deceive what I'm saying, a couple of
Speaker 1: things like how many people left the platform? I know
Speaker 1: every everybody was losing followers. I lost I think two
Speaker 1: fifty followers, and I think people are just running from
Speaker 1: it but they don't know what's going to happen. And
Speaker 1: then I'm also I feel like it's like this weird
Speaker 1: thing where if Trump I feel like people are always
Speaker 1: weird about trumping on Twitter, where it's almost like they
Speaker 1: they're like, oh man, that would be so terrible. At
Speaker 1: that big bad guy that I used to quote retweet
Speaker 1: came back, you know what I mean, Like, and I
Speaker 1: kept going viral because I was talking it on Trump.
Speaker 1: But I feel like there's a little bit of that
Speaker 1: energy too, like they don't nobody wants it, especially before
Speaker 1: nobody fucking wants Trump online talking and ship. But I
Speaker 1: think that there's this weird energy that was there when
Speaker 1: Trump was president and when he was on Twitter of
Speaker 1: like it's kind of it's kind of exciting and spicy
Speaker 1: and like, let's just play with this toxic ship. But
Speaker 1: it's like that's not good because all it ever did
Speaker 1: was elevate the trash to a higher level. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I mean, I think the real, the real losses would
Speaker 1: be to like people who organize on Twitter and actually
Speaker 1: use it for like positive things. But I think, like anything,
Speaker 1: an alternative could emerge that is easy, that that could
Speaker 1: be as easy to use. But you know, I think
Speaker 1: you know, again, you read the headlines, you think this
Speaker 1: could be. This is scary, and yeah, it could be.
Speaker 1: But it's gonna take some time to fully understand what
Speaker 1: his vision is for this and how that works because
Speaker 1: he's also he's going to find himself running Twitter in
Speaker 1: the lead up to a presidential election, and Elon Musk
Speaker 1: is in just inherent like all it's gonna take her
Speaker 1: some more spicy Marjorie Taylor Green type people to pop up,
Speaker 1: and then what does he do with them? And now
Speaker 1: people are going to connect him to all that, whether
Speaker 1: or not he wants to platform them or d platform them.
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of extra ship connected to it
Speaker 1: that like doesn't necessarily make Elon Musk just look like
Speaker 1: the coolest kid on Twitter. So that's why I'm like,
Speaker 1: definitely not. I mean, think about how much people bully Jack.
Speaker 1: They were like Jack, what are you doing? It's like
Speaker 1: that same thing is, like you really want to be
Speaker 1: that guy that's constantly like having to decide if you're
Speaker 1: gonna pull people or let them be on and how
Speaker 1: far you're gonna let people go before they just like
Speaker 1: even if he's not the one making the final decision,
Speaker 1: he's he becomes the de factors. The face. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't think he gives he And I also I think
Speaker 1: he's a combination of like, you know, realizing that all
Speaker 1: good publicity in america's like at least increases your footprint, um,
Speaker 1: and also famous enough that like he's surrounded by people
Speaker 1: who are gassing him up all the time. So I
Speaker 1: just think he's very dangerous. Probably part of a strategy
Speaker 1: is to control like discourse in some way the way
Speaker 1: that like you know, billionaires during the barren era, like
Speaker 1: we would do that. Ship. Um, yeah, I think I
Speaker 1: think the concerns are founded. I still feel like you
Speaker 1: can still use Twitter right to like coordinator to organize,
Speaker 1: Like I don't. I don't feel like it like what
Speaker 1: it should be as a public utility, and like we're
Speaker 1: moving away from that obviously, and that's fucked up. But
Speaker 1: like that, like he I feel like it's not great
Speaker 1: for our side or for people who are trying to
Speaker 1: do good in the world. If like a billionaire buys
Speaker 1: all phone networks across the America and they're like, well,
Speaker 1: I just don't use the phone anymore, and it's like, well,
Speaker 1: we're putting ourselves at a disadvantage, like we just need
Speaker 1: to you know, keep well. Yeah, And I think for
Speaker 1: the people who need that, who are resilient, this isn't
Speaker 1: gonna do much because they see the utility of it
Speaker 1: and you can just block the funk out everybody, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. Um, And maybe that's how people
Speaker 1: will get on with it and it will continue to
Speaker 1: you know, do its thing in the Musk era. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's just it's it's it's going to be very very
Speaker 1: interesting because there's so many. There's so many because like
Speaker 1: you're saying, because Twitter has become sort of like the
Speaker 1: this utility in a way, but it's still not even
Speaker 1: the top ten user basis of like social media. Plantner
Speaker 1: has this very interesting place, uh and seeing what he
Speaker 1: does really good or bad TVD, but again a billionaire
Speaker 1: buying it never good, never again. Can you guys explain
Speaker 1: the edit button to me like that? I don't fully
Speaker 1: understand the because like my my understanding is that the
Speaker 1: reason you use that a button is if you have
Speaker 1: a tweet up a lot of people like it, and
Speaker 1: then you realize like you want to change something about it,
Speaker 1: and then you edit the tweet like their likes are
Speaker 1: ascribed to like something that isn't accurate, right, Like that's
Speaker 1: that feels weird, Like what like you can't you can
Speaker 1: edit what you said, just delete the previous thing and
Speaker 1: then rere pushed your Tweet's like that thing, oh I misspelled,
Speaker 1: I misspelled said in my viral tweet. It makes me
Speaker 1: crazy though, So I'm all about the edit button for
Speaker 1: that exactly It's like a small reason because I had
Speaker 1: a tweet go viral where I said like, choke uh,
Speaker 1: but I didn't mean to say the US, so it
Speaker 1: sounds like I'm saying like choke out like Italian choke
Speaker 1: when I choke up, and I was like god damn.
Speaker 1: I kept just like watching it and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I want to take it out, so I would like
Speaker 1: to edit that, but it is fun. Have you ever
Speaker 1: There's a TikTok that I saw where it was like,
Speaker 1: keep talking about TikTok but you know what, sometimes I
Speaker 1: get portant with TikTok Um. There's a TikTok though that
Speaker 1: I saw where somebody was like texting their friend and
Speaker 1: they asked a question they said like are you white?
Speaker 1: And as the person was responding the person the other
Speaker 1: person said, if you are, then you like you say
Speaker 1: that you hate black people and love slavery, and then
Speaker 1: the person said yes, and then you know, they responded
Speaker 1: immediately like it's just that it is that thing of
Speaker 1: like where you can change what you've said, and then
Speaker 1: the person who liked it is seemingly vouching for like
Speaker 1: some crazy shit, right, So yeah, I could get out
Speaker 1: of control. But I don't know if people are. I
Speaker 1: don't know. We could. We have to see, I guess.
Speaker 1: But for me, it's just I want to take a
Speaker 1: little extra letter out of a tweet, right yeah, yeah exactly,
Speaker 1: not wholesale, be like yeah, yeah, I get somebody to
Speaker 1: like something the like you know, rope a doom into
Speaker 1: being like okay, so you okay? So is he is
Speaker 1: he like team edit button is yeah, yeah, he wants
Speaker 1: an edit button because campaigning on that. That's that's the
Speaker 1: saddest part of his like, because he's just like, I
Speaker 1: just feel if I just got the tweet just right,
Speaker 1: people would like me. It's like a buddy, we we
Speaker 1: hate you because you are you know, unethically wealthy and racist.
Speaker 1: That's that's our main thing. It's not because you've uh
Speaker 1: funked up a tweet. I for one love little Emerald boy,
Speaker 1: and I would be honored to work with him. M hmm. Interesting.
Speaker 1: That is the the number of places I've just you know,
Speaker 1: being out in public, I've had Ela Must quoted me.
Speaker 1: Still boggles my mind, Like Ela Must quoted me as
Speaker 1: if like Socratecheese once said, some ship musk once said,
Speaker 1: it's all these like strivers like rise and grind people.
Speaker 1: But it's such a because he has his rep is different,
Speaker 1: you know Twitter. He people don't like him on Twitter.
Speaker 1: Off Twitter, it's a whole other thing. It's like, I'm
Speaker 1: curious of what his supporters think about that, because yeah,
Speaker 1: there's people driving around in tesla's and I've seen a
Speaker 1: license it that said love Musk on the back and
Speaker 1: I was like, oh no, these people are like all
Speaker 1: in damn meant animal musk, love musk. Like he could
Speaker 1: he could run for president and do pretty well at
Speaker 1: some point in the future. He wasn't. He's not He's
Speaker 1: not an American, so we can't. Oh yeah, that's right,
Speaker 1: that's right. Did you see that somebody said he was
Speaker 1: an African American just to stir the pot because he's
Speaker 1: in Africa. Wasn't it a black woman? I said, come on,
Speaker 1: I thought she was white. I saw one where as
Speaker 1: a black woman. People were like, hold on now, like
Speaker 1: is this an avatar switch up? Like what what is
Speaker 1: happening here? That's but crazy? Yeah, I know, thanks, they're like,
Speaker 1: and I think someone above was like, oh I do
Speaker 1: not know about apartheid or and okay, don't worry about that.
Speaker 1: All right, let's take a quick break and we'll come
Speaker 1: back and talk MPR and we're back. Um, and this
Speaker 1: is this is kind of a weird one. This is
Speaker 1: just like, uh, you know, something I noticed, but I'm
Speaker 1: curious to get you guys thoughts. But I just like
Speaker 1: head and listen to MPR. And probably a year, Um,
Speaker 1: something happened with the way my phone was connected to
Speaker 1: my car, so I started popping on every once in
Speaker 1: a while around the time of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
Speaker 1: And it's like I was hearing it again, like with
Speaker 1: fresh years, and it just felt insane to me, Like
Speaker 1: it's like it's so gentle and like it's explaining the
Speaker 1: death of a of a pet to a child, but
Speaker 1: they're explaining the news of the world to an entire
Speaker 1: generation of adults. Um. And yeah. So I mean that's
Speaker 1: basically my thesis that if we weren't used to it
Speaker 1: from like decades of MPR being like a one of
Speaker 1: the primary neoliberal sources of information, we'd all be like,
Speaker 1: this is so fun, getting weird. Um. And then I
Speaker 1: do wonder if there's you know, a a larger point
Speaker 1: about the amount of cognitive dissonance that's required for the
Speaker 1: type of people who listen to NPR, sort of that
Speaker 1: gentry class of liberals, like where there's just a lot
Speaker 1: of calories, a lot of mental calorie, Like you could
Speaker 1: mint to bitcoin with the amount of mental work that's
Speaker 1: required too, you know, both be aware of all the
Speaker 1: inequality in the world, uh, and also believe that like
Speaker 1: the mainstream d NC is the answer, and you know,
Speaker 1: buying into mainstream corporate media narratives and like still feeling
Speaker 1: like you're the good guy. Like it's just it all
Speaker 1: feels very um, like it's a it's a lot of work,
Speaker 1: it's a it's a weird position to be in as
Speaker 1: a neoliberal. And so I feel like there's something something
Speaker 1: about this aesthetic that like helps just be like, no,
Speaker 1: that's okay, this is all happening. So you are right,
Speaker 1: you are You're good because you're listening to stuff about
Speaker 1: the bad stuff happening enough to get like a cursory
Speaker 1: understanding of of the details. Um, but don't worry. We're
Speaker 1: gonna make it down, go down very smooth, and we're
Speaker 1: going to talk to you in the way that uh,
Speaker 1: you know, your your snobby friends talk to you, and
Speaker 1: you know it's we're just doing this over a glass
Speaker 1: of like pinot grig. Don't worry like it's all cool. Um,
Speaker 1: I don't know what do you? What do you? Guys?
Speaker 1: I know I totally feel that because and we talked,
Speaker 1: We talked about this all the time, because then no
Speaker 1: mainstream media outlet like it. It's always meant to sort
Speaker 1: of frame all these conversations in a very tidy thing
Speaker 1: where it's not going to bring too much. It's not
Speaker 1: gonna bring the reader or listener or viewer to ask
Speaker 1: really tough questions about like US foreign policy or domestic
Speaker 1: economic policy. It'll describe a problem you know, somewhat you know,
Speaker 1: bad in a balanced way, but also not really confront
Speaker 1: the problem or offer solutions to the listener, which would
Speaker 1: actually spur the next first thing of like the next
Speaker 1: thought on because if it's just like and it's all bad,
Speaker 1: but it's being contained there and due to that, like
Speaker 1: the people do have a more optimistic outlook on the
Speaker 1: chances of Russia being successful in their invasion of Ukraine,
Speaker 1: and you're like, okay, I don't really I know that's happening.
Speaker 1: I don't need to fucking think deeper about this. I
Speaker 1: don't even need to think of like what does this
Speaker 1: mean for the military industrial complex in the United States?
Speaker 1: Why some factions of the U. S. Government like all
Speaker 1: in on this, others aren't. What's the deal there? Why
Speaker 1: there's like you know, it's it's again. Yeah, like you're saying,
Speaker 1: it sells like an illusion of being tapped in and
Speaker 1: that you're you're on top of it all without challenging
Speaker 1: you enough to really kind of begins doesn't have anything
Speaker 1: to do you think with that um, that annoying thing,
Speaker 1: what does it ally fatigue how people are just they're like, oh, man,
Speaker 1: I cared about this cause, but can't we take the
Speaker 1: like squares off our Instagram yet? You know that kind
Speaker 1: of thing where it's like it's like you want to
Speaker 1: be there and you want to support and fight, but
Speaker 1: like you also want it to be kind of easy
Speaker 1: and simple and short, and like maybe there's something to that,
Speaker 1: like if you if it goes down with a little
Speaker 1: bit of sugar and a smooth, you know, airy voice,
Speaker 1: then it's easier to handle. But yeah, then you're not
Speaker 1: necessarily hearing it all or understanding how big it could
Speaker 1: be because you're just like this is just it's like
Speaker 1: neatly contained. Yeah, and it's the emotion is removed. Um.
Speaker 1: It's very much like hearing a professor talk about a
Speaker 1: thing that like an event from history more so than
Speaker 1: it's like hearing somebody at that this thing is actually happening,
Speaker 1: to that there's a you exist in the world where
Speaker 1: this is happening. Um. But yeah, I think like the
Speaker 1: ally fatigue syndrome and like NPR, which has been doing
Speaker 1: this for you know, decades now, but I think they
Speaker 1: both come from the same play of you know, wanting
Speaker 1: to feel like you are on the right side while
Speaker 1: also wanting to stay at a safe distance from the
Speaker 1: like what what is actually happening? Um. I have this
Speaker 1: clip that I pulled and I literally just like, I
Speaker 1: was like, it would be helpful if we had a clip, uh.
Speaker 1: This morning, and I went to the NPR website and
Speaker 1: was like, let's find them. The thing that made me
Speaker 1: notice it was a story about Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
Speaker 1: So I just went and looked for a story where
Speaker 1: they were talking about that, and I like four minutes
Speaker 1: in I thought this is you know, this isn't like that.
Speaker 1: I'm catching them saying something wild or anything. This is
Speaker 1: just an example of what I'm talking about. Um, I
Speaker 1: don't know, Miles, do you wanna like I have the
Speaker 1: link there, I could just pull it up. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: for four ten And is this a podcast? No, well
Speaker 1: this is on the NPR. Bad they so they serve
Speaker 1: everything as a podcast. And I should say, like in
Speaker 1: relation to the podcast. Um, when we started like our
Speaker 1: little shingle of like how stuff Works, which became I
Speaker 1: heart like, one of our stated goals was to create
Speaker 1: shows that did were not influenced by the nprs that
Speaker 1: because it felt like so many shows were just like,
Speaker 1: you know, this American Life and then this American Life
Speaker 1: Descendants and like everybody was just like, hey, so this
Speaker 1: is from the one you know. Um, but yeah, the
Speaker 1: NPR is wild influential to the point that like this
Speaker 1: might not even sound that crazy to people who listen
Speaker 1: to a lot of podcasts inteligence capabilities including So this
Speaker 1: is just the end of the report of how the
Speaker 1: US is helping to investigate worker. NPR Justice correspondent Ryan Lucas,
Speaker 1: Thank you, Ryan, doesn't doesn't Isn't that soothing? I guess not?
Speaker 1: Nice Susan boys, some nice soothing music. The first step
Speaker 1: in confirming that comes in the next story, to look
Speaker 1: for themselves. Days ago, our colleagues got detro how to
Speaker 1: look around boro Yanka. That's one of the cities near
Speaker 1: Kiev from which Russian forces recently withdrew. And today we
Speaker 1: hear Scott's stories of two people who survived the Russian occupation.
Speaker 1: Natasha and her daughter's family spent a month hiding in
Speaker 1: a cramp. What did we eat? Mostly potatoes. I had
Speaker 1: some spare oil, and then I have a cow, so
Speaker 1: I had milk, and I went to my neighbor. I
Speaker 1: gave her some milk. She gave me some other things,
Speaker 1: some cheese. So this is how we survived. So that's
Speaker 1: all right. That was the main like kind of pieces
Speaker 1: I wanted to play because you know, so Scott, Scott
Speaker 1: and Skip comes in very calm, just like you know,
Speaker 1: this is the story where we're going to give you
Speaker 1: some stuff from the ground. And then they bring in
Speaker 1: somebody who is, you know, very emotional and like you know,
Speaker 1: breaks down a little later in the interview, but then
Speaker 1: they like overlay her with someone who sounds like they're
Speaker 1: recounting a meal they prepared over a glass of wine.
Speaker 1: Like ever, yeah, yeah, just when you're talking about military operation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so yeah for context that that woman uh was hiding
Speaker 1: in her basement um, starving with children, trying to hide
Speaker 1: from Russia who was trying to murder her, and like
Speaker 1: like what do we eat? Well, we had a nice
Speaker 1: little like potato saute and like it's like this kind
Speaker 1: of feel is disingenuous because like they are giving people
Speaker 1: information that people need. I just want to take a
Speaker 1: moment to acknowledge the aesthetic and uh make fun of
Speaker 1: it because it is fucking weird. I will say that.
Speaker 1: I remember in twenties teena I was watching CNN and
Speaker 1: like watching the election results come in, and I was
Speaker 1: getting so stressed out and had such anxiety. So I
Speaker 1: had to turn it to CBC Canadian TV because they
Speaker 1: were just they're just talking. They were just they're presenting
Speaker 1: the facts and not going crazy, and there weren't like
Speaker 1: air horns and loud noises every five minutes, and it
Speaker 1: was like the only way I could handle it. So
Speaker 1: it's like I know that you know that that's working.
Speaker 1: You know it gives them, you know, more listeners, and
Speaker 1: people are drawn to that for that reason. I think,
Speaker 1: but yeah, what does that say necessarily about people? Like
Speaker 1: that's how they have to handle work, crimes and things. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's just how It's just like the messaging, right,
Speaker 1: Like it's one thing if someone's like, oh, hey, that
Speaker 1: house is on fire. The house is on fire. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's inhuman. It's it's it's the humanity out of it
Speaker 1: was strange, and so your response to it is going
Speaker 1: to be completely different too. It's like it gives you
Speaker 1: the new is with a like little like anti anxiety medication,
Speaker 1: Like so yeah, yeah, I don't need Yeah, people don't
Speaker 1: need to be listening to like the Death Metal of
Speaker 1: the News podcast. You're like, it's all fucking over. But
Speaker 1: at the same time, you do do people a disservice because,
Speaker 1: like you're saying this, even this is even how I
Speaker 1: saw it, especially the summer covering all the police Fucori.
Speaker 1: They were like then some have seen it as potentially
Speaker 1: being racially motivated behavior, and you're like, hold on, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're we're all looking at this in real time and
Speaker 1: you can't even come out and properly sort of catch
Speaker 1: people up. I think is the energy should be. There's
Speaker 1: there's a serious issue with law enforcement. I think that's
Speaker 1: just there, and I get that. I think people see
Speaker 1: like we're autatorializing by saying something like that, But you
Speaker 1: also need to convey the severity of something to people,
Speaker 1: because if you say it all monotone, you're gonna think, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just a few bad apples. Meanwhile, you look at
Speaker 1: the people who are in the streets and the way
Speaker 1: they speak about it. They're not like, oh, it's this
Speaker 1: or that. We're talking about existential threats, and I think
Speaker 1: to take that out of the way you're telling the
Speaker 1: news allows people to think, oh, I mean, yeah, the
Speaker 1: invasion might be fucked up in Ukraine, but that woman
Speaker 1: seemed so, she had a cow, she had some oil y. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: this is yeah. I mean, this is the whole NPR aesthetic.
Speaker 1: Is itself a reaction to the like you know, Dan rather,
Speaker 1: Peter what's his name from ABC, Tom Broke, Peter Jennings,
Speaker 1: like that whole like and like it's unnatural like that
Speaker 1: that is, it's weird, unnatural trying to play the center
Speaker 1: type thing UM, and NPR is like, no, we'll talk
Speaker 1: to you, UM in this other way that feels less
Speaker 1: like artificial. But now it's like so uniform across so
Speaker 1: many channels, and it just doesn't like it's now its
Speaker 1: own weird artificial thing that seems to be aiming to
Speaker 1: just like make everybody feel calm about uh and like
Speaker 1: feel like they're the good guy and you know, get
Speaker 1: well can wear their tote bag with pride um and yeah,
Speaker 1: so I asked, uh super producers Becca and Tricia to
Speaker 1: you know, Becca looked into just like a history of like,
Speaker 1: what what are other people pointing this out? And she
Speaker 1: pulled some very funny tweets and also like I think
Speaker 1: a really smart one where somebody, um Alex Safe Cummings tweeted, uh,
Speaker 1: the system has every reason to want to revert back
Speaker 1: to the norm, to the even keeled MPR tone of voice,
Speaker 1: and it will probably try. But Trump, to his credit,
Speaker 1: in a weird way, has blown up all duplicitous civility
Speaker 1: to the ruling class. The pretty West wing illusions are
Speaker 1: mostly gone, and like, I think that's interesting to think
Speaker 1: of Trump as, uh, what one of the things he
Speaker 1: is reacting to is like this insufferable neo liberal class
Speaker 1: of just you know that tone like he Trump's rude
Speaker 1: conversational like kind of weird speaking style as a breaking
Speaker 1: out of the like quiet politeness that MPR embodies. Um
Speaker 1: is kind of an interesting way to think about that. UM.
Speaker 1: And then and then there is apparently like straight up
Speaker 1: gate keeping UM, Like we don't have them in a
Speaker 1: room telling people to like be more zand out. Which
Speaker 1: was the assignment. I was like, can you find out
Speaker 1: if they have like a candy bowl full of like
Speaker 1: xan X at the office or like conditioning. What do
Speaker 1: they tell the people before they go on the air,
Speaker 1: is my question? Like I I still like, well, we
Speaker 1: won't find this out, but if if zy Gang, if
Speaker 1: any of our listeners have experience with this, like I
Speaker 1: I'm dying to know, like what are there is there
Speaker 1: a process where they're like nope, okay, just calmer, all
Speaker 1: right now? Can you take it down just a little
Speaker 1: bit more? You're at like a three, I need you
Speaker 1: at like a one minus. Um, Like I would love
Speaker 1: to just hear what that's like. Maybe when they're in person,
Speaker 1: the hosts talk super quietly, they're like, so you compare,
Speaker 1: so then the other person that's talking to them feels
Speaker 1: like they need to talk quietly to like maybe it's
Speaker 1: just this weird like mirroring thing feel bad for the
Speaker 1: people of color who work in there, and they're like,
Speaker 1: let me tell you what I do, Like what I'm sorry, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean so Uh. Producer Tricia pulled a story about,
Speaker 1: you know, somebody who an MPR contributor who was preparing
Speaker 1: a story for air when he became aware that he
Speaker 1: was altering his speaking style to fit would he believed
Speaker 1: to be the MPR voice. Um. And then you know,
Speaker 1: there there's another story where somebody was basically told, h
Speaker 1: uh that they couldn't come on the air on MPR
Speaker 1: because their accent seemed to or their voice seemed to accented.
Speaker 1: Giselle Regatto road an essay and the Columbia Journalism Review
Speaker 1: in which she recounted her attempt to pitch a story
Speaker 1: to NPR, only to be told by an editor that
Speaker 1: her piece would not air out of concern for her accent. Um.
Speaker 1: So you know there's that too, Like there's obviously a
Speaker 1: crazy bias there. Um. And I think, yeah, yeah, go ahead, no,
Speaker 1: just do you think about what you're talking about Trump? Right,
Speaker 1: and like the I get you know, I get that
Speaker 1: it's soothing, right that it makes it easier but at
Speaker 1: the same time, it deep down we know it's disingenuous
Speaker 1: because we're only listening to it because we feel that
Speaker 1: we need to know about it, but don't want to
Speaker 1: get freaked out by the sort of the scale of
Speaker 1: the issue that we're trying to learn about. And I
Speaker 1: think that's another reason why a lot of people just
Speaker 1: you know, like people responded to Trump, because if you're
Speaker 1: hearing on the news, it's like, yeah, you know, medical dad,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah, and this guy's been like the pharmaceutical
Speaker 1: costs are out of control and nah like that energy
Speaker 1: people like exactly, that's the thing that that actually connects
Speaker 1: energetically with what I'm feeling about this whole situation. It's
Speaker 1: not the way it was presented to me. It's that
Speaker 1: I'm living in a very grim reality. So to present
Speaker 1: my grim reality with you know this like you know,
Speaker 1: this paint of cote or this quote or code of
Speaker 1: paint that makes it really shiny doesn't help me anyway
Speaker 1: in any way. So, yeah, people are gonna gravitate towards
Speaker 1: the people who at least are speaking with a level
Speaker 1: of emotion to it or acknowledging this verity, even if
Speaker 1: it's disingenuous, because that feels more real at times. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I mean the we've talked before about how the
Speaker 1: fact that the alternative to the mainstream that is seeing
Speaker 1: the most success right now is like authoritarianism and Nazism,
Speaker 1: like in in America, that's the thing that has the
Speaker 1: most energy. They had the fucking president for four years. Um.
Speaker 1: And I think, like, I like the fact that so
Speaker 1: much of the neoliberal like ideal and you know, image
Speaker 1: and self image is tied to NPR and a thing
Speaker 1: that seems to be intentionally trying to lull you to sleep.
Speaker 1: I think is at least part of the problem. Um.
Speaker 1: But we have we have more on this and I'm
Speaker 1: going to keep talking about it because I find it
Speaker 1: very interesting, um, in future episodes. But Nicole, it's been
Speaker 1: such a pleasure having you on t d Z. Where
Speaker 1: can people find you and follow you? Well, first of all,
Speaker 1: thank you for having me back. This is very fun,
Speaker 1: And um, people can follow me and find me on
Speaker 1: Twitter elon Musk's Twitter at Cole Thurman, I'm n I
Speaker 1: C C O. L. E. Thurman and also on Instagram
Speaker 1: at Nicole Thurman. Amazing. Is there a tweet or some
Speaker 1: other work social media you've been enjoying. Oh my god, well,
Speaker 1: I don't know if you saw this tweet. I think
Speaker 1: it was yesterday that they that just the discussing film
Speaker 1: Twitter account always be tweeting out some wild ship I swear,
Speaker 1: and I think, um, where is it? Of course I
Speaker 1: had it in my favorite and I'm not gonna be
Speaker 1: able to find it. Um, it was about Leah Michelle
Speaker 1: and Jonathan Groff. Did you see this? Okay, here it is? It,
Speaker 1: says Leah Michelle reveals she once let Jonathan Groff see
Speaker 1: her vagina using a desk lamp to give him an
Speaker 1: illustrative lesson and satisfy his curiosity in the Female Anatomy
Speaker 1: as a gay man with no practical knowledge of its particulars.
Speaker 1: And it's that it's that story is fucking hilarious. First
Speaker 1: of all, I was like, what, why do we speak
Speaker 1: like you? We don't mean to notice you could have
Speaker 1: just not said that. But also I just think there's
Speaker 1: something so damn funny about like lately tweets are being
Speaker 1: so fucking wild when people are doing press tours for
Speaker 1: movies like what's happening? Like yesterday, I thought that the
Speaker 1: official trailer for Don't Worry. Darling Variety tweeted like Harry
Speaker 1: Styles performs oral sex on Florence Pew and it's like, Yo,
Speaker 1: what happen me? We got to click on it? Okay,
Speaker 1: it's Harry Styles. We don't click on it. You don't
Speaker 1: need to say that to get us the crack. It
Speaker 1: just feels so out late, like you're just getting the
Speaker 1: craziest fucking stories for these press to wars, which I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess I appreciate the madness, but I'm also like,
Speaker 1: why do we feel like we have to go that
Speaker 1: hard to like get people to be interested in a story? Right? Totally? Yeah? Amazing?
Speaker 1: People find you what's tweet you've been enjoying? This reminds
Speaker 1: me of Megan Fox thing that just came out her
Speaker 1: machine gun. Kelly. We just we ingest a little bit
Speaker 1: of each other. Shut up, Like, first of all, shut up.
Speaker 1: They always be talking. They don't have to say anything. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm like, we know you guys peaked when Molly Lambert
Speaker 1: interviewed y'all and we found out he said he was
Speaker 1: weed anything anything that you're yeah, yeah, find me at
Speaker 1: Miles of Gray on Twitter and Instagram. Also obviously our
Speaker 1: basketball podcast, Myles and Jack Got Mad boost Ease, an
Speaker 1: NBA podcast where we celebrate the wonderful game of basketball.
Speaker 1: Also my other podcast for twenty day Fiance with Sophie Alexander.
Speaker 1: Come check that out if you like that ninety day madness.
Speaker 1: Uh tweet I like is from at stolen Dan's tweeted
Speaker 1: uh in parentheses youth pastor voice you know who else
Speaker 1: called Saul. That's great. I love it, uh tweet. I've
Speaker 1: been enjoying uh Nicole Thurman. I don't know if you've
Speaker 1: heard her. Familiar when you ask someone to rub your
Speaker 1: shoulders and they just rub it, it's like, uh, it's like, no,
Speaker 1: my dude, I'm gonna need you too, straight up pummel me.
Speaker 1: Welcome my ship, jump up and down on it, like
Speaker 1: my back is a little trampoline to help me. Oh
Speaker 1: my god. That is Uh. My wife is exactly the same.
Speaker 1: That's why they're a gun. They're all I do have
Speaker 1: one of those, because then I'm like, YO, just hit
Speaker 1: me with that, like don't worry, he's gonna do all
Speaker 1: the work. Just name it at my back, just let
Speaker 1: it drill it in, like, don't be afraid I have
Speaker 1: a shoulder pain that I just feel like it really
Speaker 1: needs to be like ripped out of my body or something.
Speaker 1: I'm like, be violent with me. There's an elbow or something.
Speaker 1: That's That's the thing I always tell people if they
Speaker 1: don't have strong hands, I'm like, yo, use your elbow
Speaker 1: and just digging in with your elbow because like that
Speaker 1: thing that that that that doesn't you gotta work it out. Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1: All right. Well, you can find me on Twitter at
Speaker 1: Jack Undersquirrel Brian. You can find us on Twitter at
Speaker 1: daily Zy. Guys were at the Daily used on Instagram.
Speaker 1: We have a Facebook fan page and a website Daily
Speaker 1: zys dot com where we post our episodes on our
Speaker 1: foot notes where we link off to the information that
Speaker 1: we talked about in today's episode, as well as a
Speaker 1: song that we think you might enjoy. Myles, what song
Speaker 1: do we think? People? We're gonna go out on a track? Uh.
Speaker 1: This Japanese artist named Hatty Mijo and uh yeah, she's
Speaker 1: just kind of um she found remember if you know
Speaker 1: Chibo Mato that band was in that band. Um. Also
Speaker 1: like he's been on like some guerrilla stuff. Really interesting artists.
Speaker 1: But this is a track out called Tokyo Story, and
Speaker 1: this has got this if I thought it was like
Speaker 1: a retro like Tokyo City pop track from the eighties,
Speaker 1: but it's like a little bit more pretty than that.
Speaker 1: Um and her singing is real spooky and the production
Speaker 1: is really cool. So yeah, check this out. Tokyo Story
Speaker 1: by Miho. Alright, well go check that out the Daily.
Speaker 1: He's like guys, a production by Heart Radio. For more
Speaker 1: podcast My Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app,
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 1: That's gonna do it for us this morning. But we're
Speaker 1: back this afternoon to tell you what's trending and we'll
Speaker 1: talk to you all that Bite by