Speaker 1: Pushkin. This is Talk Easy. I'm Samforco so welcome to
Speaker 1: the show. Today. I'm joined by actor Claire Foy. You
Speaker 1: likely first learned of Foy's work through her portrayal of
Speaker 1: Queen Elizabeth the Second in the first two seasons of
Speaker 1: The Crown, for which she won an Emmy. In the
Speaker 1: five years since her TV hit, she's appeared in films
Speaker 1: like Steven Soderbergh's un Saying and Damien Chiselle's First Man,
Speaker 1: where she played Janet Sharon, wife of famed astronaut Neil Armstrong.
Speaker 1: Her latest performance comes in the new movie Women Talking,
Speaker 1: written and directed by Sarah Polly. Inspired by real life events,
Speaker 1: it tells the story of eight women and an isolated
Speaker 1: Mennonite colony who discover that the men in their community
Speaker 1: have been surreptitiously drugging and abusing them for years. With
Speaker 1: their faith shaken and reality shattered, the women began deliberating
Speaker 1: over their response to this brutality. Here's a clip from
Speaker 1: the trailer. Quite as a love appince a love, the
Speaker 1: end of the needs for love result in so much violence.
Speaker 1: It was all waiting to happen. Before it happened, he
Speaker 1: could look back and follow the breadcrumbs along the path
Speaker 1: that led to violence. When we looked back, it had
Speaker 1: been everywhere. It is a part of our faith to forgive.
Speaker 1: We would be forced to leave the colonies. If we
Speaker 1: do not forgive these men, none of you will listen
Speaker 1: to reason. We know that we've not imagined these attacks.
Speaker 1: We know that we are rumed and terrified. Hope for
Speaker 1: the unknown is good, just better than hatred of the familiar.
Speaker 1: That was from the film Women Talking Now out in
Speaker 1: theaters across the country. It stars actors Rooney Mara, Jesse Buckley, and,
Speaker 1: of course our guest today, Claire Foy, whose performance in
Speaker 1: the film has a kind of ferocity that stays with you.
Speaker 1: It's actually why I wanted to have her on the show.
Speaker 1: The film is full of tremendous talents, but it's Foy's
Speaker 1: work as Salome, a deeply protective mother, that especially cuts deep.
Speaker 1: It's a combustible turn for Foy, who oscillates back and
Speaker 1: forth between untamable rage and unrelenting despair. Foy, to her credit,
Speaker 1: captures both ends of that spectrum, leaving the audience to
Speaker 1: wrestle with the gulf between them. We discuss the intricacies
Speaker 1: of her performance. Throughout our conversation today, we also chart
Speaker 1: her course from childhood to college to the Crown and
Speaker 1: how she hopes Women Talking is the beginning of a
Speaker 1: new chapter. But before we begin, a quick disclaimer. Given
Speaker 1: the film subject matter, there's some reference to sexual assault.
Speaker 1: As always, we've included time codes in the description of
Speaker 1: this episode. Should you want to skip ahead of the
Speaker 1: Women Talking section. If you happen to not be listening
Speaker 1: to this on your phone, you can still see the
Speaker 1: description in our show notes at talk easypod dot com.
Speaker 1: That's talk easypod dot com. And so with that, welcome
Speaker 1: back to the show. Happy twenty twenty three and I
Speaker 1: hope you enjoy this talk with the very talented Claire Foy.
Speaker 1: Claire Foy, Yes, pleasure to meet you and you thanks
Speaker 1: for having me. How you doing today. I've been up
Speaker 1: since two o'clock this morning, Jet Act, So I'm awake.
Speaker 1: That's the one qualification we also have here on the show.
Speaker 1: I'm awake. The guest has to be awake. You have
Speaker 1: this excellent new film that's out called Women Talking, and
Speaker 1: I thought we'd just dive into it to set the scene.
Speaker 1: The film takes place in an isolated religious colony where
Speaker 1: the women learned that several men in the community have
Speaker 1: been drugging and abusing them for years. For your part,
Speaker 1: you play Salome, a protective mother who learns that one
Speaker 1: of the men has a at her four year old daughter.
Speaker 1: In the aftermath of that attack, The men then leave
Speaker 1: the community for two days, during which time the women
Speaker 1: are told there to forgive them. Now, as I understand it,
Speaker 1: it was only when you landed the role that you
Speaker 1: realized the responsibility you'd been given in it. You said,
Speaker 1: I was slightly afraid because I didn't know where it
Speaker 1: was going to take me. Yeah, where did this film
Speaker 1: take you? I think I learned so much. I was
Speaker 1: constantly surprised by myself. I think I had a lot
Speaker 1: of trust in the process. I think because I trusted
Speaker 1: so much the people who were making it and the
Speaker 1: other actors around me. There was a lot of things
Speaker 1: I suddenly realized. I had to sort of go in blind,
Speaker 1: really with a lot of stuff, which is not normally
Speaker 1: my approach. But as I get older and I do
Speaker 1: it more, it's actually starting to be more of my approach. Really,
Speaker 1: what do you think that approaches? I will always for
Speaker 1: me anyway, always have to do a lot of preparation,
Speaker 1: just because I think it's sort of part of making
Speaker 1: myself feel comfortable. Like improvising always scares the living daylights
Speaker 1: out of me. It sort of enjoy it, but I
Speaker 1: enjoy it with a framework of knowing where I should
Speaker 1: be going, who my character is. I don't like just
Speaker 1: I will always prepare a lot, but I think that
Speaker 1: you have to leave room for to let the light
Speaker 1: in a bit. You have to leave room for it
Speaker 1: to be surprised. The most exciting performances are the performances
Speaker 1: that have life in them, and it's a sense of
Speaker 1: I don't know, like that you don't entirely know what's
Speaker 1: going to happen next. And I think that's what's always
Speaker 1: made me quite fearful. But I think as I'm getting older,
Speaker 1: I think I'm like, come on, I've just got to
Speaker 1: let it go. What did that look like? Probably not
Speaker 1: very good? Lots of people. I don't know. I really
Speaker 1: I surprise myself with how much I could do. When
Speaker 1: we first started shooting it, we hadn't quite as a group.
Speaker 1: I think Sarah had figured out how to shoot it technically,
Speaker 1: and I don't think as actors, we've fed back to
Speaker 1: her and the rest of the crew, how this is
Speaker 1: going to be able to be performed at that pitch
Speaker 1: for that amount of time. The first opening kind of
Speaker 1: scene which I sort of have a semi monologue in it.
Speaker 1: It's very high energy, it's very engaged. The whole time.
Speaker 1: We did one hundred and twenty times over about two days,
Speaker 1: two and a half days. I surprised myself in the
Speaker 1: sense that I was like, I've got through it, just
Speaker 1: I just plowed on. In that scene, you say I
Speaker 1: can't forgive the man, I won't do it. You then
Speaker 1: proceed I think the kicker bucket over, Oh, the bucket,
Speaker 1: the bucket, I'd have a special to thing made. I
Speaker 1: was originally adamant that. I wasn't I'm just going to
Speaker 1: kick the bucket. It's fine to kick the bucket three times,
Speaker 1: not going to be good for like the seventieth take,
Speaker 1: let alone, one hundred and twenty. Yeah, I know that
Speaker 1: was my own stop. But then we mind it. But
Speaker 1: they made me like a special thing to put my
Speaker 1: sock because obviously you wearing sandals. The lovely convo of
Speaker 1: socks and sandals. So yeah, I noticed you were wearing
Speaker 1: that today. Actually, yeah, so I feel like I'm back
Speaker 1: there and that's a place you want to live in.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, permanently. It's really nice. You're trying to make
Speaker 1: light of something that is really not worth making light of.
Speaker 1: But much of the film unfolds in that hay loft
Speaker 1: where that scene takes place, where the women must decide
Speaker 1: whether to stay and fight the men or leave the
Speaker 1: colony outright. But at the heart of that deliberation is
Speaker 1: really weighing the men's capacity to change with the women's
Speaker 1: capacity to forgive. How are you thinking about that conversation
Speaker 1: in creating this character. I think it's interesting with Salom.
Speaker 1: What I found interesting when we were shooting it is
Speaker 1: a lot of those conversations she is not part of
Speaker 1: because she's just not hearing it. So all of the
Speaker 1: women have come to terms and understood what has happened
Speaker 1: to them, and she has had to as so many
Speaker 1: women have in the community as well. The Penny has
Speaker 1: dropped that what has been experienced by her four year
Speaker 1: old daughter is not illness, that she's been also raped
Speaker 1: while she was asleep in the same house as herself
Speaker 1: and her husband and their other children. I don't think
Speaker 1: that Salome has the capacity, nor necessarily should she about
Speaker 1: having a nuanced argument about that. I think that other
Speaker 1: characters owner, for example, he who is the most educated
Speaker 1: of the women and also the most spiritually open to
Speaker 1: all different avenues, which this kind of conversation takes them down,
Speaker 1: She's able to live in that world. I just don't
Speaker 1: think Salome is at all. And so it was interesting
Speaker 1: when we were shooting it that I would hear those
Speaker 1: arguments made for the first time as the character, and
Speaker 1: then obviously, you know, one hundred takes in or you know,
Speaker 1: maybe fifty, I start hearing it as a person, and
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, God, that's really interesting. And that's what the
Speaker 1: film basically is, is watching these women change in real time.
Speaker 1: But I think the concept of the men can change
Speaker 1: is also linked to her because she has a son
Speaker 1: who's a particular and the cusp of sort of teenageddom
Speaker 1: and therefore manhood, and it matters greatly to her that
Speaker 1: her son is not going to become like these men
Speaker 1: in the community. And that doesn't just mean the rapists.
Speaker 1: It means the men in the community who have been
Speaker 1: engaged in manipulating the power to keep the women down
Speaker 1: and put them in this position in the first place.
Speaker 1: And I think she's quite afraid about whether that is
Speaker 1: possible for her son, because he's so far down the line.
Speaker 1: I think, well, why don't we watch a clip from
Speaker 1: the film Okay, in which your character wrestles with all
Speaker 1: the things we're talking about. Can you do that on
Speaker 1: a podcast? People are going to listen to it? Oh? Okay?
Speaker 1: Oh God. This is a clip from Women Talking, written
Speaker 1: and directed by Sarah Parley. What if the men who
Speaker 1: are in prisoner are not guilty? Mother? Chat? Are you
Speaker 1: asking we caught one of them? I saw him, but
Speaker 1: only one? Yes, only one, But he named the others
Speaker 1: for what if he was lying? We must consider this. No, No,
Speaker 1: that is not our responsibility, because we aren't in charge
Speaker 1: of whether or not they are punished. We know that
Speaker 1: we've been attacked by men, not by ghosts or Satan,
Speaker 1: as we were led to believe for so long. We
Speaker 1: know that we've not imagined these attacks, that we were
Speaker 1: made unconscious with cow tranquilizer. We know that we are
Speaker 1: bruised and infected and pregnant and terrified and insane, and
Speaker 1: some of us are dead. We know that we must
Speaker 1: protect our children, regardless of who is guilty. In many ways,
Speaker 1: Salaam is the lightning rond of the community, the woman
Speaker 1: who most wants to stay and fight the men at
Speaker 1: all costs. When it came to a character, you said,
Speaker 1: there was an ease in which I was able to
Speaker 1: connect with her. That is very rare. I found her
Speaker 1: the quickest to connect with of any character I've played before.
Speaker 1: Why do you think that was there's a short cut. Basically,
Speaker 1: having a book to read is obviously always a real
Speaker 1: gift basically when you're working on anything, because it gives
Speaker 1: you this, like the closest source material to what the
Speaker 1: writer was thinking about who these people were that you're
Speaker 1: about to play. And Salome in the book was just immediate.
Speaker 1: She's a very immediate person. She thinks and speaks at
Speaker 1: the same time. And that's something that I think my
Speaker 1: family and my friends will probably say is the same
Speaker 1: as me. I'm very readable, I think is the thing.
Speaker 1: And then I think some people take that really personally.
Speaker 1: Then it's obviously nothing to do with them. It's might
Speaker 1: incapacity to be able to hide what I'm my responses
Speaker 1: to things, and I'm quite a passionate person, and I
Speaker 1: don't argue very well. I'm a terrible arguer, really yeah,
Speaker 1: really bad. I can get very passionate about things I
Speaker 1: know absolutely nothing about. But if it's on the other
Speaker 1: side to someone's opposing side, opposing someone else, then I
Speaker 1: will go help. Like I've just keep going, I will
Speaker 1: die on that hill when I don't really want to.
Speaker 1: And I think that Salome, even though that's obviously not
Speaker 1: what's happening, she is righteously angry. The thing that's compelling
Speaker 1: her to fight is her belief and what is wrong
Speaker 1: she sees. I think as well, the very shaky ground
Speaker 1: that the power these men in the community have is
Speaker 1: based on. I don't think she believes it. I think
Speaker 1: she's got very strong faith and I think her capacity
Speaker 1: to have two sort of opposing things in her life,
Speaker 1: which is that she has faith and belief and love
Speaker 1: and tenderness and a huge heart, and she's also would
Speaker 1: rip someone's eyes out. I get it, Like the energy
Speaker 1: of her. I was just like, yeah, I get her
Speaker 1: the way you got her as an actor. As a person.
Speaker 1: I want to kind of understand where that maybe comes from.
Speaker 1: And to do that, I think we have to go
Speaker 1: back a little bit. Okay, what too? Is it the
Speaker 1: sound effect? That's the sound effect? Where are we going?
Speaker 1: We have been looking for a sound effect for the
Speaker 1: pivot back, the pivot back. All we needed was one
Speaker 1: lovely jet led actor to come in here and have
Speaker 1: no filter, just to keep talking. Thank God for that,
Speaker 1: that ability to connect to salam I wonder if it's
Speaker 1: informed by your time at Aylesbury High School in the
Speaker 1: mid nineties. Because of that period, you said, I was
Speaker 1: really pissed off most of the time. I didn't really
Speaker 1: follow my instincts and instead did what I thought I
Speaker 1: was supposed to be doing. A lot of that anger
Speaker 1: came from not feeling like the person that you are
Speaker 1: is allowed to be out in the world. What person
Speaker 1: did you feel like you couldn't be at that time?
Speaker 1: Preface this by saying, I don't think anybody when they're
Speaker 1: at school teenager feels particularly great about themselves. Oh I
Speaker 1: was perfect, You, however, are notorious. I heard about you
Speaker 1: even in my high school. So that is saying something
Speaker 1: slow newsday over there constantly. It was very slow newsday
Speaker 1: in the nineties. Everything was okay, not anymore. Yeah, mid
Speaker 1: nineties historically perfectly fine. Perfectly fine, like you know, Tony Blair. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I don't think anybody really gets it. I don't
Speaker 1: really think anybody really gets how to do life. Everything
Speaker 1: is very complicated, let alone the fact that your body
Speaker 1: is like on fire with hormones. And yes, you were
Speaker 1: this sort of angelic, lovely thing and you've turned into
Speaker 1: this gross, smelly creature. Yeah, that's there's a very long preface. Sorry.
Speaker 1: I just think that I always felt that I couldn't
Speaker 1: have any belief in myself. And that doesn't mean to
Speaker 1: that I had enormous amounts of belief in myself and
Speaker 1: it was hidden, but I just always felt like I
Speaker 1: was I wasn't allowed to be confident. Why because that
Speaker 1: would be saying I believed in myself. And therefore, if
Speaker 1: I believed in myself, then I had to have a
Speaker 1: reason to You can't just believe in yourself or you know,
Speaker 1: back yourself as a person. I think I'm okay, I'm
Speaker 1: a good person, but I just didn't believe that. You know,
Speaker 1: I just had had a childhood of being too loud,
Speaker 1: too much, youngest of three, youngest of three. And what's
Speaker 1: funny about it looking back, because I'm like I don't
Speaker 1: think I was that bad. It could be how many
Speaker 1: like ten instances of someone saying that and to a
Speaker 1: child that it becomes your belief system. And I found
Speaker 1: the being right really hard, like really really hard. I
Speaker 1: just couldn't get my head around how to do it.
Speaker 1: You said that you were not a wayward teenager. No,
Speaker 1: I didn't go after rails and drink loads and this
Speaker 1: is a word I would never say, and snug loads
Speaker 1: of boys. And I was probably quite angry about that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: do you not like the word snog? I like it
Speaker 1: from you. Okay, good, as long as you like it
Speaker 1: in general. I like it from you. Snarg isn't really
Speaker 1: how Yeah, yeah, that's not going to be the title
Speaker 1: of this episode, I promise. What do you say in America?
Speaker 1: You call it? No, not a smooch. If you're one
Speaker 1: hundred and five, make out, make up, make out. No
Speaker 1: it's not much better. No, it's not much better. But
Speaker 1: you as a teenager finding yourself and trying to figure
Speaker 1: out who you are in the world, What did that
Speaker 1: person look like in high school? Just very confused, very
Speaker 1: like I didn't look like I was supposed to look like.
Speaker 1: You know, I had arthritis juven anuthritis. I went to
Speaker 1: a grammar school in the UK, which is basically you
Speaker 1: have to take a test to get in. I didn't
Speaker 1: actually pass it. So I got in basically because my
Speaker 1: brother and a sister are really clever, and my mum
Speaker 1: went to the council and said, please let her in
Speaker 1: otherwise she'll get a complex. And I got a complex
Speaker 1: anyway because I went and I just wasn't really clever
Speaker 1: enough to be there. Basically. I think that's the thing
Speaker 1: is that I didn't really have And this is not
Speaker 1: a down or my mother. My mother was wonderful and
Speaker 1: did the best. She was a single parent to three children.
Speaker 1: I think when mum was pretty lucky in the sense
Speaker 1: that I took the onus away from her, in the
Speaker 1: sense that I just sort of got on with it,
Speaker 1: ignored it, buried it. I then had autoimmune conditions into
Speaker 1: my twenties, and I think that that has a lot
Speaker 1: to do with that, like not dealing with stuff and
Speaker 1: just you know, getting on with things. It's just such
Speaker 1: a difficult time, and I think unless you have a
Speaker 1: support system that goes it's really difficult. This is going
Speaker 1: to be really awful work. Probably five years of your life,
Speaker 1: but we love you, we love who you are. I'm hoping.
Speaker 1: I mean, I have a child, so I'm terrified about
Speaker 1: teenager years. But I think hopefully if you have at
Speaker 1: home as a safe place where you feel like everybody
Speaker 1: knows who you are and they accept you for who
Speaker 1: you are, then hopefully you can be able to get
Speaker 1: through it, and you can therefore push your parents away.
Speaker 1: Be a nightmare, but you know, I do things that
Speaker 1: kids you're supposed to get into trouble, and you're a teenager,
Speaker 1: you're supposed to do you're supposed to push things where
Speaker 1: and push the boundaries. I pushed absolutely no boundary because
Speaker 1: I just one was terrified. I just was terrified of
Speaker 1: death and too, I just think I was I felt
Speaker 1: like everything I was out of control my whole life.
Speaker 1: So I just was trying to control everything and therefore
Speaker 1: make myself really good, and felt out of control inside
Speaker 1: of you or your conditions at home both, I think.
Speaker 1: I think because my charge was pretty chaotic, I think
Speaker 1: inside me became pretty chaotic, and therefore the only way
Speaker 1: to deal with that was to don't do anything bad,
Speaker 1: don't do anything that wouldn't make that any worse. If
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, I do like just be good,
Speaker 1: be afraid of everything. Everything was a risk everything, So
Speaker 1: I just didn't do anything. But then, very luckily, I
Speaker 1: think because my actual nature is incredibly strong, I think
Speaker 1: that that forced me to come to making decisions in
Speaker 1: my life. Weirdly, I felt like I was on a
Speaker 1: skateboard and the skateboard was in control and that was
Speaker 1: the real me, and the other me was on top
Speaker 1: of it, and the skateboard was going, You're going to
Speaker 1: apply to go to this university. You're going to go
Speaker 1: and do this. So there was a real bravery encourage
Speaker 1: that I didn't identify with myself. I was like, what's happening,
Speaker 1: Who's making these Who's running me? And it was actually
Speaker 1: you know whoever? You know I actually was. There is
Speaker 1: some peculiar silver lining dart of this, because you say,
Speaker 1: it's not great to be eighteen and have no right eye.
Speaker 1: You're supposed to be launching yourself into the world going
Speaker 1: here I come, woo hoo woo who But it fundamentally
Speaker 1: changed me in the best way. Yeah, how did it
Speaker 1: do that? One of my aunties died of leukemia when
Speaker 1: I was about five, and I think I had from
Speaker 1: that day an absolute fear of illness and death. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just awful. I used to think that every member
Speaker 1: of my family was going to die. I used to
Speaker 1: stay awake at night thinking. I used to have like
Speaker 1: an encyclopedic knowledge at a very young age of all
Speaker 1: illnesses that I thought everyone was going to get. So
Speaker 1: when I was eighteen and life was when I was seven, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: on the cusp of kind of basically it was done
Speaker 1: my final exams, leaving school and find out I have
Speaker 1: a tumor in my eye. I think one of the
Speaker 1: things good things was about it was the vanity aspect.
Speaker 1: I think I was a teenage girl, so I was
Speaker 1: obsessed with like changing my appearance. I was obsessed with
Speaker 1: like straightening my hair and trying to look as pretty
Speaker 1: as humanly possible and putting makeup on and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: And then I was basically forced into a place where
Speaker 1: I was just had to wear dark glasses out the
Speaker 1: house and I put in loads of way because I
Speaker 1: was had to have steroids and miss a year of
Speaker 1: my life basically because I couldn't go to university. And
Speaker 1: I think it just sort of put things in perspective
Speaker 1: for me, it just made me realize what's important. I
Speaker 1: think I already knew it, but I just was like,
Speaker 1: I just it just very simplified. Health is incredibly important.
Speaker 1: When you've got it, you've got to embrace it. You know.
Speaker 1: I'd spent a lot of my teenage years either on
Speaker 1: crutches with a bandage over my eye, and so therefore
Speaker 1: anything where that wasn't happening was pretty shall. And also
Speaker 1: just that you know, you can't waste your life. I
Speaker 1: don't whatever you do, waste your life. And it just
Speaker 1: sort of put me on a trajectory of just like, right,
Speaker 1: come on, did that realization propel you into drama school
Speaker 1: in Liverpool? Yes? I think I was going to university
Speaker 1: in Liverpool anyway, I'd got in, but I had to
Speaker 1: deferm my place and then I you know, it's one
Speaker 1: of those things. Then you I've made such great friends
Speaker 1: at university, had the best time ever. Would I have
Speaker 1: if I'd gone the previous year? You know, all those
Speaker 1: sort of things that fate takes a hand, if it
Speaker 1: want to call it fate. Basically what happened was and
Speaker 1: my sister hates the story, but in my heart, I
Speaker 1: was like I really like drama, Like that's my lesson
Speaker 1: at school that I get really excited about. So I
Speaker 1: was like, maybe I'll just do like an acting call somewhere.
Speaker 1: So I pride for a couple and my sister could
Speaker 1: drive because she's five years old of me, so she
Speaker 1: took me around them and she was just saying, she said,
Speaker 1: because this is obviously we didn't know any actors, we
Speaker 1: didn't know anyone who did anything like that. She's like,
Speaker 1: isn't it a bit late now? Though I was eighteen.
Speaker 1: She was like, I shouldn't you have gone stage school
Speaker 1: or something. I was like, oh god, yeah, you're probably right.
Speaker 1: We drove into this one place in Leeds in north
Speaker 1: of England, and we drove past like a glass wall
Speaker 1: where you could see into where people were doing their
Speaker 1: drama lessons and everybody was on their hands and knees
Speaker 1: and leotard's like roaring, and she went, you are not
Speaker 1: going here, like drove me out and I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it looks awful and terrifying. So I just sort of
Speaker 1: didn't have that in my head. It was like fame
Speaker 1: going would be going, I'm a big deal. I think
Speaker 1: I'm a really big deal, and I'm going to drama
Speaker 1: school because I believe I should be star and I
Speaker 1: just could not. I was like, oh, I can't, I
Speaker 1: can't do that. So yeah, university was a warm up
Speaker 1: act and then in the third year I got the
Speaker 1: bravery took me long enough to do some actual acting,
Speaker 1: and luckily a teacher said, I think you should pursue this.
Speaker 1: And I hate that it took someone outside of myself
Speaker 1: to actually make me do that. There's something fascinating about
Speaker 1: the fact that at this age, after you leave Liverpool
Speaker 1: and attender one year postgraduate course at Oxford, that you
Speaker 1: decide I'm going to choose a profession that is so
Speaker 1: predicated on your face. Yeah. Although I when I went
Speaker 1: to drama school, I was going to do theater. You know,
Speaker 1: I had absolutely no aspiration or belief that I would
Speaker 1: be on Telly or in films. Absolutely no way. Like
Speaker 1: one of my best friends who I know from drama school,
Speaker 1: last at me because we sat next to each other
Speaker 1: in the pub on the first night, just like, say,
Speaker 1: watch thing you'll do? Do Do you think you'll moved to
Speaker 1: London after this? I was like no, what, Like why
Speaker 1: to act? I probably won't start acting after that? Like
Speaker 1: I just was in denial. I don't I just didn't
Speaker 1: know how it worked. I didn't know that acting could
Speaker 1: be something other than what I had imagined. It was
Speaker 1: in my head like it could genuinely be something I
Speaker 1: invested time in and became professional at. And when I
Speaker 1: first started acting in Telly, I was like, oh God,
Speaker 1: what they're going to say? And they're going to say
Speaker 1: that one eye smaller than the other and I'm going
Speaker 1: to have to leave. Well, let's go to that first
Speaker 1: big piece on the Telly Jelly, the BBC adaptation of
Speaker 1: Little Dorritt. It was there that the director Dervla Wash
Speaker 1: shout out, Devila Wash, gave you some sage advice. She
Speaker 1: sure did. What was that? I remember in the audition
Speaker 1: it was me and all the girls, who oh, now,
Speaker 1: my contemporaries, we all basically have the same color skin
Speaker 1: and eyes and hair. But I knew that they were
Speaker 1: all going up for it as well, and I was like, oh, guild,
Speaker 1: and they were really doing really well, and I was like,
Speaker 1: that's not gonna happen for me then. But Dervla, I
Speaker 1: remember one particular addition. I've missed my train. I was late.
Speaker 1: I was really sweaty. She said, Claire, you need to
Speaker 1: know that. The less you do, you need to you
Speaker 1: know what she say? She said, do you want the word? Yes?
Speaker 1: What did she say? She said? Everyone around you will
Speaker 1: be swinging off the chandeliers. That's what Dickens requires. But
Speaker 1: you're in the center of it. Don't do anything, don't
Speaker 1: try to act. No chandeliers. Yeah, no chandeliers for me.
Speaker 1: And it was so helpful for me because I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: so what you're saying is I cannot I don't have
Speaker 1: to act. I can I feel. I can just feel
Speaker 1: and listen and be there in the room and it
Speaker 1: will be I'll respond and that will be the right
Speaker 1: thing that happens. I think not acting is probably under
Speaker 1: selling a little bit of your talent in my view.
Speaker 1: Put it this way. If they put do cameras in here, yeah,
Speaker 1: and they filmed both of us not acting, yeah, one
Speaker 1: would be very compelling. And it's not me. Now. I
Speaker 1: don't agree. I know you don't agree, but I know
Speaker 1: what happens I think with film acting. And this is
Speaker 1: just my opinion and I don't know what I'm talking about,
Speaker 1: but is that you see a lot of ticks people
Speaker 1: have a lot of behavioral ticks like that in life.
Speaker 1: That's what we do. People look off to the side,
Speaker 1: you move your hands when you don't need to, People
Speaker 1: raise their eyebrows, don't realize and they're doing it. People
Speaker 1: personally like, there's all sorts of things that we all
Speaker 1: do that we do when we're uncomfortable, and it becomes
Speaker 1: part of who we are, and that's what we do.
Speaker 1: And I think the issue is you have to remove
Speaker 1: all of those things to do film acting. You have
Speaker 1: to be totally present and totally there in the moment
Speaker 1: and not try and catch yourself from embarrassment. You have
Speaker 1: to literally go here, I am, and I'm not going
Speaker 1: to do anything until I need to. And that's not
Speaker 1: about not acting. It's about listening and being hopefully as
Speaker 1: truthful as possible, and not putting anything on the text
Speaker 1: feeling like you need to do something to feel comfortable.
Speaker 1: You can just be there because the camera is so
Speaker 1: close to your face and the audience sees everything you're
Speaker 1: thinking and doing, and if they don't, they will put
Speaker 1: that on you anyway. So it's not about sitting there
Speaker 1: and looking vacant, but it's about being alive and not
Speaker 1: putting yourself anywhere other than where you are at that moment.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back with actor Claire Foy. So you
Speaker 1: take this no chandelier's approach, chandelier here, you know, with
Speaker 1: the sound effects. You take this after your first four
Speaker 1: ray into the BBC. Yeah, into your first movie here,
Speaker 1: Season of the Witch. You called the experience amazing, ludicrous
Speaker 1: and completely frivolous. As essentially the only woman on set
Speaker 1: filming in Budapest with Nicholas Cage, living in a two
Speaker 1: better apartment by yourself. What did that window into this
Speaker 1: system reveal to you? This was pre the financial crash
Speaker 1: of two thousand and eight. I was somewhere for basically
Speaker 1: six months. The days never ended. There was just money
Speaker 1: to keep shooting. I wasn't but people were flying on
Speaker 1: private jets because they couldn't decide what someone's haircut should be.
Speaker 1: We were up mountain. The locations were insane. They built
Speaker 1: entire villages in the period after basically that. The industry
Speaker 1: really wasn't like that at all. You know, we would
Speaker 1: be on set doing nothing all day long, riding horses,
Speaker 1: going for walks up mountains like coming back. There was
Speaker 1: just never done a job like it and did you
Speaker 1: think this is something I could do? No? I was
Speaker 1: just like, what is going on here? Who's organizing this?
Speaker 1: Who's in charge? You know, black of decisions. I was
Speaker 1: twenty three and I was just like, wow, this is
Speaker 1: come on, guys, like someone needs to pull the finger out.
Speaker 1: Because it was also that period of time where people
Speaker 1: would turn up to work after having like one now
Speaker 1: as sleep. I'm sure that kids do it now and
Speaker 1: not saying that I was like that, but there isn't
Speaker 1: like the older generations of actors, just like coming in
Speaker 1: coming into the hotel as you're leaving and then going, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm coming with you, and then turning around and coming
Speaker 1: out in the car, you know that sort of old
Speaker 1: like old school just and it was a Nicolas Cage film,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? He's notorious. And also
Speaker 1: he had lived a life which was in this world,
Speaker 1: the entire you know, his whole family, and he would
Speaker 1: ask me things like what do you do? I was like,
Speaker 1: what do you mean? Was like, what do you do
Speaker 1: in your days? I was like, just go to the shops,
Speaker 1: I think, go to the pub. The strangest impression it
Speaker 1: doesn't even sound like him, but it does sound like
Speaker 1: something he was that was good. Yeah, he's great, absolutely great,
Speaker 1: But just it was just I was like, what is
Speaker 1: going on? What is my life? And very luckily it
Speaker 1: wasn't my life. It very much was not your life.
Speaker 1: And despite how frivolous it all was, you did carry
Speaker 1: onward and start to find I think, the kind of
Speaker 1: work you wanted to make. Yes, I want to talk
Speaker 1: about the first day of shooting The Crown. Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: contractually I'm beginned to ask you about the Crown, otherwise
Speaker 1: people are going to come after me. I have nothing
Speaker 1: to ask you about the Queen. I don't even understand
Speaker 1: why Americans are so obsessed with that. It's not it's
Speaker 1: just not my business. Hey, your babes are here, babes,
Speaker 1: that's nice. So on this first day, walk me through
Speaker 1: what happened in that land Rover where you're four months
Speaker 1: into having your daughter Ivy. It's the first day of
Speaker 1: filming this big, momentous show. Of course, you did not
Speaker 1: know I was going to be as big in momentous
Speaker 1: as it would be. What happened that day shit hits
Speaker 1: the fan, basically. So I got the job when I
Speaker 1: was five months pregnant, and I certainly was not at
Speaker 1: a stage or they wouldn't have given. They wouldn't have cared.
Speaker 1: You know, if I'd said, could I push it back
Speaker 1: a few months, they would just have found someone else
Speaker 1: to do the job. So I was already scared going
Speaker 1: into it. One. I just was like, I'd never had
Speaker 1: a baby before. I didn't know what I was going
Speaker 1: to but I didn't know if I's gonna be alive, Like,
Speaker 1: I didn't know what was going to happen, and I
Speaker 1: was dreading it, like there was absolutely no element of excitement.
Speaker 1: I was just dreading it. I was dreading being away
Speaker 1: from her. But they had said very you know, they've
Speaker 1: been very supportive. They had said, you know, you can
Speaker 1: still feed her. This is going to be fine. But
Speaker 1: obviously that first week was just a baptism of fire.
Speaker 1: They had all said to me, like, we've never done
Speaker 1: this before, which is embarrassing for the industry basically. But
Speaker 1: what ended up happening was I was obviously feeding her
Speaker 1: on a relative schedule, so I planned when she could
Speaker 1: come to set, and then I was like, that would
Speaker 1: be okay. I can do like three hours of not
Speaker 1: seeing her. I can feed her. She can stay. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she's a baby. She was four months. It didn't matter
Speaker 1: if she was like in a landrover bouncing around for
Speaker 1: a bit, or we were in a stately home and
Speaker 1: things like that. She'd be okay and I could And
Speaker 1: there's so much waiting around on film sets. I was like,
Speaker 1: I'll be able to spend actually quite a lot of
Speaker 1: time with her. I found that quite reassuring. So what
Speaker 1: happened was we got in this landrover at what like
Speaker 1: eight o'clock in the morning, and we started to climb
Speaker 1: up with this mountain and we kept climbing up the
Speaker 1: mountain for about twenty five minutes, and I was like,
Speaker 1: how am I going to get down to feed my daughter?
Speaker 1: And they were like, well, they will bring her up.
Speaker 1: They will keep going up, and it's like forty five minutes.
Speaker 1: Basically we get to like a summit of a mountain
Speaker 1: where there's like men hanging off the side of the
Speaker 1: mountain case anyone falls off it accidentally. Like I was
Speaker 1: like this, I can't be a baby here, and they
Speaker 1: were like okay. So then I tried to pump breast
Speaker 1: milk and the pump didn't work, so that I was
Speaker 1: in the back of a Landrover, and I didn't know
Speaker 1: what else to do. Like I was dying. My heart
Speaker 1: was literally being crushed inside myself. I hated myself because
Speaker 1: I'd made this decision to do this job. I know
Speaker 1: what my industry was like. I couldn't believe how naive
Speaker 1: I had been to think I could do it, and
Speaker 1: I just wanted to die on the side of the
Speaker 1: mountain or just I just wanted to leave and just
Speaker 1: go with my baby. Basically, so I cried a lot,
Speaker 1: and then I called my agent. I was like, I
Speaker 1: just don't know what to say, but I just have
Speaker 1: to tell someone, and I just feel like no one
Speaker 1: else can really listen. And so they were just really
Speaker 1: scared about me and my mental health. And then I
Speaker 1: got home that night at eight o'clock. My baby was
Speaker 1: already in bed, she'd just been given form and all day,
Speaker 1: and I just cried all night. That's basically what happened.
Speaker 1: And then I obviously had a lot of residual resentment
Speaker 1: about the situation I've been in, but you know, I
Speaker 1: think I get it. They were learning too, They didn't
Speaker 1: really know. And I think sometimes our industry is really interesting.
Speaker 1: It can be incredibly rigid because people believe that things
Speaker 1: have never been done before and therefore they can't be
Speaker 1: And what I've learned from amazing producers like DD Gardener,
Speaker 1: for example, is she's like nothing is impossible, and things like,
Speaker 1: for example, COVID has shown our industry is so adaptable.
Speaker 1: If you can get an entire crew in cast tested
Speaker 1: for COVID three times a week, everyone masked up and
Speaker 1: no one get COVID at the end of it, Like,
Speaker 1: what logistical feat that is. And I just think that
Speaker 1: unfortunately people don't haven't been able to raise their voices
Speaker 1: and say, oh, this is what I need, and therefore
Speaker 1: no one's had to deal with stuff like that. You know,
Speaker 1: in looking back, these experiences feel like kind of prescriptive,
Speaker 1: like they reveal the kind of projects you want to make,
Speaker 1: but also the conditions in which you want to make them. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I want to square those two points, the characters
Speaker 1: and then the conditions for the rules. In the aftermath
Speaker 1: of The Crown, you spoke beautifully on this in a
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen speech accepting they see her award around the
Speaker 1: film first Man wanted to take a listen. The greatest
Speaker 1: privilege of your life is to be who you are.
Speaker 1: And I've realized that that's all I have to offer
Speaker 1: is myself. And all I've ever tried to do with
Speaker 1: any anything I've ever made and any work that I've
Speaker 1: been in, is to hopefully make something which people recognize,
Speaker 1: that they recognize themselves on screen in some way, that
Speaker 1: they see a thought or a feeling or an emotion
Speaker 1: or a circumstance and they can see themselves. And I've
Speaker 1: had the opportunity to play some extraordinary women for all
Speaker 1: sorts of reasons, and none more so than Janet Armstrong.
Speaker 1: She lived her life with such bravery and resilience and
Speaker 1: determination and love. And I can't tell you how many
Speaker 1: times during the making of the movie in the press
Speaker 1: store that people said to me, well, that part is
Speaker 1: normally the part of just the wife, and there's no
Speaker 1: such thing as just the wife. And that's our job.
Speaker 1: I think our job is to question ourselves, to question
Speaker 1: what we depict, who we depict, and how we depict them,
Speaker 1: and how we want people to see themselves on screen
Speaker 1: or anywhere else in the media. It's been now three
Speaker 1: years since you gave that speech. Yeah, and I'm curious
Speaker 1: with your work and women talking. How you're thinking about
Speaker 1: those questions now this moment. Yeah, I think I'm very
Speaker 1: very privileged and very fortunate to be in a position
Speaker 1: that I find myself and I am able to ask
Speaker 1: questions of the scripts and the characters that I'm being
Speaker 1: asked to play. And I always had those questions in
Speaker 1: my head, or I always had those doubts and I
Speaker 1: would instead just ignore them and carry on. And I
Speaker 1: think a lot of people have done that, A lot
Speaker 1: of female actors have done that, which is where you go,
Speaker 1: this doesn't feel quite right, and then you know the
Speaker 1: script has been written by a man, and you're told
Speaker 1: that you're wrong when you're going, oh, I'm pretty sure
Speaker 1: that a woman wouldn't do that, or pretty sure the
Speaker 1: character won't behave in that way. But I don't want
Speaker 1: to seem like I'm a troublemaker, so A'll just shut
Speaker 1: up and do it. But I do think that we
Speaker 1: have a real responsibility. I see it. I see it
Speaker 1: in children's programming. From example that the things that my
Speaker 1: daughter watches, and she's taken that in someone said something
Speaker 1: about being a girl, or just the fact that girls
Speaker 1: are all wearing a particular thing and I have to
Speaker 1: say to her, like, no one looks like that, Just
Speaker 1: so you know, do any of the women that you
Speaker 1: know in your life look that way? No, So that's
Speaker 1: not what real people look like. It's like, this is
Speaker 1: a really beautiful thing. That Kate, one of the younger actresses,
Speaker 1: Kate Hallett and Women Talking, said is that she believed
Speaker 1: that this is it in a nutshell basically what she said.
Speaker 1: She said that I believed coming into this industry, I
Speaker 1: had to come to work on time, be good, go home,
Speaker 1: don't ask any questions, just do and just don't drawing
Speaker 1: attention to yourself. But I've realized that I can expect
Speaker 1: a lot from the people that I'm working for, and
Speaker 1: that's okay. And I think it's that thing. The expectation
Speaker 1: is sort of has to be the other way around.
Speaker 1: I think on the receiving end, you've always had to
Speaker 1: be grateful for a job, and I am grateful for
Speaker 1: a job. You've always had to be do whatever you
Speaker 1: possibly can do to keep the job. If that means
Speaker 1: that someone comes into your trailer and says you're going
Speaker 1: to have to do this scene naked, you do it, like,
Speaker 1: don't question it, because there's five thousand other people who
Speaker 1: want the job, and they will remind you of that.
Speaker 1: But I just feel like I've seen a different way
Speaker 1: of making things with Women Talking. I've seen people prioritize
Speaker 1: the experience of making as something as opposed to necessarily
Speaker 1: the outcome being at the detriment of everyone's experience and
Speaker 1: all the people who are making it like their mental health.
Speaker 1: And that doesn't mean I think that everything's like birds
Speaker 1: tweeting around and her like. It just means that I
Speaker 1: do think that we can be a little bit more
Speaker 1: professional about our industry, the creative industry, while still being
Speaker 1: incredibly creative. I think it can be a safer place
Speaker 1: for everybody. You said that Women Talking cannot have been
Speaker 1: made ten years ago. No, why do you think that
Speaker 1: is what change has allowed a film like this to exist,
Speaker 1: created under the conditions in which it was created. I
Speaker 1: think it's got a lot to do with the women.
Speaker 1: So Franz mcdormant and Ddy Gardener who made it are
Speaker 1: at a particular position in their career where you know,
Speaker 1: they've got a lot of oscars between them where people
Speaker 1: would go, maybe they know what they're talking about, like
Speaker 1: maybe their instincts are actually okay, as opposed to being
Speaker 1: too crazy women who to make this film about women,
Speaker 1: which I think would have been the attitude a few
Speaker 1: years ago. I think the gravitas that they have and
Speaker 1: the also just experience and wealth of knowledge and also
Speaker 1: genius creatives that they are have imbued in them a
Speaker 1: lot of trust. Like MGM the studio or Ryan who
Speaker 1: financed the film said, Okay, we believe that what you
Speaker 1: will make will be what you want to make, and
Speaker 1: what you want to make is what we want to
Speaker 1: put out there. And I just think that those things
Speaker 1: have only been ever given to male producers, writers, directors,
Speaker 1: and their belief in Sarah and their knowing that Sarah
Speaker 1: is the director that she is, and the decisions then
Speaker 1: then who they've cast in it. It's all come from
Speaker 1: the kernel of their being, these women in the industry
Speaker 1: who have worked for this amount of time, who want
Speaker 1: to fight that corner. So as we leave with what
Speaker 1: this film showed you about what this process could be,
Speaker 1: I think it seemed to offer a different approach, a
Speaker 1: different way of making something. Yeah, I want to sit
Speaker 1: with your desire to portray what you call the unobserved
Speaker 1: character you have this quote. My favorite thing to do,
Speaker 1: and I don't know what this says about me, is
Speaker 1: to portray the unobserved character in their home with the
Speaker 1: idea that the camera's not there and that person's just
Speaker 1: living their life and it's being filmed. That's my favorite
Speaker 1: thing to do with my time. What weep. I mean
Speaker 1: they do like other things as well, but professionally I
Speaker 1: just love it. You can joke, but I have a
Speaker 1: sincere question. Okay, I'd love to hear it to ask
Speaker 1: you can still make fun of this. No, I'm going
Speaker 1: to try and be really since it. It will say,
Speaker 1: do you think this interest in the unobserved character is
Speaker 1: your way of paying homage to previous generations of your family,
Speaker 1: to specifically your Irish grandparents who came to London at
Speaker 1: the turn of the twentieth century and the Irish were stigmatized,
Speaker 1: work themselves, endlessly, raise six kids in a two up,
Speaker 1: two down apartment, leading lives that were probably often unobserved,
Speaker 1: unexamined in some way. Is acting your way of seeing them?
Speaker 1: I think it's two things. One, there's like a acting
Speaker 1: side of it. When I was at drama school, we
Speaker 1: did a lot of standard Slowski work, and that would
Speaker 1: mean living inside the character in a way that we
Speaker 1: do things like we'd bring our entire bedroom into school,
Speaker 1: into drama school, and then the whole afternoon would be
Speaker 1: this must be to people who aren't actors, must sound
Speaker 1: like hell on Earth, and also like you're paying for this,
Speaker 1: and also why would you do that with your time?
Speaker 1: That's not working? And then we would have a time pressure.
Speaker 1: It would often be going to get trainings on that
Speaker 1: and you'd have you'd watch someone in their room for
Speaker 1: thirty five minutes, and you'd watch that person moving in
Speaker 1: apparently their space doing all the things you know that
Speaker 1: you know they may committed. Drama students would like get
Speaker 1: naked or change clothes or something like that. I was
Speaker 1: going to do that, but I realized that I that
Speaker 1: was my favorite thing to do, was to be in
Speaker 1: the character's space everything be real, and just do it
Speaker 1: like everything became real. It's like an the most amazing
Speaker 1: exercise and immersion of just living someone else's life, which
Speaker 1: I as a complete you know, I just complete nosy person.
Speaker 1: I just could eat it. I love it, and I
Speaker 1: love it. When I go to set and the set
Speaker 1: designer has thought about everything, and you can put things.
Speaker 1: I always mess up sets and put things in different places,
Speaker 1: like I'm really irritating, but I just love it, and
Speaker 1: that's my favorite thing to do. And I love then
Speaker 1: the camera seeing that person in a way that we
Speaker 1: all want to see. We all want to see inside
Speaker 1: other people's houses. We love it. That's what we want.
Speaker 1: You just so nosy and like, that's what we want
Speaker 1: to see. So I have that fascination with it in
Speaker 1: the same way they think an audience does. And there
Speaker 1: are always the things I'm most interested by. But also, yes,
Speaker 1: I would say you are partly right in the sense
Speaker 1: that I don't come from a family of theatricals or
Speaker 1: people who invented a COVID vaccine or wrote a novel
Speaker 1: or travel to Inja, or you know, did things like that.
Speaker 1: I come from a family of people who work really,
Speaker 1: really fucking hard, and they laughed, they cried, they lost,
Speaker 1: they lived their life. And a lot of people would
Speaker 1: think that was in a quiet way. And what I
Speaker 1: saw wasn't quiet. What I saw was life, and it
Speaker 1: was messy and dirty and bright and hilarious. And what
Speaker 1: I see of humanity is not glitz and glamor and
Speaker 1: you know, a biography of someone who flew across the Atlantic,
Speaker 1: which is a great feat. But I'm interested in the
Speaker 1: small feats in life as a person that I am.
Speaker 1: That's just what I'm interested in. And this is not
Speaker 1: to say I'm not saying that I all I want
Speaker 1: to do is really earnest worthy things all the time.
Speaker 1: I want to do absolute nonsense as well, but I
Speaker 1: would love to read things where I recognize the people
Speaker 1: in them as people. Maybe no one else wants to
Speaker 1: watch those films, so I'll just be left hanging, but
Speaker 1: I would I love them. Well, have you come to
Speaker 1: the end that ability to see the small feats? Small
Speaker 1: feats and in turn probably see all of us? Stop?
Speaker 1: I said, thank you for doing that? How do you feel?
Speaker 1: I feel Okay, I'm worried about what I've said, but
Speaker 1: I've been really honest. I've got to stop doing that
Speaker 1: next time, completely scripted, Yeah, really guarded and frosty. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much. I've actually really enjoyed it. Actually, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I've talked a lot. Next time
Speaker 1: you can interview me. I'd love to. That can happen.
Speaker 1: Why not? Come on? So travels and that's our show.
Speaker 1: If you enjoy today's episode, be sure to give us
Speaker 1: five stars on Spotify, Apple, wherever you do your listening.
Speaker 1: I want to give a special thanks this week to
Speaker 1: Emma Jackson and the team at Tapestry London, Edward Chang
Speaker 1: At you a releasing strategy pr and of course Claire Foy.
Speaker 1: Her new film Women Talking is now out in theaters
Speaker 1: across the country. To purchase tickets and to learn more
Speaker 1: about Claire's work, visit our show notes at talk easypod
Speaker 1: dot com. If you enjoy today's conversation, I'd recommend our
Speaker 1: talks with Kate Blanchet andie Redmayne, Jonathan Majors, Laura Dern,
Speaker 1: Passa Thompson, Ethan Hawk, Paid the Pascal and Matthew McConaughey
Speaker 1: To hear those and more Pushkin Podcasts listen on the
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you like to listen.
Speaker 1: You can also follow us on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram at
Speaker 1: talk easy Pod. As always, the show would not be
Speaker 1: possible without our incredible team. Talk Easy is produced by
Speaker 1: Caroline Rebak. Our executive producer is Jennick Sobravo. Our associate
Speaker 1: producer is Caitlin Dryden. Today's talk was edited by Caitlin
Speaker 1: Dryden and mixed by Andrew Vastola. Our assistant editors are
Speaker 1: Clarice Gavara and Lindsay Ellis. Music by Dylan Peck, illustrations
Speaker 1: by Chrisha Chanoy, Photographs by Julius Chew, Video and graphics
Speaker 1: by Ian Chang, Derek gaberzak Ian Jones, Ethan Seneca and
Speaker 1: Layla Register. Special thanks to Patrice Lee, Kaylin Ung and
Speaker 1: Paulina Suarez. I'd also like to thank our team at
Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries, Justin Richmond, Julia Barton, John Snars, Karrie Brody,
Speaker 1: David Glover, Heather fine Meal, Bell, Eric Sandler, Nicole Morano,
Speaker 1: Maggie Taylor, Morgan Ratner, Jorda McMillan, Isabella Navarez, Maya Kane,
Speaker 1: Carlie mcgliore, Jason Gambrel, Malcolm Gladwell, and Jacob Weisberg. I'm Sanforgoso,
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Talk Easy. I'll see you
Speaker 1: back here next week with Keihui Kwan. Until then, stay
Speaker 1: safe and so long.