Unstoppable Mindset

BCK? Right. We get to learn all about that during our conversation this time with Milam Miller. Milam began life in Texas, but has moved around quite a bit over his life. He always has had some interests in sports as he will tell us.   During his time in New York years ago he dreamed of securing a job with his favorite baseball team, the New York Yankees. He decided that he didn’t really want to see “the behind the scenes” of the Yankees or any other team. He ended up more on the sales and promotions side of sports.   His jobs eventually took him to the UK, but eventually, the pandemic happened. For the first two years of the pandemic, he went back to Texas. In 2022 his wife’s job caused the two of them to move to Toronto Ontario where they are today.   As he looked for things to do at the start of the pandemic he hit on what became for him a watch phrase, “BCK”, (Be Confident and Kind) As he describes, what was a watch phrase for him has grown not only into a coaching business for him, but an actual movement. I leave it to Milam to tell us about that. I think why I say that there is no doubt that Milam is definitely unstoppable.     About the Guest:   “Be Confident & Kind” (or BCK) was a personal mantra that Milam Miller created in July 2020 in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic. Life was uncertain and he knew one thing to be true–showing up in a confident & kind manner kept his inner light burning bright.   What was once a private motivating statement is now a public movement. Milam launched BCK in order to offer his whole self to organizations looking to invest in its people.    BCK believes in a confident and kind approach to work, in which people are put before profits. A coachable workforce - that is already skilled and, hopefully, well trained - will, in fact, yield higher profit margins. Milam is an expert in encouraging leaders and cultivating collaboration amongst teams, especially innately competitive sales teams.   When he’s not facilitating in the boardroom or on 1:1 coaching calls, Milam can be found teaching in the yoga studio. One of the greatest gifts in life is to be able to move somebody - whether that be physically, mentally or emotionally - to a place of transformation.     Ways to connect with Milam:   Website: https://www.bckconsulting.org/ LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/milam-miller-bck Instagram: @milamrmiller   About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children’s Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association’s 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app.   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.     Transcription Notes      Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i  capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:20 Well, howdy, everyone. I am Michael Hingson, sometimes known as Mike Hingson. We were just having a discussion about that our guest and I because if I say Mike Hingson People always want to say Kingson instead of Hingson. A little factoid but it's actually Hingson with an H. So I've learned to say Michael Hingson took a while to figure that out. But here we are. Anyway, I would like to welcome you to unstoppable mindset, where inclusion, diversity in the unexpected meet. We've got a lot of things about a lot of that today. I really appreciate you listening in and hope that you like what we have to go through today. I'd like you to meet our guest Milam Miller, who lives in Toronto, be confident and kind. And he's going to tell us about that as we go through the hour or so that we spend. But for now, Milan, I want to welcome you and thank you for joining us.   Milam Miller ** 02:13 Yeah, thank you, Michael for having me. I'm very happy to chat with you this evening. My time here in Toronto. I have learned how to say that Toronto, they kind of the words mumbled together. I'm getting better at it. I'm practicing.   Michael Hingson ** 02:27 It's not like in Maryland is Baltimore.   Milam Miller ** 02:29 That's right. That's right. Yeah, Baltimore. So yeah, it's a pleasure to be with you. I love your story and what this podcast is all about and anxious to dig into to BCK and what that means to me. And hopefully anyone listening today that might be intrigued by our mission.   Michael Hingson ** 02:48 Of course everybody always wanting to be different and all that. We know it's not pronounced Worchester in Massachusetts, it's Wista.   Milam Miller ** 02:56 There you go. I don't know that one. I haven't been there yet. But maybe someday I'll get oh, you should   Michael Hingson ** 03:00 go. It's less. It's actually Wister. But of course, when you live in Massachusetts, it's Wista.   Milam Miller ** 03:05 Wisdom is the same as is, as in Texas, we say wish to share sauce is like the Western sauce is the same thing or no.   Michael Hingson ** 03:14 Well, same spelling, but yeah. But in Massachusetts, it's when you live there, wisdom,   Milam Miller ** 03:21 wisdom. Okay, let's   Michael Hingson ** 03:21 see, you're gonna make it you might make it as a Massachusetts person yet. Well, thanks again for being here. Why don't we start by you telling us a little bit about you growing up and kind of the early myeloma and all that sort of stuff?   Milam Miller ** 03:35 Sure. Happy to, you know, rewind the clock. So I tell everyone, I am a Texan in Toronto. Originally, from the big great state of Texas, I grew up in a small town. I was actually born in a town that everyone knows called Waco, Texas. Unfortunately, it's made headlines for not always the best of reasons. Although I'd like to think Chip and Joanna Gaines and other people in the Waco communities have really put it on the map for delightful things like making your home more, more enjoyable to be in. So it's Chris, did   Michael Hingson ** 04:12 you ever know Chip and Joanna, you know, I   Milam Miller ** 04:14 can't say I haven't met them. So if this podcast reaches them, hey, Chip. Hey, Joanna. i Let's let's meet old friends. I love what you've done in the community. Yeah, I still have family in Waco. My grandparents had been married for 70 years. They're both in their 90s now and sharpest attack. I'm very grateful to have them in my life. They highschool sweethearts met at Baylor. My father comes from that side of the family. He also went to Baylor met my mom there and then here Here I am. So you would think that I would have gone to Baylor but we decided to move south to Central Texas and I became a Longhorn a proud one at that. So I bleed orange, the School of Matthew McConaughey and many others.   Michael Hingson ** 04:59 So I voc several years ago, or a couple of meetings at the San Francisco Lighthouse, excuse me, the Fort Worth Lighthouse for the Blind. And the CEO is from TCU. So I obligated to talk about Go Frogs, you know,   Milam Miller ** 05:16 there you go. That my mom is from Fort Worth and my in laws, actually, my sister in law and brother in law are both TCU alum. They were at the national championship this year. So I was happy to see them so much as it hurt a little bit that Texas wasn't back there. I was happy to see a Texas school make it that far.   Michael Hingson ** 05:35 Yeah. Well, I was disappointed that USC didn't go all the way. But you know, we try. There you go. There you go. There is next year.   Milam Miller ** 05:42 That's right. There's, you know, that's what gives Dallas Cowboys fans hope. There's always next year.   Michael Hingson ** 05:47 In Massachusetts. I lived there for three years. And I remember, every year when the Red Sox started their season. In the first game, if they lost, everyone started saying wait till next year. Hmm. Tough crowd. Tough crowd. That's right. So anyway, so you became a Longhorn? That's right.   Milam Miller ** 06:09 You've got it. I studied finance at Macomb School of Business at UT Austin. And I gotta be honest, Michael, it was not for me, I hated it. Without a shadow of the doubt, I, my dad was a finance guy. And I remember I recall a time there being a lot of pressure. Within the McCombs community, it had the top rated accounting program in the country. And it was a big pipeline to go to the big four accounting firms. And then many people, of course, studied finance, too, and wanted to go work on Wall Street. Coincidentally, I was in college in 2008, during the financial crisis, the big collapse. And I didn't honor that gut intuition that told me finance wasn't for me, I thought I wanted to do manage mix, I love people. And I was told that was too woowoo, or maybe not practical enough. And marketing, I found really interesting, but again, also was told there's so many marketers out there. So I didn't, didn't honor my own intuition. And that was a great learning lesson, in my own life, to, to get in touch with my intuition and not neglect it like I did at that point in time.   Michael Hingson ** 07:24 You know, we all too often tend not to, to pay attention to our intuition. To our own consternation, I love to use the example of I watch or not watch, but I play a lot of Trivial Pursuit. I haven't so much lately, but invariably, both for me and for other people. While we're playing it. Somebody asks a question. And the answer pops into a person's head, whoever's having the question asked of them, and they go, No, it can't be that easy. And they don't answer it that way. And invariably, what popped into their head was the right answer. Mm hmm. And that happens so often. It's all because we really do know more than we think we know. We just don't always tend to want to pay attention and recognize that maybe our intuition and God and all that are are really giving us the answers. So I'm glad that you learned a lesson from that.   Milam Miller ** 08:21 That's right. That's right. And I will say this, I don't know if I knew the right answer that point. But I knew what it was. And I knew it wasn't finance, right and it takes doing the work you're doing the classwork because I got a D in that class, if I recall correctly, that I was like this, this this thing for me. So it was a great experience to set me on a path that was more in alignment with my childhood dreams and aspirations, which ultimately led me not into finance, but into the sports career. And that's where I got my start.   Michael Hingson ** 08:54 And so what did you do in the sports world?   Milam Miller ** 08:57 Yeah, thank you for asking. Good question. So bad news. I'm a Yankees fan. I heard you mentioned the Red Sox earlier. And you're wearing my favorite color red today. So if you are a Red Sox fan, I apologize. My I'm a Dodger fan, but that's okay. Well, that makes more sense. But to all the Red Sox listeners out there, they've won a couple championships. You know, since then, you know, the the rivalry is, is maybe not as heated or the curse as it once was. Right. But I grew up in big Derek Jeter fan. And also being a fan of the University of Texas, Roger Clemens came over to the Yankees. And I still remember when I was a kid sitting right field behind Paul O'Neill, and just being in the bleachers, and I was like, This is so epic. And they were winners. They were they were a team. And there were so many great leaders on that team. Yeah. And I've always been enamored by by leadership and and teamwork. So I thought I'm gonna move to New York and work for the New York Yankees, done, signed, sealed delivered very clear and specific ambition. What unfolded for me was not that As our life life journey happens i Upon graduating ut I, my criteria for a job was twofold. Live in New York City and work in sports. My entry point into the industry was actually through an agency that did sponsorship activation. So if if modells is a sponsor of the New York Yankees, I know a lot of people know that retailer in the New York area. Or let's say it's Miller Lite as their official beer. I was handling a lot of those contracts, but more specifically in the golf space. Yeah. And what else? I'm sure you're thinking, Yeah, I've maybe I've got you on the edge of your seat. I actually had a colleague who worked for the Yankees, and she had come over to our agency and hearing her firsthand accounts of what it was like to to work for a family run business, this time burners, right and kind of the change of power at that time from Mr Steinbrenner passing away to his sons. I decided I made the conscious decision at that point in time. That that was my passion. And a lot of my favorite players I mentioned Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, Andy Pettit, they were all retiring and I didn't really want to see under the hood of the business side of things my passion in a lot of it I you know, it's come out in recent years the captain the the Docu series about Derek Jeter just about his his contract negotiation as he was aging. I thought maybe it's better I keep that my passion and I can go there and ignorance is bliss. And I cheer on my team without knowing the politics and inner workings of it being my my employer. And so, yeah, I was open to opportunities in New York's a great market to be in if you're open to opportunities,   Michael Hingson ** 11:46 yes. And so what did you do? Who,   Milam Miller ** 11:50 so what did I do? I did the work I was responsible for activating omega the or omega however you pronounce it the luxury timepiece company. I always tell people this is a fun case study. People know of omega from the Olympics. They've had a long standing association with the touchpads in the pools when Michael Phelps fingers hit the touchpad and he wins gold. Or when you same bolt leans across the line and wins yet another gold. So from a marketing perception, a lot of people thought of omega as a timekeeping company right there. They're accurate, precise, but they didn't think of them as a luxury timepiece, business. So trying to pull away market share from Rolex Omega decided to sponsor golf and activate around the major championships. So I would literally go around Michael and be wearing a red polo such as your own, because that's omegas brand colors, and I would set the Swiss clocks, and I'd put them on the first tee potensi the putting green and I had to make sure that they were on time and the most. The irony in all of this, Michael is that I am not a punctual person at all, I am chronically late, despite best efforts getting from point A to point B I always underestimate time. So it was kind of a running joke in my close circles and family. How the heck did you get that job, you are never on time. You got to just stretch and grow. That's it. That's it. And it did stretch me I was fortunate to travel all across the US to very remote golf, country clubs, golf course locations, and I loved it. It was it actually taught me to be on time. So I think I was on time for our call today, which is good news. It's more when transports involves that I struggle, but I've gotten better over the years so that was a good learning lesson for me.   Michael Hingson ** 13:44 So you went around to golf courses all over the country and set time pieces and made sure they were on time right? That's right I may go see   Milam Miller ** 13:53 Yeah, manage their brand identity and it was a wonderful program to work on. But it was very much rinse and repeat and I'm a type of person that there's a time and place for certainty but I also crave variety and while there was variety in the the the courses that these tournaments were held at, I was looking for a little bit more of a way for my extroverted self or outgoing self to be on actually the sales side and not just on the fulfillment side activating and managing but actually having a seat at the table negotiating the rights because I got to see what rights they got on and it got me curious a core value man like Well, why didn't you negotiate rights to that or why does this sponsor have that and we don't and so that's when I realized I wanted to make a jump into in a very niche and sponsorship sales in sports but really just working on behalf of a team are right told her similar to the Yankees but not the Yankees again, they're my passion, but somebody else and all that to say it is me being open to opportunity. I got connected with a gentleman and who owns a professional football club, aka soccer team overseas. And he sold me on his vision, which was to build a modern day Coliseum in Rome. That's where the team played. And coincidentally, I had gone there when I was 15. My sister graduated high school she was 18. And we did a trip for city I ever stepped foot in Europe, capital city, and the Eternal City at that. And I didn't even know the team existed when I was 15 years old. So to hear this owner laying out his vision for a new stadium I was I was bought in I was I was drinking quite literally from you know, the Roman Aqua docks, I was like, I want to take your your vision to market and sell that on your behalf and was fortunate to do so.   Michael Hingson ** 15:46 So when did this happen?   Milam Miller ** 15:49 So I went to work for the ownership group previous one of AS Roma spoiler alert, back in 2016. No, excuse me, actually, 2015 and 2015 is when I went to work for them. I moved abroad in 2016.   Michael Hingson ** 16:05 And how long were you there?   Milam Miller ** 16:07 Yeah, so there specifically is a tricky answer. Because I didn't actually move to Rome. I spent the majority of my time in Rome while I was sorting out a British visa. But this was around the time the Brexit vote happened and getting a visa was a very complex process. I also unfortunately did not speak Italian. So me being in Rome, was not the wisest business move being on the commercial side of the business. However, many European football clubs Manchester United being in Manchester, they had a commercial office in London and we saw an opportunity in the market to be the first Italian team to plant roots in London and so that's where I relocated to   Michael Hingson ** 16:53 Wow Well, that was was easier as long as you can speak the language so you you didn't have to learn how to do New Jersey Italian you know, forget about it and all that sort of stuff.   Milam Miller ** 17:06 That's right. That's right. I   Michael Hingson ** 17:07 learned didn't learn good Italian.   Milam Miller ** 17:09 Yeah, perfect, though. Everything was perfect.   Michael Hingson ** 17:11 That's a nice thing. Yeah. So how long were you over there? Because you're not there now.   Milam Miller ** 17:21 That's right. So I'm, I can hear my wife saying my lawn, land the plane, hurry up, move abroad. 2016 And, again, did the work you gotta you gotta be in it, live it to Yeah, to figure it out. And a lot of life happened in those years. And my sister was diagnosed with a brain tumor in 2017. That a lot of the forward progress I was feeling it kind of stopped it to be president and attend to those needs. In 2018, we made a really deep run in the UEFA Champions League, which is the top teams across not only Italy, in Germany and France and Spain, really all across Europe. They're they're playing one another so it was outside of our domestically. And we beat Barcelona they had a player you may know a guy named Lionel Messi, who today announced he's going to take his talents to South Beach, like another athlete did about a decade ago. And so Messi Messi is headed to inter Miami David Beckham's club. And we beat we beat FC Barcelona in the Champions League quarterfinals only to get knocked out in the semi finals by Liverpool, which also had a Boston based owner, my my, our ownership group was out of Boston as well. And so it allowed us on the commercial side of the business to really capitalize on the performance side, the momentum the team was having, almost going to the Champions League final to secure some sponsors. And that was a really, really fruitful time for us commercially. And we were still riding that wave until 2020. And you know what happened then?   Michael Hingson ** 19:02 Yeah, those little bugs started escaping from somewhere.   Milam Miller ** 19:07 That's right. That's right. Now there were other like challenges that the team I'd be remiss not to mention, but that's the nature I think   Michael Hingson ** 19:14 it's the nature I think any team and it's got its ups and downs,   Milam Miller ** 19:18 or any business for that matter. Even Yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 19:20 yeah. So where were you living at the time?   Milam Miller ** 19:23 So I was still in London when the pandemic hit and you know, I think about the, the rate with which my life the speed with which my life was moving at my goal, the travel we were doing living in London on Europe's back doorstep. I think that March, my wife's birthday is in early March. We had a ski trip planned and that ski trip did not happen at least for us. We we canceled I know some people ended up going and getting stuck and that's a story for another day. But yeah, we we were in the proper UK lockdown. On from middle of March until July when they lifted it and then there was a whole start stop situation from then on.   Michael Hingson ** 20:08 Yeah. And, of course, there were additional lockdowns and all sorts of challenges, because we were still learning a lot about COVID. I think we're still gonna continue to learn a lot about COVID. But we are a lot better situated than we were.   Milam Miller ** 20:24 Absolutely, absolutely. It was a time of unprecedented change. And I think, you know, from my, my story change is something that collectively we as humans went through, at least on this planet, the collective human experience of dealing with COVID. And it impacted us all in unique ways, different ways. And changes is hard. It's scary. And it's it's I think some people are still wrestling with the Yep, permanency of changes that cause myself included, my career changed drastically from that point onward.   Michael Hingson ** 21:03 Well, so when did you leave London and I guess, move to Toronto, or excuse me, Toronto?   Milam Miller ** 21:10 Yeah, there was an intervening step. We hopped home to Texas for two years, 2021 and 2022. This Toronto opportunity came about through my wife's employer, the same one she had in London, they've been very good to us and grown her. But Toronto is new. We've only been here since the start of the year. And I I've been at my own business for the last year, it was something I launched following a pandemic pivot that didn't work out. And then really realizing it was time to trust my gut instincts and that intuition that I got connected with in college. And by this point in my career, I was like, it's time to bet on myself and take a leap of faith. And so that's the you. That's how I got here.   Michael Hingson  21:57 So I have a couple questions, because I really want to get into change and all that. But I'm just really curious. Sure. It was announced a couple of days ago that the PGA and the other organization what is it? Live golf? Yeah, live golf. Yeah. have merged. What do you think about that, given especially all the furor over the last year, you've had enough connection with golf, and I assume you got to know, golfers and things like that. But what do you think   Milam Miller ** 22:24 about that? Yeah, you know, great question. This will be it's all still so fresh that yeah, that news was announced yesterday. I got. I saw it first. I get Wall Street Journal, email alerts. And I think I spit my coffee out, Michael. I was like, wait, what?   Michael Hingson ** 22:39 I saw it on a CNN alert. Why what?   Milam Miller ** 22:44 Yeah, yeah, I posted it on my Instagram pretty immediately, because I just was so recent. I do have friends who are played golf in college are professional caddies. I am friendly with players on the tour. I don't have close friends. But obviously it's you know, it's humans that do extraordinary things. And that's what they're out the golfers that are out there are all human and we're all on a work in progress. So what do I think about it? I think that it's really unfortunate if I'm honest, that again, I my calling card is leadership. I believe in dynamic leadership and servant hearted leadership. And without calling out certain names, I think there was pressure by the tour as a as a body a governing body and entity, not one person in particular. But I think the the tour is a collective as a unit, to keep people loyal because of the history and legacy of the body and to deter them from moving to a new flashy, different format that paid better or paid well, with also questions about where that money was coming from. And it was, in fact, sports washing. So it's for them to turn a blind eye now to that argument around sports washing, and is it clean money or dirty money to then take the money? It feels? Feels a little disingenuous, like I would if the PGA Tour were on this call or was listening to this. This podcast, I would say, what are your core values? What are your corporate values? And how did that influence or impact this decision making process?   Michael Hingson ** 24:26 I'll be anxious to see how it goes over time because I think we're only starting to hear the different sides of this and what it's going to do. But I know that the whole issue of flipped Golf was was all about money. And the the problem with a lot of professional sports, it seems to me is it's way too much about money. I appreciate that players and so on do need to earn a living and they and the better they are the more they ought to earn. But I also think that there is just so much based on money, that we're losing sight of the games And then the activities themselves. And it's just kind of the nature of the beast, I think it's coming into the NCAA now with of course, the better players who can now get money in, we're going completely away from the sports. And it's just becoming much more money oriented, I'm sure that there will be people who will disagree with me and yell at me, and, and so on. But when do we get back to the basics of the competition of the game, you know, in the Olympics have done the same thing and so many same things in so many ways to that. It's been be it's become very political with some countries and organizations have turned a blind eye to it. When do we get back to the basic core values, as you just said,   Milam Miller ** 25:46 Well, there's there's so many stakeholders involved in sport as we know it today. And as somebody who worked closely with sponsors for years, I can only imagine if I been representing either entity, pitching from a PGA Tour perspective of, you know, us, this is what we're about, as opposed to live golf, hey, we're new, we're going to do things different, we're going to do it better for you sponsors, we're gonna give you better access to players or whatever it may be, you know, they've, they've been at odds. So now that now that the two entities were competing against one another, now that they're, they're merging, let's think of it as a classic m&a deal. It's two different corporate cultures, it's two different sponsorship sales. Now, it's two different. So there's going to need to be a learning and development function or core curriculum to really refer to these two bodies, and also do it in the name of caring about your people, your employees, not just the players on the tour, that maybe you feel wronged because a lot of them do. But I just I worry that there could be layoffs in the name of efficiency and productivity. And that's so unfair for either entity and and skilled people that have talents that they could bring to grow the game, because I do think at the end of the day, some fans will be happy, this is a way to grow the game in a way that's that's centralized or organized. Sure. But there's a lot of stakeholders, again, that are going to be impacted by this. So just approaching it from a place of care, I think is really important.   Michael Hingson ** 27:24 I agree, I think it's going to be very interesting to see how golf as an overall sport, now changes. So we have one entity again, but it's a completely different entity by any definition. And I hope that it changes for the better, but I don't know enough to be able to comment on that. But I've hope that in the long run, or as they say, at the end of the day, that that people will find that it really was an improvement for golf. And that has to be by actions, not by words. So we'll see what happens.   Milam Miller ** 28:02 That's right. Time will tell. Time will tell. Yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 28:05 But you know, you, you talk about change. And we've we've both experienced a lot of change. And I hear people say all the time, the change is all around us. It's there. But yet, as you said, it's very hard. Why is changed so hard? What is it that we have learned or not learned? That makes change so hard? Especially even in the light of the fact that it's all around us all the time?   Milam Miller ** 28:35 Hmm. Yeah. It's such a good question. One thing I have Michael, I think people find change hard or exhausting or challenging is because it's outside of our comfort zones. As simple as that may sound, we we get so accustomed to doing something a certain way or conditioned to do it a certain way that it's, it becomes second nature, just what we know. And if that is taken away from us, or we're told there's a different way to do it. There's a bit of resistance or agitation. I'd love to know your perspective on this just given up being on this planet, you have a little bit more wisdom than me. Some years, you're a couple years ahead of me. But I yeah, I find that change is hard for people. Because once we get good at something that will that feels nice. And so to to change it up. If it's not serving us, we start to second guess or wonder if we've made the wrong decision, instead of sitting with the discomfort and agitation to a place of actually growing our comfort zones. And I think that that's really where where growth happens is out of our comfort zone.   Michael Hingson ** 29:46 Yeah, I think the the issue is that our comfort zone needs to be broader. So I remember after September 11, I've talked about it here a few times. I started hearing people We'll say we got to get back to normal, we got to get back to normal, we got to get back to the way normal was. And I remember that I always reacted to that I always bristled at it, I didn't like it. But it took me a long time to finally realize that the reason I didn't like that comment was because normal would never be the same again. And we really need to recognize that that's really what change is all about. And so what we need to do is not necessarily look for a new normal, but instead, recognize that normal is evolving. And while we're comfortable doing things in a certain way, we get used to doing things in a certain way. If we don't explore how do we enhance that, and make that different way, or that way that we do things better, then we're going to be stuck in the same old way of doing things. So even talking about live golf in the PGA. Is that a good change? Is it a bad change and time will tell? It's a change? And rather than necessarily condemning it unless you know something that others don't? The bottom line is with any kind of change, we need to really explore and think about how we enhance because of change. And oftentimes, how do we be the ones to bring change into the world because something has to be better. I was the program director at our radio station. And one of the things that I did at the station when I was program director at K UCI when I was going to college was listen to all of our DJs. And some of them really sounded horrible. They just didn't sound good. And I thought, How do I deal with that? How can I get them to be better? How can I make them change? And I something that dawned on me is that I'm listening to them, too. They listen to themselves. And I went to them and I said, Look, I want you to record your shows. And I want you to go off and listen to them. And they wouldn't do that. And so what we did was to set up a system, I did it with Dave McHugh, our engineer, he set up a recorder in a locked cabinet. Because we had the locked cabinets where all the equipment was anyway. But anytime the mic was activated, the recorder would turn on. So we were able to make recordings of what the people said we didn't really worry about what's the music that wasn't what what we were worried about not evaluating but dealing with, we wanted the announcers to get better. And I would give them each a cassette member cassettes you don't hear you're not I don't know if you're old enough to remember cassettes. I'm a CD guy. There you go. So yeah, they're gone. But we would give them a recording of their week shows. And I said, You've got to listen to the shows. If you don't do that, then you're not going to be able to continue to be here. But you know what? People started doing it. And they started hearing what they sounded like. And by doing that, I was actually very amazed at the quality improvements in most people by the end of the year, when they decided that they would at least think about the change. And then they embrace the change. Because they started hearing themselves the way other people heard them. Some of those people went on into professional Radio One went to NBC and there are people Yeah, that was really great. But we we really, you're right, we get locked into our comfort zone. But the part of it that is the problem is we do get locked into our comfort zone. And we don't think about or explore ways to enhance or improve and maybe stretch our comfort zone. And that's kind of my thought.   Milam Miller ** 34:04 Totally I love that word enhance and also improve. I'm curious, what was the number one thing they changed? Or rather was there a through line of changing pitch tonality? What in perhaps there wasn't a through line? It was it was uniquely individual, but I I'm I want to know what that feedback you gave them resulted in.   Michael Hingson ** 34:28 It was different for different people, probably for most people, they started seeing a whole lot less, they actually started completing sentences more. They spoke in a more consistent way into the microphone. They became better speakers by any standard because they heard themselves and everyone was a little bit different. But those are the basic things they really became better speakers. And one of them actually is this is the main guy who does a lot of the work at one of the local planetariums. And he met was a good speaker anyway. But everyone got better when they started hearing themselves. When I speak, I listen to myself, because I want to hear what I say. And even today, I will listen to recordings of my talks. Sure, so that I can figure out anything that I can do to improve and we all don't like to hear ourselves talk. But I've learned that I'm also not my own worst critic, I think that's also a negative way to look at it. I'm my own best teacher. Because no one else can teach me I've got to be the one to teach myself, even if it's getting input from instructors and all that. I'm the one that has to teach. And so when I take the time to do that, I will get better. And as a result, of course, what that really means is, I change   Milam Miller ** 35:55 what a beautiful reframe not I am my own worst critic, but I have the power or capacity or potential to be my own best teacher. I love that. I love that. I love that. I think when we can also reframe change as being hard as being a means to you said the through line is they all got better changes a means for us to recalibrate, reevaluate, to improve, enhance or get better than we've become more willing to embrace it and build the new and improved or enhanced and evolved version of whatever it is,   Michael Hingson ** 36:29 right changes is something that is around us. And the other part about change is if we really look at something that is trying to get us to change whatever it is, if we truly recognize that there is a something there, then we can analyze that. And so I say to ourselves, do I really want to change this? But then you make it a real conscious decision. Now, things happen that we don't have control over. Did we have control over the World Trade Center terrorist attacks happening? No. Should we have I'm not convinced yet that we would have been able to know that. But it doesn't really matter. I didn't have control over it. The other people who were there didn't have control over it. But what we did have control over was how we chose to deal with it after it occurred.   Milam Miller ** 37:20 Amen. Amen. I love that. Just for anyone who's listening in my community, can you quickly share what you experienced on that day 911?   Michael Hingson ** 37:32 Well, I worked in the World Trade Center on the 78th floor of Tower One. And I was in the office because we were going to be conducting some seminars that day, to teach our reseller partners how to sell our products, when the plane hit the building actually flexed. Because tall buildings are like Big Springs, when it got vertical, again, a colleague's I'll fire above us. But I have spent a lot of time in the the year and a half before actually, September 11 happened, I spent a lot of time learning what to do in the case of an emergency and learning all about the World Trade Center. Because I was the leader of that offense. So I had to be able to function like any other leader would, which meant I had to know what to do and where to go. And even more so than most people because I didn't have the opportunity to rely on signs. So I learned at all. But what I realized much later was that was also helping me develop a mindset that said, you don't need to be afraid if there's an emergency, you know what to do. And you know what your options are as to where to go based on whatever the circumstances are. So don't panic. And I never realized that I learned that but I did. And so I was able to go down the stairs. I had my guide dog at the time Roselle and we traveled down the stairs all 78 floors. Mathematically if I recall, right, it was 1400 63 stairs. Wow. But you know was at least we were going down right?   Milam Miller ** 39:07 That's nice comic relief. I love that. But the   Michael Hingson ** 39:09 issue is that we we went down and we got out and then we were very close to tower two when it collapsed. That was a little bit different session situation because there I think I started to panic a little bit. But as I wrote in Thunder dog things happen that that helps to deal with that. And we did write a book later about a called Thunder dog the story of a blind man has guide dog on the train from Trust, which is available anywhere books are sold. So hopefully people will will get that and keep my current guide dog Alamo and kibbles we appreciate that. But you know, the the issue is that I discovered during COVID and I want to talk about your changes in COVID. And I discovered that while I talked about not being afraid I never really spent any time helping other people learn how to control their fear and as I put it not being blinded by fear when something unexpected happened So we're writing a new book about that. And it'll be out when it comes out. But the whole idea is to say you do have the ability to deal with whatever comes along, you can choose to create a mindset that will allow you to do that and not allow your fear to overwhelm you. It isn't to say, you aren't afraid, I guarantee you, we were afraid going down the stairs. But I used it as a positive motivator to be more observant to encourage my guide dog to go down the stairs. And the job of a guide dog, of course, is not to get lead, but to guide so the dog doesn't know where I want to go and how to get there. That's not the dog's job. But the dog's job is to keep us safe. But I knew that my dog was going to sense all the fear of everyone going down the stairs. So I had to encourage her to focus and do well. And we did, we got out. And we survived. And I've been a speaker, traveling the world talking about trust and teamwork, and dealing with change, and the human animal bond and moving from diversity to inclusion, one of my favorite speeches, but doing a lot of talks around the world ever since. So I'm a full time public speaker, and in addition to working for accessibility, so as a plug, and of course, to any of your friends who might need a speaker, let me know we're always looking for speaking opportunities. And it's been a while since I've been to Toronto, so I gotta get back there.   Milam Miller ** 41:22 There you go. Well, I I just, I think your stories so remarkable, Michael, and that you've used it to be of service to others across all those buzzwords that carry a lot of significance, right, and they hold real meaning to people. When 911 happened for me, I was in the fifth grade. And it was a year of change for me because it was actually the first year I transferred from private Catholic school to public school. And, you know, there's, there's a, what's the word I'm searching for, there's something in an 11 year old boy or girl, whomever at that age, that is striving to find themselves in a new environment, right. And so, when we talk about mindset, the mindset of a child at that time is hate. transferring schools, it's, it's maybe there's some grieving a sense of loss and welcoming in that and there's an opportunity to gain new friends are widening your circles, you know, bridge the gap between the two schools. So I just, I love that in the midst of all that adversity and things that you couldn't control. Your mindset was one in which it stayed calm and was able to self regulate is also I think, what came up for me is, is be able to get yourself to a place of, of safety.   Michael Hingson ** 42:49 My equivalent to your story is that when I was 13, I was in the eighth grade and was in November of 1963. And President Kennedy was shot. And we had to deal with all of that. Sure. It was a little bit more removed, of course, than being in the World Trade Center. But the next summer, I went and got my first sky dog and then went into high school and had to do the same sorts of changes that you did. And I did embrace it as I get to go into a whole new world. And I think that's the issue is that we learn to be so negative and pessimistic about things, rather than recognizing maybe life is an adventure. And we should really embrace more of the adventure. The internet is a great treasure trove of knowledge. And I love the net, I realized that there's a dark side to it, which I've never visited and don't have any need to. But it's like artificial intelligence and chat GPT and so on today, again, we can always look for the negatives. But why do we need to be negative about everything? Why don't we look for the positive things, recognizing that there are negative issues that we might have to deal with, but if we approach it the right way, one will take care of the other.   Michael Hingson ** 44:12 Of course, just because there's real issues going on doesn't mean they need to be approached from a negative mindset or Outlook i i think negativity is such a dream killer for lack of better word and um, if you can't tell already big glass half full kind of guy I on my report card, probably even that same fifth grade year, my teachers or whatever, enthusiastic, that was my calling card. I use enthusiasm as fuel, to embrace change to build the new and instead of fighting the old, how do we navigate this with more? Or how do I navigate this with more confidence and how do I navigate it with more inner kindness the way I'm speaking to myself in my own developmental journey, navigating the new so that's it I guess that fast forwards is back to present day what what happened during COVID. And the result of it Bck, my private coaching, speaking and consulting practice is the football club, I was working for Roma, we sold it during 2020 year. And I mentioned I made a pandemic pivot into sports media tried something out, I thought at that time content is king, everybody's at home. You know, this is a good place to be to negotiate live sports media rights. But unfortunately, that wasn't my reality. And you mentioned having agency to choose, I think that's so important. And if I could have gone back to college, and knowing that I had agency to choose a different major than I would have, and I would have done it with discernment and confidence. But in this case, it was the first time in my professional career that I realized, I have agency to walk away from this because I'm destined for something greater. And so I, after one year of of learning the business, I stepped away, I resigned, and it was actually empowering. Instead of I think so many people feel that quitting is a bad thing. And I, I like to think of do you need to grit through this? Or do you need to quit this because it's not in alignment with what makes you feel alive? And so in my case, I'd done all the grading I could do. It was time to quit not grit, and I started my own business BCK, which stands for be confident, and kind.   Michael Hingson ** 46:30 How do we get people to be more confident in a time of change or when they're when change comes to them? Sure.   Milam Miller ** 46:39 It's such a good question. I think in my own experience, and there's probably other perspectives on this. In the midst of so much newness, I like to find slivers of sameness. So whether that's a fitness modality that serves you, so in my case, I love going to a yoga class or a spin class or a Barry's Bootcamp class, a format that I know. And that brings me confidence that when I'm done, I know I'll feel better. In the midst of so much newness lean into things where you can have just like a little sliver of sameness, it will remind you that you are an expert in some things. And even though you may feel a beginner in whatever it is, I feel like a beginner finding the new grocery store in my neighborhood in Toronto. But in time, you will grow more confident of I prefer this one over that one, or it's worth the extra commute to go to that one, I know how to navigate it with confidence, get my groceries get in and out. So I tell my clients that confidence is a doing energy, it's action oriented. And if you're taking actions or steps, it will build your confidence in time, you just have to be moving in forward direction in a direction that's serving you. Because if you're languishing, then you're going to stay in that stuck or stagnant place.   Michael Hingson ** 48:01 Right. And it's all about moving. And as you're moving, thinking about what you're doing. The other part about it is really analyzing what we do, I'd love to tell people that I think one of the most important things we can do is at the end of the day, take a little bit of time just to do self examination, looking at what happened during the day, and even the good things. Could I have done it better. How did that go? Why did it go the way it did the bad things? Not? Why did I do so badly? But what do I do to make sure that that doesn't happen again? Or what really happened? self examination is such an important thing.   Milam Miller ** 48:44 It is Do you journal Michael?   Michael Hingson ** 48:47 No, I don't write things down just because, you know, it's, I write it down, it's still out of sight out of mind, I have to make a very conscious effort to then to go back and look at the journal. So I just tend to remember things a lot. Well, let   Milam Miller ** 49:00 me let me clarify, because that's probably good for listeners, do you Digital Journal or have any sort of voice memos that you record? And like listen back to kind of going back to the feedback thing or on the radio station? Or is it purely just a mental exercise for you,   Michael Hingson ** 49:16 me it's more of a mental exercise, I find that that works pretty well. If if something comes to mind, and I feel I need to to write it down somewhere, then I will record it. I'll make a note. And I have done that and gone back to it. Or if I want to remember something in six months, I will create a reminder, so it will remind me so I do some of that. But mostly, I just think about things at the end of the day. And I've learned to but I've learned to do that right? Sure. So I'm not saying that journal doesn't help. Journaling doesn't help, but I've learned to do it mentally. And so for me that has worked pretty well,   Milam Miller ** 49:56 of course and what a great way to get pushing yourself to to do that self examination that mindfulness practice. I work with my clients to have a very clear evening routine to set them up for success, so to speak the next day and then a morning ritual in the morning asking, what's my intention for the day, and then in the evening, Am I satisfied. And because I think so many people, their head hits the pillow, and they're thinking about what they didn't get done, which is a lack mindset, as opposed to being grateful for the things they did. And so a gratitude practice is something during the pandemic, I actually had to, I started experimenting with and writing down three things. I'm grateful that the sun came out today in London, I'm grateful I got to read 10 pages in my book, I'm grateful that we cooked a delicious home cooked meal, you know. And it's, it's those little simple things that remind you have how abundant and special your life is, even if you're living in lockdown in a global pandemic. Yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 51:02 And the reality is that we can take a much more positive approach to anything that we do. But it's a conscious decision to do that. And there's no reason for us to be so negative. The problem is, we also do have so many political leaders and other people who we regard as role models who are very negative, and that doesn't help either. And so we have to be able to learn to step back and say, Wait a minute, do I really want to model that when it's so negative? Or do I want to look at alternatives and that doesn't mean that you look at things through, as they say, rose colored glasses, but it does mean that you need to recognize that there is much more value in positive advancement than running things down and being negative?   Milam Miller ** 51:50 Absolutely. I think being able to discern what works for you, is so important in life. And that goes back to my own gut instincts. It's great for things to be modeled. But that doesn't mean we can carbon, copy everything, we have to really get curious and play scientists on ourselves to figure out what works for us. Because I think sometimes if we look to too many role models, we lose sight of our own intuition. And we're no longer operating according to our code of conduct, but another and it leaves room for disappointment when they let us down or judgment. And we're not being discerning of our own experience in the fact that we're all human. We're all figuring it out.   Michael Hingson ** 52:34 Well, you talk about inner kindness, and it's, it's an important thing. We need to learn to be kind to ourselves, and we yeah, we don't do that.   Milam Miller ** 52:46 So I call myself a recovering perfectionist Michael, releasing a lot of the Type A expectations of myself the shoulds. And speaking kindly of you said it best earlier I can be my own best teacher, instead of I. I'm speaking critically of myself. So I remember the first couple months I moved here in Toronto, it might have been the first couple weeks in fact, I had taken one of those blender balls, you know, like a protein shake with me. And it was so cold out I didn't have gloves on. And I dropped it and of course the way the water bottle hit it cracked and my protein shake went everywhere. And I thought oh man, I just cracked my my blender ball like I'm gonna have to go buy another one and I noticed this negative self talk I was engaging in and then I caught myself I just said oh, well you know next time wear gloves. It's it's it's a thing it can be replaced. All good. Yeah, your hands are sticky, but you still have your fingers like Oh, well. And so embracing the oh well. Like I'm I'm not perfect. I wasn't intended to be perfect has been so liberating in my own journey. Yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 54:00 We we need to recognize all sides. But we need to really remember that. We have control over how we deal with things. And that's that's ultimately it, you know that there are some changes that are very overwhelming. I mean, the World Trade Center, the pandemic and so on. How do we deal with protecting our own mental health during these kind of incredible seasons of change?   Milam Miller ** 54:28 I love that question. Just as a as an advocate for mental health, especially for men, because I find women do a really good job of asking for help. Opening up being vulnerable men have a tendency to wanting to be stoic or not show any cracks in the facade, hold it in or playing to traditional gender norms. I need to be the provider. I can't show any emotion just just do. And so we all have Mental taking care of our mental health is important to everyone. And in times of change, it can seem on the surface like this is overwhelming. This is a lot. But really when we look underneath I almost think of like the tip of an iceberg asking ourselves, what am I really experiencing? What am I feeling, and taking measures that calm that anxiety, whether it's going on a walk, cooking yourself a nutritious meal, I find that you know, past seasons of life, when I when we moved him to Texas, during the pandemic, we were so excited for fast food for Chick fil A and things that maybe I've been deprived of for a year. And then I started noticing my mood, and I tell friends, clients, food affects your mood. So it's taking care of ourselves with what we're eating, how we're, we're moving is so important, I think not just for what may seem like physical health on the surface, but really, it actually does impact our mental health too.   Michael Hingson ** 56:05 Well, you you've said it several times, doing things like taking a walk, and so on. The reality is that we do better again, when we step back, we're in the middle of something, we feel overwhelmed. If we can step back and gain perspective, then we learn how to deal with it. And that's the other part about it. We're so conditioned to work hard work all the time, and not do any kind of self analysis that we don't learn to step back when the people who do best are the ones who truly can step back unplug. One of my favorite stories is when BlackBerry was still around the BlackBerry device and so on. Sure, the company one day, had a server failure, and everybody's blackberries died, they didn't work, Research In Motion, just wasn't getting anything to anyone. And I heard a few days later that there were even people who committed suicide because they couldn't connect at 12 o'clock at night. You know, and they didn't have any control over that we don't learn to step back and deal with some of those issues and put it in perspective, which is what it's all about. Well just change her mental health. Do you think?   Milam Miller ** 57:28 Before I answer that, I want to address that case study you share because I find that fascinating and present day. I'm hearing so many Gen Z, the cohort below my millennial cohort are purchasing razor flip phones and other sort of non smart devices which I want to be clear I think is great if that if taking that measure helps protect your mental health go for it. Because we live in such an instantaneous society, what you call stepping back, I call reconnecting to myself, disconnecting from my smartphone and reconnecting to myself. It's as silly as it sounds, we learn it on the playground, I think or in some family, some households, like take a deep breath. You know, if we take three deep breaths, we it's scientifically proven and back that we will feel a sense of calm and can come back to our sense of self or reconnect ourselves. So all that to say to answer your question, do I think change is bad for our mental health? Absolutely not. I'm gonna go with with false that's that's fictitious. And I'll tell you why. Change is scary. And it's it's, it's it's not intended to be. But that's our brain trying to protect us and keep us in that comfort zone. And like we talked about earlier, if we can realize that the brain is actually just trying to be our friend and whatever, freeze fight flight mechanisms going off. It's saying proceed with caution. But it's not saying don't proceed at all. It's saying, try on the change, see if it works and in time, you'll grow more comfortable with it, you'll see if it's if it's if it's if it's working for you. And then worst case, you can always change your mind and go back I think in society, we forget that part two if, if maybe we get it wrong, or we want to go back there's no shame in doing that. And so kind of releasing the expectation of, of changes incessant, it's, it's, it's around us, and we can always change our mind again.   Michael Hingson ** 59:33 And there's nothing wrong with that. That's right. The The reality is that the whole idea behind change is you can you can look at it and as you said you can then change again and go back to the way it was or you'll probably never go back to exactly the way it was because even if you discover that whatever change you tried, doesn't really work. It still gave you more knowledge. So you're still a different person than you were Oh,   Milam Miller ** 1:00:00 absolutely 100%.   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:03 And I think that's really kind of important to, to remember, it's something that we we need to learn. I, I've had a lot of changes happen in my life. And you know, we all have my latest probably huge changes my wife passed away last November, I didn't really see it coming until very close to the time that it occurred. But now I live alone. Except I have a cat who wants to be petted every time she wants to eat. So I get her ministrations every day. And even in the middle of the night, she'll wake me up saying Phoebe. And I'll do that once. I've told her you only get it once a night. And I have of course, guide dog Alamo. So I have some company here and other people who come and help. But it's a it's an incredible change. And I've heard other people when they had a loved one pass? How could you do that to me, I'm mad at you for doing it. And I cannot say in any way shape or form that I resent Karen's passing, I didn't like it. I'm very sad about it. I also tell people that I will not move on from Karen, I will move forward. But I won't move on. Because I'm not going to forget her. And I'm sure that she's watching from somewhere. And if I misbehave, I'm going to hear about it. So you know, I have to do that. But the reality is that it's still a huge change. And what it really did for me, was caused me to learn to remember and use tools that I didn't have to use so much while we were married for 40 years. And that now I might have to use some of those skills in a different way. Sure. But, you know, change happens. And one of the things that I feel is important is you can't be angry at change, you decide what you want to do with it.   Milam Miller ** 1:01:57 How do you want to respond to it? Yeah. What a beautiful way to to honor your your wife, Michael, Your late wife, I am curious, the new tools, or rather maybe old tools that you've had to revisit by by doing it on your own and moving forward? Not moving on from her? Has that brought you a sense of newfound confidence or self efficacy? If I can? I don't, I wouldn't. I don't maybe I don't want to do it alone. I would prefer to have her here. And I'm confident and every day taking a new step. And you're actually I'm curious what that looks like for you?   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:34 Well, I think you just described it very well, the reality is that I also did travel a lot while she was alive. So I'm used to not always being home. But the the other part of it is that I'm reminded that I do have the skills to be able to function and do things and be able to live and move and grow. And I'm going to continue to do that. And I think in part that's also honoring her.   Milam Miller ** 1:03:04 Yeah, amen. live, move and grow. I love that.   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:09 So it is kind of an important thing to do. So   Milam Miller ** 1:03:14 thank you for sharing that. Michael. I know it's grief is so complex. And it's it's not a linear process. So I really commend to you for opening up in this forum. It's it gives people permission to open up about similar loss. Well, thank   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:30 you I you know, I will always honor her and remember her and that's the way it ought to be. Amen. If there were one thing that you could change in the world, what would it be?   Milam Miller ** 1:03:42 Hmm, how long can my list be? I know you said one one thing I'm thinking of Christmas like Hey, Santa Claus, I want world hunger. Where do we start? You know I I've always been fascinated by people and human connection. What makes the Earth Spin on its axis isn't super heroes like spinning planet Earth. It's It's It's we make the world go round with the decisions we make. And not just the things we do but the the way in which we embody doing it like our actual beings. So I think I would, I would love for there to be more harmony that starts, from leaders from leaders around the world. And that may sound a bit like woowoo like world peace, but I really believe that if we lead from servant hearted leadership, if everyone believed they had the capacity to lead and tapped into cultivating confidence and kind to actions, then this would be an even better planet planet to live on.   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:56 Well, I absolutely agree with you if we really want would go back to the whole idea of servant leadership, servant hearted leadership, and truly brought that into being around the world, it would be a much better thing. But unfortunately, you know, right now we've got too many people who are in it for them. And, yeah, they're not, they're not recognizing how much better they would be if they truly learned to be the servant leaders that they probably could be. And if they can't do that, then they really shouldn't try to be leaders. And we need to recognize that and feel empowered to say to them, if you can't really be a servant, to lead appropriately, then we're not going to accept that, and we're not going to accept you. And we haven't really learned to do that either. Yeah,   Milam Miller ** 1:05:49 to me, what you describe is not leadership, right? If that's the approach you take with special interest, especially personal interest, right? It's, it's put whatever label you want on it. But it's I know, for a fact, it's not leadership. And as somebody who works with leaders on a daily basis, and I'm still a work in progress with my own leadership style, and learning what works for me, if we can get really curious about that, and treat ourselves kind on that developmental journey and others, then I guarantee there would be more confident leaders out there that are doing the quote, unquote, right things that serve the greater population. And that's where we'd see accessibility for all sustainable like future of work that that people want to be a part of a collective vision for a better tomorrow. And that's the name of the game. Yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 1:06:44 absolutely. Tell me a little bit about about BCK coaching.   Milam Miller ** 1:06:48 Sure. So BCK coaching is for both individuals and organizations. Individuals, I do private one on one coaching with leaders, ones that are looking to navigate what I like to call life's daily challenges the small ones, but also life's big transitions want some we see coming others we don't, with more competence and kindness. A common theme is careers, right where we spend the majority of our work day. And it's, it's been really fun for me to hold space for people in that capacity and help them unpack wisdom from within. Similarly, on the the corporate side, it's cultivating leadership in workplaces at all levels, executives, new managers, leading for the first time and then individual contributors who have aptitude to become a leader. So I enjoy working with smaller to midsize companies that actually have a runway for scaling and growth and really get in and be a change agent for good and drive positive impact.   Michael Hingson ** 1:07:55 That's cool. You do it all over the world, or where are your clients,   Milam Miller ** 1:07:59 I do it all over though I do do it all over the world. Which is cool. Because I have a Rolodex for my time spent in Europe, I now can say I have a North American Rolodex adding Canada to the mix. But clients have ranged from markets including Paris, France, the Netherlands, individual clients from both coasts, San Francisco, all the way to New York to Brooklyn. So it's, you know, there's a saying all roads lead to Rome, Michael, but I laugh I say my Texas roots though all all roads, ultimately back to the great state of Texas and my community there has been super supportive of my journey. And I feel like I'm just getting started. So it's it's an honor to talk to other thought leaders such as yourself who are giving me a platform to share what we're about.   Michael Hingson ** 1:08:46 Well, it's it's exciting. It's exciting to hear about and we're going to have to do this again in the future so we can hear about some of the adventures going forward with coaching and the things that you're doing. But if people want to reach out to you, how do they do that if they want to learn more about what you do, engage you and so on. What's the process?   Milam Miller ** 1:09:06 It's a great question. Process is threefold You can reach me on the worldwide web. We're refreshing my website ahead of our one year anniversary on July one new domain is be confident and kind.com I'm Andy   Michael Hingson ** 1:09:22 Andy are the and symbol.   Milam Miller ** 1:09:24 A N D A N D Yeah, no, no and symbol. That's a great question. Be confident and kind. I'm also on LinkedIn, just given my background in sport and let's call it the corporate world. In Instagram, like watch out world, you know, I was very, I thought there was a place to, you know, show what I was cooking right? Like it like this is like a pie account. Now people like putting pies that they baked during the pandemic but I actually put a lot of thought leadership on Instagram, around what it means to To be a sort of a party leader and to navigate change with more competence and kindness so they can follow me on any of those channels get in touch for a free consultation and then we're off to the races. So Instagram   Michael Hingson ** 1:10:11 is watch out world   Milam Miller ** 1:10:13 I wish I would, I would have would have been awesome if I got that domain way back when it's simply my name my Milam Miller on Instagram, and you can find me Milam Miller on LinkedIn. But I'm very excited for the new website, because I do believe everybody deserves to feel a more confident or the most confident and kind version of themselves. And that's what we explore. And that's what we make happen. Cool. Well,   Michael Hingson ** 1:10:41 of course, I would be remiss if I didn't say we hope you'll put excessively on the site to make sure that the website is accessible for people with disabilities. But we can talk about that later.   Milam Miller ** 1:10:52 Let's offline on that. I want to be an ally and an advocate for that. So   Michael Hingson ** 1:10:57 we'll we'll do that. We'll do that. Well, for the rest of you out there. We'd love you to us accessiBe to but in the meanwhile, I'd love to hear your thoughts about today. Please feel free to email me Michaelhi, M I C H A E L H I at accessibe A C C E S S I B E.com. Or you can go to our podcast page www dot Michael hingson M I C H A E L H I N G S O N .com/podcast. We'd love to hear your thoughts. Love to hear your comments. And of course, we do appreciate five star ratings. So if you would give us a five star rating, I would appreciate it. And I know Milam would as well. But we really feel it's important that we do hear from you and get your thoughts. If any of you Milam including you know of anyone else who might be a good guest for our podcast. Love to hear from you love introductions, are always looking for more people and more adventures to have on unstoppable mindset. So Milam again, I want to thank you and really appreciate you taking so much time we've not done this for an hour and my gosh, 14 minutes. So we've been on quite a while. So I want to thank you for being here with us.   Milam Miller ** 1:12:11 Well, you know, I'm a talker, Michael. So if you give me a mic then especially when we're talking sports, that's fun. Well, we definitely need to do this again and see how the PGA TOUR LIVE. conundrum how it all shakes out.   Michael Hingson ** 1:12:24 I think that'll be fun. Well, thank you again for being here.   Milam Miller ** 1:12:26 Thank you. I appreciate it.   **Michael Hingson ** 1:12:32 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com. accessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for listening. Please come back and visit us again next week.