Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,
Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big
Speaker 1: changes and transitions about twenties and what they mean for
Speaker 1: our psychology. Great another week, another episode. This week the
Speaker 1: people have spoken and what they want to hear it
Speaker 1: is drum will please. The psychology of cheating, So buckle
Speaker 1: and friends, because I don't think this is an easy
Speaker 1: or light topic like last week's. We are talking about dishonesty,
Speaker 1: on faithfulness and hurt that occurs in our most precious relationships.
Speaker 1: And if you've been cheated on, if you haven't, hope
Speaker 1: you still kind of find something interesting about this. I've
Speaker 1: kind of brought in a lot of different theories. This
Speaker 1: one is actually really interesting to research. We've got theories
Speaker 1: from biological psychology, behavioral psychology, personality psychology, social psychology. So
Speaker 1: it's a bit of a doozy. Additionally, if you hear
Speaker 1: some rockers in the background, it's Christmas season and for
Speaker 1: those who know me, I live across the road from
Speaker 1: a pub, so everyone's parting. Actually Bill Shorton there the
Speaker 1: other day, so Bill Shorton's getting in on the Christmas spirit.
Speaker 1: But yeah, there might be some noise filtering in doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: We're here to learn. So yeah, the psychology of cheating.
Speaker 1: So I had the statistic on this podcast I was
Speaker 1: listening to the other day. Fifty percent of relationships will
Speaker 1: involve an act of infidelity. And I think we hear
Speaker 1: about cheating a lot in our twenties as an explanation
Speaker 1: for why people have broken up or why you shouldn't
Speaker 1: date someone. Oh you know, you know he cheating on
Speaker 1: their last partner, like he's a scumbag, that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: So let's deep dive into why. Why does this occur?
Speaker 1: Are people who cheat bad? Bad people? Is the phrase
Speaker 1: wants a cheat, always a cheater? Correct? I think it's
Speaker 1: time to investigate. So cheating for those who have experienced
Speaker 1: this is pretty terrible. I think it's a lot like
Speaker 1: a big trope in movies and songs, pop culture, folklore.
Speaker 1: We see it all around as we see it quite
Speaker 1: often up for discussion, and I feel like it's quite ubiquitous.
Speaker 1: But for people in those situations, I think nothing about
Speaker 1: it feels like something someone else could understand or rationalize.
Speaker 1: To you. It's one of those experiences that is common.
Speaker 1: I would say, what we fifty percent of people or
Speaker 1: fifty percent of relationships, but really isolating and unique in
Speaker 1: how emotionally destructive and undermining it can be. And I
Speaker 1: think the emotional aftermath is much like the stages of grief,
Speaker 1: the shock, denial, anger, but hopefully the acceptance obviously pending
Speaker 1: maybe some long term into personal damage. I think something
Speaker 1: that is really interesting when we talk about cheating is
Speaker 1: that people have different conceptions of it. Often we think
Speaker 1: of cheating as like a physical act, but cheating isn't
Speaker 1: just sex. It can also be emotional disclosure. And I
Speaker 1: think we have this idea of cheating as a physical
Speaker 1: act or sexual intimacy, and that's actually not probably I
Speaker 1: would say the most important area of our romantic relationships.
Speaker 1: Sex is just one part, but it's the emotional closeness
Speaker 1: that sex kind of comes along with its just a
Speaker 1: natural expression of that. So I think the thing that
Speaker 1: we also need to talk about whilst we be talking
Speaker 1: about physical cheating is emotional cheating, and that can kind
Speaker 1: of look like secretive, sustained closeness with someone who's not
Speaker 1: your primary partner, and in some ways I can imagine
Speaker 1: that it's worse. Sex without emotion is not uncommon, but
Speaker 1: a deep, at times non sexual emotional intimacy can mean
Speaker 1: so much more and possibly undermines the relationship more than
Speaker 1: a mere physical act. And I think the reason why
Speaker 1: we react to physical cheating is firstly the absolutely affront
Speaker 1: to notions like loyalty and trust and honesty that we
Speaker 1: want in our romantic relationships. But also it's the idea
Speaker 1: that sex could lead to more. It could leave to
Speaker 1: someone leaving, It could lead to your relationship breaking down,
Speaker 1: and that emotional intimacy between you and your partner kind
Speaker 1: of crumbling. Interestingly fun fact, but not that fun. Men
Speaker 1: tend to get more upset about physical infidelity, whilst women
Speaker 1: are more concerned with cheating that is associated with intense
Speaker 1: emotional disclosure, and some psychologists have suggested that this stems
Speaker 1: from the primitive reason behind why we take partners or
Speaker 1: accept monogamy to begin with. So men want to ensure
Speaker 1: monogamy so that they know their offspring are actually theirs
Speaker 1: for genetic purposes, whilst women, you know, biologically this is
Speaker 1: a genetic evolutionary argument. But women they want a partner
Speaker 1: or a mate who will be loyal and stick around
Speaker 1: and provide support. And I think with most evolutionary explanations,
Speaker 1: this does tend to be a bit outdated and doesn't
Speaker 1: really keep up with how we understand gender roles in
Speaker 1: reproduction and makeship nowadays. But it's still an interesting theory
Speaker 1: from kind of an evolutionary area of psychology. I think
Speaker 1: with emotional cheating, we do have to be careful about
Speaker 1: calling any type of emotional attachment to someone isn't your
Speaker 1: primary partner a form of cheating. I think it's really
Speaker 1: important to have people who aren't your partner you can
Speaker 1: share things with and that have that level of openness.
Speaker 1: But it's about boundaries. You know, if your partner is
Speaker 1: spending hours alone with someone having deep, meaningful philosophical conversations
Speaker 1: about death and your parents divorce, that might upset you,
Speaker 1: but it might not upset someone else. It's all about
Speaker 1: what you expect from that person and how you have
Speaker 1: defined the emotional boundaries of your relationship. But I can
Speaker 1: see why that would be very frustrating and upsetting and
Speaker 1: worth communicating about them in a healthy way. Obviously, always
Speaker 1: using eye language as is an idea in therapy, So
Speaker 1: let's talk about why people cheat. This is really interesting
Speaker 1: from a psychological perspective. There are obviously many reasons why
Speaker 1: people cheat, but according to this woman, Kelly Campbell, she
Speaker 1: is I think an associate or a professor of psychology
Speaker 1: at CSU, they usually fall into three categories. So the
Speaker 1: reasons people might cheat might be individual, based on the relationship,
Speaker 1: or situational. So when we talk about individual reasons, these
Speaker 1: often have something to do with a person's personality, which
Speaker 1: may make them more likely to cheat. So this is
Speaker 1: often fact as like your personality, traits, your beliefs, your religion.
Speaker 1: For example, someone who is narcissistic is more likely to cheat.
Speaker 1: There was this big study of four thousand people and
Speaker 1: they asked them about their sexual history, did a bunch
Speaker 1: of personality tests and assessments, and they found this that
Speaker 1: narcissism more likely to cheat. Side note, I did a
Speaker 1: whole episode on this if you want to know how
Speaker 1: to identify these narcissistic people and steer clear of them
Speaker 1: in your dating life. But a quick summary, A narcissist
Speaker 1: can't naturally feel empathy and often uses people as means
Speaker 1: to an ends. So maybe that's their partner or the
Speaker 1: person they're cheating with, so they may be more prone
Speaker 1: to not being able to consider or even care about
Speaker 1: the consequences of their sexual infidelity. I think it's often
Speaker 1: worth noting that it would be sexual infidelity more often
Speaker 1: than not, because emotional cheating would probably be verily rare
Speaker 1: for a narcissist and someone who can't relate to other
Speaker 1: people on an effective and emotional level. Another individual factor
Speaker 1: is people with attachment, commitment, or self esteem issues. They
Speaker 1: also seem to be more likely to cheat, as this
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen study I was talking about has suggested, so
Speaker 1: wanting a boost to self esteem can motivate infidelity. Having
Speaker 1: sex with a new person, getting to know a new
Speaker 1: person can lead to really positive internal feelings. You might
Speaker 1: feel empowered, attractive, confident, or successful, and these feelings all
Speaker 1: kind of build up your self esteem when you may
Speaker 1: not have had much previously. People who have a hard
Speaker 1: time with commitment may also be more likely to cheat
Speaker 1: in some cases. I think also importantly, because commitment it
Speaker 1: just doesn't mean the same thing to everyone. You know,
Speaker 1: it's possible for two people in a relationship to have
Speaker 1: very different ideas about the relationship status, such as whether
Speaker 1: it's casual, exclusive, and so on. I think it's also
Speaker 1: possible to really like someone and still fear making a
Speaker 1: commitment to them, and in this case, one partner might
Speaker 1: end up cheating as a way of avoiding commitment, even
Speaker 1: if they would naturally prefer to stay in that relationship.
Speaker 1: So this was the type of cheating. The reason people
Speaker 1: cheat is from an individual perspective, and the second type
Speaker 1: of cheating is due to relationship issues rather than something
Speaker 1: internally about the person who's been cheating. It's about the
Speaker 1: state of things between you as a pair, the state
Speaker 1: of your relationship. Researchers have found time and time again
Speaker 1: the partnerships that are characterized by dissatisfaction, unfulfilling sex, and
Speaker 1: high conflict, they're often at a higher risk for infidelity. Also,
Speaker 1: the more dissimilar partners are in terms of personality and
Speaker 1: education level and things in common, the more likely they
Speaker 1: are to experience infidelity. If there are unmet needs, or
Speaker 1: this glimmering euphoria of falling in love is no longer
Speaker 1: kind of sustaining your bond, cheating may become more likely
Speaker 1: because the rush and intensity of endorphins and dopamine from
Speaker 1: you as a partner is fading for that other person,
Speaker 1: but still you don't have to cheat in these situations.
Speaker 1: If you don't love someone anymore, you can always break
Speaker 1: up with them or discuss an open relationship instead of
Speaker 1: betraying your partner's trust in you or loyalty in the
Speaker 1: monogamy of your relationship. I think that's something I always say, like,
Speaker 1: if you're going to cheat on someone, why don't you
Speaker 1: just break up with them? I think that's something a
Speaker 1: lot of us think, like, why don't you just break
Speaker 1: up with them? And this kind of leads to the
Speaker 1: third reason people cheat, which is situational reasons. Sometimes people
Speaker 1: aren't going out there looking for someone else to validate them,
Speaker 1: looking for sex, looking for emotional disclosure, So situational reasons.
Speaker 1: This refers to someone who cheats, but they don't have
Speaker 1: a personality that's prone to cheating. Your relationship is fine,
Speaker 1: but something about their environment puts them at a risk
Speaker 1: for infidelity. So, like, consider this scenario. You're really frustrated
Speaker 1: with the recent distance in your relationship. Maybe you're doing
Speaker 1: longer stance and you're dealing with feelings of low self
Speaker 1: estiement and your appearance, and one day, like a coworker
Speaker 1: or someone at UNI becomes really friendly with you, and
Speaker 1: catches you alone and says something like I'm really attracted
Speaker 1: to you, like, let's get together sometime. You might not
Speaker 1: choose to cheat if only one or two factors were involved. So,
Speaker 1: for example, if it was just the situation, but this
Speaker 1: combination of motivating factors, you know, the distance in your relationship,
Speaker 1: which is a relationship issue, your feelings about your appearance
Speaker 1: self esteem a personal individual issue, and that situational factor,
Speaker 1: the attention of your coworker, can make infidelity more likely.
Speaker 1: So which reason is the worst? I guess maybe that's
Speaker 1: a question we want to ask, but I don't think
Speaker 1: we're really here to pass judgment on that. I think
Speaker 1: the emotional outcome is all the same, especially in our
Speaker 1: twenties when many of your relationships are highly formative. A
Speaker 1: relationship in which you've been cheated on can have many
Speaker 1: second order consequences on your ability to trust in the
Speaker 1: future and your own perceptions of commitment, which I think
Speaker 1: is why it's so important to kind of chat about
Speaker 1: how it's probably not your fault and don't cheat on
Speaker 1: your partners. Maybe that's something that needs to be said.
Speaker 1: Hopefully we all are on the same page there, But
Speaker 1: there is another idea that we can apply to cheating
Speaker 1: specifically why people cheat. That I found really fascinating and
Speaker 1: it comes up a lot in psychology around relationships and
Speaker 1: sex and things like that. And it's called the triangular
Speaker 1: theory of love. So the triangular theory of love suggests
Speaker 1: that love can be understood in terms of three components
Speaker 1: that together can be kind of viewed as forming the
Speaker 1: vertices of a triangle. So if you put put your
Speaker 1: hands up in a triangle, I'll explain. So on one
Speaker 1: side we've got intimacy, the next side we have passion,
Speaker 1: and the final side we have decision and commitment. This
Speaker 1: is what creates a good relationship. But when one of
Speaker 1: these sides fails, for example, intimacy or you no longer
Speaker 1: feel that passion for someone, or things like conflict and
Speaker 1: cheating piers the harmony of the triangle, that's when the
Speaker 1: relationship is probably going to fail and we might see
Speaker 1: greater degrees of infidelity. So, talking again about this amazing
Speaker 1: psychologist Kelly Campbell, there are a myriad of reasons that
Speaker 1: people cheat, but she's really quick to point out in
Speaker 1: this article that she wrote that it shouldn't actually be demonized.
Speaker 1: She makes this point, we don't know if humans are
Speaker 1: even meant to be monogamous. It's just that some people
Speaker 1: are naturally more in line with those views and others
Speaker 1: are not. So that's kind of the age old question
Speaker 1: does cheating make you a bad person? And our natural
Speaker 1: instinct might be to say, yes, of course it does.
Speaker 1: You shouldn't cheat on someone you love when you have
Speaker 1: a bond with someone, when you have agreed on exclusivity,
Speaker 1: Not honoring that and hurting the other person is pretty terrible.
Speaker 1: But like everything, there's a lot of gray area, and
Speaker 1: I think in some ways there's gray area about whether
Speaker 1: if you've cheated before that makes you a cheater for life,
Speaker 1: or whether cheating on someone is forgivable. Do we kind
Speaker 1: of allow people to make mistakes in relationships if we
Speaker 1: can call cheating that? And something else is like what
Speaker 1: constitutes cheating? And another huge question when really loading them
Speaker 1: off on you is is the evil that we kind
Speaker 1: of assign to cheating purely cultural because of the institution
Speaker 1: of monogamy that's been created by property riots and the
Speaker 1: church and religion. That's what we're going to discuss next.
Speaker 1: The phrase once a cheatah, always a cheatah. Might not
Speaker 1: be true. People can make mistakes, and whether they reoffend
Speaker 1: our guess or cheat again on the same or a
Speaker 1: different partner depends on how they rationalize their actions internally
Speaker 1: and at times unconsciously, And this has a lot to
Speaker 1: do with the psychology behind cognitive dissonance. So whether you
Speaker 1: cheat again will depend on how you change your attitude
Speaker 1: towards commitment or your partner after that first act. So
Speaker 1: dissonance reduction following a difficult moral decision can cause people
Speaker 1: to behave either more or less ethically in the future. So,
Speaker 1: using the cheating example, after you cheat on someone, whether
Speaker 1: that behavior becomes more or less likely your cheat in
Speaker 1: the future will differ based on your attitudes and how
Speaker 1: you attempt to justify your ethical choice. So if you
Speaker 1: cheat on someone, especially if you get caught, you'll probably
Speaker 1: feel really terrible. And if you're a good person, a
Speaker 1: moral person, I guess it will conflict with how we
Speaker 1: like to see ourselves trustworthy in a relationship, as good
Speaker 1: as respected, as loyal, So we experience this dissonance between
Speaker 1: the perception of ourselves and our actions. Cognitive dissonance is
Speaker 1: the term in psychology, and we're going to try to
Speaker 1: justify an action by minimizing aspects of the action you
Speaker 1: have chosen. So that's one way that you get over
Speaker 1: that dissonance of cheating. You might say, oh, it's not
Speaker 1: that bad, everyone does it. You minimize the aspects of
Speaker 1: the action. So someone chooses to justify their actions using
Speaker 1: this logic, they will probably do it again because they
Speaker 1: have some form of external justification or validation that is
Speaker 1: brought on by the reinforcement of the belief that it's
Speaker 1: not that bad because other people are doing it, because
Speaker 1: everyone does it, because you know, what do you expect? However,
Speaker 1: if you abscribe cheating to a personal flour and recognize
Speaker 1: that that you know that maybe it's because of your
Speaker 1: self esteem, maybe it's because you know there's tension in
Speaker 1: your relationship that you might be responsible for, you don't
Speaker 1: have open communication that external validation is no longer there.
Speaker 1: If you say to yourself that you've cheated because of
Speaker 1: situational and internal factors, you can control that behavior and
Speaker 1: you can see that it was a mistake that you
Speaker 1: don't want to make again. This is when long lasting
Speaker 1: change is possible because you've created and you counter belief
Speaker 1: about yourself that does not include cheating on a partner.
Speaker 1: You've decided this is not who I am. It was
Speaker 1: because of a situational factor or because of something I
Speaker 1: can control, like poor levels of confidence, and I can
Speaker 1: change that. So this is called self persuasion, and it
Speaker 1: creates a long lasting attitude change that results from this
Speaker 1: self justification. So if someone's cheated on you and you've
Speaker 1: decided to forgive them, firstly, God bless you forgiveness always,
Speaker 1: but if you're worried about whether they're going to cheat again,
Speaker 1: it's probably important to talk to them about how they
Speaker 1: see their now. If they say, oh, you know, it
Speaker 1: wasn't that bad, I think it's a lot more common
Speaker 1: than you think. I guess it was just to slip up,
Speaker 1: they probably will do it again. But if they say, oh,
Speaker 1: my gosh, it's just not who I am. That was
Speaker 1: such a mistake. I think it was because of this
Speaker 1: issue in our relationship that I want to fix. I've
Speaker 1: decided that, like, this isn't who I want to be.
Speaker 1: It was because of this, then it's unlikely that they'll
Speaker 1: do it again. So it really depends on the route
Speaker 1: a person chooses to take. Do they seek external or
Speaker 1: internal justification for their actions in order to minimize their guilt.
Speaker 1: And if that person feels no guilt, well, it might
Speaker 1: be because the relationship, well, the relationship you're in is
Speaker 1: with maybe a narcissist or someone with a pretty sinister
Speaker 1: personality trait that has manifested in infidelity, and you probably
Speaker 1: shouldn't stay with that person if they've hurt you and
Speaker 1: they don't feel guilty. Red flag, big red flag, get
Speaker 1: out of there. I think it is always important, though,
Speaker 1: to remember that humans make mistakes, and that includes your partner.
Speaker 1: There is no use, ever, I think, holding your partner
Speaker 1: to the standard of perfection because you'll kind of always
Speaker 1: be let down. You've got to love someone for who
Speaker 1: they are, not who you want them to be. And
Speaker 1: while infidelity is far from perfection, far I don't think
Speaker 1: you should always totally write off your partner because they've
Speaker 1: cheated in the past or they cheated before in your relationship.
Speaker 1: Obviously this is your call, but like we've said, sometimes
Speaker 1: cheating can be because of low self esteem, or they
Speaker 1: might feel as if they need attention from someone outside
Speaker 1: of the relationship to feel desirable or worthy. I think
Speaker 1: that kind of makes it seem like it's your fault
Speaker 1: that you should have been like hyping them up day
Speaker 1: and day night. But I think it's important to recognize
Speaker 1: that whilst the cheatah is ultimately at fault, there are
Speaker 1: things that can drive someone to cheat. So while we
Speaker 1: are evaluating the mistakes that cheats are making, it's also
Speaker 1: important to consider the type mistakes that lead people to
Speaker 1: cheat and whether it maybe you could have done it
Speaker 1: as well. And if you are in a relationship, you
Speaker 1: should be sure to kind of encourage your partner and
Speaker 1: communicate to them that they are good enough and deserving
Speaker 1: of your love. You know, I think your kind of
Speaker 1: role is to provide the security in a relationship. But again,
Speaker 1: not your fault. If someone cheats on you, it's not
Speaker 1: because you didn't love them enough. That's kind of stupid.
Speaker 1: But again I think if someone oversteps your boundary or
Speaker 1: hurts you, like I said, not your fault, I think,
Speaker 1: And in no way does the philosophy of people make
Speaker 1: mistakes mean you should just forgive and forget, especially if
Speaker 1: it's caused lasting damage or you think this person could
Speaker 1: do it again. I think your peace is probably not
Speaker 1: worth staying with them, and maybe it will cause you
Speaker 1: guys to reassess your relationship and communicate better, but that
Speaker 1: might not always be an option. Now, let's introduce some
Speaker 1: social psychology into the mix, which is my favorite. So
Speaker 1: we've looked at by all or evolutionary psychology. We've looked
Speaker 1: at personality in terms of narcissism, and at behavioral psychology.
Speaker 1: But what constitutes cheating and why is it that we
Speaker 1: are so disproving of it? So there are obvious reasons
Speaker 1: we don't like cheating, because it hurts us and it's
Speaker 1: awful and it sucks. But is that reaction only because
Speaker 1: we have been trained to expect monogamy? Is the rejection
Speaker 1: of cheating behaviors something that is culturally ingrained in us.
Speaker 1: I also think people have different conceptions of what cheating is,
Speaker 1: and that's important to set up first. For some, if
Speaker 1: their partner were to spend time with someone else in
Speaker 1: a non sexual way, but you know, for a company,
Speaker 1: that could be you know, something just non sexual, like
Speaker 1: I said, that could be deemed as cheating, whereas for others,
Speaker 1: things like kissing or floating might not be a big
Speaker 1: deal or in context where you know, maybe they go
Speaker 1: and see strippers or they're making out with a friend
Speaker 1: or a friend of the same gender. These things may
Speaker 1: be okay in some relationships and not others. I do
Speaker 1: have kind of a problem with like guys being like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, my girlfriend like kissed another girl, but it's
Speaker 1: not cheating, because they kind of like undervalue especially if
Speaker 1: that woman's bisexual, because they undervalue the sexual urges, Like
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know. I think it's like a
Speaker 1: bit problematic to be like, oh, just because it's like
Speaker 1: between two women, I'm less offended, whereas if it was
Speaker 1: with a man, because I see women as less of
Speaker 1: a threat because I don't actually respect my girlfriend's sexuality anyhow,
Speaker 1: A bit of a segue, But I think that line
Speaker 1: of what you see is cheating or not is highly subjective,
Speaker 1: and it's based on what you decide as a couple.
Speaker 1: I don't think that it's something that you can determine
Speaker 1: by trial and error, like at all, set those boundaries
Speaker 1: and make them clear. But kind of that second part
Speaker 1: we're talking about, is cheating that bad and do our
Speaker 1: reactions to it only come about because of certain social norms?
Speaker 1: So it feels like we've spent the past century making
Speaker 1: a slew of progressive social changes that kind of undermine
Speaker 1: the sanctity of monogamy. I think it's more open and
Speaker 1: more common for couples to talk about the nature of
Speaker 1: their relationship than ever before, and I think we've reached
Speaker 1: a stage where relationships aren't as black and white as
Speaker 1: society has perhaps previously expected them to be. This is
Speaker 1: something really interesting that my friend Carolina, a friend of
Speaker 1: the show, told me. There's this idea in gender psychology
Speaker 1: and in gender studies that monogamy arose because of laws
Speaker 1: around property and the influence of religion. So men wanted
Speaker 1: to ensure that the offspric they were passing their inheritance
Speaker 1: onto were actually theirs, and so cheating became more taboo,
Speaker 1: especially for women, because it would undermine male sexual, emotional, economic,
Speaker 1: and physical authority. Also, as religious teachings made sex more
Speaker 1: conservative and wanted it to become more sacred. This restricted
Speaker 1: sex and intimacy into marriage, and people were shamed for
Speaker 1: breaking that sanctity of one man, one wife and their
Speaker 1: kind of marriage. Ben So, I think the cultural humiliation
Speaker 1: and pressure not to cheat throughout history because of the
Speaker 1: influence of these institutions and influences, has perhaps created the
Speaker 1: feelings we have now around cheating. Obviously it still naturally
Speaker 1: doesn't feel good, but emotions and reactions are, as we know,
Speaker 1: culturally conditioned in many ways from your parents, from your peers,
Speaker 1: from the media. And if history had promoted polyamory and
Speaker 1: multiple sexual partners or no marriage, maybe as a way
Speaker 1: to increase population and keep greater harmony, and that was
Speaker 1: our history, maybe these ideas around cheating, which by the way,
Speaker 1: it still see as pretty fucking apparent, but maybe those
Speaker 1: ideas around cheating would be less negative in the idea
Speaker 1: of sleeping with someone else or having emotional intimacy with
Speaker 1: someone else would be more accepted. I hope that we've
Speaker 1: enjoyed this kind of quick episode on the psychology of cheating.
Speaker 1: I think cheating, you know, as hard as it is,
Speaker 1: is kind of common in our twenties as we're testing
Speaker 1: out our boundaries and how we communicate with partners and
Speaker 1: kind of experiencing sex and intimacy and emotional disclosure for
Speaker 1: the first time. We hear a lot of stories about it.
Speaker 1: Perhaps you've experienced it, so I hope this kind of
Speaker 1: shed some light on why it happens, the reasons around
Speaker 1: why people cheat, but also kind of expresses that I
Speaker 1: don't think it's ever someone's like the person who's been
Speaker 1: cheated on's fault. There are so many theories that explain
Speaker 1: why people are driven to cheat, but so few theories
Speaker 1: that kind of put that blame on the partner. And
Speaker 1: I think especially interesting about this is this idea of
Speaker 1: like that culturally conditioned idea of monogamy, and whether we
Speaker 1: would see cheating as less bad if history had been different,
Speaker 1: if we didn't have the influence of property rights or religion.
Speaker 1: Obviously that's a bit of a fantasy, but just kind
Speaker 1: of something to think about anyhow. Another episode. I also
Speaker 1: just want to quickly say I got my Spotify wrapped
Speaker 1: for my podcast this year and there was just so
Speaker 1: much love you guys. You've all been listening so much
Speaker 1: and I really really appreciate it like a lot. I
Speaker 1: think at one point we were like twenty fourth in
Speaker 1: the charts in Australia, which is like insane considering I
Speaker 1: recall this on my phone in my Cambra bedroom. So
Speaker 1: thank you so much. And if you do like the
Speaker 1: podcasts and you feel called to support it more, please
Speaker 1: let write us a review on Apple Podcasts it really
Speaker 1: helps the community and the show kind of grow, brings
Speaker 1: more people into, bring new ideas, what they want to discuss,
Speaker 1: and hopefully they get something out of it like you have.
Speaker 1: So thanks again for listening. Next week we're talking about
Speaker 1: the psychology of loneliness another sad one, so I hope
Speaker 1: we're all ready for that. Zero