Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,
Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big
Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they
Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello, everybody, Welcome back to the show.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode. This week, it's a fabulous,
Speaker 1: wonderful guest episode with a lovely human. I'm so glad
Speaker 1: to have her on board. Thank you. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: that's so sweet. Um. What's your name? Yeah, yeah, I'm Laura. Hi. Hi. Um, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's so fun to be here. Yeah, how really exciting Laura. Um,
Speaker 1: how do we know each other before we jump into
Speaker 1: we have a mutual friend? Um? Yeah? EJ Yeah, because
Speaker 1: she's on the podcast. J and Jah Yeah they were.
Speaker 1: Yeah they were last time. Yeah, we'll EJ and Jr.
Speaker 1: Are my roommates. Yes, we went out to dinner and
Speaker 1: then we got chatting and here I am. That's how
Speaker 1: it works. If you ever want to come on the podcast,
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna like vaguely approach you after that a
Speaker 1: weird Mexican dinner and be like, Hi, you should come
Speaker 1: on the podcast. That's basically what I did with you.
Speaker 1: Remember Instagram, dudes, because yeah, you said it like at
Speaker 1: dinner when I told you about what I was doing
Speaker 1: at UNI. Yeah, and then I was like, oh, I
Speaker 1: think she I think I might be on the podcast,
Speaker 1: and I was just kind of waiting to see if
Speaker 1: it actually if it actually happened. Yeah, and then you
Speaker 1: messaged me. I was like, so exciting, I've been terms. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I always think to my word, I feel like, once
Speaker 1: i've met someone, I'm like, I love this. I love
Speaker 1: your vibe. And it sounds like I'm like approaching you
Speaker 1: for like a thre vibe. That's really funny, but like
Speaker 1: I love their vibe. They have an interesting story of
Speaker 1: which you do, which you're going to get into very shortly.
Speaker 1: I'm like, here we go, yes, next step, So maybe
Speaker 1: that's worth talking about. Yeah, what I do? Why? Why
Speaker 1: why are you on the show today? What's what's what's
Speaker 1: special special about me? Um? Well, the thing you know
Speaker 1: that made you approach me was my unique degree. So
Speaker 1: I do a degree in forensic moutry. So I don't
Speaker 1: know if for people who don't really know what that means, UM,
Speaker 1: when someone dies, I will perform an autopsy and figure
Speaker 1: out how they died essentially. Yeah. Yeah, So I do
Speaker 1: a medical degree. Yeah, a medical degree. Yeah, that's a
Speaker 1: really great way to put it. Yeah, because it's Bachelor
Speaker 1: of Medical Science in brackets forensic moultry. That's my official title.
Speaker 1: That's okay. One thing that I've wanted to know is
Speaker 1: how many people are in your course because so I
Speaker 1: just quickly say this. The reason also I wanted to
Speaker 1: bring you on this because I'm trialing this new series
Speaker 1: called Unconventional where I get people such as yourself, who
Speaker 1: are doing career paths that I wouldn't say an alternative,
Speaker 1: like it is still a definite, established career path and
Speaker 1: something that's very necessary in society. Yes, something that I
Speaker 1: think most children aren't, like when I grow up, I
Speaker 1: want to be a mortician, Yeah, the same way that
Speaker 1: I want to be a ballerina or I want to
Speaker 1: be a doctor or Yeah. So I was like, this
Speaker 1: is such an interesting an interesting concept to me, and
Speaker 1: you're such an interesting person that you have decided to
Speaker 1: do this, and yeah, So how many other people would
Speaker 1: you say are in the same boat with you? Well,
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure there's eighteen of us currently because I'm
Speaker 1: in my last semester at UNI. So yeah, in two
Speaker 1: weeks I'm that's it. I'm graduated. Yeah, very exciting, very
Speaker 1: nerve wracking, but exciting. But yeah, I think there's eighteen
Speaker 1: of us currently. But I don't think that everyone actually
Speaker 1: will go into the field of forensic Mountree technician. I
Speaker 1: think that a few people want to go on to
Speaker 1: do research and things like that. So it's very small
Speaker 1: compared to my other UNI classes because I have like
Speaker 1: a placement like unit and yeah, there's eighteen of us,
Speaker 1: eighteen people. Yeah, and what do you mean by research
Speaker 1: because you obviously want to be hands on. Yes, um,
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people just want to do it. Um.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's like a stepping stone into other kind of
Speaker 1: medical things. I'm not really sure. We have a lot
Speaker 1: of people from very diverse like areas. I know, like
Speaker 1: someone I used to do it with, UM wanted to
Speaker 1: be a teacher, was a teacher beforehand and has now transitioned.
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of different stories within how people
Speaker 1: end up there because it's definitely not and it's unconventional.
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. I was going to say normal. I was like, no, unconventional,
Speaker 1: that's a very good word. I think it's totally normal.
Speaker 1: Do you think, yeah, what do you think of some
Speaker 1: of the common Sorry we're about to get into serious questions. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I just want like spitballing here, because yeah, this is
Speaker 1: so fascinating. But what do you think of some of
Speaker 1: the reasons people get into this field or why did
Speaker 1: you decide like this is what I want to do
Speaker 1: with my life right now? Yeah? Well, um, I've always
Speaker 1: been really into like science, and I really loved like
Speaker 1: biology that kind of thing at school. And I think
Speaker 1: I used to I always really fucked up my words,
Speaker 1: but yeah, always Really I used to want to be
Speaker 1: a vet because I really like animals. Obviously, you know
Speaker 1: that that's what I do, is my side hustle. At
Speaker 1: the moment, I was looking after dogs exactly. That's carrying
Speaker 1: me through UNI. But I really I ended up doing
Speaker 1: a volunteering work at a vet clinic when I was
Speaker 1: probably about fourteen, and I really liked, like watching the surgeries.
Speaker 1: I thought it was really interesting. The reason that I
Speaker 1: stopped doing that was because when people were crying about
Speaker 1: putting their dogs down, I just wanted to cry with
Speaker 1: them and it was so heartbreaking, and I was like,
Speaker 1: this is not very professional if I cry with every
Speaker 1: single person, So I switched. And then when I was sixteen,
Speaker 1: I was really obsessed with this show called Silent Witness
Speaker 1: on the BBC. I used to watch it every Friday
Speaker 1: with my mum. Yeah, what's it about. It's out a
Speaker 1: forensic anthologist. So yeah, so forensic moultary technician is what
Speaker 1: I will be after this, whereas forensic achologist is kind
Speaker 1: of like the higher the analogy that I made too
Speaker 1: earlier about the nurse versus the surgeon, Yeah, that's so.
Speaker 1: It was about the certain one, the forensic anthologist, and yeah,
Speaker 1: I just thought it was really interesting watching her dissect
Speaker 1: people essentially, And because I've always been interested in medicine,
Speaker 1: I just started googling how to become a forensic anthologist
Speaker 1: and then I found this degree and then since I
Speaker 1: was sixteen, I just kind of stuck with it. I
Speaker 1: just decided, Okay, that's what I'm going to do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I don't really I just kind of I just
Speaker 1: kind of stumbled into it, I guess, and I've just
Speaker 1: stuck with it. But I've really whilst because I've just
Speaker 1: finished my UM, because I'm in my last degree, my
Speaker 1: last degree in my last semester. I've just finished my
Speaker 1: clinical placement period. And the part that I actually found
Speaker 1: that I've really enjoyed about it was feeling like I
Speaker 1: was taking care of people when they couldn't anymore. Oh,
Speaker 1: that's such a beautiful way of putting it. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: there was a couple cases that were quite confronting, and
Speaker 1: or because obviously our job is to find cause of death,
Speaker 1: so you need to know their medical history, their personal history.
Speaker 1: We get a story that comes kind of with them
Speaker 1: from the police about what happened, that kind of thing,
Speaker 1: so that we and the apologist knows what to look for.
Speaker 1: Because the whole point is to be as noninvasive as possible,
Speaker 1: because you don't really want to be, you know, doing
Speaker 1: all these procedures to someone if you don't have to,
Speaker 1: if you could just do a scan, a CT scan
Speaker 1: and find a cause of death. But so some of
Speaker 1: the ones that were more challenging, it felt really nice
Speaker 1: to like after we'd done a procedure, especially sometimes we
Speaker 1: wash their hair. We like we wash the body down,
Speaker 1: you know, we make sure they're really clean, and we
Speaker 1: restore them, like part of the job is restoration. So
Speaker 1: it's it felt really nice to be able to wash
Speaker 1: their hair, brush their hair, and make sure they were
Speaker 1: like taken care of. And I felt even though it
Speaker 1: was a hard thing to do, it made me feel
Speaker 1: like I was helping them in a way when they
Speaker 1: couldn't help themselves anymore. Yeah. Yeah, so I think that's
Speaker 1: actually something that I didn't think about before I went
Speaker 1: on placement, but that that really it made me feel good,
Speaker 1: like I felt like I was doing something so like
Speaker 1: so worthwhile. Yeah, yeah, that is absolutely stunning. I like
Speaker 1: that is such not that there are any wrong answers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what a beautiful answer. And do you think that that
Speaker 1: is like a common motivation like wanting to Obviously you
Speaker 1: came into this being like I'm just fascinated by this.
Speaker 1: I've had this um, you know, fictional hero who does
Speaker 1: this kind of work, and it's brought me into this
Speaker 1: kind of field. And but do you think now that
Speaker 1: you're kind of beginning to work in this profession on
Speaker 1: a professional level, like doing it as almost you're almost
Speaker 1: about to graduate and it's going to become your job. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what do you think some of those really important skills
Speaker 1: or traits are to have if you want to if
Speaker 1: you're considering pursuing this kind of job. Yeah, so everyone.
Speaker 1: Pretty much everyone that I like interacted with whilst I
Speaker 1: was on this placement period, they all we all had
Speaker 1: that same respect, like obviously, you know, it's not a
Speaker 1: normal thing, this job, Like it's not normal to deal
Speaker 1: with dead people every day, and it's very like confronting
Speaker 1: and mentally tiring. But I've never felt more supported in
Speaker 1: a work environment than when I was on that placement
Speaker 1: period because that I remember my lecturers have actually discussed
Speaker 1: this with us before, like when I started kind of
Speaker 1: this year, that it's so important to make those connections
Speaker 1: with your like like your peers and your co workers
Speaker 1: in the future because no one else will understand what
Speaker 1: you're going through than those people. And so it was
Speaker 1: like this beautiful community and everyone shares this respect for
Speaker 1: like how important what we're doing is, and that you know,
Speaker 1: person like whoever they are, someone loved them some they
Speaker 1: were someone's entire world, and it's so important that we
Speaker 1: find out what happened to them, to give that family closure,
Speaker 1: but to also respect them as a person and to
Speaker 1: make sure that they're taken care of. And I felt
Speaker 1: that with everyone that that's a shared kind of belief
Speaker 1: and like the motivation for it yeah, I think that
Speaker 1: answered your question. Honestly, it's really changing my perspective because
Speaker 1: I think when we think of people who deal with
Speaker 1: dead bodies, it can be really strange. Yeah. Would you
Speaker 1: find that's like a reaction a lot of people have. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I I the only kind of two reactions I get
Speaker 1: when people ask what I do, which comes up all
Speaker 1: the time. I feel like I talk about my degree
Speaker 1: all the time, because you know, you go to the
Speaker 1: hairdress and they ask you what you're up to, and
Speaker 1: I go, oh, I'm at UNI, and they go, oh,
Speaker 1: what do you do at UNI? And then I have
Speaker 1: to go I cut up dead people? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: like oh I stuff on the internet? Yeah, um yeah.
Speaker 1: I either get like, oh my god, wow, that's so cool.
Speaker 1: I love ncis like the amount of people that are like,
Speaker 1: oh I used to love criminal minds um and or
Speaker 1: I've had a couple of people who kind of go
Speaker 1: oh and they give me like this weird look, like
Speaker 1: oh okay, that makes and someone even told me once
Speaker 1: that oh that makes me feel a little uncomfortable and Okay,
Speaker 1: why someone has to do it? Yeah, exactly, And I
Speaker 1: think that, honestly, I was actually talking about this with
Speaker 1: one of my arm supervisors I had on placement that
Speaker 1: this I feel like a lot of it is because
Speaker 1: you know, like you watch movies and TV shows and
Speaker 1: that and a lot of the time like the morticians
Speaker 1: and that they're painted is like this kind of like creeps.
Speaker 1: Like I was gonna say that that's obviously I met you.
Speaker 1: I really like you, Like, yeah, I get along very well.
Speaker 1: You're a lovely human. Wish you see how lovely off
Speaker 1: the microphone? Thank you. But I think my perspective is
Speaker 1: like exactly that before I met you, as like these
Speaker 1: people are like strange ye like middle aged. Then you're
Speaker 1: all balled for some reason. Yeah, in my mind, I
Speaker 1: always think of this is going to be such a
Speaker 1: weird comparison. But if you've ever seen did you watch Riverdale?
Speaker 1: No I didn't. I did it, and you know what,
Speaker 1: I'm glad I did. Now. I like seeing it on
Speaker 1: TikTok all the time and I'm like, it's so bad,
Speaker 1: But I like. It came out in high school when
Speaker 1: I was like fifteen, so I was the target demographic.
Speaker 1: And there's my god, people think I'm so weird. But
Speaker 1: there's this guy on it who's the mortician. And he's
Speaker 1: like called doctor Kurtle or something, and he's the creepiest dude.
Speaker 1: They paid him as like this absolute creep and he's
Speaker 1: always just like he's like taking bribes and stuff and
Speaker 1: just being all like they always film him like he's
Speaker 1: just like eerie, and I hate it because then people
Speaker 1: watch that and then like, yeah, do you think that's
Speaker 1: some of the stigma that comes along with it. I
Speaker 1: think so, I'd like, yeah, like people who work with
Speaker 1: dead people, like people like funeral directors, that people always
Speaker 1: see them as like like what that it's weird. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's because they're like, well, what's wrong with you? Why
Speaker 1: do you want to work with dead people? Yeah? Yeah,
Speaker 1: but but here we are, Yeah we are. Yeah. But
Speaker 1: I do think that that definitely is something that the
Speaker 1: more that I get into it, the more I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I wish that that wasn't a thing, because it is
Speaker 1: like everyone there like just wants to take care of
Speaker 1: the people and like it, like you said, like it's
Speaker 1: someone has to do this job. Yeah, And I like, personally,
Speaker 1: I find it very interesting because I like the science
Speaker 1: of it, Like I I have such a passion for
Speaker 1: like anatomy of the human body, because I think it's
Speaker 1: so interesting the way that we like like born and
Speaker 1: then keep living and just the way that our bodies
Speaker 1: keep us alive all the time, like your organ systems
Speaker 1: and that. I just think it's so interesting. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that's what I love about it. But then it's also
Speaker 1: the added bit of like being able to take care
Speaker 1: of those people. Yeah, you know, that's kind of my
Speaker 1: thing about it. And you would say that's like the
Speaker 1: best part of your job. Yeah, yeah, I would think so. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I think as well because like I was only
Speaker 1: on placement for two weeks, but I felt like everyone
Speaker 1: was so friendly and close to each other, because it
Speaker 1: is an experience that only a very few amount of
Speaker 1: people are going to understand. Yeah, because especially the field
Speaker 1: is really small as well, and you know, it's not
Speaker 1: something that most people can relate to. So it felt
Speaker 1: it was like a real kind of community, nice environment,
Speaker 1: and that was really nice as well. Yeah, because I
Speaker 1: can imagine, and please correct me if I'm wrong, like
Speaker 1: the levels of burnout would be pretty high. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think we do get there is a quite high dropout
Speaker 1: rate in this degree as well. I think just because
Speaker 1: obviously some people really don't it's not for them. It's
Speaker 1: not definitely not for everyone this kind of job, but yeah,
Speaker 1: there's definitely obviously some people dying in incredibly traumatic ways,
Speaker 1: and or even if they're not traumatic, if it's mirrors
Speaker 1: something that's happened in your life, it can be quite
Speaker 1: like triggering. So yeah, there is definitely times where people
Speaker 1: who work in that field are going to freak out
Speaker 1: and not be able to cope with it. But like,
Speaker 1: I think that's why that community is so important. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that kind of leads to my second question. Second question,
Speaker 1: next question. I feel like we've already touched on many things.
Speaker 1: I know I've already asked you so many questions. But
Speaker 1: what do you think is the hardest part of this?
Speaker 1: But other than you know, the stigmament you said being triggered, Yeah,
Speaker 1: like your own experiences, which is unavoidable I think in
Speaker 1: many professions. Yeah, but what is really what he thinks
Speaker 1: the hardest partum it sounds I don't think that for me,
Speaker 1: the mental toll is the hardest part. I think mine
Speaker 1: is like the physical nature is that it's quite it's
Speaker 1: it's a very physically intensive job and you're on your
Speaker 1: feet all day. I think that's I know that's quite
Speaker 1: a boring answer, but but it's. Yeah, it's just quite
Speaker 1: physically intensive. And that's actually I was thinking about this
Speaker 1: the other day that along with the stigma thing, it's
Speaker 1: like it is a hard job obviously, both emotionally, but
Speaker 1: also physically as well. It's very like labor intensive. You're
Speaker 1: on your feet all the time. You know, people are heavy,
Speaker 1: you have to lift things, you know, like because you know,
Speaker 1: moving bodies around, that kind of thing, Like it's they're heavy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so people, you know, it's it's hard, both emotionally
Speaker 1: and physically. And so if people didn't like what am
Speaker 1: I trying to say here, that if people weren't so
Speaker 1: passionate about it, they wouldn't do it. It's not just
Speaker 1: a job that you fall into because it's easy. It's
Speaker 1: you need to be passionate to want to do that job.
Speaker 1: You need to care about going to work every day.
Speaker 1: Yeah that you know, that's the important you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? Yeah, absolutely, And I feel like that is
Speaker 1: the same with a lot of jobs, but particularly in
Speaker 1: your profession. I think most of us don't like to
Speaker 1: think about death, yeah, which is a very very human
Speaker 1: animal reaction, Like even before we were recording this episode,
Speaker 1: we were having this massive chat about loss and grief
Speaker 1: and death and how difficult that is. And do you
Speaker 1: think that in that in any way that working so
Speaker 1: close to those who are no longer alive has impacted
Speaker 1: you when it comes to other things that have happened
Speaker 1: in your life. I think that, Yeah, it definitely, like
Speaker 1: I was telling you before this when we were talking
Speaker 1: about our loss and everything, that yeah, I have. I've
Speaker 1: personally lost a few people in my life, and it
Speaker 1: actually it kind of motivated me to push harder in
Speaker 1: this degree because I think especially during COVID, you know,
Speaker 1: everyone at UNI with I think was struggling with everything
Speaker 1: being online, but I really was d of struggling to
Speaker 1: feel motivated to do it. But I think having those
Speaker 1: my personal experiences, it made me want to help the
Speaker 1: families of these people more because I've been on the
Speaker 1: side of that. You know, I know how traumatic it
Speaker 1: is when you lose someone so like especially unexpectedly, So
Speaker 1: I think that kind of fueled me to want to
Speaker 1: do it more because that means that now I can
Speaker 1: be a part of finding out what happened to their
Speaker 1: loved one and being able to tell them like what
Speaker 1: actually happened and yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I think it.
Speaker 1: It kind of the being around the dead people all
Speaker 1: the time. I think it actually in a way, it
Speaker 1: has made me like more compassionate and more like just
Speaker 1: more aware because obviously, you know, I am, like you're
Speaker 1: around death or day and it makes you really apprec
Speaker 1: It kind of just made me really appreciate like being
Speaker 1: alive and yeah, and just being more gentle around people
Speaker 1: as well, because I have no idea you know, who
Speaker 1: they've lost or or even like sometimes now I see
Speaker 1: because I've seen so many different people come through that
Speaker 1: I sometimes see people on the street and I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh wow, like they remind me of this person, and
Speaker 1: like it makes me want to be nicer because when
Speaker 1: we get these people and we see like their life story,
Speaker 1: and it just makes me be like, I have no
Speaker 1: idea what's going on with anyone else, because that's this
Speaker 1: sad life that someone has lived and now I get
Speaker 1: to take care of them. But like when I'm out
Speaker 1: around living people, it just makes me feel so much
Speaker 1: more compassion because I really have no idea what they
Speaker 1: could be going through kind of thing. Yeah, it feels
Speaker 1: like it's given like you're able to give a gift
Speaker 1: to others in terms of closure. Yeah, exactly, which is
Speaker 1: honestly like one of the best things. Yeah, you can
Speaker 1: hope for if you've lost someone unexpectedly exactly or in
Speaker 1: really tragic circumstances. Yeah, it's just being given a gift
Speaker 1: of closure. But it's also given you, like a much
Speaker 1: stronger a gift of empathy. Yeah. And I would say
Speaker 1: you're already an incredibly passionate person, So thank you. But
Speaker 1: is it um, I just want to touch on that
Speaker 1: part that just one thing that you said to me
Speaker 1: that I was like, wow, that's really interesting when you
Speaker 1: see people on the street, Yeah, who look like people
Speaker 1: that you've seen it at their like most vulnerable end
Speaker 1: of life state. It is it strange like or is
Speaker 1: it more or is it just that singular reaction of
Speaker 1: like because I because you, I can relate to it,
Speaker 1: because you rehind me of someone I want to treat
Speaker 1: you better. It can it be like kind of an
Speaker 1: emotional reaction? Yeah? Sometimes I think it definitely can be,
Speaker 1: especially if someone looks quite similar. And obviously I was
Speaker 1: on the un placement for two weeks, so I feel
Speaker 1: like when you work there, obviously you're more going to happen,
Speaker 1: but sometimes reading people's stories, Yeah, like you might feel
Speaker 1: more connected with someone because you look at their story
Speaker 1: and you're like, oh wow, Like that's similar to me.
Speaker 1: And I think then if you saw someone who looked
Speaker 1: like them in public, then that would be more of
Speaker 1: an emotional thing. But I also think that, um, a
Speaker 1: lot of it is like you get quite desensitized too
Speaker 1: that because you kind of have to, because if you
Speaker 1: go in and you're like so sad about death every day,
Speaker 1: you're not going to be able to do the job. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and like and like ultimately like I'm you know, I'm
Speaker 1: there to do this job as best I can and
Speaker 1: make sure that these people are looked after, So I
Speaker 1: kind of you kind of need to leave that, um
Speaker 1: and yeah, and yeah, there's a you really have to
Speaker 1: be quite mentally strong to be able to separate your
Speaker 1: work from your home life and not take work home
Speaker 1: with you. But yeah, I definitely like sometimes I yeah,
Speaker 1: you would see people and I'm like, wow, yeah, you
Speaker 1: look just like this personal. Yeah, what cases do you
Speaker 1: think are the hardest. Do you think it's people who
Speaker 1: were our age who are young or Yeah, I don't. Um, yeah, obviously, yeah,
Speaker 1: children is always a hard one. Yeah, um, but I
Speaker 1: find more the stories, yeah are the harder ones. Um,
Speaker 1: when it's you read one that someone had no family
Speaker 1: or something or that they were alone, Like that is
Speaker 1: a hard one, um more than like yeah, like it's
Speaker 1: it's very like determined on like the case. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: there's yeah, it's definitely yeah, children, children is a hard one.
Speaker 1: I even find sometimes just um, like elderly people because
Speaker 1: obviously we live in an aging yeah, like aging population.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it is, it is. There's Yeah, it makes
Speaker 1: you realize there's a lot of old people that, um,
Speaker 1: especially like die alone, which is very I find that sad. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's one of my biggest fears. Yeah, I honestly because
Speaker 1: like this is a kind of a tandard. But sometimes
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, I want to like, um, you know,
Speaker 1: be alone forever and like just marry and be single
Speaker 1: and just like live a great life, a childless life,
Speaker 1: Like yeah, I just get a travel and then I'm
Speaker 1: like the flip side of that is like what if
Speaker 1: I end up dead and no one finds me? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Weeks Yeah, yeah, those are always because you do read
Speaker 1: about stories like that where like neighbors called because of
Speaker 1: you know, as flies on the windows there's a smell
Speaker 1: and that Yeah, which is so? Which is which is sad? Sad?
Speaker 1: It's like the other one. I read this really sad
Speaker 1: story today about this guy who was found in Wa
Speaker 1: kind of related, not really, but um Wa for those
Speaker 1: American listeners is a state in Australia and they he
Speaker 1: was what's it called not a motorbike rider mountain bike
Speaker 1: round and he had been missing for like ten days
Speaker 1: or something, and no one knew who he no one
Speaker 1: who noticed that he was missing, and he got into
Speaker 1: like a really bad accident while he was mountain bike
Speaker 1: riding and some woman with her dog like found him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I was like, that is really really sad that
Speaker 1: there is no one to notice the absence exactly. Yeah, like,
Speaker 1: no one to notice your absence because your presence, yeah exactly.
Speaker 1: Wasn't that felt? And I'm sure his press was felt
Speaker 1: in ways that yeah, we might not even know, yeah,
Speaker 1: but I can definitely say why that would be very
Speaker 1: very difficult. Yeah, yeah, definitely. There's been ones whilst I
Speaker 1: was on a two week placement that we would read
Speaker 1: and it's like because that you tend to chat about
Speaker 1: them a lot as well, because, like I said, like
Speaker 1: that community, no one else understands what you're going through,
Speaker 1: so we tend to there's a lot of talk about like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: that's sad, and we all read the story and we
Speaker 1: that's really nice. Yeah, there's a lot of conversation about it.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I remember there was one um where we
Speaker 1: will so sad because yeah, no one, no family, like
Speaker 1: they'd been left for a while, and then that's it is.
Speaker 1: It's hard because it's like that's it's that's sad that
Speaker 1: there was no one, yeah, to realize that you were missing,
Speaker 1: or no one checking up on you. Yeah. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: do you feel like I feel like that would almost
Speaker 1: make what you were saying better, whereabout you're able to
Speaker 1: give them that like exactly, Yeah, my god, I can
Speaker 1: hear the noise that because that something's hard. Sorry if
Speaker 1: you guys can hear that. But but someone's having a
Speaker 1: little party in the street, go off, we're wrong about death.
Speaker 1: They're living life. Duality of man. Duality of man. Okay,
Speaker 1: So we had a little bit of a distraction because
Speaker 1: there were people walking up and down the street having
Speaker 1: an amazing time but I guess that actually really links
Speaker 1: to what I want to talk about next. And we
Speaker 1: have kind of touched on this before, But how do
Speaker 1: you think this work has changed your perceptions around death
Speaker 1: and what a good death is? Yeah? Um, I obviously
Speaker 1: I think that a lot of people would think that
Speaker 1: there's probably no good way to die, because obviously it's
Speaker 1: a it's not a good thing. But I think it
Speaker 1: has just made me appreciate being like alive more. I
Speaker 1: think I said that before, but um, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's it's hard to like say what a good death
Speaker 1: is because like you can never really that's it's the
Speaker 1: one thing that you can't really control. I mean actually
Speaker 1: likes some people in terms of yes, like with suicides
Speaker 1: and that, But yeah, I don't. I don't think there's
Speaker 1: really a good time ever to die. But I like
Speaker 1: what we were talking about before of not being alone,
Speaker 1: like I would just not That's what I wouldn't like.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't enjoy being left, if that makes sense. But
Speaker 1: then again, that's why I think I feel like this
Speaker 1: job is really important, is that then we can help. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, do you find that this job makes you
Speaker 1: think more about death? Um? I do think actually, yeah,
Speaker 1: because I think then in terms of however that person
Speaker 1: has died, whether it be you know, an accident or
Speaker 1: a medical thing. I was saying to you before, I've
Speaker 1: never felt like I wanted to be healthier in my
Speaker 1: life because obviously, you know, obesity and that is a
Speaker 1: big problem within modern like the modern world. And wow,
Speaker 1: I have never wanted Yeah, well, because even if someone
Speaker 1: looks relatively healthy on the outside, sometimes I don't know
Speaker 1: if you've ever heard of the phrase, like I think
Speaker 1: someone said it when I was in high school, but
Speaker 1: like skinny fat where it's like skinny on the outside
Speaker 1: but fat on the inside. What does that mean? So
Speaker 1: like when you have like not sometimes a poor diet,
Speaker 1: but like your organs can develop. This is just like
Speaker 1: a medical lesson. Yeah, they develop, You develop more fat
Speaker 1: around your organs. So even if you look relatively healthy
Speaker 1: in quotations on the outside, your organs can be quite unhealthy. Yea,
Speaker 1: and yeah, and so sometimes now I think I'm like, wow,
Speaker 1: they when someone I know is quite thin, or like
Speaker 1: you see someone who's quite thin but maybe they don't
Speaker 1: eat well, I'm like they could still be really unhealthy,
Speaker 1: really unhealthy on the inside, and it's yeah, because I
Speaker 1: don't think about that with myself a lot. Like I
Speaker 1: think that I you know, I would I relatively healthy
Speaker 1: and you know, I like I do my exercise, but like, wow,
Speaker 1: maybe my organs don't look great. That's so weird because
Speaker 1: you would see them, you would see like what it
Speaker 1: looks like. Well, and that's the other thing as well,
Speaker 1: with like I was talking about this with the other people,
Speaker 1: I want on placement with that now. Sometimes I see
Speaker 1: people and I'm like, I bet I know what your
Speaker 1: organs look like. Really, yeah, because hopefully my organs are
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm sure your organs would beautiful. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much. You I exercise, I promise, Yeah, I had
Speaker 1: some strawberries for lunch. Yes. What's the weirdest organ do
Speaker 1: you think? Like that you when you're doing your examinations,
Speaker 1: is the one that you're like, oh, yeah, I can't
Speaker 1: wait to get to the brain, or like oh dang,
Speaker 1: I'm going to remove the pancreas, or like look at
Speaker 1: the pancreas or um. I don't think there's one that
Speaker 1: I like, well, they get excited. I do like to
Speaker 1: look at people's hearts because of your heart, I think
Speaker 1: heart health tells you a lot about overall health because
Speaker 1: obviously it's a very important organ. Um. So I do
Speaker 1: think it's really interesting to see people's hearts because even
Speaker 1: some people who are quite small, Ye, your heart weight
Speaker 1: is supposed to be like roughly, I can't remember the percentage,
Speaker 1: but it's supposed to be a person like a specific
Speaker 1: percentage of your overall body weight to be healthy. And
Speaker 1: some people's hearts are just absolutely massive and I wouldn't
Speaker 1: even think to control that or like that. Health. Yeah,
Speaker 1: heart health is about um not like sometimes diet, but
Speaker 1: mostly exercise, because your heart is a muscle. So the
Speaker 1: more that you work that muscle, yeah, the bigger bigger. Yet, yeah,
Speaker 1: because I think it's I'm not, I'm not the best
Speaker 1: at it, but so well, like I know that your
Speaker 1: diet can affect like your heart and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: I'm I haven't done my medical degree yet. I'm not
Speaker 1: I'm not a doctor yet, but yeah, yeah, but you
Speaker 1: know more than most of us. But yeah, so, like
Speaker 1: it's kind of crazy seeing some people. If you who
Speaker 1: on the outside, you wouldn't think that their organs with
Speaker 1: that unhealthy, but then you open them up and oh,
Speaker 1: my god, wow, look look how big that organ is,
Speaker 1: or look how big their liveries. Look how big their
Speaker 1: heart is. So I do enjoy the heart to see that,
Speaker 1: because that's quite indicative. But I do always just as
Speaker 1: well when you first see the organs. It's always very
Speaker 1: interesting because sometimes it's not what you're expected to see
Speaker 1: at all. It's just like, whoa, they looked quite healthy.
Speaker 1: This is not what I expected, So that's quite interesting.
Speaker 1: But obviously the grossest part is the bowels because oh
Speaker 1: my god, yuck. Wait, explain is that? Tm I? But
Speaker 1: can you explain that more? Like I thought, maybe this
Speaker 1: is my like plep knowledge. When people die, like all
Speaker 1: the in like unprocessed food just gets exerted. Yeah. No, um,
Speaker 1: sometimes sometimes people do, like I guess, like pee themselves
Speaker 1: put themselves when they die because of that release of muscles.
Speaker 1: But a lot of times you still get it quite
Speaker 1: like because obviously your intestines is quite a long pathway.
Speaker 1: So if it's like somewhere in there that's not close
Speaker 1: to the end, we just have to like scoop it out. Well. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you try to kind of keep the bowel intact because
Speaker 1: it doesn't smell very nice. Because it's a bowl, but
Speaker 1: sometimes it bursts or it will come out, and yeah,
Speaker 1: you just kind of you wear a hell of a
Speaker 1: lot of ppe like yeah, yeah, personal protective equipment there.
Speaker 1: I wear like seven layers whilst you're I don't even
Speaker 1: think three pairs of gloves, like you're really kitted up,
Speaker 1: because it's and that's just to protect us, because if
Speaker 1: you know, we get everyone from all walks of life.
Speaker 1: They could have anything like I don't want to I
Speaker 1: want to protect myself if they have a disease, or
Speaker 1: just like you just don't really want to get someone
Speaker 1: else's fluid on you because that's just not pleasant. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you just kind of you just deal with it.
Speaker 1: You It's very much like if anyone's a nurse, they
Speaker 1: would totally get a Nurses get very desensitized to poop
Speaker 1: because that's just part of the job. And it's same
Speaker 1: with this. You just you get used to it. That's crazy,
Speaker 1: because that's a whole different world to the work I do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: someone was pooping on my table all the time. I'd
Speaker 1: be like, what the fuck, why is my office friend
Speaker 1: sitting everywhere? Like what? Okay, this kind of is kind
Speaker 1: of off topic, but I just want to ask really quick,
Speaker 1: what's like the biggest if you told someone about your job, Like,
Speaker 1: what do you think is a fact or something that
Speaker 1: would surprise someone the most about your job? Um? I
Speaker 1: think the one that I think shocks people is the
Speaker 1: amount of people that we get in every day, the
Speaker 1: amount of admissions we have every day. Because obviously everyone
Speaker 1: knows that people die all the time, but even me,
Speaker 1: when I first started my first day of placement, I
Speaker 1: was like, WHOA, that's a lot of people. M yeah,
Speaker 1: because you get you get like I mean, there's not
Speaker 1: a set number obviously because it's not an exact science,
Speaker 1: but yeah, like it's it's a it's a lot um
Speaker 1: and you just don't really think about how many people
Speaker 1: are dying all the time. And so I think that's
Speaker 1: I remember telling my mom about it and she would
Speaker 1: ask like, oh, how many people do have it in today?
Speaker 1: And I'd be like, oh, like nine and she was like,
Speaker 1: whoa nine overnight? I was like, yeah, that nine people? Yeah,
Speaker 1: and how what's the average for it? Would you have
Speaker 1: like an average on a weekly basis, but you obviously
Speaker 1: don't serve the entire no. Yeah, so there's because there's
Speaker 1: three facilities. Does everyone who die have to go through No,
Speaker 1: there's a there's a set of legislation. Um, that's the
Speaker 1: Coroner's Act of two thousand and nine. I'm pretty sure
Speaker 1: it is, like, God, she's done last exam, my lecture
Speaker 1: is listening to this and I got that wrong. Please
Speaker 1: don't yell at me. I'm pretty sure it was Coroner's
Speaker 1: Active thousand and nine. Um. But yeah, there's a list
Speaker 1: of like reasons why someone would be admitted. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: because normally someone dies and then if it was essentially
Speaker 1: if it was not I if it wasn't expected for
Speaker 1: that person, if they weren't supposed to die, or if
Speaker 1: they were going in for a routine operation and then
Speaker 1: died that they shouldn't that shouldn't have been the outcome.
Speaker 1: That they'll get sent to us. If they're in hospital,
Speaker 1: or if they're in a government facility of any kind
Speaker 1: like hospitals, if they're in custody, if they're in mental
Speaker 1: institutions like anything like that, if they under the care
Speaker 1: of any government agency, then they get sent to us,
Speaker 1: even if they know of what happened. Yeah. Interesting, Yeah,
Speaker 1: because I thought you were about to say the opposite,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I'm sorry, if someone died in custody,
Speaker 1: I feel like I would want exmination. Yeah, what happened there? No, no, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: they all get sent um. Yeah. And it's so it's
Speaker 1: only really like if because normally someone dies, they'll call
Speaker 1: up the police, will call up their doctor and be like,
Speaker 1: will you sign off on this death certificate? You know,
Speaker 1: do you think that they do? You think that they
Speaker 1: this was what you expected for them? And a lot
Speaker 1: of the time doctors will just say yeah, if they've
Speaker 1: had you know, if they've had terminal cancer for four
Speaker 1: years or something, they're going to be like, yeah, I'll
Speaker 1: sign off on that that was expected. Or if they're
Speaker 1: ninety five and they've got this host of health problems, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll sign off on that. But I'm pretty sure the
Speaker 1: doctors can also part of the currents actors. If you
Speaker 1: don't report, because they're called like reportable deaths, that's what
Speaker 1: the legislation is under, and if you don't report that
Speaker 1: as a doctor, you can get in quite significant trouble.
Speaker 1: So a lot of time we do get bodies in
Speaker 1: where you'll look at the history and they've got this
Speaker 1: massive long health history and they've been in hospital for
Speaker 1: two years or something, and you're like, why are they
Speaker 1: here because I just progresses the progress for the family,
Speaker 1: Like that body, you've just been sent straight to the
Speaker 1: funeral home. They could have their funeral. Yeah, but it's
Speaker 1: a bit unnecessary, like unnecessary grief exactly. But they tend
Speaker 1: to err on the side of caution just because they
Speaker 1: don't want to lose their medical license. But yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: so yeah, there's definitely something you get in that don't
Speaker 1: need to be there. But not not every single person
Speaker 1: who dies will be sent us. Okay, that is really surprising. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there we go. We're learning more and we've talked about
Speaker 1: how it's changed your perspectives on death. But something you
Speaker 1: said to me that really stuck with me when we
Speaker 1: were chatting before we started recording. Yes you could die tomorrow. Yeah,
Speaker 1: m So, how has it impacted like how you live
Speaker 1: your life now? Obviously you want to be healthier, a
Speaker 1: lot more present at more present to every moment and
Speaker 1: being like, oh wow, life is really amazing. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: is there anything else that it's really impacted on for you? Um,
Speaker 1: I think it's it's yeah, it's a hard question because
Speaker 1: I think I've already already as a person with my
Speaker 1: own experience, as I've been very much like not taking
Speaker 1: life for granted, Like I'm very much like a live
Speaker 1: in the moment kind of person. But yeah, I do
Speaker 1: think it, Yeah, I really, I just think that it
Speaker 1: just makes me appreciate life more. I'm not sure if
Speaker 1: there's really anything else that it's affected in me as
Speaker 1: a person besides like the compassion, like just more that
Speaker 1: kind of thing. Yeah, but maybe that's something you'll see,
Speaker 1: is you get more into it, Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Like
Speaker 1: I like, I've only had this very limited kind of
Speaker 1: experience because obviously, like I've done I've done a three
Speaker 1: year Unied degree, um so I've like known what it
Speaker 1: was about. But obviously actually experiencing that every day for
Speaker 1: two weeks is yeah a lot more. Yeah, But yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't. It's hard to think of anything
Speaker 1: off the top of head. I think I might just
Speaker 1: it might be something that comes more with time. And
Speaker 1: is it a job that you see yourself doing for
Speaker 1: the rest of your life. We talked about this before. Yeah,
Speaker 1: let's examine that a bit more. Um I it is
Speaker 1: incredibly like exhausting both mentally and I mean, I find
Speaker 1: it more physically is at that mentally, but um, I've
Speaker 1: been told by my lectures before that I am just
Speaker 1: a little bit strange in that. Um, nothing really grosses
Speaker 1: me out. Really, Like even when I was on placement,
Speaker 1: there was some cases where the experience technicians were like,
Speaker 1: that's gross and I was like, it doesn't really bother me. Um,
Speaker 1: But definitely like the physical exhaustion and because that, you know,
Speaker 1: it makes me have this more appreciation for life. It's like,
Speaker 1: do I want to be spending my life working all
Speaker 1: the time because it's very because it's very it's long hours,
Speaker 1: because you know, people are dying all the time, and
Speaker 1: there's never any there's there's never any stop to that.
Speaker 1: There's always going to be people dying. And so if
Speaker 1: you you know, we have the weekend off and then
Speaker 1: you come back on Monday, and it's just massive, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, and I think that's I don't know if
Speaker 1: I could see myself doing it for the rest of
Speaker 1: my life. Like I love it, I really really enjoy it.
Speaker 1: But then again, and it's very much like, um, a
Speaker 1: job where it's like that's the job. There's not really
Speaker 1: much more that you can't really progress up in the
Speaker 1: fields unless you do like further study, so like once
Speaker 1: you start, like that's that. Yeah, you know, it's like
Speaker 1: a typical job where it's like maybe not a typical job,
Speaker 1: but like some jobs where you can prepos think about
Speaker 1: a lot of our friends work corporate jobs. Yea for
Speaker 1: the public service, and there's very clear from martial pathways
Speaker 1: and like areas to excel and I have more responsibility.
Speaker 1: But I guess when you have all the responsibility you
Speaker 1: need when you're like when you're starting, yeah exactly, Like yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like, well, what I start working, I'll be twenty
Speaker 1: two and then why I'm going to do that until
Speaker 1: I'm like sixty. Yeah, like that's along. So I don't
Speaker 1: I don't know really if I'll do it for it,
Speaker 1: but I like, I do enjoy it, and I definitely
Speaker 1: want to pursue it more, and I do I like
Speaker 1: the medical field. I think I don't think that I would, Oh,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't want to say that I wouldn't
Speaker 1: do anything outside of the medical field because I do
Speaker 1: enjoy my animals side thing, yeah exactly, And I would
Speaker 1: never want to like fully be like, yeah, I won't
Speaker 1: do anything else but I do definitely I see myself
Speaker 1: working in it, and I think the placement definitely made
Speaker 1: me more confident in that because, like the super my
Speaker 1: supervisor was so supportive and they really helped me just
Speaker 1: feel more confident in myself and that little self doubt
Speaker 1: that I had that maybe I wasn't like skilled enough
Speaker 1: to do this job or it just wasn't for me
Speaker 1: like that, they really helped to reassure that. And so
Speaker 1: I definitely see myself like working there for at least
Speaker 1: some period of my life. Yeah. Yeah, that's good to hear. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So one of the last couple of questions I really
Speaker 1: want to ask you is we've talked about how it
Speaker 1: can be rough, how it can be physically and mentally training,
Speaker 1: but there's obviously a lot of rewards. What kind of
Speaker 1: what do you do to unwine you know, obviously seeing
Speaker 1: dead bodies all the time and being exposed to death
Speaker 1: can be quite overwhelming. Like what kind of supports you
Speaker 1: in your personal life to be able to do that
Speaker 1: day and day out when you begin working. I have
Speaker 1: a really kind of strong network of well, like I
Speaker 1: have a small amount of very close people in my life. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like my my roommates and my mom and my partner
Speaker 1: like all, like I can talk to them about that
Speaker 1: and if I, yeah, I tell them about what I've
Speaker 1: what I've been through, and like, obviously I can't tell
Speaker 1: them a lot of specifics for legal reasons because of
Speaker 1: confidentiality in that, but it's good to be able to
Speaker 1: tell them at least if I've had a month day
Speaker 1: and those and those people are very important to my
Speaker 1: life and that if I tell them that I've had
Speaker 1: a bad day, they will be there for me. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I also have quite a strong like rewind kind
Speaker 1: of I've really enjoy me time. I'm a very me
Speaker 1: time person at the end of the day. And I
Speaker 1: was telling you before, you know, I do my yoga.
Speaker 1: I have like a pretty strong when I'm in a routine.
Speaker 1: I have a pretty strong like exercise kind of routine,
Speaker 1: like I keep myself like and the yoga for me
Speaker 1: is really nice. Like I put on my meditation music
Speaker 1: and I just kind of step out of my head
Speaker 1: for a sec. And I think that's really important for
Speaker 1: me to unwind. Yeah, I think that's kind of the
Speaker 1: main thing. So like the yeah, the connections that I
Speaker 1: have with my friends and family. Yeah, and so yeah,
Speaker 1: exactly which I think is in anything is really important.
Speaker 1: But again that community actually in the workplace and being
Speaker 1: able to talk to everyone. And actually whilst at UNI,
Speaker 1: I've it's been really like drawled into us, like to
Speaker 1: make sure you're okay. We had a whole lecture series
Speaker 1: one time about your mental health and making sure you're okay,
Speaker 1: And we have to do these reflections as assignments, which
Speaker 1: is essentially just how do I feel. Yeah, our lecture
Speaker 1: is being like are you okay? Because even when I
Speaker 1: wrote a reflection earlier this year, I talked about some
Speaker 1: of my personal experiences and how that was making me
Speaker 1: nervous to go on placement and continue in this career.
Speaker 1: But and then my lecture actually reached out to me
Speaker 1: and was like, please come and talk to me about this,
Speaker 1: and then we arranged have this like one on one
Speaker 1: meeting and we like we talked it out with her
Speaker 1: and she was really lovely about it. So it's it's
Speaker 1: been really good support from the Union. But then again
Speaker 1: in my personal life, but I think that's because I
Speaker 1: spend a lot of time like explaining to my family
Speaker 1: and friends, like what exactly I'm doing kind of things
Speaker 1: so they understand it on a deeper level. Like my
Speaker 1: partner knows everything about anatomy, like go off, he watches
Speaker 1: all my life stuff. Yeah yeah, so yeah that's really good.
Speaker 1: And I think final question, you know, the whole kind
Speaker 1: of theme of this is like this is unconventional. Yes, right, yes,
Speaker 1: you're doing something that is so important to society I
Speaker 1: think is really overlooked. Yeah, like when it gets down
Speaker 1: to it, like I think that was half my surprise
Speaker 1: when you told me, like I'm you know, I'm a
Speaker 1: mortician and all, yeah, what is the forensic technician? Forensic
Speaker 1: moutary technician. And I guess if there's someone listening, maybe
Speaker 1: they found this episode because like I actually want to
Speaker 1: do this. Yeah, maybe they watched the same BBC series
Speaker 1: as Yeah. Interesting. What would be like your one piece
Speaker 1: of advice? Um, I definitely think to expose yourself because
Speaker 1: on YouTube actually because it's educational, there is numerous videos
Speaker 1: of autopsies. What. Yeah, that's how I started watching them
Speaker 1: in high school, Like I had a favorite autopsy in
Speaker 1: high school because you can, like you can. It's the
Speaker 1: same way that if you've ever seen like berthing videos
Speaker 1: are on YouTube. Yeah, yeah, because it's educational, so it's
Speaker 1: not it's not it's not gory. Yeah, well, I mean
Speaker 1: it exactly, it's like a medical procedure. Yeah. Um, So
Speaker 1: definitely expose yourself to those things because the times that
Speaker 1: I was feeling doubts was during lockdown, when I couldn't
Speaker 1: have any of my classes online and I wasn't going
Speaker 1: into my like anatomy labs where we had you know,
Speaker 1: the Audebaric specimens and that kind of thing, and that
Speaker 1: was when I was like, do I really want to
Speaker 1: be doing this? And it wasn't until then I was
Speaker 1: more in person again and started actually being exposed to
Speaker 1: like the bodies that I like, really reignited my passion
Speaker 1: because I love, like, I'm very interested in the anatomy
Speaker 1: and like the science of it all. So I would
Speaker 1: definitely say that, but um, also just making sure that
Speaker 1: like it's not going to be too much yeah for you,
Speaker 1: because that's like I said earlier that there's quite a
Speaker 1: high dropout, right I think in this degree. Um, but
Speaker 1: you're like, again, you're never going to know until you try,
Speaker 1: and if you do have an interest, then that's good.
Speaker 1: But saying that, I think that my degree is being
Speaker 1: canceled by my UNI because they don't think there's enough.
Speaker 1: How are you going to do How are they going
Speaker 1: to do it? Then? I think I think one of
Speaker 1: my lecturers wants to make it a master's program and
Speaker 1: a different UNI or something like there will be a pathway.
Speaker 1: But it's yeah, it's it's it's a very small field.
Speaker 1: It's definitely something that's hard to get into. I would
Speaker 1: say it's not well, first, it's not for everyone, but
Speaker 1: it's also yeah, it's very small, everyone knows everyone kind
Speaker 1: of thing. Um, So yeah, I think through your choices.
Speaker 1: Yeah and yeah, and I think in the future it
Speaker 1: might be a bit harder. Like I'm very privileged that
Speaker 1: I had the chance to do this degree because it's
Speaker 1: only been running since twenty nineteen, I think, so, yeah,
Speaker 1: very it hasn't very amazing. Yeah, so, but I think
Speaker 1: I believe they will do it. I know they do
Speaker 1: it in other states. It's just me talking New South
Speaker 1: Wales in general. Yeah. Yeah, for the Australian Yeah, for
Speaker 1: the Australian audience. This is not for an international because
Speaker 1: well the job is quite different in other countries anyway. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I can imagine. Yeah, so it very much varies across
Speaker 1: the world, but yeah, I think that's kind of Yeah,
Speaker 1: if you if you really do have a passion for it,
Speaker 1: it's definitely worth it because it's a it's an experience. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because even the people I went on placement with, like
Speaker 1: I said, a lot of them might not even go
Speaker 1: and end up into this field, but they still went
Speaker 1: through the placement because what an experience. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: it's not something that everyone else's yeah, like ninety nine point,
Speaker 1: they never know what it feels like. Yeah, exactly. Well, Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for coming home and thank you
Speaker 1: for having me. It's been fun. Yeah, did you enjoy it? Yeah? Yeah,
Speaker 1: did we all learn something? Hopefully? Oh my gosh, hopefully.
Speaker 1: I think we probably do. I definitely learned something. This
Speaker 1: is such a fascinating episode, And thank you for just
Speaker 1: sharing your learnings and your experience. Thank you. And to
Speaker 1: be honest, it makes me feel a lot better about
Speaker 1: dying that somebody's going to wash my hair for me
Speaker 1: exactly when I'm dead. We all we do really care. Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's honestly really sweet. Like I know that sounds strange
Speaker 1: to say, Maybe I don't think it's strange, but like,
Speaker 1: for other people in stinging, Like what this sounds sweet,
Speaker 1: but it makes me feel really nice that like there
Speaker 1: is this sense of respect for people after they go,
Speaker 1: and that there's people like you who are passionate about
Speaker 1: that and willing to do that work. So exactly. Any
Speaker 1: final comments before we wrap up this lovely episode. Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, not really, but just thank you for having me.
Speaker 1: It's really nice. Yeah. Yeah, I really hope that people
Speaker 1: you know, learn something or at least found it interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah I did. Yeah, Well, thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 1: As always, thank you to Laura, And if you feel
Speaker 1: compelled and you really enjoyed this episode, share it wherever
Speaker 1: you feel and leave a five star review on either Spotify,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're getting your podcasts, and remember
Speaker 1: to subscribe. Thank you so much